Posting from my phone, so I'm unsure of what to make of it.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2014/04/17/jews-ordered-to-register-in-east-ukraine/7816951/
I told you guys what happens if you don't nail 20C into it's fucking casket. I told you.
This stinks. I'd put money I don't have on there being more to this.
Off-hand, I'd speculate that more than a few western nations have been riding the comparisons to WW2 (Olympics, invasions after them, annexation with vote under occupation etc, etc.) so I have to question if this isn't an extension to that theme. Either way it's fucking disturbing and well worth watching for more info.
The gist I got is that it's a small movement, not the actual government, but again, reading on the phone and a bit distracted and in transit at the moment. Maybe Cain can give more insight.
I'm more interested in who's involved in it and who's funding it.
Because I bet it's someone "Respectable".
Depends on who the "small movement" is.
If it's Right Sector, or Svoboda...well, they are part of the government. The very unsavoury, pro-fascist part.
Or it could be Russian propaganda. I mean, Russia is viewing this whole conflict in a WWII lense, and that POV is strongly related to the current splits in Ukrainian society (in short, the western Ukrainians were more pro-Hitler than pro-Stalin).
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on April 17, 2014, 03:33:37 PM
I told you guys what happens if you don't nail 20C into it's fucking casket. I told you.
This is the 21C, like 20C but more shitty and we call it a "Reboot"
Misunderstood. Still waking up.
Claim is pro-Russian militants are asking Jews to register. Possible. Nationalists are much the same the world over, ie; stupid.
Could be Ukrainian government propaganda, could be true. Dangerous either way. Playing with fire, throwing around accusations of anti-Semitism when actual fascist and nationalists are facing off against each other.
Quote from: Faust on April 17, 2014, 03:59:23 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on April 17, 2014, 03:33:37 PM
I told you guys what happens if you don't nail 20C into it's fucking casket. I told you.
This is the 21C, like 20C but more shitty and we call it a "Reboot"
Don't forget trying to make it look more raw and gritty.
Suu, are all your facebook friends morons?
"The world's press says it cannot determine one way or another who is responsible for these leaflets, but I KNOW FOR A FACT that Putin actually wrote the document in his own jizz before approving it's release."
Gary's wife is Ukrainian, and they've been together since before the Iron Curtain fell, so this thing has got him really worked up for obvious reasons and they aren't exactly pro-Russia. I just kind of let him rant, because I know he's seen what life is like on the other side, so to speak. Which is a pity, because they are two of the sweetest folks I know as long as you don't bring up the Communist and Socialist words. I don't know if "shell-shocked" is the correct term or what, but honestly, not worth arguing with him, he's going to believe what he wants. :|
OK, I wont pick on him, then. I have little interest in people who are fanatics in an argument. They're no fun, for starters.
Before Yanukovich was ousted, I remember a bit on NPR where they interviewed one of the Ukrainian nationalists. These were the kind of guys that went around in traditional Ukrainian clothing looking for people to make fun of them so they could pick a fight. The part that stuck out to me was, in the guy's own words (paraphrased), they would 'stand up to anyone who had a problem with Ukrainian sovereignty, whether they be Russian, Jews, etc.' Obviously, the conspicuous mention of Jews stuck out to me like a neon sign.
I can't even pretend to be knowledgeable about who exactly is doing what over there. But, things have gotten ugly and Jews happen to be nearby. This, historically, has never really worked out well.
I know I said I'd ignore him, but people saying I'm in thrall to propaganda when they are really get my goat. Or they would, if I had one. Which if I did, I would frequently set free in their gardens, as an object lesson in being a pain in the arse.
But yes. Now it turns out the Chief Rabbi of Donetsk strongly believes the leaflets are forgeries designed to cause panic among the Jewish community and slander the pro-Russian militias.
Meanwhile, the man coordinating the crackdown on said militias helped found the "Social-National Party of Ukraine" in 1991 and is a big fan of the WWII Nazi collaborator, Stepan Bandera, whose followers helped the Einsatzgruppen exterminate thousands of Jews and Poles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_Insurgent_Army#Ethnic_cleansing_of_Poles_in_Volhynia_and_Galicia).
So where are the fascists again? Well, the National Security Council and its newly formed "Reserve Units of the National Guard", staffed with "Maidan Self-defense volunteers" would be a good place to start looking.
He probably won't bother coming back to the thread. If he does, I'll be surprised.
Honestly, outside of political wingnuttery, Gary is the type of guy who will give you the shirt off his back, and he always brings me back substantial yardage of top quality Ukrainian linen without me asking, because he's just that kind of person. He's been a very good friend and USUALLY stays the fuck off my page when this stuff comes up. I know he's nervous about this though, and he has every right to be of course, I just wish he would chill the fuck out sometimes. :|
Anyone with half a brain is nervous. We don't want to see Ukraine descend into a hellish civil war which will draw in Russia and NATO.
Unfortunately, his attitude is the kind which is not helping in that cause.
Not at all, but c'est la vie. Assholes will be assholes.