During the daytime, my daughter hangs out with her friends IRL. In the evenings, they all get on their computers and watch bad movies together, laughing theirs asses off in the channel they're using.
My son does basically the same thing. And given the nature of this sort of thing, the groups slowly expand, so there's always a dozen or more people watching the really bad movie of the night. All it takes is logging in.
So they're never alone, unless they choose to be alone.
We've discussed how kids are so much more civilized over the last generation or two, and perhaps this has something to do with it? Each generation has more and more communications capability, to the point where every night is a bad movie party, even with friends that live hundreds of thousands of miles away?
Wasn't a experiment done in Africa with kids using a cell phone, or laptop? Literally the kids retaught the village everything.
It showed communication is vital for progression.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 05:03:08 PM
During the daytime, my daughter hangs out with her friends IRL. In the evenings, they all get on their computers and watch bad movies together, laughing theirs asses off in the channel they're using.
My son does basically the same thing. And given the nature of this sort of thing, the groups slowly expand, so there's always a dozen or more people watching the really bad movie of the night. All it takes is logging in.
So they're never alone, unless they choose to be alone.
We've discussed how kids are so much more civilized over the last generation or two, and perhaps this has something to do with it? Each generation has more and more communications capability, to the point where every night is a bad movie party, even with friends that live hundreds of thousands of miles away?
I think you may very well be on to something... our kids are vastly more connected than we are, to the point where our generation, the Last of the Rugged Individualists, writes opinion articles about Kids These Days and their Horrible Internet Addiction.
What's most interesting about it, to me, is that not only are kids more socially connected, but they care more about what happens to other people. They have a stronger sense of compassion and social justice. They are very concerned about issues like fairness and oppression. They may be too young to yet have the complexity of intellect and experience to put it all together into a cohesive values package that directs their behavior, but they have a better start on it than most of our generation did... and our generation has a better handle on these things, as you mentioned, than the deeply dysfunctional generation before us.
When people talk disparagingly about internet addiction, in a sense what they're putting down is the natural human desire to socialize and be part of a community. The desire of kids to connect online is fundamentally no different from the desire of all people from time immemorial to gather around a fire, drinking, telling stories, and laughing. This is fundamental to the human experience.
I've noticed that my children don't give a crap about toys, or
stuff, anymore, other than stuff that helps them connect with other kids. Stuff that puts them online. Their rooms are, bizarrely, nearly empty, and when I ask them what they want for their birthdays they have no idea, other than a laptop or maybe a tablet. Recently they've started asking for kitchenware, so they'll be equipped to throw dinner parties when they move out.
What's wrong with these kids? Don't they want to shut themselves up in their rooms, with their things, and disconnect from their communities, like Good Americans?
And what will it mean for our future that they don't?
Quote from: /b/earman on July 18, 2013, 06:05:32 PM
Wasn't a experiment done in Africa with kids using a cell phone, or laptop? Literally the kids retaught the village everything.
It showed communication is vital for progression.
Yep. A bunch of kids in a village were given tablets. The kids taught themselves to use the tablets, taught themselves English, and started hacking them and writing programs within 30 days,
all without any outside instruction. They also taught the adults how to use them and started teaching them English.
Basically, these kids went from complete computer illiteracy to Skyping and writing Minecraft hacks in just a few weeks.
Instagrammers,techies,neckbeards, internet cat junkies unite we must rebuild a better future. I forgot all about young people spreading more and more awareness about assholes shitting on people.
Quote from: M. Nigel Salt on July 18, 2013, 06:09:45 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 05:03:08 PM
During the daytime, my daughter hangs out with her friends IRL. In the evenings, they all get on their computers and watch bad movies together, laughing theirs asses off in the channel they're using.
My son does basically the same thing. And given the nature of this sort of thing, the groups slowly expand, so there's always a dozen or more people watching the really bad movie of the night. All it takes is logging in.
So they're never alone, unless they choose to be alone.
We've discussed how kids are so much more civilized over the last generation or two, and perhaps this has something to do with it? Each generation has more and more communications capability, to the point where every night is a bad movie party, even with friends that live hundreds of thousands of miles away?
I think you may very well be on to something... our kids are vastly more connected than we are, to the point where our generation, the Last of the Rugged Individualists, writes opinion articles about Kids These Days and their Horrible Internet Addiction.
What's most interesting about it, to me, is that not only are kids more socially connected, but they care more about what happens to other people. They have a stronger sense of compassion and social justice. They are very concerned about issues like fairness and oppression. They may be too young to yet have the complexity of intellect and experience to put it all together into a cohesive values package that directs their behavior, but they have a better start on it than most of our generation did... and our generation has a better handle on these things, as you mentioned, than the deeply dysfunctional generation before us.
