http://blog.holist.hu/?p=842 (http://blog.holist.hu/?p=842)
Slag it.
hm... i recommend adding more white space and then shaking it up a bit. that should make the funny more powerful.
Quote from: Elder Iptuous on November 28, 2012, 10:38:22 PM
hm... i recommend adding more white space and then shaking it up a bit. that should make the funny more powerful.
I think I understand the more white space (I considered adding pillows and more of the duvet, in outline only... but drawing with a mouse is atrocious, can you recommend a reliable, useful but not very expensive digitizing tablet?) - but I'm at a loss as to what you mean by shaking up a bit. Can you explain?
http://blog.holist.hu/?p=852
Punchline?
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 30, 2012, 02:13:00 PM
Punchline?
I think it's called wry humour.
Not your kind of funny.
Again.
Poor Roger.
Quote from: holist on November 30, 2012, 03:21:24 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 30, 2012, 03:20:33 PM
Quote from: holist on November 30, 2012, 03:17:38 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 30, 2012, 02:13:00 PM
Punchline?
I think it's called wry humour.
Not your kind of funny.
Again.
Poor Roger.
The execution sucked.
What, the guillotine wasn't sharpened properly? Bug off.
Shoe pinches like a bitch on the other foot, doesn't it? I am merely giving you the same critique you so kindly gave to Twid.
Your comic sucks. It's really that simple. It is to comics what pictures of dogs playing poker are to fine art.
Personally don't find this good at all.
Are your comics supposed to be one shots or is there a story involved, because as one shots it sucks horribly.
If there is a story you really need to work on how each page ties together.
First page was roll eye worthy at best. Second page just seemed like you were relaying some uneventful event.
Just the opinion of one avid webcomic reader.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 30, 2012, 03:23:19 PM
Shoe pinches like a bitch on the other foot, doesn't it? I am merely giving you the same critique you so kindly gave to Twid.
Fair point. But actually, from where I'm standing, you not liking my comics just makes them shine all the brighter.
:lulz:
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 30, 2012, 03:23:19 PM
Your comic sucks. It's really that simple. It is to comics what pictures of dogs playing poker are to fine art.
No, it's not that simple. The poor drawing (with a mouse) was intentional, I didn't do it because I couldn't do it differently, but because I liked the effect. The contrast of photographic faces with completely lame black-on-white line drawing is pleasing to my eyes, though I appreciate that to others it may not be appealing. But I would like to mention that I have been invited by an artists' collective to print and frame these two for a collective exhibition on the theme of "WHITE" (http://zoldlampas.blogspot.hu/2012/05/pingpong-klub.html - sorry, it's in Hungarian). I will be able to provide photographic evidence after the opening on the 15th of december.
Also, what I was aiming to produce were sort of "mock-up" webcomics - something graphically dead simple as a vehicle for the little conversations - vignettes, if I may be excused for using a pretentious word, of married life. But, since you are short-sighted and boorish, you fail to look past your nose and choose to "teach me by example", or "feed me a spoonful of my own medicine". Which is fine by me.
:lulz:
yeah, not funny. But then you're hungarian.
ok, you like the simplicity so as to be no more than a vehicle for the conversation. (a la xkcd where it's just stick figures, or dinosaur comics where it's all reuse) got it.
but the conversations have no evident point from the perspective of the viewer.
so it is one of those jokes where the punchline is the audience, as far as i can see.
Will look at later.
Quote from: Elder Iptuous on November 30, 2012, 04:23:44 PM
ok, you like the simplicity so as to be no more than a vehicle for the conversation. (a la xkcd where it's just stick figures, or dinosaur comics where it's all reuse) got it.
but the conversations have no evident point from the perspective of the viewer.
so it is one of those jokes where the punchline is the audience, as far as i can see.
Well that's curious. Over here, over a dozen people have found it funny, in roughly the same way. At the risk of explaining it do death, and only because I am interested in why you say what you say, I shall attempt to explain.
