Change my mind :lulz:
Nope, you are right :lulz:
I got nothing.
Except that Eastern Occultism is also bullshit. Any and all forms of occultism are by definition bullshit.
Like Howl said.
Occultism by defininition is trolling even to the 'initiates' that is how it works that's why you need the bullshit ciphers and secret teachings to understand it 'fully' no matter if it is Eastern, western, extra dimensional or whatever high falluting attachment added to make you believe it is authentic, but there is some value in all of it if you read between the lines and find out what works for you in my experience.
I think it is reasonable to expect ancient peoples to have accumulated knowledge that was so valuable to them that they a)better write that shit down, yo and b)can't let just any old schlomo know about this
I'm willing to take this much further :lulz:
The occult is a giant troll
Religion/spirituality is just well-wishing
Atheism is dishonest and blatantly lying
Agnosticism is intellectually lazy
Science is fraudulent
The universe is laughing at us because nobody has the right perspective (or models and systems) of the nature of life and the universe itself (especially those that say we can't or don't know) :lol:
This is what Eris's gift is to us.
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 10, 2018, 09:29:24 AM
The universe is laughing at us because nobody has the right perspective (or models and systems) of the nature of life and the universe itself (especially those that say we can't or don't know) :lol:
We have an incomplete idea of what is going on, a set of blind men touching an elephant inappropriately, casting a shadow into Plato's Fritzl cave.
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 10, 2018, 09:29:24 AM
I'm willing to take this much further :lulz:
The occult is a giant troll
Religion/spirituality is just well-wishing
Atheism is dishonest and blatantly lying
Agnosticism is intellectually lazy
Science is fraudulent
The universe is laughing at us because nobody has the right perspective (or models and systems) of the nature of life and the universe itself (especially those that say we can't or don't know) :lol:
This is what Eris's gift is to us.
I suppose that series of statements works if you own a ukulele and a fixed-gear bike.
Quote from: Faust on August 10, 2018, 11:03:12 AM
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 10, 2018, 09:29:24 AM
The universe is laughing at us because nobody has the right perspective (or models and systems) of the nature of life and the universe itself (especially those that say we can't or don't know) :lol:
We have an incomplete idea of what is going on, a set of blind men touching an elephant inappropriately, casting a shadow into Plato's Fritzl cave.
Only the elephant got cancelled. :mad:
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 10, 2018, 04:24:49 PM
Quote from: Faust on August 10, 2018, 11:03:12 AM
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 10, 2018, 09:29:24 AM
The universe is laughing at us because nobody has the right perspective (or models and systems) of the nature of life and the universe itself (especially those that say we can't or don't know) :lol:
We have an incomplete idea of what is going on, a set of blind men touching an elephant inappropriately, casting a shadow into Plato's Fritzl cave.
Only the elephant got cancelled. :mad:
Then what the hell are the blind men meant to fondle to figure out the shape of the world? I guess this is what they meant by the Death of Enlightenment.
Our job down here is more or less done. All the head-dizzying science stuff is done by computers, and they seem way more efficient at it than we biological fucknuts ever could. How could you ever even dream of catching that million dollar price they put on figuring out the meaning of life, when some smug computer program does all your research in a simulated reality in seconds and then uses the money to buy more research equipment instead of drugs and hookers.
We just should leave the computers do their thing in peace, dismantle the society and go back hunter-gatherering the woods (if there's any left) until the next poor bastard accidentally drops seeds in front of their home-cave.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 10, 2018, 04:08:49 PMI suppose that series of statements works if you own a ukulele and a fixed-gear bike.
....and sit around the campfire with a fat cigar with that ukulele :lulz:
Quote from: Faust on August 10, 2018, 05:27:01 PM
Then what the hell are the blind men meant to fondle to figure out the shape of the world? I guess this is what they meant by the Death of Enlightenment.
They can feel an ass and think to themselves "this is round and soft", to which they can hypothesize that planet earth is likely spherical
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 13, 2018, 01:14:44 AM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 10, 2018, 04:08:49 PMI suppose that series of statements works if you own a ukulele and a fixed-gear bike.
....and sit around the campfire with a fat cigar with that ukulele :lulz:
Electric campfire. Gluten free cigars.
Quote from: EK WAFFLR on August 13, 2018, 01:19:49 PM
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 13, 2018, 01:14:44 AM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 10, 2018, 04:08:49 PMI suppose that series of statements works if you own a ukulele and a fixed-gear bike.
....and sit around the campfire with a fat cigar with that ukulele :lulz:
Electric campfire. Gluten free cigars.
Obviously. We're not
barbarians.
