I declare this poor man the Unofficial Saint of 2011:
Henry Bemis: a man who seeks salvation in the rubble of a ruined world
Henry Bemis, who finally understands the distinction between solitude and loneliness.
(http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb163/wompcabal/At-last-I-can-read-my-books.jpg)
"At last I can read my books
I have time enough at last...."
AT LAST it is 2011
our handlers are just finishing the world they have carefully built for us
all our problems are over
& we have time enough at last
probably my favorite twilight zone of all time.
just look at his face! It says it all, doesn't it?
The whole world used to be against him, now it's smoking ash. He's so fucking happy, he doesn't have a care in the world.
yeah, Bemis needed technology, and that ended up being his downfall. But look at this perfect moment. He's stacked up all the books he wants to read, he has the next few months planned out already. No work, no duties, no nagging wife. He's not concerned about the food or radiation or loneliness, all he has is his passion. Nobody's left to distract him from that. Eris bless him.
My kids loved this episode. We started watching The Twilight Zone with them last year or something like that. So great to listen to my kids talk about the themes in the oldies--they particularly liked Bemis and his trickery.
Before I left for vacation this year, I printed out the picture in the OP and hung it up outside my cubicle.
This is a great idea, but why pin him down to 2011? This next century is his, baby, HIS!
Quote from: The Dancing Pickle on December 20, 2010, 04:49:53 PM
probably my favorite twilight zone of all time.
My LEAST favorite. The Twilight Zone was usually about people getting what they had coming.
The Henry Bemis episode wasn't. It was about a man who got kicked and kicked and kicked some more, then the world ends, and then he gets kicked again.
I fucking hated it. It was a downer, that didn't even have any sort of moral message behind it. Perhaps if Bemis was surrounded by NICE people he ignored in favor of books, but he wasn't. He was utterly surrounded by shitnecks, and he always tried to be nice. Then he gets fucked royally in the end.
If I wanted that kind of "entertainment", I'd just go watch them go into and out of the goddamn battered womens' center.
some interesting interpretations of the episode at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_Enough_at_Last#Themes
Quote from: Cramulus on December 21, 2010, 06:20:26 PM
some interesting interpretations of the episode at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_Enough_at_Last#Themes
BAH!
Bemis wasn't antisocial, he was socially inept. Big difference.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:17:34 PM
Quote from: The Dancing Pickle on December 20, 2010, 04:49:53 PM
probably my favorite twilight zone of all time.
My LEAST favorite. The Twilight Zone was usually about people getting what they had coming.
The Henry Bemis episode wasn't. It was about a man who got kicked and kicked and kicked some more, then the world ends, and then he gets kicked again.
I fucking hated it. It was a downer, that didn't even have any sort of moral message behind it. Perhaps if Bemis was surrounded by NICE people he ignored in favor of books, but he wasn't. He was utterly surrounded by shitnecks, and he always tried to be nice. Then he gets fucked royally in the end.
If I wanted that kind of "entertainment", I'd just go watch them go into and out of the goddamn battered womens' center.
I think of it as victory for him... he has time to read all the books he wants now. So his glasses are broken, so what? With all the abundant food and books seemingly untouched there must be a pair of glasses which will work for him... he just needs to find them.
But he represents a big part of why we need to wake up and not let life be so damned miserable all the time--Bemis always had "time"--he did, as we all do, drudgery in life with those who didn't appreciate him--because it was STILL his choice. I think I mixed up this episode with another of Burgess Meredith's, though, that was about books. My kids liked the "Time Enough at Last" for different reasons, but they enjoyed the one where reading was verboten even more ("The Obsolete Man").
It was my mother who got me into the old twilight zone and particularly this episode because I often said "I want to be alone, I just want to read" or some variation on that. And that was fine, she always encouraged reading, but with this episode she wanted me to take away the "be careful what you wish for, you might get it" aspect of the story, which I think comes across well.
Quote from: Hoopla on December 21, 2010, 06:28:03 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:17:34 PM
Quote from: The Dancing Pickle on December 20, 2010, 04:49:53 PM
probably my favorite twilight zone of all time.
My LEAST favorite. The Twilight Zone was usually about people getting what they had coming.
The Henry Bemis episode wasn't. It was about a man who got kicked and kicked and kicked some more, then the world ends, and then he gets kicked again.
I fucking hated it. It was a downer, that didn't even have any sort of moral message behind it. Perhaps if Bemis was surrounded by NICE people he ignored in favor of books, but he wasn't. He was utterly surrounded by shitnecks, and he always tried to be nice. Then he gets fucked royally in the end.
If I wanted that kind of "entertainment", I'd just go watch them go into and out of the goddamn battered womens' center.
I think of it as victory for him... he has time to read all the books he wants now. So his glasses are broken, so what? With all the abundant food and books seemingly untouched there must be a pair of glasses which will work for him... he just needs to find them.
