What the fuck is this shit? I was just looking around, and suddenly the military can drag us out of our houses and chuck us in jail on mere accusation, with no guarantee of a trial! This is fucking un-American as hell!1 We just gave money to BANKERS, who are now charging us interest on the loan that WE gave to THEM! GODDAMMIT! This is CRAP! If this was written as a novel, NOBODY WOULD FUCKING BUY IT, because who the hell could maintain that level of suspension of disbelief?
We can somehow afford a few wars that make no fucking sense, but they're cancelling AP classes in the few high schools that could EVER afford them? A SERIOUS PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE is proposing the re-illegalization of fucking BIRTH CONTROL?2 Regular citizens regularly argue that they don't have - and shouldn't have - the BASIC FUCKING HUMAN RIGHT OF PRIVACY?
Oh, yeah, and I'm told that CONSENTING ADULTS cannot marry each other, because it offends people who have no fucking stake in the matter? That people can be LEGALLY BLACK? That women can be investigated and then ARRESTED for HAVING A MISCARRIAGE?
JUST WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON, HERE?
It's a bunch of shit. It's some horrible joke. It's a troll...It HAS to be. How the fuck is ANYBODY taking this seriously? I'm not putting up with this shit. It's not Goddamn funny anymore3, and it's high time whoever is doing this FOUND A NEW BIT.
I FUCKING DEMAND A BETTER JOKE.
Or Kill Me. No, really.
1 I am told that this is nothing new for brown people.
2 See my sig.
3 HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW HAW
It's not just funny... it's fucking DYSTOPIAN COMEDY GOLD is what it is. Orwell couldn't have done better, because he wasn't writing comedy, is why.
Quote from: Nigel on January 07, 2012, 06:26:47 AM
It's not just funny... it's fucking DYSTOPIAN COMEDY GOLD is what it is. Orwell couldn't have done better, because he wasn't writing comedy, is why.
I laughed and laughed and laughed and while I was laughing, they were fucking me in my eye socket! HAW HAW!
Being that I feel merely intensely, bleakly disturbed instead of horrormirth at the State's state of affairs, I don't know what to say.
Nice bile duct usage, though.
SOYLENT GREEN IS...
oh god it's not funny anymore.
Quote from: Nigel on January 07, 2012, 06:44:16 AM
SOYLENT GREEN IS...
oh god it's not funny anymore.
But there's a way it CAN be made funny again.
Need a bit of time to figure it out. Probably by tomorrow.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 07, 2012, 06:46:23 AM
Quote from: Nigel on January 07, 2012, 06:44:16 AM
SOYLENT GREEN IS...
oh god it's not funny anymore.
But there's a way it CAN be made funny again.
Need a bit of time to figure it out. Probably by tomorrow.
Yeah, I wanna hear this. :lulz:
I think it's high time we stopped letting Warren Ellis write the future.
In seriousness though, I think we've hit upon their strategy: they're trying to make too many things go wrong at once. The indefinite "preventative" detention, the schools, the wars, the fucking roads, the banks, the healthcare... and things like gay rights and abortion sprinkled on top to get people's inner "Ook!" all in a tizzy.
Break people up into too many fronts, and then our modern, frazzled attention spans won't be able to stay Angry at any one thing long enough to hold our ground. Instead of squeezing one pressure point, they're jabbing as many as they can, as fast as they can.
Roger,
why do you hate America?
best wishes,
Belgium.
Maybe this makes me part of the problem, but...
I remember when I cared about some monstrous shit this country was doing 10 years ago. I tried to rally with a group of people also outraged but found none. I tried to educated people on the implications but no one cared. There was a moment in my life when I would have rebelled and happily gone to jail to see something change, but no one wanted to do anything. Now I see people outraged, and... well I just don't care anymore.
You could say that I just want to get back at everyone who didn't listen to me, but I don't think that is the case.
I don't think I am except from the problem either.
I think I could watch a meteor hit this planet and shrug. Instead Ill just sit back while everyone decides to implode.
This isn't a depression thing either. I am just going to do whatever it is I find fun for as long as that lasts. It feels good to not have kids in this country.
This thread has reminded me of an idea that has popped into my head more than once, but which I have never written down or explored.
I find myself in two minds, in a state of long-term cognitive dissonance.
