Principia Discordia

Principia Discordia => Think for Yourself, Schmuck! => Topic started by: LMNO on March 11, 2016, 06:40:21 PM

Title: Life Changes
Post by: LMNO on March 11, 2016, 06:40:21 PM
:deadthread:

OK? OK.

I've been drinking for a very long time, starting about 26 years ago, and really getting into it for about 20.  Over the years I've dabbled in other stuff, but have been primarily a drinker.  Wine with dinner, beer at shows/band practice, cocktails at clubs and bars, nightcaps, etc etc.  No worries.  It was legal (fine, I had a fake ID for a few years), it was mostly socially acceptable, it was convenient and available, and I liked both the taste and the buzz.

Then, my latest physical happened, and I got the news I'd been anticipating for a while.  "Elevated liver function".  Not full blown damage, nothing permanent, but it had finally become an issue.  OK, fine.  I knew it was coming.  It's not a full-blown "quit or die" scenario, but more of a "cut in half" sort of thing.

So:  Science time!  I began charting my consumption.  I looked at what I was drinking, when, and how.  And I came across some interesting results.  Essentially, during the week I would come home from work, have a cocktail, and wine with dinner.  Fine, I can make a half-sized cocktail, or eliminate it altogether on some days.  Wine with dinner really isn't going to change, believe me.  But then, after dinner.... More wine.  Sometimes, a lot of wine.  Like, bottles worth.  And while I really do like the taste, it seemed the goal was different than it is when having it with dinner.  I was looking for the buzz.  Accusations of escapism aside, this was a functionally different use for alcohol than the other ways I was using it.  That got me thinking, if that's the main goal, what can I do that achieves similar results without stressing the liver?

So I got a weed dealer a month or so ago.  And thanks to neighboring states with more relaxed laws, getting edibles is easy.  My routine now is a half-cocktail, a glass or two of wine with dinner, and then a bit of edible THC.  The release for me is slower than smoking it, and the high is, well... I get high.  Then I go to bed.  Of course, I kept with my observations, to see if it was a temporary thing, or if I would slip back into old habits.  And you know what?  It hasn't, so far.  On top of that, I'm going to bed earlier, and as one would expect, I wake up without feeling like I drank a gallon of wine the night before. 

In fact, last Wednesday a friend of mine flew in from Croatia, and we went out for tacos and drinks.  I had a few of each, and then some more drinks on top of that.  And I felt terrible the next day.  It was quite striking.  So, my subjective/objective observations seem to come to a tentative conclusion: My life is better when I'm not drinking so much, and so far my THC consumption has harmed my life less than my drinking. 

I'm not going to be one of those "alcohol sucks, weed forever" types of people, as I really do enjoy cocktails and wine, but so far this approach is working for me.

What a fucking hippie.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Cain on March 11, 2016, 07:19:00 PM
420 blaze it fgt
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: LMNO on March 11, 2016, 07:25:52 PM
Quote from: Cain on March 11, 2016, 07:19:00 PM
420 blaze it fgt
:potd:
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 11, 2016, 09:25:20 PM
I, too, have started mediating a reduced alcohol consumption with weed.

Less so these last three weeks.

I find that I feel better, I sleep better, my emotional regulation is better, and I consume fewer calories when I smoke or eat pot instead of downing a bottle of wine.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on March 11, 2016, 11:42:25 PM
I've totally eliminated alcohol, due to drug interaction problems with the pills.

I don't get drug tested at this job, but I'm not really in the mood to smoke weed.  I am considering having a talk with the doc and seeing if weed will in fact work better than pills.  Then I'd just have to deal with horrible withdrawals.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Vanadium Gryllz on March 12, 2016, 12:11:13 PM
I went through a similar experience a few years ago - I went from drinking pretty much every day to a couple of years alcohol free by essentially swapping it out for weed.

I get annual urine tests at work that I am 90% sure are just for sugars etc but I  not taking the risk so I have 3 months in a year weed free - I am currently in that phase of the year.