By touch?
Quote from: The Dancing Pickle on December 21, 2010, 06:31:54 PM
It was my mother who got me into the old twilight zone and particularly this episode because I often said "I want to be alone, I just want to read" or some variation on that. And that was fine, she always encouraged reading, but with this episode she wanted me to take away the "be careful what you wish for, you might get it" aspect of the story, which I think comes across well.
There is precisely NOTHING wrong with wanting a couple of hours to read. In the story, it isn't even about solitude, it's about wanting to be away from abusive fucks while he reads.
At one point, his wife asks him to read to her, and he's fucking thrilled (not the actions of an antisocial man), only to find out that she's defaced the book beyond use.
The only possible morals to this story are:
1. Wanting to be able to read in peace is a sin, and
2. The assholes all go out in a blink, and the poor bastard they hounded gets to starve to death while functionally blind.
It's a rotten fucking story, and the asshole that wrote it ought to have been fed to rabid weasels, feet first.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:32:27 PM
Quote from: Hoopla on December 21, 2010, 06:28:03 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:17:34 PM
Quote from: The Dancing Pickle on December 20, 2010, 04:49:53 PM
probably my favorite twilight zone of all time.
My LEAST favorite. The Twilight Zone was usually about people getting what they had coming.
The Henry Bemis episode wasn't. It was about a man who got kicked and kicked and kicked some more, then the world ends, and then he gets kicked again.
I fucking hated it. It was a downer, that didn't even have any sort of moral message behind it. Perhaps if Bemis was surrounded by NICE people he ignored in favor of books, but he wasn't. He was utterly surrounded by shitnecks, and he always tried to be nice. Then he gets fucked royally in the end.
If I wanted that kind of "entertainment", I'd just go watch them go into and out of the goddamn battered womens' center.
I think of it as victory for him... he has time to read all the books he wants now. So his glasses are broken, so what? With all the abundant food and books seemingly untouched there must be a pair of glasses which will work for him... he just needs to find them.
By touch?
Sure, why not?
Quote from: Hoopla on December 21, 2010, 06:38:58 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:32:27 PM
Quote from: Hoopla on December 21, 2010, 06:28:03 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:17:34 PM
Quote from: The Dancing Pickle on December 20, 2010, 04:49:53 PM
probably my favorite twilight zone of all time.
My LEAST favorite. The Twilight Zone was usually about people getting what they had coming.
The Henry Bemis episode wasn't. It was about a man who got kicked and kicked and kicked some more, then the world ends, and then he gets kicked again.
I fucking hated it. It was a downer, that didn't even have any sort of moral message behind it. Perhaps if Bemis was surrounded by NICE people he ignored in favor of books, but he wasn't. He was utterly surrounded by shitnecks, and he always tried to be nice. Then he gets fucked royally in the end.
If I wanted that kind of "entertainment", I'd just go watch them go into and out of the goddamn battered womens' center.
I think of it as victory for him... he has time to read all the books he wants now. So his glasses are broken, so what? With all the abundant food and books seemingly untouched there must be a pair of glasses which will work for him... he just needs to find them.
By touch?
Sure, why not?
Four words: Velma from Scooby Doo.
It is well established fact that people who drop their glasses 1 foot from their feet are unable to find them without assistance. Bemis being able to find a pair in the ruins of a huge city is an absolute impossibility.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:40:52 PM
Quote from: Hoopla on December 21, 2010, 06:38:58 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:32:27 PM
Quote from: Hoopla on December 21, 2010, 06:28:03 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:17:34 PM
Quote from: The Dancing Pickle on December 20, 2010, 04:49:53 PM
probably my favorite twilight zone of all time.
My LEAST favorite. The Twilight Zone was usually about people getting what they had coming.
The Henry Bemis episode wasn't. It was about a man who got kicked and kicked and kicked some more, then the world ends, and then he gets kicked again.
I fucking hated it. It was a downer, that didn't even have any sort of moral message behind it. Perhaps if Bemis was surrounded by NICE people he ignored in favor of books, but he wasn't. He was utterly surrounded by shitnecks, and he always tried to be nice. Then he gets fucked royally in the end.
If I wanted that kind of "entertainment", I'd just go watch them go into and out of the goddamn battered womens' center.
I think of it as victory for him... he has time to read all the books he wants now. So his glasses are broken, so what? With all the abundant food and books seemingly untouched there must be a pair of glasses which will work for him... he just needs to find them.
By touch?
Sure, why not?
Four words: Velma from Scooby Doo.
It is well established fact that people who drop their glasses 1 foot from their feet are unable to find them without assistance. Bemis being able to find a pair in the ruins of a huge city is an absolute impossibility.
Rats...
Quote from: Hoopla on December 21, 2010, 06:45:06 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:40:52 PM
Quote from: Hoopla on December 21, 2010, 06:38:58 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:32:27 PM
Quote from: Hoopla on December 21, 2010, 06:28:03 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:17:34 PM
Quote from: The Dancing Pickle on December 20, 2010, 04:49:53 PM
probably my favorite twilight zone of all time.