When people talk disparagingly about internet addiction, in a sense what they're putting down is the natural human desire to socialize and be part of a community. The desire of kids to connect online is fundamentally no different from the desire of all people from time immemorial to gather around a fire, drinking, telling stories, and laughing. This is fundamental to the human experience.
I've noticed that my children don't give a crap about toys, or stuff, anymore, other than stuff that helps them connect with other kids. Stuff that puts them online. Their rooms are, bizarrely, nearly empty, and when I ask them what they want for their birthdays they have no idea, other than a laptop or maybe a tablet. Recently they've started asking for kitchenware, so they'll be equipped to throw dinner parties when they move out.
What's wrong with these kids? Don't they want to shut themselves up in their rooms, with their things, and disconnect from their communities, like Good Americans?
And what will it mean for our future that they don't?
Thing is, my daughter goes out IRL
more now, because of the connections she has made with her friends and their friends. I have a house full of teenagers on a regular basis. And they're all very nice and polite, and they DO STUFF (they're really involved in stage makeup, etc), because they talked about it and then arranged it on channel while watching a zombie flick.
I think this is great, obviously. These kids are ten times more socialized
1 than I ever was in my whole life, let alone at age 17.
Best part is, their parties don't involve alcohol or anything. Just Really Bad Movies.
One of their friends is from the CDO district, and couldn't manage a computer that was fast enough to manage this activity. The crowd found a messed up laptop, diagnosed it with the help of one of the UK tards, and repaired it for cheap, got the kid online.
I can't say enough about this.
1 It occurs to me that we could have a lot of fun with the two definitions of "socializing" kids.
Make some teabaggers roar.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 06:20:19 PM
1 It occurs to me that we could have a lot of fun with the two definitions of "socializing" kids.
Make some teabaggers roar.
:lulz:
I can't help but notice that many of the parents who write those articles about internet addiction and kids these days seem to be the same people who made everything else about being a kid not fun.
Scheduling regulated activities from morning to night, constantly looking over their shoulders, making it untenable for them to go outside and ride bikes or catch frogs. I'm mainly talking about my extended family here (most who are overbearing and rather uptight) I see my younger cousins get needled with a thousand invasive questions about their life and then the older generation shrugs when they lurk off and tap on their phones.
Of course they've retreated into the internet! It's the last bastion for them to be connected to each other without being chaperoned.
What gets me, is that much of the older generation can't see the difference between a healthy internet activity (watching bad movies with friends) and something that actually is internet addiction (Warcraft for 12 hours a day). They just blanket the entire technological marvel of the internet age as 'just a fancy pacman'
Quote from: McGrupp on July 18, 2013, 06:29:01 PM
I can't help but notice that many of the parents who write those articles about internet addiction and kids these days seem to be the same people who made everything else about being a kid not fun.
Scheduling regulated activities from morning to night, constantly looking over their shoulders, making it untenable for them to go outside and ride bikes or catch frogs. I'm mainly talking about my extended family here (most who are overbearing and rather uptight) I see my younger cousins get needled with a thousand invasive questions about their life and then the older generation shrugs when they lurk off and tap on their phones.
Of course they've retreated into the internet! It's the last bastion for them to be connected to each other without being chaperoned.
What gets me, is that much of the older generation can't see the difference between a healthy internet activity (watching bad movies with friends) and something that actually is internet addiction (Warcraft for 12 hours a day). They just blanket the entire technological marvel of the internet age as 'just a fancy pacman'
Couldn't agree more. Something happened between my generation, when we were allowed, hell we were expected, to fuck off miles away and explore the wilderness with our friends from an early age and then, suddenly, someone invented pedophiles and insisting that kids wear fucking crash helmets on pushbikes and a whole bunch of other shit which, if it had been imposed on me when I was that age, would have felt like fucking Belsen
This reminds me of what McLuhan wrote about how communication
mediums change the structure of society far more than anything said via that medium.
He talked about how these electric communications were leading to a "re-tribalization". When you read a book, you are having an individual, personal, internal experience. But when you watch live TV, or post on a forum, or read a blog, it becomes a shared experience. And this leads to different types of communities forming.
In old literate culture, the literate experience led to specialization. It forms us around hierarchies and niches. But the electric culture, McLuhan suggested, is leading us to form better groups, think as groups, interpret things as groups. Spontaneously.
