At the request of some people here, I have decided to host a game. However, I wanted to make it in a more PD-oriented idiom, so here's the deal.
There will be three Spiders. They will be known collectively as The Spider. They will initially know only ONE other Spider. Each round ("round" is to be defined later), one of the Spiders will choose a Citizen to subsume. If subsumed, the Citizen is out of the game and will sit on the couch to watch Jersey Shore reruns.
There will be initially one Discordian. No one else will know who this is. Every round, one Discordian can evangelize a Citizen. There will be a 50% chance that the Citizen will convert and become a Discordian. The new Discordian will know who converted him. If not converted, the Citizen will not know who the Discordian is.
If a Spider tries to subsume a Discordian, there will be a 50% chance they will not succeed.
If a Discordian tries to evangelize a Spider, there will be a 50% chance they will be subsumed.
If a Discordian tries to convert another Discordian, they will create a CABAL. The CABAL has a 100% chance of converting a Citizen, who will then be part of that CABAL. It will be up to the CABAL if they want to make it public. The CABAL will be broken if it's members are subsumed or Put On A Bus.
If a Spider tries to subsume one of the other Spiders, they will create The Machine™. Once created, The Machine™ has a 100% chance of crushing both Citizens and Discordians, but only a 50% chance if they are part of a CABAL. Once created, The Machine™ will continue to exist, even if one of the Spiders is Put On A Bus (see below).
If a Discordian is not subsumed, they will be given two names. One will be the Spider, and one will be a Citizen or another Discordian. They will not know which is which.
Every round, the Citizens will discuss and choose a fellow Citizen to Put On A Bus (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PutOnABus), where they will be forced to surf TVTropes.com for the remainder of the game, and can not participate. A simple majority will choose who to Put On A Bus. If no simple majority is reached, then no one gets Put On A Bus that round.
A Round will be defined as the length of time it takes for EVERYONE playing the game to make a post. The game will not continue until everyone has posted in that round.
Depending on how the game is going, there may or may not be clues in the various narratives as to the identities of the Discordian and the Spider.
The game is over when either all the Spiders have been Put On A Bus, or all Citizens have been Subsumed.
If all Citizens are Discordians at the end of the game, and all Spiders have been Put On A Bus, then the game ends with REVOLUTION.
To Recap:
-At the beginning of the game, no one will know who the Discordian is.
-A Spider will only know one other Spider (out of three).
-A converted Discordian will only know who converted them.
-Each round, there will be a vote for who gets Put On A Bus.
-A Discordian has a chance of not being subsumed by a Spider.
-A Discordian has a chance of converting a Citizen into a Discordian.
-A Discordian can create a CABAL by converting a Discordian.
-A Spider can create The Machine™ by subsuming another Spider.
-A round is not over until all eligible Citizens have made a post.
The idea here is to make it a more forum-friendly game, and to string it along for a while. There are plenty of directions the game could go, depending on what choices players make. There is a good chance that a CABAL or The Machine™ will never be created. There is a possibility that more than one CABAL can be created and destroyed in a game. And Discordians might not get subsumed. Plus, everyone has to post each round. No more of this "hiding and hoping no one notices" crap.
Now, we're going to need a lot of people in order to do this right. I'm thinking at least 15 to 20 people.
I am now opening this up to general comments, questions, and Citizen Signup. All good suggestions will be incorporated into the game.
I'm in.
Me me me!
Sounds cool. Count me in.
May I suggest though, rather than a round be counted as the time it takes for everyone to post, a round is the amount of time it takes for everyone to vote (or abstain from voting, in which case they must declare that they are abstaining), because I know that sometimes I post but do not vote, because I am waiting on seeing what others are doing.
ETA: Also, am I right in assuming that spiders will pick who so subsume at the same time the citizens are voting?
I was going to suggest that a round take the time it takes for EVERYONE to post, but if it's a particularly lively conversation, have there be a tie limit, like a day or something.