My LEAST favorite. The Twilight Zone was usually about people getting what they had coming.
The Henry Bemis episode wasn't. It was about a man who got kicked and kicked and kicked some more, then the world ends, and then he gets kicked again.
I fucking hated it. It was a downer, that didn't even have any sort of moral message behind it. Perhaps if Bemis was surrounded by NICE people he ignored in favor of books, but he wasn't. He was utterly surrounded by shitnecks, and he always tried to be nice. Then he gets fucked royally in the end.
If I wanted that kind of "entertainment", I'd just go watch them go into and out of the goddamn battered womens' center.
I think of it as victory for him... he has time to read all the books he wants now. So his glasses are broken, so what? With all the abundant food and books seemingly untouched there must be a pair of glasses which will work for him... he just needs to find them.
By touch?
Sure, why not?
Four words: Velma from Scooby Doo.
It is well established fact that people who drop their glasses 1 foot from their feet are unable to find them without assistance. Bemis being able to find a pair in the ruins of a huge city is an absolute impossibility.
Rats...
Velma (pawing around 3" from her glasses): "I lost my glasses, I can't see without my glasses!"
Shaggy: "Like, this is news? You do this EVERY FUCKING TIME. Put the fucking things on a lanyard, asshole."
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
I love where this thread went.
Quote from: LMNO, PhD on December 21, 2010, 06:55:19 PM
I love where this thread went.
Sorry, that's been bugging me since 1975.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:35:40 PM
Quote from: The Dancing Pickle on December 21, 2010, 06:31:54 PM
It was my mother who got me into the old twilight zone and particularly this episode because I often said "I want to be alone, I just want to read" or some variation on that. And that was fine, she always encouraged reading, but with this episode she wanted me to take away the "be careful what you wish for, you might get it" aspect of the story, which I think comes across well.
There is precisely NOTHING wrong with wanting a couple of hours to read. In the story, it isn't even about solitude, it's about wanting to be away from abusive fucks while he reads.
At one point, his wife asks him to read to her, and he's fucking thrilled (not the actions of an antisocial man), only to find out that she's defaced the book beyond use.
The only possible morals to this story are:
1. Wanting to be able to read in peace is a sin, and
2. The assholes all go out in a blink, and the poor bastard they hounded gets to starve to death while functionally blind.
It's a rotten fucking story, and the asshole that wrote it ought to have been fed to rabid weasels, feet first.
I completely agree with this. Except I
enjoyed the episode for how absolutely terrible message it had. The good guy loses no matter what.
Quote from: Doktor Phox on December 21, 2010, 07:45:56 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:35:40 PM
Quote from: The Dancing Pickle on December 21, 2010, 06:31:54 PM
It was my mother who got me into the old twilight zone and particularly this episode because I often said "I want to be alone, I just want to read" or some variation on that. And that was fine, she always encouraged reading, but with this episode she wanted me to take away the "be careful what you wish for, you might get it" aspect of the story, which I think comes across well.
There is precisely NOTHING wrong with wanting a couple of hours to read. In the story, it isn't even about solitude, it's about wanting to be away from abusive fucks while he reads.
At one point, his wife asks him to read to her, and he's fucking thrilled (not the actions of an antisocial man), only to find out that she's defaced the book beyond use.
The only possible morals to this story are:
1. Wanting to be able to read in peace is a sin, and
2. The assholes all go out in a blink, and the poor bastard they hounded gets to starve to death while functionally blind.
It's a rotten fucking story, and the asshole that wrote it ought to have been fed to rabid weasels, feet first.
I completely agree with this. Except I enjoyed the episode for how absolutely terrible message it had. The good guy loses no matter what.
Thing is, I can watch good men get run down like dogs anytime I want,
in real life. The one appeal The Twilight Zone had for me was the same as Guy Richie flicks...People get what they deserve.
If they don't, I may as well just walk down Congress St to see grim reality.
eh they can't all be happy endings
Quote from: Cramulus on December 21, 2010, 07:50:30 PM
eh they can't all be happy endings
No, but on The Twilight Zones, the unhappy endings should happen to lousy people.
I agree that Bemis should be a Saint...But the writer should be set on fire and thrown in the Hudson.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 07:47:54 PM
Quote from: Doktor Phox on December 21, 2010, 07:45:56 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 06:35:40 PM
Quote from: The Dancing Pickle on December 21, 2010, 06:31:54 PM
It was my mother who got me into the old twilight zone and particularly this episode because I often said "I want to be alone, I just want to read" or some variation on that. And that was fine, she always encouraged reading, but with this episode she wanted me to take away the "be careful what you wish for, you might get it" aspect of the story, which I think comes across well.