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 10, 2018, 09:29:24 AM
Agnosticism is intellectually lazy
As a Militant Agnostic it is my religious duty to be triggered by this to an extremist level.
A my boot grinds your cheek into the ground I'll proclaim agnosticism is the only truly intellectually honest stance.
Quote from: Faust on August 13, 2018, 05:06:06 PM
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 10, 2018, 09:29:24 AM
Agnosticism is intellectually lazy
As a Militant Agnostic it is my religious duty to be triggered by this to an extremist level.
A my boot grinds your cheek into the ground I'll proclaim agnosticism is the only truly intellectually honest stance.
FAUST DOESN'T KNOW AND NEITHER DO YOU!
Quote from: EK WAFFLR on August 13, 2018, 01:19:49 PM
Electric campfire. Gluten free cigars.
Now that makes TOO much sense :lol:
Quote from: Faust on August 13, 2018, 05:06:06 PM
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 10, 2018, 09:29:24 AM
Agnosticism is intellectually lazy
As a Militant Agnostic it is my religious duty to be triggered by this to an extremist level.
A my boot grinds your cheek into the ground I'll proclaim agnosticism is the only truly intellectually honest stance.
Agnosticism is the correct answer to the right question.
Quote from: Hoopla on August 17, 2018, 04:24:51 PM
Quote from: Faust on August 13, 2018, 05:06:06 PM
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 10, 2018, 09:29:24 AM
Agnosticism is intellectually lazy
As a Militant Agnostic it is my religious duty to be triggered by this to an extremist level.
A my boot grinds your cheek into the ground I'll proclaim agnosticism is the only truly intellectually honest stance.
Agnosticism is the correct answer to the right question.
This!
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 13, 2018, 04:42:55 PM
Quote from: EK WAFFLR on August 13, 2018, 01:19:49 PM
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 13, 2018, 01:14:44 AM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 10, 2018, 04:08:49 PMI suppose that series of statements works if you own a ukulele and a fixed-gear bike.
....and sit around the campfire with a fat cigar with that ukulele :lulz:
Electric campfire. Gluten free cigars.
Obviously. We're not barbarians.
You may not be. I, on the other hand.
Quote from: EK WAFFLR on August 17, 2018, 09:45:04 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 13, 2018, 04:42:55 PM
Quote from: EK WAFFLR on August 13, 2018, 01:19:49 PM
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 13, 2018, 01:14:44 AM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 10, 2018, 04:08:49 PMI suppose that series of statements works if you own a ukulele and a fixed-gear bike.
....and sit around the campfire with a fat cigar with that ukulele :lulz:
Electric campfire. Gluten free cigars.
Obviously. We're not barbarians.
You may not be. I, on the other hand.
Yes, you barbaric Norwegians, with your savage free health care and your horrific unlimited free education mayhem.
Undetermined is not a non-answer. It is the only answer.
Your ego may not like it, but the universe doesn't care and it's not here to answer your questions.
Unless of course you demand knowing, in which case, hold on to your 'pieces'. Because the "un/indeterminate" can still be way more positive than your average cut.
Here's a knowable concept for you, Qliph: your tagging skills are subpar.
What time is it?
Time to get ill
I'll mix up de medcin.
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on July 23, 2018, 04:43:16 AM
Change my mind :lulz:
Okay, I'll try.. but let me give you the context that I'm a materialist; I don't believe in woo.
The occult/spiritual texts with any value are usually interpreted
way too literally. We modern people have the context of science as a powerful explanatory principle, and it's materially incompatible with concepts like
heaven, soul, demons, et cetera. I think a lot of that stuff is worthless if you read it as a material explanation. Like, clearly there are no demons whispering in our ears, tempting us. But if you read demons as an
internal force, a part of the self that must be struggled with, you are in a place where you can make
personal sense of these writings.
Let's get a bit more concrete,
let's take one of the world's oldest occult maxims, found on the Emerald Tablet of Hermes: "
As above, so below" (the line continues, "With this knowledge alone you may work miracles.")
I could unpack my own understanding of this line, but it might be better if I just mentioned that "above" might not refer to "the heavens", so much as "the zoomed-out universe", (ie macrocosm) and "below" could refer to "the zoomed-in universe" - maybe we're talking about microorganisms, or fine material like molecules, or maybe we're talking about the microcosm, the "inner world".
In some traditions, it's seen this way - when a world is big, it looks like galaxies and nebulas and black holes. A smaller world looks like a sun with planets orbiting around it. A smaller world looks like a planet. A much smaller world looks like an individual person. And within that person maybe there are worlds too.
