How Trump Happened Part 1 of Whatever

[The Good Reverend Roger]

You know what the problem is with your message, RP?  Seriously?  No bullshit?

Go right ahead.

Fascism - in any form - is a lot of pomp and bullshit, but when you strip all the glitter off of it, it's shabby.  Boring.

Right now, we can make choices based on our ability to financially support those choices.  Hardly ideal.  But under fascism, you get choices based on whether you can ingratiate yourself to the sole ruling party, provided you can grease the right officials and kiss the right asses.

It's pretty much the only system available that is worse than what we have, short of outright autocracy (DPRK, etc).

So you are going door-to-door, trying to sell a lump of shit with an Amway-esue "eco-fascist" logo on it.

I had expected better of you.  You seem like a smart guy...And while I know that intelligence alone is no protection from religious thinking, I sort of assumed that the Discordian bit of you would short-circuit the influence of other, more malign cult behavior.

That last bit is *my* fault, because in the last little while, there is ample evidence to the contrary from a lot of people around here.  But still, your product is frankly crap, no matter how jubilant and/or butthurt you are about it.

[xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed)]

You know what the problem is with your message, RP?  Seriously?  No bullshit?

Go right ahead.

Fascism - in any form - is a lot of pomp and bullshit, but when you strip all the glitter off of it, it's shabby.  Boring.

Right now, we can make choices based on our ability to financially support those choices.  Hardly ideal.  But under fascism, you get choices based on whether you can ingratiate yourself to the sole ruling party, provided you can grease the right officials and kiss the right asses.

It's pretty much the only system available that is worse than what we have, short of outright autocracy (DPRK, etc).

So you are going door-to-door, trying to sell a lump of shit with an Amway-esue "eco-fascist" logo on it.

I had expected better of you.  You seem like a smart guy...And while I know that intelligence alone is no protection from religious thinking, I sort of assumed that the Discordian bit of you would short-circuit the influence of other, more malign cult behavior.

That last bit is *my* fault, because in the last little while, there is ample evidence to the contrary from a lot of people around here.  But still, your product is frankly crap, no matter how jubilant and/or butthurt you are about it.

But you see thats the thing. Fascism is whats going to happen. Its unavoidable. Dont tell me you havent noticed the headlines about how Trump proves that "democracy has failed" or "democracy isnt working." Trump, not for you but for the other half of America, is a big boost in legitimacy for the current system. Maybe he can keep things going for awhile, maybe not. If he doesnt, if EVERYONE is suddenly completely disillusioned with Democracy then fascism is not far away.
   It wont call itself fascism, you will likely not even recognize it as fascism, but it will be. You will cheer for it when it comes, all of you, and you ill never call it what it is. Im just ahead of the curve, and Ill recognize what it is when it happens. I want fascism to happen right. If we have to go through a few decades, or even centuries with fascism the least it can do is leave a more habitable earth behind for the future. Thats another advantage of seeing it coming, I plan on getting in on the ground floor.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

You know what the problem is with your message, RP?  Seriously?  No bullshit?

Go right ahead.

Fascism - in any form - is a lot of pomp and bullshit, but when you strip all the glitter off of it, it's shabby.  Boring.

Right now, we can make choices based on our ability to financially support those choices.  Hardly ideal.  But under fascism, you get choices based on whether you can ingratiate yourself to the sole ruling party, provided you can grease the right officials and kiss the right asses.

It's pretty much the only system available that is worse than what we have, short of outright autocracy (DPRK, etc).

So you are going door-to-door, trying to sell a lump of shit with an Amway-esue "eco-fascist" logo on it.

I had expected better of you.  You seem like a smart guy...And while I know that intelligence alone is no protection from religious thinking, I sort of assumed that the Discordian bit of you would short-circuit the influence of other, more malign cult behavior.

That last bit is *my* fault, because in the last little while, there is ample evidence to the contrary from a lot of people around here.  But still, your product is frankly crap, no matter how jubilant and/or butthurt you are about it.

But you see thats the thing. Fascism is whats going to happen. Its unavoidable. Dont tell me you havent noticed the headlines about how Trump proves that "democracy has failed" or "democracy isnt working." Trump, not for you but for the other half of America, is a big boost in legitimacy for the current system. Maybe he can keep things going for awhile, maybe not. If he doesnt, if EVERYONE is suddenly completely disillusioned with Democracy then fascism is not far away.
   It wont call itself fascism, you will likely not even recognize it as fascism, but it will be. You will cheer for it when it comes, all of you, and you ill never call it what it is. Im just ahead of the curve, and Ill recognize what it is when it happens. I want fascism to happen right. If we have to go through a few decades, or even centuries with fascism the least it can do is leave a more habitable earth behind for the future. Thats another advantage of seeing it coming, I plan on getting in on the ground floor.

Never mind, keep preaching.

[xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed)]

You know what the problem is with your message, RP?  Seriously?  No bullshit?

Go right ahead.

Fascism - in any form - is a lot of pomp and bullshit, but when you strip all the glitter off of it, it's shabby.  Boring.

