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Psychobiotics?

Started by EK WAFFLR, January 29, 2014, 04:34:03 PM

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EK WAFFLR

January 29, 2014, 04:34:03 PM
"At first I lifted weights.  But then I asked myself, 'why not people?'  Now everyone runs for the fjord when they see me."


Horribly Oscillating Assbasket of Deliciousness
[/b]

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

#1
January 29, 2014, 05:26:46 PM
New Scientist is generally garbage (I think of it as New Age Scientist) that likes to take interesting studies and blow them up tabloid-style into "SCIENTISTS FIND BACTERIA THAT CURE DEPRESSION AND SCHIZOPHRENIA", but my understanding is that there is some merit to the ongoing research into the effects that gut flora can have on our minds and bodies.

Here's a somewhat more well-reasoned article on the topic: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/11/131114094754.htm

And another one from a couple years back: http://www.apa.org/monitor/2012/09/gut-feeling.aspx

Plus a more humorous take on it: http://neuwritesd.org/2013/10/26/how-germs-in-the-gut-control-our-brain/
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."

Left

#2
January 29, 2014, 05:32:56 PM

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/06/20/gut-brain-connection.aspx

QuoteYou may not be aware that you actually have two nervous systems:

    Central nervous system, composed of your brain and spinal cord
    Enteric nervous system, which is the intrinsic nervous system of your gastrointestinal tract

Both are created from identical tissue during fetal development—one part turns into your central nervous system while the other develops into your enteric nervous system. These two systems are connected via the vagus nerve, the tenth cranial nerve that runs from your brain stem down to your abdomen. It is now well established that the vagus nerve is the primary route your gut bacteria use to transmit information to your brain.

While many think of their brain as the organ in charge, your gut actually sends far more information to your brain than your brain sends to your gut.

...In fact, there's a method of treating treatment-resistant depression called "vagus nerve stimulation."  A pacemaker-type implant is used to send regular zaps to the vagus nerve; over time this can alleviate depression:

QuoteResearch into the effects of VNS on people with treatment-resistant depression has generally been positive. A study in Biological Psychiatry in 2005 compared 124 people that received usual treatment to 205 people that received usual treatment plus VNS. After one year of treatment, the combination treatment group showed more improvement than the usual treatment group. Significant improvement was seen in 27% of patients that received VNS vs. 13% that did not.
http://www.webmd.com/depression/vagus-nerve-stimulation
(I should ask for this.)

I heard about some of this recently through this radiolab program:
http://www.radiolab.org/story/197112-guts/
Hope was the thing with feathers.
I smacked it with a hammer until it was red and squashy

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

#3
January 29, 2014, 05:37:50 PM
Oh god, please never, ever, ever post a Mercola link and expect to be taken seriously ever again. That website is a giant sack of shit that exists solely for "Doctor"* Mercola to promote and sell his books and supplements.

http://www.quackwatch.com/11Ind/mercola.html

*Not a medical doctor.
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."

The Good Reverend Roger

#4
January 29, 2014, 06:17:39 PM
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Left

#5
January 29, 2014, 06:46:56 PM
Thanks for heads-up.  I hadn't heard of the guy.  Just felt I get too science-daily dependent.
Hope was the thing with feathers.
I smacked it with a hammer until it was red and squashy

Left

#6
January 29, 2014, 06:50:15 PM
Hope was the thing with feathers.
I smacked it with a hammer until it was red and squashy

The Good Reverend Roger

#7
January 29, 2014, 06:54:32 PM
Quote from: Random anger problem on January 29, 2014, 06:46:56 PM
Thanks for heads-up.  I hadn't heard of the guy.  Just felt I get too science-daily dependent.

Checking sources is kind of the first step, not something you do if there's time.

It's not easy, of course.  The interbutt supermarket is basically one gigantic disinformation machine...A fact we as Discordians do not use to our advantage nearly enough.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Left

#8
January 29, 2014, 07:52:40 PM
Quote from: Dirty Old Uncle Roger on January 29, 2014, 06:54:32 PM
Quote from: Random anger problem on January 29, 2014, 06:46:56 PM
Thanks for heads-up.  I hadn't heard of the guy.  Just felt I get too science-daily dependent.

Checking sources is kind of the first step, not something you do if there's time.

It's not easy, of course.  The interbutt supermarket is basically one gigantic disinformation machine...A fact we as Discordians do not use to our advantage nearly enough.
:lulz:
...Any ideas on that latter?
I skimmed article, thought it described mechanism sufficiently.  Had not heard of quackiness of the guy.  Now I know...

Here's some evidence that stress can work the other way, causing bacterial disruption; and thence immune disruption...:

Quoteresearchers demonstrated that psychological stress causes almost immediate changes to the gut bacterial population, and that some of these affected sub-populations strongly influence the effect that stress has on immunity. In the study, the researchers exposed mice to social disruption, which is known to cause increases in circulating cytokines ('hormones of the immune system), which themselves induce enhanced reactivity in the immune system.
...
...And the immune disruption can cause brain disruption indirectly...
QuoteFurthermore, we can now see, that stress, via its effect on gut bacteria, and hence the immune system (IL-6) can change brain function. We know this because IL-6 activates a certain enzyme (IDO), which actually 'steals' or syphons-off tryptophan from its normal metabolic pathway ( ie conversion into serotonin and then melatonin) and instead converts it into chemicals that increase activity of glutamate (in depression) at an excitatory-and some times toxic- receptor (NMDA) in the brain. The result of all of this is increased depression, anxiety, and reduced memory.
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/health-matters/201104/mood-gut-bacteria-and-the-immune-system
Hope was the thing with feathers.
I smacked it with a hammer until it was red and squashy

The Good Reverend Roger

#9
January 29, 2014, 08:03:20 PM
Quote from: Random anger problem on January 29, 2014, 07:52:40 PM
...Any ideas on that latter?

I had a few hundred people going on the idea that Michael Bay was remaking To Kill a Mockingbird.  Sadly, that's about all I've done this year.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

LMNO

#10
January 29, 2014, 08:09:40 PM
Quote from: Dirty Old Uncle Roger on January 29, 2014, 08:03:20 PM
Quote from: Random anger problem on January 29, 2014, 07:52:40 PM
...Any ideas on that latter?

I had a few hundred people going on the idea that Michael Bay was remaking To Kill a Mockingbird.  Sadly, that's about all I've done this year.

Holy shit.  Where was I when you were doing that?

The Good Reverend Roger

#11
January 29, 2014, 08:18:08 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on January 29, 2014, 08:09:40 PM
Quote from: Dirty Old Uncle Roger on January 29, 2014, 08:03:20 PM
Quote from: Random anger problem on January 29, 2014, 07:52:40 PM
...Any ideas on that latter?

I had a few hundred people going on the idea that Michael Bay was remaking To Kill a Mockingbird.  Sadly, that's about all I've done this year.

Holy shit.  Where was I when you were doing that?

Doing your TPS reports.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

LMNO

#12
January 29, 2014, 08:29:21 PM
:crankey:

The Good Reverend Roger

#13
January 29, 2014, 08:32:16 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on January 29, 2014, 08:29:21 PM
:crankey:

Sorry, I just turned my AC back on because it's too fucking hot here.

Where were we?
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

LMNO

#14
January 29, 2014, 08:42:45 PM
I think I was about to launch an explosive diarrhea attack in the general vicinity of Tucson.
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