Dear PrincipiaDiscordia.com:
While performing an Internet search, one of our employees discovered that you have started a publication that you are calling "Intermittens." We urge you to stop.
"Intermittens" is a trademark of Shine Your Light, which is headquarted in Vancouver, British Columbia in Canada. While your site was registered on 30 October of 2000 with Dreamhost in the United States, the earliest reference to Intermittens on your site appeared in 2008. We registered the domain name "Intermittens.com" on 11 April of 2003, and renewed it on 28 September of 2007 to extend our ownership of the domain through 11 April of 2013.
It is very clear that we have the prior and current claim to the use of the name "Intermittens." Because of general international agreements and specific treaties between the United States and Canada, any use of the name "Intermittens" without permission is a violation of Canadian and U. S. law. Note that prior registration is not required for the filing of a lawsuit in regard to such ownership. (Please consult Uniform Domain Name Dispute Resolution Policy of Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN), and Trade-Related Aspects of Intellectual Property Rights of the World Trade Organization (WTO)).
We do, however, wish to avoid the time and cost of bringing legal action against you, and assume you do not want it brought against you. Therefore, if you will cease and desist from using the name "Intermittens" for your magazine or for any other publication, product, item, or any goods or service within a period of fourteen (14) days from this notice, we will accept that as compliance.
This shall be considered official notification, in accordance with Canadian and United States federal law.
If you have any questions, you may call our office at (604) 736-4743 or send us a Fax to (604) 224-5557.
Shine Your Light
302W-801 East 6th Ave
Vancouver, British Columbia V5T 1L8
Canada
.................................................
NOTICE:
Consider this a Kopyleft submission for Intermittens, SPAGS!
TFT! :lulz:
You want to sue us over a site you don't even use?
Tell me, can you spell the word "petty"?
I am the owner of this site:
I will certainly remove any hosting of intermittens publications here if that makes you happy and can prove your trademarking of term intermittens, but seeing as I am not responsible for the publication, I cannot promise that publication will end, it will however end here.
Please note that nowhere on this site has intermittens.com been mentioned.
I would however like to see your registering of the trademark "intermittens" please, if you do not we are quite happy to buy intermittens.net, or .org or any of the other available domains.
I've looked at intermittens.com. There is nothing there. You have no corporation, nor writings, nor anything that can be found associated with the name intermittens except an internet domain name. In fact, upon a search of "shine your light" and "intermittens", I find only a single hit. This same hit showed me you have 15 other domains registered to your name, none of which are likely in use. As far as I know, paying for a domain name on the internet does not give you copyright or trademark of said name, UNLESS you are using it to or for the purpose of conducting buisness. At this time there is nothing there, and there is no other corroborating evidence.
Via the US Ninth Circut Court of Appeals, Bosley Medical Institute v. Kremer, No. 04-55962 (April 4, 2005), held that domain names must be used in some association with or for the future purpose of the sale of goods or services in order to be considered trademarked under copyright law. There is no sign of sale of goods or services at your domain, FURTHERMORE, the intermittens publication is printed not for sale and freely distributed.
You have no ground to stand on.
Faust, you can access the trademark electronic search system here: http://www.uspto.gov/main/trademarks.htm
I can't find any trademark associated with 'intermittens'.
From the 9th Circut's Court opinion:
QuoteWe hold today
that the noncommercial use of a trademark as the domain name of a
website - the subject of which is consumer commentary about the
products and services represented by the mark - does not
constitute infringement under the Lanham Act.
Well, now we know what happened to Issue #4...
A) No content/work/anything at Intermittens.com. Courts don't like domain squatters.
B) If we had Intermittens magazine and then someone registered Intermittens.com we would have legal grounds to get that name (or try to). It doesn't work that way in reverse though.
C) Since there is no content on Internittens.com then they are not running an online magazine. Therefore we are not competition.
We deal with this kind of stuff all the time at the office.
PROTIP: My good friend in our legal dept says he's happy to provide PROTIPS :)
Yeah, but we don't really have a legal fund.