Right now, we can make choices based on our ability to financially support those choices.  Hardly ideal.  But under fascism, you get choices based on whether you can ingratiate yourself to the sole ruling party, provided you can grease the right officials and kiss the right asses.

It's pretty much the only system available that is worse than what we have, short of outright autocracy (DPRK, etc).

So you are going door-to-door, trying to sell a lump of shit with an Amway-esue "eco-fascist" logo on it.

I had expected better of you.  You seem like a smart guy...And while I know that intelligence alone is no protection from religious thinking, I sort of assumed that the Discordian bit of you would short-circuit the influence of other, more malign cult behavior.

That last bit is *my* fault, because in the last little while, there is ample evidence to the contrary from a lot of people around here.  But still, your product is frankly crap, no matter how jubilant and/or butthurt you are about it.

But you see thats the thing. Fascism is whats going to happen. Its unavoidable. Dont tell me you havent noticed the headlines about how Trump proves that "democracy has failed" or "democracy isnt working." Trump, not for you but for the other half of America, is a big boost in legitimacy for the current system. Maybe he can keep things going for awhile, maybe not. If he doesnt, if EVERYONE is suddenly completely disillusioned with Democracy then fascism is not far away.
   It wont call itself fascism, you will likely not even recognize it as fascism, but it will be. You will cheer for it when it comes, all of you, and you ill never call it what it is. Im just ahead of the curve, and Ill recognize what it is when it happens. I want fascism to happen right. If we have to go through a few decades, or even centuries with fascism the least it can do is leave a more habitable earth behind for the future. Thats another advantage of seeing it coming, I plan on getting in on the ground floor.

Never mind, keep preaching.

If you like it or not it is inevitable. It doesnt matter if its shabby, boring, inefficient, it will happen. I just want it to be environmentally friendly.

[Faust]

I said this in the other thread: When eco becomes the policy thrust upon the government, which will happen regardless of which party is in office. It won't be fascism, and it wont be ordered, and there will be no one thankful for it when it manifests as it is dramatic population reduction and nothing more.

You can call it fascism if you want, but it wont uphold any of the tenants of fascism other then mass death at scale.

[xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed)]

You can call it fascism if you want, but it wont uphold any of the tenants of fascism other then mass death at scale.

That isnt really a tenant of fascism. And I wholly disagree that this will be thrust on the government. We are already seeing the negative effects of ecological devestation, no one is changing. We get petty changes, carbon taxes that just punt emissions off to poorer countries, banning BPA which just replaces it with even worse shit like Tritan.

Look at shit like this https://www.rt.com/news/172340-dubai-climate-controlled-city/ and tell me they ever plan on stopping. Someday they will eventually be forced to like you said, but it will be too late, it will be desperately trying to patch up the massive irreversible devastation once they finally realize that Climate Domes and Drones wont save them and that they cannot actually eat money.

And population has little to do with it. There is enough on this Earth for every person to live a good life. There isnt enough for everyone to live an industrial life. There isnt enough for everyone to have a pair of nikes and an xbox. But thats what we try to do. We are so insanely dedicated to our miserable poisonous way of life that we would rather see millions of people die than just stop. That we find that more conceivable than giving up cheap electronics and McDonalds.

What youre describing is very likely, it is also a nightmare. We need to work towards the alternative NOW, not later. And it has to be us not the literally satanic Savile and Co reptiles whove taken turning the entire world into a shopping mall as their holy mission in life.

[Junkenstein]

rt.com.

Jesus fucking wept.

[xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed)]

rt.com.

Jesus fucking wept.

http://motherboard.vice.com/read/dubais-domed-climate-controlled-city-is-a-dystopia-waiting-to-happen

http://io9.gizmodo.com/dubai-to-build-the-worlds-first-climate-controlled-city-1601731394

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/07/08/dubai_announces_huge_domed_city_climate_controlled_gigamall/

Ive noticed you people are obsessed with appealing to authority. Like when I linked to that vid of a Trump supporter being attacked all you had to say was INFOWARS. Does this story being on RT make it less true? Are you saying there ISNT a domed city being built in the UAE? Do you in fact have anything at all to add to this conversation?

[Faust]

It hasn't started yet because the many single point failures we have created for ourself have not happened yet, we're still waiting for the other shoe to drop and no one will take it seriously until that happens.

I would agree it's a nightmare scenario, but I would also say we have passed the point of no return. I would also disagree that there is enough for everyone to live what I've seen as the modest life. It's simply a numbers game:

With 7 Billion people we as a collective community share the following single point failures
-Energy: Oil production peaked several years ago, we're now mopping up the dregs with hydrophracking which is both a short term solution and artificially deflates oil costs, Saudi claims that there is no downturn because they have maintained the levels of production. In reality we need increased production to sustain things at current levels.
When this falls it wont be Xbox's you need to worry about, it will be the heating, transport infrastructure for food. The transport argument generally deflates anyone who is ready to shout out nuclear when the energy issue is brought up never takes into account that does nothing to mitigate the infrastructural issues. Not to mention the use of agricultural machinery.
The time frame on this one is vague, we don't know when it will run out.
A solution to this is renewable for as much as possible of the infrastructure, batteries for vehicles, reduced air transport, and less reliance on long haul food transport via shipping. It also has a knock on effect on medicine but the other parts will hurt us before that.
Regardless of how much you get in renewable, there simply isn't a way to do it at that scale. It means when this shoe drops you get famine

Medicine: With antibiotics gradually failing and nothing to replace them people will start dying from common infections again. There are two simple solutions to this: reduce the use of antiboitics (used extensively in agriculture, that's two for a famine), or reduce the propagation factor: this is not an area I am hugely knowledgeable but the risk comes in when a virus/bacteria? copies itself, when it incubates in a new person who uses antibiotics it increases its chances of becoming resistant. The only solution to this is find a new antibiotic, or stop people using them in which case again you have megadeaths

The already polluted fish bowl: the icecaps are melting, we passed the critical point of no return on temperature increases, global warming is now a given. The mitigation of the scale of damage we have committed is the best we can hope for. At best you now have a closed system with more energy in it = more volatile storms, rising sea levels and changes to ecological habitat. Best case scenario a few land masses are uninhabitable and we have to shift crop growth around a bit. Worst case is crop failure or reduced yield.

All in all we are likely looking at a massive famine anywhere between 2-20 years away. This will result in automatically reducing the population in a dramatic and rather rapid fashion. Don't expect any kind of fascism to help that be averted, and don't expect a fascist society to be nice and ordered when the shit hits the fan. Starving people don't like to conform.

[Faust]

Biodomes and closed systems like that work for very small limited groups of people. When they work.
They have a reliance on external maintenance and in a lot of cases food and pumping out of waste.
Again, don't expect starving people to protect you in your bubble, expect them to eat you right as soon as they are done cutting off your breathable air supply.

[Junkenstein]

rt.com.

Jesus fucking wept.

http://motherboard.vice.com/read/dubais-domed-climate-controlled-city-is-a-dystopia-waiting-to-happen

http://io9.gizmodo.com/dubai-to-build-the-worlds-first-climate-controlled-city-1601731394

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/07/08/dubai_announces_huge_domed_city_climate_controlled_gigamall/

Ive noticed you people are obsessed with appealing to authority. Like when I linked to that vid of a Trump supporter being attacked all you had to say was INFOWARS. Does this story being on RT make it less true? Are you saying there ISNT a domed city being built in the UAE? Do you in fact have anything at all to add to this conversation?

I'm saying that an RT.com articles has unusual levels of opinion disguised and presented as truth. That alone is enough to make me ignore it. When a news source is not credible, it's not a news source. Therefore largely irrelevant.

If I want to read propaganda, I'll read something funnier.


You seem a little upset. Is it because I'm not bothering to read your wall of bullshit and just pointing out obvious reasons to dismiss it?

[The Wizard Joseph]

Any time you feel like shutting the fuck up, please feel free.

2018 cant come fast enough.

>butthurt
>winning

Also this should just be pointed out:

They truly believe this is a legitimate response because to them education is not to be trusted.

The education system is currently selling an entire generation into debt slavery and you think it SHOULD be trusted? Do you honestly think people who make you take out massive loans to pay for a piece of paper that might or might get an actual education with it, in the vain hopes that this piece of paper will let you get a good enough job to eventually pay it off, actually care about informing you about how the world works? Like, do you think career debt slavers taught you all privilege and social justice crap, because theyre good people who want to see you cast off the shackles of your oppression?

[The Wizard Joseph]

But I read Faust loud and clear....  yup.. 

A bit more irony for the RPspag: Selling out your soul and species for absolutely nothing that you hoped to gain. The usual game, new fish.

Well... at least now
I have room for more.

[Faust]

But I read Faust loud and clear....  yup.. 

A bit more irony for the RPspag: Selling out your soul and species for absolutely nothing that you hoped to gain. The usual game, new fish.

Well... at least now
I have room for more.

Yeah bear in mind, this isn't what I want, its what I fear will happen, unless a miracle happens.

[The Wizard Joseph]

But I read Faust loud and clear....  yup.. 

A bit more irony for the RPspag: Selling out your soul and species for absolutely nothing that you hoped to gain. The usual game, new fish.

Well... at least now
I have room for more.

Yeah bear in mind, this isn't what I want, its what I fear will happen, unless a miracle happens.

Oh yeah. Faust in your case I've never had a doubt about sincerity. I also understand the very real dangers of systemic failure fairly well and think you're probably all too correct. Any chance of reversing or meaningfully mitigating the trend just went extinct, eventually all we know as life will follow. It's not going to be anything like RP's deluded intent. Just industrial waste and slow collapse until resource wwars go nuclear or worse.

Did you see the new "Fury Road" Road Warrior movie? The protagonist makes a good point about hope being deadly because it makes you do dumb shit like ride into certain doom to avoid a fight that's merely hopeless.