Principia Discordia

Principia Discordia => Or Kill Me => Topic started by: Rev. Mondo Anvil on January 17, 2015, 03:08:07 pm

Title: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Rev. Mondo Anvil on January 17, 2015, 03:08:07 pm
To be honest, I kinda admire them. Their belief system is insane and idiotic yet they are devilishly clever in their brainwashing methods. L. Ron Hubbard was definitely a genius, but not in the way they claim; anyone who can disguise hypnosis and mental programming sessions as therapy while making it a confession of secrets at the same time to blackmail ex-members with is quite intelligent.

What do you guys think?

Want to know just how insane they are? Check this out: http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--TI0kmC7---/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/17mt2hwa46neepng.png



Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Eater of Clowns on January 17, 2015, 04:06:22 pm
I think it's deplorable to prey upon the vulnerable with false promises and pseudoscience and then bully and manipulate them into going along with the program while campaigning against actual, proven treatment methods.

But hey, admire away.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Doktor Howl on January 17, 2015, 04:22:54 pm
It's like admiring a protection racket that targets the mentally ill.

Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: EK WAFFLR on January 17, 2015, 04:26:12 pm
It's like admiring a protection racket that targets the mentally ill.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 17, 2015, 04:36:48 pm
I guess if your thing is admiring schemes that prey on the vulnerable, more power to you. Have you ever heard of Bernie Madoff? You might find him really cool too.

Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 17, 2015, 04:38:50 pm
My other question is; u trollin? Or are you just an internet noob?
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: LMNO on January 17, 2015, 08:29:46 pm
My brother's a Scientologist.  It's working for him, so I can't say it's entirely useless.

I don't have time to go through it right now, but I've posted about it before.  You might want to try to search for it.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Q. G. Pennyworth on January 17, 2015, 09:47:58 pm
My wedding was officiated by an ex-Scientologist who lost millions and helped found OSA (because every religion needs secret police), before getting out.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Rev. Mondo Anvil on January 17, 2015, 11:02:36 pm
I should clarify that I don't support what they do, but my inner evil genius thinks they did a great job.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Rev. Mondo Anvil on January 17, 2015, 11:26:40 pm
Like, I know it's a horrible scam that's ruined the lives of many people, but it's done so well I have to applaud.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 17, 2015, 11:36:45 pm
Like, I know it's a horrible scam that's ruined the lives of many people, but it's done so well I have to applaud.

Why this one scam in particular?
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Q. G. Pennyworth on January 17, 2015, 11:48:40 pm
Like, I know it's a horrible scam that's ruined the lives of many people, but it's done so well I have to applaud.

Why this one scam in particular?

Asking in general, or do you want the OP's opinion?
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 18, 2015, 12:32:18 am
Like, I know it's a horrible scam that's ruined the lives of many people, but it's done so well I have to applaud.

Why this one scam in particular?

Asking in general, or do you want the OP's opinion?

I was asking him, but if you want to reply with your own take on it, I'd be interested in that too.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Rev. Mondo Anvil on January 18, 2015, 02:02:41 am
Because it's a cult, and I'm interested in cults.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 18, 2015, 03:10:02 am
Because it's a cult, and I'm interested in cults.

Cults are interesting, for sure. I was just wondering why out of all the swindles in the world, that was the one you decided to proclaim your admiration for. It's hardly extraordinary.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 18, 2015, 03:14:01 am
You know, actually, never mind. I don't think I care. But I do have another question; are you new to the Internet, or were you just in a coma or perhaps under a rock in 2006 and 2007?

I'm kinda trying to figure out where you're coming from, and partly wondering if you're actually trolling.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Doktor Howl on January 18, 2015, 03:15:08 am
Meh.  I'm out.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 18, 2015, 03:17:51 am
Meh.  I'm out.

Probably the way to go.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Rev. Mondo Anvil on January 18, 2015, 03:21:29 pm
I know about the Anonymous campaign, and I've read a lot of Arnie Lerma and xenu.net.