On the one hand, I can see what this country is headed for, what it's screaming for. I know there's incredibly strange, troubled times ahead. However, I don't know what my place in this ever-shifting monstrosity of a world will be. There's lots of well-meaning advice out there, but it was meant for a different time.
On the other hand, I truck on with my vague life goals. I still act like I'm gonna get a degree, a career, a home, a family. I don't mean that I expect any of those things to come smoothly, or easily. But I do have preconceived notions of what I'm "supposed" to accomplish, and what is "supposed" to be in store for me.
I haven't really made significant changes to my behavior based on what I know or can intuit about events to come.
I don't really have a satisfying conclusion to the above thoughts. Maybe they don't even belong in this thread, but here they are.
Quote from: Penumbral on January 08, 2012, 03:19:25 AM
Maybe this makes me part of the problem, but...
I remember when I cared about some monstrous shit this country was doing 10 years ago. I tried to rally with a group of people also outraged but found none. I tried to educated people on the implications but no one cared. There was a moment in my life when I would have rebelled and happily gone to jail to see something change, but no one wanted to do anything. Now I see people outraged, and... well I just don't care anymore.
You could say that I just want to get back at everyone who didn't listen to me, but I don't think that is the case.
I don't think I am except from the problem either.
I think I could watch a meteor hit this planet and shrug. Instead Ill just sit back while everyone decides to implode.
This isn't a depression thing either. I am just going to do whatever it is I find fun for as long as that lasts. It feels good to not have kids in this country.
I find taking action with other dissidents to be some of the most fun I've have had.
But by all means, keep trying to convince yourself you don't care, and that there's somehow a need to choose between having a good time and standing up for what you know is right.
You're a coward. Everything you were fighting for 10 years ago is coming to a head, and instead of sacking up you're retreating with your tail between your legs. If shit would have culminated 10 years ago I bet you would have made lame excuses to puss out then too.
Good riddance, you spineless husk of a human being.
I'd like to forward this to the white house. (mostly for the shits and giggles of it)
Give me the OK and it will be done.
Squid,
Not fucking kidding.
Quote from: Net on January 08, 2012, 05:35:51 AM
You're a coward. Everything you were fighting for 10 years ago is coming to a head, and instead of sacking up you're retreating with your tail between your legs. If shit would have culminated 10 years ago I bet you would have made lame excuses to puss out then too.
Good riddance, you spineless husk of a human being.
:lulz:
See, the funny comes from all sides. Nothing matters and I am going to die. Even if I change things and become the father of modern modernism it won't matter tomorrow or in a hundred years. I would rather be an exclamation point in my own existence then be a footnote in the worlds.
I don't believe there are any absolutely good ideas out there. I think the world is obsessed with the apocalypse because that is the only thing we can all agree would be one step forward.
Fuck anyone who tells me "This thing is intrinsically wrong" or "This is the solution." It's all cycle and all I can and will do is exist in the peaks and dips that occur in my life.
For my information what would sacking up look like? Calling my congressman? Occupying something? Posting twitter opinions? Stapling essays to telephone poles? Getting teargassed for an ideal that will be skewed and watered down before it hits the masses?
I am not folding. I am not giving up on my life. I am simply resining any responsibility for what others do with theirs. Fuck yourself if you want to.
Quote from: Penumbral on January 08, 2012, 10:09:19 AM
Quote from: Net on January 08, 2012, 05:35:51 AM
You're a coward. Everything you were fighting for 10 years ago is coming to a head, and instead of sacking up you're retreating with your tail between your legs. If shit would have culminated 10 years ago I bet you would have made lame excuses to puss out then too.
Good riddance, you spineless husk of a human being.
:lulz:
See, the funny comes from all sides. Nothing matters and I am going to die.
It's not laughter if you're just going through the muscle movements you remember from the times you actually gave a fuck.
It's sneaky that way because emotional memory triggers can echo for a long time, but they will slowly fade if you have nothing to rekindle them with.
And when the last ember goes black, even the "funny" will suck. And you will either wither away, or you will "sack up" and slowly try and get the fire going again, all the while wishing you'd just kept it burning all along.
QuoteFor my information what would sacking up look like? Calling my congressman? Occupying something? Posting twitter opinions? Stapling essays to telephone poles? Getting teargassed for an ideal that will be skewed and watered down before it hits the masses?
It all starts with giving a fuck. Those things you just named, are only for you to shoot down, because you don't. You won't find anything until you do, either.
