https://medium.com/@kmikeym/is-this-a-sandwich-50b1317eb3f5
QuoteI put them in pairs and instructed them to create as clear and literal a definition as they could—one that encompassed all things they knew to be sandwiches, while providing criteria for excluding all those things that were obviously not sandwiches. Furthermore, anything they were going to submit as examples of a "sandwich" also had to pass the thought experiment of imagining ordering "a sandwich" in a restaurant and being brought that thing—because after all, this is an exercise about common knowledge. We all "know" what a sandwich is. Their definition had to somehow account for this shared mental understanding. So "a bowling ball between two pieces of lettuce" would not count, for example.
This is guaranteed to result in a screaming match every time. Let's do it!
That was awesome and I must share the article with a teacher friend of mine given to philosophical arguments on FB and a fan of Socrates.
See I used to consider the taco to simply be a "Mexican sandwich". Then I discovered the torta. It had more "sandwichness" and I realized that the important "Mexican" attributes of contents and flavor were nearly identical, yet by being on a yeasty flour bun rather than a flat, unleavened tortilla my reasoning mind saw more "sandwichness". My unreasonable eating mind promptly instructed me to "shut up and eat it" in it's usual wordless fashion.
I kind of wish the "Socrates" in the article had folded the pizza over and asked if it was then a taco or asked if the (IMO already oxymoronic )vegan pepperoni was still just that once it was touching cheese.
Starting to think logocentrism is strictly for suckers.
A sandwich is a thing you can hold in your hand that is two flat-ish food items with at least one different food item in between, with no non-food items, and is intended to be eaten as-is (not taken apart, eaten one piece at a time, or leaving any portion uneaten).
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 05:34:30 PM
A sandwich is a thing you can hold in your hand that is two flat-ish food items with at least one different food item in between, with no non-food items, and is intended to be eaten as-is (not taken apart, eaten one piece at a time, or leaving any portion uneaten).
So... if a cheap corn tortilla splits along the fold has it metamorphosed into a sandwich if it remains otherwise intact and edible?
An Oreo is a sammish!
Sandwich cookie. Gonna go Google fish for "cookie sandwich".
:argh!:
ALL returns were images of either ice cream sandwiches or sandwich cookies. Not one single example of a cookie stuffed betwixt two edible things!
Lasagna is a sammish!
Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on September 11, 2015, 05:43:08 PM
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 05:34:30 PM
A sandwich is a thing you can hold in your hand that is two flat-ish food items with at least one different food item in between, with no non-food items, and is intended to be eaten as-is (not taken apart, eaten one piece at a time, or leaving any portion uneaten).
So... if a cheap corn tortilla splits along the fold has it metamorphosed into a sandwich if it remains otherwise intact and edible?
Yes, it is now a taco sammich.
Alternatively the definition could be modified to include intent. But I'm okay with taco sammich.
So one piece of bread and a slice of bologna folded in half is not a sandwich?
Open face sammich?
Quote from: Emo Howard on September 11, 2015, 06:22:35 PM
So one piece of bread and a slice of bologna folded in half is not a sandwich?
Not a sandwich. Unless you break the bread in half when you fold it.
Quote from: Don Coyote on September 11, 2015, 06:25:18 PM
Open face sammich?
NOT A SAMMICH. I WILL FIGHT YOU.
Is the sandwich blue or not?
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on September 11, 2015, 06:37:54 PM
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 05:57:02 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on September 11, 2015, 05:53:45 PM
Lasagna is a sammish!
Lasagna is not hand held.
You, my dear, have obviously never been stoned out of your gourd at 3am.
:lulz:
Been a good day for teh lulz!
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on September 11, 2015, 06:37:54 PM
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 05:57:02 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on September 11, 2015, 05:53:45 PM
Lasagna is a sammish!
Lasagna is not hand held.
You, my dear, have obviously never been stoned out of your gourd at 3am.
Obviously not. Lasagna can be a 3am stoned sammich, but only if it's held in the hand.
