Messages

None of the bolded aligns with your summation.

Please, tell me your read on all this.

Ok, getting closer.  A proposed ordinance.

Still nothing about what the text of the ordinance is, nor how likely it is to pass.

Lol ok dude. When they print the full text of the bill to ban a poitical opponents mother from her own home maybe then we can judge. And of course, the important thing isnt the attempt to target a political opponents mother, its how likely it is to succeed.

MMIX, please come share your wisdom on the Russian hacking. Im sure it doesnt come close to your standard of evidence.

[First owned by Richard Spencer, and now owned by his mother, Sherry.]

https://archive.is/qKSm2

An ABC FOX Montana investigation tonight into Richard Spencer, the part-time Whitefish resident who is inspiring white supremacists across the country.
Our reporting has uncovered an unexpected by-product of Spencer's notoriety - - a family and a community torn apart.
Spencer's latest news-storm came last week when he spoke at Texas A & M, provoking heated confrontation and once-again, mentions of Montana - - and Whitefish specifically - - as his part-time home.
So, we went back to Whitefish - - and here's what we uncovered.
Richard Spencer was raised in Texas, but has been spending time in Whitefish for years with his family.  His mother, Sherry Spencer, still lives in a beautiful home at Whitefish Mountain Resort.  She also runs a business downtown, but perhaps not for long.
"Hail trump!  Hail our people!  Hail victory!" says Richard Spencer.
In a speech last month at the National Policy Institute's annual convention, the crowd's Nazi-like response rocketed Richard Spencer into the media stratosphere. But back here on Earth, and specifically in Whitefish, the war over Spencer's white nationalist views has locals fighting battles in the newspaper and on the street - - 22 Lupfer Avenue specifically.
It's a new building in Whitefish's downtown historic district.  First owned by Richard Spencer, and now owned by his mother, Sherry.  There are vacation rentals on the top floor, businesses lease at street-level.
But Sherry says her son's political views - - and his detractors - - are forcing her to sell the property.  In an email to us, Sherry says, "As painful as this is, I am exploring a potential sale of the building."
One of those detractors is Tanya Gersh, a prominent member of the community, who told me in an email: "She (Sherry) is profiting off of the people of the local community, all the while having facilitated Richard's work spreading hate by letting him live and use her home address for his organization."
Virginia's state corporation commission still lists Sherry's home as the principle office location for Richard's white nationalist organization, The National Policy Institute.   And a dive into Sherry's Facebook page supports the fact that Richard has spent a substantial amount of time with his mother in Whitefish, snow skiing, water skiing, hiking, holidays.
Sherry's Facebook page also has photos of her son when he spoke at the Mencken Club's annual gathering in 2010, A group the Southern Poverty Law Center refers to as "A band of white nationalists and pseudo academic racists."  Pictures also show Sherry and her husband attending.
In Sherry's email to me, she says, "As parents, we deeply love our son, as we always will.  We unequivocally do not agree with the extreme positions espoused by Richard."
She goes on to say, "We are stunned by the actions of Love Lives Here, an organization claiming to advocate tolerance and equal treatment of all citizens, yet coursing financial harm to many innocent parties."
Ina Albert, Love Lives Here co-founder, says, "I don't know what she's talking about.  We don't cause financial harm to anybody."
Human rights group Love Lives Here has been vocally opposed to Richard Spencer's views, but its co-founder says she has no problem with Richard spending time, or his mother doing business in Whitefish.
"I don't know what he does when he comes here," says Albert.  "But that is not our problem with Richard Spencer.  It is the national policy institute and what that stands for and our town being smeared by his philosophy."
Tanya says she does have a problem with it, though.  She says, Sherry "Could address this by selling the building, making a donation to human rights efforts, and making a statement in opposition to white supremacist ideas spread by Richard."
One thing on which both Tanya and Sherry agree: The tenants at 22 Lupfer are stuck in the middle.  The owner of Whitefish Aesthetics tells me her association with the building is destroying her business and she's moving out if Sherry doesn't sell it.
Sherry wrote to Tanya that, "Her son's actions have been a source of anguish within her family."
It's also been a source of contention in Whitefish.  A letter to the editor of the Daily Interlake: "The mob rule reaction to Richard Spencer's mere existence in Whitefish reminds me of the old Frankenstein movies where the townspeople gathered with pitchforks and torches."
And: "This 'group' which is supposed to love all, only loves those who agree with them."
A town divided, a mother torn, and a man whose mission is continuing to stir controversy on a national, and very local level.