I'm not trolling. I actually wanted to know what you thought about Everyone's Favorite Crazies™.

So, enough about me. Share your thoughts!
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Nephew Twiddleton on January 18, 2015, 07:45:11 pm
Like, I know it's a horrible scam that's ruined the lives of many people, but it's done so well I have to applaud.

Do you applaud Nazis as well, then? I mean, that was a scam that ruined the lives of millions.

If you applaud the suffering of others, in any form, then maybe there's something about yourself that needs some introspection and close examination.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: hooplala on January 18, 2015, 08:02:28 pm
Also, brainwashing isn't exactly difficult.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 18, 2015, 11:16:23 pm
I know about the Anonymous campaign, and I've read a lot of Arnie Lerma and xenu.net.

I'm not trolling. I actually wanted to know what you thought about Everyone's Favorite Crazies™.

So, enough about me. Share your thoughts!

http://www.principiadiscordia.com/forum/index.php?action=search2
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Q. G. Pennyworth on January 19, 2015, 01:52:17 am
Like, I know it's a horrible scam that's ruined the lives of many people, but it's done so well I have to applaud.

Why this one scam in particular?

Asking in general, or do you want the OP's opinion?

I was asking him, but if you want to reply with your own take on it, I'd be interested in that too.

I think I've mentioned here before that I was heavily involved in the Anonymous vs. Scientology thing. My initial reasons for getting interested and then diving in had much more to do with Anonymous itself than the target, but as I got deeper into it and fell into the role of propagandist I needed to do my homework on Scientology.

The initial points that brought Anonymous and Scientology into conflict were how seriously Scientology took their bullshit and how vicious they were about shutting up people who tried to expose their bullshit to the public. Critics of Scientology have been subject to insanity that makes conspiracy theorists go "now wait a minute..." and news outlets that have published stories that paint Scientology in a poor light have been sued for literally every sentence of the article. Mormons, JWs, Catholics, any religion you want to point to as a "why not them?" does not do that kind of crap these days, either because they do not have the resources or the will to do so.

The abuses within the church mostly fall on the mentally ill and the members of the Sea Org. Scientologists (like some other religions) don't believe that mental illness is a thing and believe with all their hearts that psychiatry is the devil and psychiatrists are responsible for the holocaust and I am not shitting you. There have been cases of children within the church being denied access to psychiatric care, sometimes resulting in deaths. There is at least one documented case of an adult Scientologist having a mental health crisis and being held against her will, resulting in her death. It's not a unique form of shitty shitty crappy, but it is one more thing to throw on the pile of stuff Scientology gets wrong. The Sea Org is Scientology's private navy that only has one boat and mostly acts as slave labor. People are paid pennies a day, their movements are closely monitored, and they're kept in cramped, unhealthy conditions. If you fuck up in the Sea Org, you're sent into the Rehabilitation Project Force, where you may find yourself inside a locked compound doing manual labor under even worse conditions and little to no contact with the outside world. Members of the Sea Org sign a billion year contract, many of them are minors as young as 12 when they sign up.

Children in Scientology get pretty royally fucked by the experience. Hubbard had some specific ideas about education that sound kind of okay if simplistic at first, but when you see them put into action it's some of the worst teaching methodology you're likely to see anywhere. If a student misunderstands something, it's because they misunderstood one of the words, and they need to go back through the text until they find their MU and look it up in a dictionary. If they get through the whole thing and looked up every word and still don't get it, they have to go make clay models of the concept until they get it. Again, not the worst thing that any religion has ever done, and while the MU and clay models thing is pretty unique, the wholesale omission of math and sciences has a lot in common with whack job Christian homeschooling.

Scientology has the Office of Special Affairs, formerly the Guardian's Office, which is tasked with ruining the lives of people who threaten Scientology and keeping the flock in line. Hubbard and Scientology's love of memos and record keeping means there is a long and incriminating trail of paperwork documenting the creation of the Guardians Office and its transition to OSA and all of the terrible things that OSA is expected to do. I do not know of any other religion that has its own secret police. It's pretty monumentally fucked.

