Mommy Shaming

[The Good Reverend Roger]

LMNO, I think lazy slob best describes you, always ready for the cheap shot, as long as it doesn't occupy much more than a line and a half.

So's your mom.

My muther is a very active lady who still exerts tremendous effort at 70. She is somewhat ready for the cheap shot, but will belabour it at the drop of a hat.

Enrico is not certain "effort" is word he would use to describe, but will admit: she have remarkable elasticity!

You been poaching Uday's dates again?

[Dildo Argentino]

On one hand, I feel like I ought to say something about criticizing someone on how many children they have is a form of mommy shaming / slut shaming in itself.

On the other hand, I don't like Holist very much.

That's a good point.

But as long as he's accusing everyone else of being terrible parents for arbitrary reasons, why not?

I wasn't accusing anyone. I was expressing surprise that someone would just be like the Little Man she described for no particular reason. Turns out there's plenty reason. That's what I was after when I asked about it.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

[hooplala]

On one hand, I feel like I ought to say something about criticizing someone on how many children they have is a form of mommy shaming / slut shaming in itself.

On the other hand, I don't like Holist very much.

That's a good point.

But as long as he's accusing everyone else of being terrible parents for arbitrary reasons, why not?

I wasn't accusing anyone. I was expressing surprise that someone would just be like the Little Man she described for no particular reason. Turns out there's plenty reason. That's what I was after when I asked about it.

You seem to be working under the mistaken impression that people on this forum actually want to engage you on a serious level.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

On one hand, I feel like I ought to say something about criticizing someone on how many children they have is a form of mommy shaming / slut shaming in itself.

On the other hand, I don't like Holist very much.

That's a good point.

But as long as he's accusing everyone else of being terrible parents for arbitrary reasons, why not?

I wasn't accusing anyone. I was expressing surprise that someone would just be like the Little Man she described for no particular reason. Turns out there's plenty reason. That's what I was after when I asked about it.

You seem to be working under the mistaken impression that people on this forums actually want to engage you on a serious level.

He's still waiting for us to be reasonable about the woo he peddles.

[Dildo Argentino]

Let's put it this way.

When I hear about people having more than 3 children, I feel like I shouldn't reproduce at all because they already had kids for me and it would be irresponsible of ME to have any myself.

You know, tragedy of the commons and all that shit.

"If you think having 6 kids is okay, I want you to imagine telling brown children in foreign lands where all the food went."

And remember, Twid, that's MOMMY SHAMING.  Because dads have nothing to do with the reproduction of children.  Ever.

Let me explain again that though I live in a household currently containing six minors, I in fact have only sired 4. That might be somewhat more than a fair share, but we are further below reproduction rate than even the US, so it hardly puts a dent in a steady decline of the population...

[The Good Reverend Roger]

You are such a sorry bunch of losers.

None of you appear to be particularly happy, except on occasion, generally accompanied by being manic... pills, job unhappyness, angry children, stressed for money, stressed for time, etc., but you are still completely convinced that your way of going about things is the best possible way...

Roger, in addition to being a reasonably clever moron, you are also a manipulative bastard with entirely too much time on your hands. The reason I am not going to try to respond to your criticism, scattered among manipulative lies as it is, is that there's no point.

LMNO, I think lazy slob best describes you, always ready for the cheap shot, as long as it doesn't occupy much more than a line and a half.

Gogira, your take on life and your fake posturing at times inspire little other than pity.

Nigel, I've heard of children born angry, but stay-angry? Not really, unless they continually have something to be angry about. And people who continuously strive to find something to be angry about don't grow on trees. Twid, you are a bit daft, aren't you?

However, you all have redeeming qualities and I love you.


I don't live in a perfect world. I live in the world where reasonable cunning and circumspection affords a comfortable and enjoyable life, with the occasional crisis. Most people fail to achieve this and decide to live boring, infuriating, self-harming, maddening lives, but I guess it's a free world.

In my family, and the families that are close to mine, children stay home until the age of three. I know this sounds outrageous, but that's how it is. So their social context is their family until the age of three: and by that time, verbality is entrenched, and most of the dependence is gone (if you raise them resourceful, like you should). And no, the entire social context of those children isn't supportive and positive, but a sufficiently large chunk of it is. They then go on to decent nursery schools and then schools where they actually do stuff they enjoy and generally like going and have a good time. We are a rather small minority, mind you. Most people here, just like there in your wonderland Ammerricka, perceive that they are forced to return to work earlier and put their children in industrial childminding facilities that damage them. I think it is a terrible shame that happens, but the best thing I can do to stop it is not to follow the pattern myself. And you see, the reason we don't mind being called stupid fucking hippies at all, but at all, is that we are having fun.

I am not perfect, in fact, I don't know anyone who is. But there is a difference, and you all know it, between mindlessly repeating the same mistakes day in day out, and making mistakes, noticing them, correcting them and learning from them. I am continuously making an effort to chose the second option.

Oh, and you could live in that world. It's up to you.

Golden Applesauce:

Okay, fuck me. Do you know why you were suicidal?

Suu:
I'll start it in a minute, when I'm finished with this answer.

Pent:
You completely misunderstood me. It my communications skills be must. I harder try here now:

I don't tell my kids what to do unless they ask me to. The first bit after they are born, when they are not capable of asking, is a bit more complicated than that, m'kay?

I never really conformed to the System, and I emigrated at age 17, from the then Soviet-dominated Eastern Block to the UK, my last job in the sense of paid employment was when I worked as a pool-attendand for 4 years in my early twenties. Since then I have been a frontal lobe prostitute, and did pretty well out of it, though to tell you the truth, it has become right boring in recent years. I currently support a large family together with my wife working very irregular hours that even out at 25-30 hours a week I guess, I play in a band and have sold music for money... yep, I'm a fucking conformist, who wants parents to beat their kids into shape. Right.