So Richard Spencers mother is being bullied into selling her property and leaving town. Because hes mean.

I should know better than to respond, but there is quite literally nothing in that article that states what Love Lives Here's actions in regards to the building even are.

This isnt the best source on this, but if you read the bold and then this article you see how sneaky the denial is.

http://www.dailyinterlake.com/opinion/is-it-love-or-hate-that-lives-here/article_109d0cfe-782a-11e4-83b5-ff31a2d4698f.html

100 people, led by a group known as "Love Lives Here," packed into Whitefish's small town city council chambers demanding our local government pass an ordinance prohibiting Richard Spencer and the National Policy Institute he represents from doing business or having offices in Whitefish.

The article is here, was up the other day but appears to have be TechCrunch effect'd:
http://www.whitefishpilot.com/news/whitefish-rallies-for-no-hate-ordinance/article_e5affe4a-6e8b-11e4-b514-0b06fc748f5e.html?mode=image&photo=

So what happens is, Spencer used to live there and use the place as the office for his group because, as Ive stated before, Spencers group is like 15 people. He then moves away but lets his mother move into his former home. Even though he doesnt use it as a headquarters, and again, his MOTHER lives there, Love Lives Here tries to pass a local law which would force his Mother to get rid of her house.

Meanwhile his poor Mother is forced to publicly denounce her sons ideas, is put under a microscope because her son VISITS her, and even has a member of the pro-kicking her out law camp declare that for the sin of raising someone who seig hailed some journalists she should sell her house and give it to human rights organizations, like Love Lives Here.

Again, this is because Richard Spencer is mean.

[after]

Also the fact that Russia does this kind of thing constantly,

So no evidence.

and the fact that Putin was also openly trying to influence the election through intimidation (IIRC he threatened to start a war if Hillary was elected)

This was after SHE threatened a war with Russia. He didnt say he was going to nuke us for not voting Trump, he told his aides to prepare for a potential war if the person who said she was ok with starting a war was elected and it made its way to the press.

Hillary Clinton: “You’ve seen the reports. Russia’s hacked into a lot of things, China’s hacked into a lot of things. Russia even hacked into the Democratic National Committee. Maybe even some state election systems? So we gotta step up our game. Make sure we are well defended and make sure we are able to take the fight to those who go after us. As president I will make it clear that the United States will treat cyber attacks just like any other attack. We will be ready with serious political, economic and military responses.

Again. No evidence.

So what evidence would you prefer? A confession directly from Putin perhaps?

Any evidence at all.

It seems you've missed the importance of the CIA making the statement in general. In diplomatic terms it's the equivalent of "hey. Hey fuckers. Do you really want to play?".

What CIA statement? It was a single unnamed source. In diplomatic terms, its nothing but an attempt to try and invalidate the presidency of Trump before hes even sworn in, while washing the DNCs hands of a massive infosec fuckup.

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/politics/2016/12/12/records-many-votes-detroits-precincts/95363314/