There is precisely NOTHING wrong with wanting a couple of hours to read. In the story, it isn't even about solitude, it's about wanting to be away from abusive fucks while he reads.
At one point, his wife asks him to read to her, and he's fucking thrilled (not the actions of an antisocial man), only to find out that she's defaced the book beyond use.
The only possible morals to this story are:
1. Wanting to be able to read in peace is a sin, and
2. The assholes all go out in a blink, and the poor bastard they hounded gets to starve to death while functionally blind.
It's a rotten fucking story, and the asshole that wrote it ought to have been fed to rabid weasels, feet first.
I completely agree with this. Except I enjoyed the episode for how absolutely terrible message it had. The good guy loses no matter what.
Thing is, I can watch good men get run down like dogs anytime I want, in real life. The one appeal The Twilight Zone had for me was the same as Guy Richie flicks...People get what they deserve.
If they don't, I may as well just walk down Congress St to see grim reality.
Good point, Roger. People getting what they deserve is more entertaining.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 07:52:48 PM
Quote from: Cramulus on December 21, 2010, 07:50:30 PM
eh they can't all be happy endings
No, but on The Twilight Zones, the unhappy endings should happen to lousy people.
I agree that Bemis should be a Saint...But the writer should be set on fire and thrown in the Hudson.
And, again, I agree with this.
I dunno, were I married to Bemis, I'd probably be a shitneck to him too. He's not the most loveliest of humans, after all. And his choice in wives points at his poor taste. Maybe I'm just not entirely convinced that he didn't deserve what he got. The message wasn't really about reading--it was about choices and how you choose what you do in your life. The drudgery that was this man's life was STILL his choice--when the drudgeries were taken way without his will, he was still a failure.
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 07:58:37 PM
I dunno, were I married to Bemis, I'd probably be a shitneck to him too. He's not the most loveliest of humans, after all. And his choice in wives points at his poor taste. Maybe I'm just not entirely convinced that he didn't deserve what he got. The message wasn't really about reading--it was about choices and how you choose what you do in your life. The drudgery that was this man's life was STILL his choice--when the drudgeries were taken way without his will, he was still a failure.
Being a failure doe not equate to deserving to be completely isolated, starving, and blind.
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 07:58:37 PM
I dunno, were I married to Bemis, I'd probably be a shitneck to him too. He's not the most loveliest of humans, after all. And his choice in wives points at his poor taste. Maybe I'm just not entirely convinced that he didn't deserve what he got. The message wasn't really about reading--it was about choices and how you choose what you do in your life. The drudgery that was this man's life was STILL his choice--when the drudgeries were taken way without his will, he was still a failure.
Because he dropped his glasses?
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 07:52:48 PM
Quote from: Cramulus on December 21, 2010, 07:50:30 PM
eh they can't all be happy endings
No, but on The Twilight Zones, the unhappy endings should happen to lousy people.
Nah, I think on Twilight Zone, they show in fact that the good people are often bad, and that the lousy people are often not so lousy. Like "real life." The "duality" is really a sham, that we're not all black and white as the episodes themselves are. It's the epitome, really, of sci fi in its essence. Throwing up the "other" into our faces even as it looks strange and supernatural, till it's close up and we realize: we're staring into a mirror.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 08:00:51 PM
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 07:58:37 PM
I dunno, were I married to Bemis, I'd probably be a shitneck to him too. He's not the most loveliest of humans, after all. And his choice in wives points at his poor taste. Maybe I'm just not entirely convinced that he didn't deserve what he got. The message wasn't really about reading--it was about choices and how you choose what you do in your life. The drudgery that was this man's life was STILL his choice--when the drudgeries were taken way without his will, he was still a failure.
Because he dropped his glasses?
The fact that he was such a fixated person on BOOKS. There's no fucking life out there, but the books are going to save him? And then the books are taken away, too. Why is that?
I just think he's not being "punished" for being un-lousy, but the opposite. For not choosing the "right things" while he still had the "time." Time was always on his side, but his face was in books, not dealing actively with his life, in the then and there.
Quote from: Doktor Phox on December 21, 2010, 07:59:53 PM
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 07:58:37 PM
I dunno, were I married to Bemis, I'd probably be a shitneck to him too. He's not the most loveliest of humans, after all. And his choice in wives points at his poor taste. Maybe I'm just not entirely convinced that he didn't deserve what he got. The message wasn't really about reading--it was about choices and how you choose what you do in your life. The drudgery that was this man's life was STILL his choice--when the drudgeries were taken way without his will, he was still a failure.
Being a failure doe not equate to deserving to be completely isolated, starving, and blind.
It's allegorical.
Ever read Job?
Also, I reject the notion that a man is a failure because he won't interact with assholes any more than he has to, or because he enjoys reading.
Or even because he has a boring job.
Or even because he married the wrong person. That shit happens to more than 50% of the population.