For me, it is tempting to let being high become a constant during my waking hours and that's probably not an ideal situation. There are definitely drawbacks in cognition when being high becomes your new normal and then, when you arent, I become anxious and have no appetite for a couple of days.

When I can indulge again, in April, I plan on exercising a little more moderation and seeing how that goes.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Eater of Clowns on March 12, 2016, 08:23:18 PM
Quote from: Cain on March 11, 2016, 07:19:00 PM
420 blaze it fgt
:lulz:
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 12, 2016, 08:29:35 PM
Quote from: Xaz on March 12, 2016, 12:11:13 PM
I went through a similar experience a few years ago - I went from drinking pretty much every day to a couple of years alcohol free by essentially swapping it out for weed.

I get annual urine tests at work that I am 90% sure are just for sugars etc but I  not taking the risk so I have 3 months in a year weed free - I am currently in that phase of the year.

For me, it is tempting to let being high become a constant during my waking hours and that's probably not an ideal situation. There are definitely drawbacks in cognition when being high becomes your new normal and then, when you arent, I become anxious and have no appetite for a couple of days.

When I can indulge again, in April, I plan on exercising a little more moderation and seeing how that goes.

Yeah, I don't like to be in an altered state during the day at all, it makes me useless. Fortunately I'm a total lightweight, so I can get by on like 1/4 of what a veteran stoner would consume.

I've had too much to drink many times since my son died, including last night and the night before and the night before that, and I need to break that habit before it sets in. I made it through my first year of school despite brutal near-daily hangovers, but I don't want to go back to that even if I could fumble through 400/500 level biology in a sickly daze. The last thing the kid would have wanted is for my life to be derailed over this.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Pergamos on March 14, 2016, 04:12:11 AM
I like altered states as a break from reality, if they become reality (which they have a few times, fortunately not often) then it just costs more to maintain reality.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on March 14, 2016, 09:39:53 AM
I've had a few brushes with alcohol over the years. Shit is like quicksand, just grabs a hold of me and all of a sudden I'm a lot worse off than before, physically, mentally, emotionally.

Been sober for about 14 months now and I still find myself occasionally hankering for a three week bender. Weed, on the other hand has always been there for me and only really became a problem that time I got too deep into the business side of things. 
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Max Blyss on March 17, 2016, 04:42:15 AM
I used to drink a lot, but that mellowed out by my mid 20's...  Been a confirmed potHEAD since I was 13.  It's always been nice, although my lungs are probably coated in resin.  Alas, we all must go sometime, so one might as well be chill and slightly paranoid.

Congrats to OP on reigning in a habit, though.  That can be a bit of a bitch.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: LMNO on March 18, 2016, 01:51:14 PM
The experiment is still going strong, and as far as I can tell, the results are still promising.

One of the more amazing things I've learned is that I think I've spent the majority of the past decade suffering a low-grade hangover, which I "normalized" into the common state of things.

:news:

I'm an idiot.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on March 18, 2016, 02:47:41 PM
A world of wonders awaits you. Healthy REM sleep, improved memory and concentration, freedom from constant, low grade background depression...

The only problem is this nagging little voice in the back of my head that gets louder whenever I'm near a pub or off-license or even just a bit bored, yelling "PARTY TIME - DO EET!!!"

Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Vanadium Gryllz on March 18, 2016, 03:39:04 PM
Quote from: LMNO on March 18, 2016, 01:51:14 PM
The experiment is still going strong, and as far as I can tell, the results are still promising.

One of the more amazing things I've learned is that I think I've spent the majority of the past decade suffering a low-grade hangover, which I "normalized" into the common state of things.

:news:

I'm an idiot.

