http://money.cnn.com/2015/02/05/technology/security/bitcoin-silk-road/?iid=EL
I LOLed at "prosecution futures".
Yeah it seems to be the most deluded fallacy to believe, the very system is peer to peer, every transaction leaves records on exchanges and on the machines processing it, all they have to do is prove that he used a computer that had access to the wallet.
That part seems really strange to me, for someone who understood the need for anonymity and had created his systems using a .tor domain you would think he would be smart enough to not link his personal laptop with that wallet. He could have bought any number of intermediaries, and hidden it away better.
Without that bitcoin wallet he could have argued he just hosts it, or maintains it etc for someone else. Bitcoin ended up being the irrefutable proof of his guilt. Oh well.
I think life imprisonment is too much for him, but he really got caught with the hand in the cookie jar, its hard to have too much sympathy.
I suspect he may have succumbed to the rich man's disease of thinking that he was untouchable? I don't know. He definitely didn't deserve life, but I am also not surprised that the judge chose to make an example of him.
Life? That is Entirely too severe a lesson for using persistence.
Well some of the charges they brought against him were attempting to buy a hitman on 5 separate occasions, I have no idea of the validity of those charges, I haven't read up on the case enough, but thats enough to escalate things to a life sentence.
Yeah, that kind of deserves it really. After failing to hire someone 3 times you've got to drop it or sort it out yourself.
That's why it annoys me when people say things like "if he had only used his brilliance to do something positive". Lack of ethical scruples is not the same as genius, and trying but failing to hire a hitman FIVE TIMES? Linking his Bitcoin account to his laptop? That's the kind of thing that just makes me irritated to realize that incompetents all over America are making millions.
My thinking would be to move that transaction not working to his credit. It seems like his uncharacteristic lack of ingenuity on the subject of murder demonstrates how he was not seriously thinking of going through with it. If he really wanted to, he would have got it done (that is my superficial and preliminary statement).
I'm no expert, however, since when do people get life for meta-attempted murder?
The price is not right.
Quote from: LuciferX on May 31, 2015, 09:49:54 PM
I'm no expert, however, since when do people get life for meta-attempted murder?
It's not really meta-attempted murder he was charged for, it was Conspiracy to commit a crime, which in this case its pretty clear cut, they had back and forth records with a number of parties.
I'm afraid I exaggerated the figure as Junkenstien says, it was 3 times he attempted to arrange the hits.
I've been racking my head trying to figure out why he was keeping the bitcoin wallet details on his machine instead of some kind of disposable machine located elsewhere and all I can come up with is paranoia that his wealth would be stolen from him if someone managed to get access to said disposable machine, in short greed.
With proper risk reward balancing the worst that would have happened is he loses his fortune and has to start over, instead, he gambled his freedom to protect that fortune and lost it all.
But then no one is accusing bitcoin users of prudent investment.
Quote from: Faust on May 31, 2015, 10:44:00 PM
Quote from: LuciferX on May 31, 2015, 09:49:54 PM
I'm no expert, however, since when do people get life for meta-attempted murder?
It's not really meta-attempted murder he was charged for, it was Conspiracy to commit a crime, which in this case its pretty clear cut, they had back and forth records with a number of parties.
I'm afraid I exaggerated the figure as Junkenstien says, it was 3 times he attempted to arrange the hits.
I've been racking my head trying to figure out why he was keeping the bitcoin wallet details on his machine instead of some kind of disposable machine located elsewhere and all I can come up with is paranoia that his wealth would be stolen from him if someone managed to get access to said disposable machine, in short greed.
With proper risk reward balancing the worst that would have happened is he loses his fortune and has to start over, instead, he gambled his freedom to protect that fortune and lost it all.
But then no one is accusing bitcoin users of prudent investment.
I agree with your conclusion, yet it does not validate the premise. It seems unreasonable that One persons OPSEC would fail so miserably, given all the precautions taken. The lead seems contrived so I keep defaulting to thinking he just took the fall.
Then, recently, I skimmed some of DPR's posts that indicate a type of maniacal thinking, perhaps lending itself to lapses of reason, and subsequent security breach(es).
So, to summarize, I don't have a clear picture, yet.
3 was more of a gut feeling based on the following logic:
You want to kill a guy. You don't want to do it yourself. You don't want to get caught.
The WORST possible thing is potential witnesses or others who know anything about your willingness to hire a murderer.
So surely if a hitman turns you down, the next one you're talking to, you automatically have to talk about two murders now.
By the time you get to 5 rejections you're killing half a dozen people (at least, assuming everyone works solo and is reliably mute) just to get the original guy who pissed you off killed. This also assumes that none of the previous 5 decided to get rich by selling the info to your target in the meanwhile.
It also assumes that murderers for hire are willing to work for bitcoin. I would have suspected they would prefer something more tangible. Like, say, anything. I wouldn't be surprised if that's what killed every would be murder pact. "Kill this guy and I'll make you a millionaire in something that's kind of like money but not really".
According to the closing statements of the judge, he hired a conman posing as a hitman to kill five different people, and this act was factored into his sentencing.
Yeah, In Ireland there was a case a few years ago when a woman tried to hire a man to kill her husband, she got six years in jail for conspiracy to commit murder. The funny thing is that her sentence was reduced because her husband was a witness for the defense and lobbied for her after the charge, paying for the appeals.
If you were to take into account the repeated nature of DPR's actions a life sentence doesn't seem at all outrageous.
Quote from: Cain on June 01, 2015, 02:24:57 PM
According to the closing statements of the judge, he hired a conman posing as a hitman to kill five different people, and this act was factored into his sentencing.
"...You are dumb for believing in the offer of the group rate."
£5 says he was targeting previous conmen who also posed as hitmen.
TL;Don't want to read?: This guy made a lot of mistakes, and here's how not to make them.