Quote from: LMNO on February 03, 2009, 01:47:47 PM
Yeah, but we don't really have a legal fund.
My guess is, neither do the squatters ;-)
Quote from: Ratatosk on February 03, 2009, 01:46:51 PM
A) No content/work/anything at Intermittens.com. Courts don't like domain squatters.
B) If we had Intermittens magazine and then someone registered Intermittens.com we would have legal grounds to get that name (or try to). It doesn't work that way in reverse though.
C) Since there is no content on Internittens.com then they are not running an online magazine. Therefore we are not competition.
We deal with this kind of stuff all the time at the office.
PROTIP: My good friend in our legal dept says he's happy to provide PROTIPS :)
I think from the 9th court opinion its pretty clear that they don't have any ground to stand on. You can't claim a domain name as a trademark unless you are or plan on using it to sell goods or services, its that simple.
I love it when a plan comes together. 8)
Hold on, guys. This might be a lot more interesting than we first thought.
"Shine Your Light" was a song written by Robbie Robertson for the film "Ladder 49" (released in 2004).
Robertson is a Canadian.
These guys might be a subsidiary company for Robbie himself! Which would be really cool, even if the Band kind of destroyed Rock & Roll in the 70s.
Robbie Robertson, why do you hate D.I.Y. magazines?
:x
Quote from: Kai on February 03, 2009, 01:57:37 PM
Quote from: Ratatosk on February 03, 2009, 01:46:51 PM
A) No content/work/anything at Intermittens.com. Courts don't like domain squatters.
B) If we had Intermittens magazine and then someone registered Intermittens.com we would have legal grounds to get that name (or try to). It doesn't work that way in reverse though.
C) Since there is no content on Internittens.com then they are not running an online magazine. Therefore we are not competition.
We deal with this kind of stuff all the time at the office.
PROTIP: My good friend in our legal dept says he's happy to provide PROTIPS :)
I think from the 9th court opinion its pretty clear that they don't have any ground to stand on. You can't claim a domain name as a trademark unless you are or plan on using it to sell goods or services, its that simple.
Yep!
In fact, even if they were using the domain... unless their product was an online magazine, it still wouldn't be infringement.
This smells suspicious, considering the 'problem' we had last week.
Was this even posted from a Canadian IP?
All the information given is legitimate. I do not think it is related to our other problem, though I suspected it.
I still think its a scam, just of the more usual kind.
Hey Ratatosk, ask your legal dep't about this:
Quote from: Shine Your Light on February 03, 2009, 12:18:13 PM
Dear PrincipiaDiscordia.com:
QuoteThis shall be considered official notification, in accordance with Canadian and United States federal law.
I mean I'm no lawyer or anything, so I'm
amazed that you can file legal action against a forum!
and for that matter, I'm astounded that a letter posted at that internet forum can in any way be considered "official notice"
I guess I just don't understand the legal system. We'd better stop the presses.
oh snap -- that means any script kiddie can cripple the entire judicial system!
Quote from: Cramulus on February 03, 2009, 03:07:49 PM
Hey Ratatosk, ask your legal dep't about this:
Quote from: Shine Your Light on February 03, 2009, 12:18:13 PM
Dear PrincipiaDiscordia.com:
QuoteThis shall be considered official notification, in accordance with Canadian and United States federal law.
I mean I'm no lawyer or anything, so I'm amazed that you can file legal action against a forum!
and for that matter, I'm astounded that a letter posted at that internet forum can in any way be considered "official notice"
I guess I just don't understand the legal system. We'd better stop the presses.
oh snap -- that means any script kiddie can cripple the entire judicial system!
and do you really think that the 14 days notice would hold up if I was not contacted by email, phone address.
or directly at all?
Hold up: "Intermittens" seems to be a medical/biological term, or at least is latin-ish.
Example: "dyskinesia intermittens" is the intermittent disability of the limbs due to impairment of circulation.