Rumck, an emoticon will count as a post, as will saying you don't feel like voting.
HOWEVER, the game is no fun if nobody posts. So post, and have fun.
Also, the game will start with conversation, and a vote. I hate it when someone gets kicked off before anything happens. After someone gets Put On A Bus, the Spider will make its choice, and the Discordian will try to convert. Then another vote.
Freeky, I wanted the rounds not to be bound by time. If someone is having a rough day at work and can't get online, or if they're taking the weekend off, the game shouldn't penalize them for that.
As Narrator, I am probably going to be flexible with the timeline and the story. Additionally, if there suddenly appears to be a serious flaw in the mechanics, I may change them mid-game (unless it's really funny, in which case I'll let it ride).
Oh, and both the Spider and the Discordian can choose not to choose.
I would like to join. :)
Sounds pretty awesome, and I'd love to sign up.
Some questions, though:
1. Does the Discordian receive confirmation whether or not his convert was successful?
2. If a Spider subsumes another Spider, are both players still in the game, or does only one adopt the role of the Machine?
3. When a Machine is created, is the third Spider automatically part of it? If not, can they become a part of it, or must they start their own Machine?
4. Do the Citizens receive notification when a Cabal or Machine is created?
It seems to me that the Cabal and the Machine will be the very first things created. If I were a Discordian, I would just keep trying to convert a single person, making them into a Discordian and then into a Cabal-member. It would be absurdly easy to create a Cabal, as I know who all the other Discordians are. Ditto for the Spiders.
An example: I am one of the Spiders. I know the identity of one of the Spiders, but not the other. On the very first night, I subsume the person I know is a Spider, thereby creating the Machine on the very first round.
1. Does the Discordian receive confirmation whether or not his convert was successful?
-Yes, it will be part of the Narration.
2. If a Spider subsumes another Spider, are both players still in the game, or does only one adopt the role of the Machine?
-Both players will be in the game, but all three Spiders now know each other and have combined to form The Machine™.
3. When a Machine is created, is the third Spider automatically part of it? If not, can they become a part of it, or must they start their own Machine?
-Logic would imply that if Alice is a Spider and knows Bob is a Spider, and Alice subsumes Chris who is a Spider and the Machine™ is formed, then Alice will tell Bob that Chris is the third Spider, and they are now all part of The Machine™.
4. Do the Citizens receive notification when a Cabal or Machine is created?
-Yes, it will be in the narration. The Citizens will not know who is in the CABAL, however. It is up to the Discordians to reveal that, if they choose.
Quote
It seems to me that the Cabal and the Machine will be the very first things created. If I were a Discordian, I would just keep trying to convert a single person, making them into a Discordian and then into a Cabal-member. It would be absurdly easy to create a Cabal, as I know who all the other Discordians are. Ditto for the Spiders.
Allow me to clarify. A CABAL is formed when you try to convert someone
you did not originally convert yourself.
On each turn, only one Discordian can act, just as only one Spider can act. It is not exponential.
So, Alice converts Bob (Turn One), and then Bob converts Chris (Turn Two). If Chris converts Alice (Turn Three), a CABAL is formed between Alice and Chris (AC). It is now Alice's turn, acting in the capacity of the CABAL. Alice cannot make Bob part of the CABAL, because she originally converted him. She converts Dawn, instead, who is now part of the CABAL. The turn then goes back to Bob (CABAL counts as a single entity), who can either convert Dawn and Join the CABAL, or try to convert Ernie.
A->B
B->C
C->A = AC
AC->D = ACD
B can either ->D (for ABCD), or ->E
Keep in mind that at any point, they may end up trying to convert a Spider, or a Spider may try to subsume any one of the Discordians.
Quote from: Remington on September 14, 2010, 05:12:55 PM
An example: I am one of the Spiders. I know the identity of one of the Spiders, but not the other. On the very first night, I subsume the person I know is a Spider, thereby creating the Machine on the very first round.
