Hi, I am a forum member writing under an alt in order to maintain some degree of anonymity (I know some of you will be able to figure out who I am. If you do, please respect my wish to remain anonymous). I am writing this because things are really bad for me right now, and I need some help.
I have been struggling with depression for as long as I can remember. It has its ups and downs, and normally I can tough it out and keep on moving, regardless of how bad I might feel. However, yesterday I had an episode that was much worse than anything I've experienced, and I am not sure if I can continue this way. Yesterday, I awoke feeling so terrible that I couldn't leave my room. I was so depressed that I could not bear to look at anyone. My breathing was shallow, and my heart beat was rapid. I was so emotionally fucked up that I was starting to get physical pain in my neck and head.
It's not that I haven't worked hard to try to improve myself and my conditions, but every success I earn becomes nullified by circumstances beyond my control. I have a degree in (*****), which I wanted to continue into a masters or phd program, but just as I was going to start the testing/application processes, my family (who I had been living with) decided to sell the house without telling me important details, and I ended up just barely dodging homelessness. The money I had saved for school stuff now must be spent on rent and food, meaning that I can no longer pursue graduate school. By the time I'd be financially ready to begin again, I'd be so much out of practice that it would be pointless. I loved studying (*****), but I'm pretty sure the train has passed.
I don't have many friends, and the ones I do have either do not have the ability to help with this particular problem or are already doing what they can (I'm living with a friend, who is letting me stay here cheap, which I am grateful for, but he's not the type of person that is equipped to deal with the types of problems I'm having now). ANd, as mentioned, I no longer can trust the things my family says, as they have shown themselves to be outright liars or as such through omission.
I have tried as many things as I can to try to stop myself from feeling this way. I have sought psychiatric care at my old uni, but they never were able to tell me anything that I did not already know or suggest anything that I had not already tried. I have altogether stopped reaching out to friends, because most people don't know how to deal with this stuff, and they inadvertently minimize my problems, blame me for them, or offer some boot-strap myth bullshit.
About two months ago, I had made a plan. I've had ideas for a (creative project), so I decided that I would spend the time between then and next Thanksgiving to give my (creative project) a fair shot at success. If, at that point, it was unsuccessful, I had decided that I would end my life. However, I have finished my (creative project) and am realizing that there is no chance that it will be successful, outside of personal gratification. Now that it's finished, all I can think of is just cutting out early.
I have no car, no money, no family, no partner, few friends, and useless achievements that ultimately mean nothing. There is no future that I can conceive that doesn't involve living in poverty and slaving away my life to make someone else rich. And none of this is to mention the state of the world we live in, which is a whole other post in itself.
I'm not sure what to do. I do not expect that, by posting here, someone will magically arrive and say something that changes my outlook, but I feel I need to try something, because otherwise I think it's all over. There is little joy in my life, and the pleasure I do receive comes from things that cannot, in the state of the world today, remove me from my situation, and anything I do accomplish comes as bittersweet.
If you think you can help in any way, please share your thoughts.
Or kill me.
I'm really sad to hear that you're feeling so awful. I know it's a horrible cliché thing to say, but you are not alone. I also know the pain of having been unfairly shafted by family members, and the fear of not knowing where to live and how I'm going to take care of myself. So overwhelming. I wish I could give you a hug through the internet.
I don't think anyone has ever told you, or made you feel like you matter in life. So let me tell you that YOU MATTER. Your feelings matter, your thoughts matter, and your achievements matter (I say this because reading your post, I don't think you've given yourself credit for what you have achieved and celebrated them). You matter.
If you ever need someone to talk to, or just to vent, please PM me.
May I ask what the purpose of that anonymity is? There's a strong tone of distrust between that and how you describe your relationships with your family and friends.
Depression is a motherfucker, and the best advice I ever received for it is that it is by definition not being in your right mind, and therefore not a state from which you should make life decisions. That includes whether or not to continue it.
Your situation is overwhelming, but while all the factors contributing to it are connected, they are still able to be solved independently. It's good that you were able to focus on that creative project, it means you can still apply yourself. Focus on becoming independent first, and from there your social life and etc. Even if it means slaving away for The Man.