Yes, laugh laugh laugh, but Enrico had unique experience with a Sand Witch when he was young, was no laugh matter.
Quote from: President Television on September 11, 2015, 08:04:48 PM
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 05:57:02 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on September 11, 2015, 05:53:45 PM
Lasagna is a sammish!
Lasagna is not hand held.
Neither is a "hot" sandwich.
See now this is more a matter of personal endurance.
Which brings up a fine point. If a person cannot hold the sandwich for some reason has it ceased to be a sandwich for them? Like if you have no arms, as an extreme illustration, do sandwiches cease to be?
Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on September 11, 2015, 08:20:38 PM
Quote from: President Television on September 11, 2015, 08:04:48 PM
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 05:57:02 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on September 11, 2015, 05:53:45 PM
Lasagna is a sammish!
Lasagna is not hand held.
Neither is a "hot" sandwich.
See now this is more a matter of personal endurance.
Which brings up a fine point. If a person cannot hold the sandwich for some reason has it ceased to be a sandwich for them? Like if you have no arms, as an extreme illustration, do sandwiches cease to be?
Hot sandwiches aren't literally hot, they're covered in gravy.
Though the gravy itself is usually hot.
Quote from: President Television on September 11, 2015, 08:21:50 PM
Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on September 11, 2015, 08:20:38 PM
Quote from: President Television on September 11, 2015, 08:04:48 PM
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 05:57:02 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on September 11, 2015, 05:53:45 PM
Lasagna is a sammish!
Lasagna is not hand held.
Neither is a "hot" sandwich.
See now this is more a matter of personal endurance.
Which brings up a fine point. If a person cannot hold the sandwich for some reason has it ceased to be a sandwich for them? Like if you have no arms, as an extreme illustration, do sandwiches cease to be?
Hot sandwiches aren't literally hot, they're covered in gravy.
Though the gravy itself is usually hot.
No, I got you Mr. President. Had a few hot beef 'n gravy in my time. Just because it's messy is no reason not to pick it up at some point. I usually have fries and improvise a poutien with the remaining gravy.
Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on September 11, 2015, 08:20:38 PM
Quote from: President Television on September 11, 2015, 08:04:48 PM
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 05:57:02 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on September 11, 2015, 05:53:45 PM
Lasagna is a sammish!
Lasagna is not hand held.
Neither is a "hot" sandwich.
See now this is more a matter of personal endurance.
Which brings up a fine point. If a person cannot hold the sandwich for some reason has it ceased to be a sandwich for them? Like if you have no arms, as an extreme illustration, do sandwiches cease to be?
If you can't eat it as a sandwich, it's not a sandwich. So, if you have to put a pastrami and rye in a blender and drink it as a shake, it is not a sandwich anymore.
I wonder where the line is for people with very handy feet, though.
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 08:48:52 PM
Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on September 11, 2015, 08:20:38 PM
Quote from: President Television on September 11, 2015, 08:04:48 PM
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 05:57:02 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on September 11, 2015, 05:53:45 PM
Lasagna is a sammish!
Lasagna is not hand held.
Neither is a "hot" sandwich.
See now this is more a matter of personal endurance.
Which brings up a fine point. If a person cannot hold the sandwich for some reason has it ceased to be a sandwich for them? Like if you have no arms, as an extreme illustration, do sandwiches cease to be?
If you can't eat it as a sandwich, it's not a sandwich. So, if you have to put a pastrami and rye in a blender and drink it as a shake, it is not a sandwich anymore.
I wonder where the line is for people with very handy feet, though.
See NOW were talking enlightenment! That would be the "kung-fu" Way of making sandwiches real.
Pretty soon mind-machine interfacing and prosthetic advancement could make sandwiches real for almost anyone with a functioning brain and nervous system, without all the stretching and balance training.
I always thought sandwich was an action and we called the food sandwiches that because they showed the action.