Yes, that
could happen. As this could only happen randomly, or as part of an extremely good guess, this is yet another reason that a larger number of people playing would be better.
Wait. You're right. if a=b=c, then A will know C is a Spider via a simple PM.
Ok, perhaps the Spiders shouldn't know each other at first. They have to figure it out, too.
Eh, might be interesting. I'll join.
Quote from: Doktor Alphapance on September 14, 2010, 05:29:26 PM
Quote
It seems to me that the Cabal and the Machine will be the very first things created. If I were a Discordian, I would just keep trying to convert a single person, making them into a Discordian and then into a Cabal-member. It would be absurdly easy to create a Cabal, as I know who all the other Discordians are. Ditto for the Spiders.
Allow me to clarify. A CABAL is formed when you try to convert someone you did not originally convert yourself.
On each turn, only one Discordian can act, just as only one Spider can act. It is not exponential.
So, Alice converts Bob (Turn One), and then Bob converts Chris (Turn Two). If Chris converts Alice (Turn Three), a CABAL is formed between Alice and Chris (AC).
Same problem as the Spiders. Bob tells Chris that Alice is a Discordian, so therefore Chris is guaranteed a Cabal when it's his turn to convert someone.
Also:
Spider subsuming Discordian----> 50% chance
Machine subsuming Discordian -----> 100% chance
Machine subsuming Cabal-member ------> 50% chance
Spider subsuming Cabal-member -------> ????
I've missed all the lycanthopic misadventures, but i'd like in on one of these games... :)
That's fine, though. Being in a Cabal means that you have a 50% chance of survival if The Machine™ is formed, and you're spending your turn creating the cabal rather than spreading the word of Discordia.
Intro narration
Round 1:
-Someone gets Put On A Bus (could be one of three Spiders, a Citizen, or the Discordian). Or, not enough votes.
-Spider subsumes. If it's the Discordian, it may not work. Could be another Spider.
-Discordian tries conversion (if they're still around).
Narration ensues.
Round 2:
-Someone gets Put on a Bus (could be one of three Spiders, a Citizen, or the/a Discordian [depending if the conversion worked]). Or, not enough votes.
-Spider subsumes. If it's the/a Discordian, it may not work. There may only be one Spider left at this point. Or, The Machine™ may be formed.
-Discordian(s) try conversion (if they're still around).
Narration ensues.
Round 3:
-Someone gets Put on a Bus (could be one of three Spiders, a Citizen, or the/a Discordian [depending if the conversion worked]). Or, not enough votes.
-Spider subsumes, or the game is over, or The Machine™ either crushes a citizen, or a Discordian.
-Discordian either tries a conversion, or forms a Cabal. Note that there still may be only one Discordian at this point.
Narration ensues.
So you see, it will take a minimum of three rounds to even get to the point of attempting a Cabal. And that's if everything goes well. On top of that, by that point we've lost between 0 and 6 players. Would it be better to keep converting new people, or waste a turn forming a Cabal that only is 50% effective against The Machine™?
QuoteAlso:
Spider subsuming Discordian----> 50% chance
Machine subsuming Discordian -----> 100% chance
Machine subsuming Cabal-member ------> 50% chance
Spider subsuming Cabal-member -------> ????
I was thinking that if The Machine™ has not been created by the time a Cabal is formed, the same 50% chance exists if a Spider attempts to subsume a Cabal member.
The reasoning is as follows: The Cabal has an advantage in that they know and can trust each other, and organize their votes in secret, and can narrow down their choices of who is a Spider. Even if the Cabal is broken, they still know who's in and who's out. Plus, I want to limit this to coin flipping, and not dice rolling.
And it becomes a strategy whether it's worth it to form a Cabal if you think you can nail one of the Spiders before they form The Machine™.
I'm in.
That seems like it would work. Forming a Cabal is only beneficial if the Machine has been formed. I'm in.
Ok, that's 8 people. We need more.
