Fat, fat, fat

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

And I certainly did say something earlier today about the issues I have with the fat-acceptance movement; some of which you appeared to specifically take issue with.

[Salty]

I see. So it must have been you. I was talking, specifically, about you and your kid. Because that's the kind of thing I do. All the time.

[Salty]

And I certainly did say something earlier today about the issues I have with the fat-acceptance movement; some of which you appeared to specifically take issue with.

Which means I am saying, ITT, that you're a shitty parent. Got it.

[Salty]

Because I take personal stances like that with people I respect. I must have mean I know your family history better than you do.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

We live in a society where excess, empty calories, and sedentary behavior is the norm. That is not healthy. That is not to be encouraged, embraced, or accepted. There is nothing wrong with trying to foster social shift by pointing this out. If anything, obesity and other excess-and-inactivity-related health issues are social issues, not individual issues, and they are therefore to be improved through social action, not individual action.

[Faust]

Faust, I am sort of surprised to see you compare the proliferation of gun use leading to more deaths by gun, to obesity.

What medical knowledge do you possess that allows you to make an informed comparison between the two? Not to mention the callousness toward people who really, really already have enough to deal without being made to feel they should DIE because of their bodies.

I ask again:

How do you know, from looking at someone and their body, that they are unhealthy? How do you know their arteries are caked on the inside out with muck that will eventually clog their hearts? Based on what data do you make these broad assumptions?

I was comparing the proliferation of obesity to the proliferation of guns, it's dangerous and harmful.

I've no medical knowledge in the least, I can only comment on the statistics

In Ireland at the present time 39% of adults are overweight and 18% are obeses these figures are double what they were ten years ago. In ireland the leading cause of death is heart disease. There are many causes to it, alcoholism being a far more detrimental then obesity but the amount of complications associated with obesity is growing.

As to your second question because it is not the same thing you asked me the first time.
If I looked at a fat person I'm not going to make any assumptions on their health. However If I look at a room full of obese people, I can safely say that there are a number of people there not at their optimal body weight.

I'm not judging them, nor have I an interest in their personal appearance or health, they can be whatever they want to be. But I'm not going to lie, I'm not going to say they aren't an at risk group and I'm not going to say statistically some of them will go on to develop complications because of their lifestyle.

Based on what? On this?

http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/health/health-topics/topics/obe/risks.html

As your body mass index rises, so does your risk for coronary heart disease (CHD). CHD is a condition in which a waxy substance called plaque (plak) builds up inside the coronary arteries. These arteries supply oxygen-rich blood to your heart.

http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/GettingHealthy/WeightManagement/Obesity/Obesity-Information_UCM_307908_Article.jsp

People with a body mass index (BMI) of 30 or higher are considered obese.

BMI is bullshit.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=106268439&sc=fb&cc=fp

The definition of obesity is based off BMI and only BMI.

Um BMI might be bullshit but mechanics is not. You have a pump running in rtyhm in your chest. From the moment it starts to the day it stops it has a finite lifespan before it wears out.

Without complicating it by talking about cholesterol we can take the simple case, same size pump, larger mass to provide for.

Take it on a case by case basis, two people with the same BMI will have different results, one may have no negative effect from his or her weight. Take it on a larger scale and a pattern emerges.

There is no way for me to say that a single person is unhealthy because of their weight (though I will make certain judgements if I hear them struggling for breath which might be unfair), but on a group you can draw some pretty grim conclusions.

[ñͤͣ̄ͦ̌̑͗͊͛͂͗ ̸̨̨̣̺̼̣̜͙͈͕̮̊̈́̈͂͛̽͊ͭ̓͆ͅé ̰̓̓́ͯ́́͞]

Like I don't struggle all the time with how to encourage healthier habits WITHOUT giving her more of a complex than she already has thanks to this fucked-up toxic society.

That sounds REALLY stressful.

The entire core of the issue seems to be encapsulated in that sentence.

[Salty]

We live in a society where excess, empty calories, and sedentary behavior is the norm. That is not healthy. That is not to be encouraged, embraced, or accepted. There is nothing wrong with trying to foster social shift by pointing this out. If anything, obesity and other excess-and-inactivity-related health issues are social issues, not individual issues, and they are therefore to be improved through social action, not individual action.

Oh, we are having a debate now. A possibly heated debate about social health issues?

News to me. I thought I was shitting all over your parenting.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Because I take personal stances like that with people I respect. I must have mean I know your family history better than you do.

I didn't see a lot of wiggle room for concerned family members back there. In fact, the only mention of family was negative. So pardon me if I was supposed to write in an exception for myself, because I'm "not like all the others", or whatever.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

We live in a society where excess, empty calories, and sedentary behavior is the norm. That is not healthy. That is not to be encouraged, embraced, or accepted. There is nothing wrong with trying to foster social shift by pointing this out. If anything, obesity and other excess-and-inactivity-related health issues are social issues, not individual issues, and they are therefore to be improved through social action, not individual action.

