Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 01:24:51 AM
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on July 30, 2012, 12:30:02 AM
Metal has expanded quite a bit over the past four decades. Certainly there is a good portion of it that has been informed by punk, but there is also a good chunk of it that I would posit has little to know lineage involving punk. I'm thinking of the symphonic, power metal strains of metal that are more rooted in classical masters like Wagner. Same with some of the more symphonic strains of black metal.
As far as the Satan angle. Black metal certainly but there has been Satanism in other forms of Metal, including the Elvis-Metal of Danzig, who obviously was very influenced by punk given his tenure in prior punk bands. There are some pretty Satanic death metal bands too, Deicide being the first that comes to mind.
I forgot about Danzig. But, the point that Waffles and myself are getting at is that while there are satanic Death Metallers, and other types of Metallers, it's not inherently Satanic. A lot just kinda dabble with the image for a song here and there, but otherwise don't bother. I mean, hell, Iron Maiden wrote a song about the number 666 and Nicko is a born-again Christian.
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 30, 2012, 01:20:17 AM
Quote from: Triple Zero on July 29, 2012, 09:40:13 PM
Well, I wanted to know which kind of metal was the satanic one and Wikipedia said it was Death Metal, and it's really not the point but now I do wonder which one *is* it that has all the satanic lyrics and such, then?
King Diamond was supposed to be a practicing Satanist but I always just LOL'ed at his shit. "No Presents For Christmas"? :lol:
Slayer's got a lot of hell-and-the-devil stuff.
I forgot about King Diamond. A friend of mine was into him and tried to get me to listen to some of his stuff. The falsetto shrieking made me want to punch him through the headphones.
Also, I'm going to start up a new thread, so as not to spag up the punk with metal. I'mma quote this as the OP.
Also, Trip, you can tell the difference between a black metaller and a death metaller by the following:
The death metaller wears jeans, t-shirt, and long hair. Music is more focused on speed and technical prowess. Vocal style is growling.
The black metaller looks like a bastard child of KISS and some sort of cheesy group of warlords out of a sword-and-sandal tv show. They also take pictures of themselves with implausible weaponry in the woods, or performing ceremonies in basements in Oslo. ETA: Music is more focused on atmospherics. Music is focused on atmospherics, though black metal is some of the fastest metal I've heard. Music theory is thrown out the window to a degree intentionally, to make it more evil sounding (for example, a chord progression including E minor, G minor, A minor and C minor. Also black metallers never play major chords except when they can make them sound grim). Vocal style is as raspy as death metal, but more projected and higher pitch. Basically gravelly shrieking.
Pop quiz: Which one is which?
(http://www.earache.com/bands/carcass/news_archive/carcass/Carcass03.jpg)
(http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/12300000/Black-Metal-Bands-black-metal-12354393-477-331.jpg)
:lulz:
I did actually enjoy reading Lords of Chaos, which did not neglect Heavy Metal's blues origins (indeed, it declared Robert Johnson to be the grandfather of Metal- it pointed out the irony that Black Metal, which can have Nazi sympathy depending on the band, only exists because of a black dude). Heavy Metal and Rock and Roll are actually siblings, not an evolution. Black Sabbath started out as a Blues band that wanted to scare people. Seriously, listen to the first Black Sabbath album and tell me that it's nothing more than heavy, spooky Blues. It doesn't sound like the Rock and Roll of the time. Like, say this song here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=304UPVcAkso).
Now, the history of Metal subgenres is interesting too, and can be traced back to the band Venom who inadvertently created 4 subgenres in one sentence during an interview. But it's all Metal. Not Heavy Metal. Just Metal. Heavy Metal is now a subgenre of Metal.
So let us start with this Robert Johnson character, shall we?
He's and interesting fellow.
He's basically the founder of the Forever 27 club. He was a bluesman. He was a shitty guitarist until he disappeared for a while and came back a master.
Now, at the time, there was this expression in music among black Americans- selling your soul to the Devil. It meant that you played secular music instead of doing Gospel. Except, Son House, who knew Robert Johnson when he was a shitty guitarist, actually believed that RoJo made a literal pact with the Devil. And indeed, RoJo's lyrics are fairly Satanic in content. When I read Lords of Chaos, it was the first I had heard of Robert Johnson. Well, I was a goddamn Metalhead and I wanted to know my lineage (Note also, this guy apparently inspired English motherfuckers everywhere during the period of the 1950s-1960s. This is how Rock and Metal are siblings.) so I was going to buy his shit. Well lo and behold. I was already familiar with him and didn't even fucking know it (listening to the intros of both are sufficient, but I recommend listening to all of both).
The Sun Is Going Down, by the Tea Party (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7S3L-UHgvA)
http://Me and the Devil Blues, by Robert Johnson (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MCHI23FTP8)
Now Tea Party are obviously not Metal, but it goes to show how directly influential this dude who died in the 1930s was on music in the 1990s. Not just the Tea Party, but also Zep, the Stones, Clapton, a bunch of others. Now, I'm not tracing all of the origins of Metal to RoJo, but his influence is undeniable. And the more you listen to old Metal, the more you realize that it really is just Heavy Blues that lost control of the wheel and went in a very odd direction.
*Modified because I hit pic instead of link button for the second link
I wouldn't say Johnson was Satanic,any more than Bon Scott was for all those hell and the devil lyrics, which were actually only referring to fighting, fucking, life on the road and getting drunk. :lol: A lot of Johnson's lyrics just talked about good old American hoodoo, same as a lot of other blues artists of that era. Black cat bones, mojo hands...here's one about a nation sack (you might not want to show Villager. :lol: )
http://www.luckymojo.com/nationsack.html
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 01:40:10 AM
Pop quiz: Which one is which?
(http://www.earache.com/bands/carcass/news_archive/carcass/Carcass03.jpg)
(http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/12300000/Black-Metal-Bands-black-metal-12354393-477-331.jpg)
:lulz:
I see Carcass and, Red X?
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 01:33:23 AM
Also, Trip, you can tell the difference between a black metaller and a death metaller by the following:
The death metaller wears jeans, t-shirt, and long hair. Music is more focused on speed and technical prowess. Vocal style is growling.
The black metaller looks like a bastard child of KISS and some sort of cheesy group of warlords out of a sword-and-sandal tv show. They also take pictures of themselves with implausible weaponry in the woods, or performing ceremonies in basements in Oslo. ETA: Music is more focused on atmospherics. Music is focused on atmospherics, though black metal is some of the fastest metal I've heard. Music theory is thrown out the window to a degree intentionally, to make it more evil sounding (for example, a chord progression including E minor, G minor, A minor and C minor. Also black metallers never play major chords except when they can make them sound grim). Vocal style is as raspy as death metal, but more projected and higher pitch. Basically gravelly shrieking.
The black metal bands often evolve into other forms of music. A band like Arcturus that started off as a fairly straight-ahead, atmospheric black metal band and kind of evolved into a trip-hop/electronica kind of act. There have been a couple other bands, that have gone that route.
The Death Metal bands don't seem to evolve as much though a handful will kind of end up going in the metalcore/groove-metal direction.
Death Metal definitely is more jeans and beer while black metal is more leather and wine.
My favorite as of late has been the folk metal genre which blends all kinds of shit together. Black metal, death metal, traditional folk instruments and tunes.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 01:52:02 AM
I did actually enjoy reading Lords of Chaos, which did not neglect Heavy Metal's blues origins (indeed, it declared Robert Johnson to be the grandfather of Metal- it pointed out the irony that Black Metal, which can have Nazi sympathy depending on the band, only exists because of a black dude). Heavy Metal and Rock and Roll are actually siblings, not an evolution. Black Sabbath started out as a Blues band that wanted to scare people. Seriously, listen to the first Black Sabbath album and tell me that it's nothing more than heavy, spooky Blues. It doesn't sound like the Rock and Roll of the time. Like, say this song here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=304UPVcAkso).
Now, the history of Metal subgenres is interesting too, and can be traced back to the band Venom who inadvertently created 4 subgenres in one sentence during an interview. But it's all Metal. Not Heavy Metal. Just Metal. Heavy Metal is now a subgenre of Metal.
Yeah, I think typically Heavy Metal has become synonymous with "traditional metal", basically anything that developed in or stemmed from the NWOBH movement.
Metal encompasses a broad swath of sounds and styles now. It's really amazing how much it has branched out since the Sabbath days. So much now that it seems almost absurd to think an extreme black metal band like Marduk is in the same genre as a doom/groove band like Cathedral.
Ok so there's no singular subgenre that is specifically known for its Satanic lyrics? Cause I was really trying to get it right but I guess I must have misread something on WP. Your distinction makes sense though. I knew it would be either Black Metal or Death Metal because Doom Metal is all like "Awww I'm so depressed and all is hopeless and my life has no purpose and on top of that my string broke" and if Satan'd hear that He'd be all STFU YOU WHINING LITTLE PISS OR ILL GIVE YOU SOMETHING TO BE ETERNALLY DEPRESSED ABOUT and then He'd infect the World with Justin Bieber just to spite them some more--true story.
Hey and what about Dimmu Borgir then? WP says they're "symphonic death metal" but my favourite song is Puritania (yes because of the vocoders--but also the industrial beats help) and that one's clearly industrial metal, Fear Factory could've done it. This video someone made is awesome, it's got the lyrics AND bigass nuclear splosions: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QSP51TNTdQ -- it's quite obvious they're singing about Daleks.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 01:40:10 AM
Pop quiz: Which one is which?
(http://www.earache.com/bands/carcass/news_archive/carcass/Carcass03.jpg)
(http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/12300000/Black-Metal-Bands-black-metal-12354393-477-331.jpg)
:lulz:
Next time rehost on imgur so I can't see the answer in your img urls as I reply.
The guy with the short black hair is obviously a Satanist, but his three girlfriends might not realize this until it's too late?
The other image won't seem to load. But I'm guessing it's Black Metal because of the URL filename!! :D
I think it is fair to say that Black Metal is the subgenre that has most of the Satanic lyrical content, like anything of course it isn't 100% across the board.
Although, while not satanic, the Doom metal genre can have some significantly anti-religious lyrical content. My Dying Bride is a good example, when he wasn't singing about vampires making out, Aaron was writing some fairly scathing anti-Christian content. So it isn't always a lot of "woe is me" stuff with the Doomsters.
Robert Johnson never stopped being a shitty guitar player. I'd just like to clarify that point.
The sad truth about most heavy metal, like most of everything else, is that it's crap. If any of it is put in some "rock n roll hall of fame" (oh, the irony in THAT institution), then the lyrics should written on toilet paper and installed in the bathrooms of said hall of fame.