Also the government knows what you fap to when you're not busy. And they know the method by which you fap. And they can psychologically explain why and how you fap based on the slant in your handwriting and whether or not you use verb tenses correctly. And this information can be used to put you in the slammer.
If you want something done, do it your goddamn self. If you don't have the time, use someone you consider to be an extension of yourself. My closest friends would do anything I asked in that regard. But I wouldn't use them if I didn't understand them through and through.
If you plan on becoming a murderer or conspiring to commit murder, go into a career that gives you the information you need to avoid getting caught, like Crime Scene Investigator or something in Crime Lab. Or maybe just get the text books and keep yourself updated on the new tech.
If you wanna stay anonymous with your banking and transactions, make some foreign friends. It can take years to gather the amount of human resources you need to run something that big. You know what would be better than foreign friends, though? Lobbyist friends. The high-rolling ones. The ones that deal with the FBI for example, or the DEA. This kind of business is all about friends and connections. Junkenstein is right. If you wanna hire a stranger to do something illegal, and they reject you, then you better be making sure they're either playing for the right side, or they better be in a body bag within the week. And make sure your organization (If you're organized) isn't connected to their death. Dead potential business partners or dead previous contacts are bad for business, unless you tactically planned one to send a message.
If you're running something on the black market/deep web like he was, you should know to assume every single person that you encounter on the deep web is a fucking narc. Assume everyone is in the FBI, and you'll never do anything stupid enough to get caught. That was the first rule of the 70s-90s phone phreaker crowd, and that hasn't changed for the Deep Web crowd. This guy probably got comfortable talking to people on the Deep Web and gave a little bit too much information to one of the "Hit-men." Or was incapable of killing the rejecting "hit-men" before the end of the week (End of the week is more of a suggested amount of time. Some, if they are suspicious, might require some early retaliation, while others might just be a basic, mostly non-threatening loose end).
Keep in mind that if you think the government doesn't suspect you of the crimes you've tried to cover up, you're wrong. They don't just have a report on all of your internet and phone communications and bank accounts and everything. They also have a psychological profile that outlines behavioral tendencies and writing styles. You better be good at changing your writing style for different environments if you wanna at least stay under the radar. Most of the time, the only reason you're not in jail for what you did is because they're waiting for you to lead them to another criminal or criminal organization. Or it's because they can't use legally (Or mostly legally) obtained evidence to convict you. And if your crime is big enough, you better not be able to remember your passwords, because if you can remember it, you're kidding yourself if you think they won't get it out of you by any means necessary.
And finally, the device you're using for transactions, illegal communications, and sensitive transfers, should be amnesiac via Live Disc OS or it should be disposable, as Faust stated (Destroyed, completely, when disposed of). (FOR GOD'S FUCKING SAKE, DON'T FUCKING USE YOUR OWN WIFI THAT YOU PAY FOR. FUCK.) I wouldn't trust any encryption that the government doesn't use for top-secret communications. It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
TL;Don't want to read?: This guy made a lot of mistakes, and here's how not to make them.
Also the government knows what you fap to when you're not busy. And they know the method by which you fap. And they can psychologically explain why and how you fap based on the slant in your handwriting and whether or not you use verb tenses correctly. And this information can be used to put you in the slammer.
If you want something done, do it your goddamn self. If you don't have the time, use someone you consider to be an extension of yourself. My closest friends would do anything I asked in that regard. But I wouldn't use them if I didn't understand them through and through.
If you plan on becoming a murderer or conspiring to commit murder, go into a career that gives you the information you need to avoid getting caught, like Crime Scene Investigator or something in Crime Lab. Or maybe just get the text books and keep yourself updated on the new tech.
If you wanna stay anonymous with your banking and transactions, make some foreign friends. It can take years to gather the amount of human resources you need to run something that big. You know what would be better than foreign friends, though? Lobbyist friends. The high-rolling ones. The ones that deal with the FBI for example, or the DEA. This kind of business is all about friends and connections. Junkenstein is right. If you wanna hire a stranger to do something illegal, and they reject you, then you better be making sure they're either playing for the right side, or they better be in a body bag within the week. And make sure your organization (If you're organized) isn't connected to their death. Dead potential business partners or dead previous contacts are bad for business, unless you tactically planned one to send a message.
If you're running something on the black market/deep web like he was, you should know to assume every single person that you encounter on the deep web is a fucking narc. Assume everyone is in the FBI, and you'll never do anything stupid enough to get caught. That was the first rule of the 70s-90s phone phreaker crowd, and that hasn't changed for the Deep Web crowd. This guy probably got comfortable talking to people on the Deep Web and gave a little bit too much information to one of the "Hit-men." Or was incapable of killing the rejecting "hit-men" before the end of the week (End of the week is more of a suggested amount of time. Some, if they are suspicious, might require some early retaliation, while others might just be a basic, mostly non-threatening loose end).
Keep in mind that if you think the government doesn't suspect you of the crimes you've tried to cover up, you're wrong. They don't just have a report on all of your internet and phone communications and bank accounts and everything. They also have a psychological profile that outlines behavioral tendencies and writing styles. You better be good at changing your writing style for different environments if you wanna at least stay under the radar. Most of the time, the only reason you're not in jail for what you did is because they're waiting for you to lead them to another criminal or criminal organization. Or it's because they can't use legally (Or mostly legally) obtained evidence to convict you. And if your crime is big enough, you better not be able to remember your passwords, because if you can remember it, you're kidding yourself if you think they won't get it out of you by any means necessary.
And finally, the device you're using for transactions, illegal communications, and sensitive transfers, should be amnesiac via Live Disc OS or it should be disposable, as Faust stated (Destroyed, completely, when disposed of). (FOR GOD'S FUCKING SAKE, DON'T FUCKING USE YOUR OWN WIFI THAT YOU PAY FOR. FUCK.) I wouldn't trust any encryption that the government doesn't use for top-secret communications. It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
What are you doing?