Quote from: http://www.nextnature.net/2009/12/the-playboy-interview-marshall-mcluhan/PLAYBOY: Would you describe this retribalizing process in more detail?
McLUHAN: The electronically induced technological extensions of our central nervous systems, which I spoke of earlier, are immersing us in a world-pool of information movement and are thus enabling man to incorporate within himself the whole of mankind. The aloof and dissociated role of the literate man of the Western world is succumbing to the new, intense depth participation engendered by the electronic media and bringing us back in touch with ourselves as well as with one another. But the instant nature of electric-information movement is decentralizing — rather than enlarging — the family of man into a new state of multitudinous tribal existences. Particularly in countries where literate values are deeply institutionalized, this is a highly traumatic process, since the clash of the old segmented visual culture and the new integral electronic culture creates a crisis of identity, a vacuum of the self, which generates tremendous violence — violence that is simply an identity quest, private or corporate, social or commercial.
...
It is not an easy period in which to live, especially for the television-conditioned young who, unlike their literate elders, cannot take refuge in the zombie trance of Narcissus narcosis that numbs the state of psychic shock induced by the impact of the new media. From Tokyo to Paris to Columbia, youth mindlessly acts out its identity quest in the theater of the streets, searching not for goals but for roles, striving for an identity that eludes them.
PLAYBOY: Why do you think they aren't finding it within the educational system?
McLUHAN: Because education, which should be helping youth to understand and adapt to their revolutionary new environments, is instead being used merely as an instrument of cultural aggression, imposing upon retribalized youth the obsolescent visual values of the dying literate age. Our entire educational system is reactionary, oriented to past values and past technologies, and will likely continue so until the old generation relinquishes power. The generation gap is actually a chasm, separating not two age groups but two vastly divergent cultures. I can understand the ferment in our schools, because our educational system is totally rearview mirror. It's a dying and outdated system founded on literate values and fragmented and classified data totally unsuited to the needs of the first television generation.
he has a lot to say on this topic... some of it is pretty out there, but some of it seems amazingly prescient for a guy who was writing about trends in 1969. :p
Obviously blocked at work, but I'm going to go read the whole thing when I get home. Thanks, Cram!
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 06:19:06 PM
Quote from: M. Nigel Salt on July 18, 2013, 06:09:45 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 05:03:08 PM
During the daytime, my daughter hangs out with her friends IRL. In the evenings, they all get on their computers and watch bad movies together, laughing theirs asses off in the channel they're using.
My son does basically the same thing. And given the nature of this sort of thing, the groups slowly expand, so there's always a dozen or more people watching the really bad movie of the night. All it takes is logging in.
So they're never alone, unless they choose to be alone.
We've discussed how kids are so much more civilized over the last generation or two, and perhaps this has something to do with it? Each generation has more and more communications capability, to the point where every night is a bad movie party, even with friends that live hundreds of thousands of miles away?
I think you may very well be on to something... our kids are vastly more connected than we are, to the point where our generation, the Last of the Rugged Individualists, writes opinion articles about Kids These Days and their Horrible Internet Addiction.
What's most interesting about it, to me, is that not only are kids more socially connected, but they care more about what happens to other people. They have a stronger sense of compassion and social justice. They are very concerned about issues like fairness and oppression. They may be too young to yet have the complexity of intellect and experience to put it all together into a cohesive values package that directs their behavior, but they have a better start on it than most of our generation did... and our generation has a better handle on these things, as you mentioned, than the deeply dysfunctional generation before us.
When people talk disparagingly about internet addiction, in a sense what they're putting down is the natural human desire to socialize and be part of a community. The desire of kids to connect online is fundamentally no different from the desire of all people from time immemorial to gather around a fire, drinking, telling stories, and laughing. This is fundamental to the human experience.
I've noticed that my children don't give a crap about toys, or stuff, anymore, other than stuff that helps them connect with other kids. Stuff that puts them online. Their rooms are, bizarrely, nearly empty, and when I ask them what they want for their birthdays they have no idea, other than a laptop or maybe a tablet. Recently they've started asking for kitchenware, so they'll be equipped to throw dinner parties when they move out.
What's wrong with these kids? Don't they want to shut themselves up in their rooms, with their things, and disconnect from their communities, like Good Americans?
And what will it mean for our future that they don't?
Thing is, my daughter goes out IRL more now, because of the connections she has made with her friends and their friends. I have a house full of teenagers on a regular basis. And they're all very nice and polite, and they DO STUFF (they're really involved in stage makeup, etc), because they talked about it and then arranged it on channel while watching a zombie flick.