Your "fun", I believe they call it "False Slack". You do not escape that trap by giving as little of a fuck as possible. Nothing worth doing is ever easy.
Quote from: Sir Squid Diddimus on January 08, 2012, 10:00:09 AM
I'd like to forward this to the white house. (mostly for the shits and giggles of it)
Give me the OK and it will be done.
Squid,
Not fucking kidding.
Do it.
Quote from: Penumbral on January 08, 2012, 10:09:19 AM
Nothing matters and I am going to die. Even if I change things and become the father of modern modernism it won't matter tomorrow or in a hundred years.
Nihilism doesn't become you.
Quote from: Triple Zero on January 07, 2012, 10:38:12 PM
Roger,
why do you hate America?
best wishes,
Belgium.
I don't hate America.
I hate
Americans. Because I've never met one.
we all work on what we wish to work on
(those genuinely under coercion not included)
i happen to think that creating the res publica of a people, the establishment (or re-establishment, or restoration) of a country in the sense of a nation state is an outmoded enterprise with little merit
in order to find more timely and glorious work, it is expedient to review the situation that we find ourselves in first from a larger (global), then from a narrower (personal) perspective
none of what i will say is new
global perspective:
one earth, seven billion people
roughly one tenth of that number do not eat their fill every day of the week
at the same time, ten percent of the population dispose over eighty-five percent of all earthly wealth
within that number, the richest one percent control forty percent of the wealth
man does not live by bread alone
over half the population of the earth live in cities, though mostly not cities in the european sense
and well over half the population strive to realise, in their personal lives, the ideals of the welfare consumer society
lots of food, lots of channels, lots of clutter
estimating the size of the autonomous, adult population who hold their lives and their hands and thus purposefully form them is harder
after a small, highly subjective and far from representative opinion survey and a great deal of pondering i have concluded that such people occur in higher proportion in the third world (brutal existential uncertainty is a strong selection pressure at both the individual and the social levels)
the transitional margin between the autonomous and the slave/slaver group is quite wide and gradual along a number of distinct dimensions
globally, the proportion of autonomous, self-governing adults is somewhere between 0.1 percent and 10 percent
as an incorrigible optimist, i would wager around 1 percent
one in a hundred people
*
personal perspective:
i posit that only sovereign, adult people, who know their own lives and hold them in their hands in order to shape them are capable of authentic political action
i posit that in the present situation authentic political action is impossible without first letting go of all sorts of national or racial phantasmagories, imaginings, emotional tangles
i posit that today, authentic political action may be aimed at the following two targets (possibly among others, i am not making an exhaustive claim here):
firstly, moving fellow humans in the transitional stages between being robots and being people (or half-asleep, or what have you) towards sufficient levels of sovereignity
such actions include raising children, clarity of thinking and speech and the exemplary practice of authentic ways of being
secondly, the strengthening, supporting, mobilisation, vitalisation of the networks, the systems of interrelationships of autonomous people
this includes tribal enterprise, active community building and maintenance, trust-based barter trade and the promotion of communication and cooperation between small sovereign communities
thank you for your attention
Quote from: holist on January 08, 2012, 09:42:40 PM
i posit that only sovereign, adult people, who know their own lives and hold them in their hands in order to shape them are capable of authentic political action
What's "authentic political action"?
Because the political action that actually wields power is nothing like that at all.
I like what he has to say, I think. But the implementation...
Quote from: Nigel on January 09, 2012, 02:07:39 AM
I like what he has to say, I think. But the implementation...
I want to know what he means by "authentic".
Because people with nukes and tanks and troops are authentic as hell. Ask any Iraqi what's real, he or she will tell you.
...we have been waking people up for how many years now? In the last 20 years I have gone from seeing the spark of revolution to the spark of acceptance.
Quote from: Nigel on January 09, 2012, 02:10:01 AM
...we have been waking people up for how many years now? In the last 20 years I have gone from seeing the spark of revolution to the spark of acceptance.
What?
