The last few days have sent me knocking all over the place. My headspace resembles a pinball machine, complete with shards of sharp, tinny music and incessant ringing bell noises. The election results put a pit in my stomach what has not budged since, no matter what levers I pull or what I try to wash the taste of the last 72 hours out of my brain with. I have browsed all of the idea outlets that have earned my attention and my time over the past 18 months, digital, physical, and personal. The sharp pangs of piercing disgust have multiplied at every turn, but at least they have dulled a bit and grown into a constant, droning melancholy eating at the edges of my consciousness. Hope has been reported missing. I have slept restlessly, and I not dreamed for what seems like a very, very long time.
I have tried the normal, human reaction, which is to attempt to wrap my mind around the events of the past week. But the standard issue "Facebook Leftist" repertoire of communal wisdom is impotent in explaining these. The extended set of explanations offered by various emotional wrecks, all of them scrambling over one another to arrive at the first sound conclusion, yields little better results other than a vague suggestion that "Liberals are too mean", which in my estimation is dangerously close to saying "Nazis are not too mean", and is thus suspicious brain food. I must admit that to whatever extent I still care to find a unifying theory as to why we as a culture have chosen this path, I am not much farther along in that investigation today than I was at midnight Tuesday night. Although, to my horror, it would seem that the most correct statement that can be made in relation to "why" this has happened, is simply to state the obvious: America has chosen Fascism.
We can all, I think, agree that the American Left failed in this election. But contrary to the maniacs who are doing whatever they can to convince us that the failure rests solely with the American Left, I find the sheer mass of this decision to outweigh anything the American Left is capable of, even in its heyday, which this certainly is not. I do not know exactly how to express this eloquently, so forgive me if I devolve into grunts and shrieks here, but America has chosen Fascism.
Some people want us to believe that this is due to the fact that "Progressives" are "too condescending". Which basically amounts to an argument that Liberals are bullying white people. It almost sounds reasonable, too, until you remember that the Fascists who won this election by being outright hostile to everyone who is not a white Christian male. So to accept the blame on behalf of "mean Liberals" is to first dismiss the humanity of the Right's targets out of hand, because if we can lose an election by being indifferent to the plight of whites but win an election by being openly hostile to people of color, the disabled, the elderly, and the queer, I really do not understand why I am supposed to feel guilty about the former, and appease those practicing the latter.
My initial reaction (which can be gleaned from my prolific shit-posting on Facebook throughout the event) was to place the blame squarely on so-called "Progressives" who managed to justify to themselves a complete lack of action on behalf of people who were in the sights -- and continue to be in the sights -- of the incoming Trump administration. And although I have learned that such initial reactions are often valueless, in this case I must conclude my instincts were fairly accurate. At its heart, whatever your belief about absolutely anything in this year and a half long endurance test, the most fundamental fact borne out on election day was that when it really counted, the "allies" -- WE "Allies" -- turned high tail and fled the field.
So in the coming days, months, and years, when every manner of horror visits the people of this country, one marginalized group at a time, I lack any faith that there is any coherent resistance at all. While we are busy worrying about sounding "condescending", whole neighborhoods will disappear. While we are wringing our hands about being "too uncooperative", our neighbors will disappear. While we sing the praise of a peaceful transition of power, the lights will go out, and the we won't know who to call. And someday, in a future that might as well be a century from today for many of us, when the lights come back on, and someone dares to hope again, where will we have been?
:mittens:
Thank you for saying this.
Nice to see you're alive and thinking sense as usual.
QuoteSo to accept the blame on behalf of "mean Liberals" is to first dismiss the humanity of the Right's targets out of hand, because if we can lose an election by being indifferent to the plight of whites but win an election by being openly hostile to people of color, the disabled, the elderly, and the queer, I really do not understand why I am supposed to feel guilty about the former, and appease those practicing the latter.
Also, this is worth a little more of a look.
To start with the USA version of "liberal" is pretty conservative compared to the rest of the west. The version of "Liberal" that passes in the UK, or gods forbid certain parts of europe (for the moment) would horrify the shit out of your voters because of SOCIALISM and COMMUNISTS. This gives a fair indication of what the USA right wing looks like in comparison. It would be funny if it didn't manifest in obvious ways like, say, healthcare statistics.
As the the second part, the more I consider it, fuck these people. If you're stupid enough to fall for this cretin then you're unlikely to listen to anything resembling sense and reason.
Am alive. Barely. And hoping an autocrat in power might, if nothing else, lend a little of that spirit of 2006-2008 to this place.
Quote from: V3X on November 12, 2016, 12:47:59 AM
Am alive. Barely. And hoping an autocrat in power might, if nothing else, lend a little of that spirit of 2006-2008 to this place.
It definitely seems to be having a revival. :lulz:
LOL. God damn I was honestly afraid the left might learn something from this for awhile. Thank you SMART PEOPLEtm for assuring me that the next two, three, maybe even four elections will be a cakewalk for the AltRight.