Congratulations on the discovery.  :banana:
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Cainad (dec.) on March 18, 2016, 03:55:37 PM
I wish I could enjoy pot more than I do. I've had about 50/50 on "nice high" and "sweating paranoia and cognitive fog" in my experiences. It actually makes me less creative and more clammed up.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: LMNO on March 18, 2016, 04:05:22 PM
That's one of the things that made me stop back in the day.

Personally, it's because I was smoking way more than I needed.

Like, instead of enjoying a few fingers of scotch, I'd down half a bottle. But with weed.

I've found that I can portion edibles in a more manageable way, and I've gotten old enough I don't need to prove anything to anyone.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 18, 2016, 04:54:51 PM
Quote from: LMNO on March 18, 2016, 01:51:14 PM
The experiment is still going strong, and as far as I can tell, the results are still promising.

One of the more amazing things I've learned is that I think I've spent the majority of the past decade suffering a low-grade hangover, which I "normalized" into the common state of things.

:news:

I'm an idiot.

:lulz: Been there.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 18, 2016, 04:57:18 PM
Quote from: LMNO on March 18, 2016, 04:05:22 PM
That's one of the things that made me stop back in the day.

Personally, it's because I was smoking way more than I needed.

Like, instead of enjoying a few fingers of scotch, I'd down half a bottle. But with weed.

I've found that I can portion edibles in a more manageable way, and I've gotten old enough I don't need to prove anything to anyone.

Some people don't seem to have an internal brake when it comes to mind-altering substances, whether they are cigarettes or coffee or alcohol or weed. I am one of those people as well. Edibles help me reach a point of "stable high" that permits me to function and sleep almost normally, while minimizing my alcohol intake.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on March 18, 2016, 05:01:04 PM
I kind of come and go with pot. Like I'll smoke regular for a bit then get bored with the headspace and quit for months or years but with booze it never gets boring.

I guess I have pot-brake but not booze brake  :)
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: LMNO on March 18, 2016, 05:44:38 PM
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 18, 2016, 04:57:18 PM
Quote from: LMNO on March 18, 2016, 04:05:22 PM
That's one of the things that made me stop back in the day.

Personally, it's because I was smoking way more than I needed.

Like, instead of enjoying a few fingers of scotch, I'd down half a bottle. But with weed.

I've found that I can portion edibles in a more manageable way, and I've gotten old enough I don't need to prove anything to anyone.

Some people don't seem to have an internal brake when it comes to mind-altering substances, whether they are cigarettes or coffee or alcohol or weed. I am one of those people as well. Edibles help me reach a point of "stable high" that permits me to function and sleep almost normally, while minimizing my alcohol intake.

Yeah, I fully realize what I've found is only what's working for me.  Other people react different ways to things.  I really don't want to become one of "those people". 
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on March 18, 2016, 09:09:51 PM
Personally, I don't think of anyone as those people based on their intoxicant of choice.

whatever gets you through the night, right?
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: The Wizard Joseph on March 19, 2016, 03:06:56 AM
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 12, 2016, 08:29:35 PM
Quote from: Xaz on March 12, 2016, 12:11:13 PM
I went through a similar experience a few years ago - I went from drinking pretty much every day to a couple of years alcohol free by essentially swapping it out for weed.

I get annual urine tests at work that I am 90% sure are just for sugars etc but I  not taking the risk so I have 3 months in a year weed free - I am currently in that phase of the year.

For me, it is tempting to let being high become a constant during my waking hours and that's probably not an ideal situation. There are definitely drawbacks in cognition when being high becomes your new normal and then, when you arent, I become anxious and have no appetite for a couple of days.

When I can indulge again, in April, I plan on exercising a little more moderation and seeing how that goes.

Yeah, I don't like to be in an altered state during the day at all, it makes me useless. Fortunately I'm a total lightweight, so I can get by on like 1/4 of what a veteran stoner would consume.

I've had too much to drink many times since my son died, including last night and the night before and the night before that, and I need to break that habit before it sets in. I made it through my first year of school despite brutal near-daily hangovers, but I don't want to go back to that even if I could fumble through 400/500 level biology in a sickly daze. The last thing the kid would have wanted is for my life to be derailed over this.