The last band that "happened" doesn't even matter in context of all the other bands JUST LIKE IT, and also people think they are real aware if they can just list some names that they think everyone else knows (or better yet, has just barely heard of). Like you say the name of a band that is really popular but which "everyone knows" totally sucks and that's some sort of amazing cultural critique.
I hung around with some perverts and some rock climbers and they were all "jargon jargon jargon", and it was exactly the same thing. Totally irrelevant outside of their closely drawn confines. Insight into popular culture is like keeping meticulous records of the activities of your hamster.
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 05:10:19 PM
The sad truth about most heavy metal, like most of everything else, is that it's crap. If any of it is put in some "rock n roll hall of fame" (oh, the irony in THAT institution), then the lyrics should written on toilet paper and installed in the bathrooms of said hall of fame.
The last band that "happened" doesn't even matter in context of all the other bands JUST LIKE IT, and also people think they are real aware if they can just list some names that they think everyone else knows (or better yet, has just barely heard of). Like you say the name of a band that is really popular but which "everyone knows" totally sucks and that's some sort of amazing cultural critique.
I hung around with some perverts and some rock climbers and they were all "jargon jargon jargon", and it was exactly the same thing. Totally irrelevant outside of their closely drawn confines. Insight into popular culture is like keeping meticulous records of the activities of your hamster.
Troof! It's just another form of trainspotting :lulz: Same as sports geeks, same as movie buffs, same as followers of politics but, hey, I'm pretty sure most people have one or two geeky things they fill their brains full of facts about. No harm in that - storing and regurgitating trivia is part of what brains do.
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on July 30, 2012, 05:20:48 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 05:10:19 PM
The sad truth about most heavy metal, like most of everything else, is that it's crap. If any of it is put in some "rock n roll hall of fame" (oh, the irony in THAT institution), then the lyrics should written on toilet paper and installed in the bathrooms of said hall of fame.
The last band that "happened" doesn't even matter in context of all the other bands JUST LIKE IT, and also people think they are real aware if they can just list some names that they think everyone else knows (or better yet, has just barely heard of). Like you say the name of a band that is really popular but which "everyone knows" totally sucks and that's some sort of amazing cultural critique.
I hung around with some perverts and some rock climbers and they were all "jargon jargon jargon", and it was exactly the same thing. Totally irrelevant outside of their closely drawn confines. Insight into popular culture is like keeping meticulous records of the activities of your hamster.
Troof! It's just another form of trainspotting :lulz: Same as sports geeks, same as movie buffs, same as followers of politics but, hey, I'm pretty sure most people have one or two geeky things they fill their brains full of facts about. No harm in that - storing and regurgitating trivia is part of what brains do.
This is why I typically avoid music threads. The ones where obscure (or now obscure) bands are discussed are bad enough (for me), but the ones where music is actually broken down in technical terms are unreadable for non-specialists.
I'm not saying people shouldn't make threads like that, I was just mentioning my own personal opinion of said threads. So if anyone is taking this as a screech about these threads existing, shut up. It's just my personal thing.
YUR ROONING PD!
\
:jihaad:
Meh, there's a lot of crap metal bands out there but there are a lot of good ones too. But I would argue that Metal is more than just the music and has become a culture, and one that hasn't gone away despite all of the best efforts from the government, religion, and lawyers.
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on July 30, 2012, 06:02:28 PM
But I would argue that Metal is more than just the music and has become a culture,
That's the saddest thing I've heard this month.
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on July 30, 2012, 10:56:55 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 01:40:10 AM
Pop quiz: Which one is which?
(http://www.earache.com/bands/carcass/news_archive/carcass/Carcass03.jpg)
(http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/12300000/Black-Metal-Bands-black-metal-12354393-477-331.jpg)
:lulz:
I see Carcass and, Red X?
(http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/12300000/Black-Metal-Bands-black-metal-12354393-477-331.jpg)
Huh.
It was Mayhem. This one is 1349
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_MlmYCbJ49g4/TGkqN5o8dqI/AAAAAAAAAF8/UmttunbCiag/s1600/1349.jpg)
So many things can be technically defined as "metal" now that it hardly has any definition left. There are more subgenres in metal than any other kind of music as far as I'm aware, and many of them are as different from other metal genres as they are from other types of music entirely.
But I'm pretty sure I still have a monopoly on the Lounge Metal genre.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 01:40:10 AM
Pop quiz: Which one is which?
(http://www.earache.com/bands/carcass/news_archive/carcass/Carcass03.jpg)
Look how serious they all are. :lulz:
The guy in the blue denim jacket, especially.
LOOK AT MY ANGST, YE MIGHTY, AND TREMBLE!
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 05:27:34 PM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on July 30, 2012, 05:20:48 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 05:10:19 PM
The sad truth about most heavy metal, like most of everything else, is that it's crap. If any of it is put in some "rock n roll hall of fame" (oh, the irony in THAT institution), then the lyrics should written on toilet paper and installed in the bathrooms of said hall of fame.
The last band that "happened" doesn't even matter in context of all the other bands JUST LIKE IT, and also people think they are real aware if they can just list some names that they think everyone else knows (or better yet, has just barely heard of). Like you say the name of a band that is really popular but which "everyone knows" totally sucks and that's some sort of amazing cultural critique.
I hung around with some perverts and some rock climbers and they were all "jargon jargon jargon", and it was exactly the same thing. Totally irrelevant outside of their closely drawn confines. Insight into popular culture is like keeping meticulous records of the activities of your hamster.
Troof! It's just another form of trainspotting :lulz: Same as sports geeks, same as movie buffs, same as followers of politics but, hey, I'm pretty sure most people have one or two geeky things they fill their brains full of facts about. No harm in that - storing and regurgitating trivia is part of what brains do.
This is why I typically avoid music threads. The ones where obscure (or now obscure) bands are discussed are bad enough (for me), but the ones where music is actually broken down in technical terms are unreadable for non-specialists.
I'm not saying people shouldn't make threads like that, I was just mentioning my own personal opinion of said threads. So if anyone is taking this as a screech about these threads existing, shut up. It's just my personal thing.
I wouldn't say we're breaking things down into technical terms rather than just kinda discussing the history of it.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 06:16:13 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 05:27:34 PM
Quote from: P3nT4gR4m on July 30, 2012, 05:20:48 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 05:10:19 PM
The sad truth about most heavy metal, like most of everything else, is that it's crap. If any of it is put in some "rock n roll hall of fame" (oh, the irony in THAT institution), then the lyrics should written on toilet paper and installed in the bathrooms of said hall of fame.
The last band that "happened" doesn't even matter in context of all the other bands JUST LIKE IT, and also people think they are real aware if they can just list some names that they think everyone else knows (or better yet, has just barely heard of). Like you say the name of a band that is really popular but which "everyone knows" totally sucks and that's some sort of amazing cultural critique.
I hung around with some perverts and some rock climbers and they were all "jargon jargon jargon", and it was exactly the same thing. Totally irrelevant outside of their closely drawn confines. Insight into popular culture is like keeping meticulous records of the activities of your hamster.
Troof! It's just another form of trainspotting :lulz: Same as sports geeks, same as movie buffs, same as followers of politics but, hey, I'm pretty sure most people have one or two geeky things they fill their brains full of facts about. No harm in that - storing and regurgitating trivia is part of what brains do.
This is why I typically avoid music threads. The ones where obscure (or now obscure) bands are discussed are bad enough (for me), but the ones where music is actually broken down in technical terms are unreadable for non-specialists.
I'm not saying people shouldn't make threads like that, I was just mentioning my own personal opinion of said threads. So if anyone is taking this as a screech about these threads existing, shut up. It's just my personal thing.
I wouldn't say we're breaking things down into technical terms rather than just kinda discussing the history of it.
Oh, I know. I was referring to some past threads with that comment.
Quote from: v3x on July 30, 2012, 06:07:04 PM
So many things can be technically defined as "metal" now that it hardly has any definition left. There are more subgenres in metal than any other kind of music as far as I'm aware, and many of them are as different from other metal genres as they are from other types of music entirely.
But I'm pretty sure I still have a monopoly on the Lounge Metal genre.
You're right there. But I think that's because you can do a lot within Metal. Though, one guy once told me that Iron Maiden wasn't Metal. His point was that it doesn't sound like Metal that comes out these days- except it was called Metal back in the day, most people still call it Metal and Metalheads attend their concerts.
The subgenre thing is interesting though- you'll see Death Metallers going to a Doom Metal show wearing a Black Metal shirt. As much as it branches out, it still seems to have broad appeal to other Metalheads.
This one time though, some asshat who wrote for a magazine noted that Death Metal and Black Metal had seemed to fuse into a new genre and that he suggested it be called Turbo Metal.
Quote from: Triple Zero on July 30, 2012, 12:23:12 PM
Ok so there's no singular subgenre that is specifically known for its Satanic lyrics? Cause I was really trying to get it right but I guess I must have misread something on WP. Your distinction makes sense though. I knew it would be either Black Metal or Death Metal because Doom Metal is all like "Awww I'm so depressed and all is hopeless and my life has no purpose and on top of that my string broke" and if Satan'd hear that He'd be all STFU YOU WHINING LITTLE PISS OR ILL GIVE YOU SOMETHING TO BE ETERNALLY DEPRESSED ABOUT and then He'd infect the World with Justin Bieber just to spite them some more--true story.
Hey and what about Dimmu Borgir then? WP says they're "symphonic death metal" but my favourite song is Puritania (yes because of the vocoders--but also the industrial beats help) and that one's clearly industrial metal, Fear Factory could've done it. This video someone made is awesome, it's got the lyrics AND bigass nuclear splosions: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QSP51TNTdQ -- it's quite obvious they're singing about Daleks.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 01:40:10 AM
Pop quiz: Which one is which?
(http://www.earache.com/bands/carcass/news_archive/carcass/Carcass03.jpg)
(http://images2.fanpop.com/image/photos/12300000/Black-Metal-Bands-black-metal-12354393-477-331.jpg)
:lulz:
Next time rehost on imgur so I can't see the answer in your img urls as I reply.
The guy with the short black hair is obviously a Satanist, but his three girlfriends might not realize this until it's too late?
The other image won't seem to load. But I'm guessing it's Black Metal because of the URL filename!! :D
I never really paid much attention to the lyrics of Doom Metal. I always figured it was Metal for people who were too perpetually stoned to want to listen to stuff that was faster and was played an octave above whatever the E string was tuned down to. There was this one Doom band- my last band played with them at our first show, and we remembered them because of this one song. We never saw them live again, but they practiced at the same place that another band we were friends with practiced at, so we got to hear them play that same song over and over as if they had somehow forgotten everything else that was written. The song was long too and had little variation. 7 minutes of DUN DUN DUN DUN DUUUUUUUN "HOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWL" DUN DUN DUN DUN DUUUUUUUN "HOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWL"
It was as funny as it was annoying.