Oh, we are having a debate now. A possibly heated debate about social health issues?

News to me. I thought I was shitting all over your parenting.

No, you were shitting all over my perspective on obesity, because it isn't my place to judge or think I know what's healthy for anyone else ever, remember?

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

YOU can deal with YOUR weight, and your own shame, however the hell you want.

Just to address this in particular;

I am 15-ish pounds overweight. My blood sugar is stable, my cholesterol is excellent, I look pretty damn good, especially for going-on-43 and having had three kids, and I really, really need to lose weight. Not because I'm ashamed of how I look.

It's because I am dangerously hypertensive and at high risk for a stroke, and losing 15-20 pounds would probably bring me out of the red zone.

Soooooo

I think you should take your judgement-on-judgement and reconsider what you're saying and how you're coming across to people who have REAL concerns about their own excess fat and that of their families, because you may be on fire with righteous indignation but it isn't YOURS to be on fire WITH.

[The Johnny]

Im "skinny" by society's standard, because i weight around 61kg and am about 6'2 tall... the thing is, that i live a kind of unhealthy sedentary life, and i know i have a problem with my fatty percentage (Im ok with my weight, i just think i need to transform the fat percentage to muscle percentage).

End result? Im unhealthy and i dont get judged while there are people with "bigger bodies" that probably are healthier with more muscle composition that get tons of shit.

[Faust]

I have gone out with a girl who would in BMI terms be quantified as dangerously anorexic, It was her choice, I know this because she was capable of gaining weight when she wanted to.

Is it OK for her to be that thin? Sure, it is none of my business. Do I have to delude myself that she was healthy? No.

A great many of my friends are obese, have any of them health complications because of it? Some yes. Is it any of my business, no. Do I have to pretend that they are healthy? fuck no.

I fall into the fat range of the BMI scale, it doesn't really bother me and I don't consider myself unhealthy because of it, I'm a tall guy. (Am I healthy? Fuck no but probably not because of my weight)

The BMI is a rule of thumb, an average taken on a large set, not a figure set in stone to say this is right and this is wrong, the over/underweight is very much an approximation. But the further ranges from the median ARE high values, there is a difference of 4.5 stone from nominal weight to obese for a person my height.

Taken on a large enough sample and I can with confidence say that a sizeable proportion of them will be prone to health issues because of it.

[Faust]

Im "skinny" by society's standard, because i weight around 61kg and am about 6'2 tall... the thing is, that i live a kind of unhealthy sedentary life, and i know i have a problem with my fatty percentage (Im ok with my weight, i just think i need to transform the fat percentage to muscle percentage).

End result? Im unhealthy and i dont get judged while there are people with "bigger bodies" that probably are healthier with more muscle composition that get tons of shit.

Yes there is a social stigma with overweight people and you are on the very low end for a person your height. But I was only a stone heavier than you until I hit 23 when I gained about three stone in a year.

And it's true underweight (unless they are quiet obviously emaciated) don't get targeted for bullying or any of that.
No one is saying that the bullying is ok. For overweight people, or for underweight or anyone else.

But that doesn't mean there shouldn't be awareness of how unhealthy having a polarised weight in either direction is.

[The Johnny]

Im "skinny" by society's standard, because i weight around 61kg and am about 6'2 tall... the thing is, that i live a kind of unhealthy sedentary life, and i know i have a problem with my fatty percentage (Im ok with my weight, i just think i need to transform the fat percentage to muscle percentage).

End result? Im unhealthy and i dont get judged while there are people with "bigger bodies" that probably are healthier with more muscle composition that get tons of shit.

Yes there is a social stigma with overweight people and you are on the very low end for a person your height. But I was only a stone heavier than you until I hit 23 when I gained about three stone in a year.

And it's true underweight (unless they are quiet obviously emaciated) don't get targeted for bullying or any of that.
No one is saying that the bullying is ok. For overweight people, or for underweight or anyone else.

But that doesn't mean there shouldn't be awareness of how unhealthy having a polarised weight in either direction.

Well, im 27 just for reference... at my peak health moment i was 65kg but pure muscle and i did get A LOT of positive attention... contrast with my worst moment where i got to 53kg of pure bones and fat and i didnt get any shit for it - now lets say, if by the same ammount ive been UNDER, imagine if i was OVER, how much shit i would had gotten... calculating that "supposed ideal weight" is around 75, doing the under-to-over comparison, the example would be: 97kg.

Im not sure how 6'2 with 100kg (220lbs) even looks like, but im sure no positive comments would come out of it.