I'm just trying to define terms here. I'm not saying any particular situation is okay, or even tolerable.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 09, 2012, 02:12:36 AM
I'm just trying to define terms here. I'm not saying any particular situation is okay, or even tolerable.
too right
constant vigilance is the least we expect
given this:
"authentic
mid-14c., "authoritative," from O.Fr. autentique (13c., Mod.Fr. authentique) "authentic; canonical," and directly from M.L. authenticus, from Gk. authentikos "original, genuine, principal," from authentes "one acting on one's own authority," from autos "self" (see auto-) + hentes "doer, being," from PIE *sene- "to accomplish, achieve." Sense of "entitled to acceptance as factual" is first recorded mid-14c. Traditionally (at least since the 18c.), authentic implies that the contents of the thing in question correspond to the facts and are not fictitious; genuine implies that the reputed author is the real one; though this distinction is not etymological and is not always now recognized."
i have the old meaning in mind
autonomous, 'self-ruled' is also a good word i would use in this context
action resulting from a mature and workable understanding of what being human (or ursid) in this world now entails (i'm not saying there aren't at least several such world-views, only that there are many very popular and widely adopted ones that are not in that category... at all)
i think i will proceed with some examples:
i would say that finding a farmer nearby to support by buying my vegetables and as much of my food from after ascertaining that said farmer has a halfway decent relationship with the land and the animals they exploit is eminently sensible and authentic and i would say political
chattering and possibly getting all het up about which candidate is not, in fact, voting in the so-called democracies, while a time-honoured ritual, is a bit of an empty gesture these days in most places (iceland being a noteable exception, perhaps, from what i hear)
in highly disfunctional countries such as this one, which is being habitually abusive with its population, spreading anonymous information about how to get away with paying as little in the way of taxes as possible is political and authentic
not buying into a global pension system that is obviously a major perpetrator of our troubles and is going to fold as the population as a whole ages is political and authentic
teaching children from an early age about the nature of nation-states and the methods of self-adjustment and careful consideration is political and authentic
that sort of thing
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 08, 2012, 12:48:34 PM
Quote from: Sir Squid Diddimus on January 08, 2012, 10:00:09 AM
I'd like to forward this to the white house. (mostly for the shits and giggles of it)
Give me the OK and it will be done.
Squid,
Not fucking kidding.
Do it.
Tomorrow.... it happens.
Quote from: Penumbral on January 08, 2012, 10:09:19 AM
Fuck anyone who tells me "This thing is intrinsically wrong" or "This is the solution." It's all cycle and all I can and will do is exist in the peaks and dips that occur in my life.
What does this rationale enable you to perpetrate?
Quote from: holist on January 09, 2012, 06:00:37 AM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 09, 2012, 02:12:36 AM
I'm just trying to define terms here. I'm not saying any particular situation is okay, or even tolerable.
too right
constant vigilance is the least we expect
given this:
"authentic
mid-14c., "authoritative," from O.Fr. autentique (13c., Mod.Fr. authentique) "authentic; canonical," and directly from M.L. authenticus, from Gk. authentikos "original, genuine, principal," from authentes "one acting on one's own authority," from autos "self" (see auto-) + hentes "doer, being," from PIE *sene- "to accomplish, achieve." Sense of "entitled to acceptance as factual" is first recorded mid-14c. Traditionally (at least since the 18c.), authentic implies that the contents of the thing in question correspond to the facts and are not fictitious; genuine implies that the reputed author is the real one; though this distinction is not etymological and is not always now recognized."
i have the old meaning in mind
autonomous, 'self-ruled' is also a good word i would use in this context
action resulting from a mature and workable understanding of what being human (or ursid) in this world now entails (i'm not saying there aren't at least several such world-views, only that there are many very popular and widely adopted ones that are not in that category... at all)
i think i will proceed with some examples:
i would say that finding a farmer nearby to support by buying my vegetables and as much of my food from after ascertaining that said farmer has a halfway decent relationship with the land and the animals they exploit is eminently sensible and authentic and i would say political
chattering and possibly getting all het up about which candidate is not, in fact, voting in the so-called democracies, while a time-honoured ritual, is a bit of an empty gesture these days in most places (iceland being a noteable exception, perhaps, from what i hear)
in highly disfunctional countries such as this one, which is being habitually abusive with its population, spreading anonymous information about how to get away with paying as little in the way of taxes as possible is political and authentic
not buying into a global pension system that is obviously a major perpetrator of our troubles and is going to fold as the population as a whole ages is political and authentic
teaching children from an early age about the nature of nation-states and the methods of self-adjustment and careful consideration is political and authentic
that sort of thing
Okay, I can buy that.
