Atheists and White Supremacists

[Telarus]

... So far, the best defense has been Telarus saying 'shouldn't we take the most charitable interpretation of the argument?' ...

Hm, I haven't actually posted in this thread yet, so this confused me (still on page 15 here). That's cool, confusion's a natural state 

Maybe it was just a reference to another thread....

Oh, the OP was posted on the high holy MALADAY(Boomtime), the 5th day of The Aftermath in the YOLD 3179.



......I'll go finish the thread now. I hope the ending is good.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Nigel, I've got a hella long thing to post, mind if I start a new one?

I certainly vote for letting this thread die and bringing all the good bits out of it into new topics.

Why?

[Pæs]

YES: &noW that i see 4sure it wAS U , pre pair thySelves.

[Telarus]

Well, first time through I can't say I completely understand what went down.

At least I have some context for why Cain & Coyote aren't around at the moment......

[Golden Applesauce]

Nigel, I've got a hella long thing to post, mind if I start a new one?

I certainly vote for letting this thread die and bringing all the good bits out of it into new topics.

Why?

After 30 pages it gets hard to keep track of discussions. I remember seeing several interesting posts that were ignored in favor of continuing to be butthurt - if they all had to stay in this thread, at best only one or two of them would be able to get momentum to push through rehashing of drama. Easier to link to a topic thread than to say "this thread, one post on page 3, one on page 7, and then 22-26."

[Golden Applesauce]

And having just said that, here's a cross thread reply.

I am also, on an unrelated note, going to add that I won't personally be comfortable identifying as an Atheist until the majority of people who claim that label are taking a stand about denouncing bigotry even when it comes from their own ranks. As a person of color I am very aware of what bigotry looks and sounds like, and I don't know if this is simply invisible to a lot of people, but when you compare them to the bigotry in racist jokes, most of the content on websites like this:

http://www.booksie.com/humor/miscellaneous/city_of_evil_/funny-atheist-quotes-bumper-stickers
http://funnyatheist.tumblr.com/
http://www.atheistmemebase.com/tag/funny/
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Atheist-Memes/239047102844505
http://thaumaturgical.com/funny-atheist-memes-part-666/
http://proud-atheist.tumblr.com/

...aren't very funny anymore. So, yanno, maybe it's just my personal crusade of the moment, but I will say that I have friends of various faiths who have had my back against racism and sexism for years, some even decades, and I'm not going to leave the favor unreciprocated.

It also occurs to me that this is one of the reasons people are moving towards facebook/twitter and other forms of online communication where you are free to impose your own filters on the content you read.

I don't think that setting up your own echo chamber is healthy, but those formats let you choose the terms on which you take part in a discussion much easier than traditional forums.

I realized that I have seen a fair amount of antitheist image macros... I just tend to not to stick around on sites where they're acceptable, and unfriend people on FB / Twitter who make a habit of it. (As much as I respect Neil Degrasse-Tyson, he says some stupid shit on Twitter.) Some of my disconnect has to do with it being very easy for me personally to avoid anti-me bigotry.

Reflecting, there's a reason I'm on this board instead of an atheist one, and that reason has a lot to do with the stuff you've been saying ITT.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

YES: &noW that i see 4sure it wAS U , pre pair thySelves.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Nigel, I've got a hella long thing to post, mind if I start a new one?

I certainly vote for letting this thread die and bringing all the good bits out of it into new topics.

Why?

After 30 pages it gets hard to keep track of discussions. I remember seeing several interesting posts that were ignored in favor of continuing to be butthurt - if they all had to stay in this thread, at best only one or two of them would be able to get momentum to push through rehashing of drama. Easier to link to a topic thread than to say "this thread, one post on page 3, one on page 7, and then 22-26."

It's not hard to manually multi-quote, and if those ignored posts were so interesting, quote and reply to them. At least that way they maintain context.

My opinion is that in the context of an ongoing thread, if it has any value, the butthurt also has value. It is often valuable for helping to identify hotbutton issues, both for seeing where the cognitive dissonance lies and also for finding how it can be resolved. And if in the end it turns out that I'm just an asshole in the first place, it's good for that as well.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Nigel, I've got a hella long thing to post, mind if I start a new one?

I certainly vote for letting this thread die and bringing all the good bits out of it into new topics.

Why?

After 30 pages it gets hard to keep track of discussions. I remember seeing several interesting posts that were ignored in favor of continuing to be butthurt - if they all had to stay in this thread, at best only one or two of them would be able to get momentum to push through rehashing of drama. Easier to link to a topic thread than to say "this thread, one post on page 3, one on page 7, and then 22-26."

I saw two.  One of them was yours.   

"LET'S GET BACK ON TOPIC.  NIGEL'S A JERK."

[The Good Reverend Roger]

YES: &noW that i see 4sure it wAS U , pre pair thySelves.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Nigel, I've got a hella long thing to post, mind if I start a new one?

I certainly vote for letting this thread die and bringing all the good bits out of it into new topics.

Why?

After 30 pages it gets hard to keep track of discussions. I remember seeing several interesting posts that were ignored in favor of continuing to be butthurt - if they all had to stay in this thread, at best only one or two of them would be able to get momentum to push through rehashing of drama. Easier to link to a topic thread than to say "this thread, one post on page 3, one on page 7, and then 22-26."

I saw two.  One of them was yours.   

"LET'S GET BACK ON TOPIC.  NIGEL'S A JERK."

Yeah, I am not so sure about starting a new thread because this thread contains the real dialogue, even if it isn't pretty or comfortable. Distancing ourselves from the actual dialogue isn't necessarily productive or conducive to growth, especially when the discussion is as raw as it has been.

[Q. G. Pennyworth]

I had a big thing written that got into personal stuff I'd rather wasn't googleable, and then my computer shat itself and I lost the lot.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I had a big thing written that got into personal stuff I'd rather wasn't googleable, and then my computer shat itself and I lost the lot.

Yeah, the personal stuff is another matter; that's a good reason to start a new thread in an un-indexed subforum. That, or having a rant/essay that has enough weight to really call for a thread of its own. In general though it makes no sense to split up the existing discussion just for the sake of breaking it up.

[Forsooth]

YES: &noW that i see 4sure it wAS U , pre pair thySelves.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Wow, I guess I missed all the fun

It seems to me that this boils down to several truisms.

1. People who feel sure of a position tend to join a tribe which supports that position (There is YHVH, There is Allah, Thelemic Magic works, Free Market Works, There is not any God, The Government should be socialist, Fuck Everyone and Hail Eris etc etc etc).

2. All tribes have loud, obnoxious assholes (Fred Phelps, Bin Laden, Rush Limbaugh, Dawkins, AKK etc etc etc)

3. Often humans generalize the tribe based on the loud obnoxious assholes. They speak ill of the tribe, when they really intend to speak ill of the assholes.

4. Other members of the tribe can get pissed off when they're lumped in with the assholes.

5. Tribal identity can thus make even cool, non-assholes act like assholes, because their tribe has been attacked.

Faithfools, Libertards, Athiests, Pagans, Madjickians etc etc etc can all be broad generalized labels used to attack a tribe based on the loud tribal idiots. Since generalizations often are overly broad, other members of the tribe are upset since the generalization doesn't apply to them. Personal attacks, personal offense are thus normal defensive mechanisms of tribes.

That's actually pretty interesting.