Currently, my view of the case is that a man was sentenced to life with a crime for which he was never charged. Outstanding work.
Quote from: N E T on June 02, 2015, 12:11:27 AM
What are you doing?
Stating how to take precautions that enable you to do what DPR was doing WITHOUT going to prison for life. Also, I connected some of what the others stated to my purpose.
Was I too verbose and off-topic with this one? I do that sometimes, especially when it's about topics I'm
obsessed with. :oops:
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
TL;Don't want to read?: This guy made a lot of mistakes, and here's how not to make them.
Also the government knows what you fap to when you're not busy. And they know the method by which you fap. And they can psychologically explain why and how you fap based on the slant in your handwriting and whether or not you use verb tenses correctly. And this information can be used to put you in the slammer.
If you want something done, do it your goddamn self. If you don't have the time, use someone you consider to be an extension of yourself. My closest friends would do anything I asked in that regard. But I wouldn't use them if I didn't understand them through and through.
If you plan on becoming a murderer or conspiring to commit murder, go into a career that gives you the information you need to avoid getting caught, like Crime Scene Investigator or something in Crime Lab. Or maybe just get the text books and keep yourself updated on the new tech.
If you wanna stay anonymous with your banking and transactions, make some foreign friends. It can take years to gather the amount of human resources you need to run something that big. You know what would be better than foreign friends, though? Lobbyist friends. The high-rolling ones. The ones that deal with the FBI for example, or the DEA. This kind of business is all about friends and connections. Junkenstein is right. If you wanna hire a stranger to do something illegal, and they reject you, then you better be making sure they're either playing for the right side, or they better be in a body bag within the week. And make sure your organization (If you're organized) isn't connected to their death. Dead potential business partners or dead previous contacts are bad for business, unless you tactically planned one to send a message.
If you're running something on the black market/deep web like he was, you should know to assume every single person that you encounter on the deep web is a fucking narc. Assume everyone is in the FBI, and you'll never do anything stupid enough to get caught. That was the first rule of the 70s-90s phone phreaker crowd, and that hasn't changed for the Deep Web crowd. This guy probably got comfortable talking to people on the Deep Web and gave a little bit too much information to one of the "Hit-men." Or was incapable of killing the rejecting "hit-men" before the end of the week (End of the week is more of a suggested amount of time. Some, if they are suspicious, might require some early retaliation, while others might just be a basic, mostly non-threatening loose end).
Keep in mind that if you think the government doesn't suspect you of the crimes you've tried to cover up, you're wrong. They don't just have a report on all of your internet and phone communications and bank accounts and everything. They also have a psychological profile that outlines behavioral tendencies and writing styles. You better be good at changing your writing style for different environments if you wanna at least stay under the radar. Most of the time, the only reason you're not in jail for what you did is because they're waiting for you to lead them to another criminal or criminal organization. Or it's because they can't use legally (Or mostly legally) obtained evidence to convict you. And if your crime is big enough, you better not be able to remember your passwords, because if you can remember it, you're kidding yourself if you think they won't get it out of you by any means necessary.
And finally, the device you're using for transactions, illegal communications, and sensitive transfers, should be amnesiac via Live Disc OS or it should be disposable, as Faust stated (Destroyed, completely, when disposed of). (FOR GOD'S FUCKING SAKE, DON'T FUCKING USE YOUR OWN WIFI THAT YOU PAY FOR. FUCK.) I wouldn't trust any encryption that the government doesn't use for top-secret communications. It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
Aren't you cute?
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 02, 2015, 12:45:38 AM
Quote from: N E T on June 02, 2015, 12:11:27 AM
What are you doing?
Stating how to take precautions that enable you to do what DPR was doing WITHOUT going to prison for life. Also, I connected some of what the others stated to my purpose.
Was I too verbose and off-topic with this one? I do that sometimes, especially when it's about topics I'm obsessed with. :oops:
Won't work, even with all your precautions the probability of getting caught is still over 80%
Also, why are you writing a how-to for murder? Murder is bad, stop trying to teach people how to do it.
Also also, you are implying that privacy is only used for bad things, stop conflating my desire to not be watched all the time with organized crime.
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on June 02, 2015, 07:49:09 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
TL;Don't want to read?: This guy made a lot of mistakes, and here's how not to make them.
Also the government knows what you fap to when you're not busy. And they know the method by which you fap. And they can psychologically explain why and how you fap based on the slant in your handwriting and whether or not you use verb tenses correctly. And this information can be used to put you in the slammer.
If you want something done, do it your goddamn self. If you don't have the time, use someone you consider to be an extension of yourself. My closest friends would do anything I asked in that regard. But I wouldn't use them if I didn't understand them through and through.
If you plan on becoming a murderer or conspiring to commit murder, go into a career that gives you the information you need to avoid getting caught, like Crime Scene Investigator or something in Crime Lab. Or maybe just get the text books and keep yourself updated on the new tech.
If you wanna stay anonymous with your banking and transactions, make some foreign friends. It can take years to gather the amount of human resources you need to run something that big. You know what would be better than foreign friends, though? Lobbyist friends. The high-rolling ones. The ones that deal with the FBI for example, or the DEA. This kind of business is all about friends and connections. Junkenstein is right. If you wanna hire a stranger to do something illegal, and they reject you, then you better be making sure they're either playing for the right side, or they better be in a body bag within the week. And make sure your organization (If you're organized) isn't connected to their death. Dead potential business partners or dead previous contacts are bad for business, unless you tactically planned one to send a message.