Quote from: v3x on July 30, 2012, 06:07:04 PM
So many things can be technically defined as "metal" now that it hardly has any definition left. There are more subgenres in metal than any other kind of music as far as I'm aware, and many of them are as different from other metal genres as they are from other types of music entirely.
But I'm pretty sure I still have a monopoly on the Lounge Metal genre.
Nope. I was in a lounge metal side project back in the day called "Sippy Cup Margarita". And even then it wasn't original, as evidenced by the existence of Mister Bungle.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 30, 2012, 07:14:11 PM
Quote from: v3x on July 30, 2012, 06:07:04 PM
So many things can be technically defined as "metal" now that it hardly has any definition left. There are more subgenres in metal than any other kind of music as far as I'm aware, and many of them are as different from other metal genres as they are from other types of music entirely.
But I'm pretty sure I still have a monopoly on the Lounge Metal genre.
Nope. I was in a lounge metal side project back in the day called "Sippy Cup Margarita". And even then it wasn't original, as evidenced by the existence of Mister Bungle.
Hell, even Metallica did "The Metallicats" thing, even though it was more a joke than an act.
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on July 30, 2012, 06:02:28 PM
Meh, there's a lot of crap metal bands out there but there are a lot of good ones too. But I would argue that Metal is more than just the music and has become a culture, and one that hasn't gone away despite all of the best efforts from the government, religion, and lawyers.
As much as I love metal (the music), I'm'a have to say that metal is a culture in the same way that Juggalos are a culture, in that people who grasp on to it as some sort of uniform/life-identifier rather than just a type of music they enjoy tend to be the same kind of people that in a different context and/or with a different upbringing would be proud of being white.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 30, 2012, 07:17:15 PM
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on July 30, 2012, 06:02:28 PM
Meh, there's a lot of crap metal bands out there but there are a lot of good ones too. But I would argue that Metal is more than just the music and has become a culture, and one that hasn't gone away despite all of the best efforts from the government, religion, and lawyers.
As much as I love metal (the music), I'm'a have to say that metal is a culture in the same way that Juggalos are a culture, in that people who grasp on to it as some sort of uniform/life-identifier rather than just a type of music they enjoy tend to be the same kind of people that in a different context and/or with a different upbringing would be proud of being white.
Hence my earlier comment.
Indeed. I felt like clarifying my opinion further because, sadly, that was NOT the saddest thing I've heard this month.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 30, 2012, 07:21:23 PM
Indeed. I felt like clarifying my opinion further because, sadly, that was NOT the saddest thing I've heard this month.
Ouch. Bad month, eh?
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 05:10:19 PM
The sad truth about most heavy metal, like most of everything else, is that it's crap. If any of it is put in some "rock n roll hall of fame" (oh, the irony in THAT institution), then the lyrics should written on toilet paper and installed in the bathrooms of said hall of fame.
KILL IT WITH FIRE. PLEASE.
QuoteThe last band that "happened" doesn't even matter in context of all the other bands JUST LIKE IT, and also people think they are real aware if they can just list some names that they think everyone else knows (or better yet, has just barely heard of). Like you say the name of a band that is really popular but which "everyone knows" totally sucks and that's some sort of amazing cultural critique.
I hung around with some perverts and some rock climbers and they were all "jargon jargon jargon", and it was exactly the same thing. Totally irrelevant outside of their closely drawn confines. Insight into popular culture is like keeping meticulous records of the activities of your hamster.
Yeah. Fuck jargon, fuck metal, fuck pop cultures, fuck grunge, fuck punk, fuck "country", etc. ad nauseum. Especially fuck GENRES. Everybody knows that rule about 99% of everything sucking kong dong.
'Scuse me while I plug my mp3 player into the stereo and piss off the neighbors as it jumps from psychedelic to new wave to Tex Mex to George Clinton to Johnny Cash.
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 06:08:17 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 01:40:10 AM
Pop quiz: Which one is which?
(http://www.earache.com/bands/carcass/news_archive/carcass/Carcass03.jpg)
Look how serious they all are. :lulz:
The guy in the blue denim jacket, especially.
LOOK AT MY ANGST, YE MIGHTY, AND TREMBLE!
He's trying to live down a stint in
Hanson. :lulz:
The very IDEA of a rock n roll hall of fame makes me cringe.
If you're a rock n roller, you're going to be remembered...And your music is going to do the job. At least, it will do the job far better than a schmaltzy museum in Cleveland, Ohio. Jesus, how depressing is THAT?
Worse, it was co-founded by Jann Wenner, who had his last good or even relevant idea in 1967.
Wenner's either senile or trolling. Look at the people who get inducted (or don't), it's like the Grammys.
MADONNA? :horrormirth:
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 30, 2012, 07:42:15 PM
Wenner's either senile or trolling. Look at the people who get inducted (or don't), it's like the Grammys.
MADONNA? :horrormirth:
Apparently, he leans on the judges pretty hard so that music he doesn't like doesn't get in, and music he does like does get in.
That's the only thing that makes sense. They always have a bullshit excuse for not inducting people.
So is Brittney in yet? She's been on the cover of RS a few times, I think. :puke:
The RRHF is where dried-up careers go to finalize their death plans. It's a preemptive funeral parlor. It's also a multi-million-dollar pad for premortem circlejerks, where people whose influence has waned can gather and reminisce and play 25-year-old songs nobody wants to hear anymore. Induction speeches are all blowhards trying to out-epitaph each other, and the whole thing is a gigantic orgy of coughing, wheezing, bitching about the Chemo, and twitching from too many years of drug abuse.
In fact, if it was any more centered around death, it would make a decent subject for a real metal song. That is, if it wasn't in fucking Cleveland.
Quote from: v3x on July 30, 2012, 08:03:04 PM
The RRHF is where dried-up careers go to finalize their death plans. It's a preemptive funeral parlor. It's also a multi-million-dollar pad for premortem circlejerks, where people whose influence has waned can gather and reminisce and play 25-year-old songs nobody wants to hear anymore. Induction speeches are all blowhards trying to out-epitaph each other, and the whole thing is a gigantic orgy of coughing, wheezing, bitching about the Chemo, and twitching from too many years of drug abuse.
In fact, if it was any more centered around death, it would make a decent subject for a real metal song. That is, if it wasn't in fucking Cleveland.
Cleveland offered to pay for it. That was Wenner's only criteria. It could just as easily been in Cowfucker, Indiana.
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 30, 2012, 07:33:33 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 06:08:17 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 01:40:10 AM
Pop quiz: Which one is which?
(http://www.earache.com/bands/carcass/news_archive/carcass/Carcass03.jpg)
Look how serious they all are. :lulz:
The guy in the blue denim jacket, especially.
LOOK AT MY ANGST, YE MIGHTY, AND TREMBLE!
He's trying to live down a stint in Hanson. :lulz:
Because making fun of Metalheads' hair is a novel thing, even in this thread.
My band in high school got the Hanson comment. My smart ass shouted "MMM-Bop!" back at them. A fight almost broke out until the other guitarist casually pulled his knife out of his pocket.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:17:22 PM
Because making fun of Metalheads' hair is a novel thing, even in this thread.
I was talking about the look on his face.
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:18:08 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:17:22 PM
Because making fun of Metalheads' hair is a novel thing, even in this thread.
I was talking about the look on his face.
I was referencing Trip's calling them girlfriends. Your comment was valid. Metalheads must always look serious in a picture. Or otherwise look like they're having a shouting good time. However for that to work, there must be half consumed beers in the picture.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:21:22 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:18:08 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:17:22 PM
Because making fun of Metalheads' hair is a novel thing, even in this thread.
I was talking about the look on his face.
I was referencing Trip's calling them girlfriends. Your comment was valid. Metalheads must always look serious in a picture. Or otherwise look like they're having a shouting good time. However for that to work, there must be half consumed beers in the picture.
MORAL: All metalheads come from Seguin, TX.
Quote from: v3x on July 30, 2012, 08:03:04 PM
The RRHF is where dried-up careers go to finalize their death plans. It's a preemptive funeral parlor. It's also a multi-million-dollar pad for premortem circlejerks, where people whose influence has waned can gather and reminisce and play 25-year-old songs nobody wants to hear anymore. Induction speeches are all blowhards trying to out-epitaph each other, and the whole thing is a gigantic orgy of coughing, wheezing, bitching about the Chemo, and twitching from too many years of drug abuse.
In fact, if it was any more centered around death, it would make a decent subject for a real metal song. That is, if it wasn't in fucking Cleveland.
However, Leonard Cohen's acceptance speech was EPIC.
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:25:48 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:21:22 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:18:08 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:17:22 PM
Because making fun of Metalheads' hair is a novel thing, even in this thread.
I was talking about the look on his face.
I was referencing Trip's calling them girlfriends. Your comment was valid. Metalheads must always look serious in a picture. Or otherwise look like they're having a shouting good time. However for that to work, there must be half consumed beers in the picture.
MORAL: All metalheads come from Seguin, TX.
Does one out of four guys in Seguin have his fly down?
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:58:36 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:25:48 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:21:22 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:18:08 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:17:22 PM
Because making fun of Metalheads' hair is a novel thing, even in this thread.
I was talking about the look on his face.
I was referencing Trip's calling them girlfriends. Your comment was valid. Metalheads must always look serious in a picture. Or otherwise look like they're having a shouting good time. However for that to work, there must be half consumed beers in the picture.
MORAL: All metalheads come from Seguin, TX.
Does one out of four guys in Seguin have his fly down?
Only in church. Otherwise, it's more like 4/4.
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:59:44 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:58:36 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:25:48 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:21:22 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:18:08 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:17:22 PM
Because making fun of Metalheads' hair is a novel thing, even in this thread.
I was talking about the look on his face.
I was referencing Trip's calling them girlfriends. Your comment was valid. Metalheads must always look serious in a picture. Or otherwise look like they're having a shouting good time. However for that to work, there must be half consumed beers in the picture.
MORAL: All metalheads come from Seguin, TX.
Does one out of four guys in Seguin have his fly down?
Only in church. Otherwise, it's more like 4/4.
Damn.
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:25:48 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:21:22 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:18:08 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:17:22 PM
Because making fun of Metalheads' hair is a novel thing, even in this thread.
I was talking about the look on his face.
I was referencing Trip's calling them girlfriends. Your comment was valid. Metalheads must always look serious in a picture. Or otherwise look like they're having a shouting good time. However for that to work, there must be half consumed beers in the picture.
MORAL: All metalheads come from Seguin, TX.