In that context, "as above, so below" gives us a key to appreciating the structural similarities between macro and micro, which in turn gives us a direct and personal connection to the Big Picture.
I could elaborate more, but probably best to stop there before I get carried away :p
Quote from: Cramulus on August 24, 2018, 02:15:15 PM
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on July 23, 2018, 04:43:16 AM
Change my mind :lulz:
Okay, I'll try.. but let me give you the context that I'm a materialist; I don't believe in woo.
The occult/spiritual texts with any value are usually interpreted way too literally. We modern people have the context of science as a powerful explanatory principle, and it's materially incompatible with concepts like heaven, soul, demons, et cetera. I think a lot of that stuff is worthless if you read it as a material explanation. Like, clearly there are no demons whispering in our ears, tempting us. But if you read demons as an internal force, a part of the self that must be struggled with, you are in a place where you can make personal sense of these writings.
Let's get a bit more concrete,
let's take one of the world's oldest occult maxims, found on the Emerald Tablet of Hermes: "As above, so below" (the line continues, "With this knowledge alone you may work miracles.")
I could unpack my own understanding of this line, but it might be better if I just mentioned that "above" might not refer to "the heavens", so much as "the zoomed-out universe", (ie macrocosm) and "below" could refer to "the zoomed-in universe" - maybe we're talking about microorganisms, or fine material like molecules, or maybe we're talking about the microcosm, the "inner world".
In some traditions, it's seen this way - when a world is big, it looks like galaxies and nebulas and black holes. A smaller world looks like a sun with planets orbiting around it. A smaller world looks like a planet. A much smaller world looks like an individual person. And within that person maybe there are worlds too.
In that context, "as above, so below" gives us a key to appreciating the structural similarities between macro and micro, which in turn gives us a direct and personal connection to the Big Picture.
I could elaborate more, but probably best to stop there before I get carried away :p
"It's all in your head - you just have no idea how big your head is!" - Lon Milo DuQuette
Matthew 17:20 "He replied, "Because you have so little faith. Truly I tell you, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you."
Hyperclessians 8:10 "Ain't nobody around here got mustard."
:lulz:
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 17, 2018, 11:26:59 PM
Quote from: EK WAFFLR on August 17, 2018, 09:45:04 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 13, 2018, 04:42:55 PM
Quote from: EK WAFFLR on August 13, 2018, 01:19:49 PM
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 13, 2018, 01:14:44 AM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 10, 2018, 04:08:49 PMI suppose that series of statements works if you own a ukulele and a fixed-gear bike.
....and sit around the campfire with a fat cigar with that ukulele :lulz:
Electric campfire. Gluten free cigars.
Obviously. We're not barbarians.
You may not be. I, on the other hand.
Yes, you barbaric Norwegians, with your savage free health care and your horrific unlimited free education mayhem.
I, for one, am just waiting for someone
civilized to show us The Light and give us private health care.
It's not a troll because they really are that stupid
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 10, 2018, 09:29:24 AMAgnosticism is intellectually lazy
Agnosticism makes sense because there are so many different religious systems. And a lot of them have really low standards. Throwing lightning bolts was one of the demonstrations back when I used to work at the science museum. Good old Nikola Tesla.
Quote from: Prelate Diogenes Shandor on September 04, 2018, 02:33:43 AM
Quote from: THE QLIPHITISER on August 10, 2018, 09:29:24 AMAgnosticism is intellectually lazy
Agnosticism makes sense because there are so many different religious systems. And a lot of them have really low standards. Throwing lightning bolts was one of the demonstrations back when I used to work at the science museum. Good old Nikola Tesla.
At least, back in the day, they used to call it animatronics. Now, aerobatic
stuntronics are supposed to be a novel alternative. Just sayin'.
Quote"It's all in your head - you just have no idea how big your head is!" - Lon Milo DuQuette
Yoink
I mean in some places all you need in order to qualify as a divinity is a commercial pilot's license.
Quote from: Prelate Diogenes Shandor on September 04, 2018, 08:04:05 PM
I mean in some places all you need in order to qualify as a divinity is a commercial pilot's license.
Dude, all you need to do is fuck Ray J.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 24, 2018, 06:22:58 PM
Matthew 17:20 "He replied, "Because you have so little faith. Truly I tell you, if you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you."
I think J was trolling his bros when he said that. The true meaning is, "If you believe in stuff too much, you'll end up delusional and thinking you can move mountains with your mind. But they won't really be moving. It'll all be in your head. Also, don't mess around with this exorcism stuff. Leave it to the pros."
Quote
Hyperclessians 8:10 "Ain't nobody around here got mustard."