If you're running something on the black market/deep web like he was, you should know to assume every single person that you encounter on the deep web is a fucking narc. Assume everyone is in the FBI, and you'll never do anything stupid enough to get caught. That was the first rule of the 70s-90s phone phreaker crowd, and that hasn't changed for the Deep Web crowd. This guy probably got comfortable talking to people on the Deep Web and gave a little bit too much information to one of the "Hit-men." Or was incapable of killing the rejecting "hit-men" before the end of the week (End of the week is more of a suggested amount of time. Some, if they are suspicious, might require some early retaliation, while others might just be a basic, mostly non-threatening loose end).
Keep in mind that if you think the government doesn't suspect you of the crimes you've tried to cover up, you're wrong. They don't just have a report on all of your internet and phone communications and bank accounts and everything. They also have a psychological profile that outlines behavioral tendencies and writing styles. You better be good at changing your writing style for different environments if you wanna at least stay under the radar. Most of the time, the only reason you're not in jail for what you did is because they're waiting for you to lead them to another criminal or criminal organization. Or it's because they can't use legally (Or mostly legally) obtained evidence to convict you. And if your crime is big enough, you better not be able to remember your passwords, because if you can remember it, you're kidding yourself if you think they won't get it out of you by any means necessary.
And finally, the device you're using for transactions, illegal communications, and sensitive transfers, should be amnesiac via Live Disc OS or it should be disposable, as Faust stated (Destroyed, completely, when disposed of). (FOR GOD'S FUCKING SAKE, DON'T FUCKING USE YOUR OWN WIFI THAT YOU PAY FOR. FUCK.) I wouldn't trust any encryption that the government doesn't use for top-secret communications. It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
Aren't you cute?
Its 5am, but this is entertaining. Its like im Neo from the Matrix and some guru is teaching me how to commit felonies i dont know what for yet.
Now the real question is RED pill or BLUE pill i forget.
Literally everything in there is bad advice, even the AES thing is contentious, with most people saying don't use standards the three letter agencies were involved with, the one I see that seems to be the most popular at the moment is PGP.
#LIFEHACKING TIP 42069 -Murdering someone
If you want to murder someone, don't just rush out and do it. Get a job as a Crime Scene Investigator or something in Crime Lab.
With a lucrative new career as a forensic investigator you can enjoy the spoils of new found wealth and job fulfillment, this will make your initial gripe with that person seem insignificant and the need to murder redundant.
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 11:40:21 AM
#LIFEHACKING TIP 42069 -Murdering someone
If you want to murder someone, don't just rush out and do it. Get a job as a Crime Scene Investigator or something in Crime Lab.
With a lucrative new career as a forensic investigator you can enjoy the spoils of new found wealth and job fulfillment, this will make your initial gripe with that person seem insignificant and the need to murder redundant.
:lol:
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 11:40:21 AM
#LIFEHACKING TIP 42069 -Murdering someone
If you want to murder someone, don't just rush out and do it. Get a job as a Crime Scene Investigator or something in Crime Lab.
With a lucrative new career as a forensic investigator you can enjoy the spoils of new found wealth and job fulfillment, this will make your initial gripe with that person seem insignificant and the need to murder redundant.
:lulz: :lulz: :lulz:
I'll respond piecemeal while I get break times at work, or I will respond completely all at once much later on in the night. Either way, I'm getting mixed feelings on this one. I either a) Continue the debate through clarification of methodology for committing crimes - Something that appears to be morally objectionable to people on this board, or b) I let this go, swallow my pride, and just get laughed at for awhile. Decisions, decisions...
I'm just messing with you, I get what you meant with a lot of what you said, you just have a terrible way of phrasing some of it.
Idk man you just sounded like those arm-chair gun experts... who was that guy? The resident nazi we had? That waxed on about rifles, the models and calibers which also sounds like those guys with break-in fantasies about luring the intruder then killing them in some intricate manner and getting off legally clean.
Sort of a try-hard amateur expert-non-expert.
That's all there is to it.
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 08:13:16 PM
I'm just messing with you, I get what you meant with a lot of what you said, you just have a terrible way of phrasing some of it.
When I get into my fan-girl/enthusiast rants, I tend to leave out the info and phrasing that
sells it. Or maybe that's my problem. Maybe I'm trying to
sell it too much.
I know that I'm verbose with what I say, so I try to tone it down when I can. But sometimes, that just leads to me leaving out necessary information. When you, yourself, know what you're talking about, sometimes it's hard to prioritize information correctly. It makes it even harder when you're trying to be flashy and entertaining at the same time. I just gotta work on it.
At the same time, I don't wanna just throw out the fact that you might have some good points against what I said. Or that anyone has some good points, for that matter.
Quote from: The Johnny on June 02, 2015, 08:33:35 PM
Idk man you just sounded like those arm-chair gun experts... who was that guy? The resident nazi we had? That waxed on about rifles, the models and calibers which also sounds like those guys with break-in fantasies about luring the intruder then killing them in some intricate manner and getting off legally clean.
Sort of a try-hard amateur expert-non-expert.
That's all there is to it.
I always feel like that. No matter how much time I spend looking into a subject, I always feel like I've just barely scratched the surface.
On top of that, I have to worry about getting too in-depth, which can cause some readers to zone out, as well as making sure I get precise enough for those who do know what I'm talking about.
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 11:23:21 AM
Literally everything in there is bad advice, even the AES thing is contentious, with most people saying don't use standards the three letter agencies were involved with, the one I see that seems to be the most popular at the moment is PGP.
Yea, PGP.
Also, I think most AES implementations are symmetric block-cyphers, so not as robust as public key for communication. IIRC, RSA used to be good, and then I heard some things about DES possibly being compromised, but I always get the two mixed-up, and, I forget why, but I don't use Elgamal.
If anyone remembers, long, long ago, when Veronica was bigger than the Web, domestic PGP releases had more options for the cypher, and, it was illegal to export certain keys. Being caught abroad with said cyphers amounted to international weapons trafficking; fun stuff, the good 'ol days.