Quote from: Meunster on September 11, 2015, 09:29:28 PM
I always thought sandwich was an action and we called the food sandwiches that because they showed the action.
Look up Earl of Sandwich. For real.
I'm not sure if "hand held" really works as a criteria, since it's a contextual property rather than inherent property of a sandwich. A burrito isn't reay a sandwich but can be hand held, and if you're weird you could eat a sandwich with fork and knife.
Patty melt?
Quote from: Cain on September 11, 2015, 06:38:25 PM
Is the sandwich blue or not?
You can make a blue sandwich if you want, as long as it meets the other criteria.
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 10:31:35 PM
Quote from: Cain on September 11, 2015, 06:38:25 PM
Is the sandwich blue or not?
You can make a blue sandwich if you want, as long as it meets the other criteria.
Please see your English language thread, you Goddamn lunch tyrant.
Quote from: Cainad (dec.) on September 11, 2015, 10:12:01 PM
I'm not sure if "hand held" really works as a criteria, since it's a contextual property rather than inherent property of a sandwich. A burrito isn't reay a sandwich but can be hand held, and if you're weird you could eat a sandwich with fork and knife.
A burrito isn't a sandwich because it isn't two matching things with at least one different thing in the middle. It's one thing wrapped around at least one other thing.
Hand held I think can be a property of a thing. http://www.thefreedictionary.com/handheld
Quote from: Doktor Howl on September 11, 2015, 10:35:46 PM
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 10:31:35 PM
Quote from: Cain on September 11, 2015, 06:38:25 PM
Is the sandwich blue or not?
You can make a blue sandwich if you want, as long as it meets the other criteria.
Please see your English language thread, you Goddamn lunch tyrant.
I'm a tyrant of lots of things.
This kind of epistemic terrorism is what's keeping America from being great again, you know. I won't stand for it.
Quote from: Cainad (dec.) on September 11, 2015, 10:40:33 PM
This kind of epistemic terrorism is what's keeping America from being great again, you know. I won't stand for it.
Me neither. We should probably sit down.
One thing I despise about sandwiches is how quickly we lose all the good ones. Sometimes it seems like the only real sandwiches left are bad, or at least have something wrong with them. I mean that, by definition, a good sandwich is one that once was itself only by becoming part of something else, like my belly. So, all extant sandwitches can be identified by their ego problems and lack of enthusiasm to fulfill their destiny. Bad sandwitches!
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 10:38:08 PM
Quote from: Cainad (dec.) on September 11, 2015, 10:12:01 PM
I'm not sure if "hand held" really works as a criteria, since it's a contextual property rather than inherent property of a sandwich. A burrito isn't reay a sandwich but can be hand held, and if you're weird you could eat a sandwich with fork and knife.
A burrito isn't a sandwich because it isn't two matching things with at least one different thing in the middle. It's one thing wrapped around at least one other thing.
So would this make a stuffed pork chop a form of burrito?
you guys ever heard "Sandwich of Love" by Mentors?
Quote from: rong on September 11, 2015, 11:50:23 PM
you guys ever heard "Sandwich of Love" by Mentors?
Not sure, can you hum a few bars?
Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on September 12, 2015, 12:02:38 AM
Quote from: rong on September 11, 2015, 11:50:23 PM
you guys ever heard "Sandwich of Love" by Mentors?
Not sure, can you hum a few bars?
youtube is blocked at work so i'm not sure if this link will work . . . (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCAQyCkwAGoVChMIyO6cxY7wxwIVg4kNCh30VgWk&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Ds9ek6dGBntI&usg=AFQjCNFkIyP-cVJ5MHaQ0R3gq9RelKgoQA&sig2=1wFjwq2qmHk0_Smc4NrdmA&bvm=bv.102537793,d.eXY)
Quote from: rong on September 12, 2015, 12:17:37 AM
Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on September 12, 2015, 12:02:38 AM
Quote from: rong on September 11, 2015, 11:50:23 PM
you guys ever heard "Sandwich of Love" by Mentors?