Can you really copyright something like that, or would it be more of a trademark issue?
we now own intermittens.org
so it can have a front page, issues and updates on it for whoever wants to use it
Heh. Now, we constantly monitor intermittens.com, and constantly remind them not to create a magazine.
Quote from: Shine Your Light on February 03, 2009, 12:18:13 PM
If you have any questions, you may call our office at (604) 736-4743 or send us a Fax to (604) 224-5557.
BTW:
this fax number actually connects to a chiropracter's office.
I think Raffi S. Titizian should learn copyright law better, or else stick to chiropractic treatments.
http://www.pointgreychiro.com/
Hmmm...smells fishy itt...I think the OP is a bottom-feeder.
Great detective work, Everyone!
Quote from: Cramulus on February 03, 2009, 03:07:49 PM
Hey Ratatosk, ask your legal dep't about this:
Quote from: Shine Your Light on February 03, 2009, 12:18:13 PM
Dear PrincipiaDiscordia.com:
QuoteThis shall be considered official notification, in accordance with Canadian and United States federal law.
I mean I'm no lawyer or anything, so I'm amazed that you can file legal action against a forum!
and for that matter, I'm astounded that a letter posted at that internet forum can in any way be considered "official notice"
I guess I just don't understand the legal system. We'd better stop the presses.
oh snap -- that means any script kiddie can cripple the entire judicial system!
Answer is: NO
Legal communication would require something in the nature of a certified letter etc. FROM a Legal firm, not some spag.
Also: They do not have a trademark according to my legal buddies. See Kai's post for the reasons.
Quote from: Cain on February 03, 2009, 03:02:47 PM
All the information given is legitimate. I do not think it is related to our other problem, though I suspected it.
I still think its a scam, just of the more usual kind.
what's the other problem?
You, of course.
I don't get why Mr. Shine Your Light thought that this would actually work. And what did he think he'd actually get out of it? Did he think we'd bribe him to get back a trademark that he doesn't really own? Is he just being a knob-gobbler because he's a masochist that enjoys made idle legal threats and cracking people's bones. Seriously, what is he getting out of this??
the listed phone number has been busy for over an hour and a half.
Quote from: Iason Ouabache on February 03, 2009, 05:19:36 PM
I don't get why Mr. Shine Your Light thought that this would actually work. And what did he think he'd actually get out of it? Did he think we'd bribe him to get back a trademark that he doesn't really own? Is he just being a knob-gobbler because he's a masochist that enjoys made idle legal threats and cracking people's bones. Seriously, what is he getting out of this??
Lulz? Dunno--it's rather obvious this is a volunteer effort, so there's no $ in it. Maybe PD.com got MF'd? But it was a weak attempt if so. Trolling the trolls usually ends up in burnt asscheeks.
Quote from: Shine Your Light on February 03, 2009, 12:18:13 PM
Dear PrincipiaDiscordia.com:
While performing an Internet search, one of our employees discovered that you have started a publication that you are calling "Intermittens." We urge you to stop.
"Intermittens" is a trademark of Shine Your Light, which is headquarted in Vancouver, British Columbia in Canada. While your site was registered on 30 October of 2000 with Dreamhost in the United States, the earliest reference to Intermittens on your site appeared in 2008. We registered the domain name "Intermittens.com" on 11 April of 2003, and renewed it on 28 September of 2007 to extend our ownership of the domain through 11 April of 2013.
It is very clear that we have the prior and current claim to the use of the name "Intermittens." Because of general international agreements and specific treaties between the United States and Canada, any use of the name "Intermittens" without permission is a violation of Canadian and U. S. law. Note that prior registration is not required for the filing of a lawsuit in regard to such ownership. (Please consult Uniform Domain Name Dispute Resolution Policy of Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN), and Trade-Related Aspects of Intellectual Property Rights of the World Trade Organization (WTO)).