And go the fuck outside. Cold be damned.
Whether you know it or not, you're loved, respected, and trusted by someone. Maybe they're shy about it. Maybe they're trying to show you. A lot of maybes.
Please don't kill yourself.
Quote from: Eater of Clowns on January 14, 2016, 06:34:31 PM
May I ask what the purpose of that anonymity is? There's a strong tone of distrust between that and how you describe your relationships with your family and friends.
I'm sorry for that. I am trying to approach this as analytically as possible, and posting anonymously helps me keep things as objective as they can be for these types of situations.
I appreciate all of your responses. I am trying hard to find a solution. It is hard to act now, because I have been convinced that my actions do not matter (inductive evidence leaves great psychological impacts despite its probabilistic nature).
To be clear, at this moment, I do not think I will kill myself (survival instinct is very strong), but I do not doubt that if this is allowed to continue as it is, it might become unbearable, regardless of strength of will. I just needed to say something now to avoid getting to that point.
I am trying to find a root cause for this condition. I am beginning to think that it could be physiological somehow.
Thank you all for your kindness. I will try to be receptive to advice and ideas.
While it's good that you are trying to view your situation analytically, remember that the same mind that you are using to fix the problem is the same mind that created the problem (the depression). That's why it's impossible to "think your way out of depression". I would encourage you instead to focus your energy on taking care of yourself today, just at this moment. That means eating well, taking a walk, taking a shower... I'm sure you've heard it all before. I know it sounds pointless and not a real solution to your difficulties, but I promise you will feel better, and that is a step in the right direction.
Quote from: Nast on January 14, 2016, 08:27:42 PM
While it's good that you are trying to view your situation analytically, remember that the same mind that you are using to fix the problem is the same mind that created the problem (the depression). That's why it's impossible to "think your way out of depression". I would encourage you instead to focus your energy on taking care of yourself today, just at this moment. That means eating well, taking a walk, taking a shower... I'm sure you've heard it all before. I know it sounds pointless and not a real solution to your difficulties, but I promise you will feel better, and that is a step in the right direction.
Absolutely, 100% this.
I've been in similar situations to you. I also tried to look at my depression in an analytical fashion...I do not recommend it, for precisely these reasons. After I graduated, I was also in a similar boat, in many ways. I was unemployed, for a very long time, or only considered for the kind of shit jobs I could have had when I was 16, without spending 4 years of my life on my studies. Most of my friends had vanished, and while I had some support from my family in terms of secure living provisions, I rarely saw them either, and when they did they invariably chastised me for all my supposed failures.
Healthy living is definitely part of it. I believe depression has a physiological basis, in many cases, and so changes in lifestyle, exercise etc can definitely impact on it. Professional help is also an option I would seriously consider though. I foolishly did not seek any out...luckily, my circumstances improved along with my lifestyle to the point where the depression was no longer a factor, but I personally would not chance it.
I prefer to look at it this way: I'm a fighter. I do not back down, get intimidated or yield. I never really have. I did martial arts for years, and I was good at it. I was a tricky bastard in any sparring situation, and no matter how technically outmatched I may be by an opponent, due to skill or size or speed, I always knew I could outthink my adversary. I wouldnt let someone who was trying to physically dominate or hurt me do so...so why would I let circumstance and situation off the hook so easily. When life is trying to grind you down, you spit in its eye and give it a good stomach punch. Then kick it while it's on the ground for good measure.
I'm at work, so this will be brief -- probably better that way anyhow.
I have wrestled with depression throughout my life. You have my sympathy and, to some legitimate extent, my empathy.
It appears, based on your post, that you are getting locked into certain thought patterns. Based on my own observations, I tend to think intelligent people get hit harder by depression because it does lend itself to these negative thought patterns. Intelligent people are used to being served by their ability to see and exploit patterns. When your depression is telling you that the net result of these patterns you're seeing is futility, death, and nihilism, your intelligence is likely to double-down and reinforce that notion. From a certain (depressed) perspective, your train of thought to those ends may even indeed have a degree of rational merit.