Not sure, can you hum a few bars?
youtube is blocked at work so i'm not sure if this link will work . . . (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCAQyCkwAGoVChMIyO6cxY7wxwIVg4kNCh30VgWk&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Ds9ek6dGBntI&usg=AFQjCNFkIyP-cVJ5MHaQ0R3gq9RelKgoQA&sig2=1wFjwq2qmHk0_Smc4NrdmA&bvm=bv.102537793,d.eXY)
It did. Definitely never heard it before.
Your humming sounds an awful lot like a guitar intro. :lol:
I'll stop being an ass now.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on September 11, 2015, 10:41:32 PM
Quote from: Cainad (dec.) on September 11, 2015, 10:40:33 PM
This kind of epistemic terrorism is what's keeping America from being great again, you know. I won't stand for it.
Me neither. We should probably sit down.
Good call, my feet hurt.
Quote from: Q. G. Pennyworth on September 11, 2015, 10:31:35 PM
Quote from: Cain on September 11, 2015, 06:38:25 PM
Is the sandwich blue or not?
You can make a blue sandwich if you want, as long as it meets the other criteria.
I did, but when I posted it on Facebook everyone said it was grey :sad:
In my personal, internal definition of sandwich, a sandwich is one or more pieces of leavened, sliced bread, used as a vehicle for other items of food that are cooked or prepared separately from the bread but meant to be eaten in the same bite with the bread once placed upon it in the construction of a sandwich.
I am completely willing to be flexible on this, though, resulting in my conclusion that a taco is, indeed, potentially a kind of sandwich, as is a burrito.
There is a great deal of gray area in sandwiches. A hot brown, for example. Is it a sandwich? I am inclined to think it is more a type of hot salad.
And cake. Cake is clearly a sandwich.
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on September 12, 2015, 10:42:07 PM
And cake. Cake is clearly a sandwich.
One of the great secrets of my paternal cultural heritage has already hit FB and so I might as well say it here.
Lasagna is really just spaghetti flavored cake. :fnord:
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on September 12, 2015, 10:42:07 PM
And cake. Cake is clearly a sandwich.
When I was just a little girl, back in the infantry, we would occasionally get hot food brought out to us. It was kind of a sick joke, because there was never TIME to go through a chow line, eat your food, whatever.
So what we'd do is make a commando sammich.
2 slices of bread.
Put lasagna or whatever the main meal was on the bread.
Put side on top of main meal.
Put salad on top of side.
Put desert on top of salad.
Put other slice of bread on top.
Smash down.
Eat.
Flip the bird at the outraged cooks whinging about how you insulted their culinary skills in such a manner.
Go back to walking in circles in a swamp.
Pretty sure cake is a kind of pie.
Ergo, sandwiches are pies.
Quote from: Cain on September 13, 2015, 02:01:29 AM
Pretty sure cake is a kind of pie.
Ergo, sandwiches are pies.
Pie requires a crust. Cake lacks a crust, and is typically smeared with frosting. Ergo, cake is a sandwich.
I decided to end the great pie/cake debate by defining it away.
A pie is a cake is a burger is a sandwich is...something. Problem solved.
Apart from what colour the picture of it is.
Quote from: Cain on September 13, 2015, 03:08:54 AM
I decided to end the great pie/cake debate by defining it away.
A pie is a cake is a burger is a sandwich is...something. Problem solved.
Apart from what colour the picture of it is.
EXACTLY.
Sandwiches are an illusion. Except for tuna melts. I think we all know why.
Quote from: Cain on September 13, 2015, 03:08:54 AM
I decided to end the great pie/cake debate by defining it away.
A pie is a cake is a burger is a sandwich is...something. Problem solved.
Apart from what colour the picture of it is.
Even so, pie is still superior to cake.
What if I'M a sandwich? WHAT IF WE'RE ALL SANDWICHES!?!
Quote from: Chelagoras The Boulder on September 14, 2015, 05:15:37 AM
What if I'M a sandwich? WHAT IF WE'RE ALL SANDWICHES!?!