Sounds right. :lulz: :lulz: :lulz:
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 09:02:19 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:59:44 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:58:36 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:25:48 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:21:22 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 08:18:08 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 30, 2012, 08:17:22 PM
Because making fun of Metalheads' hair is a novel thing, even in this thread.
I was talking about the look on his face.
I was referencing Trip's calling them girlfriends. Your comment was valid. Metalheads must always look serious in a picture. Or otherwise look like they're having a shouting good time. However for that to work, there must be half consumed beers in the picture.
MORAL: All metalheads come from Seguin, TX.
Does one out of four guys in Seguin have his fly down?
Only in church. Otherwise, it's more like 4/4.
Damn.
"Welcommmmme to my world..."
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 06:05:39 PM
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on July 30, 2012, 06:02:28 PM
But I would argue that Metal is more than just the music and has become a culture,
That's the saddest thing I've heard this month.
Why is that sad?
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on July 30, 2012, 09:27:06 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 30, 2012, 06:05:39 PM
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on July 30, 2012, 06:02:28 PM
But I would argue that Metal is more than just the music and has become a culture,
That's the saddest thing I've heard this month.
Why is that sad?
See ECH's response. He beat me to it.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 30, 2012, 07:17:15 PM
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on July 30, 2012, 06:02:28 PM
Meh, there's a lot of crap metal bands out there but there are a lot of good ones too. But I would argue that Metal is more than just the music and has become a culture, and one that hasn't gone away despite all of the best efforts from the government, religion, and lawyers.
As much as I love metal (the music), I'm'a have to say that metal is a culture in the same way that Juggalos are a culture, in that people who grasp on to it as some sort of uniform/life-identifier rather than just a type of music they enjoy tend to be the same kind of people that in a different context and/or with a different upbringing would be proud of being white.
I disagree, I think mostly because we seem to have different ideas of what "culture" connotates.
Im ok with heavy metal being a culture. It where it becomes a metalheads only culture that it becomes problematic. Cuz then you get a group of outcasts shitting on other types of outcasts. And then theres the whole not metal enough attitude. Nothing wrong with going to a show in a cut off denim jacket with patches on it. Wearing it to a baseball game might not be the best place for it.
Well you can have that within any culture. But in general, I don't find metal heads to be any more or less welcoming than any other kind of culture. Indeed, more often than not, I've found metal heads to be very welcoming and friendly.
I think Sam Dunn, someone who is a metal fan AND an anthropologist, did a great documentary on the metal culture called "Metal: A Headbanger's Journey" It truly takes an anthropological lens to metal and explores the culture and the spectrum of the fan base from young to old. It's very much more than just wearing a uniform for the sake of being cool.
I liked Metal: A Headbanger's Journey, and met Mr. Dunn when he was in Norway to shoot it, but I think he is a bit too apologetic about some of the rampant stupidity metallers have done, especially the church burners here in Norway.
(I hate myself a bit for having written such a poorly structured sentence. Please forgive me)
The movie also gave us this: .....SATAN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQJqZFUell8), which is arguably the best interview in the history of music.
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 12:56:12 AM
I liked Metal: A Headbanger's Journey, and met Mr. Dunn when he was in Norway to shoot it, but I think he is a bit too apologetic about some of the rampant stupidity metallers have done, especially the church burners here in Norway.
(I hate myself a bit for having written such a poorly structured sentence. Please forgive me)
The movie also gave us this: .....SATAN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQJqZFUell8), which is arguably the best interview in the history of music.
I think it's funny foreigners apologize for their sentence structure when an American or a Brit would never have noticed. I still don't know what you're talking about error wise and standardized tests say that I have a better grasp on the English language than most Americans. The only thing I would have changed was use the word arsonists instead of burners.
And on the subject of church arson, that shit was just plain terrorism. I'm glad that black metal has settled down. And you know, it wasn't all just historical site destruction and knocking over tombstones. People died. Not just Euronymous (founder of Mayhem who was murdered by his friend Varg Vikernes of Burzum) and that gay dude Faust from Emperor killed, Per Anders or something was his name. No, there was a French priest, a German school kid, a couple of other people. I like Black Metal, but there are some albums that I will not buy because of the people it would support. I do have Emperor's whole catalogue, but I bought that when Faust was still in prison and quite replaced with Trim. Faust, and Varg, are out now, btw. This is one of those rare times when I believe that the American judicial system is superior to that of European nations.
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 12:56:12 AM
I liked Metal: A Headbanger's Journey, and met Mr. Dunn when he was in Norway to shoot it, but I think he is a bit too apologetic about some of the rampant stupidity metallers have done, especially the church burners here in Norway.
(I hate myself a bit for having written such a poorly structured sentence. Please forgive me)
The movie also gave us this: .....SATAN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQJqZFUell8), which is arguably the best interview in the history of music.
You know, I've never listened to Gorgoroth, but I love Gaahl if for the simple fact that he's like, "Yeah, I'm gay. I'll eat you alive if you have a problem with that too."
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:30:41 AM
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 12:56:12 AM
I liked Metal: A Headbanger's Journey, and met Mr. Dunn when he was in Norway to shoot it, but I think he is a bit too apologetic about some of the rampant stupidity metallers have done, especially the church burners here in Norway.
(I hate myself a bit for having written such a poorly structured sentence. Please forgive me)
The movie also gave us this: .....SATAN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQJqZFUell8), which is arguably the best interview in the history of music.
You know, I've never listened to Gorgoroth, but I love Gaahl if for the simple fact that he's like, "Yeah, I'm gay. I'll eat you alive if you have a problem with that too."
Though, now having watched that, "Semitic roots" bit is a bit fucked up. The pause with a very calm "Satan" was hilarious though.
Like, I don't like Christianity very much. I don't like what it has done to Ireland. I don't like what it has done to the United States. But you know what? It's there. It's part of both cultures. Even though my religion is Irish polytheism, I have to thank Christian monks for two things- preserving our mythology and getting rid of all of that sacrifice bullshit. I'm sure that Norway, like Ireland, has benefited from Christianity, even though it is useless, especially in Norway, now (from what I understand most Scandinavians identify as atheist, whereas Irish still identify as Christian, at least as a political statement).
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:30:41 AM
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 12:56:12 AM
I liked Metal: A Headbanger's Journey, and met Mr. Dunn when he was in Norway to shoot it, but I think he is a bit too apologetic about some of the rampant stupidity metallers have done, especially the church burners here in Norway.
(I hate myself a bit for having written such a poorly structured sentence. Please forgive me)
The movie also gave us this: .....SATAN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQJqZFUell8), which is arguably the best interview in the history of music.
You know, I've never listened to Gorgoroth, but I love Gaahl if for the simple fact that he's like, "Yeah, I'm gay. I'll eat you alive if you have a problem with that too."
I deeply respect his balls to come out of the closet in one of the most homophobic (and homoerotic) scenes in the music world.
I do not, however respect his methods of "teaching people lessons" when they have crossed him in the past. He has served four or five years in jail for violence and torture. Fuck that shit.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:39:09 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:30:41 AM
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 12:56:12 AM
I liked Metal: A Headbanger's Journey, and met Mr. Dunn when he was in Norway to shoot it, but I think he is a bit too apologetic about some of the rampant stupidity metallers have done, especially the church burners here in Norway.
(I hate myself a bit for having written such a poorly structured sentence. Please forgive me)
The movie also gave us this: .....SATAN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQJqZFUell8), which is arguably the best interview in the history of music.
You know, I've never listened to Gorgoroth, but I love Gaahl if for the simple fact that he's like, "Yeah, I'm gay. I'll eat you alive if you have a problem with that too."
Though, now having watched that, "Semitic roots" bit is a bit fucked up. The pause with a very calm "Satan" was hilarious though.
Like, I don't like Christianity very much. I don't like what it has done to Ireland. I don't like what it has done to the United States. But you know what? It's there. It's part of both cultures. Even though my religion is Irish polytheism, I have to thank Christian monks for two things- preserving our mythology and getting rid of all of that sacrifice bullshit. I'm sure that Norway, like Ireland, has benefited from Christianity, even though it is useless, especially in Norway, now (from what I understand most Scandinavians identify as atheist, whereas Irish still identify as Christian, at least as a political statement).
Well, in many ways we have benefited from it, even if
blot was a rare thing when Heilag Olav christened Norway by the tried and true method of Convert or Die. Olav was, by the way sainted because, when they went to get his body, his nails and hair had grown. A true message from God, that.
For the record, I'm not particularly anti-Christian. I'm a fan of the highly exaggerated ritual of the Russian Orthodox Church, and, to a lesser extent, the Roman Catholic Church. I do think Protestantism and other Lutheran sects are way too boring, though, even if I do enjoy church coffee, from time to time. Many of the churches in Norway serve great waffles.
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 02:41:50 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:39:09 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:30:41 AM
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 12:56:12 AM
I liked Metal: A Headbanger's Journey, and met Mr. Dunn when he was in Norway to shoot it, but I think he is a bit too apologetic about some of the rampant stupidity metallers have done, especially the church burners here in Norway.
(I hate myself a bit for having written such a poorly structured sentence. Please forgive me)
The movie also gave us this: .....SATAN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQJqZFUell8), which is arguably the best interview in the history of music.
You know, I've never listened to Gorgoroth, but I love Gaahl if for the simple fact that he's like, "Yeah, I'm gay. I'll eat you alive if you have a problem with that too."
Though, now having watched that, "Semitic roots" bit is a bit fucked up. The pause with a very calm "Satan" was hilarious though.
Like, I don't like Christianity very much. I don't like what it has done to Ireland. I don't like what it has done to the United States. But you know what? It's there. It's part of both cultures. Even though my religion is Irish polytheism, I have to thank Christian monks for two things- preserving our mythology and getting rid of all of that sacrifice bullshit. I'm sure that Norway, like Ireland, has benefited from Christianity, even though it is useless, especially in Norway, now (from what I understand most Scandinavians identify as atheist, whereas Irish still identify as Christian, at least as a political statement).
Well, in many ways we have benefited from it, even if blot was a rare thing when Heilag Olav christened Norway by the tried and true method of Convert or Die. Olav was, by the way sainted because, when they went to get his body, his nails and hair had grown. A true message from God, that.
We sainted Patrick because he explained a theological concept we already had to us using a plant. Also, he got rid of reptiles. In Ireland. Think about that. Our Latin name, Hibernia, literally translates to "Winterland." How many snakes would you expect to find there, even, what, 1600 years ago?
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:47:51 AM
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 02:41:50 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:39:09 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:30:41 AM
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 12:56:12 AM
I liked Metal: A Headbanger's Journey, and met Mr. Dunn when he was in Norway to shoot it, but I think he is a bit too apologetic about some of the rampant stupidity metallers have done, especially the church burners here in Norway.
