Author Topic: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1  (Read 8970 times)

The Good Reverend Roger

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The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« on: April 29, 2016, 07:25:37 pm »
After last Tuesday, the democratic primary is more or less a done deal.  Barring an outright miracle (like Sanders winning ALL of California), Hillary Clinton will be the nominee, and I am going to have to vote for her.  I am less than thrilled about this, given her comments towards those of us who voted for Sanders in the primary.  But I'm going to vote for her anyway, because I can't see leaving every non-straight, non-white protestant I know behind (my kid included), just because I personally am - more or less - immune to most of the effects of a republican victory in November.

So at this point, I have to consider the "Bernie or Bust" crowd to be my enemies.  It's not hard to do, between their tantrums and their insistence that four years of pain would do us all a world of good.  No, that sort of shit makes me hate them almost as bad as the Clinton supporters who have spent the last 6+ months actively making me hate them, though for very different reasons.

I am uninterested in this big fucking elephant in the living room.  I am apathetic towards it entirely.  I will go vote the straight democratic ticket, then I will go home and hate the democratic party, from Hillary and Debbie Wasserman-Schultz all the way down to the shitbags that decided to tell me WHAT weeks or months ago.  I am doing this because I can tell the difference between "bad" and "worse", not because I have seen the light or failed to notice a rigged election or three.  I can look past all of that to see my youngest kid.  For whatever reason, the bernie-bots cannot.  They would prefer Trump over Clinton, because they are having what amounts to a screeching tantrum.

You may notice that I am in the slightly bizarre position of hating every single faction in an election.  I am of course okay with that.

That being said, it's also worth mentioning that where you get elephants, you get lots and lots of elephant poop.  One of the mighty stacks of said poop has red hair and a beard. and is snarling at you, saying:

"If you hated on me because I voted for Sanders OR because I am willing to face a few stark realities and vote for Clinton...If that was all it took to call me a "Clinton shill" or a "racist" or "part of the problem", then do not bother trying to reconnect with me following the general election.  No, instead you should go find new friends, because I am not nor will be your friend after what's been going on.  Not because I'm so terribly butthurt about the election, but because you don't meet my standards of friendship.  I have your contempt and you have my hate and so far everyone seems to be happy with the situation.  So fuck off."

Or kill me, dirtbags.


(This is being cross-posted at a political board on FB, and more is on the way)



« Last Edit: April 29, 2016, 10:59:13 pm by The Good Reverend Roger »
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LMNO

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2016, 07:39:35 pm »
I like it.  Part of me thinks Clinton gets more shit than she deserves, but she's still way more moderate than I'd like.

If you have the time, I'd like to read the other things you post over yonder -- and if possible, some screen grabs of reactions.

Pergamos

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2016, 07:40:41 pm »
I can't judge you for voting Clinton, the people that do are pricks.  It's clear to anyone with any brains on the left that she is better than Trump, at least in the short term, especially for non white people.  I can't do it myself, I can't vote for Clinton after the way she's behaved in the primary and after dealing, my entire adult life, with the fallout from her husband's administration.  I would prefer Trump in that he would be a disaster, and I am hopeful that disaster would cause a hard swing to the left in 2020.  I certainly cant bring myself to vote for him either, but I will go third party rather than vote for Clinton.  It may be a shitty decision on my part but I hope you can refrain from judging me for which shit sandwhich I choose, the same as I refrain from judging you.

LMNO

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2016, 07:50:55 pm »
So, explain to me how, after a primary where the "more radical" candidates made a strong showing on both the left and right, a disastrous four years of Trump (including, let's not forget, a Supreme Court pick) would somehow spur the country into thinking, "yeah, more of that, please"?

To me, it seems far more probable that the majority of voters would swing hard middle away from both extremes, leaving ideologues out in the cold for a long, long time.

I feel if Bernie were really sincere about a "revolution", he would immediately pivot his current momentum into changing the makeup of the House and Senate, where an influx of lefter-leaning politicians would begin forming a base to a more liberal government.

Pergamos

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2016, 08:10:06 pm »
We've had decades of being screwed by the middle, If the middle is bad, and the far right is worse that leaves the far left as a possibly not bad option.  Clinton will give us more of what we've received from every politician since (at least) Bush Sr.  That hasn't worked out well for most people and looks to me like it will produce a hard swing to the right in 2020. 

The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #5 on: April 29, 2016, 08:57:14 pm »
The point of this chapter wasn't who you should vote for.