As a money making scheme, Scientology beats every religion running. Every time one of the books is opened in their Orgs, every time they perform a real auditing session (not the stress tests on the street), every course a Scientologist takes, that money is funneled directly to the top. The Ideal Org scheme is particularly odious, as local Scientology communities are expected to purchase large properties, renovate them at their own expense, then open up the Ideal Org and sign the property over to the top brass for free. The money goes to fancy parties for rich people and printing new copies of existing materials that Scientologists will have to buy and redo all their courses for new certificates to keep up, which all costs them more money.

I don't think Scientology is the worst or even most dangerous thing out there right now. I do think the combination of actual physical danger to a minority of their members, significant financial bullshit, and attacking critics like woah makes them a valid target of ridicule and protests.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 19, 2015, 01:59:11 am
I was familiar with most of the details from my own research, except for the educational methods, which sound terrible.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Doktor Howl on January 19, 2015, 01:57:35 pm
I know about the Anonymous campaign, and I've read a lot of Arnie Lerma and xenu.net.

I'm not trolling. I actually wanted to know what you thought about Everyone's Favorite Crazies™.

So, enough about me. Share your thoughts!

No.

This is not North Korea.  This is AMERICA.  We expect to be paid for those thoughts, same as LMNO expects to be paid for being a Big Gay Cowboy, and I expect to be paid when I randomly eject an organ for the amusement of the crowd.

Oh, wait.  We DID tell you our opinion, and you ignored it because we weren't agreeing with you on the genius of tormenting and/or preying on the weakest members of society.

Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Rev. Mondo Anvil on January 19, 2015, 03:26:48 pm
To Mr. Pennyworth:

My sentiments exactly.

And no, I don't like the Nazis. I just think that the way Scientology works is mind-numbingly stupid while being devilishly clever all at once. That's why I'm interested in them.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 19, 2015, 03:33:38 pm
I know about the Anonymous campaign, and I've read a lot of Arnie Lerma and xenu.net.

I'm not trolling. I actually wanted to know what you thought about Everyone's Favorite Crazies™.

So, enough about me. Share your thoughts!

No.

This is not North Korea.  This is AMERICA.  We expect to be paid for those thoughts, same as LMNO expects to be paid for being a Big Gay Cowboy, and I expect to be paid when I randomly eject an organ for the amusement of the crowd.

Oh, wait.  We DID tell you our opinion, and you ignored it because we weren't agreeing with you on the genius of tormenting and/or preying on the weakest members of society.

This.

In addition, I kindly provided him with a link so that he could easily locate our past discussions on this topic, which he ignored.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Doktor Howl on January 19, 2015, 03:53:45 pm
I know about the Anonymous campaign, and I've read a lot of Arnie Lerma and xenu.net.

I'm not trolling. I actually wanted to know what you thought about Everyone's Favorite Crazies™.

So, enough about me. Share your thoughts!

No.

This is not North Korea.  This is AMERICA.  We expect to be paid for those thoughts, same as LMNO expects to be paid for being a Big Gay Cowboy, and I expect to be paid when I randomly eject an organ for the amusement of the crowd.

Oh, wait.  We DID tell you our opinion, and you ignored it because we weren't agreeing with you on the genius of tormenting and/or preying on the weakest members of society.

This.

In addition, I kindly provided him with a link so that he could easily locate our past discussions on this topic, which he ignored.

TELL ME YOUR OPINIONS!
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 19, 2015, 03:58:49 pm
I know about the Anonymous campaign, and I've read a lot of Arnie Lerma and xenu.net.

I'm not trolling. I actually wanted to know what you thought about Everyone's Favorite Crazies™.

So, enough about me. Share your thoughts!

No.

This is not North Korea.  This is AMERICA.  We expect to be paid for those thoughts, same as LMNO expects to be paid for being a Big Gay Cowboy, and I expect to be paid when I randomly eject an organ for the amusement of the crowd.