Discordianism actually helped me a lot in my own struggles with depression. Remember Starbuck's Pebbles; maybe your depression is encouraging you to see the patterns in your life as a pentagon. Perhaps from another perspective they would appear to be a star. Of course they are both and neither. The important part is that you remind yourself the interpretation of the patterns in your life are not fixed. You can reassess them. Even better, you can will to change them.
I second the recommendations to engage in some personal hygiene and to go outside. Depression tends to leave one feeling disconnected. If you don't feel like you can go out and engage with other people quite yet, at least go outside and try to reconnect with nature, even if it's just a few minutes of breathing some outside air.
I'm not a fighter, like Cain, but I'm stronger than I tend to give myself credit for, and I wouldn't be surprised if you are too. Keep reaching out and remind yourself that the beauty and joys of life are bigger than you and the patterns of thought which reinforce your depression.
Good luck, and remember there are weird disembodied voices in your corner, cheering you on.
I have located a coffee shop about 20 mins away from my new address. I'm going to go tomorrow and do some reading or something. I don't feel particularly positive about it, but I suppose that's kind of the point of going. Just to see.
I'm new to this forum, but I'm not new to dealing with depression. I was diagnosed with dysthymia a long, long time ago. You'll have to take my word for it, but it gets easier to deal with as you get older. At this point in my life, I don't give it much thought.
There's a lot of good advice in the above posts. I'm sure your old friends, and some new ones, can help you get though this.
Approaching your depression analytically is a good move. There are places where emotional responses are appropriate, and places where they won't do you any good whatsoever. Learn what is helping you, and what is hurting you.
The best advice I can give you, from my own experience, is that if you have access to psychiatric care, take advantage of it. I've learned that for my particular form of depression, a small, daily dose of medication helps tremendously. I can not overemphasize that fact, as my own depression does have a physiological basis. (I don't go out of my way to advertise that I take 10 mg of Paxil every morning, but I'm not ashamed to admit that it works.)
As others have already posted, take care of yourself physically. If you're not exercising, start a program. Walking is a good start. Get out and talk to people, even if you have to fake a little cheerfulness.
Keep posting here, the human contact will help. I hope to hear from you again soon.
Listen, person. You've gotten some super, super great advice from people here. And I don't know if I can really add anything meaningful to it, but I wanted to say a couple of things anyway.
Thing one is that depressed people easily get isolated because of their depression, effectively cutting themselves off from a support system. This is not to blame the depressed for their isolation, but rather to try to remind you that along with self-care in the form of going out and doing things comes meeting people. Don't let the reel in your head that tells you people won't like you prevent you from responding to friendly overtures. You ARE likable and interesting, and people DO want to get to know you.
The second thing I wanted to say is that academically, that ship will never sail. I know people who have gone back to school for an advanced degree in their 50's. My stepmom got her PhD in her 50's. I'm 44 and just now applying to grad school. I have professors who got their PhD later in life. Taking time off to work before applying to grad school is perfectly normal. You can, and it sounds like you should, plan on going back. It's NOT too late. It really isn't.
The third thing I wanted to say is to suggest doing something new. I don't know what, just something. Something that takes you places you haven't seen yet, doing things you haven't done yet. It really doesn't matter what, as long as it's novel. Novelty is good for your brain and helps you make new neurons, some of which may even do stuff that helps with depression and motivation.
Lastly, good luck. I mean it. Hang in there.
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 15, 2016, 04:48:25 AM
The second thing I wanted to say is that academically, that ship will never sail. I know people who have gone back to school for an advanced degree in their 50's. My stepmom got her PhD in her 50's. I'm 44 and just now applying to grad school. I have professors who got their PhD later in life. Taking time off to work before applying to grad school is perfectly normal. You can, and it sounds like you should, plan on going back. It's NOT too late. It really isn't.
I have been told this before, I'm just worried that by the time I get there, I'll be out of practice and unable to get accepted anywhere. It's been pointed out to me before that people do go back to school later in life, but what did they do to stay sharp in their field while they were away from academia? I already feel my knowledge fading, because it's not the type of thing that is easy to practice alone, and I do not really see many people with a similar background... But I think I have an answer to this. I'll try to find local groups... Is that the right idea?