"But contrary to the maniacs who are doing whatever they can to convince us that the failure rests solely with the American Left"
YES. It is very important in the face of absolute failure(President, Senate/Congress and soon the Supreme court Bee-atches) to completely absolve yourself of all responsibility. Dont learn anything, because there isnt anything to learn. Your enemies won because they are all big fat meaniepantses. There was nothing you could have done differently. You didnt field the weakest possible candidate, with multiple scandals, an active criminal investigation and dysmal polling. And even if you did, Donald Trump is a FASCIST. Now dont hang yourself up trying to actually figure out what that word means, because it doesnt mean anything! Want to cut down on illegal immigration? Fascism. Want to repeal Obamacare? Fascism. Just keep repeating over and over again that your opponents are racists, fascists, mysogynists all the badwrong words you can think of. EVENTUALLY it will work!
Now, it is literally impossible to find out why these people voted for trump right from their mouths. If only there was some kind of electronic invention which connected every computer and phone on the planet allowing instantaneous communication. So in absence of any way to actually communicate with these people and discern their motives we must go to the next best thing "Facebook Leftists." Remember, just because these people completely failed to predict the results of this election at every stage of the way doesnt mean they shouldnt be the first people you turn to in these dark and dysmal times.
What they have so far managed to figure out, is that the left is "too condescending." Again, these should be the first people we turn to in figuring out the motivations of the people who voted for Trump. There are no communities of Trump supporters we can talk to and confirm this. It is a complete mystery that we must figure out on our own. And the simple truth is, they are evil. Pure evil. The brownshirts are forming right now. Trump is already planning to round up the LGBT POCs into camps. This was after all a cornerstone of his campaign.
That is why, we absolutely cannot extend any kind of olive branch to these people. We cannot make any attempts to reason with them. There is no room in democracy for compromise. Trump is Voldemort Hitler and if we make any attempts to actually win back his voting base and weaken his power, VOLDEMORT HITLER WINS!
Besides. These people are all going to die anyways. Its not like 40% of millennials and 48% of white millennials voted Trump. Literally 100% of them voted Clinton and if we just double down on the strategies that have failed us so far eventually, you know 20, 30, 50, 60 years from now, we will just automatically win! We dont even have to confront the fact that we are completely unappealing and unpersuasive!
Thank you! Thank you so much for these great words of wisdom! I almost thought Id have to rethink my worldview and strategy.
Quote from: xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed) on November 12, 2016, 01:21:43 AM
LOL. God damn I was honestly afraid the left might learn something from this for awhile. Thank you SMART PEOPLEtm for assuring me that the next two, three, maybe even four elections will be a cakewalk for the AltRight.
Which part of the alt-right do you like best? Screaming slurs at blacks, or screaming slurs at women?
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 12, 2016, 01:30:19 AM
Quote from: xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed) on November 12, 2016, 01:21:43 AM
LOL. God damn I was honestly afraid the left might learn something from this for awhile. Thank you SMART PEOPLEtm for assuring me that the next two, three, maybe even four elections will be a cakewalk for the AltRight.
Which part of the alt-right do you like best? Screaming slurs at blacks, or screaming slurs at women?
Id prefer screaming slurs to physical attacks and riots.
http://www.infowars.com/video-high-school-girl-viciously-attacked-for-supporting-donald-trump/
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2016/11/11/man-describes-brutal-attack-crowd-yelled-thats-a-white-boy-trump-supporter/
Quote from: xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed) on November 12, 2016, 01:35:55 AM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 12, 2016, 01:30:19 AM
Quote from: xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed) on November 12, 2016, 01:21:43 AM
LOL. God damn I was honestly afraid the left might learn something from this for awhile. Thank you SMART PEOPLEtm for assuring me that the next two, three, maybe even four elections will be a cakewalk for the AltRight.
Which part of the alt-right do you like best? Screaming slurs at blacks, or screaming slurs at women?
Id prefer screaming slurs to physical attacks and riots.
http://www.infowars.com/video-high-school-girl-viciously-attacked-for-supporting-donald-trump/
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2016/11/11/man-describes-brutal-attack-crowd-yelled-thats-a-white-boy-trump-supporter/
Infowars. :lulz:
But it's refreshing to see your honesty concerning slurs.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 12, 2016, 01:47:30 AM
Quote from: xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed) on November 12, 2016, 01:35:55 AM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 12, 2016, 01:30:19 AM
Quote from: xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed) on November 12, 2016, 01:21:43 AM
LOL. God damn I was honestly afraid the left might learn something from this for awhile. Thank you SMART PEOPLEtm for assuring me that the next two, three, maybe even four elections will be a cakewalk for the AltRight.
Which part of the alt-right do you like best? Screaming slurs at blacks, or screaming slurs at women?
Id prefer screaming slurs to physical attacks and riots.
http://www.infowars.com/video-high-school-girl-viciously-attacked-for-supporting-donald-trump/
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2016/11/11/man-describes-brutal-attack-crowd-yelled-thats-a-white-boy-trump-supporter/
Infowars. :lulz:
But it's refreshing to see your honesty concerning slurs.
FUCKING AMEN!