Quote from: Net on January 09, 2012, 08:59:00 AM
Quote from: Penumbral on January 08, 2012, 10:09:19 AM
Fuck anyone who tells me "This thing is intrinsically wrong" or "This is the solution." It's all cycle and all I can and will do is exist in the peaks and dips that occur in my life.
What does this rationale enable you to perpetrate?
Well for starters I live without cognitive dissidence. I am not afraid to take chances because I am not afraid of failure.
I don't have passion or faith. I don't believe strongly in any cause.
People are idiots and asking them to fix anything is astounding. According to a number of polls anywhere from a third to more than half the country believes in ghosts. Source1 (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/10/29/opinion/polls/main994766.shtml) Source2 (http://www.rickross.com/reference/general/general533.html) And 100% of the country belives in at least one stupid thing.
People aren't the only idiots though. I am an idiot asking me to fix anything is irresponsible of you. My ideals are sad examples of half thought out ideas mostly based on the views of writers who killed themselves and comedians who drink daily.
Yes, I think the banking system is fucked up, and the financial market is a mess. I have thought those two things were a mess my entire life and have quietly boycotted and form of credit or loan my whole life. I haven't had a bank account for 6 years. (Counter point: if everyone treated the banking system as I did the country and technology as a whole would be beyond years behind. Only the rich would go to college and I wouldn't have had a house to grow up in.) I don't have all the information or even enough to stand on a street corner. If I wanted to get educated (which I don't) all the hyperbole in media and internet makes even the most unbiased sources based on bad information.
I don't want to go to prison without trial... but a lot of people in gitmo are terrorists and no court system would be able to hold them. While I want to say even one mistake is enough to throw out the system I understand where the system comes from.
Its all a big ball of mess and at the end off the day what I am enabled to perpetrate is just sitting down with a ciggerette and doing whatever fucking insignificant thing it is I find joy in without trying to solve other peoples problems. Its stess about something out of my control.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 08, 2012, 12:49:47 PM
Quote from: Penumbral on January 08, 2012, 10:09:19 AM
Nothing matters and I am going to die. Even if I change things and become the father of modern modernism it won't matter tomorrow or in a hundred years.
Nihilism doesn't become you.
I fucking hate it when people say that shit. People get mad at nihilism for some knee jerk fear that they will lose their grasp on reality. I have literally heard this so many times in person as well as movies and literature: It doesn't matter what you believe just believe in it. HORSESHIT! That's what suicide cults do. That's what people who kill abortion doctors do. That's what the Mormons did when they fought prop 8.
The Nihilist is the least harmful person to Your Cause
tm
Quote from: Penumbral on January 09, 2012, 06:55:32 PM
I don't have passion or faith. I don't believe strongly in any cause.
I'm sorry to hear that. I hope you get better.
JUST SAY IT: THE LIBERTARIANS WERE RIGHT.
For my next trick: Chemtrails are a consyruppy for the Farm Bill and Monsanto corp is poisoning the water with something called "fluoride."
Who all wants to chip in on a defunct weapons silo in NM?
What the hell?
Okay, thread's all yours.
I liked the version in my head better where you argued with me.
Quote from: navkat on January 09, 2012, 07:38:36 PM
I liked the version in my head better where you argued with me.
Well, you've already stated that you don't want to hear me jabber, so I figured it was best just to move on.
I stated that I wanted you to shut up.
But don't you go changin a thing for me, schweethaht."
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 09, 2012, 06:59:11 PM
Quote from: Penumbral on January 09, 2012, 06:55:32 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 08, 2012, 12:49:47 PM
Nihilism doesn't become you.
I fucking hate it when people say that shit.
Then what the hell kind of nihilist ARE you?
The Dude: Well, they finally did it. They killed my fucking car.
Nihilist: Ve vant ze money, Lebowski.
Nihilist #2: Ja, uzzervize ve kill ze girl.
Nihilist #3: Ja, it seems you have forgotten our little deal, Lebowski.
The Dude: You don't HAVE the fucking girl, dipshits! We know you never did!
[the Nihilists, stunned, confer amongst themselves in German]
Donny: Are these the Nazis, Walter?
Walter Sobchak: No, Donny, these men are nihilists, there's nothing to be afraid of.
Nihilist: Ve don't care. Ve still vant ze money, Lebowski, or ve fuck you up.
Walter Sobchak: Fuck you. Fuck the three of you.