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 15, 2016, 04:48:25 AM
The third thing I wanted to say is to suggest doing something new. I don't know what, just something. Something that takes you places you haven't seen yet, doing things you haven't done yet. It really doesn't matter what, as long as it's novel. Novelty is good for your brain and helps you make new neurons, some of which may even do stuff that helps with depression and motivation.
I'm trying to do this, but every project reaches a point where it needs to be reviewed by others for the purpose of improvement, and I'm having difficulties trying to find others that are willing to help in the process. But, then again, maybe I should find a local group for this, too...
Anyhow, talking with you dudes had given me some ideas. I will try a few things and see how it goes.
Quote from: FailedAI on January 15, 2016, 03:29:19 PM
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 15, 2016, 04:48:25 AM
The second thing I wanted to say is that academically, that ship will never sail. I know people who have gone back to school for an advanced degree in their 50's. My stepmom got her PhD in her 50's. I'm 44 and just now applying to grad school. I have professors who got their PhD later in life. Taking time off to work before applying to grad school is perfectly normal. You can, and it sounds like you should, plan on going back. It's NOT too late. It really isn't.
I have been told this before, I'm just worried that by the time I get there, I'll be out of practice and unable to get accepted anywhere. It's been pointed out to me before that people do go back to school later in life, but what did they do to stay sharp in their field while they were away from academia? I already feel my knowledge fading, because it's not the type of thing that is easy to practice alone, and I do not really see many people with a similar background... But I think I have an answer to this. I'll try to find local groups... Is that the right idea?
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 15, 2016, 04:48:25 AM
The third thing I wanted to say is to suggest doing something new. I don't know what, just something. Something that takes you places you haven't seen yet, doing things you haven't done yet. It really doesn't matter what, as long as it's novel. Novelty is good for your brain and helps you make new neurons, some of which may even do stuff that helps with depression and motivation.
I'm trying to do this, but every project reaches a point where it needs to be reviewed by others for the purpose of improvement, and I'm having difficulties trying to find others that are willing to help in the process. But, then again, maybe I should find a local group for this, too...
Anyhow, talking with you dudes had given me some ideas. I will try a few things and see how it goes.
If your field is one that is suited to being practiced in a local group, then yes! Absolutely! Also, keep reading the literature, and writing down your thought on the literature. And likewise with your projects. But when I say to do something new, I don't just mean "start new projects", I mean, learn or do something completely novel to you. Like join a lawn darts club, or start bowling, or do community theater, or something else you have never done before, preferably something that involves other people. It doesn't have to be a creative project, just SOMETHING that's totally novel to you.
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 15, 2016, 03:36:15 PM
...But when I say to do something new, I don't just mean "start new projects", I mean, learn or do something completely novel to you. Like join a lawn darts club, or start bowling, or do community theater, or something else you have never done before, preferably something that involves other people. It doesn't have to be a creative project, just SOMETHING that's totally novel to you.
I understand now, thank you for the clarification. I will start thinking of some things, and I suppose I'm open to suggestions.
I don't have a whole lot of advice to offer here but in terms of keeping up with studying then there's a shitload of free courses available here:
http://www.openculture.com/freeonlinecourses (http://www.openculture.com/freeonlinecourses)
Or maybe you could learn something new.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOAgplgTxfc
Obligatory Sapolsky. If the lecture isn't useful, the soothing voice is.
Quote from: Junkenstein on January 15, 2016, 09:25:08 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOAgplgTxfc
Obligatory Sapolsky. If the lecture isn't useful, the soothing voice is.
GOD I LOVE THAT MAN.
Ok, so first, I want to thank everyone for their responses, and apologize if I made anyone worry. I was panicking pretty hard.
This 'thing' that happens to me comes in waves, and it seems to have passed. Normally, when it finally blows over, I pretend it never happened and I try to get on with things. The problem with that is that it invariably comes back, and I am then unprepared to deal with it.
This time, however, I created a public account of the incident, meaning that I have a reminder that this happened, and I cannot ignore it, even after it has blown over.