I think this is great, obviously. These kids are ten times more socialized1 than I ever was in my whole life, let alone at age 17.
Best part is, their parties don't involve alcohol or anything. Just Really Bad Movies.
One of their friends is from the CDO district, and couldn't manage a computer that was fast enough to manage this activity. The crowd found a messed up laptop, diagnosed it with the help of one of the UK tards, and repaired it for cheap, got the kid online.
I can't say enough about this.
yep, same with mine; they have insanely thriving social lives, and aren't locked into just the kids from school. They know kids from all over the Metro area, and on any given day of the week they have meetups in parks, often pot-luck (which also inspires them to cook more, which is great). And they exchange technology wherever it's possible or necessary to allow one of their friends to maintain participation with the group. It's pretty incredible, as social phenomena go.
Quote from: M. Nigel Salt on July 18, 2013, 06:41:23 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 06:19:06 PM
Quote from: M. Nigel Salt on July 18, 2013, 06:09:45 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 05:03:08 PM
During the daytime, my daughter hangs out with her friends IRL. In the evenings, they all get on their computers and watch bad movies together, laughing theirs asses off in the channel they're using.
My son does basically the same thing. And given the nature of this sort of thing, the groups slowly expand, so there's always a dozen or more people watching the really bad movie of the night. All it takes is logging in.
So they're never alone, unless they choose to be alone.
We've discussed how kids are so much more civilized over the last generation or two, and perhaps this has something to do with it? Each generation has more and more communications capability, to the point where every night is a bad movie party, even with friends that live hundreds of thousands of miles away?
I think you may very well be on to something... our kids are vastly more connected than we are, to the point where our generation, the Last of the Rugged Individualists, writes opinion articles about Kids These Days and their Horrible Internet Addiction.
What's most interesting about it, to me, is that not only are kids more socially connected, but they care more about what happens to other people. They have a stronger sense of compassion and social justice. They are very concerned about issues like fairness and oppression. They may be too young to yet have the complexity of intellect and experience to put it all together into a cohesive values package that directs their behavior, but they have a better start on it than most of our generation did... and our generation has a better handle on these things, as you mentioned, than the deeply dysfunctional generation before us.
When people talk disparagingly about internet addiction, in a sense what they're putting down is the natural human desire to socialize and be part of a community. The desire of kids to connect online is fundamentally no different from the desire of all people from time immemorial to gather around a fire, drinking, telling stories, and laughing. This is fundamental to the human experience.
I've noticed that my children don't give a crap about toys, or stuff, anymore, other than stuff that helps them connect with other kids. Stuff that puts them online. Their rooms are, bizarrely, nearly empty, and when I ask them what they want for their birthdays they have no idea, other than a laptop or maybe a tablet. Recently they've started asking for kitchenware, so they'll be equipped to throw dinner parties when they move out.
What's wrong with these kids? Don't they want to shut themselves up in their rooms, with their things, and disconnect from their communities, like Good Americans?
And what will it mean for our future that they don't?
Thing is, my daughter goes out IRL more now, because of the connections she has made with her friends and their friends. I have a house full of teenagers on a regular basis. And they're all very nice and polite, and they DO STUFF (they're really involved in stage makeup, etc), because they talked about it and then arranged it on channel while watching a zombie flick.
I think this is great, obviously. These kids are ten times more socialized1 than I ever was in my whole life, let alone at age 17.
Best part is, their parties don't involve alcohol or anything. Just Really Bad Movies.
One of their friends is from the CDO district, and couldn't manage a computer that was fast enough to manage this activity. The crowd found a messed up laptop, diagnosed it with the help of one of the UK tards, and repaired it for cheap, got the kid online.
I can't say enough about this.
yep, same with mine; they have insanely thriving social lives, and aren't locked into just the kids from school. They know kids from all over the Metro area, and on any given day of the week they have meetups in parks, often pot-luck (which also inspires them to cook more, which is great). And they exchange technology wherever it's possible or necessary to allow one of their friends to maintain participation with the group. It's pretty incredible, as social phenomena go.
Which sort of leaves me with nothing to bitch about...
...
...
DAMN KIDS!
\
:crankey:
Another thing that occurs to me is that this even reduces the really nastier risks children face...Because they're always travelling in a mob, especially when there's someone new to meet.
A large crowd of kids, all of whom are wired for communication.
AND that mob of kids is far less likely to be a pack of hooligans, do drugs or alcohol, or any of the other shit we did for "fun" (read, "O GOD WE'RE BORED") back in the dark ages.
Prediction: As this phenomenon gets recognized, the usual suspects will try to "regulate" and "guide" it, "for the children".