I think that understanding why most Trump voters did so is important, but not especially mysterious. They are overwhelmingly relatively comfortable white Christian middle-class people with high school diplomas but little higher education, who feel threatened by progressivism because they think that to help others means losing what they have. They believe this is a zero-sum game. They also have an ideal of the white middle-class that harkens back to the nuclear family of the 1950's. They are not overtly racist, but rather, most of them are passively racist in the sense that they can't identify with people of color and don't really think about them as people. They don't consider themselves misogynists, but agree that women belong in the home, especially after having children, and that the man should be the head of the house. They are perfectly ordinary Americans who see themselves as what normal *should* be, and think that anyone who works hard can have the lifestyle they have.
I think a lot of them were reluctant to vote for him, and may actually be feeling a little guilty about it by the time the 2018 mid-term elections come around. I think we need to focus on maximizing the buyer's remorse of the salvageable Trump voters, the ones who actually have a conscience. They need to know how badly their country needs them to help fix the mess they were duped into helping create. Make them feel better about the good they can do rather than feel bad about the horrible thing they did. We don't want them to decide that they are just bad at voting and stay home.
Those others, we need them to Sig Heil and goose step as hard as possible to maximize the NOPE factor of the swing voters.
Also, rioting liberals are super counterproductive.
What's weird for me is that I fit Nigel's description of Trump voters, demographically, to a T. White. Middle class. High school diploma, but little higher ed. Shit, I even have 2 kids and a stay at home wife. Not Christian, but raised as one. But neither Trump nor any other Republicanduring my conscious lifetime has appealed to me, especially not with any "boogety boo brown people!" argument.
It isn't weird because I don't understand exceptions to rules, but because I would think with so many otherwise matching data points, two things would be true: 1) I would at least understand why someone would go that way, and 2) I should be capable of relating to them in a way that seems more sincere than an "Ivy league elite" could. But no, they are as immune to my sincere pleading as to the condescension from Academia, and it just boggles my mind a little.
I was thinking yesterday that being one of the white middle-class non-Trump votes has to be a weird, lonely feeling. Just knowing that the majority of your demographic doesn't share your values at all must be bizarre.
Suppose you could ask Trae Crowder
Well yeah. I'm not going to pretend I'm as disaffected or discarded as millions of other people are right now, but it's definitely bizarre. The logic leading to the conclusion that it's OK to ignore the vulnerable is as impenetrable to my mind as my reasoning that it is abhorrent is to my demographic peers. I'm sure it has to do with my having escaped the small white town I grew up in and being slightly more traveled. People who saw the world as unjust and unfair when I went to high school with them are, today, smugly self-satisfied and unconcerned whatsoever with the plight of the disadvantaged, if not openly hostile to them. I think it must be what I call "the Tofu effect", where spending years in an echo chamber, even if it contradicts one's thinking, has an inevitable effect of changing one's worldview.
Quote from: V3X on November 12, 2016, 04:38:04 PM
Well yeah. I'm not going to pretend I'm as disaffected or discarded as millions of other people are right now, but it's definitely bizarre. The logic leading to the conclusion that it's OK to ignore the vulnerable is as impenetrable to my mind as my reasoning that it is abhorrent is to my demographic peers. I'm sure it has to do with my having escaped the small white town I grew up in and being slightly more traveled. People who saw the world as unjust and unfair when I went to high school with them are, today, smugly self-satisfied and unconcerned whatsoever with the plight of the disadvantaged, if not openly hostile to them. I think it must be what I call "the Tofu effect", where spending years in an echo chamber, even if it contradicts one's thinking, has an inevitable effect of changing one's worldview.
I think that for some people, believing that they are simply more hardworking/deserving and that's why they are among the haves and not the have-nots helps to soothe the cognitive dissonance that they would have to live with if they recognized that they aren't simply innately more deserving.
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on November 12, 2016, 04:21:44 PM
I was thinking yesterday that being one of the white middle-class non-Trump votes has to be a weird, lonely feeling. Just knowing that the majority of your demographic doesn't share your values at all must be bizarre.
Hi. Yes, it is.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 12, 2016, 01:47:30 AM
Quote from: xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed) on November 12, 2016, 01:35:55 AM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on November 12, 2016, 01:30:19 AM
Quote from: xXRon_Paul_42016Xxx(weed) on November 12, 2016, 01:21:43 AM
LOL. God damn I was honestly afraid the left might learn something from this for awhile. Thank you SMART PEOPLEtm for assuring me that the next two, three, maybe even four elections will be a cakewalk for the AltRight.
Which part of the alt-right do you like best? Screaming slurs at blacks, or screaming slurs at women?
Id prefer screaming slurs to physical attacks and riots.
http://www.infowars.com/video-high-school-girl-viciously-attacked-for-supporting-donald-trump/
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2016/11/11/man-describes-brutal-attack-crowd-yelled-thats-a-white-boy-trump-supporter/
Infowars. :lulz:
But it's refreshing to see your honesty concerning slurs.
So infowars hosting it invalidates that video of a trump supporter being attacked? Because there are more of them. Of course youre all into "breaking fascist kneecaps" now so Im guessing you dont care. By all means continue, a few more riots and 2018 is in the bag for us.