I think what is happening is called "double depression." I have been affected by dysthymia for over 20yrs, and I think I have developed Seasonal Affective Disorder. However, I am affected by this twice a year, once in the summer, and once in the winter. I believe this happened because those seasons are the off-times for school, and during those times that I wasn't working on school stuff, I had nothing to work on to make myself feel useful, and I would not see many people, because I saw most of my friends at school. So, basically, twice a year I get an extra serving of bad-times dumped on top of a persistent, low-level depression.
Anyhow, since I have graduated, I forgot that I was entering the next loop, and even kind of assumed that it wouldn't happen this time around because I am no longer in school, but apparently I was very wrong. Oops.
While it is true that I should probably seek some professional help, I do not currently have access to the type of help I would need. So, while I am trying to get that set up, I also need to have a plan for the next time this happens. Finding support from those that I know IRL has been incredibly difficult, but, even though it was embarrassing to post about this on a public forum, everybody's support here was helpful enough to get through it. Of course, I know that posting here is not a solution, nor does it eliminate the root cause for the problem. But, while I am working towards a solution, this thread can help me by being a kind of safety net if shit gets really bad again.
Thanks again to everyone, next time I will be more prepared, and I will also know that I have support here. I promise you all, I will not let this defeat me. Thank you all so much.
Quote from: FailedAI on January 17, 2016, 07:15:03 PM
Ok, so first, I want to thank everyone for their responses, and apologize if I made anyone worry. I was panicking pretty hard.
This 'thing' that happens to me comes in waves, and it seems to have passed. Normally, when it finally blows over, I pretend it never happened and I try to get on with things. The problem with that is that it invariably comes back, and I am then unprepared to deal with it.
This time, however, I created a public account of the incident, meaning that I have a reminder that this happened, and I cannot ignore it, even after it has blown over.
I think what is happening is called "double depression." I have been affected by dysthymia for over 20yrs, and I think I have developed Seasonal Affective Disorder. However, I am affected by this twice a year, once in the summer, and once in the winter. I believe this happened because those seasons are the off-times for school, and during those times that I wasn't working on school stuff, I had nothing to work on to make myself feel useful, and I would not see many people, because I saw most of my friends at school. So, basically, twice a year I get an extra serving of bad-times dumped on top of a persistent, low-level depression.
Anyhow, since I have graduated, I forgot that I was entering the next loop, and even kind of assumed that it wouldn't happen this time around because I am no longer in school, but apparently I was very wrong. Oops.
While it is true that I should probably seek some professional help, I do not currently have access to the type of help I would need. So, while I am trying to get that set up, I also need to have a plan for the next time this happens. Finding support from those that I know IRL has been incredibly difficult, but, even though it was embarrassing to post about this on a public forum, everybody's support here was helpful enough to get through it. Of course, I know that posting here is not a solution, nor does it eliminate the root cause for the problem. But, while I am working towards a solution, this thread can help me by being a kind of safety net if shit gets really bad again.
Thanks again to everyone, next time I will be more prepared, and I will also know that I have support here. I promise you all, I will not let this defeat me. Thank you all so much.
I get seasonal affective disorder, sometimes pretty bad (I basically just lose all motivation to get things done and want to sleep all the time) but I do find that a SAD lamp helps a fair amount. You might give that a shot, because especially with the fact that you get it in the summer too, what may be happening is that the extremely long/short days may be fucking with the timing of your pineal gland's release of melatonin, thereby starting a cascade effect that throws off your whole system and results in depression. If so, using the SAD lamp in the mornings in the winter and melatonin supplements in the evenings in the summer may help regulate your mood.
I wish you luck with this.
I'll definitely look into a SAD lamp. I've also started efforts to visit a doctor. Considering how long it's been since my last checkup, I wouldn't be surprised if there were health issues making things worse. Other than that, I'm focusing mainly on diet. It's a little tough, as a single person it can be difficult to keep the right amount of food around; too much and it'll go bad before I finish it, too little and, well, you know.