But first: where did it say that you needed an evident point in order to be humorous? I thought ambiguity was a major source of humour...
But, anyway: the older story, the 4-picture one is, I thought, really quite xkcd-ey... the brainy, verbose man, the down-to-earth, determined woman... also, the use-mention crossover, when the conversation itself becomes a case in point at the end (I did toy with the idea of adding a fifth picture in which Bruno says "it's three things now", but decided it would be too didactic). For me, it is also a paradigmatic example of how attempts at communication in a busy marriage can go awry through no fault of either party other than, possibly, slight and easily forgiven negligence... which, if left untreated, can lead to awful horrors...
The newer, 3-picture one is less subtle. Just an observation of how unequally object-management skills and duties are often distributed in relationships... and how struggling against it is futile.
so....
people like you are common in Hungary? :sad:
humor is frequently found in the tension between some point and its obscurity due to some vagueness which is then pierced. otherwise it's nonsense, which can be aesthetically pleasing in its own right.
...can be.
Quote from: Elder Iptuous on November 30, 2012, 04:54:21 PM
so....
people like you are common in Hungary? :sad:
Actually, not particularly...
Quote from: Elder Iptuous on November 30, 2012, 04:54:21 PM
humor is frequently found in the tension between some point and its obscurity due to some vagueness which is then pierced. otherwise it's nonsense, which can be aesthetically pleasing in its own right.
...can be.
hmm. So my explanations about what the points are are not worthy of comment?
I don't care how verbose he is, a brainy man would have had better grammatical sense than to use "now" twice in the first sentence just as he did, knowing it would grate on the eyes and ears of brainier men than he.
Also, something being placed in an exhibit only means that the person placing it there might like it, but has no indication of its quality otherwise.
And it WAS just like xkcd except for the part where it wasn't funny and wasn't anything like it
I liked the white spaces between the pictures.
I liked the first one. It's so true and shit. :lulz:
I don't like the artwork!
I get the contrast thing you did with it, but it's not my thing. Not this time at least.
Being totally objective, seriously.
I don't get it.
Really I don't. You failed in your delivery.
And honestly I wanted to like it, so I could ride a high horse.
Hey, I can be a dick too, just a more moral and indignant one.
But seriously dude, I don't know if it's a Hungarian humor thing, if something's getting lost in translation or what.
But being familiar with American, British, and Irish humor... it's just some dull, meaningless conversation. But as an honest critique, I just don't get it.
:boring: :boring: :boring: :boring: :boring:/5
If you fail to reach the audience, then you have failed. And your comic did. Your totally insufferable response to critiques is no one likes you. If you want worship, then a) don't post it here because slobbering praise is not in PD's make up, and b) don't ask us to "slag it" if you're gonna refuse all suggestions anyway.
(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh309/Paesior/HolistComic.png)
Quote from: Pæs on December 02, 2012, 02:14:44 AM
(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh309/Paesior/HolistComic.png)
:lulz:
(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh309/Paesior/HolistComic2.png)
Oh, shit. :lulz: :lulz: :lulz: Paes, delivering the coup de grace.
Quote from: Pæs on December 02, 2012, 02:14:44 AM
(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh309/Paesior/HolistComic.png)
Brilliant! How long did it take you?
Of course, it's also a bit of a sleight of hand... I was talking to iptous, so while funny, the comic lies about me. Which makes it propaganda? Maybe not quite.
Quote from: Secret Agent GARBO on December 01, 2012, 10:42:08 PM
If you fail to reach the audience, then you have failed. And your comic did. Your totally insufferable response to critiques is no one likes you. If you want worship, then a) don't post it here because slobbering praise is not in PD's make up, and b) don't ask us to "slag it" if you're gonna refuse all suggestions anyway.
Well boo-hoo, but not quite. I produced some pictures. I showed it some people. Most found them funny in an understated way, some encouraged me to exhibit them. One bunch of people, in a bizarre corner of my life, who are largely rather hostile towards me for other reasons, decided it wasn't worth shit.