Seems like I'm due for a little refresher course.
Just a FYI for everyone, even talking about how to evade criminal detection techniques can be used against you as proof of intentional deception in a court of law.
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 02, 2015, 08:59:29 PM
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 08:13:16 PM
I'm just messing with you, I get what you meant with a lot of what you said, you just have a terrible way of phrasing some of it.
When I get into my fan-girl/enthusiast rants, I tend to leave out the info and phrasing that sells it. Or maybe that's my problem. Maybe I'm trying to sell it too much.
I know that I'm verbose with what I say, so I try to tone it down when I can. But sometimes, that just leads to me leaving out necessary information. When you, yourself, know what you're talking about, sometimes it's hard to prioritize information correctly. It makes it even harder when you're trying to be flashy and entertaining at the same time. I just gotta work on it.
At the same time, I don't wanna just throw out the fact that you might have some good points against what I said. Or that anyone has some good points, for that matter.
Quote from: The Johnny on June 02, 2015, 08:33:35 PM
Idk man you just sounded like those arm-chair gun experts... who was that guy? The resident nazi we had? That waxed on about rifles, the models and calibers which also sounds like those guys with break-in fantasies about luring the intruder then killing them in some intricate manner and getting off legally clean.
Sort of a try-hard amateur expert-non-expert.
That's all there is to it.
I always feel like that. No matter how much time I spend looking into a subject, I always feel like I've just barely scratched the surface.
On top of that, I have to worry about getting too in-depth, which can cause some readers to zone out, as well as making sure I get precise enough for those who do know what I'm talking about.
No, the verbosity and detail are fine, most of us take an interest at breaking things down and seeing how they work, but we're all civilians here that aren't experts at such things, so its just ends up being reading about crime-fiction... and im sure we're capable of outputting our creativity to better things.
Quote from: The Johnny on June 02, 2015, 10:06:58 PM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 02, 2015, 08:59:29 PM
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 08:13:16 PM
I'm just messing with you, I get what you meant with a lot of what you said, you just have a terrible way of phrasing some of it.
When I get into my fan-girl/enthusiast rants, I tend to leave out the info and phrasing that sells it. Or maybe that's my problem. Maybe I'm trying to sell it too much.
I know that I'm verbose with what I say, so I try to tone it down when I can. But sometimes, that just leads to me leaving out necessary information. When you, yourself, know what you're talking about, sometimes it's hard to prioritize information correctly. It makes it even harder when you're trying to be flashy and entertaining at the same time. I just gotta work on it.
At the same time, I don't wanna just throw out the fact that you might have some good points against what I said. Or that anyone has some good points, for that matter.
Quote from: The Johnny on June 02, 2015, 08:33:35 PM
Idk man you just sounded like those arm-chair gun experts... who was that guy? The resident nazi we had? That waxed on about rifles, the models and calibers which also sounds like those guys with break-in fantasies about luring the intruder then killing them in some intricate manner and getting off legally clean.
Sort of a try-hard amateur expert-non-expert.
That's all there is to it.
I always feel like that. No matter how much time I spend looking into a subject, I always feel like I've just barely scratched the surface.
On top of that, I have to worry about getting too in-depth, which can cause some readers to zone out, as well as making sure I get precise enough for those who do know what I'm talking about.
No, the verbosity and detail are fine, most of us take an interest at breaking things down and seeing how they work, but we're all civilians here that aren't experts at such things, so its just ends up being reading about crime-fiction... and im sure we're capable of outputting our creativity to better things.
Point taken. Kinda silly to point your creative effort into a field that you don't plan on working in. I never really thought of it that way.
Now I'm trying to think of a way to put the information into a format that reads like a security article. Security is what I'm interested in, mainly. I like breaking things down and seeing how things work. But sometimes, I get a little more of a rise out of the "breaking things down" part than I do the "seeing how things work" part.
I wanna be in a line of work that deals with security. Whether or not it will be about building it up (By analyzing it as it breaks down), or breaking it down for personal gain, is what I can't decide on.
Quote from: Cain on June 02, 2015, 09:57:30 PM
Just a FYI for everyone, even talking about how to evade criminal detection techniques can be used against you as proof of intentional deception in a court of law.
I would totally be a defense lawyer if it didn't require amazing memory. Then I could get paid to use bullshit, fallacious precedents and arguments, instead of trying to be precise and accurate in debates on here for free.
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 02, 2015, 06:26:06 PM
a) Continue the debate through clarification of methodology for committing crimes - Something that appears to be morally objectionable to people on this board,
I have no moral objections against most crimes, murder is another matter though.
Wait, you meant clarification = morally objectionable. In that case my position shifts:
Clarifying methodology of doing murder I would be fine with, but teaching people how to get away with it lowers the social cost of murder thereby making it more common.
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 11:40:21 AM
#LIFEHACKING TIP 42069 -Murdering someone
If you want to murder someone, don't just rush out and do it. Get a job as a Crime Scene Investigator or something in Crime Lab.
With a lucrative new career as a forensic investigator you can enjoy the spoils of new found wealth and job fulfillment, this will make your initial gripe with that person seem insignificant and the need to murder redundant.
:lol:
I know that for myself, when I think I might get a hankerin' for murder, the first thing I do is spend six years working on a Master's Degree in Forensic Genetics so that I can be qualified to work in a crime lab.
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 02, 2015, 08:59:29 PM
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 08:13:16 PM
I'm just messing with you, I get what you meant with a lot of what you said, you just have a terrible way of phrasing some of it.
When I get into my fan-girl/enthusiast rants, I tend to leave out the info and phrasing that sells it. Or maybe that's my problem. Maybe I'm trying to sell it too much.