Oh, wait.  We DID tell you our opinion, and you ignored it because we weren't agreeing with you on the genius of tormenting and/or preying on the weakest members of society.

This.

In addition, I kindly provided him with a link so that he could easily locate our past discussions on this topic, which he ignored.

TELL ME YOUR OPINIONS!

If he really wants a shitty regime to admire, he should look into Pol Pot.

Or maybe check out Fundamentalist Mormonism, now there's a racket.

I just think he could do better.

FWIW, Anvil, in order to have an "inner evil genius", you have to first have genius.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 19, 2015, 04:00:30 pm
To Mr. Pennyworth:

 :lulz:

He isn't even vaguely bothering to read the rest of the board and get to know us. I call troll.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Doktor Howl on January 19, 2015, 04:01:51 pm
To Mr. Pennyworth:

 :lulz:

He isn't even vaguely bothering to read the rest of the board and get to know us. I call troll.

I call you mister all the time, mister.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Doktor Howl on January 19, 2015, 04:02:19 pm
It's like I wrote the Who's Who thread for nothing.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Doktor Howl on January 19, 2015, 04:03:23 pm
http://www.principiadiscordia.com/forum/index.php?topic=34998.msg1278846#msg1278846
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: EK WAFFLR on January 19, 2015, 04:35:35 pm
It's like I wrote the Who's Who thread for nothing.

Now, now, Ms Howl.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Doktor Howl on January 19, 2015, 04:39:01 pm
It's like I wrote the Who's Who thread for nothing.

Now, now, Ms Howl.

Don't you "now, now" me, you sexist pig.  All of you men are the same.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: EK WAFFLR on January 19, 2015, 04:39:40 pm
Now, Now missy. I am a beatiful viking princess. DON'T YOU DARE OPPRESS ME
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Doktor Howl on January 19, 2015, 04:47:46 pm
Now, Now missy. I am a beatiful viking princess. DON'T YOU DARE OPPRESS ME

Check your Belgian privilege.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: EK WAFFLR on January 19, 2015, 04:48:43 pm
The "check engine" light is blinking.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Doktor Howl on January 19, 2015, 04:49:52 pm
The "check engine" light is blinking.

You've lost an oxygen sensor on your privilege.  It won't hurt your privilege, but your butthurt efficiency will drop a bit, and you'll generate more pollution.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: EK WAFFLR on January 19, 2015, 04:56:59 pm
The "check engine" light is blinking.

You've lost an oxygen sensor on your privilege.  It won't hurt your privilege, but your butthurt efficiency will drop a bit, and you'll generate more pollution.

Does this mean I have to dig up the spiked buttplug?
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Doktor Howl on January 19, 2015, 05:00:46 pm
The "check engine" light is blinking.

You've lost an oxygen sensor on your privilege.  It won't hurt your privilege, but your butthurt efficiency will drop a bit, and you'll generate more pollution.

Does this mean I have to dig up the spiked buttplug?

I'd leave it where it is, or you're likely to do yourself an injury.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 19, 2015, 05:11:37 pm
To Mr. Pennyworth:

 :lulz:

He isn't even vaguely bothering to read the rest of the board and get to know us. I call troll.

I call you mister all the time, mister.

YES BUT THERE ARE REASONS!  :lulz:
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 19, 2015, 05:12:36 pm
The "check engine" light is blinking.

You've lost an oxygen sensor on your privilege.  It won't hurt your privilege, but your butthurt efficiency will drop a bit, and you'll generate more pollution.

 :lulz: :lulz: :lulz: Thread redeemed.
Title: Re: Thoughts on Scientology?
Post by: Q. G. Pennyworth on January 19, 2015, 06:55:06 pm
I will say beating my head against the brick wall of Scientology did force me to re-evaluate my flaky pagan ways, as I had been super into consensus reality shit and here I was making fun of these guys for their ridiculous consensus reality shit that obviously wasn't working. These days I try to reserve my lying to myself for things where the lies can actually change things (see: "you are the scariest thing in this room").