Story of the artists life, really.
I don't mind it being slagged, but I think the only valid criticism offered so far was offered by Iptous, at the beginning. "I don't get it"', "It sucks" and "It's not funny" are not valid forms of criticism, and if they are offered as such (rather than opinion, which is what they are), that really only speaks about the person(s) offering them. Not nicely. :lulz:
Quote from: holist on December 02, 2012, 07:54:16 AM
Of course, it's also a bit of a sleight of hand... I was talking to iptous, so while funny, the comic lies about me. Which makes it propaganda? Maybe not quite.
It also suggests that Roger enjoyed your comic once you explained it, so I feel like I balanced the injustice that was done by misrepresenting the conversation.
The comic reminds me of Fred Basset, in that it establishes characters going about what we infer are fairly typical behaviours for those characters. It feels like the setup for a clever twist and we buy into it despite the stereotype being played upon because we're anticipating some interesting juxtaposition, reversal or any sort of surprise at all. And then the scene ends.
Fred Basset:
(http://www.webcomicsnation.com/memberimages/the_worst_of_fred_basset_1.jpg)
And another:
(http://www.webcomicsnation.com/memberimages/the_worst_of_fred_basset_21.jpg)
It may be that it was interesting the first time I recognised the scenarios portrayed in your comic as recurring themes and that my disinterest could be explained as overexposure.
Because I find nothing particularly noteworthy in the dialogue of the first comic (I don't think enough is done to establish brainy and verbose vs determined and down to earth, those characters weren't communicated to me at all) , the message I get is "it's common for couples to disagree about things... and further, disagree about how to approach those disagreements" but I cannot think of any packaging in which this message would entertain me.
It probably does communicate that "attempts at communication in a busy marriage can go awry through no fault of either party other than, possibly, slight and easily forgiven negligence" but you could have typed that on a blank background and entertained me equally.
Similarly with the second comic, sure, object-management skills and duties are often distributed unequally in relationships... but I am left desiring a point, as Iptuous was. I don't think that ambiguity is, by itself, a source of humour. It can be funny when, for example, the intended messages is contrasted with a dirty or absurd interpretation... but it's not funny just because it's ambiguous.
I have, in my experience as a comedian, not had an audience whose entertainment I would anticipate in response to these comics but that may be down to my own indifference to the material or some cultural difference I am unaware of.
Ｉ"ｍ ｎｏｔ ｓｅｅｉｎｇ ｔｈｅ ａｍｂｉｇｕｉｔｙ ｔｈａｔ ｐｅｏｐｌｅ ａｒｅ ｔａｌｋｉｎｇ ａｂｏｕｔ, anyone care to elucidate? Also the comedy that tickles me personally is the type that riffs off familiarity and recognition, and I get that from both of these.
Quote from: holist on December 02, 2012, 07:57:25 AM
Quote from: Secret Agent GARBO on December 01, 2012, 10:42:08 PM
If you fail to reach the audience, then you have failed. And your comic did. Your totally insufferable response to critiques is no one likes you. If you want worship, then a) don't post it here because slobbering praise is not in PD's make up, and b) don't ask us to "slag it" if you're gonna refuse all suggestions anyway.
Well boo-hoo, but not quite. I produced some pictures. I showed it some people. Most found them funny in an understated way, some encouraged me to exhibit them. One bunch of people, in a bizarre corner of my life, who are largely rather hostile towards me for other reasons, decided it wasn't worth shit.
Story of the artists life, really.
I don't mind it being slagged, but I think the only valid criticism offered so far was offered by Iptous, at the beginning. "I don't get it"', "It sucks" and "It's not funny" are not valid forms of criticism, and if they are offered as such (rather than opinion, which is what they are), that really only speaks about the person(s) offering them. Not nicely. :lulz:
Oh, so now "it sucks" is not a valid form of criticism? :lulz: :lulz: :lulz: Hypocrite.