https://archive.is/qKSm2

An ABC FOX Montana investigation tonight into Richard Spencer, the part-time Whitefish resident who is inspiring white supremacists across the country.
Our reporting has uncovered an unexpected by-product of Spencer's notoriety - - a family and a community torn apart.
Spencer's latest news-storm came last week when he spoke at Texas A & M, provoking heated confrontation and once-again, mentions of Montana - - and Whitefish specifically - - as his part-time home.
So, we went back to Whitefish - - and here's what we uncovered.
Richard Spencer was raised in Texas, but has been spending time in Whitefish for years with his family.  His mother, Sherry Spencer, still lives in a beautiful home at Whitefish Mountain Resort.  She also runs a business downtown, but perhaps not for long.
"Hail trump!  Hail our people!  Hail victory!" says Richard Spencer.
In a speech last month at the National Policy Institute's annual convention, the crowd's Nazi-like response rocketed Richard Spencer into the media stratosphere. But back here on Earth, and specifically in Whitefish, the war over Spencer's white nationalist views has locals fighting battles in the newspaper and on the street - - 22 Lupfer Avenue specifically.
It's a new building in Whitefish's downtown historic district.  First owned by Richard Spencer, and now owned by his mother, Sherry.  There are vacation rentals on the top floor, businesses lease at street-level.
But Sherry says her son's political views - - and his detractors - - are forcing her to sell the property.  In an email to us, Sherry says, "As painful as this is, I am exploring a potential sale of the building."
One of those detractors is Tanya Gersh, a prominent member of the community, who told me in an email: "She (Sherry) is profiting off of the people of the local community, all the while having facilitated Richard's work spreading hate by letting him live and use her home address for his organization."
Virginia's state corporation commission still lists Sherry's home as the principle office location for Richard's white nationalist organization, The National Policy Institute.   And a dive into Sherry's Facebook page supports the fact that Richard has spent a substantial amount of time with his mother in Whitefish, snow skiing, water skiing, hiking, holidays.
Sherry's Facebook page also has photos of her son when he spoke at the Mencken Club's annual gathering in 2010, A group the Southern Poverty Law Center refers to as "A band of white nationalists and pseudo academic racists."  Pictures also show Sherry and her husband attending.
In Sherry's email to me, she says, "As parents, we deeply love our son, as we always will.  We unequivocally do not agree with the extreme positions espoused by Richard."
She goes on to say, "We are stunned by the actions of Love Lives Here, an organization claiming to advocate tolerance and equal treatment of all citizens, yet coursing financial harm to many innocent parties."
Ina Albert, Love Lives Here co-founder, says, "I don't know what she's talking about.  We don't cause financial harm to anybody."
Human rights group Love Lives Here has been vocally opposed to Richard Spencer's views, but its co-founder says she has no problem with Richard spending time, or his mother doing business in Whitefish.
"I don't know what he does when he comes here," says Albert.  "But that is not our problem with Richard Spencer.  It is the national policy institute and what that stands for and our town being smeared by his philosophy."
Tanya says she does have a problem with it, though.  She says, Sherry "Could address this by selling the building, making a donation to human rights efforts, and making a statement in opposition to white supremacist ideas spread by Richard."
One thing on which both Tanya and Sherry agree: The tenants at 22 Lupfer are stuck in the middle.  The owner of Whitefish Aesthetics tells me her association with the building is destroying her business and she's moving out if Sherry doesn't sell it.
Sherry wrote to Tanya that, "Her son's actions have been a source of anguish within her family."
It's also been a source of contention in Whitefish.  A letter to the editor of the Daily Interlake: "The mob rule reaction to Richard Spencer's mere existence in Whitefish reminds me of the old Frankenstein movies where the townspeople gathered with pitchforks and torches."
And: "This 'group' which is supposed to love all, only loves those who agree with them."
A town divided, a mother torn, and a man whose mission is continuing to stir controversy on a national, and very local level.

So Richard Spencers mother is being bullied into selling her property and leaving town. Because hes mean.

They're not supposed to

What are you even trying to say dude?

You talk as if the states were seperate countries rather than arbitrary administrative divisions. That hasn't been the case for over 221 years. And for 36 of the states it was never the case anyway.

I mean, maybe if they were separated by some vast distance it would be different, but it's not like we have any regions that are more than half a day's travel away from each other (give or take an hour or two)

EDIT:
Not counting embassies. I suppose travel between some of the embassies could be longer than maine to hawaii.

So states dont have their own individual economies, and populations with different desires and interests? Rust Belt Michigan and California have the exact same goals and values?

[Felix Edmundovich — an obvious nom de guerre honoring the founder of the Soviet secret police, Felix Edmundovich Dzerzhinsky.]

BTW, they finally released the evidence that the DNC hack was a Russian intelligence operation.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/13/us/politics/russia-hack-election-dnc.html?_r=1

Guccifer 2.0 borrowed the moniker of an earlier hacker, a Romanian who called himself Guccifer and was jailed for breaking into the personal computers of former President George W. Bush, former Secretary of State Colin L. Powell and other notables. This new attacker seemed intent on showing that the D.N.C.'s cyberexperts at CrowdStrike were wrong to blame Russia. Guccifer 2.0 called himself a "lone hacker" and mocked CrowdStrike for calling the attackers "sophisticated."