The Dude: Hey, cool it Walter.
Walter Sobchak: No, without a hostage, there is no ransom. That's what ransom is. Those are the fucking rules.
Nihilist #2: His girlfriend gave up her toe!
Nihilist #3: She though we'd be getting million dollars!
Nihilist #2: Iss not fair!
Walter Sobchak: Fair! WHO'S THE FUCKING NIHILIST HERE!
Your message has been sent to the White House.
Expect absolutely nothing to happen. :lulz:
Quote from: navkat on January 09, 2012, 07:50:51 PM
I stated that I wanted you to shut up.
But don't you go changin a thing for me, schweethaht."
BUT I CAINT
For what it's worth, I'm in pretty much exactly the same boat as Penumbral. The only difference between Penumbral and I is that I'm not about to even begin to pretend that I'm having fun with it.
I'd like to make a difference, but every way seems like a dead end. It's like the bumper sticker says: "If you stand for anything, you'll fall for something."
I don't want to give up, but I don't see any other options. I feel like each and every action amounts to banging my head on a wall. This isn't Slack. But what is?
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 09, 2012, 06:59:11 PM
Quote from: Penumbral on January 09, 2012, 06:55:32 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 08, 2012, 12:49:47 PM
Nihilism doesn't become you.
I fucking hate it when people say that shit.
Then what the hell kind of nihilist ARE you?
I never claimed to be a nihilist. You called me that. I just think it is dumb to look down on nihilists for not believing in anything when it seems like only people who believe in things are causing the problems.
Quote from: Penumbral on January 10, 2012, 02:19:36 AM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 09, 2012, 06:59:11 PM
Quote from: Penumbral on January 09, 2012, 06:55:32 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 08, 2012, 12:49:47 PM
Nihilism doesn't become you.
I fucking hate it when people say that shit.
Then what the hell kind of nihilist ARE you?
I never claimed to be a nihilist. You called me that. I just think it is dumb to look down on nihilists for not believing in anything when it seems like only people who believe in things are causing the problems.
Because the fuckers that don't believe in anything stand aside.
Quote from: Uncle Wallified on January 10, 2012, 12:28:00 AM
For what it's worth, I'm in pretty much exactly the same boat as Penumbral. The only difference between Penumbral and I is that I'm not about to even begin to pretend that I'm having fun with it.
I'd like to make a difference, but every way seems like a dead end. It's like the bumper sticker says: "If you stand for anything, you'll fall for something."
I don't want to give up, but I don't see any other options. I feel like each and every action amounts to banging my head on a wall. This isn't Slack. But what is?
For whom?
Quote from: holist on January 08, 2012, 09:42:40 PM
over half the population of the earth live in cities, though mostly not cities in the european sense
I don't understand this. What does it mean? What is a "city in the European sense"?
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 10, 2012, 02:43:46 AM
Quote from: Uncle Wallified on January 10, 2012, 12:28:00 AM
For what it's worth, I'm in pretty much exactly the same boat as Penumbral. The only difference between Penumbral and I is that I'm not about to even begin to pretend that I'm having fun with it.
I'd like to make a difference, but every way seems like a dead end. It's like the bumper sticker says: "If you stand for anything, you'll fall for something."
I don't want to give up, but I don't see any other options. I feel like each and every action amounts to banging my head on a wall. This isn't Slack. But what is?
For whom?
I dunno. I think I've mostly just been letting some things get under my skin that I shouldn't have been. I'll figure it out for myself.
It's been bugging me, though, that for as long as I can remember I've only ever been able to take things seriously. Obviously, this isn't a trait that I'm fond of. Otherwise, I wouldn't be hanging around this forum. I think I have a lot of personal angst rooted in that, and it's been dragging me down for far too long.
I'll leave it at that. A support group this is not, nor should it be. I don't intend to infect anyone with my particular brand of negativism.