For the record, I didn't find your comics funny, and I'm not seeing the alleged "ambiguity" you claim makes them funny.
Quote from: FROTISTED FUDGE CAK on December 02, 2012, 05:50:26 PM
Oh, so now "it sucks" is not a valid form of criticism? :lulz: :lulz: :lulz: Hypocrite.
It was offered as an opinion. The criticism came later. Twid didn't respond to it, as far as I know, but it was there.
Quote from: FROTISTED FUDGE CAK on December 02, 2012, 05:50:26 PM
For the record, I didn't find your comics funny, and I'm not seeing the alleged "ambiguity" you claim makes them funny.
Noted.
Quote from: holist on December 02, 2012, 05:55:27 PM
Quote from: FROTISTED FUDGE CAK on December 02, 2012, 05:50:26 PM
Oh, so now "it sucks" is not a valid form of criticism? :lulz: :lulz: :lulz: Hypocrite.
It was offered as an opinion. The criticism came later. Twid didn't respond to it, as far as I know, but it was there.
Quote from: FROTISTED FUDGE CAK on December 02, 2012, 05:50:26 PM
For the record, I didn't find your comics funny, and I'm not seeing the alleged "ambiguity" you claim makes them funny.
Noted.
Check your unlimited thread. When you finally did give a something more than "it sucks" I had a rebuttal.
Quote from: Nephew Twiddleton on December 02, 2012, 08:09:47 PM
Quote from: holist on December 02, 2012, 05:55:27 PM
Quote from: FROTISTED FUDGE CAK on December 02, 2012, 05:50:26 PM
Oh, so now "it sucks" is not a valid form of criticism? :lulz: :lulz: :lulz: Hypocrite.
It was offered as an opinion. The criticism came later. Twid didn't respond to it, as far as I know, but it was there.
Quote from: FROTISTED FUDGE CAK on December 02, 2012, 05:50:26 PM
For the record, I didn't find your comics funny, and I'm not seeing the alleged "ambiguity" you claim makes them funny.
Noted.
Check your unlimited thread. When you finally did give a something more than "it sucks" I had a rebuttal.
Sorry. If you would be so kind as to direct me to it, I would be very grateful. I am atrociously busy right now, sorry. I'll owe you a little.
Also, there is my latest blogpost (http://blog.holist.hu/?p=866 (http://blog.holist.hu/?p=866))! It have picture in it:
http://blog.holist.hu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/BrunoandNaomi3x-1024x767.jpg (http://blog.holist.hu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/BrunoandNaomi3x-1024x767.jpg)
Any comments? Better? Even worse? Differently bad? Different? :lulz:
Quote from: holist on December 02, 2012, 08:23:25 PM
Quote from: Nephew Twiddleton on December 02, 2012, 08:09:47 PM
Quote from: holist on December 02, 2012, 05:55:27 PM
Quote from: FROTISTED FUDGE CAK on December 02, 2012, 05:50:26 PM
Oh, so now "it sucks" is not a valid form of criticism? :lulz: :lulz: :lulz: Hypocrite.
It was offered as an opinion. The criticism came later. Twid didn't respond to it, as far as I know, but it was there.
Quote from: FROTISTED FUDGE CAK on December 02, 2012, 05:50:26 PM
For the record, I didn't find your comics funny, and I'm not seeing the alleged "ambiguity" you claim makes them funny.
Noted.
Check your unlimited thread. When you finally did give a something more than "it sucks" I had a rebuttal.
Sorry. If you would be so kind as to direct me to it, I would be very grateful. I am atrociously busy right now, sorry. I'll owe you a little.
Specifically this part. I snipped the rest.
Quote from: Nephew Twiddleton on December 01, 2012, 08:58:26 AM
Oh, we're doing this here?
QuoteI thought this would be a good opportunity to break the news to you: your band is not particularly talented, the music you produce is without interesting distinguishing features (twelve to a dozen, as they say)
Perhaps not. I leave that to the listener who isn't a fucking asshole for the sake of being an asshole.