Fact is, at every turn, Bemis attempted to be nice to people while interacting with them. At every point, the people he interacted with shat on him for the sheer joy of doing so, and to get laughs from their coworkers, etc. This isn't his fault.
And I refuse to consider a nice, hard-working, well-read man to be a failure.
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 08:03:00 PM
The fact that he was such a fixated person on BOOKS. There's no fucking life out there, but the books are going to save him? And then the books are taken away, too. Why is that?
I just think he's not being "punished" for being un-lousy, but the opposite. For not choosing the "right things" while he still had the "time." Time was always on his side, but his face was in books, not dealing actively with his life, in the then and there.
So the solution was to give up his one joy in life, so he could spend more time interacting with assholes?
The only person in that story that didn't deserve a kick in their bits was Bemis.
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 08:03:27 PM
Quote from: Doktor Phox on December 21, 2010, 07:59:53 PM
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 07:58:37 PM
I dunno, were I married to Bemis, I'd probably be a shitneck to him too. He's not the most loveliest of humans, after all. And his choice in wives points at his poor taste. Maybe I'm just not entirely convinced that he didn't deserve what he got. The message wasn't really about reading--it was about choices and how you choose what you do in your life. The drudgery that was this man's life was STILL his choice--when the drudgeries were taken way without his will, he was still a failure.
Being a failure doe not equate to deserving to be completely isolated, starving, and blind.
It's allegorical.
Ever read Job?
Yes. Where's the redemption?
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 08:04:27 PM
Also, I reject the notion that a man is a failure because he won't interact with assholes any more than he has to, or because he enjoys reading.
Or even because he has a boring job.
Or even because he married the wrong person. That shit happens to more than 50% of the population.
Fact is, at every turn, Bemis attempted to be nice to people while interacting with them. At every point, the people he interacted with shat on him for the sheer joy of doing so, and to get laughs from their coworkers, etc. This isn't his fault.
And I refuse to consider a nice, hard-working, well-read man to be a failure.
Also, this.
Fit in.
Be like everyone else.
Interact with people who hate you.
Smile at people you despise.
It's a Bozo's world.
He rejected them as they rejected him, and he ended up without them, to his own final lament. The allegory is pretty clear. There's a point between this guy's gentile nihilism and embracing all to self-subversion as you two ate suggesting, Rog. There's liking reading, then there's liking reading to the point that it's your whole life.
I'm not saying Bemis deserves annihilation as everyone else got, but neither does he deserve absolution just because others close to him made him weaker. They made his character pathetic on purpose, villainizing his everyday contacts. But his desire to shut himself away to the exclusion of all else seems to point to his inability to see the forest for the trees... Am on my phone so am not explaining myself well, sorry.
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 08:23:44 PM
He rejected them as they rejected him, and he ended up without them, to his own final lament. The allegory is pretty clear. There's a point between this guy's gentile nihilism and embracing all to self-subversion as you two ate suggesting, Rog. There's liking reading, then there's liking reading to the point that it's your whole life.
I'm not saying Bemis deserves annihilation as everyone else got, but neither does he deserve absolution just because others close to him made him weaker. They made his character pathetic on purpose, villainizing his everyday contacts. But his desire to shut himself away to the exclusion of all else seems to point to his inability to see the forest for the trees... Am on my phone so am not explaining myself well, sorry.
He was right to reject them. Assholes exist to be rejected.
I'd do the same thing, except that I am a horrible cunt by nature, and prefer to punish them. Fortunately, I don't need glasses, so I'm all set.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 08:25:49 PM
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 08:23:44 PM
He rejected them as they rejected him, and he ended up without them, to his own final lament. The allegory is pretty clear. There's a point between this guy's gentile nihilism and embracing all to self-subversion as you two ate suggesting, Rog. There's liking reading, then there's liking reading to the point that it's your whole life.
I'm not saying Bemis deserves annihilation as everyone else got, but neither does he deserve absolution just because others close to him made him weaker. They made his character pathetic on purpose, villainizing his everyday contacts. But his desire to shut himself away to the exclusion of all else seems to point to his inability to see the forest for the trees... Am on my phone so am not explaining myself well, sorry.
He was right to reject them. Assholes exist to be rejected.
I'd do the same thing, except that I am a horrible cunt by nature, and prefer to punish them. Fortunately, I don't need glasses, so I'm all set.
I guess the point is, don't masturbate. You will need your eyesight when the fuckers are all dead.
Better ending: Everyone vanishes, Bemis, emerges, and sees hundreds of fellow bookworms, blinking in the sunlight, holding a stack of books.
Finally, a world without shitnecks. A world for them.
LMNO
-petty idealist.
Quote from: LMNO, PhD on December 21, 2010, 08:28:02 PM
Better ending: Everyone vanishes, Bemis, emerges, and sees hundreds of fellow bookworms, blinking in the sunlight, holding a stack of books.