Well, that's all I wanted to say, Imma start a thread now...

But he loves us all.



I told you fuckers he hadn't changed.

[Dildo Argentino]

You know, this last bit got me thinking, and I realized that - despite several chances to do so - holist has never "daddy shamed".

I wonder why that is?

As I recall, I actually rather did. The particular daddy I shamed was me.

[Enrico Salazar]

If we are to speak of shaming daddies, Enrico will need to change his sheet first.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

You are such a sorry bunch of losers.

None of you appear to be particularly happy, except on occasion, generally accompanied by being manic... pills, job unhappyness, angry children, stressed for money, stressed for time, etc., but you are still completely convinced that your way of going about things is the best possible way...

Roger, in addition to being a reasonably clever moron, you are also a manipulative bastard with entirely too much time on your hands. The reason I am not going to try to respond to your criticism, scattered among manipulative lies as it is, is that there's no point.

LMNO, I think lazy slob best describes you, always ready for the cheap shot, as long as it doesn't occupy much more than a line and a half.

Gogira, your take on life and your fake posturing at times inspire little other than pity.

Nigel, I've heard of children born angry, but stay-angry? Not really, unless they continually have something to be angry about. And people who continuously strive to find something to be angry about don't grow on trees. Twid, you are a bit daft, aren't you?

However, you all have redeeming qualities and I love you.

[Dildo Argentino]

Anyway, the point I was making was that within Holist's conditions, having that amount of children is in fact a bit shocking on a few different levels, and I don't feel like I am shaming him or the missus by pointing it out. I really want to know what the rationale behind it was, because they clearly have access to birth control in the UK, don't really need to have more than 2 or 3 children from a survival angle, and unless Holist has pound sterling shooting out of his asshole, those children actually compete for resources rather than benefit by it. I mean, I could be wrong. Holist might well be a rich motherfucker who can support a large number of children and spread relative, Western, economic comfort equally among them.

I think they live in Hungary or some other 3rd world country, not the UK. If I recall, they tried moving to the UK a year or so ago, and they couldn't hack it so they moved back to the jungle or wherever.

Jeeesus! :lolz:

[Dildo Argentino]

Oh. Well, that's a literal dick move on Holist's part. No wonder he was an admittedly shitty father to the first three.

Actually, I think the mild neglect and preoccupation I was packing along with enough money and working from home which equals basically available for services at all times is actually above average in terms of dadhood.

Though, even that said, If I had 3 kids with wife number one and got divorced, I would probably try and woo a woman who already had children and had no desire for any more. You know, emotional support is a resource too, like.

Well that's true, we had so much more in common. Like having more than one kid, each.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

You are such a sorry bunch of losers.

None of you appear to be particularly happy, except on occasion, generally accompanied by being manic... pills, job unhappyness, angry children, stressed for money, stressed for time, etc., but you are still completely convinced that your way of going about things is the best possible way...

Roger, in addition to being a reasonably clever moron, you are also a manipulative bastard with entirely too much time on your hands. The reason I am not going to try to respond to your criticism, scattered among manipulative lies as it is, is that there's no point.

LMNO, I think lazy slob best describes you, always ready for the cheap shot, as long as it doesn't occupy much more than a line and a half.

Gogira, your take on life and your fake posturing at times inspire little other than pity.

Nigel, I've heard of children born angry, but stay-angry? Not really, unless they continually have something to be angry about. And people who continuously strive to find something to be angry about don't grow on trees. Twid, you are a bit daft, aren't you?

However, you all have redeeming qualities and I love you.

[Dildo Argentino]

Except the part where race has nothing to do with overpopulation and resource consumption. And I've never said that human beings are wastes of space. If I felt that way I would be in favor of warfare. I am a pacifist. A rather adamant one at that.

Point of order:  Every war has resulted in a net population GAIN.  No shit.  People fuck faster than you can shoot them.  (Sarcasm aside, the boom after the war invariable makes up and exceeds the casualties of the war, in every case).

The only event that significantly reduced the human population was the black plague.  And THAT didn't last long, either.

There's another event that significantly reduced the human population.

I'm drawing a blank. I do know at one point we almost faced extinction, and worldwide population floated around 2000.

It's affecting Japan and a few other nations right now.

Radioactivity on fertility rates?

Prosperity.

Well, that's the ultimate win/win, if we can make it sustainable for everyone.

You see, it turns out that living a long healthy life and having the possibility of being something other than a breeding machine severely impacts a human's desire to gestate and push out child after child at the expense of their own health and longevity.

Prosperity is relative, and one of the key markers is education, which is not resource-intensive.

Can we at least all agree that this is a good thing?
I'm most interested in the opinions of the pro-breeding camp.

Well I agree, and I'm pro-breeding. Not a camp, though.

[Dildo Argentino]

I would be interested in hearing holists line of thinking that lead to his socially and ecologically irresponsible decision to aim for a reproduction rate that high.

So hey, it's quite simple: I didn't aim for no reproduction rate, I just got married young, had three boys in succession, my wife left me after 13 years and then a while later I found my ideal spouse and current wife, who happened to have two kids of her own. Then we went and had a kid as well. So that's six, not planned or aimed at, more of a drifting, aimless thing.

So, no planning ahead or anything.

Seems very...enlightened.

Well no, it  wasn't particularly enlightened at all. Liza, this youngest child, we both wanted to have. Sorry.