(I hate myself a bit for having written such a poorly structured sentence. Please forgive me)
The movie also gave us this: .....SATAN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQJqZFUell8), which is arguably the best interview in the history of music.
You know, I've never listened to Gorgoroth, but I love Gaahl if for the simple fact that he's like, "Yeah, I'm gay. I'll eat you alive if you have a problem with that too."
Though, now having watched that, "Semitic roots" bit is a bit fucked up. The pause with a very calm "Satan" was hilarious though.
Like, I don't like Christianity very much. I don't like what it has done to Ireland. I don't like what it has done to the United States. But you know what? It's there. It's part of both cultures. Even though my religion is Irish polytheism, I have to thank Christian monks for two things- preserving our mythology and getting rid of all of that sacrifice bullshit. I'm sure that Norway, like Ireland, has benefited from Christianity, even though it is useless, especially in Norway, now (from what I understand most Scandinavians identify as atheist, whereas Irish still identify as Christian, at least as a political statement).
Well, in many ways we have benefited from it, even if blot was a rare thing when Heilag Olav christened Norway by the tried and true method of Convert or Die. Olav was, by the way sainted because, when they went to get his body, his nails and hair had grown. A true message from God, that.
We sainted Patrick because he explained a theological concept we already had to us using a plant. Also, he got rid of reptiles. In Ireland. Think about that. Our Latin name, Hibernia, literally translates to "Winterland." How many snakes would you expect to find there, even, what, 1600 years ago?
Other than the odd common viper, not very many, I'd wager. :lulz:
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 02:45:36 AM
For the record, I'm not particularly anti-Christian. I'm a fan of the highly exaggerated ritual of the Russian Orthodox Church, and, to a lesser extent, the Roman Catholic Church. I do think Protestantism and other Lutheran sects are way too boring, though, even if I do enjoy church coffee, from time to time. Many of the churches in Norway serve great waffles.
I am also not opposed to Christianity, since, recently I have gone back to some of the folk forms of Catholicism. Orthodox is interesting, but long as fuck. I went to see a friend ordained in the Antiochan tradition (he was a French-American raised Catholic. His wife was also really fucking hot, and Russian.) I gotta say, I do not want to be in any church for 3 hours for any reason. But, he knew I was Pagan and we both chuckled at each other when I came up to the altar to kiss the cross. Likewise, I am friends with two Lutheran ministers (they came out here to get their degrees, but are primarily from Indiana, which has a lot of Germans and Scandinavians, who are, of course, Lutheran). I used to be anti-Christian until I realized, about 90% of the people I cared about were Christian in some form or another.
I'm going to have a Catholic wedding. I'm going to have a Unitarian funeral.
That reminds me, become a Unitarian the day after wedding.
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 02:49:37 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:47:51 AM
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 02:41:50 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:39:09 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 02:30:41 AM
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 12:56:12 AM
I liked Metal: A Headbanger's Journey, and met Mr. Dunn when he was in Norway to shoot it, but I think he is a bit too apologetic about some of the rampant stupidity metallers have done, especially the church burners here in Norway.
(I hate myself a bit for having written such a poorly structured sentence. Please forgive me)
The movie also gave us this: .....SATAN (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQJqZFUell8), which is arguably the best interview in the history of music.
You know, I've never listened to Gorgoroth, but I love Gaahl if for the simple fact that he's like, "Yeah, I'm gay. I'll eat you alive if you have a problem with that too."
Though, now having watched that, "Semitic roots" bit is a bit fucked up. The pause with a very calm "Satan" was hilarious though.
Like, I don't like Christianity very much. I don't like what it has done to Ireland. I don't like what it has done to the United States. But you know what? It's there. It's part of both cultures. Even though my religion is Irish polytheism, I have to thank Christian monks for two things- preserving our mythology and getting rid of all of that sacrifice bullshit. I'm sure that Norway, like Ireland, has benefited from Christianity, even though it is useless, especially in Norway, now (from what I understand most Scandinavians identify as atheist, whereas Irish still identify as Christian, at least as a political statement).
Well, in many ways we have benefited from it, even if blot was a rare thing when Heilag Olav christened Norway by the tried and true method of Convert or Die. Olav was, by the way sainted because, when they went to get his body, his nails and hair had grown. A true message from God, that.
We sainted Patrick because he explained a theological concept we already had to us using a plant. Also, he got rid of reptiles. In Ireland. Think about that. Our Latin name, Hibernia, literally translates to "Winterland." How many snakes would you expect to find there, even, what, 1600 years ago?
Other than the odd common viper, not very many, I'd wager. :lulz:
:lulz:
Odd common nothing.
There have been no reptiles in Ireland for thousands of years, let alone snakes. Too raw. The temperature is always around 50 degrees Fahrenheit and it's almost always raining. I've never been to Ireland when it's hotter than 75 in direct sun, and that never lasted very long. I've never been there and not seen rain, no matter how short the trip. When I went over to bury grandma, that was the ONLY sunny day in a week, according to my relatives. And lo and behold, it was raining that night. We got a lucky fucking window.
I did not know that Ireland was reptile free.
I did know about the rain.
Even Norway has two species of venomous vipers, the Common European and the grass snake.
Apparently the grass snake is not venomous, but it still bites ya. Damn my lack of knowledge! :argh!:
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on July 31, 2012, 03:01:18 AM
I did not know that Ireland was reptile free.
I did know about the rain.
Even Norway has two species of venomous vipers, the Common European and the grass snake.
In Ireland, it's mammals, birds, insects and fish as far as the animal kingdom goes. Obviously we have bacteria and fungi and all that other fun stuff. But yeah, if you're not warm blooded, you're definitely not native to Ireland. Ireland even only has one major predator species-
Homo sapiens. Sure they have dogs and cats, and... lackeys to
Homo sapiens... No wolves. We domesticated them. No bears, they've been extinct for fucking forever, the only feline species is the one that we tolerate as pets because they eat mice. Also, few forests. Almost no deer. Ireland is about as industrialized as you can get without flat out total urbanization. It's a mostly rural country, but it's obvious who's in charge.
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
Thin Lizzy took their bus through the drive through at the Burger King in my home town years ago.
People still remember that. It's probably the coolest thing that ever happened there.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
If Phil Fucking Lynott had anybody with sense in it, it would still be alive. That said, if I was able to vote there, he'd get at least one.
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 31, 2012, 04:51:43 AM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
Thin Lizzy took their bus through the drive through at the Burger King in my home town years ago.
People still remember that. It's probably the coolest thing that ever happened there.
Mental note, easy act to follow in Seguin. Get hammered, destroy stuff. Also eat at Wendy's to make a statement about gods know what.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 05:48:14 AM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
If Phil Fucking Lynott had anybody with sense in it, it would still be alive. That said, if I was able to vote there, he'd get at least one.
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 31, 2012, 04:51:43 AM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
Thin Lizzy took their bus through the drive through at the Burger King in my home town years ago.
People still remember that. It's probably the coolest thing that ever happened there.
Mental note, easy act to follow in Seguin. Get hammered, destroy stuff. Also eat at Wendy's to make a statement about gods know what.
I said "my hometown", I'm not FROM Seguin. DO YOU SEE ELBOW FLAPS? DOES MY STOMACH HANG LIKE A GIANT OLD TIT? CAN I READ?
I would like it if you came here and destroyed stuff, though. :lulz:
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 31, 2012, 06:59:07 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 05:48:14 AM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
If Phil Fucking Lynott had anybody with sense in it, it would still be alive. That said, if I was able to vote there, he'd get at least one.
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 31, 2012, 04:51:43 AM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
Thin Lizzy took their bus through the drive through at the Burger King in my home town years ago.
People still remember that. It's probably the coolest thing that ever happened there.
Mental note, easy act to follow in Seguin. Get hammered, destroy stuff. Also eat at Wendy's to make a statement about gods know what.
I said "my hometown", I'm not FROM Seguin. DO YOU SEE ELBOW FLAPS? DOES MY STOMACH HANG LIKE A GIANT OLD TIT? CAN I READ?
I would like it if you came here and destroyed stuff, though. :lulz:
I'll pretend like its Lawrence.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 07:13:34 AM
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 31, 2012, 06:59:07 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 05:48:14 AM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
If Phil Fucking Lynott had anybody with sense in it, it would still be alive. That said, if I was able to vote there, he'd get at least one.
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 31, 2012, 04:51:43 AM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
Thin Lizzy took their bus through the drive through at the Burger King in my home town years ago.
People still remember that. It's probably the coolest thing that ever happened there.
Mental note, easy act to follow in Seguin. Get hammered, destroy stuff. Also eat at Wendy's to make a statement about gods know what.
I said "my hometown", I'm not FROM Seguin. DO YOU SEE ELBOW FLAPS? DOES MY STOMACH HANG LIKE A GIANT OLD TIT? CAN I READ?
I would like it if you came here and destroyed stuff, though. :lulz:
I'll pretend like its Lawrence.
You're going to pay a little kid to steal your car and drive it into the river? :|
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 31, 2012, 08:38:49 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 07:13:34 AM
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 31, 2012, 06:59:07 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 05:48:14 AM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
If Phil Fucking Lynott had anybody with sense in it, it would still be alive. That said, if I was able to vote there, he'd get at least one.
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 31, 2012, 04:51:43 AM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
Thin Lizzy took their bus through the drive through at the Burger King in my home town years ago.
People still remember that. It's probably the coolest thing that ever happened there.
Mental note, easy act to follow in Seguin. Get hammered, destroy stuff. Also eat at Wendy's to make a statement about gods know what.
I said "my hometown", I'm not FROM Seguin. DO YOU SEE ELBOW FLAPS? DOES MY STOMACH HANG LIKE A GIANT OLD TIT? CAN I READ?
I would like it if you came here and destroyed stuff, though. :lulz:
I'll pretend like its Lawrence.
You're going to pay a little kid to steal your car and drive it into the river? :|
...No. I just think Lawrence needs to be destroyed.
It wasnt completely terrible when I was growing up there, at least not South Lawrence. Though there were many occassions where we were walking by/over various drug dealers/prostitutes being arrested while going to our favorite chinese restaurant. And the few occassions when the owner would have screaming match with miscellaneous people coming in off the street. But yea it's pretty bad now.
Some safest places to live in/dangerousness site my boyfriend was looking at the other night actually ranked Lawrence worse than Lynn, which surprised me, but it could just be my vague familiarity with Lawrence. That and since I don't know what site he was looking at, who knows what the criteria were.
/threadjack
Quote from: trippinprincezz13 on July 31, 2012, 05:16:08 PM
It wasnt completely terrible when I was growing up there, at least not South Lawrence. Though there were many occassions where we were walking by/over various drug dealers/prostitutes being arrested while going to our favorite chinese restaurant. And the few occassions when the owner would have screaming match with miscellaneous people coming in off the street. But yea it's pretty bad now.