But online investigators quickly undercut his story. On a whim, Lorenzo Franceschi-Bicchierai, a writer for Motherboard, the tech and culture site of Vice, tried to contact Guccifer 2.0 by direct message on Twitter.

"Surprisingly, he answered right away," Mr. Franceschi-Bicchierai said. But whoever was on the other end seemed to be mocking him. "I asked him why he did it, and he said he wanted to expose the Illuminati. He called himself a Gucci lover. And he said he was Romanian."

That gave Mr. Franceschi-Bicchierai an idea. Using Google Translate, he sent the purported hacker some questions in Romanian. The answers came back in Romanian. But when he was offline, Mr. Franceschi-Bicchierai checked with a couple of native speakers, who told him Guccifer 2.0 had apparently been using Google Translate as well — and was clearly not the Romanian he claimed to be.

Cyberresearchers found other clues pointing to Russia. Microsoft Word documents posted by Guccifer 2.0 had been edited by someone calling himself, in Russian, Felix Edmundovich — an obvious nom de guerre honoring the founder of the Soviet secret police, Felix Edmundovich Dzerzhinsky. Bad links in the texts were marked by warnings in Russian, generated by what was clearly a Russian-language version of Word.

When Mr. Franceschi-Bicchierai managed to engage Guccifer 2.0 over a period of weeks, he found that his interlocutor's tone and manner changed. "At first he was careless and colloquial. Weeks later, he was curt and more calculating," he said. "It seemed like a group of people, and a very sloppy attempt to cover up."

Computer experts drew the same conclusion about DCLeaks.com, a site that sprang up in June, claiming to be the work of "hacktivists" but posting more stolen documents. It, too, seemed to be a clumsy front for the same Russians who had stolen the documents. Notably, the website was registered in April, suggesting that the Russian hacking team planned well in advance to make public what it stole.

Thats it. Someone who knew Russian and had a Russian version of Word edited some documents Guccifer 2 posted. Case closed.

Thank you.

Yes.

wrong

Lung-cuck

[Texas]

You mean it would depend on what you believe, not where you live. Why would anything in the presidential election still be done by region without the electoral college?

You dont understand the population disparity between states. It would literally be Texas, Florida, New York and California deciding every election with 90% of our landmass, each individual states with their own economies and interests, having no say in anything. Again, this election is a perfect example of why we need it. The dense urban areas trying to force free trade agreements on the rest of the country which doesnt want it so they can profit at their expense.

I get that the liberals and conservatives are in different geographic areas, what I don't get is why this is in any way relevant

Hold on

Two things:

1) Would this reform extend to the senate as well? Because its the same principle and few people ever bitch about it.

2) This would have been no guarantee against a Trump victory this year and if it ever happens would not guarantee a lack of future victories. As he himself explained, he built his campaign around scoring electoral votes because thats what it takes to win. If the election was based on the popular vote he would have altered his strategy for that.

Also, think about this for a moment. California and New York being the big contendors seems nice, but the other two heavy weights would be Texas and Florida. I know you think Trump is bad, but do you really really want every Republican candidate from this point on basing his platform on winning the Texan vote out of necessity?

   Which brings us to the point of the EC. America isnt a homogeneous nation, it has a lot of different interests and cultures. Without the EC (and the Senate) America would be run by Texas, Florida, New York and California with the rest of us all just along for the ride. Do you honestly want this? Just because Clinton won in some alternate reality what if fanfiction where Article II vanished on November 7th?

One point I want to drive home here is that Trump based his strategy on winning swing states, going for electoral votes. In a popular vote he would have likely used a different strategy and very well could have won on swinging Florida R and Texas's given R votes.

Again, why do you want to destroy an institution that protects weaker states from stronger ones because in some hypothetical scenario where Trump went for electoral votes but the election was really decided on the popular  vote Hillary wins?

You mean it would depend on what you believe, not where you live. Why would anything in the presidential election still be done by region without the electoral college?

You dont understand the population disparity between states. It would literally be Texas, Florida, New York and California deciding every election with 90% of our landmass, each individual states with their own economies and interests, having no say in anything. Again, this election is a perfect example of why we need it. The dense urban areas trying to force free trade agreements on the rest of the country which doesnt want it so they can profit at their expense.