Fortunately, they will be totally out of their league.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 07:22:01 PM
they will be totally out of their league.
Are you sure? The government will want to expand their monitoring of electronic communications.
They have almost always succeeded, so far.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 07:22:01 PM
Prediction: As this phenomenon gets recognized, the usual suspects will try to "regulate" and "guide" it, "for the children".
Fortunately, they will be totally out of their league.
I suspect that this is one of the fundamental unspoken concerns about Google glass. Every police force must already be pushing for some kind of restriction or ban.
Add a decade say to this tech, and you should hopefully be at the point where you can voice command a stream direct to a news network of your choice. Accountability increases, hard to guess how much at this point but probably quite a bit.
Transmetropolitan seems closer than previously considered in some regards.
Quote from: Lord Cataplanga on July 18, 2013, 07:33:04 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 07:22:01 PM
they will be totally out of their league.
Are you sure? The government will want to expand their monitoring of electronic communications.
They have almost always succeeded, so far.
Good luck keeping up with 100,000,000 teenagers watching George Romero flicks.
But I'm talking about the CONCERNED people, who cannot trust kids to do something like this without PROPER OVERSIGHT. Not the government.
Quote from: Junkenstein on July 18, 2013, 07:33:32 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 07:22:01 PM
Prediction: As this phenomenon gets recognized, the usual suspects will try to "regulate" and "guide" it, "for the children".
Fortunately, they will be totally out of their league.
I suspect that this is one of the fundamental unspoken concerns about Google glass. Every police force must already be pushing for some kind of restriction or ban.
Add a decade say to this tech, and you should hopefully be at the point where you can voice command a stream direct to a news network of your choice. Accountability increases, hard to guess how much at this point but probably quite a bit.
Transmetropolitan seems closer than previously considered in some regards.
You can stop all sorts of shit, but you can't stop tech, especially once its in the hands of teenagers.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 07:22:01 PM
Prediction: As this phenomenon gets recognized, the usual suspects will try to "regulate" and "guide" it, "for the children".
Fortunately, they will be totally out of their league.
my prediction (and I don't know if you could call it a prediction because it's already happening at full force) is that we're going to see other groups like anonymous - decentralized tribes aligned along a common interest, who become something like an extended family.
and that some of these will be perceived as dangerous
and we're going to see an iterated form of the anti-gang PSA and anti-drugs PSA, starring contemporary cartoon characters.
((also, these cartoon characters will be ineffective in stopping kids from joining the furry tribe))
just imagine the awkward out-of-touch parent/kid conversations.
"It's okay to watch a little anime IN MODERATION. But be careful of fandoms, they can become dangerous. One thing leads to another, and then you'll be writing Chip & Dale Rescue Rangers slashfic."
dad stares out the window with a look of regret, a single tear runs down his cheek
Quote from: Cramulus on July 18, 2013, 07:45:03 PM
my prediction (and I don't know if you could call it a prediction because it's already happening at full force) is that we're going to see other groups like anonymous - decentralized tribes aligned along a common interest, who become something like an extended family.
and that some of these will be perceived as dangerous
and we're going to see an iterated form of the anti-gang PSA and anti-drugs PSA, starring contemporary cartoon characters.
((also, these cartoon characters will be ineffective in stopping kids from joining the furry tribe))
just imagine the awkward out-of-touch parent/kid conversations.
"It's okay to watch a little anime IN MODERATION. But be careful of fandoms, they can become dangerous. One thing leads to another, and then you'll be writing Chip & Dale Rescue Rangers slashfic."
dad stares out the window with a look of regret, a single tear runs down his cheek
:lulz:
Now I'm looking forward to it.
And damn right Anon is dangerous. Good on 'em. World needs shit like that.
Dok & Nigel, when did you start letting your small people on the internet unsupervised?
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:15:50 PM
Dok & Nigel, when did you start letting your small people on the internet unsupervised?
9 years old.
Quote from: M. Nigel Salt on July 18, 2013, 06:12:53 PM
Quote from: /b/earman on July 18, 2013, 06:05:32 PM
Wasn't a experiment done in Africa with kids using a cell phone, or laptop? Literally the kids retaught the village everything.
It showed communication is vital for progression.
Yep. A bunch of kids in a village were given tablets. The kids taught themselves to use the tablets, taught themselves English, and started hacking them and writing programs within 30 days, all without any outside instruction. They also taught the adults how to use them and started teaching them English.
:awesome:
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 08:20:55 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:15:50 PM
Dok & Nigel, when did you start letting your small people on the internet unsupervised?
