So What's A White Boy To Do?

[Juana]

You made the argument, don't grumble at me.  If you don't believe it is a universal say so.  Do you believe it is a universal in all people in our society, yes or no?

I sure do. Varying degrees between various people, but yes, I think everyone has some subtle biases they ought to root out.
I also don't buy the idea that you're somehow 100% free of all biases.

[AFK]

You made the argument, don't grumble at me.  If you don't believe it is a universal say so.  Do you believe it is a universal in all people in our society, yes or no?

I sure do. Varying degrees between various people, but yes, I think everyone has some subtle biases they ought to root out.
I also don't buy the idea that you're somehow 100% free of all biases.

I'm sure you don't.  That deficit-orientation is going to do wonders for you.  Go change the world!

[Cain]

Mocking people is my sacred tradition, so this thread makes me sad 

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Mocking people is my sacred tradition, so this thread makes me sad 

Be nice to the white boys! They only want to be loved.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Right, and your insistence that YOUR experience with people you work with (who, if I may note, are probably the kind of people aware of subtle biases) is universally applicable, whereas there's scads and scads of literature that disagrees with you, is fucking obnoxious.

I've never claimed any kind of universality at all, my whole point is to counter the universality YOU have applied to everyone.  My point isn't that everyone is free of latent or buried prejudice.  My point is that not everyone is burdened with latent or buried prejudice.

Well, the available evidence shows that everyone who grows up in a culture that is full of embedded prejudices does absorb those prejudices to some extent, some moreso than others. This includes the people who are the victims of prejudice, and that has negative consequences for their self-image. You have heard of stereotype threat? That is only one example of a type of negative consequence.

Stereotype threat:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/07/opinion/sunday/intelligence-and-the-stereotype-threat.html?_r=0

Internalized racism:
http://jbs.sagepub.com/content/42/4/690.abstract

Some explorations on implicit (unconscious) prejudice and racism:
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=the-implicit-prejudice
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/1998/09/980930082237.htm
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/between-the-lines/201204/studies-unconscious-bias-suggest-racism-not-necessarily-perpetrated-ra
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/MindMoodNews/unconscious-racial-bias-shapes-trust-money/story?id=13437350#.ULqLxYU_1Gc
http://ideas.time.com/2012/04/19/inside-the-racist-mind/
http://newamericamedia.org/2012/05/scholars-say-unconscious-bias-leads-to-discrimination.php
http://www.news.harvard.edu/gazette/2003/07.17/15-prejudice.html

Hey, guess what, I'm not a speed-reading robot.


Also, just so you know, the internalized racism one is an abstract, it would be more helpful if you posted the whole article, which I'm assuming you have read since you are offering it as evidence.

That would be against copyright law, but the abstract outlines the study's conclusions. I assume that because you work for a government agency you have access to JSTOR and other engines if you want to read the whole thing.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Here are some other interesting articles on internalized prejudice:
http://ctb.ku.edu/en/tablecontents/sub_section_main_1172.aspx
http://her.oxfordjournals.org/content/15/1/97.full
http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/html/ihpitems.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/internalized-racism
http://revelandriot.com/resources/internalized-homophobia
http://www.jacksonfreepress.com/news/2012/apr/04/internalized-racism/
http://www.culturalbridgestojustice.org/programs/sexism/internalized-sexism/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/wade-davis-jr/reflections-on-self-hatred-and-relationships_b_1431996.html
http://crackingthecodes.org/hugh-vasquez-internalized-racism/


You have a daughter, right? So you are probably interested in how things like internalized sexism can affect adolescent girls. I know there are some really good books on that subject available, including a lot of new ones since I was reading about it when my girls were little. I'll look some up and see if I can get back to you with titles.

[Doktor Howl]

A person with Shiva-shorts is a) exploiting Hindu culture commercially and b) putting their ass on one of the most important deities in the religion. It's stripping the meaning off Shiva because he kind of looks cool, which is kind of an asshole move, imo.

All this is really starting to rub up against my dislike of religion in general.  I don't want to be told that I must be respectful of anyone's superstitions.

More broadly, I don't like being TOLD that I should be respectful of ANYTHING. I'll choose what I want to respect based on whether or not I think it's respectable, not based on whether or not it might hurt somebody's wittle fee-fees.

ECH, if you happen to be wandering through, this is the post upon which I based the JJ Principle.