We do, however, wish to avoid the time and cost of bringing legal action against you, and assume you do not want it brought against you. Therefore, if you will cease and desist from using the name "Intermittens" for your magazine or for any other publication, product, item, or any goods or service within a period of fourteen (14) days from this notice, we will accept that as compliance.
This shall be considered official notification, in accordance with Canadian and United States federal law.
If you have any questions, you may call our office at (604) 736-4743 or send us a Fax to (604) 224-5557.
Shine Your Light
302W-801 East 6th Ave
Vancouver, British Columbia V5T 1L8
Canada
Please nobody touch this - I'm going to use it as a foreward in iss#6
Along with the obligatory "please do not troll" disclaimer :evil:
Too late, we've already decided to put it in Issue #4
:argh!:
drama
If it does end up in #4 I'm claiming the next one for #6
P3nt, please take a quick look around for more information on Issue #4.
I see threads for 3 & 5 is 4 a secret or something?
Read from the start of the #5 thread.
Quote from: Cramulus on February 03, 2009, 05:25:26 PM
the listed phone number has been busy for over an hour and a half.
still busy. At this point I'm fairly sure this is an "always busy" number
does anybody else miss phreaking? :lulz: An
always busy number is a great front door for a scam.
Quote from: LMNO on February 03, 2009, 06:20:26 PM
Read from the start of the #5 thread.
Heh! great idea. Also this means I can use the letter and I'll pick up a couple of spare "allusions to #4" in the process. I'll have my issue done in no time :D
Quote from: Shine Your Light on February 03, 2009, 12:18:13 PM
Dear PrincipiaDiscordia.com:
While performing an Internet search, one of our employees discovered that you have started a publication that you are calling "Intermittens." We urge you to stop.
"Intermittens" is a trademark of Shine Your Light, which is headquarted in Vancouver, British Columbia in Canada. While your site was registered on 30 October of 2000 with Dreamhost in the United States, the earliest reference to Intermittens on your site appeared in 2008. We registered the domain name "Intermittens.com" on 11 April of 2003, and renewed it on 28 September of 2007 to extend our ownership of the domain through 11 April of 2013.
It is very clear that we have the prior and current claim to the use of the name "Intermittens." Because of general international agreements and specific treaties between the United States and Canada, any use of the name "Intermittens" without permission is a violation of Canadian and U. S. law. Note that prior registration is not required for the filing of a lawsuit in regard to such ownership. (Please consult Uniform Domain Name Dispute Resolution Policy of Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN), and Trade-Related Aspects of Intellectual Property Rights of the World Trade Organization (WTO)).
We do, however, wish to avoid the time and cost of bringing legal action against you, and assume you do not want it brought against you. Therefore, if you will cease and desist from using the name "Intermittens" for your magazine or for any other publication, product, item, or any goods or service within a period of fourteen (14) days from this notice, we will accept that as compliance.
This shall be considered official notification, in accordance with Canadian and United States federal law.
If you have any questions, you may call our office at (604) 736-4743 or send us a Fax to (604) 224-5557.
Shine Your Light
302W-801 East 6th Ave
Vancouver, British Columbia V5T 1L8
Canada
:lulz:
This is hilarious! It's got to be a joke.
I hope... it looks like a form letter that would apply if we were registering a Domain Name that conflicted with theirs. ICANN has no jurisdiction on the name of our online magazine.
Either its a troll, a dumb squatter or ... well that seems to be the options.
For those of you just joining us, here's a tl;dr version of this thread:
Quote from: Shine Your Light
Copyright, bitches.
\
(http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/uncyclopedia/images/9/97/Fund0170.png)
Quote from: PD.com
:?
Nope.
\
:roflcake:
:lulz: + :goatse:
Quote from: Ratatosk on February 03, 2009, 07:45:46 PM
I hope... it looks like a form letter that would apply if we were registering a Domain Name that conflicted with theirs. ICANN has no jurisdiction on the name of our online magazine.
Either its a troll, a dumb squatter or ... well that seems to be the options.