Some safest places to live in/dangerousness site my boyfriend was looking at the other night actually ranked Lawrence worse than Lynn, which surprised me, but it could just be my vague familiarity with Lawrence. That and since I don't know what site he was looking at, who knows what the criteria were.
/threadjack
Places change. Right now it's Lawrence's turn to be a wretched place.
Lawrence also had to basically shut down the Fire Department. Not sure if it's been reopened yet.
Lynn isn't anywhere near the scumhole it used to be back in the "Lynn, Lynn, city of sin" days. Especially since they stopped running hounds at the Wonderland.
That said, if Lawrence is as bad as it gets around you it means you live in a pretty nice place.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 06:25:07 PM
Lynn isn't anywhere near the scumhole it used to be back in the "Lynn, Lynn, city of sin" days. Especially since they stopped running hounds at the Wonderland.
That said, if Lawrence is as bad as it gets around you it means you live in a pretty nice place.
We are talking about Lawrence, MA, correct?
Yep. Not really all that shitty a shithole, in the grand scheme of things. And yes, I have been there fairly recently.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 06:59:04 PM
Yep. Not really all that shitty a shithole, in the grand scheme of things. And yes, I have been there fairly recently.
Ah. The grand scheme of things. Then, yes, that's a fair assessment.
I think people get hung up on the "depressed former mill town" visual aesthetic. I'd sure as hell rather be walking alone around Lawrence at night than, say, Roxy or Dorchester. Or even most of Chelsea or Saugus.
And when you compare it to shitholes in other states, well, it doesn't even qualify. Mass is, in general, a fairly safe place with very little random violent crime.
And that's not a "my shithole is worse than your shithole" thing. It's nice to live in a place where you don't have to worry much about getting randomly shot/mugged/beaten/etc. It's one of the reasons I chose Portland over Seattle when I decided to move back to the PNW.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 07:02:42 PM
I think people get hung up on the "depressed former mill town" visual aesthetic. I'd sure as hell rather be walking alone around Lawrence at night than, say, Roxy or Dorchester. Or even most of Chelsea or Saugus.
And when you compare it to shitholes in other states, well, it doesn't even qualify. Mass is, in general, a fairly safe place with very little random violent crime.
Actually, it's funny you;d say that. I feel fairly safe in Dorchester at night- safer than I certainly would in Lawrence. Maybe it was just the neighborhood my friend lived in though, but he wasn't particularly fond of the place either, and he was from Roxbury.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 05:42:19 PM
Quote from: trippinprincezz13 on July 31, 2012, 05:16:08 PM
It wasnt completely terrible when I was growing up there, at least not South Lawrence. Though there were many occassions where we were walking by/over various drug dealers/prostitutes being arrested while going to our favorite chinese restaurant. And the few occassions when the owner would have screaming match with miscellaneous people coming in off the street. But yea it's pretty bad now.
Some safest places to live in/dangerousness site my boyfriend was looking at the other night actually ranked Lawrence worse than Lynn, which surprised me, but it could just be my vague familiarity with Lawrence. That and since I don't know what site he was looking at, who knows what the criteria were.
/threadjack
Places change. Right now it's Lawrence's turn to be a wretched place.
Lawrence also had to basically shut down the Fire Department. Not sure if it's been reopened yet.
I lived in Lynn in the late 90's and you could walk down Union St. and see nary a hooker or dopehouse. Stuff still went on, like anyplace else, but it wasn't overt. Wonderland was still open, too. Whatever the brouhaha was over, they'd already put a stop to it. It was actually pretty high class compared to the shithole I'm in now. Totally agree that Mass, as a rule, is safe with very few exceptions.
What happened with the Lawrence fire dept.? :lulz:
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on July 31, 2012, 05:42:19 PM
Places change. Right now it's Lawrence's turn to be a wretched place.
Lawrence also had to basically shut down the Fire Department. Not sure if it's been reopened yet.
I heard that the police department was undergoing something like that too - that various other local agencies were pretty much taking care of business. But I forget the source and I know there's also just been various raids going on right now. On the other hand, wouldn't be terribly surprising.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 06:25:07 PM
Lynn isn't anywhere near the scumhole it used to be back in the "Lynn, Lynn, city of sin" days. Especially since they stopped running hounds at the Wonderland.
That said, if Lawrence is as bad as it gets around you it means you live in a pretty nice place.
Ahh ok, it's been a while since I've been there and I usually have no reason to go.
And yea, I agree. It's bad, but I know comparatively it's not THAT bad. When I used to tell people I grew up there, some people would be all "OMG really? Lawrence?". But to be fair, some of those people come from towns where the worst crimes tend to be OUIs and maybe domestics & simple possession. While I myself am by no means "street tough", it does tickle me a bit to see people from places like Boxford thinking they are "gangster" and "hardcore" because they smoke pot and wear bagggy pants.
There are always areas you may be better off avoiding, mainly by common sense, but overall I feel fairly safe in the surrounding areas and know there are far worse cities out there.
Quote from: trippinprincezz13 on July 31, 2012, 07:17:03 PM
While I myself am by no means "street tough", it does tickle me a bit to see people from places like Boxford thinking they are "gangster" and "hardcore" because they smoke pot and wear bagggy pants.
While I am myself a little bit gangster, I am not sufficiently qualified to judge if such behavior is in fact gangster. I shall have to defer to LMNO, who is gangster as fuck
1, or even dare I say ECH
2, who is so gangster that I urinate helplessly in his presence, even when that presence is restricted to PD.com. They are both far more qualified than I am
3.
1 He shot Biggie Smalls, just for spitting in the road.
2 He also shot Biggie Smalls, for no good reason.
3 I have not shot Biggie Smalls. I have, however, sent him a withering glance on occasion.
Being somewhat ganster, I must strenuously object to people from Boxford (or, perhaps, Duxbury) assuming the said mantle of "gangsta".
Boxfords that town that always cancels school because of snow. Every time id see boxford pop up after billerica id get a little cranky.
One thing which we are blessed with in Tucson is the fact that we don't have the drop-bottom, doodoo pance style of gangster, on account of 3rd degree sunburns on the top of your ass crack.
Our gangsters look like everyone else. In fact, they act like everyone else. It's a job, and you are just about as likely to get shot at my job as at theirs.
So either we're all gangster, or none of us are. I don't know.
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on July 31, 2012, 07:28:24 PM
Being somewhat ganster, I must strenuously object to people from Boxford (or, perhaps, Duxbury) assuming the said mantle of "gangsta".
Too many Big Fish, Little Pond complexes which I guess is bound to happen in towns where there's nothing better to do. I prefer to be Fish That Tries to Be Generally Nice to Everyone and Doesn't Need to Start Shit with Any Random Person to Prove How Big My Balls May Or May Not Be. Some asshat thought it'd be impressive to tell us that he "stabbed someone once" and "used to run shit in Merrimac". Yes, I am shaking in my boots from the vague threat you decided to give the first time coming into our apartment. You're lucky I don't politely ask you to leave. And I'm not sure what there was to run in Merrimac now or 10 years ago, but I doubt it was much.
Enough of that, I suppose. I try to use common sense for the most part, day to day, but don't get the need to reassure everyone you talk to how "tough" you are, often shortly before getting the shit kicked out of you
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 31, 2012, 08:11:17 PM
Quote from: trippinprincezz13 on July 31, 2012, 08:06:54 PM
"used to run shit in Merrimac".
Where?
Exactly.
On a slightly more serious note, this pit of depravity: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merrimac,_Massachusetts
Quote from: trippinprincezz13 on July 31, 2012, 08:22:44 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 31, 2012, 08:11:17 PM
Quote from: trippinprincezz13 on July 31, 2012, 08:06:54 PM
"used to run shit in Merrimac".
Where?
Exactly.
On a slightly more serious note, this pit of depravity: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merrimac,_Massachusetts
WELL STEP BACK, DR DRE! :lulz:
"I used to run shit in Merrimac"???
:lulz: :lulz: :lulz: :lulz:
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 08:25:55 PM
"I used to run shit in Merrimac"???
:lulz: :lulz: :lulz: :lulz:
I'll have you know that for a year, I ran shit in Hillsborough, Ontario.
So step the fuck off before ya get bumrushed.
TDRR,
Living Large at 14th & Minna.
:lulz: :lulz:
But GUYZ! He stabbed someone once!
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 31, 2012, 08:27:25 PM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 08:25:55 PM
"I used to run shit in Merrimac"???
:lulz: :lulz: :lulz: :lulz:
I'll have you know that for a year, I ran shit in Hillsborough, Ontario.
So step the fuck off before ya get bumrushed.
TDRR,
Living Large at 14th & Minna.
Careful. You're talking to a founding member of Castine, Maine's premier (and only) street gang.
that's right, C-Unit OG up in this mutha.
I've stabbed someone many times.
Nevermind that the "someone" in question is myself. I'm hard as nails, dawg. :lulz:
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 08:40:19 PM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on July 31, 2012, 08:27:25 PM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 08:25:55 PM
"I used to run shit in Merrimac"???
:lulz: :lulz: :lulz: :lulz:
I'll have you know that for a year, I ran shit in Hillsborough, Ontario.
So step the fuck off before ya get bumrushed.
TDRR,
Living Large at 14th & Minna.
Careful. You're talking to a founding member of Castine, Maine's premier (and only) street gang.
that's right, C-Unit OG up in this mutha.
I have consulted with Talufa concerning a response to your statement. He didn't have much of a response, except to punch me in the face.
Then I shat myself.
Quote from: trippinprincezz13 on July 31, 2012, 08:39:12 PM
:lulz: :lulz:
But GUYZ! He stabbed someone once!
Riiiiiiiiiiight.
Everyone knows That Guy.
I warned you about eating lunch at the Korean taco truck. You know how far Talufa takes it.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 08:42:46 PM
I warned you about eating lunch at the Korean taco truck. You know how far Talufa takes it.
Actually, I just compounded my error and asked him for a ride to the emergency room.
Annnnnd he punched me in the face again.
Annnnnd I shat myself.
Again.
But you just don't know how down and dirty things get at the Rhythm Cafe (http://media.merchantcircle.com/22658409/P9030895_full.jpeg)
And I heard that sometimes the kids smoke pot in rough spots in town such as this (http://www.massrealty.com/photos/ma/002/496/974_00_medium.jpg)
Quote from: trippinprincezz13 on July 31, 2012, 08:47:20 PM
But you just don't know how down and dirty things get at the Rhythm Cafe (http://media.merchantcircle.com/22658409/P9030895_full.jpeg)
I bet a motherfucker would get CAPPED trying to sell fake patchouli up in that bitch.