I'm very glad that you already see the need to not try using alcohol overmuch. It's great for ventilation of repression, but actually a VERY BAD antidepressant. You need strong neurons to recover and re-write the reflexive thought patterns that are going to just keep hurting no matter what for a long time yet. I won't go so far as to say pot will inherently help with this, but it's better than booze on almost every level healthwise.

Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: The Wizard Joseph on March 19, 2016, 03:24:55 AM
I get my drink on from time to time at celebrations, but I have a bad history of alcoholism on my mother's side and so don't incorporate it into my daily, or even monthly, lifestyle. It's an expensive option for me anyway because I'm freaking huge, genetically well adapted, and of robust health prone to quickly flushing toxins. Weed is not only more cost-effective for me it's also never, ever made me ill.

I once envisioned my best dream for myself in an ideal universe as being medicinal pot-farmer and part-time scholar. Just live my life learning and writing. Think I'm going to try and make it actually happen. I'm a free agent now and there are ever more places I can make this a reality legally. I have plenty of just the right sort of friends to help me too.

I don't ever really get paranoid anymore, but the herb and I are old, beloved friends at this point in my life. I remember first trying it at about the age of 15. My bros and I would smoke during winter in an old, busted station wagon that sat in the driveway for years. We called it the Shamanmobile. It never moved, but you were definitely elsewhere when you stepped out of it let me tell you! I still remember the youngest and I running out in the dead of night into the muddy field behind the house looking for Great Coyote because we could hear them on on the wind.

We eventually turned back when one of us lost a shoe, I forget who, and the Coyotes sounded like they were having a laugh at our expense. Good times!
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: POFP on March 19, 2016, 07:00:56 PM
Congrats on finding ways to curb the addiction(s)/habit(s)!  :)

Unfortunately, after first trying anything, I become addicted. Chemically. I am constantly fighting the urge to drink or smoke, especially if I'm around it.
After having a bad experience with a Cuban cigar (Put me on my ass for an hour. Deep depression and sick feeling the whole time. Had to lay down and could barely talk to my gf on the phone), I still feel the urge to buy a cigar or smoke a cigarette, or get a Black and Mild. I have to smoke every once in a while to gain some relief. But it makes me sick every single time I have tobacco.

It doesn't help that my sense of smell and taste are almost completely gone (I'm 20, and I can barely tell a difference between the smell of a shitty bathroom, and the smell of a Yankee Candle Shop.), enabling alcohol and smoke to go down like water and oxygen. I have to swish whiskey around in my mouth to get the taste for it. It also doesn't help that it hardly has an effect on me when I drink, so there's not much putting a limit on the alcohol except my own Will or the supply.

Even though I hate the high of anything other than Reg, I feel like I have to smoke weed every time I'm around it. Just so happens my cousin always has Loud. Goodbye rest of my night when he comes over.  :lol:

Save watching my mother get tossed around when I was little, I don't really have anything to smoke or drink for. Just a bunch of chemical bullshit that makes it all hard to avoid.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Salty on March 19, 2016, 07:21:08 PM
RE OP: That's awesome! I'm always happy to hear it when people make that switch because I think it makes for a happier life than just the booze.

I definitely need some kind of something and booze gets nasty fast.

Recently, I've been considering switching to CBD heavy, low THC weed. It seems to make me relaxed and less anxious without the high interfering with my mental processes. I want to get a med card and make 5lbs of cbd honey for tea/toddies so I can nix the smoking part.

*lengthy assertions of my own drug use*
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: LMNO on March 19, 2016, 08:42:21 PM
Tell me more about this CBD of which you speak.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Salty on March 19, 2016, 09:00:28 PM
Quote from: LMNO on March 19, 2016, 08:42:21 PM
Tell me more about this CBD of which you speak.