And being empty of stomach and refrigerator, the LORD went unto the grocery store. There he came to the condiments aisle, and as he cast his eyes upon the mustard, declared "One of these things is not like the other, one of these things isn't the same!" And he took a bottle marked
MAILLE à l'Ancienne, and lo! It was filled not with paste, but with mustard seeds soaked in vinegar and wine. And the LORD placed it in his grocery basket, and also placed therein cured meats, and rich cheese, and textured bread, and then returned home to make a Reuben sandwich. And he tasted it, and it was good.
--The Book of Product Placement, 14:19-27.
There has never been something that cannot be undermined by its own inconsistencies.
Quote from: Smillsoid on September 30, 2018, 08:57:24 PM
There has never been something that cannot be undermined by its own inconsistencies.
YOU have clearly never gone to the bathroom after me.
YES I HAVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Quote from: Smillsoid on September 30, 2018, 10:05:32 PM
YES I HAVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
No. If you had, you wouldn't have the energy to post word salad. LMNO had to use the can after me at the Kitchen in Boston, and he's posted like 3 times in the 6 years since, and only when it was really important. Two years before THAT, Professor Cramulus AND Cainad had to use the can after me at a hot dog joint off of the Common. Cramulus DIED and Cainad became a
geologist, if you can believe that.
My Godlike ability to destroy a toilet is recorded in epic poetry in Providence, Boston, Chicago, and mostly Portland, where toilets are apparently made for tiny people with tiny poop.
Nobody gets to shit after me in Portland.
Here in Tucson, it's just another day.
He's not kidding. Hamilton was a halfway decent burg at one point.
Then Howl tried the poutine.
Roger's poops didn't make me belive in God, but they did make me believe in the devil.
Quote from: Hoopla! on October 02, 2018, 03:44:15 AM
He's not kidding. Hamilton was a halfway decent burg at one point.
Then Howl tried the poutine.
Lies. That joint was degenerate long before I dropped trou. They are in fact the only city that didn't NOTICE that I had shit. Only it's just that Burlington smelled a bit worse, and everyone moved from Mississauga to Pickering.
Quote from: Cramulus on October 02, 2018, 01:02:12 PM
Roger's poops didn't make me belive in God, but they did make me believe in the devil.
Yes, but he's dead. Can we talk about ME now?
I had a weird thought when I was reading about some Grimoire or other and it was this;
It does not make narrative sense to imagine that in antiquity, a person might write a meaningless book that seems superfically magical. The narrative of a sixteenth century, dusty "book of spells" that is just abject nonsense and means nothing does not suit, it does not fit. We refuse to believe it. We will go to extraordinary lengths to justify that this text means something / does something... Rationalizing it as like, okay, it actually allows us to do something magic. Or; it contains great truths if it is interpreted poetically and knowingly...
The idea that one day Some Bloke might sit down and go; ho fucking hum I'm going to draw a bunch of angles and write spooky things in an odd tone... Then I'm going to sign it with my weird made up name... Magister Magus Glenn Ravenwhiteround. It's too... Simultaneously mundane and weird. It is completely unsatisfactory to us so we never even Think it.
Yet Livejournal existed.
Quote from: Slyph on January 04, 2019, 05:16:42 AM
I had a weird thought when I was reading about some Grimoire or other and it was this;
It does not make narrative sense to imagine that in antiquity, a person might write a meaningless book that seems superfically magical. The narrative of a sixteenth century, dusty "book of spells" that is just abject nonsense and means nothing does not suit, it does not fit. We refuse to believe it. We will go to extraordinary lengths to justify that this text means something / does something... Rationalizing it as like, okay, it actually allows us to do something magic. Or; it contains great truths if it is interpreted poetically and knowingly...
The idea that one day Some Bloke might sit down and go; ho fucking hum I'm going to draw a bunch of angles and write spooky things in an odd tone... Then I'm going to sign it with my weird made up name... Magister Magus Glenn Ravenwhiteround. It's too... Simultaneously mundane and weird. It is completely unsatisfactory to us so we never even Think it.
Yet Livejournal existed.
You also have hucksters (I have something people want to hear, and it's all already bullshit, might as well write more bullshit) and genuine proto-scientists. The latter is especially true of farmer's almanac type documents and earlier, the kind of magical texts associated with the nobility.
But your concept there has some historical backing too. I present to you my favorite real life werewolf tale ever. http://www.philosophyforlife.org/the-good-werewolf/
He sounds remarkably like a modern day Otherkin. I can totally see him sitting there by candle-light sketching his OC in charcoal, then by day bumming around in a long oilskin jacket striking poses. All power to him, man. That's actually kind of cool, I love mitties.