Quote from: Nigel on January 10, 2012, 03:10:37 AM
Quote from: holist on January 08, 2012, 09:42:40 PM
over half the population of the earth live in cities, though mostly not cities in the european sense
I don't understand this. What does it mean? What is a "city in the European sense"?
well spotted, the single most dangling end of a string in there
you see the piece was recycled from my blog, sans the rather long analysis of the hungarian situation in particular
and when i translated it, even though i saw it wasn't particularly connected to anything, i decided to leave it in, because i think this factette is somehow strangely relevant to the present-day human predicament
it just so happens, as of a few years ago, city-dwellers now outnumber country-folk
only, when musing about the implications, it is important to keep in mind that say the average of those cities is certainly closer to Xiamen, Mexico City or Kairo than New York, London or Berlin - no sanitation, no organised, clean public transport, no stifling regulations
networks, though, digital networks!
where that gets us, i'm not quite sure
Quote from: holist on January 10, 2012, 04:42:52 AM
Quote from: Nigel on January 10, 2012, 03:10:37 AM
Quote from: holist on January 08, 2012, 09:42:40 PM
over half the population of the earth live in cities, though mostly not cities in the european sense
I don't understand this. What does it mean? What is a "city in the European sense"?
well spotted, the single most dangling end of a string in there
you see the piece was recycled from my blog, sans the rather long analysis of the hungarian situation in particular
and when i translated it, even though i saw it wasn't particularly connected to anything, i decided to leave it in, because i think this factette is somehow strangely relevant to the present-day human predicament
it just so happens, as of a few years ago, city-dwellers now outnumber country-folk
only, when musing about the implications, it is important to keep in mind that say the average of those cities is certainly closer to Xiamen, Mexico City or Kairo than New York, London or Berlin - no sanitation, no organised, clean public transport, no stifling regulations
networks, though, digital networks!
where that gets us, i'm not quite sure
I suspect you may be making some incorrect assumptions about cities in developing nations.
Xiamen:
(http://images.beijing2008.cn/20080506/Img214342760.jpg)
Mexico City:
(http://www.traveldestinationinfo.com/mexicocity/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/Mexico-City-1.jpg)
Kairo:
(http://tekstovi-pesama.com/g_img/0/190610/kairo-5.jpg)
They may also have rampant poverty and sprawling slums, but that has nothing to do the "European sense of city", as London has historically shown us. Those all look quite like cities in anyone's sense, especially Xiamen.
I had a feeling I knew what you were going to reference, particularly with regard to cities in China, as it seems most Westerners assume that Chinese cities are basically collections of thatched huts.
In China, the standard of living is much higher in the cities than it is in the countryside, BTW.
Quote from: Nigel on January 10, 2012, 06:12:06 AM
They may also have rampant poverty and sprawling slums, but that has nothing to do the "European sense of city", as London has historically shown us. Those all look quite like cities in anyone's sense, especially Xiamen.
I had a feeling I knew what you were going to reference, particularly with regard to cities in China, as it seems most Westerners assume that Chinese cities are basically collections of thatched huts.
In China, the standard of living is much higher in the cities than it is in the countryside, BTW.
i don't get it, but if it pleases you, i stand corrected
i may even have picked the wrong cities and not given it sufficient thought
(i picked Cairo because i spent 5 weeks there hanging out and believe me it is not like a western city in a great number of respects, despite the fact that the central part has a lot of luxury apartments,
i picked Xiamen because i recently finished REAMDE ,
and i picked Mexico City because it occurred to me)
i simply wanted to say that although over 3.5 billion people are city dwellers, the majority have an experience of living in a city that is quite different to the cities of the west
of course there is one essential thing that connects practically all city-dwellers: high population density, people all around, in many if not most cities with a wild plurality of cultures within walking range
Well yeah, different cultures, different median incomes, different standards of living... but that's not what you said. Defend what you said, not what you wish you'd said. Or, be a biped and admit you were wrong.
Quote from: Nigel on January 10, 2012, 08:07:53 AM
Well yeah, different cultures, different median incomes, different standards of living... but that's not what you said. Defend what you said, not what you wish you'd said. Or, be a biped and admit you were wrong.
quadru, actually
this is what i said:
"only, when musing about the implications, it is important to keep in mind that say the average of those cities is certainly closer to Xiamen, Mexico City or Kairo than New York, London or Berlin - no sanitation, no organised, clean public transport, no stifling regulations"
i was wrong, and failed to express myself clearly, for which i apologise
what i meant to say was that the average city dweller, globally speaking, does not have access to reliable sanitation or institutionalised public transport, sewerage in the European sense, his/her life is much less constrained by social organisation/regulations than in European cities
i am truly sorry but suspect you are irate with me due to homeopathy
Quote from: holist on January 10, 2012, 11:28:25 AM
i am truly sorry but suspect you are irate with me due to homeopathy
Toldja, Nigel. :lulz:
Quote from: navkat on January 10, 2012, 02:38:21 PM
Quote from: Demolition_Squid on January 10, 2012, 02:32:02 PM
Quote from: Waffle Iron on January 10, 2012, 02:30:47 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 10, 2012, 01:55:28 PM
Quote from: holist on January 10, 2012, 11:28:25 AM
i am truly sorry but suspect you are irate with me due to homeopathy
Toldja, Nigel. :lulz:
DUE TO HOMEOPATHY?