Basically, my understanding is, the primary active parts of weed are THC and two cannabanoids, CBDs. THC is the only one the US is permitted to study, so we don't knoe a lot about the others. However, medical patients reports all of the known benefits without the paranoia or euphoria that THC provides.

High CBD bud is a lot like a muscle relaxer/Valium. I was worried I'd miss the high, and I'm not sure I can give it up 100%, but the CBD removes most of my symptoms. It feels like nothing in the way ibuprofen feels like nothing, it's the absence of symptoms that's the thing.

I could be wrong about a few of those points, I'm not well versed, but I know what I like. 
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: LMNO on March 19, 2016, 09:10:36 PM
Thanks for that. I'll keep an eye out.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 19, 2016, 09:25:31 PM
Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on March 19, 2016, 03:06:56 AM
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 12, 2016, 08:29:35 PM
Quote from: Xaz on March 12, 2016, 12:11:13 PM
I went through a similar experience a few years ago - I went from drinking pretty much every day to a couple of years alcohol free by essentially swapping it out for weed.

I get annual urine tests at work that I am 90% sure are just for sugars etc but I  not taking the risk so I have 3 months in a year weed free - I am currently in that phase of the year.

For me, it is tempting to let being high become a constant during my waking hours and that's probably not an ideal situation. There are definitely drawbacks in cognition when being high becomes your new normal and then, when you arent, I become anxious and have no appetite for a couple of days.

When I can indulge again, in April, I plan on exercising a little more moderation and seeing how that goes.

Yeah, I don't like to be in an altered state during the day at all, it makes me useless. Fortunately I'm a total lightweight, so I can get by on like 1/4 of what a veteran stoner would consume.

I've had too much to drink many times since my son died, including last night and the night before and the night before that, and I need to break that habit before it sets in. I made it through my first year of school despite brutal near-daily hangovers, but I don't want to go back to that even if I could fumble through 400/500 level biology in a sickly daze. The last thing the kid would have wanted is for my life to be derailed over this.

I'm very glad that you already see the need to not try using alcohol overmuch. It's great for ventilation of repression, but actually a VERY BAD antidepressant. You need strong neurons to recover and re-write the reflexive thought patterns that are going to just keep hurting no matter what for a long time yet. I won't go so far as to say pot will inherently help with this, but it's better than booze on almost every level healthwise.

Well, I am a neurobiologist, so if I didn't know these things it would reflect pretty poorly on the $100k sunken into my education so far.
Title: Re: Life Changes
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 19, 2016, 09:43:30 PM
Quote from: Alty on March 19, 2016, 09:00:28 PM
Quote from: LMNO on March 19, 2016, 08:42:21 PM
Tell me more about this CBD of which you speak.


Basically, my understanding is, the primary active parts of weed are THC and two cannabanoids, CBDs. THC is the only one the US is permitted to study, so we don't knoe a lot about the others. However, medical patients reports all of the known benefits without the paranoia or euphoria that THC provides.

High CBD bud is a lot like a muscle relaxer/Valium. I was worried I'd miss the high, and I'm not sure I can give it up 100%, but the CBD removes most of my symptoms. It feels like nothing in the way ibuprofen feels like nothing, it's the absence of symptoms that's the thing.

I could be wrong about a few of those points, I'm not well versed, but I know what I like.

There are weird restrictions that are hard to get around, like; researchers can get pure THC oil, but not CBD or whole cannabis oil, for studies using rats in self-administration. Inhalation studies with rats (as opposed to IV studies, which researchers hate because nobody injects marijuana!) require using oils rather than the whole plant, for practical reasons involving not setting your lab on fire.

The CBD honey sticks definitely take the edge off the anxiety and the unsettled ache, but without messing me up or flat-out numbing me the way Xanax does. Interestingly, endocannabinoids are a mediator in the stress response, but nobody is exactly sure what exogenous CBD is doing because it doesn't seem to be targeting the same receptors.