I'm hoping it's a troll for the lulz, but more likely it's a dumb squatter. All the more reason, by the way, that someone should register Intermittens as a business name ASAP. I'll pitch in $10... I think it costs $50 in Oregon, no idea what it costs elsewhere. Just to solidify the case against them and fuck them in the ass so they CAN'T use the name later on, for being dicks. :lulz:
The address given by 'Shine Your Light' and the Chiropractor don't match
Has SYL just used the phone number of the office for yuks?
I've seen stuff like this before. I had a scam e-mail that said it was from a London law firm. The law firm did exist but the e-mail address was for some store in the U.S.
WE GOT TROLLED
I just saw this now. I know peeps in Vancouver... lets send some representatives to their "office".
at the very least, we should drop off some Intermittens at that chiropracter's office
Quote from: Cramulus on February 03, 2009, 10:39:29 PM
at the very least, we should drop off some Intermittens at that chiropracter's office
:mittens:
Quote from: Cramulus on February 03, 2009, 10:39:29 PM
at the very least, we should drop off some Intermittens at that chiropracter's office
:lulz:
Quote from: Cramulus on February 03, 2009, 10:39:29 PM
at the very least, we should drop off some Intermittens at that chiropracter's office
Are we going to include some porn with it?
:lol:
yeah and Kai nailed it down in his first post.
what I know from trademark law is that first, you need to make a vested effort into establishing your trademark. you can't secretly register the trademark and then kick the first person to use it. especially not if you just register a domain name that you don't do anything with.
and even then, they need to show we're competitors. if they have a tomato-paste brand named Intermittens, they got nothing, cause we make a magazine. So they'd either need to attach their brand to a magazine, or to discordia/philosophy or counterculture in general. If they did that, and had the name Intermittens, more power to them btw :-)
and I'm all for using this letter to allude to issue 4 in issue 5.
Quote from: Triple Zero on February 04, 2009, 01:41:06 PM
and I'm all for using this letter to allude to issue 4 in issue 5.
This.
so, someone from vancouver trolled us using a fake group whose initials are "SYL"...
Devin Townsend, is that YUO?
I'm disappointed that SYL hasn't come back to answer our questions. Maybe he'll log back in after the 14 days are up.
Who?
Shine Your Light, the original poster.
If no Intermittens editor has claimed it already, I'd like to use this for Intermittens #7: Operation Mindfuck.
We got Jaked! :argh!: :lulz:
EDIT: Just noticed, this was already claimed for Issue 6 by P3nT4gR4m at http://www.principiadiscordia.com/forum/index.php?topic=19570.msg652652#msg652652 (http://www.principiadiscordia.com/forum/index.php?topic=19570.msg652652#msg652652) :sad:
Well, technically it hasn't been a full 14 days yet. Give him a couple more hours. He might come back and sue this forum to the ground. :scared:
Wait. I just saw the Notice. Very funny whoever did this. :lol:
Well, I learned something new. PDcom can get downright litigious when threatened with legal action.
:lulz: That was pretty funny. Man, we were seething over this.
Seething? I was laughing all day!
also, this little stunt prompted faust to register intermittens.org. So while the intent might have been to waste our time, it actually strengthened the project.
the memetics of group dynamics - very important!
Quote from: Felix on February 21, 2009, 08:18:56 AM
Well, I learned something new. PDcom can get downright litigious when threatened with legal action.
Something I am very very relieved about.
As soon as Kai did the (excellent and very fast) research on the legality of this, I was pretty relaxed.
Who's TFT?
That's what I was wondering too...
no idea.
does it matter?
Kind of.
As nobody else used this Jake in an issue, I used it in Intermittens: In the Beginning. The identity of TfT is revealed there.
http://kerrythornley.com/publications/magazines/intermittens/intermittens_11_ITB.pdf
Terrorists for Truth eh, I just assumed it was Sheered Völva/Reverend Uncle BadTouch.
I had forgotten about this how nice, it came during my final year of college, when I was sleeping about two hours a night and sick as a dog, real peachy.