Quoteyour understanding (as a band) of harmony, melody and rhythm is minimal at best: music may not be the field for you, despite the fact that you decided to hang most of your personality on 'being a musician' for a few years. I just shortened this to "your music sucks" for dramatic effect.
Aside for your "dramatic effect" you're way off base here. Perhaps my specific understanding of music theory is limited (it's not), but regardless, we do have a member who is a music major. With a degree. And a well sought after musician in the Boston area. And said member wouldn't put up with shitty composition. Just saying. I'd be willing to entertain you saying "I know you have two guitarists and I'm guessing you're the shitty one" but the suggestion that we, as a group, have no understanding of harmony, melody OR rhythm, shows that you're really speaking about your own skill set. Sorry. Just outed yourself as a musical idiot. Calling you on it.
As for owing me a little, you can pay that back by us going back to ignoring each other.
Hell, you may have a point with the idea that there's nothing that makes us pop out as a group. Everyone sounds the same sort of thing. But the rest of it kinda takes your argument into the territory of being an asshole intentionally.
Quote from: holist on December 02, 2012, 08:25:48 PM
Also, there is my latest blogpost (http://blog.holist.hu/?p=866 (http://blog.holist.hu/?p=866))! It have picture in it:
http://blog.holist.hu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/BrunoandNaomi3x-1024x767.jpg (http://blog.holist.hu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/BrunoandNaomi3x-1024x767.jpg)
Any comments? Better? Even worse? Differently bad? Different? :lulz:
With the dialogue supplied in the blog post? Still bad. I'm not sure it's differently bad.
This one feels less imitative of reality than the previous ones. The dialogue is emotionless and empty.
Because I haven't had much to do with you, I'm not sure whether outside of this format you are a very funny person. I haven't seen any evidence of your sense of comic timing, which is an important thing to bring to a comic narrative.
You came closest with Bruno's "I see. Thanks." I think if that had been a funny punchline, it could have done with a beat (pause: in a comic it's often a panel without dialogue) before the delivery of the line.
QuoteBruno: Do you think that is barking up the wrong tree? I'm increasingly suspicious, but it's hard to let go of it.
Naomi: I like this one. Really. Bruno, I think this, too, can be a viable avenue to explore.
Do you talk like this in real life? Something about the structure of these sentences (it may be that they feel like a poor translation, quiet unnatural to read) leads to my reading them rather than hearing them from the characters.
Quote from: Pæs on December 02, 2012, 08:47:37 PM
QuoteBruno: Do you think that is barking up the wrong tree? I'm increasingly suspicious, but it's hard to let go of it.
Naomi: I like this one. Really. Bruno, I think this, too, can be a viable avenue to explore.
Do you talk like this in real life? Something about the structure of these sentences (it may be that they feel like a poor translation, quiet unnatural to read) leads to my reading them rather than hearing them from the characters.
No, we don't. The second two sentences are actually from a couple of emails we exchanged with somebody else. The first two we made up, but no, we don't talk like that. Good Heavens. It is translated with a kind of pretentious tone, slightly off, on purpose. It's actually my kind of funny, though on a scale of ten I would only rate it 5 or 6. But I think it's an impossible idea to only make really good ones. (FYI, I think the first one, with its self-reference and inanity, is great. But I do have rather strange tastes.)
Quote from: holist on December 02, 2012, 08:25:48 PM
Also, there is my latest blogpost (http://blog.holist.hu/?p=866 (http://blog.holist.hu/?p=866))! It have picture in it:
http://blog.holist.hu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/BrunoandNaomi3x-1024x767.jpg (http://blog.holist.hu/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/BrunoandNaomi3x-1024x767.jpg)
Any comments? Better? Even worse? Differently bad? Different? :lulz:
I like the image. The dialogue, I do not get at all. It leaves me going :?