9 years old.
:scared:
I really wish I could find the purse-clutching demon they stuck in my head, that guy makes life so fucking difficult.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 07:54:14 PM
Quote from: Cramulus on July 18, 2013, 07:45:03 PM
my prediction (and I don't know if you could call it a prediction because it's already happening at full force) is that we're going to see other groups like anonymous - decentralized tribes aligned along a common interest, who become something like an extended family.
and that some of these will be perceived as dangerous
and we're going to see an iterated form of the anti-gang PSA and anti-drugs PSA, starring contemporary cartoon characters.
((also, these cartoon characters will be ineffective in stopping kids from joining the furry tribe))
just imagine the awkward out-of-touch parent/kid conversations.
"It's okay to watch a little anime IN MODERATION. But be careful of fandoms, they can become dangerous. One thing leads to another, and then you'll be writing Chip & Dale Rescue Rangers slashfic."
dad stares out the window with a look of regret, a single tear runs down his cheek
:lulz:
Now I'm looking forward to it.
And damn right Anon is dangerous. Good on 'em. World needs shit like that.
You guys are warming my heart...
:vom:
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:23:01 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 08:20:55 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:15:50 PM
Dok & Nigel, when did you start letting your small people on the internet unsupervised?
9 years old.
:scared:
I really wish I could find the purse-clutching demon they stuck in my head, that guy makes life so fucking difficult.
YOU: Worry about them meeting pedos.
THEY: Are too busy watching flash animation to meet psychos.
YOU: Worry that they'll be exposed to violence.
THEY: Play Minecraft while you watch Law & Order SVU.
YOU: Worry about porn.
THEY: Watch cheesy old horror movies together.
I'm not even worried about porn, just pedos and the fact that the internet has a bad case of remembering shit you did when you were too dumb to know better.
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:43:52 PM
I'm not even worried about porn, just pedos and the fact that the internet has a bad case of remembering shit you did when you were too dumb to know better.
That latter needs to be driven home.
The former? prevention (IMO) can be accomplished in a few ways.
...Make sure they know what sex is, accurately (the accuracy being the important part)
...Tell them what pedophiles are, age-appropriately.
Tell them to tell you IMMEDIATELY if someone tries anything weird...no matter what that person says to them-or who it is.
Pedoes work through either guilting the child or threatening the child-death threats are not uncommon.
Please to note, 80% of children who are sexually abused? it's someone whom they know and trust.
(And the denial around THAT is a whole other thread. That whole stranger-danger BS?)
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:43:52 PM
I'm not even worried about porn, just pedos and the fact that the internet has a bad case of remembering shit you did when you were too dumb to know better.
Yeah, so, the official Doktor Howl interbutt safety briefing:
1. Never use your real name or tell anyone your phone number or address.
2. Never give anyone your password to anything.
3. Furries make the best trolling targets.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 09:04:43 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:43:52 PM
I'm not even worried about porn, just pedos and the fact that the internet has a bad case of remembering shit you did when you were too dumb to know better.
Yeah, so, the official Doktor Howl interbutt safety briefing:
1. Never use your real name or tell anyone your phone number or address.
2. Never give anyone your password to anything.
3. Furries make the best trolling targets.
Both of them already know 1 and 2 (with the exception of police officers when you get lost in a crowd), I guess I'm just nail-bitey because my girl's gonna be nine this fall and it's weird to think of her being almost double-digits, with all the cultural baggage that entails.
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 09:23:05 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 09:04:43 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:43:52 PM
I'm not even worried about porn, just pedos and the fact that the internet has a bad case of remembering shit you did when you were too dumb to know better.
Yeah, so, the official Doktor Howl interbutt safety briefing:
1. Never use your real name or tell anyone your phone number or address.
2. Never give anyone your password to anything.
3. Furries make the best trolling targets.
Both of them already know 1 and 2 (with the exception of police officers when you get lost in a crowd), I guess I'm just nail-bitey because my girl's gonna be nine this fall and it's weird to think of her being almost double-digits, with all the cultural baggage that entails.
Well, I had these friends back in junior high, right? Marshall and Daisy. Brother and sister, Daisy being the oldest (and also probably the prettiest girl I ever met in my life). Both smart, both responsible, both talented in the arts.
Their mom KEPT THEM SAFE. In fact, she kept them SO SAFE that they STILL LIVE IN HER HOUSE AT AGES 44 & 46. Neither one of them has ever had an SO, because nobody was good enough for Mother's Perfect Children in this AWFUL EVIL WORLD.
