http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
Most of the chapter on Ramakrishna seems to be about him being trans and/or gay. I fail to see the problem or why this would invalidate him as a spiritual leader.
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
No it doesn't. In fact, the chapter on the Dalai Lama has absolutely nothing bad to say about the current one except that he declined to comment to a critical article by the New York Times, yet found time to pose for a photo op with Ricky Martin. It makes him out to seem like pretty much the most decent of the Dalai Lamas, actually, what with his chastity, meditation, and promotion of nonviolence.
Quote from: Nigel on May 24, 2011, 08:50:03 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
No it doesn't. In fact, the chapter on the Dalai Lama has absolutely nothing bad to say about the current one except that he declined to comment to a critical article by the New York Times, yet found time to pose for a photo op with Ricky Martin. It makes him out to seem like pretty much the most decent of the Dalai Lamas, actually, what with his chastity, meditation, and promotion of nonviolence.
Well, if its all the same guy, just reincarnated... then he did all of that stuff.
Also, the commentary on sexual misconduct was pretty fuckin' LULZY :)
Quote from: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on May 24, 2011, 09:27:39 PM
Quote from: Nigel on May 24, 2011, 08:50:03 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
No it doesn't. In fact, the chapter on the Dalai Lama has absolutely nothing bad to say about the current one except that he declined to comment to a critical article by the New York Times, yet found time to pose for a photo op with Ricky Martin. It makes him out to seem like pretty much the most decent of the Dalai Lamas, actually, what with his chastity, meditation, and promotion of nonviolence.
Well, if its all the same guy, just reincarnated... then he did all of that stuff.
Also, the commentary on sexual misconduct was pretty fuckin' LULZY :)
Why are we supposed to believe that? :? I didn't see the part where it says "by reading this book, you accept the belief systems of every religious leader discussed herein".
Ah, but he's using the arguments provided in the book on those who DO believe, so...
Quote from: Luna on May 24, 2011, 09:31:13 PM
Ah, but he's using the arguments provided in the book on those who DO believe, so...
Yeah, thats what I saw this as. Not to mention the comments on his rather odd ideas about being reincarnated as a computer, or that Sex during the day is bad, but Nuns slapping each others genitals for pleasure is OK... maybe some of his followers have no clue about some of his more controversial commentary.
Quote from: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on May 24, 2011, 09:35:09 PM
Quote from: Luna on May 24, 2011, 09:31:13 PM
Ah, but he's using the arguments provided in the book on those who DO believe, so...
Yeah, thats what I saw this as. Not to mention the comments on his rather odd ideas about being reincarnated as a computer, or that Sex during the day is bad, but Nuns slapping each others genitals for pleasure is OK... maybe some of his followers have no clue about some of his more controversial commentary.
OK, but I was responding to Lies' comment:
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
The book does no such thing, unless you buy into the idea that the current Dalai Lama is actually the same guy as previous ones who were creeps. Unless it's not in the chapter about the Dalai Lama, it had pretty much nothing bad to say about the current Dalai Lama at all.
Quote from: Nigel on May 24, 2011, 09:38:52 PM
Quote from: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on May 24, 2011, 09:35:09 PM
Quote from: Luna on May 24, 2011, 09:31:13 PM
Ah, but he's using the arguments provided in the book on those who DO believe, so...
Yeah, thats what I saw this as. Not to mention the comments on his rather odd ideas about being reincarnated as a computer, or that Sex during the day is bad, but Nuns slapping each others genitals for pleasure is OK... maybe some of his followers have no clue about some of his more controversial commentary.
OK, but I was responding to Lies' comment:
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
The book does no such thing, unless you buy into the idea that the current Dalai Lama is actually the same guy as previous ones who were creeps. Unless it's not in the chapter about the Dalai Lama, it had pretty much nothing bad to say about the current Dalai Lama at all.
The current one said that some people might get reincarnated as computers... and his sexual commentary...
I think I would count that all as a bit off.
Quote from: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on May 24, 2011, 09:42:41 PM
Quote from: Nigel on May 24, 2011, 09:38:52 PM
Quote from: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on May 24, 2011, 09:35:09 PM
Quote from: Luna on May 24, 2011, 09:31:13 PM
Ah, but he's using the arguments provided in the book on those who DO believe, so...
Yeah, thats what I saw this as. Not to mention the comments on his rather odd ideas about being reincarnated as a computer, or that Sex during the day is bad, but Nuns slapping each others genitals for pleasure is OK... maybe some of his followers have no clue about some of his more controversial commentary.
OK, but I was responding to Lies' comment:
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
The book does no such thing, unless you buy into the idea that the current Dalai Lama is actually the same guy as previous ones who were creeps. Unless it's not in the chapter about the Dalai Lama, it had pretty much nothing bad to say about the current Dalai Lama at all.
The current one said that some people might get reincarnated as computers... and his sexual commentary...
I think I would count that all as a bit off.
So you posit that Lies has been thinking "This Dalai Lama seems like a real prude, and has some funny ideas about computers?" :lulz:
Whatever.
I clicked on one of the source links and it went to a search box at the Mirror dot co.uk. Tabloid newspaper. Hmm.
Things that are "off" about the Dalai Lama:
- The apparent persecution of the Dorje Shugden worshippers by mainstream Tibetan Buddhists, which the Dalai Lama has tacitly condoned
- The Dalai Lama met with and provided support (and, according to Hitchens, possibly cash as well) to Shoko Asahara, the leader of Aum Shinrikyo.
- During the 1960s, he was taking nearly $2 million a year from the CIA, who were also training Tibetan "resistance fighters"
- Nepotism is rife within the Tibetan Government-in-Exile
- That he routinely (I would go so far as to say "automatically") takes the side of India in all its disputes with China
- Oh, that he's a representative of a Theocratic regime which treated serfs as cattle and non-Tibetans as one step above slaves.
Tibet's a highly complicated issue with plenty of bad guys on every side, but Western liberals tend to fawn over the Dalai Lama because he's a non-western (yes, I'm including Islam as Western. Deal) theocrat, Buddhism is enlightened pacifism and because China are automatically the bad guys. That none of these are necessarily true is just proof of pro-Chinese Maoist sympathies on behalf of the doubter.
I probably know more about the Dalai Lama now than I ever have before; thanks Cain.
I'm not a fan; I was just confused by Lies' statement because I went there and read that chapter looking for some juicy dirt on the guy, and all I got from it was that he's a prude with some funny ideas about reincarnation.
Yeah, it is rather disappointing, since all of the above dirt is available and has been, for the most part, since the mid-90s. I guess the book's information is a starting point for penetrating this holy aura his western supporters seem convinced he has, but it hardly goes as far as it could in making a case against him.
I think that being pro-nuns-slapping-each-others'-genitals-for-pleasure is a very noble and underappreciated cause.
Quote from: Rip City Hustle on May 24, 2011, 11:29:41 PM
I think that being pro-nuns-slapping-each-others'-genitals-for-pleasure is a very noble and underappreciated cause.
:lulz:
Quote from: Rip City Hustle on May 24, 2011, 11:29:41 PM
I think that being pro-nuns-slapping-each-others'-genitals-for-pleasure is a very noble and underappreciated cause.
I was going to say . . . shouldn't this be promoted as a sport or something?
Quote from: Rip City Hustle on May 24, 2011, 11:29:41 PM
I think that being pro-nuns-slapping-each-others'-genitals-for-pleasure is a very noble and underappreciated cause.
ECH is correct. Now let's convince that pesky Pope that this highly enlightened., Eastern ideal works well within the strictures of Catholicism as well.
:lulz:
Quote from: Nigel on May 24, 2011, 09:38:52 PM
Quote from: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on May 24, 2011, 09:35:09 PM
Quote from: Luna on May 24, 2011, 09:31:13 PM
Ah, but he's using the arguments provided in the book on those who DO believe, so...
Yeah, thats what I saw this as. Not to mention the comments on his rather odd ideas about being reincarnated as a computer, or that Sex during the day is bad, but Nuns slapping each others genitals for pleasure is OK... maybe some of his followers have no clue about some of his more controversial commentary.
OK, but I was responding to Lies' comment:
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
The book does no such thing, unless you buy into the idea that the current Dalai Lama is actually the same guy as previous ones who were creeps. Unless it's not in the chapter about the Dalai Lama, it had pretty much nothing bad to say about the current Dalai Lama at all.
How much did you read of it Nigel?
TL:DR heres a youtube clip summarising http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kstH-8jwa80
Oh, and thanks Cain for saving me the trouble of having to actually elaborate on the shiftiness of the Dalai-Lama.
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on May 24, 2011, 08:40:52 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
Most of the chapter on Ramakrishna seems to be about him being trans and/or gay. I fail to see the problem or why this would invalidate him as a spiritual leader.
I dunno who that is.
But I assume, if he preaches one thing and does another, that would invalidate his spiritual leaderness, and I don't know many spiritual leaders of prominence being ok with the gays.
Quote from: Lies on May 26, 2011, 06:20:09 AM
Quote from: Nigel on May 24, 2011, 09:38:52 PM
Quote from: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on May 24, 2011, 09:35:09 PM
Quote from: Luna on May 24, 2011, 09:31:13 PM
Ah, but he's using the arguments provided in the book on those who DO believe, so...
Yeah, thats what I saw this as. Not to mention the comments on his rather odd ideas about being reincarnated as a computer, or that Sex during the day is bad, but Nuns slapping each others genitals for pleasure is OK... maybe some of his followers have no clue about some of his more controversial commentary.
OK, but I was responding to Lies' comment:
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
The book does no such thing, unless you buy into the idea that the current Dalai Lama is actually the same guy as previous ones who were creeps. Unless it's not in the chapter about the Dalai Lama, it had pretty much nothing bad to say about the current Dalai Lama at all.
How much did you read of it Nigel?
TL:DR heres a youtube clip summarising http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kstH-8jwa80
I read the chapter about the Dalai Lama. So unless all the dirt about the Dalai Lama was in chapters that weren't about him, I'm confused about what you said. How much of it did
you read? What parts confirmed which thoughts you'd had about him being "off", in what ways?
I don't think you read it. Did you?
Yes,I did.
My feelings about him are long and winded, actually this is just one of many things that have confirmed what I always felt deep inside.
Lets just say, the warning bells went off around the time I realised if you have a question for his holiness, it must be screened and processed and be the "right" question before you get to hear his answer,.
I'm no fan of the Dalai Lama, but I am a fan of non-fiction books clearly citing reliable sources. This book doesn't seem to. When I started reading the chapter about the Dalai Lama I read this quote:
QuoteGiven this reincarnational lineage, then, we need hardly be surprised that the current Dalai Lama has himself voiced a thought or two concerning sexual matters. For, when questioned as to which common experiences he had most missed out on, the retirement-aged monk "pointed at his groin and laughed: 'I obviously missed this'" (Ellis, 2003).
and clicked the link in the source and its a broken link to The Mirror.
Then this one:
Quote"Ignoring the sacred customs of Lamas and monks in Tibet he began by bestowing care on his hair, then he took to drinking intoxicating liquors, to gambling, and at length no girl or married woman or good-looking person of either sex was safe from his unbridled licentiousness" (French, 2003; italics added).
the source is not a link, so we have nothing but "French, 2003" for a source. The fuck? Half a name and half a date? Sure I could google the quote and find out if this is a person by the name of French or the collective citizenry of France circa 2003, but meh. I'm not very educated or well versed in current academic standards so maybe this type of thing is acceptable, but as an average person reading a non-fiction book I expect the sources to be more specific and reliable before I'll pay any attention to the content and conclusions.
Quote from: Lies on May 26, 2011, 06:54:56 AM
Yes,I did.
My feelings about him are long and winded, actually this is just one of many things that have confirmed what I always felt deep inside.
Lets just say, the warning bells went off around the time I realised if you have a question for his holiness, it must be screened and processed and be the "right" question before you get to hear his answer,.
This has nothing to do with my feelings about the guy; I assume religious leaders are total shits. I'm just calling bullshit on what you said because the actual chapter on the Dalai Lama didn't really contain anything condemning of the current one. And the book doesn't look like anything I'd cite with confidence anyway... it's very tabloidesque. And, you didn't answer my questions.
Quote from: Nigel on May 26, 2011, 06:28:53 AM
I read the chapter about the Dalai Lama. So unless all the dirt about the Dalai Lama was in chapters that weren't about him, I'm confused about what you said. How much of it did you read? What parts confirmed which thoughts you'd had about him being "off", in what ways?
Quote from: Lies on May 26, 2011, 06:54:56 AM
My feelings about him are long and winded, actually this is just one of many things that have confirmed what I always felt deep inside.
Alarm bells should be going off, right about now.
Quote from: Aloe on May 26, 2011, 03:38:38 PM
the source is not a link, so we have nothing but "French, 2003" for a source. The fuck? Half a name and half a date? Sure I could google the quote and find out if this is a person by the name of French or the collective citizenry of France circa 2003, but meh. I'm not very educated or well versed in current academic standards so maybe this type of thing is acceptable, but as an average person reading a non-fiction book I expect the sources to be more specific and reliable before I'll pay any attention to the content and conclusions.
That form of citation is actually fairly common in academic writing. It should be covered in the bibliography...if there is one. If there isn't, then that is pretty useless, I agree.
Quote from: Cain on May 26, 2011, 05:29:07 PM
Quote from: Aloe on May 26, 2011, 03:38:38 PM
the source is not a link, so we have nothing but "French, 2003" for a source. The fuck? Half a name and half a date? Sure I could google the quote and find out if this is a person by the name of French or the collective citizenry of France circa 2003, but meh. I'm not very educated or well versed in current academic standards so maybe this type of thing is acceptable, but as an average person reading a non-fiction book I expect the sources to be more specific and reliable before I'll pay any attention to the content and conclusions.
That form of citation is actually fairly common in academic writing. It should be covered in the bibliography...if there is one. If there isn't, then that is pretty useless, I agree.
I was afraid there would be a simple explanation that I was missing. lol Thanks.
Looked in the bibliography, here's the source: French, Patrick (2003), Tibet, Tibet: A Personal History of a Lost Land (New York: Alfred A. Knopf).
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
What does it say about Thich Nhat Hahn?
Quote from: Lies on May 26, 2011, 06:24:56 AM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on May 24, 2011, 08:40:52 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
Most of the chapter on Ramakrishna seems to be about him being trans and/or gay. I fail to see the problem or why this would invalidate him as a spiritual leader.
I dunno who that is.
But I assume, if he preaches one thing and does another, that would invalidate his spiritual leaderness, and I don't know many spiritual leaders of prominence being ok with the gays.
He's the first chapter. It doesn't mention him preaching against homosexuality, I haven't heard about any Hindu spiritual leader doing so actually.
My heroes have always been cowboys.
Quote from: Charley Brown on May 26, 2011, 08:16:48 PM
My heroes have always been cowboys.
BIG GAY COWBOYS.
Anyway, who the hell follows a Lama? They're a beast of burden from Peru. Hardly Holy™ at all.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on May 26, 2011, 08:18:46 PM
Quote from: Charley Brown on May 26, 2011, 08:16:48 PM
My heroes have always been cowboys.
BIG GAY COWBOYS.
Anyway, who the hell follows a Lama? They're a beast of burden from Peru. Hardly Holy™ at all.
Roger wins the thread. :lulz:
But tasty. And their wool is quite excellent.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on May 26, 2011, 08:18:46 PM
Quote from: Charley Brown on May 26, 2011, 08:16:48 PM
My heroes have always been cowboys.
BIG GAY COWBOYS.
Anyway, who the hell follows a Lama? They're a beast of burden from Peru. Hardly Holy™ at all.
Maybe not, but they can spit some truly disgusting stuff with some decent accuracy, so I give 'em points for that.
Quote from: Luna on May 26, 2011, 08:21:21 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on May 26, 2011, 08:18:46 PM
Quote from: Charley Brown on May 26, 2011, 08:16:48 PM
My heroes have always been cowboys.
BIG GAY COWBOYS.
Anyway, who the hell follows a Lama? They're a beast of burden from Peru. Hardly Holy™ at all.
Maybe not, but they can spit some truly disgusting stuff with some decent accuracy, so I give 'em points for that.
Hell, some of the posters here can do that anally, with much more effect.
Quote from: Nigel on May 26, 2011, 04:02:42 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 26, 2011, 06:54:56 AM
Yes,I did.
My feelings about him are long and winded, actually this is just one of many things that have confirmed what I always felt deep inside.
Lets just say, the warning bells went off around the time I realised if you have a question for his holiness, it must be screened and processed and be the "right" question before you get to hear his answer,.
This has nothing to do with my feelings about the guy; I assume religious leaders are total shits. I'm just calling bullshit on what you said because the actual chapter on the Dalai Lama didn't really contain anything condemning of the current one. And the book doesn't look like anything I'd cite with confidence anyway... it's very tabloidesque. And, you didn't answer my questions.
Quote from: Nigel on May 26, 2011, 06:28:53 AM
I read the chapter about the Dalai Lama. So unless all the dirt about the Dalai Lama was in chapters that weren't about him, I'm confused about what you said. How much of it did you read? What parts confirmed which thoughts you'd had about him being "off", in what ways?
Sorry, I'll answer your questions Nigel:
1- I read it all, it's been a while since I've read it all, as I found this info a long time ago, it's only now where I decided to share it after getting into an e-argument about the dalai lama, so I admit, maybe there's stuff I'm just assuming is in there that probably isn't and that I'm thinking of different sources that also say stuff that have confirmed my suspicions of him (and pretty much any leader of a religious organisation).
Yeah, from the sounds of it, he's nowhere near as bad as the previous Lamas, but he ain't the enlightened saint that everyone makes him out to be.
I used to be a fan when I was in highschool. HE visited Australia at one point and I went with a group of other students to go see and meet him.
It bothered me that questions had to be pre-approved before he would answer them, and they were all questions which I thought were kinda... how to put it... not important I suppose.
Ever since then, I had suspicions he wasn't all he was cracked up to be.
Ever since then, I've found more and more sources suggesting he isn't the awesome guy that I once thought he was.
Better?
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on May 26, 2011, 04:36:49 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 26, 2011, 06:54:56 AM
My feelings about him are long and winded, actually this is just one of many things that have confirmed what I always felt deep inside.
Alarm bells should be going off, right about now.
What do you mean? I should have said, what I felt about him came about after meeting him, and walking away feeling somewhat disappointed.
Quote from: ϗ, M.S. on May 26, 2011, 05:52:50 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
What does it say about Thich Nhat Hahn?
Quote from: ϗ, M.S. on May 27, 2011, 01:20:36 AM
Quote from: ϗ, M.S. on May 26, 2011, 05:52:50 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
What does it say about Thich Nhat Hahn?
Sorry, nothing, as far as I know, but I haven't read the whole thing, but if the chapter pages are anything to go by, e's not mentioned.
Quote from: Lies on May 27, 2011, 01:22:20 AM
Quote from: ϗ, M.S. on May 27, 2011, 01:20:36 AM
Quote from: ϗ, M.S. on May 26, 2011, 05:52:50 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
What does it say about Thich Nhat Hahn?
Sorry, nothing, as far as I know, but I haven't read the whole thing, but if the chapter pages are anything to go by, e's not mentioned.
He's the most prominent member of Vietnamese Zen Buddhism and the founder of Engaged Buddhism, has written over 100 books, and holds meditation/peace retreats around the world. I didn't expect there would be anything dirty on him, but I was curious if the author might try.
Quote from: ϗ, M.S. on May 27, 2011, 01:34:04 AM
Quote from: Lies on May 27, 2011, 01:22:20 AM
Quote from: ϗ, M.S. on May 27, 2011, 01:20:36 AM
Quote from: ϗ, M.S. on May 26, 2011, 05:52:50 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 24, 2011, 06:26:32 AM
http://www.strippingthegurus.com/index.html
Great book which exposes pretty much every famous "guru" and is great fodder to use on devotees.
One of my favorites mentioned is the Dalai Llama. I've actually met the dude. I knew something seemed a bit "off" about him, and this book pretty much confirms stuff I've thought for a while.
Enjoy.
What does it say about Thich Nhat Hahn?
Sorry, nothing, as far as I know, but I haven't read the whole thing, but if the chapter pages are anything to go by, e's not mentioned.
He's the most prominent member of Vietnamese Zen Buddhism and the founder of Engaged Buddhism, has written over 100 books, and holds meditation/peace retreats around the world. I didn't expect there would be anything dirty on him, but I was curious if the author might try.
It doesn't mention much about Vietnamese Buddhism but it does mention Japanese zen buddhism.
If it's anything like that, there's plenty of dirt to be found.
But I've never heard of this person til you mentioned him, so I can't say much, other than, wherever there is organised religion, there's pretty much a guarantee of corruption somewhere in it, most of the time, at the very top.
Vietnamese Buddhism isn't, as far as I'm aware, anywhere near as militaristic and tied to state power as Japanese Zen Buddhism was. I assume it had some power, at least, but I know under some of the South Vietnamese generals in the Vietnam War it was brutally suppressed, often with minimal resistance from the Buddhists themselves. And I doubt the Communists in the North were very keen on it either.
Quote from: Lies on May 27, 2011, 12:30:31 AM
Quote from: Nigel on May 26, 2011, 04:02:42 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 26, 2011, 06:54:56 AM
Yes,I did.
My feelings about him are long and winded, actually this is just one of many things that have confirmed what I always felt deep inside.
Lets just say, the warning bells went off around the time I realised if you have a question for his holiness, it must be screened and processed and be the "right" question before you get to hear his answer,.
This has nothing to do with my feelings about the guy; I assume religious leaders are total shits. I'm just calling bullshit on what you said because the actual chapter on the Dalai Lama didn't really contain anything condemning of the current one. And the book doesn't look like anything I'd cite with confidence anyway... it's very tabloidesque. And, you didn't answer my questions.
Quote from: Nigel on May 26, 2011, 06:28:53 AM
I read the chapter about the Dalai Lama. So unless all the dirt about the Dalai Lama was in chapters that weren't about him, I'm confused about what you said. How much of it did you read? What parts confirmed which thoughts you'd had about him being "off", in what ways?
Sorry, I'll answer your questions Nigel:
1- I read it all, it's been a while since I've read it all, as I found this info a long time ago, it's only now where I decided to share it after getting into an e-argument about the dalai lama, so I admit, maybe there's stuff I'm just assuming is in there that probably isn't and that I'm thinking of different sources that also say stuff that have confirmed my suspicions of him (and pretty much any leader of a religious organisation).
Yeah, from the sounds of it, he's nowhere near as bad as the previous Lamas, but he ain't the enlightened saint that everyone makes him out to be.
I used to be a fan when I was in highschool. HE visited Australia at one point and I went with a group of other students to go see and meet him.
It bothered me that questions had to be pre-approved before he would answer them, and they were all questions which I thought were kinda... how to put it... not important I suppose.
Ever since then, I had suspicions he wasn't all he was cracked up to be.
Ever since then, I've found more and more sources suggesting he isn't the awesome guy that I once thought he was.
Better?
Oh.
I thought this thread was about the book you linked to.
Quote from: Nigel on May 27, 2011, 01:47:56 AM
Quote from: Lies on May 27, 2011, 12:30:31 AM
Quote from: Nigel on May 26, 2011, 04:02:42 PM
Quote from: Lies on May 26, 2011, 06:54:56 AM
Yes,I did.
My feelings about him are long and winded, actually this is just one of many things that have confirmed what I always felt deep inside.
Lets just say, the warning bells went off around the time I realised if you have a question for his holiness, it must be screened and processed and be the "right" question before you get to hear his answer,.
This has nothing to do with my feelings about the guy; I assume religious leaders are total shits. I'm just calling bullshit on what you said because the actual chapter on the Dalai Lama didn't really contain anything condemning of the current one. And the book doesn't look like anything I'd cite with confidence anyway... it's very tabloidesque. And, you didn't answer my questions.
Quote from: Nigel on May 26, 2011, 06:28:53 AM
I read the chapter about the Dalai Lama. So unless all the dirt about the Dalai Lama was in chapters that weren't about him, I'm confused about what you said. How much of it did you read? What parts confirmed which thoughts you'd had about him being "off", in what ways?
Sorry, I'll answer your questions Nigel:
1- I read it all, it's been a while since I've read it all, as I found this info a long time ago, it's only now where I decided to share it after getting into an e-argument about the dalai lama, so I admit, maybe there's stuff I'm just assuming is in there that probably isn't and that I'm thinking of different sources that also say stuff that have confirmed my suspicions of him (and pretty much any leader of a religious organisation).
Yeah, from the sounds of it, he's nowhere near as bad as the previous Lamas, but he ain't the enlightened saint that everyone makes him out to be.
I used to be a fan when I was in highschool. HE visited Australia at one point and I went with a group of other students to go see and meet him.
It bothered me that questions had to be pre-approved before he would answer them, and they were all questions which I thought were kinda... how to put it... not important I suppose.
Ever since then, I had suspicions he wasn't all he was cracked up to be.
Ever since then, I've found more and more sources suggesting he isn't the awesome guy that I once thought he was.
Better?
Oh.
I thought this thread was about the book you linked to.
Well it is but it's also to do with what I think of the dalai lama and other gurus, I just figured this book might be interesting to you guys. Sorry for the confusion.
Quote from: Cain on May 27, 2011, 01:47:01 AM
Vietnamese Buddhism isn't, as far as I'm aware, anywhere near as militaristic and tied to state power as Japanese Zen Buddhism was. I assume it had some power, at least, but I know under some of the South Vietnamese generals in the Vietnam War it was brutally suppressed, often with minimal resistance from the Buddhists themselves. And I doubt the Communists in the North were very keen on it either.
Yeah, this is the denomination that Thich Quang Duc came out of, and we all know what he did (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-immolation).
You never hear /anything/ bad about Nhat Hahn. You hear all sorts of things about the Dalai Lama, but TNH has a clean record as far as I can tell, which is either wonderful or suspicious.
Quote from: ϗ, M.S. on May 27, 2011, 02:26:31 AM
Quote from: Cain on May 27, 2011, 01:47:01 AM
Vietnamese Buddhism isn't, as far as I'm aware, anywhere near as militaristic and tied to state power as Japanese Zen Buddhism was. I assume it had some power, at least, but I know under some of the South Vietnamese generals in the Vietnam War it was brutally suppressed, often with minimal resistance from the Buddhists themselves. And I doubt the Communists in the North were very keen on it either.
Yeah, this is the denomination that Thich Quang Duc came out of, and we all know what he did (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-immolation).
You never hear /anything/ bad about Nhat Hahn. You hear all sorts of things about the Dalai Lama, but TNH has a clean record as far as I can tell, which is either wonderful or suspicious.
As far as "terrible" things go for vietnamese biddhists, they seem cleaner than a whistle, although I can find critique of their philosophies, corroption seems almost non-existant, as far as I can tell.
As you said, this strikes me as either wonderful or suspicious. Or wonderfully suspicious.
I only read the chapter on Krishnamurti since he's one I'm familiar with and...
meh.
I came away from his stuff with the idea that there wasn't going to be any particular set of words or some set path or some UNset path that you make up all on your own that's going to lead to The Big T Truth. He even says that you won't reach any kind of enlightenment through the words he says as your listening to them or afterward or ever.
He said something to the effect of "Truth comes like a breeze, you can open a window but that act in itself will not make the breeze come." For simple a metaphor I find it useful. He also talked quite a bit about "Grooved thinking" repeating patterns without considering alternative possibilities.
Most of the stuff about him being a hypocritical, evasive, self-entitled asshole has been available to anyone who bothers to look. Of course he was an asshole.
QuoteIn 1932, Krishnamurti and Rajagopal's wife began an affair which would last for more than twenty-five years. The woman, Rosalind, became pregnant on several occasions, suffering miscarriages and at least two covert/illegal abortions. The oddity of that relationship is not lessened by Jiddu's earlier regard for the same woman. For, both he and his brother believed that Rosalind was the reincarnation of their long-lost mother ... in spite of the fact that the latter had only died two years after Rosalind was born (Sloss, 2000).
Beyond the :vom: factor
QuoteConsequently, apologetic protests that Krishnamurti's behavior with Rosalind was "not dishonest/hypocritical," simply for him not having spent his entire life preaching the benefits of celibacy or marriage, ring hollow. On the contrary, if we are to believe Peat's report that Krishnamurti "had spoken to Bohm of the importance of celibacy," there absolutely was a contradiction between Krishnamurti's teachings and his life.
QuoteOn at least one occasion, Krishnamurti was likewise inadvertently overheard making unprovoked, uncomplimentary remarks about others ... in his bedroom, with the married Rosalind (Sloss, 2000).
Ok. He was a hypocrite. Well done.
So?
The entire point of his "teachings" after disbanding the Order of the Star was "You're never going to learn anything about Truth and Freedom that you don't learn yourself."
At least, that's what I got out of it.
QuoteHe once wrote to [Fritz Wilhelm] that he thought that his chest pains were a result of K's [i.e., Krishnamurti's] misbehaving towards him. "This problem with K is literally crushing me" (Peat, 1997).
Literally.
That sounds suspiciously like MIND CONTROL LAZORS.
Just judging from this chapter this book looks like it's targeted at people who firmly buy into this crap, that you NEED someone to show you the way, wholeheartedly. And those folks are rarely open to having their idols stripped of Godhood. I guess. I read J. Krishna's stuff, got the point where I realized it wasn't going to do me any good and moved on. None of his stuff appears to be very original, but useful in certain respects. Just like this book, as far as I can see.