Finally, a world without shitnecks. A world for them.
LMNO
-petty idealist.
I could enjoy a world like that. If they'd all stay quiet and read, I mean.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 08:35:46 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD on December 21, 2010, 08:28:02 PM
Better ending: Everyone vanishes, Bemis, emerges, and sees hundreds of fellow bookworms, blinking in the sunlight, holding a stack of books.
Finally, a world without shitnecks. A world for them.
LMNO
-petty idealist.
I could enjoy a world like that. If they'd all stay quiet and read, I mean.
Diogenes Club as the world, FTW!
Quote from: Hoopla on December 21, 2010, 08:39:35 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 21, 2010, 08:35:46 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD on December 21, 2010, 08:28:02 PM
Better ending: Everyone vanishes, Bemis, emerges, and sees hundreds of fellow bookworms, blinking in the sunlight, holding a stack of books.
Finally, a world without shitnecks. A world for them.
LMNO
-petty idealist.
I could enjoy a world like that. If they'd all stay quiet and read, I mean.
Diogenes Club as the world, FTW!
This.
Though, to be honest, I'm more of a people person, myself. I love having a huge city full of shitnecks to abuse. I love watching monkeys do stupid things to themselves, and everything within 100 meters of them.
So his heaven, not so much my heaven.
I guess what I was saying was, even a cute, gentle old man who just wants to read in his pathetic little existence is going to get shit on in life, even when things finally go his way. And guess what? That's ok. Beause he's not getting shit on for any other purpose really than he just exists. He's not perfect, and if you knew him, perhaps he's just as shitty in his own way as those who ridiculed him for being him.
He had the "last laugh" in the end, and even that was a sad little whimper. I think if he was a "worthier" opponent of all fate had in store for him, he'd be more of a hero. But instead, he's, again, as in his former life without the bomb dropping, the anti-hero. And we all can identify with that scenario.
Hate it, love it, but it's basically the same concept all around. I'm not lockstep in favor of this, but I do think it is not a bad road to go--rejecting all extreme rounds and goals to the exclusion of all else because it's convenient or you're lazy or the other way's too painful but will in the longrun gain you your own salvation...
But I think I'm overthinking this and so backing out. :lulz: When do I ever do differently, anyway?
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 08:49:42 PM
I guess what I was saying was, even a cute, gentle old man who just wants to read in his pathetic little existence is going to get shit on in life, even when things finally go his way. And guess what? That's ok. Beause he's not getting shit on for any other purpose really than he just exists. He's not perfect, and if you knew him, perhaps he's just as shitty in his own way as those who ridiculed him for being him.
He had the "last laugh" in the end, and even that was a sad little whimper. I think if he was a "worthier" opponent of all fate had in store for him, he'd be more of a hero. But instead, he's, again, as in his former life without the bomb dropping, the anti-hero. And we all can identify with that scenario.
Hate it, love it, but it's basically the same concept all around. I'm not lockstep in favor of this, but I do think it is not a bad road to go--rejecting all extreme rounds and goals to the exclusion of all else because it's convenient or you're lazy or the other way's too painful but will in the longrun gain you your own salvation...
But I think I'm overthinking this and so backing out. :lulz: When do I ever do differently, anyway?
Damnit, I had a response all typed out to your last reply before my net went down and ate it, so I'm just going to reply to this.
I disagree. If he had been a "worthier" opponent of fate (which is a bullshit idea in the first place), then the story would have been completely different. The fact is, Henry Bemis was the only person in that episode who wasn't a complete and utter cock. He wanted solitude, yeah. He wanted to run and hide away in his books. Big fucking deal. Who here can honestly say that they don't have some form of escapism they practice? It's not that it was convenient, or lazy, or too painful, it's that he had no fucking release whatsoever. He broke. He had had enough of it, and didn't want to deal with it anymore. It wasn't a choice between dealing with life and hiding in books, but it was damn near a choice between hiding in books and suicide. And then, when it finally occurs that he doesn't have to deal with the stresses of life, and he can do what he likes for once, the universe in all it's assholish glory fucks him in the ass so hard it's not even funny. A guy who deserved what he got would be the guy from "A Kind of Stopwatch" (another favorite of mine). Henry Bemis, on the other hand, did no harm to anyone and he still ended up being nothing more than an unlucky sap who survived the apocalypse only to wind up dead anyway. You are overthinking in the assumption that Henry Bemis was more than what we see, that he had a layer of shittiness somewhere, that didn't come up. And i would say he is what we see, and nothing more.
But he didn't deal with his stresses in life, Phox. He escaped. Time and again. The world would have been the same to him, decimated or not.
And it may be a bullshit notion, but that's literature for you. There are those that are "set up" to be beaten down, and those who aren't.
...:lulz: I totally lied about staying out of this thread. But then, Phox seems to think this is like real life or something.