I think of myself to be more of a burrito
Quote from: Meunster on September 14, 2015, 08:05:58 PM
Quote from: Chelagoras The Boulder on September 14, 2015, 05:15:37 AM
What if I'M a sandwich? WHAT IF WE'RE ALL SANDWICHES!?!
I think of myself to be more of a burrito
You, good sir, are a slice of ham between two bits of plastic cheese.
Quote from: Cain on September 14, 2015, 08:10:15 PM
Quote from: Meunster on September 14, 2015, 08:05:58 PM
Quote from: Chelagoras The Boulder on September 14, 2015, 05:15:37 AM
What if I'M a sandwich? WHAT IF WE'RE ALL SANDWICHES!?!
I think of myself to be more of a burrito
You, good sir, are a slice of ham between two bits of plastic cheese.
that gave me an idea.
Burrito wraps, made of cheese.
Sending in my patent now.
Quote from: President Television on September 14, 2015, 04:55:53 AM
Quote from: Cain on September 13, 2015, 03:08:54 AM
I decided to end the great pie/cake debate by defining it away.
A pie is a cake is a burger is a sandwich is...something. Problem solved.
Apart from what colour the picture of it is.
Even so, pie is still superior to cake.
Piecake, bitches. (http://www.principiadiscordia.com/forum/index.php?topic=28367.msg1007020#msg1007020)
I'd define a typical sandwich as a stack of food items - and/or items which a sufficiently drunk person might reasonably try to ingest (but no others) - shaped either like a tall or wide prism and starting with a slice of bread on the bottom and ending with a slice of bread on top or shaped like a long cylinder with a piece of (usually partly cut) bread on bottom and fillings on top. Rarely there may be non-standard combinations of these attributes, such as the hamburger, which is a wide cylinder with either two terminal pieces of bread or occasionally one partly sliced piece of bread or the open faced club, which is a wide or tall prism with only one piece of bread. The bread must in most cases be leavened. It should be reasonably be able to stay together if set down; either on it's own or with the aid of non-poisonous structural support items. Any sauces added should not be of such quality and quantity to disintegrate the bread without additional stimulus. Long cylindrical sandwiches may face additional restrictions.
This definition still suffers from a Loki's Wager issue in regards to deviation from proper shape but otherwise seems pretty solid to me
Two planar starch-based edible layers, oriented with their broad faces parallel, must be arranged with some amount of space between.
Layers of edible material are to be laid within this interstarch space. The layers are to be prepared and arranged such that they have length and width that is greater than their thickness. These layers shall be placed within the defined space such that they are parallel to the defining layers (the aforementioned starch).
Then you throw it in the garbage and go get pizza.
Quote from: Cainad (dec.) on September 20, 2015, 08:11:27 PM
Two planar starch-based edible layers, oriented with their broad faces parallel, must be arranged with some amount of space between.
Layers of edible material are to be laid within this interstarch space. The layers are to be prepared and arranged such that they have length and width that is greater than their thickness. These layers shall be placed within the defined space such that they are parallel to the defining layers (the aforementioned starch).
Then you throw it in the garbage and go get pizza.
Cant you also use lettuce instead of starch-based materials to make a samwhich?
Never. Lettuce is a lie perpetrated by vegan communists.
once lettuce is used in such a manner, it is a officially a wrap and well out of the scope of this discussion.
Your exclusionary views on the BLT community are problematic, check your privilege bigot.
http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/2638647
I cant be the only weirdo who uses hashbrowns to make egg samwhiches.
Or who uses cheese as a bun.
In Ireland (might be a thing here in the UK too) those are called a breakfast wrap, bacon sausage, hash brown tomatoes. Its sinful and I've only ever had two in my life, but they were so delicious.
Quote from: Faust on September 21, 2015, 05:11:42 PM
Your exclusionary views on the BLT community are problematic, check your privilege bigot.
:lulz: