[Note, I'm pretty sure there are a dozen threads of this sort floating around, so if need be, feel free to merge with the most appropriate one.]
So, I've been thinking about this off and on for some time. What is the purpose of Discordia? I know why I became a Discordian and why I started posting at PD, but I haven't really reflected on my motives for doing so. I'm not really sure what they are. I've been thinking about this for a couple of reasons. Firstly, I basically came here to collaborate with other Discordians on O:MF, but I've been unfortunately lagging in that department. And part of that is, that I've been wondering what the purpose of O:MF is. Without knowing what I'm trying to accomplish with a particular thing, I really don't have any perspective of where to go with a project that I'm starting or trying to help with, or what makes it specifically Discordian.
Example: I've seen a few things on Art of Trolling that could easily have been designed and put up by someone taking part in PosterGASM. So what sets us apart from IRL trolling? If something gets put up and someone takes a picture of it and puts it up there, that's not necessarily a bad thing. It gets more distribution that way. But is it really trolling? I get that many of us here are trolls, but there's more to what we do than that. So what is it? Why do we do what we do?
Is it for a laugh? Is it to make someone else laugh? Is it so that we can enlighten others receptive to Discordian ideas? Is it to keep ourselves from taking ourselves too seriously and thus protect ourselves as Discordians from being too grey? Is it to make the world a weirder place or call attention to the abundant weirdness that already exists? Are we trying to balance the illusions of order and disorder? Are we trying to tweak the Machine bit by bit, in order to create positive change or is it to keep ourselves sane while everything falls apart? Is it all of these, or a combo of some, or none?
I must admit that this thread was inspired by a sense of other posters of something missing from the forum. I must admit that I am missing the same thing, since that is part of the reason that I came here. I am grateful to have come here and made friends with the lot of you, and share in the exchange of ideas, the showing the fruits of each other's creativity and sharing in the process of creativity. But I am uncertain of my purpose in being a Discordian. I don't want it to just be some label I attach to myself because I have common philosophical view points with other Discordians. I want it to mean something more concrete to me.
I know that each of us has a different take on Discordia, and a different way of being a Discordian. I know some of us relish in the activity of it, others the ranting, others the writing, the womping, the sharing of ideas, or even just having someone like minded to talk to. These are all great things.
So my fellow PDers, why did you become Discordian, what do you think the purpose of Discordia is, and how do you incorporate it into your life? What are the pros and cons of your approach? What is the purpose of your approach? I'm hoping by getting your perspectives, I'll get a better handle on mine, and be better able to determine my motivation for O:MF, GASMs, and the like.
Disclaimer: This is not the beginning of a flounce. This is not an attempt to try and band Discordians together for a common goal. This is not a critique against other PDers about the level or content of their posts, what they do or don't do, nor is it a critique about how other PDers view Discordia, or the Goddess, or what they did to her when they found her. This is merely an attempt to figure out what approach is best for me in regards to it.
I came because it was a Discordian forum and the pd really connected with me. I wasn't going to join in but came on board to edit an Intermittens (and am pumped for the next one.)
My motivations have changed around a bit. At first I was just into the idea of collaborating with others, but truly I'm not a fantastic collaborator; I do my own thing too much; I wasnt sure what to add to Nessies at first and it moved too fast and eventually I just gave up.
Omf isn't my scene: I like to get out there with other people not just solo, and there's not a lot of collaborator round here.
Recently I'm more onto the ideas from activitism, my Cressing trip, chaos Marxism about the exploration of doing, and embracing action over asesthetic, and this forum works well as a place to unravel thoughts as I explore this. Also, weirdly you guys give great advice.
Also: to me o:mf is more "find the others" than "enlighten the unenlightened".
Nessies was awesome. I was hoping to jump in on that too, but I took too long trying to think of something too.
I like your take on OMF as find the others. I guess part of it is that I want to go out and do stuff. I like posting on PD, but I want to make some of the ideas happen in meatspace too. I'm lucky in that there are quite a few PDers within about an hour's journey from here, but I think that's also part of the reason why the idea of GASMs appeal to me. You don't really have to physically meet up with someone in order to work on one together. Or, that's my take on it at least.
I'll have to take a second look at people's recent threads (including yours). I've been guilty of skimming the past couple of months. I have a lot of spare time tomorrow morning, so I might do some catch up then.
In the meantime, I'm trying to think up some good rants. I have some ideas floating around in my head that I'm trying to solidify. The Honest Politician was the first to come out. The fact that I was tossing it around for about a week shows how unused to ranting I am. I'm hoping that by doing more of it, I'll get better at it, and come up with more ideas. Kinda like the more you practice guitar, the more likely you are to start fucking around on it and coming upon something that sounds pretty good.
Quote from: Placid Dingo on June 18, 2011, 04:29:28 AM
I wasnt sure what to add to Nessies at first and it moved too fast and eventually I just gave up.
Nessies isn't linear and is SUPPOSED to be inconsistent. You can write whatever you like, and just plunk it in.
Yeah, I will get onto that sometime.
Quote from: Placid Dingo on June 18, 2011, 04:29:28 AM
I came because it was a Discordian forum and the pd really connected with me. I wasn't going to join in but came on board to edit an Intermittens (and am pumped for the next one.)
My motivations have changed around a bit. At first I was just into the idea of collaborating with others, but truly I'm not a fantastic collaborator; I do my own thing too much; I wasnt sure what to add to Nessies at first and it moved too fast and eventually I just gave up.
Omf isn't my scene: I like to get out there with other people not just solo, and there's not a lot of collaborator round here.
Recently I'm more onto the ideas from activitism, my Cressing trip, chaos Marxism about the exploration of doing, and embracing action over asesthetic, and this forum works well as a place to unravel thoughts as I explore this. Also, weirdly you guys give great advice.
Two things.
1.) Write whatever Nessie stuff you want. Seriously. Find an angle and wedge something in there.
2.) Your Cressing stuff is awesome-sauce. It makes my brain go spinny-whir-thinky.
Thread cleaned, Twid.
The Doktor is IN.
Might've been Jean Francois Revel who said "There is no Socialism, only Evidence for Socialism".
Ditto Discordianism and Discord.
[edit: Actually I think he was paraphrasing someone else, fuck it.]
Quote from: Slyph on June 19, 2011, 11:17:41 AM
Might've been Jean Francois Revel who said "There is no Socialism, only Evidence for Socialism".
Ditto Discordianism and Discord.
[edit: Actually I think he was paraphrasing someone else, fuck it.]
So the movement/group/construct is only the product of the features that are built around or from it. Is that your kind of point here?
there is no motivation but what you find. discordianism is nothing. dont listen to anyone, even me. Find your own reason. A logical look at existence shows nothing matters. Do what you feel like. be good to others if thats what you want. or be an asshole. no maral difference honestly. Hust in the way other people percieve. Live life, do what the moment tells you, and even if the moment tells you to plan ahead, whatever. There are no right or wrong answers. listen to me, or whover strike you the best, or a mix. just kick it yourself. Id love for you to like what i say but i know i dont have the guaranteed solution. and i really believe only you can figure that out. Just keep kickin ass, cause if you found this forum you prp;;y do more than most, and do your own thing, however you see fit
Quote from: Placid Dingo on June 19, 2011, 11:34:36 AM
Quote from: Slyph on June 19, 2011, 11:17:41 AM
Might've been Jean Francois Revel who said "There is no Socialism, only Evidence for Socialism".
Ditto Discordianism and Discord.
[edit: Actually I think he was paraphrasing someone else, fuck it.]
So the movement/group/construct is only the product of the features that are built around or from it. Is that your kind of point here?
Exactly. I think it applies particularly well here, since Discordianism is in most cases something we don't think about outside of the immediacy of raids/boards. I could be wrong, but I don't think anyone's consciously living la vida discordia or anything or nothing... Discordianism begins and ends at Discordian deeds.
Things done in the name of the Discordian ideal (vexing people's 'eads right good and proper) constitute the whole of Discordianism.
Man I think I just vomited a little pineal.
I disagree with that. I think the philosophies of Discordianism can be woven into one's every day life and it is actually something I strive for. I don't go out and do a bunch of crazy jakes. I don't go on regular board raids. I don't sticker the town.
But, what I have done is taken some of the core ideals of Discordianism and made them part of my every day life. I've even been able to weave in some of the philosophies into my work, sans the jokes from the 50s and all of the pinealistic jargon.