-Sigmatic joins your party-
Quote from: Doktor Alphapance on September 14, 2010, 04:28:33 PM
Freeky, I wanted the rounds not to be bound by time. If someone is having a rough day at work and can't get online, or if they're taking the weekend off, the game shouldn't penalize them for that.
yeah but afaik, she was talking about a minimum time, not a time-limit.
cause it would also mean that, in the event that everybody is online during a round, the round will be over as soon as everybody has said something right? so that means some people will only get to put in one post in a round. and as someone else said, sometimes it's good to see what others have to say first.
so how about saying that a round will take at least 24 hours, and longer if not everybody has posted yet?
also, count me in. this weekend I might not be able to be online every 24h though (dunno when you planned to start)
I want to play.
I've been wanting to join in one of ese games for a while, and this one seems like a great time to do it.
Count me in.
I'd like to play.
Question: Is the Cabal broken after only one of it's members is Subsumed or Bused, or must all members be removed?
I WANNA PLAY TOO! :argh!:
Sign me up.
IN! In in in in in in in in in!
P.S. I'm SO in.
So, we have, what, 16 peoples so far?
what are you going to shoot for, LMNO?
THE WORLD.
I think that's 15 people:
BDS
Cudgel
Dok Howl
Dr James Semaj
Eater of Clowns
Iptuous
Joh'Nyx
Mistress Freeky
phoenixofdiscordia
Remington
Requia
Rumckle
Sigmatic
That Green Gentleman
Triple Zero
That's a pretty good amount. However, I'm going on my anniversary vacation tomorrow, so we'll keep registration open until Tuesday, when things will kick off.
Comments:
The minimum of a round will be 24 hours. I will signal the end of a round by asking for a Final Vote, and Final PMs regarding conversion or subsuming. When those are received, a Narrative will follow.
If, after 24 hours some people have not made their post, I will announce who has not posted yet.
Additionally, any round that occurs during a weekend will be a Very Long Round.
Quote from: Remington on September 14, 2010, 11:54:56 PM
Question: Is the Cabal broken after only one of it's members is Subsumed or Bused, or must all members be removed?
When a Cabal is reduced to only one person, it has been broken.
And in case you're wondering, yes. I
did make a spreadsheet for tracking this fucking monster.
WHY SPIDERS!!?!??! :x :x :x :x
WHY CANT WE BE BUTTERFLIES?
is this game going to have pics of spiders?
No. Not from me, at least.
Interested in playing?
i will play if there are NO PICTURES :argh!:
I will put you on the list, and promise not to post pics of spiders.
One thought I had when reading the rules was that while the Spiders are our invention, in line with the setting, we could just as well call them Illuminati agents, in a more "traditional" Discordian sense. Not that I mind Spiders, btw.
Spiders seems to fit the narration I'm developing, and it has ties to PD.com themes, so... Yeah.
Quote from: Frederieke van Noodleberg on September 15, 2010, 02:35:55 PM
WHY SPIDERS!!?!??! :x :x :x :x
WHY CANT WE BE BUTTERFLIES?
is this game going to have pics of spiders?
I was going to make a joke involving these:
(http://mikeeatsdetroit.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/boston-cooler.jpg?w=210&h=250)
But then I realised that us Aussies are just wacky, and other people don't call these spiders.
:sad:
Is rootbeer float? :?
We call any kind of "floats", spiders down here.
Ohhh.
That's because you have gigantic mutant freak spiders, who will rip your face off, eat it, and piss on your remains.
I personally like the Spider Project tie-in.
Ok, I'm not going to be back at my work computer until Tuesday. The game will begin Tuesday morning with Narration. All those who sign up between now and then will be included in the game.
Even do the Illuminati are more of a Discordian Tradition, the interactions within the game makikng synergy with LMNOs Spider narrative could turn out to be a very interesting thing - i mean, this seems like its gonna be a long game, might as well boost its potential for art.
Let's save that for the next game-- I'm pretty sure its already overly complicated. I task you with a way to include Illuminati next time around.
Also, StoreBrand is playing, too.
Im confused as if you are responding to Trip or me. For clarity, i wasnt implying that its necessary to include the Illuminati, i was responding to this:
Quote from: Triple Zero on September 15, 2010, 02:56:04 PM
One thought I had when reading the rules was that while the Spiders are our invention, in line with the setting, we could just as well call them Illuminati agents, in a more "traditional" Discordian sense. Not that I mind Spiders, btw.
And I was actually just trying to say the Spiders reminded me of Illumati agents, in some way. Nothing about changing anything, I wouldn't know what you're planning anyway :)
Joh'Nyx sent me this PM, ad gave me permission to x-post:
Quote-What happens when a CABAL attempts to evangelize a Spider? or The Machine?
-Is there a hierarchy of decision for who decides who will be evangelized by the CABAL?(which i think would be off-theme, recommend making it unanimous or majority)
-When a CABAL is formed, will the Discordians be able to Evangelize independently with the original success ratio? (i suggest this is implemented, to add more gameplay options)
Id like to recommend too there being two initial Discordians, and (to compensate) 4 initial Spiders; reason being that otherwise all the Discordians created know each other, and it might add to the fun having two independent Discos working independently initially (adding the possibility for a couple WTF moments)
And just for the lulz, maybe throw in a Pinealism ability, along the lines of 10% chance to Put On a Bus a random Spider with 90% of being Subdued - a trait option to become a Really Real Discordian, upping the Evangelize ability to 75% while being 75% vulnerable to Subdue.
Perhaps change the name of Evangelize to Mindfuck?
Although a Cabal is treated as one unit during turns, only one person in that Cabal will PM me their choice of who they want to convert. If they choose to convert someone who turns out to be a Spider or The Machine, then they run the same chances as if the Spider attacked them.
The Cabal can use whatever system they want in order to choose who to evangelize. I just need a PM from one of them when it's their turn.
Since a Cabal has a 100% chance of converting a citizen, why would they want to try to convert on their own? But, I suppose there could be a reason. So: When it's the Cabal's turn, the individual PMing me should indicate if they are doing it outside of the Cabal, if they choose. The default is that it's the Cabal (that is, if they don't tell me they're doing it solo, I'm assuming they're acting on behalf of the Cabal).
I don't think we have enough players for 2 Discordians and 4 Spiders, although that would be a lot of fun. If there's a second game, try to get more people, and we can do that.
The Pinealism idea is interesting, but it seems too complicated for me right now. Perhaps we can develop something for the next round.
Are you going to clear up the rules at the beginning of the game cause im CONFUSED right now
Don't worry, Fred.
there's enough rules nerds present that you can simply enjoy the narrative of the game and rely on them to steer you in regards to the rules, i would imagine...
no if its like the previous games i will have to be the rules nerd :lulz:
3 spiders, 1 Discordian.
Each round, 1 spider attacks, 1 discordian converts, and the citizens puts 1 person on a bus.
A cabal is treated as 1 "person".
The spider faction is every bit as scary as their metaphorical (real life) counterpart is.
Ok, I am going to start the game in a new thread. Here are the players for Game 1:
BDS
Cudgel
Dok Howl
Dr James Semaj
Eater of Clowns
Frederieke van Noodleberg
Iptuous
Joh'Nyx
Mistress Freeky
phoenixofdiscordia
Remington
Requia
Rumckle
Sigmatic
Storebrand
That Green Gentleman
Triple Zero
A final(lol) clarification: Since there are three actions that happen each round, They are being arranged in this order:
Vote
Spider
Discordian
So, if the Discordian is Put on a Bus, then no conversion happens. Similarly, if the Spider whose turn it was gets voted off, no one is subsumed, etc.
I am going to have to watch a few rounds of this game to understand it I think.
The basic structure is like Werewolves - vote/attack/repeat as necessary.
There are a few twists which give the possibility an attack may not work.
That's pretty much it.