I know that I'm verbose with what I say, so I try to tone it down when I can. But sometimes, that just leads to me leaving out necessary information. When you, yourself, know what you're talking about, sometimes it's hard to prioritize information correctly. It makes it even harder when you're trying to be flashy and entertaining at the same time. I just gotta work on it.
At the same time, I don't wanna just throw out the fact that you might have some good points against what I said. Or that anyone has some good points, for that matter.
Quote from: The Johnny on June 02, 2015, 08:33:35 PM
Idk man you just sounded like those arm-chair gun experts... who was that guy? The resident nazi we had? That waxed on about rifles, the models and calibers which also sounds like those guys with break-in fantasies about luring the intruder then killing them in some intricate manner and getting off legally clean.
Sort of a try-hard amateur expert-non-expert.
That's all there is to it.
I always feel like that. No matter how much time I spend looking into a subject, I always feel like I've just barely scratched the surface.
On top of that, I have to worry about getting too in-depth, which can cause some readers to zone out, as well as making sure I get precise enough for those who do know what I'm talking about.
You can be a murder fanboi all you want, that doesn't mean you could get away with one, or advise someone else on how to. Keep in mind that people are getting convicted (and exonerated) all the time on the basis of evidence uncovered with technologies that didn't even exist when the crime was committed.
People get away with murder all the time, it's true. Not necessarily because they planned it perfectly, though. Planning is methodical, and method is predictable.
And that's not even delving into the psychology behind being a murder fanboi, which I can only speculate might arise from a very sad sense of disempowerment and helplessness. Most people don't feel that way, and hence may tend to find your hobby creepy, juvenile, and distasteful.
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 11:23:21 AM
Literally everything in there is bad advice, even the AES thing is contentious, with most people saying don't use standards the three letter agencies were involved with, the one I see that seems to be the most popular at the moment is PGP.
As far as I know, AES is still an algorithm that still gives the NSA trouble. However, I forgot to specify that AES was the best for stored data, and that communications would be more effectively hidden by some other form of encryption system. I was thinking more in the realm of efficiency and bandwidth control, though. Until I just looked it up recently, I had no idea of the flaws AES creates when dealing with communications. Also, I was not aware of PGP's popularity at the time of writing this. Admittedly, I had no idea PGP even existed. Obviously this was poor research on my part.
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 11:40:21 AM
#LIFEHACKING TIP 42069 -Murdering someone
If you want to murder someone, don't just rush out and do it. Get a job as a Crime Scene Investigator or something in Crime Lab.
With a lucrative new career as a forensic investigator you can enjoy the spoils of new found wealth and job fulfillment, this will make your initial gripe with that person seem insignificant and the need to murder redundant.
:lulz: I feel like it would be fallacious to try and say that I intended to specify that CSI would be a good official career path if you wanted to make a career out of crime and murder, not if you just wanted to get rid of one person. It would probably sound like an ass-covering through hindsight. So I'll just let you have this one.
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on June 03, 2015, 04:58:29 PM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 02, 2015, 08:59:29 PM
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 08:13:16 PM
I'm just messing with you, I get what you meant with a lot of what you said, you just have a terrible way of phrasing some of it.
When I get into my fan-girl/enthusiast rants, I tend to leave out the info and phrasing that sells it. Or maybe that's my problem. Maybe I'm trying to sell it too much.
I know that I'm verbose with what I say, so I try to tone it down when I can. But sometimes, that just leads to me leaving out necessary information. When you, yourself, know what you're talking about, sometimes it's hard to prioritize information correctly. It makes it even harder when you're trying to be flashy and entertaining at the same time. I just gotta work on it.
At the same time, I don't wanna just throw out the fact that you might have some good points against what I said. Or that anyone has some good points, for that matter.
Quote from: The Johnny on June 02, 2015, 08:33:35 PM
Idk man you just sounded like those arm-chair gun experts... who was that guy? The resident nazi we had? That waxed on about rifles, the models and calibers which also sounds like those guys with break-in fantasies about luring the intruder then killing them in some intricate manner and getting off legally clean.
Sort of a try-hard amateur expert-non-expert.
That's all there is to it.
I always feel like that. No matter how much time I spend looking into a subject, I always feel like I've just barely scratched the surface.
On top of that, I have to worry about getting too in-depth, which can cause some readers to zone out, as well as making sure I get precise enough for those who do know what I'm talking about.
You can be a murder fanboi all you want, that doesn't mean you could get away with one, or advise someone else on how to. Keep in mind that people are getting convicted (and exonerated) all the time on the basis of evidence uncovered with technologies that didn't even exist when the crime was committed.
People get away with murder all the time, it's true. Not necessarily because they planned it perfectly, though. Planning is methodical, and method is predictable.
And that's not even delving into the psychology behind being a murder fanboi, which I can only speculate might arise from a very sad sense of disempowerment and helplessness. Most people don't feel that way, and hence may tend to find your hobby creepy, juvenile, and distasteful.
I think you misunderstood where my interests and obsessions lie. It's not about killing, with me. It's about figuring out how to bypass a system that's supposed to catch you doing it or keep you from doing it. Again, my hobby is security.
Some may ask themselves, "Why be on the offensive side of security?" And others may answer "Well, without the offensive side of security, we could never build security up." And then, the natural response is, "But if it weren't for offensive security enthusiasts, or people who are on the offensive, we wouldn't need security in the first place. You're contributing to the wrong side. You're adding more soldiers to the army that's destroying what we care about."
So, why do I like it? Because I see security as a set, or system of walls and enclosures. A maze, full of dead ends and loops. It feels pretty good to break things like walls. If you haven't done it before, I suggest you try it.
You see, I can't stand limitations. I like to think there are little vulnerabilities and holes in the walls of my reality, and in the walls of the world in my reality. If I'm gonna see what's outside of my reality, I gotta break through to the outside first, or at least take a peek through the holes. When making additions to a house, do we not have to put a door or opening in to make the sure the addition is functional?