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on July 31, 2012, 04:51:43 AM
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on July 31, 2012, 03:41:35 AM
If that silly little bog had anybody with sense in it, Phil Fucking Lynott would be in charge.
Thin Lizzy took their bus through the drive through at the Burger King in my home town years ago.
People still remember that. It's probably the coolest thing that ever happened there.
The funny thing about Thin Lizzy is that I have trouble thinking of them as Heavy Metal, even though they clearly are.
Yeah, after listening to metal bands like Death, Carcass, or even Slayer, it's hard to think of a band like Thin Lizzy as Metal. Hell, even some early Priest can sound much more Rock in comparison.
By the way, I dunno if any of y'all have heard the new Testament stuff yet or not, but to me it comes off as horribly meh. Though, I think Testament has largely been pretty meh as a thrash band, which is a damn shame when you have someone as talented as Skolnick in your band. I find his jazz music much more interesting than present-day Testament.
I was always kinda take it or leave it with Testament.
And it is kinda funny too, Metal gets more Metal as time goes on. I know what you mean about Priest. Hell, if the first time I heard Bruce Dickinson sing was listening to Book of Thel, which is the tits, by the way, I would never have though of a lot of Maiden as Metal, even though, again, they clearly are. (Number of the Beast was the first Metal album I heard, sometime around the age of 9 or so. I actually liked it right away, but my friend refused to tell me who they were. Bastid. I only recognized the songs later when I started hanging out with Metalheads in 8th grade when I was a grunge kid.
My music history is kinda funny. First I didn't give a crap. Then I heard Maiden, then I listened to like, MC Hammer and shit. Then I permanently borrowed my mom's copy of Slippery When Wet by Bon Jovi, then my uncle gave me a copy of Nevermind. Then I became a die hard Nirvana fan and jumped into the grunge thing, then Kurt killed himself and I started hating alternative music. Simultaneously I started hanging out with people who listened to Maiden, Motorhead, Megadeth, and Metallica. Became a Metallica fan first (I once had more Metallica shirts than I do have Maiden shirts now). Then Load. Then Reload. Then Chemical Wedding. Then Blaze left Maiden. Then I gave Emperor a shot. The rest, as they say, is history.
If you don't include hair metal, my first metal album was Gutter Ballet by Savatage, who went on to become my favorite metal band. Still love that band even though its pretty much defunct.
But I did the whole hair metal thing first. White Lion was one of the first bands I got into. But I gravitated to the less BIG bands like Poison and the Crue and was more into the Teslas, Kix, Badlands, Bang Tango, etc.
I got into the alternative/post modern scene too, Nirvana was one of my faves. I didn't really have much exposure to black metal, my avenue to the heavier stuff was the Sabbathy doom metal like Solitude Aeturnus and Cathedral and the deathy doom stuff like Anathema (who these days sound more like Radiohead) and My Dying Bride.
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on August 03, 2012, 01:38:51 AM
Yeah, after listening to metal bands like Death, Carcass, or even Slayer, it's hard to think of a band like Thin Lizzy as Metal. Hell, even some early Priest can sound much more Rock in comparison.
Hell, after listening to Napalm Death, Cephalic Carnage, and Goatwhore it's hard to think of a band like Slayer as metal. There's no end to that rabbit hole. Which, really, is why I just like good music and don't much care what other people decide to call it.
I'm bummed to hear that Testament's newest is meh, though I'm hoping that since I REALLY like Testament I'll find myself disagreeing. But the one song I heard was, well, kinda meh.
I've always felt that they were the underachievers of Thrash. It just seems like they should be so much better and interesting than they are, because there is no question there is a lot of talent in that band.
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on August 03, 2012, 02:18:24 AM
I've always felt that they were the underachievers of Thrash. It just seems like they should be so much better and interesting than they are, because there is no question there is a lot of talent in that band.
Sometimes talents don't quite mesh into really great song writing. Just look at RHCP. And sometimes lack of talent doesn't mean that song writing more than makes up for it. Sometimes you can be a mediocre musician, with a bunch of other mediocre musicians, but it just works. I would say Nirvana is an example of that but Dave Grohl is a great drummer. He had to be. Kurt was picky as fuck about that sort of thing.
IMO, Skolnick is the best living guitar player (unless Andres Segovia is still alive but he'd be old as dirt by now), and Chuck Billy gets credit for being the only guy I can think of whose voice got better after throat cancer, but they've frequently had a case of awesome riffs and tight musicianship not translating into amazing songs. I love New Order and Souls of Black, and I really dug Demonic and The Gathering. I'm holding onto my high hopes for the new one for no other reason than Gene Hoglan is playing drums on it.
Twid, RHCP had all kinds of awesome songs. Just remember that BloodSugarSexMagic was their last good album, even though it was the first one most people heard. But that old shit, like Freaky Styley and Mofo Uplift Party Plan, that shit is pretty goddamn awesome.
Now, though, well....I can see why Frusciante left the band. He's WAY too good to be doing what they've been doing lately. BTW, you guitar-heads, if you ever come across any of his solo stuff it's pretty damn good.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on August 03, 2012, 02:29:13 AM
IMO, Skolnick is the best living guitar player (unless Andres Segovia is still alive but he'd be old as dirt by now), and Chuck Billy gets credit for being the only guy I can think of whose voice got better after throat cancer, but they've frequently had a case of awesome riffs and tight musicianship not translating into amazing songs. I love New Order and Souls of Black, and I really dug Demonic and The Gathering. I'm holding onto my high hopes for the new one for no other reason than Gene Hoglan is playing drums on it.
I think The Gathering had James Murphy on lead, who's also a pretty bad-ass metal lead guitar player.
And you can't go wrong having The Atomic Clock on the skins.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on August 03, 2012, 02:31:19 AM
Now, though, well....I can see why Frusciante left the band. He's WAY too good to be doing what they've been doing lately. BTW, you guitar-heads, if you ever come across any of his solo stuff it's pretty damn good.
Their newer stuff has a tendency to overshadow their older stuff in my mind.
Also, I'll check out his solo stuff
Yeah, James Murphy is a wicked sick guitar player. loved his leads since Obituary days. Raises the question, though...does being in Testament cause/ cancer?
Hey, do you guys happen to know the origins of some of these labels like "thrash", "metal", "punk", "new wave", "black metal", etc.?
I'm willing to bet a lot of them started with dumbass journalists anyway. I mean, come on..."grunge"? :lol:
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on August 03, 2012, 04:32:07 AM
Hey, do you guys happen to know the origins of some of these labels like "thrash", "metal", "punk", "new wave", "black metal", etc.?
I'm willing to bet a lot of them started with dumbass journalists anyway. I mean, come on..."grunge"? :lol:
It stems from the band Venom. Let me see if I can find the quote.
Lords of Chaos doesn't have an index. Looking for Lucifer Rising.
Lucifer Rising by Gavin Baddeley, ISBN 0 85965 280 7, page 129, interview with Abaddon of Venom:
Quote from: Lucifer Rising
GB: How did the 'black metal' tag come about?
Abaddon: People pigeonholed us, as they do every band. We actually said in an interview, 'Fuck off, we're not heavy metal. We're death metal, we're speed metal, we're thrash metal, we're black metal.' We actually said that in anger, but we created a whole range of new pigeonholes. Because we called an album Black Metal you now get people calling Black Sabbath black metal, and they were happening long before we were in nappies.
Punk and New Wave are independent of Venom, obviously. Punk used to be equivalent to the term faggot, New Wave, I'm not sure.
fucking Venom. Crappy band, great interviewees. :lulz:
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on August 03, 2012, 05:39:36 AM
Punk and New Wave are independent of Venom, obviously. Punk used to be equivalent to the term faggot, New Wave, I'm not sure.
Yeah, I remember that. And getting "punked" was getting fucked up the ass, usually unwillingly, like in prison. When punk came out, everybody was going "what the fuck?" :lol:
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on August 03, 2012, 06:13:09 AM
fucking Venom. Crappy band, great interviewees. :lulz:
Can't always win gold medals. :lulz:
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on August 03, 2012, 06:35:27 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on August 03, 2012, 05:39:36 AM
Punk and New Wave are independent of Venom, obviously. Punk used to be equivalent to the term faggot, New Wave, I'm not sure.
Yeah, I remember that. And getting "punked" was getting fucked up the ass, usually unwillingly, like in prison. When punk came out, everybody was going "what the fuck?" :lol:
:lulz:
The term Metal is just shortened from Heavy Metal, which comes from a line in "Born to Be Wild" and Grunge presumably is from aversion to bathing.
Twid,
Was grunge. Meant it.
PS: Rock and Roll used to be a lyrical eupemism in the Blues for sex.
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on August 03, 2012, 04:15:35 AM
Yeah, James Murphy is a wicked sick guitar player. loved his leads since Obituary days. Raises the question, though...does being in Testament cause/ cancer?
Just noticed this.
:horrormirth:
Quote from: Echo Chamber Music on August 03, 2012, 04:15:35 AM
Yeah, James Murphy is a wicked sick guitar player. loved his leads since Obituary days. Raises the question, though...does being in Testament cause/ cancer?
He was also in Death (Chuck, brain tumor), and the band Cancer.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on August 03, 2012, 06:42:13 AM
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on August 03, 2012, 06:35:27 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on August 03, 2012, 05:39:36 AM
Punk and New Wave are independent of Venom, obviously. Punk used to be equivalent to the term faggot, New Wave, I'm not sure.
Yeah, I remember that. And getting "punked" was getting fucked up the ass, usually unwillingly, like in prison. When punk came out, everybody was going "what the fuck?" :lol:
:lulz:
The term Metal is just shortened from Heavy Metal, which comes from a line in "Born to Be Wild" and Grunge presumably is from aversion to bathing.
Twid,
Was grunge. Meant it.
PS: Rock and Roll used to be a lyrical eupemism in the Blues for sex.
I'm pretty sure 'grunge' was invented by some music journalist in Seattle.
And Venom might've tossed out the term 'death' metal, but I think the actual subgenre sound an aesthetic were really solidified by the band Death as well as Possessed who had an early song called Death Metal which really set out the template for the style of music.
Quote from: Gen. Disregard on August 03, 2012, 10:48:41 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on August 03, 2012, 06:42:13 AM
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on August 03, 2012, 06:35:27 AM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on August 03, 2012, 05:39:36 AM
Punk and New Wave are independent of Venom, obviously. Punk used to be equivalent to the term faggot, New Wave, I'm not sure.
Yeah, I remember that. And getting "punked" was getting fucked up the ass, usually unwillingly, like in prison. When punk came out, everybody was going "what the fuck?" :lol:
:lulz:
The term Metal is just shortened from Heavy Metal, which comes from a line in "Born to Be Wild" and Grunge presumably is from aversion to bathing.