The point was that I don't want anyone to feel that there will be no hard feelings when this election cycle is over.  Because there will be.  Oh, yes.  The three people that shit on me publicly over all of this may one day be forgiven.

I'm thinking 3 days after I forgive Hugh and Eldora.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

 "Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

LMNO

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #6 on: April 29, 2016, 08:59:30 pm »
"We had to destroy the country in order to save it.  Detroit has been renamed My Lai."

Q. G. Pennyworth

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #7 on: April 29, 2016, 09:09:16 pm »
This sums up my feelings nicely.

Cain

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2016, 09:16:47 pm »
Seriously.  The two of them, Sanders and Clinton, have something like 93-97% voting parity.  I can understand being a bit more supportive of one over the other, preferences based on style, viability, history, rhetoric...but some of the vitriol that has been thrown around, you'd think some people were convinced their opposing candidate was closer to Trump.  Or Hitler.

The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2016, 09:39:02 pm »
Seriously.  The two of them, Sanders and Clinton, have something like 93-97% voting parity.  I can understand being a bit more supportive of one over the other, preferences based on style, viability, history, rhetoric...but some of the vitriol that has been thrown around, you'd think some people were convinced their opposing candidate was closer to Trump.  Or Hitler.

Something about hating people for their doctrine the closer their doctrine is to yours.


" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

 "Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Eater of Clowns

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #10 on: April 29, 2016, 09:56:06 pm »
Fucking RAH!

I 100% do not get the vitriol aimed at Clinton. She's not ideal, but witnessing the complete unwillingness to settle for a less than Jesus-level perfect candidate really makes the Bernie crowd sound like they're playing Baby's First Election Cycle. Sack up, kids, progress isn't winning this election but it's not precisely losing, either, unless everyone decides it's hopeless and stays home and uses none of the momentum.
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The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #11 on: April 29, 2016, 10:02:03 pm »
Fucking RAH!

I 100% do not get the vitriol aimed at Clinton. She's not ideal, but witnessing the complete unwillingness to settle for a less than Jesus-level perfect candidate really makes the Bernie crowd sound like they're playing Baby's First Election Cycle. Sack up, kids, progress isn't winning this election but it's not precisely losing, either, unless everyone decides it's hopeless and stays home and uses none of the momentum.

But the vitriol aimed at Sanders voters since last November is just fine.  I didn't take it personally or anything.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

 "Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #12 on: April 29, 2016, 10:02:30 pm »
So I'm gonna sack up and stuff.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

 "Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Eater of Clowns

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #13 on: April 29, 2016, 10:04:33 pm »
Fucking RAH!

I 100% do not get the vitriol aimed at Clinton. She's not ideal, but witnessing the complete unwillingness to settle for a less than Jesus-level perfect candidate really makes the Bernie crowd sound like they're playing Baby's First Election Cycle. Sack up, kids, progress isn't winning this election but it's not precisely losing, either, unless everyone decides it's hopeless and stays home and uses none of the momentum.

But the vitriol aimed at Sanders voters since last November is just fine.  I didn't take it personally or anything.

Not what I meant at all, bud. Let the hate flow on.
EoC, you are the bane of my existence.

EoC doesn't make creepy.

EoC makes creepy worse.

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the afflicted persons get hold of and consume carrots even in socially quite unacceptable situations.

The Good Reverend Roger

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Re: The Elephant in the Living Room, part 1
« Reply #14 on: April 29, 2016, 10:09:49 pm »
Fucking RAH!

I 100% do not get the vitriol aimed at Clinton. She's not ideal, but witnessing the complete unwillingness to settle for a less than Jesus-level perfect candidate really makes the Bernie crowd sound like they're playing Baby's First Election Cycle. Sack up, kids, progress isn't winning this election but it's not precisely losing, either, unless everyone decides it's hopeless and stays home and uses none of the momentum.

But the vitriol aimed at Sanders voters since last November is just fine.  I didn't take it personally or anything.

Not what I meant at all, bud. Let the hate flow on.

I will.  This thread isn't about political realities.  It's about the way supposed friends demonstrate contempt over said politics.  It's when you find out that a "friend" of 10+ years wasn't really your friend, you were just pixels on her screen and an occasional advantage to be used.  Or an army buddy you've known since 1987 that has decided that you are scum for not riding the whole Sanders thing down in flames.

It's about the fact that most of the Jesii may forgive, but I am not any of them.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

 "Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.