(again, this is all allegorical, though I see parallels in peoples' lives near and dear to me)
Henry Bemis did harm to himself. That's it. And so was left to himself and to his books, ineffectually.
The "be careful what you wish for" in life is just that scenario--that making the most of what you already have may NOT the worst proposition, and is often the best. Or not. *shrug*
NOW I'll leave (since everything I'm saying is apparently bullshit :lulz:).
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 09:17:06 PM
But he didn't deal with his stresses in life, Phox. He escaped. Time and again. The world would have been the same to him, decimated or not.
And it may be a bullshit notion, but that's literature for you. There are those that are "set up" to be beaten down, and those who aren't.
...:lulz: I totally lied about staying out of this thread. But then, Phox seems to think this is like real life or something.
(again, this is all allegorical, though I see parallels in peoples' lives near and dear to me)
Henry Bemis did harm to himself. That's it. And so was left to himself and to his books, ineffectually.
The "be careful what you wish for" in life is just that scenario--that making the most of what you already have may NOT the worst proposition, and is often the best. Or not. *shrug*
NOW I'll leave (since everything I'm saying is apparently bullshit :lulz:).
I am well aware that literature is full of bullshit ideas, but that doesn't mean that I like to see "worthy opponents of fate battling their destiny" all the time, especially in something like the Twilight Zone, where the stories were reflections, if a bit hyperbolic, of real life.
Henry Bemis did harm to himself? How?
The problem with "be careful what you wish for" is that it didn't serve a purpose in the story of a harried man who is only asking for a moment's respite, aside from a giant fuck you from the cosmic powers.
And again I
liked the episode, I just happen to disagree with your interpretation. Also, i'm not saying that everything you're saying is bullshit either.
I love this thread, for the fact that it's an awesome discussion.
Okay WTF is the deal that every story has to have a moral?
What is this nonsense about the writer having to be punished for having the audacity to write a story where people don't get what they deserve?
It's a fucking story, sometimes a story is great because it triggers that feeling of "aww he did not deserve that" in you.
This is bullshit does EVERY story on TV have to have a proper moral where people only get what they deserve?
Because god forbid it ever leaves you hanging with an unresolved feeling of "hey ... wait a minute that's not ... fair?"
Obviously a writer can ONLY write a story when they want to teach a point about morality, so this means the writer MUST have been trying to teach us uhhh "be careful what you wish for" and "bad things come to those who want to read", and if the writer believes that he should be thrown into a river.
What utter nonsense. Sometimes a story doesn't have a moral, sometimes it isn't spelled out and obvious like the latest romcom or Disney, sometimes, the only moral conclusion you can draw from a story is the hard one that you draw by yourself when you think "Hey, that's not FAIR, that's not RIGHT, he didn't deserve that!", and not the easiest route where the morally right thing must have been manifested somehow in God's the writer's mysterious ways.
I remember a children's show, a guy is walking around in the dunes, and comes at a stall where he buys a throw-away lighter. A bit later, he finds out the lighter doesn't work so he goes back. The salesman grabs the lighter from the guy, throws it as far away into the dunes as he can, "ITS A THROWAWAY LIGHTER!!!", and starts kicking the man's ass until he runs away while the salesman yells , "A THROWAWAY LIGHTER!! DONT LET ME EVER SEE YOU AGAIN!!!"
moral of the story? Dutch sunday morning TV shows are fucked up.
Just for the hell of it :-
http://www.gutenberg.org/files/32633/32633-h/32633-h.htm
The original short story.
http://www.finebooksmagazine.com/fine_books_blog/2009/03/henry-bemis-hero-bibliomaniac-dead-at-97.phtml
Quote from: Triple Zero on January 23, 2011, 11:21:34 AM
Okay WTF is the deal that every story has to have a moral?
What is this nonsense about the writer having to be punished for having the audacity to write a story where people don't get what they deserve?
It's a fucking story, sometimes a story is great because it triggers that feeling of "aww he did not deserve that" in you.
This is bullshit does EVERY story on TV have to have a proper moral where people only get what they deserve?
Because god forbid it ever leaves you hanging with an unresolved feeling of "hey ... wait a minute that's not ... fair?"
Obviously a writer can ONLY write a story when they want to teach a point about morality, so this means the writer MUST have been trying to teach us uhhh "be careful what you wish for" and "bad things come to those who want to read", and if the writer believes that he should be thrown into a river.
What utter nonsense. Sometimes a story doesn't have a moral, sometimes it isn't spelled out and obvious like the latest romcom or Disney, sometimes, the only moral conclusion you can draw from a story is the hard one that you draw by yourself when you think "Hey, that's not FAIR, that's not RIGHT, he didn't deserve that!", and not the easiest route where the morally right thing must have been manifested somehow in God's the writer's mysterious ways.
I remember a children's show, a guy is walking around in the dunes, and comes at a stall where he buys a throw-away lighter. A bit later, he finds out the lighter doesn't work so he goes back. The salesman grabs the lighter from the guy, throws it as far away into the dunes as he can, "ITS A THROWAWAY LIGHTER!!!", and starts kicking the man's ass until he runs away while the salesman yells , "A THROWAWAY LIGHTER!! DONT LET ME EVER SEE YOU AGAIN!!!"
moral of the story? Dutch sunday morning TV shows are fucked up.
I agree, it doesn't have a moral. It's a story about the human condition, about solitude and introspection, its a social commentary on the need for quiet and aloneness in this world of constant distraction, interaction, and activity. The glasses breaking at the end was a way to get us to empathize that sense of loss to enjoy that solitude, but it wasn't moralizing. We wouldn't empathize if we also didn't wish for some peace and quiet with which to read for some time. It's an example of catharsis, and played out much like the greeks wrote tragedy, or Shakespeare for that matter.
Meh. Forget everything I said in this thread.
I'm just going to leave this right here: What Do You Mean It's Not Didactic? (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Ptitledz7rgdh9wrk1) :fnord:
Quote from: Triple Zero on January 23, 2011, 11:21:34 AM
Okay WTF is the deal that every story has to have a moral?
What is this nonsense about the writer having to be punished for having the audacity to write a story where people don't get what they deserve?
On
The Twilight Zone?
It's what that show was all about.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 23, 2011, 11:41:49 PM
Quote from: Triple Zero on January 23, 2011, 11:21:34 AM
Okay WTF is the deal that every story has to have a moral?
What is this nonsense about the writer having to be punished for having the audacity to write a story where people don't get what they deserve?
On The Twilight Zone?
It's what that show was all about.
I remember other episodes where that wasn't the case. I mean, what about the pilot, The Time Element, for example? Just because The Monsters are Due on Maple Street is an iconic example of people getting what they deserve, doesn't mean they were all like that. Does Gart Williams from A Stop at Willoughby get what he deserved? No, he ends up going insane and jumping off the train, dying, at a funeral home named Willoughby and Son. Or how about The Eye of the Beholder?
Quote from: Jenne on December 21, 2010, 09:17:06 PM
But he didn't deal with his stresses in life, Phox. He escaped. Time and again. The world would have been the same to him, decimated or not.
And what's immoral about that? There's nothing wrong with wanting solitude...You aren't hurting anyone else. I strongly disagree that somehow wanting to be left alone is in itself an immoral or unethical thing.
I'm going to retract my earlier statement.
Bemis DID deserve what he got, because he didn't run his wife through the chipper, and then quit his job and sell drugs to his coworkers' kids. And maybe put drano in the reservoir.
There is no room in The Kingdom for a person who won't I WILL KILL A MOTHERFUCKER when it becomes necessary.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 16, 2011, 09:31:10 PM
I'm going to retract my earlier statement.
Bemis DID deserve what he got, because he didn't run his wife through the chipper, and then quit his job and sell drugs to his coworkers' kids. And maybe put drano in the reservoir.
There is no room in The Kingdom for a person who won't I WILL KILL A MOTHERFUCKER when it becomes necessary.
:lulz:
I'm still of the opinion that he got fucked over for no good reason.
Quote from: Doktor Zero on December 17, 2011, 05:03:19 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 16, 2011, 09:31:10 PM
I'm going to retract my earlier statement.
Bemis DID deserve what he got, because he didn't run his wife through the chipper, and then quit his job and sell drugs to his coworkers' kids. And maybe put drano in the reservoir.
There is no room in The Kingdom for a person who won't I WILL KILL A MOTHERFUCKER when it becomes necessary.
:lulz:
I'm still of the opinion that he got fucked over for no good reason.
Yeah, well, welcome to the 21st Century. The idea of a person who harms nobody being left alone strictly for that reason is a notion that died with the last century. Is this a good thing? Of course not. Is it a sign of the times we live in? Of course. This ain't a matter of my opinion of Bemis, it's a matter of reality. They fuck with those people
first, because they're easy targets.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 18, 2011, 06:23:22 PM
Quote from: Doktor Zero on December 17, 2011, 05:03:19 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on December 16, 2011, 09:31:10 PM
I'm going to retract my earlier statement.
Bemis DID deserve what he got, because he didn't run his wife through the chipper, and then quit his job and sell drugs to his coworkers' kids. And maybe put drano in the reservoir.
There is no room in The Kingdom for a person who won't I WILL KILL A MOTHERFUCKER when it becomes necessary.
:lulz:
I'm still of the opinion that he got fucked over for no good reason.
Yeah, well, welcome to the 21st Century. The idea of a person who harms nobody being left alone strictly for that reason is a notion that died with the last century. Is this a good thing? Of course not. Is it a sign of the times we live in? Of course. This ain't a matter of my opinion of Bemis, it's a matter of reality. They fuck with those people first, because they're easy targets.
No disagreement there, Roger.