We need to be careful. We don't want to be judged homeophobic.
Came here to say this.
Also: Homeopathic Personality Disorder.
Homeo Erectus?
You guys are being really unfair just because you don't understand something that holist can't explain.
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on January 10, 2012, 02:40:12 PM
You guys are being really unfair just because you don't understand something that holist can't explain.
Frankly, I don't give a fuck about homeopathy. I just think he's being a dick.
Everyone gets Nigeled here, even Nigel. The difference between a primate and a human is that the human acknowledges that he was wrong. The primate is afraid that if he admits being wrong, he loses any chance of being an alpha, and won't get to breed.
Monkey head-wiring is funny.
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 10, 2012, 02:53:56 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on January 10, 2012, 02:40:12 PM
You guys are being really unfair just because you don't understand something that holist can't explain.
Frankly, I don't give a fuck about homeopathy. I just think he's being a dick.
Everyone gets Nigeled here, even Nigel. The difference between a primate and a human is that the human acknowledges that he was wrong. The primate is afraid that if he admits being wrong, he loses any chance of being an alpha, and won't get to breed.
Monkey head-wiring is funny.
I'm with you. And for the record, my tongue was jammed so far into my cheek that I almost bit it off when I sneezed.
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on January 10, 2012, 04:57:40 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on January 10, 2012, 02:53:56 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on January 10, 2012, 02:40:12 PM
You guys are being really unfair just because you don't understand something that holist can't explain.
Frankly, I don't give a fuck about homeopathy. I just think he's being a dick.
Everyone gets Nigeled here, even Nigel. The difference between a primate and a human is that the human acknowledges that he was wrong. The primate is afraid that if he admits being wrong, he loses any chance of being an alpha, and won't get to breed.
Monkey head-wiring is funny.
I'm with you. And for the record, my tongue was jammed so far into my cheek that I almost bit it off when I sneezed.
Just another sarcasm-related injury for the books. Just another laughing man turned into a statistic by his own sinuses. Someone should do something. I mean, you have OSHA clamping down on irresponsible crane use, and the FDA clamping down on dangerous "bulk up" supplements, but nobody does ANYTHING about people laughing until their spleen shoots out their ass.
It's just one more example of the failure of government to regulate responsibly.
VOTE RON PAUL.
Quote from: Triple Zero on January 08, 2012, 11:14:46 AM
It's not laughter if you're just going through the muscle movements you remember from the times you actually gave a fuck.
NEWSFEED?
I can hardly remember I wrote that, and reading the context I can hardly believe it was me. Not that I disagree, the contrary. I just thought I'd remember writing that because it's something that I myself need to be told sometimes. Thank you, past-tripzip :) (Don't worry about it, future-zero! ;-))
So how'd Penumbral end up? Is he still here?
Quote from: Triple Zero on August 12, 2013, 09:48:48 PM
I can hardly remember I wrote that, and reading the context I can hardly believe it was me. Not that I disagree, the contrary. I just thought I'd remember writing that because it's something that I myself need to be told sometimes. Thank you, past-tripzip :) (Don't worry about it, future-zero! ;-))
So how'd Penumbral end up? Is he still here?
Naw, he wanders in and out about once every 6 months or so.
And you get good advice from your past self. NEVER listen to your future self. He's the bastard that's going to get you in trouble, sooner or later.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 12, 2013, 09:21:04 PM
Quote from: Triple Zero on January 08, 2012, 11:14:46 AM
It's not laughter if you're just going through the muscle movements you remember from the times you actually gave a fuck.
NEWSFEED?
Yes.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 12, 2013, 09:50:32 PMAnd you get good advice from your past self. NEVER listen to your future self. He's the bastard that's going to get you in trouble, sooner or later.
Shit, I wouldn't want to be that guy! [/homer]
(D'OH!)