To improve, or extend life, we must first understand death. If your goal is to survive, you must be familiar with the failure to survive. Maintenance of life is achieved through security. If you don't see the flaws in the security, or understand them, then your life will be limited. I see every death as a failure in security - A sign of a vulnerability. The end-goal, of course, is to make sure every person's security is 100% voluntary. Well, actually, my goal is to make sure that
my security is voluntary. Note that I don't mean 100% infallible. You can't have life without death. They are two sides of the same coin. I just want my death to be my choice. Well, mostly.
OK, that's fair. Still a little mall-cop or wannabe-ninja from my perspective, but I will try to rein myself in.
I mean, one of my longtime close friends is a former hacker turned white hat. Security is totally a legitimate line of work. It's the armchair part that's hard to take seriously, honestly.
As we decided when I first came to this board, I am preachy. It has its perks. But it also has its drawbacks. One of them is that I sound like an armchair enthusiast when I've still got lots to learn. I also romanticize things that can be upsetting to the average Joe/Jane. I know that that will cause some issues in understanding, sometimes. I'm still workin on it.
Just under a year until I've been on this Earth two decades. So I feel like I've got some time to be weird as fuck. At least for a little while.
I think the reason many of us are eye-rolling is because we've mostly all had some practical experience of security work, or know someone who has.
Roger: cop, hired muscle.
Me: terrorism expert, occasional private security contractor
Junkenstein: works with explosives all day every day
ECH: experience on the "other side of the fence", so to speak
Faust: enough tech and programming knowledge to know about net security
NET: I think did some network maintenance style job, a while back? not sure.
Paes: showed security flaws on some major politicians site in his country
And I'm sure I'm forgetting a few.
Quote from: Cain on June 04, 2015, 05:08:16 PM
I think the reason many of us are eye-rolling is because we've mostly all had some practical experience of security work, or know someone who has.
Roger: cop, hired muscle.
Me: terrorism expert, occasional private security contractor
Junkenstein: works with explosives all day every day
ECH: experience on the "other side of the fence", so to speak
Faust: enough tech and programming knowledge to know about net security
NET: I think did some network maintenance style job, a while back? not sure.
Paes: showed security flaws on some major politicians site in his country
And I'm sure I'm forgetting a few.
The Science Gestapo was more experience in a much smaller can. But yeah.
Quote from: Cain on June 04, 2015, 05:08:16 PM
I think the reason many of us are eye-rolling is because we've mostly all had some practical experience of security work, or know someone who has.
Roger: cop, hired muscle.
Me: terrorism expert, occasional private security contractor
Junkenstein: works with explosives all day every day
ECH: experience on the "other side of the fence", so to speak
Faust: enough tech and programming knowledge to know about net security
NET: I think did some network maintenance style job, a while back? not sure.
Paes: showed security flaws on some major politicians site in his country
And I'm sure I'm forgetting a few.
Plenty of real-world experience that I don't have would make my views a bit far-fetched. I kinda only have an observer's perspective, if that wasn't obvious. It's all completely understandable.
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 04, 2015, 02:25:23 AM
Quote from: Faust on June 02, 2015, 11:23:21 AM
Literally everything in there is bad advice, even the AES thing is contentious, with most people saying don't use standards the three letter agencies were involved with, the one I see that seems to be the most popular at the moment is PGP.
As far as I know, AES is still an algorithm that still gives the NSA trouble. However, I forgot to specify that AES was the best for stored data, and that communications would be more effectively hidden by some other form of encryption system. I was thinking more in the realm of efficiency and bandwidth control, though. Until I just looked it up recently, I had no idea of the flaws AES creates when dealing with communications. Also, I was not aware of PGP's popularity at the time of writing this. Admittedly, I had no idea PGP even existed. Obviously this was poor research on my part.
DES begot 3des begot AES or something like that. It is believed to still be secure, there are those who believe the believe the standard was tampered with leading to stuff like this:
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2048510/nist-denies-nsa-tampering-with-encryption-standards.html
You may be correct: pgp might be more suited to email and aes for general use or something I'd have to read more on it.
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 04, 2015, 08:53:05 PM
Quote from: Cain on June 04, 2015, 05:08:16 PM
I think the reason many of us are eye-rolling is because we've mostly all had some practical experience of security work, or know someone who has.
Roger: cop, hired muscle.
Me: terrorism expert, occasional private security contractor
Junkenstein: works with explosives all day every day
ECH: experience on the "other side of the fence", so to speak
Faust: enough tech and programming knowledge to know about net security
NET: I think did some network maintenance style job, a while back? not sure.
Paes: showed security flaws on some major politicians site in his country
And I'm sure I'm forgetting a few.
Plenty of real-world experience that I don't have would make my views a bit far-fetched. I kinda only have an observer's perspective, if that wasn't obvious. It's all completely understandable.
No worries. Just thought I should explain you getting the reaction you did.
There's a whole bunch of stuff to respond to in this thread, but the thing I hit reply for was to say that AES is still considered viable by most people. It's at least considered as secure as it was pre-Snowden. For context, I've been working in security for telcos, financial institutions and government agencies for the last ten months (consulting and offensive testing, part of the reason why I haven't had many updates on what I'm doing) and frequently use AES-256. That's not to say that it's impossible that data encrypted using AES-256 to be read by an actor with the resources of a nation-state, but that I think they would be exploiting as-yet-undetected errors in implementation, rather than deliberate weaknesses in the algorithm.
AES and PGP are typically used for different purposes. AES is a symmetric-key algorithm, which means that the encryption and decryption functions use the same key. If you want to share AES-encrypted data, you need to provide the recipient your key. Anyone in possession of this key can read and write to the conversation between you and this other party.