I have extra motivation because I'm a parent of two kids. So it is very important to me to pass down "the art of playing games" to my kids. To teach them the dangers of becoming trapped in the mundane world. Sure, I'm not going to sit down, give them the PD, and overtly teach them Discordianism. But the ideals are the ideals.
In fact, I would go as far to say that I'm MORE Discordian in my every day life than I am on these boards.
Would you self-describe as a Discordian to someone who didn't know what the fuck you were talking about?
edit: Actually forget this, it's a stupid question.
Well, I'll answer anyway.
No, because I think with most average people the name would be a distraction.
Case in point. I have a "fnord" hat. Now, when everyone asks me what "fnord" is, I could launch into a brief conversation about Discordianism, etc., etc., but I'm usually asked in a situation where I don't really have the time to give it adequate justice. So I usually just say, "Uhh, it was a cool hat." and leave it at that.
Back in the Retail Hell days, when I was required to wear a tie, I had a "fnord" tie I would wear to work. This one time I had a customer who saw the tie and recounted to me how a couple of asshats had broken into their apartment and wrote "fnord" in Sharpie all over the place. So now, she was associating "fnord" with vandals.
My point being, is that rightly or wrongly, I think the jargon and jokes and symbolism of Discordianism CAN be a distraction from the philosophies that are wrapped with that stuff. I, personally, feel the core philosophies are much more important than the labels and superficial trappings.
So, no, I wouldn't' self-identify as a Discordian, but I am not shy about sharing my belief systems and philosophies.
But here's a question for you and everyone else, which would be the better, obviously very idealistic and unlikely, scenario?
A) A fuckton more people being aware of what Discordianism is, but not following it.
or
B) Following the core philosophies of Discordianism (TFY,S, "art of playing games", nonsense as salvation, etc.) but not knowing them as Discordianism?
I'd pick B seven days a week and twice on Fridays.
#A:
http://cramul.us/2011/01/why-i-put-up-posters/
#B:
http://www.principiadiscordia.com/forum/index.php?topic=29434.msg1059746#msg1059746
#C:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Situationist_International
#D:
(http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a95/discordman/forumspecific/something-awful-eye.gif)
Quote from: GeneralCunt on June 19, 2011, 12:59:26 PM
there is no motivation but what you find. discordianism is nothing. dont listen to anyone, even me. Find your own reason. A logical look at existence shows nothing matters. Do what you feel like. be good to others if thats what you want. or be an asshole. no maral difference honestly. Hust in the way other people percieve. Live life, do what the moment tells you, and even if the moment tells you to plan ahead, whatever. There are no right or wrong answers. listen to me, or whover strike you the best, or a mix. just kick it yourself. Id love for you to like what i say but i know i dont have the guaranteed solution. and i really believe only you can figure that out. Just keep kickin ass, cause if you found this forum you prp;;y do more than most, and do your own thing, however you see fit
Well, yes, that's what I'm doing here with this thread. Part of me figuring it out is hearing what others think about the whole thing, see what strikes a chord with me the most.
Thanks for those, Cram. I'll have to read up more on the Situationist International. I don't think that I've heard of them before.
They should be required reading for every Discordian. They basically went through Marxism and the avant-garde scene and came out the other side, and somehow found themselves in almost an identical place to Discordianism, but from a French political-cultural perspective.
Here's some more about nonsense, absurdism, and the revolution (http://www.principiadiscordia.com/forum/index.php?topic=20959.msg708388#msg708388)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spectacle_(Situationism)
Screaming Hysterical Nothingness (http://www.principiadiscordia.com/forum/index.php?topic=20233.msg680725#msg680725), an anecdote about screaming hysterical nothingness. The thread goes on to talk about absurdity and how it is the CURE.
"We live in a spectacular society, that is, our whole life is surrounded by an immense accumulation of spectacles. Things that were once directly lived are now lived by proxy. Once an experience is taken out of the real world it becomes a commodity. As a commodity the spectacular is developed to the detriment of the real. It becomes a substitute for experience." -Larry Law
I get the impression that this thread is going to lead me to a lot of reading :)
Thanks again, Cram.
I don't really have anything to add but wanted to say thanks for the links Cram, I hadn't heard of Situationist International either but am enjoying reading up on them.
The good thing about threads like these is for things like that. There's a lot of threads here, and it's a lot to wade through sometimes, and sometimes you do see a referenced post and think of it in a different way.
I also seem to have gotten my rant juices flowing again, since making this thread.