I have this one, but there are many cheaper ones that should do the job: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0094HBU6I/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_dp_ss_2?pf_rd_p=1944687562&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B0001ATEJ2&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=0165HNF7RDJ2QPG5KY99
Quote from: FailedAI on January 18, 2016, 06:57:46 PM
I'll definitely look into a SAD lamp. I've also started efforts to visit a doctor. Considering how long it's been since my last checkup, I wouldn't be surprised if there were health issues making things worse. Other than that, I'm focusing mainly on diet. It's a little tough, as a single person it can be difficult to keep the right amount of food around; too much and it'll go bad before I finish it, too little and, well, you know.
It's good to read that you're feeling better.
I can't offer any advice on dealing with SAD from personal experience, but a friend with the disorder tells me the lamps do help.
A visit to a M.D. for a checkup is a good move. In truth, I'm pretty bad about having regular checkups myself. I do, however, keep my appointments with my friendly neighborhood headshrinker, even though I'm down to once a year, five minute visits. As I've written before, dysthymia does get easier to deal with as you get older.
Hang in there. I'm sure, with a little help, you'll figure it all out.
I appreciate the update, and the fact that you seem to be honest with yourself, and with us, about this.
I also tend to experience waves of depression during the Summer months. I've always assumed this was a symptom of my childhood: I was an only child in a rural area (no nearby neighbors), so once school let out I because somewhat isolated, socially. It was very odd to realize this was still affecting me into adulthood, after finishing school.
Good food for thought. Thank you for reminding me of this element during my "off-season." Hopefully it will help me prepare for the months ahead, as well.
I'm glad to hear you're feeling better. 🙂
I just wanted to leave this here for you: www.meetup.com.
It's a great way to learn about novel topics and meet interesting people.
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 15, 2016, 04:48:25 AMThe second thing I wanted to say is that academically, that ship will never sail. I know people who have gone back to school for an advanced degree in their 50's. My stepmom got her PhD in her 50's. I'm 44 and just now applying to grad school. I have professors who got their PhD later in life. Taking time off to work before applying to grad school is perfectly normal. You can, and it sounds like you should, plan on going back. It's NOT too late. It really isn't.
My ma didn't finish her master's degree until the year before she retired and it
still helped her career (because it was the last thing she needed to qualify for a raise which positively impacted her pension)
I'm glad it passed. This kind of shit sucks hard.
From my own personal depression toolkit...
Indulge in physical fitness and improvement - Exercise releases feelgood chemicals in the brain that help make me less depressed. Join a gym, take up martial arts, jogging, skateboarding... Track improvements and set goals, work to improve lap times, new moves, whatever. This will feel like progress which counters that - "I'm getting fucking nowhere" - thing that gets stuck in my head when I'm down.
Learn to cook good food using fresh ingredients. This will help with the physical improvement, since your body will be getting a steady supply of actual nutrients as opposed to mostly sugar and preservatives which don't have a massively beneficial effect on your bio and neurochemistry. Go nuts and practice cooking new dishes. More progress...
Drink a lot of water. Dehydration is the baseline normal for most of western civilisation. Dehydration causes all sorts of bad shit and prolly doesn't help with depression either.
Just say "yes". Say someone invites me to do something. Go for a coffee, visit the zoo, skydive... A depressed person's default answer is "No. [insert lame excuse here]" or "I'll think about it. [excuse pending]" Change that default answer to "Okay" and the hard bit is done in a split second.
After that I might spend the rest of the time dreading it and running over worst case scenarios in my head but who cares, the decision is made, it's out of my hands now. Most of the time I'll find I actually have fun cos, I end up outside, with my friends doing some stuff instead of lying on the floor of a darkened room, in the fetal position, hating my life.
Good advice has been posted here. It may be helpful to keep in mind that one cannot think their way out of bad thinking, they can only act their way out of it. Nearly all therapy or advice that doesn't address behavior is useless.
Quote from: Dr. Cow Ass on February 09, 2016, 04:44:48 AM
Good advice has been posted here. It may be helpful to keep in mind that one cannot think their way out of bad thinking, they can only act their way out of it. Nearly all therapy or advice that doesn't address behavior is useless.
:lulz: