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"It's not my job to educate you" - asymmetries in accessibility

Started by Cramulus, May 06, 2020, 02:27:10 PM

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lexi

Quote from: Fujikoma on November 14, 2020, 01:34:03 PM
The energy behind my behavior pattern comes from my male inability to admit defeat, would be nice if it weren't a thing, I know, snip snip and it's over. My impulse control is ever a problem. Thanks for recognizing my self-awareness.

I mean, I could ship you some testosterone blockers today which i no longer need, but do you really think that is the culprit? Masculinity doesn't require testosterone, as much as having testosterone doesn't automatically make you a man. I can think of plenty of people who don't identify as a man but still can't admit defeat.

Your self-awareness is obvious, which makes it all the more curious to me why you ignore it. Any unresolved conflicts gnawing at you?

Frontside Back

Quote from: Fujikoma on November 13, 2020, 11:53:34 PM
If you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him.
I met Buddha on the road and had a pleasant conversation about the 2nd amendment and how people just randomly assault people these days.
"I want to be the Borg but I want to do it alone."

Chelagoras The Boulder

I agree with Dok for the most part, the tricky part is that some trolls like sealioning enough that they've gotten good at appearing to be the first type of person- engaged, ready to learn, looking for honest debate, but after those 2 minutes even if you recognize their shitneckery,  they may have already laid the groundwork to convince whoever else is on a given thread. All they want is an audience, after all. not saying one should give up on trying to educate anyone on anything ever, but this is a thing I've noticed.
"It isn't who you know, it's who you know, if you know what I mean.  And I think you do."

The Johnny


"Can you explain to me why you think submittiing my will and desires to a tyrant is a bad idea? Genuinely curious, pls answer. BTW, i think democracy is socialism and the weak should perish."
<<My image in some places, is of a monster of some kind who wants to pull a string and manipulate people. Nothing could be further from the truth. People are manipulated; I just want them to be manipulated more effectively.>>

-B.F. Skinner

lexi

Quote from: Chelagoras The Boulder on November 16, 2020, 03:55:31 AM
I agree with Dok for the most part, the tricky part is that some trolls like sealioning enough that they've gotten good at appearing to be the first type of person- engaged, ready to learn, looking for honest debate, but after those 2 minutes even if you recognize their shitneckery,  they may have already laid the groundwork to convince whoever else is on a given thread. All they want is an audience, after all. not saying one should give up on trying to educate anyone on anything ever, but this is a thing I've noticed.
True. Is this surprising given how many seem to choose going online as a form of entertainment to comfort and reinforce not challenge their view of reality? The most effective way to engage with such people is one-on-one, offline.

But it's a dirty job and I'm no longer doing it.

Fujikoma

Quote from: purpleXi on November 14, 2020, 02:04:46 PM
Quote from: Fujikoma on November 14, 2020, 01:34:03 PM
The energy behind my behavior pattern comes from my male inability to admit defeat, would be nice if it weren't a thing, I know, snip snip and it's over. My impulse control is ever a problem. Thanks for recognizing my self-awareness.

I mean, I could ship you some testosterone blockers today which i no longer need, but do you really think that is the culprit? Masculinity doesn't require testosterone, as much as having testosterone doesn't automatically make you a man. I can think of plenty of people who don't identify as a man but still can't admit defeat.

Your self-awareness is obvious, which makes it all the more curious to me why you ignore it. Any unresolved conflicts gnawing at you?

I appreciate the offer but I'd probably just keel over without testosterone. You are correct that plenty of people don't admit defeat when they possibly should. That said I should likely show others respect and shut the fuck up. It seems like there's something everyone else gets that I'm missing, been that way my whole life, still waiting for that magical piece of the puzzle that is so easy for others to access, but not everyone is so offended that I have a few loose screws.

lexi

I know what that feels like. Is it more likely that everyone else has found the same magical puzzle piece, or just found a set of reality filters that happens to work for them in their daily interactions?

How likely is it that shutting the fuck up is going to grant you the understanding you seek?

Fujikoma

It's actually unusually practical, I can listen to these folks ramble and glean little bits of knowlege from what they say.

To answer your first question though... I don't know. In my mind that magical piece doesn't exist, it's just something everyone else seems to have, I suppose it's a shared hallucination.

lexi

Progress involves first learning history, then repeating the same mistakes. Don't listen to the clowns who say you can learn without falling on your face :)

You need at least 10 learys of acid to pull off a half decent shared hallucination. That's hard to obtain - it's easier to find The Others. Where do you feel like you most belong?

Fujikoma

I was actually a test subject for a friend who dealt acid back in the early nineties, I did a LOT of it.

Fujikoma

But me and where I belong, it feels like wherever I get accepted I have to tear my way in with my teeth. It's definitely not something that's just a given, not something that happens overnight, but I really, actively have to force my personality on everyone until they get used to me, that's not gonna happen here, for pretty obvious reasons.

lexi

Quote from: Fujikoma on November 17, 2020, 03:36:20 AM
But me and where I belong, it feels like wherever I get accepted I have to tear my way in with my teeth. It's definitely not something that's just a given, not something that happens overnight, but I really, actively have to force my personality on everyone until they get used to me,
Does it bother you that an approach where you force anything is by definition non-consensual - or am I misunderstanding you? Is this something you are aware of in the moment, or a post-event narrative?


Fujikoma

This is a world of force. We're edging away from that but it has always been about force. It will be about force for as long as we solve problems with ballistics. To argue otherwise is to be a victim, and who wants that? This world is hard, lonely, fucked up, and you take whatever you can get from it, because it only gets worse from here. One day, you're going to get older, and waste away and die. Nobody is going to remember Alexis the graceful soul but they will never forget Alexis the horrific savage.

Doktor Howl

Quote from: Fujikoma on November 17, 2020, 04:00:59 AM
This is a world of force. We're edging away from that but it has always been about force. It will be about force for as long as we solve problems with ballistics. To argue otherwise is to be a victim, and who wants that? This world is hard, lonely, fucked up, and you take whatever you can get from it, because it only gets worse from here. One day, you're going to get older, and waste away and die. Nobody is going to remember Alexis the graceful soul but they will never forget Alexis the horrific savage.

Needs MOAR angst.
Molon Lube

lexi

Quote from: Fujikoma on November 17, 2020, 04:00:59 AM
This is a world of force. We're edging away from that but it has always been about force. It will be about force for as long as we solve problems with ballistics. To argue otherwise is to be a victim, and who wants that? This world is hard, lonely, fucked up, and you take whatever you can get from it, because it only gets worse from here. One day, you're going to get older, and waste away and die. Nobody is going to remember Alexis the graceful soul but they will never forget Alexis the horrific savage.
I have to go wash my hair now, but if you expound upon this theory in a separate thread - I'll argue the fuck out of it later.