So, yeah. You have to let them grow up. Doesn't mean that there's no discipline or anything, or that they can just run wild. But sooner or later you have to let them fly a little on their own.
Or else.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 09:27:10 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 09:23:05 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 09:04:43 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:43:52 PM
I'm not even worried about porn, just pedos and the fact that the internet has a bad case of remembering shit you did when you were too dumb to know better.
Yeah, so, the official Doktor Howl interbutt safety briefing:
1. Never use your real name or tell anyone your phone number or address.
2. Never give anyone your password to anything.
3. Furries make the best trolling targets.
Both of them already know 1 and 2 (with the exception of police officers when you get lost in a crowd), I guess I'm just nail-bitey because my girl's gonna be nine this fall and it's weird to think of her being almost double-digits, with all the cultural baggage that entails.
Well, I had these friends back in junior high, right? Marshall and Daisy. Brother and sister, Daisy being the oldest (and also probably the prettiest girl I ever met in my life). Both smart, both responsible, both talented in the arts.
Their mom KEPT THEM SAFE. In fact, she kept them SO SAFE that they STILL LIVE IN HER HOUSE AT AGES 44 & 46. Neither one of them has ever had an SO, because nobody was good enough for Mother's Perfect Children in this AWFUL EVIL WORLD.
So, yeah. You have to let them grow up. Doesn't mean that there's no discipline or anything, or that they can just run wild. But sooner or later you have to let them fly a little on their own.
Or else.
There is that too.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 09:27:10 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 09:23:05 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 09:04:43 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:43:52 PM
I'm not even worried about porn, just pedos and the fact that the internet has a bad case of remembering shit you did when you were too dumb to know better.
Yeah, so, the official Doktor Howl interbutt safety briefing:
1. Never use your real name or tell anyone your phone number or address.
2. Never give anyone your password to anything.
3. Furries make the best trolling targets.
Both of them already know 1 and 2 (with the exception of police officers when you get lost in a crowd), I guess I'm just nail-bitey because my girl's gonna be nine this fall and it's weird to think of her being almost double-digits, with all the cultural baggage that entails.
Well, I had these friends back in junior high, right? Marshall and Daisy. Brother and sister, Daisy being the oldest (and also probably the prettiest girl I ever met in my life). Both smart, both responsible, both talented in the arts.
Their mom KEPT THEM SAFE. In fact, she kept them SO SAFE that they STILL LIVE IN HER HOUSE AT AGES 44 & 46. Neither one of them has ever had an SO, because nobody was good enough for Mother's Perfect Children in this AWFUL EVIL WORLD.
So, yeah. You have to let them grow up. Doesn't mean that there's no discipline or anything, or that they can just run wild. But sooner or later you have to let them fly a little on their own.
Or else.
Yeah, my sister kind of "or else"d, so I'm not trying to KEEP THEM SAFE, we even had a talk about how all of life is a risk of one kind or another, and if you never take any risks it kinda blows, you just have to learn to manage risks so you stand a good chance of getting to the fun stuff. It's just scary parenting stuff.
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 09:41:56 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 09:27:10 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 09:23:05 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 09:04:43 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:43:52 PM
I'm not even worried about porn, just pedos and the fact that the internet has a bad case of remembering shit you did when you were too dumb to know better.
Yeah, so, the official Doktor Howl interbutt safety briefing:
1. Never use your real name or tell anyone your phone number or address.
2. Never give anyone your password to anything.
3. Furries make the best trolling targets.
Both of them already know 1 and 2 (with the exception of police officers when you get lost in a crowd), I guess I'm just nail-bitey because my girl's gonna be nine this fall and it's weird to think of her being almost double-digits, with all the cultural baggage that entails.
Well, I had these friends back in junior high, right? Marshall and Daisy. Brother and sister, Daisy being the oldest (and also probably the prettiest girl I ever met in my life). Both smart, both responsible, both talented in the arts.
Their mom KEPT THEM SAFE. In fact, she kept them SO SAFE that they STILL LIVE IN HER HOUSE AT AGES 44 & 46. Neither one of them has ever had an SO, because nobody was good enough for Mother's Perfect Children in this AWFUL EVIL WORLD.
So, yeah. You have to let them grow up. Doesn't mean that there's no discipline or anything, or that they can just run wild. But sooner or later you have to let them fly a little on their own.
Or else.
Yeah, my sister kind of "or else"d, so I'm not trying to KEEP THEM SAFE, we even had a talk about how all of life is a risk of one kind or another, and if you never take any risks it kinda blows, you just have to learn to manage risks so you stand a good chance of getting to the fun stuff. It's just scary parenting stuff.