Twid,
Was grunge. Meant it.
PS: Rock and Roll used to be a lyrical eupemism in the Blues for sex.
I'm pretty sure 'grunge' was invented by some music journalist in Seattle.
And Venom might've tossed out the term 'death' metal, but I think the actual subgenre sound an aesthetic were really solidified by the band Death as well as Possessed who had an early song called Death Metal which really set out the template for the style of music.
Probably. The funny thing is that grunge wasn't really a cohesive genre to begin with. Soundgarden was a Metal band, Nirvana was a Punk band, Stone Temple Pilots was.... wiggly heroin addicts who should keep their shirts on Rock.
Not this again...
We had a nice board fight over what grunge "was" a few monthd back. Not sure I'd like to revisit that.
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on August 03, 2012, 03:49:50 PM
Not this again...
We had a nice board fight over what grunge "was" a few monthd back. Not sure I'd like to revisit that.
I must have missed it. It was more a comment on labels anyway. This thread is too Metal for an argument about what grunge is.
I wasn't really arguing anyway, just relaying what I seem to recall, but it is lighthearted and not serious commentary. I'm not terribly invested.
If I remember correctly, Mark Arm accidentally coined the term in an interview and the press ran with it. Nobody that was actually in the music scene in Seattle at the time thought of the scene as being one cohesive genre. And by the time the term "grunge" was being used to describe that scene, the scene was mostly dead and replaced by 2nd-wave heavy alternative bands (STP, Candlebox, etc.) that weren't even from the PNW.
As for the term "Heavy Metal", I'm curious about the origin and when it became part of the common lexicon. I'd hazard a guess that Black Sabbath was called something completely different when they first came out.
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on August 03, 2012, 03:49:50 PM
Not this again...
We had a nice board fight over what grunge "was" a few monthd back. Not sure I'd like to revisit that.
Not trying to define it. I think it's a retarded term.
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on August 03, 2012, 03:53:56 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on August 03, 2012, 03:49:50 PM
Not this again...
We had a nice board fight over what grunge "was" a few monthd back. Not sure I'd like to revisit that.
I must have missed it. It was more a comment on labels anyway. This thread is too Metal for an argument about what grunge is.
METAL SQUASHES GRUNGE.
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on August 03, 2012, 10:59:57 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on August 03, 2012, 03:53:56 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on August 03, 2012, 03:49:50 PM
Not this again...
We had a nice board fight over what grunge "was" a few monthd back. Not sure I'd like to revisit that.
I must have missed it. It was more a comment on labels anyway. This thread is too Metal for an argument about what grunge is.
METAL SQUASHES GRUNGE.
METAL SQUASHES, PERIOD.
I don't think "grunge" actually exists, anyway: "HEY, IT'S THE 90'S NOW, WE NEED NEW STUPID WORDS!"
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on August 04, 2012, 04:27:26 AM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on August 03, 2012, 10:59:57 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on August 03, 2012, 03:53:56 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on August 03, 2012, 03:49:50 PM
Not this again...
We had a nice board fight over what grunge "was" a few monthd back. Not sure I'd like to revisit that.
I must have missed it. It was more a comment on labels anyway. This thread is too Metal for an argument about what grunge is.
METAL SQUASHES GRUNGE.
METAL SQUASHES, PERIOD.
I don't think "grunge" actually exists, anyway: "HEY, IT'S THE 90'S NOW, WE NEED NEW STUPID WORDS!"
Sounds about right
It was always very clearly a marketing gimmick and one most bands publicly derided. Mudhoney even wrote a song about it, 'Overblown'. The funny thing is, if any band fit a 'grungy' sound, it was definitely Mudhoney.
Like I said, I'm pretty sure Mark Arm was the one who actually coined the term.
I was thinking about this the other day, while listening to Twin Shadow, who is clearly ripping off old Police tracks, and DIIV, who is essentially giving Joy Division a reacharound -- If you take a random sampling of bands from the late 80s - early 90s catalog of Sub Pop, Am Rep, Duch East, and maybe even SST, and then insert into that sampling a number of rock tracks from the major labels, it would be very, very easy to discern between the two, even if blindfolded. You might not be able to say, "it's because of this guitar sound," or "it's this specific way the vocals are produced," but there would be a difference. You might not want to put a label on it, but you can't deny a general "otherness" to the collection of music that was rising to the surface.
It's the turbo-echo on the snare drum that all the Big Name Bands used.
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on August 06, 2012, 12:52:47 PM
I was thinking about this the other day, while listening to Twin Shadow, who is clearly ripping off old Police tracks, and DIIV, who is essentially giving Joy Division a reacharound -- If you take a random sampling of bands from the late 80s - early 90s catalog of Sub Pop, Am Rep, Duch East, and maybe even SST, and then insert into that sampling a number of rock tracks from the major labels, it would be very, very easy to discern between the two, even if blindfolded. You might not be able to say, "it's because of this guitar sound," or "it's this specific way the vocals are produced," but there would be a difference. You might not want to put a label on it, but you can't deny a general "otherness" to the collection of music that was rising to the surface.
I think I can largely explain that sound in two words: Jack Endino.
From what I can recall, the term 'Heavy Metal' (aside from it's obvious use in chemistry...) showed up in Steppenwolf's 'Born To Be Wild' which was, in turn borrowed from the writing of W S Burroughs.
The term 'heavy metal' was used as in a derogatory review of one of Black Sabbath's early albums.
I could, of course, be wrong and this is apocryphal bullshit.
Quote from: Mangrove on August 06, 2012, 09:46:55 PM
From what I can recall, the term 'Heavy Metal' (aside from it's obvious use in chemistry...) showed up in Steppenwolf's 'Born To Be Wild' which was, in turn borrowed from the writing of W S Burroughs.
The term 'heavy metal' was used as in a derogatory review of one of Black Sabbath's early albums.
I could, of course, be wrong and this is apocryphal bullshit.
That's actually interesting- I didn't know it was used as a derogatory term.
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on August 04, 2012, 04:27:26 AM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on August 03, 2012, 10:59:57 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on August 03, 2012, 03:53:56 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on August 03, 2012, 03:49:50 PM
Not this again...
We had a nice board fight over what grunge "was" a few monthd back. Not sure I'd like to revisit that.
I must have missed it. It was more a comment on labels anyway. This thread is too Metal for an argument about what grunge is.
METAL SQUASHES GRUNGE.
METAL SQUASHES, PERIOD.
METAL IS A SQUASH.
Quote from: Nephew Hiroshima on August 07, 2012, 07:51:46 PM
Quote from: Mangrove on August 06, 2012, 09:46:55 PM
From what I can recall, the term 'Heavy Metal' (aside from it's obvious use in chemistry...) showed up in Steppenwolf's 'Born To Be Wild' which was, in turn borrowed from the writing of W S Burroughs.
The term 'heavy metal' was used as in a derogatory review of one of Black Sabbath's early albums.
I could, of course, be wrong and this is apocryphal bullshit.
That's actually interesting- I didn't know it was used as a derogatory term.
Yeah, I remember some commentary to that effect in the documentary Heavy:The History of Metal.
Quote from: Nephew Hiroshima on August 07, 2012, 07:51:46 PM
Quote from: Mangrove on August 06, 2012, 09:46:55 PM
From what I can recall, the term 'Heavy Metal' (aside from it's obvious use in chemistry...) showed up in Steppenwolf's 'Born To Be Wild' which was, in turn borrowed from the writing of W S Burroughs.
The term 'heavy metal' was used as in a derogatory review of one of Black Sabbath's early albums.
I could, of course, be wrong and this is apocryphal bullshit.
That's actually interesting- I didn't know it was used as a derogatory term.
I think there was a generalized dissing of Sabbath back in the early days, even though everybody loved them.
Tommy Chong, from some ancient routine: "I DID THAT, mannnnn! With BLACK SABBATH!"
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on August 08, 2012, 02:37:04 AM
Quote from: Nephew Hiroshima on August 07, 2012, 07:51:46 PM
Quote from: Mangrove on August 06, 2012, 09:46:55 PM
From what I can recall, the term 'Heavy Metal' (aside from it's obvious use in chemistry...) showed up in Steppenwolf's 'Born To Be Wild' which was, in turn borrowed from the writing of W S Burroughs.
The term 'heavy metal' was used as in a derogatory review of one of Black Sabbath's early albums.
I could, of course, be wrong and this is apocryphal bullshit.
That's actually interesting- I didn't know it was used as a derogatory term.
I think there was a generalized dissing of Sabbath back in the early days, even though everybody loved them.
Tommy Chong, from some ancient routine: "I DID THAT, mannnnn! With BLACK SABBATH!"
One of the things I love about you Stella, is that you can make me WINCE about the 70s and 80s. Because, apparently, you must have been about a block away from me the whole time.
Quote from: Dirty Old Uncle Roger on August 08, 2012, 02:39:55 AM
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on August 08, 2012, 02:37:04 AM
Quote from: Nephew Hiroshima on August 07, 2012, 07:51:46 PM
Quote from: Mangrove on August 06, 2012, 09:46:55 PM
From what I can recall, the term 'Heavy Metal' (aside from it's obvious use in chemistry...) showed up in Steppenwolf's 'Born To Be Wild' which was, in turn borrowed from the writing of W S Burroughs.
The term 'heavy metal' was used as in a derogatory review of one of Black Sabbath's early albums.
I could, of course, be wrong and this is apocryphal bullshit.
That's actually interesting- I didn't know it was used as a derogatory term.
I think there was a generalized dissing of Sabbath back in the early days, even though everybody loved them.
Tommy Chong, from some ancient routine: "I DID THAT, mannnnn! With BLACK SABBATH!"
One of the things I love about you Stella, is that you can make me WINCE about the 70s and 80s. Because, apparently, you must have been about a block away from me the whole time.
Damn, how did I miss that? :lulz:
Quote from: Waffles, The Iron on August 07, 2012, 09:32:35 PM
Quote from: TEXAS FAIRIES FOR ALL YOU SPAGS on August 04, 2012, 04:27:26 AM
Quote from: The Dead Reverend Roger on August 03, 2012, 10:59:57 PM
Quote from: Bruce Twiddleton on August 03, 2012, 03:53:56 PM
Quote from: LMNO, PhD (life continues) on August 03, 2012, 03:49:50 PM
Not this again...
We had a nice board fight over what grunge "was" a few monthd back. Not sure I'd like to revisit that.
I must have missed it. It was more a comment on labels anyway. This thread is too Metal for an argument about what grunge is.
METAL SQUASHES GRUNGE.
METAL SQUASHES, PERIOD.
METAL IS A SQUASH.
SUMMER SQUASH. MOTHERFUCKERS.