Quote from: holist on November 30, 2012, 05:07:58 PM
Quote from: Elder Iptuous on November 30, 2012, 04:54:21 PM
humor is frequently found in the tension between some point and its obscurity due to some vagueness which is then pierced. otherwise it's nonsense, which can be aesthetically pleasing in its own right.
...can be.
hmm. So my explanations about what the points are are not worthy of comment?
You explained the setup. There is no point.
These webcomics are half-done, at best. And I'm not talking about the stylistic choices you have chosen to pursuit.
But more on that they aren't jokes. They may classify as observations, but not amusing ones.
And I
am alternative comedy, so don't even try any "oh but you don't understand" or any of that bullshit.
I'm the kind of person who can point exactly at the je-ne-sais-quoi, and you're comic, while weird and
kinda going for the lame-funny, does not have that little extra. And in this specific case, that little extra would be "the funny".
Quote from: iSPEAKonlyFORthe23 on February 01, 2013, 12:06:02 AM
Quote from: holist on November 30, 2012, 05:07:58 PM
Quote from: Elder Iptuous on November 30, 2012, 04:54:21 PM
humor is frequently found in the tension between some point and its obscurity due to some vagueness which is then pierced. otherwise it's nonsense, which can be aesthetically pleasing in its own right.
...can be.
hmm. So my explanations about what the points are are not worthy of comment?
You explained the setup. There is no point.
These webcomics are half-done, at best. And I'm not talking about the stylistic choices you have chosen to pursuit.
But more on that they aren't jokes. They may classify as observations, but not amusing ones.
And I am alternative comedy, so don't even try any "oh but you don't understand" or any of that bullshit.
I'm the kind of person who can point exactly at the je-ne-sais-quoi, and you're comic, while weird and
kinda going for the lame-funny, does not have that little extra. And in this specific case, that little extra would be "the funny".
:lulz:
Quote from: iSPEAKonlyFORthe23 on February 01, 2013, 12:06:02 AM
Quote from: holist on November 30, 2012, 05:07:58 PM
Quote from: Elder Iptuous on November 30, 2012, 04:54:21 PM
humor is frequently found in the tension between some point and its obscurity due to some vagueness which is then pierced. otherwise it's nonsense, which can be aesthetically pleasing in its own right.
...can be.
hmm. So my explanations about what the points are are not worthy of comment?
You explained the setup. There is no point.
These webcomics are half-done, at best. And I'm not talking about the stylistic choices you have chosen to pursuit.
But more on that they aren't jokes. They may classify as observations, but not amusing ones.
And I am alternative comedy, so don't even try any "oh but you don't understand" or any of that bullshit.
I'm the kind of person who can point exactly at the je-ne-sais-quoi, and you're comic, while weird and
kinda going for the lame-funny, does not have that little extra. And in this specific case, that little extra would be "the funny".
Oh snap. :lulz:
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 30, 2012, 03:23:19 PM
Quote from: holist on November 30, 2012, 03:21:24 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 30, 2012, 03:20:33 PM
Quote from: holist on November 30, 2012, 03:17:38 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 30, 2012, 02:13:00 PM
Punchline?
I think it's called wry humour.
Not your kind of funny.
Again.
Poor Roger.
The execution sucked.
What, the guillotine wasn't sharpened properly? Bug off.
Shoe pinches like a bitch on the other foot, doesn't it? I am merely giving you the same critique you so kindly gave to Twid.
Your comic sucks. It's really that simple. It is to comics what pictures of dogs playing poker are to fine art.
The difference being that a lot of people actually LIKE the poker playing dogs.
This comic doesn't have the kitsch factor, it's got no comedy, no drama, no aesthetic appeal, the list goes on and on.
It's a total waste of time and bandwidth. And I usually LIKE comics that are utterly fucked.
It's amazing in the sense that it has NO APPEAL TO ANYONE.
Quote from: Wuli Fufu on February 01, 2013, 06:22:23 PM
It's amazing in the sense that it has NO APPEAL TO ANYONE.
thank you!