Yep. If it was easy, the world would be full of well-adjusted people.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 05:03:08 PM
During the daytime, my daughter hangs out with her friends IRL. In the evenings, they all get on their computers and watch bad movies together, laughing theirs asses off in the channel they're using.
My son does basically the same thing. And given the nature of this sort of thing, the groups slowly expand, so there's always a dozen or more people watching the really bad movie of the night. All it takes is logging in.
So they're never alone, unless they choose to be alone.
We've discussed how kids are so much more civilized over the last generation or two, and perhaps this has something to do with it? Each generation has more and more communications capability, to the point where every night is a bad movie party, even with friends that live hundreds of thousands of miles away?
Hell yeah.
I remember when a bunch of us got in in IRC to tear down the Palin / Chenney debate as it was happening.
It was hilarious, relevant to our level of politcs savvy, and no one person shouted out the channel since we all type in teh same volume.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 07:16:59 PM
Another thing that occurs to me is that this even reduces the really nastier risks children face...Because they're always travelling in a mob, especially when there's someone new to meet.
A large crowd of kids, all of whom are wired for communication.
Yep! People bitch about nine-year-olds having cell phones... but the result is that both kid and parents get a higher degree of freedom and safety.
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:15:50 PM
Dok & Nigel, when did you start letting your small people on the internet unsupervised?
Birth, pretty much.
I mean, "unsupervised" is really hard to say, because all the computers are in one room and none of us have laptops. But they have had unfettered access since they were old enough to control a mouse, so about 1. Sam used to get up at dawn, go downstairs, turn on the computer, and get on the Internet before we were awake, starting as soon as he could walk. I did keep safesearch turned on so they wouldn't accidentally find something they didn't want, but I have relied on conversations about being careful on the internet, rather than controls. I don't think controlling people helps them, I think it makes them resentful and sneaky, kids included.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 09:04:43 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:43:52 PM
I'm not even worried about porn, just pedos and the fact that the internet has a bad case of remembering shit you did when you were too dumb to know better.
Yeah, so, the official Doktor Howl interbutt safety briefing:
1. Never use your real name or tell anyone your phone number or address.
2. Never give anyone your password to anything.
3. Furries make the best trolling targets.
Add to this: Griefing is the basest form of trolling. If you feel you need to do it, be aware that someone may just track you down and beat you up.
Another thing to consider is that online communication somewhat makes peoples age irrelevant. If youd have told me when i was sixteen that by the time i was thirty i would have friends that were both ten years older and ten years younger than me i probably wouldnt have believed you.
Quote from: M. Nigel Salt on July 19, 2013, 08:30:30 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 09:04:43 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:43:52 PM
I'm not even worried about porn, just pedos and the fact that the internet has a bad case of remembering shit you did when you were too dumb to know better.
Yeah, so, the official Doktor Howl interbutt safety briefing:
1. Never use your real name or tell anyone your phone number or address.
2. Never give anyone your password to anything.
3. Furries make the best trolling targets.
Add to this: Griefing is the basest form of trolling. If you feel you need to do it, be aware that someone may just track you down and beat you up.
CAVEAT - Griefing done right is fucking wonderful. It's about the target, class and how funny you are.
Example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RedLyae4b2s
And hilarious result
QuoteThis attack in Second Life later became a template for a real life flying penis attack on chess world champion and Russian presidential candidate Garry Kasparov,[23] producing another example of how virtual actions can become a prototype for real-world action.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anshe_Chung
Quote from: Junkenstein on July 19, 2013, 11:46:32 PM
Quote from: M. Nigel Salt on July 19, 2013, 08:30:30 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 18, 2013, 09:04:43 PM
Quote from: Queen Gogira Pennyworth, BSW on July 18, 2013, 08:43:52 PM
I'm not even worried about porn, just pedos and the fact that the internet has a bad case of remembering shit you did when you were too dumb to know better.
Yeah, so, the official Doktor Howl interbutt safety briefing:
1. Never use your real name or tell anyone your phone number or address.
2. Never give anyone your password to anything.
3. Furries make the best trolling targets.
Add to this: Griefing is the basest form of trolling. If you feel you need to do it, be aware that someone may just track you down and beat you up.
CAVEAT - Griefing done right is fucking wonderful. It's about the target, class and how funny you are.
Example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RedLyae4b2s
You have a point. It's just that the typical ten-year-old has zero grasp on griefing with finesse.
My son is actually pretty good at it, and Little Orange is getting better and better all the time.