PGP is slower but uses asymmetric-key crypto as well as symmetric. The result of which is that someone can encrypt a message using one key (your public key) and even if everyone else knows this key as well, they cannot use it to decrypt the message. Only your private key can do that. Because of this, it's often better for communications as it ensures that only the intended recipient can read the message and lends itself better to being used to verify the identity of a party in the conversation.
PGP requires both parties to have generated keys and while not super technical, this is not a user-friendly process, resulting in it not being very well adopted by non-tech-folk. To communicate securely with people who do not have a PGP key, I would tend to encrypt it using AES and provide them with the single-use key out-of-band, preferably in person or over the phone/SMS if you're willing to add those networks to the risk register.
And if you want your online marketplace to facilitate illegal transactions, don't roll your own custom shit in PHP and throw it on top of an experimental anonymous network with an increasing number of design weaknesses being identified then call that a day.
Also don't keep a detailed journal of your criminal exploits. Honestly, Ulbricht was a bit of a fool who benefited from a black swan in his terrible marketplace gaining notoriety. He got all wrapped up in the theatre of being a mastermind, totally failing to actually cover his ass and they caught him with his laptop open, logged into Silk Road admin panel. You couldn't own yourself any harder.
The dude called himself The Dread Pirate Roberts.
He may as well have called himself Lupine McLoneWolfmaster, his chances of not being a self-aggrandizing dickbag were so perishingly low.
Quote from: Cain on June 06, 2015, 03:07:14 AM
The dude called himself The Dread Pirate Roberts.
He may as well have called himself Lupine McLoneWolfmaster, his chances of not being a self-aggrandizing dickbag were so perishingly low.
:lulz: Exactly this.
Quote from: Cain on June 06, 2015, 03:07:14 AM
The dude called himself The Dread Pirate Roberts.
He may as well have called himself Lupine McLoneWolfmaster, his chances of not being a self-aggrandizing dickbag were so perishingly low.
:lulz: :lulz: :lulz:
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
I'm not sure what you're trying to communicate here. You seem to be conflating hashing and encryption and misunderstanding both.
(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/06/02/09/2949749800000578-3107027-image-a-2_1433234632413.jpg)
[Re: Pidgeon malfunction]
Quote from: Pæs on June 06, 2015, 11:24:59 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
I'm not sure what you're trying to communicate here. You seem to be conflating hashing and encryption and misunderstanding both.
Probably. Hence, why I prefaced it with "I forget exactly how it works." Sorry about the laziness. I'll get back to this when I have time.
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 07, 2015, 12:37:50 AM
Quote from: Pæs on June 06, 2015, 11:24:59 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
I'm not sure what you're trying to communicate here. You seem to be conflating hashing and encryption and misunderstanding both.
Probably. Hence, why I prefaced it with "I forget exactly how it works." Sorry about the laziness. I'll get back to this when I have time.
I think you meant to preface it with "I have no real idea what I'm talking about".
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on June 07, 2015, 03:13:45 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 07, 2015, 12:37:50 AM
Quote from: Pæs on June 06, 2015, 11:24:59 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
I'm not sure what you're trying to communicate here. You seem to be conflating hashing and encryption and misunderstanding both.
Probably. Hence, why I prefaced it with "I forget exactly how it works." Sorry about the laziness. I'll get back to this when I have time.
I think you meant to preface it with "I have no real idea what I'm talking about".
Nigel, I love it when you are Nigeling someone who is not me.
Quote from: Reginald Ret on June 07, 2015, 11:10:38 PM
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on June 07, 2015, 03:13:45 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 07, 2015, 12:37:50 AM
Quote from: Pæs on June 06, 2015, 11:24:59 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
I'm not sure what you're trying to communicate here. You seem to be conflating hashing and encryption and misunderstanding both.
Probably. Hence, why I prefaced it with "I forget exactly how it works." Sorry about the laziness. I'll get back to this when I have time.
I think you meant to preface it with "I have no real idea what I'm talking about".
Nigel, I love it when you are Nigeling someone who is not me.
:lulz:
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on June 07, 2015, 03:13:45 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 07, 2015, 12:37:50 AM
Quote from: Pæs on June 06, 2015, 11:24:59 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
I'm not sure what you're trying to communicate here. You seem to be conflating hashing and encryption and misunderstanding both.
Probably. Hence, why I prefaced it with "I forget exactly how it works." Sorry about the laziness. I'll get back to this when I have time.
I think you meant to preface it with "I have no real idea what I'm talking about".
Well, that wouldn't be completely true. I did know at one point, back when I was consistently studying in the field. I just don't know now. Hence the term "forget."
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 09, 2015, 01:59:59 AM
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on June 07, 2015, 03:13:45 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 07, 2015, 12:37:50 AM
Quote from: Pæs on June 06, 2015, 11:24:59 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
I'm not sure what you're trying to communicate here. You seem to be conflating hashing and encryption and misunderstanding both.
Probably. Hence, why I prefaced it with "I forget exactly how it works." Sorry about the laziness. I'll get back to this when I have time.
I think you meant to preface it with "I have no real idea what I'm talking about".
Well, that wouldn't be completely true. I did know at one point, back when I was consistently studying in the field. I just don't know now. Hence the term "forget."
:lulz: :lulz: :lulz:
God I hope you come back and reread these posts in five years. You're adorable.
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on June 09, 2015, 03:29:39 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 09, 2015, 01:59:59 AM
Quote from: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on June 07, 2015, 03:13:45 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 07, 2015, 12:37:50 AM
Quote from: Pæs on June 06, 2015, 11:24:59 AM
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
I'm not sure what you're trying to communicate here. You seem to be conflating hashing and encryption and misunderstanding both.
Probably. Hence, why I prefaced it with "I forget exactly how it works." Sorry about the laziness. I'll get back to this when I have time.
I think you meant to preface it with "I have no real idea what I'm talking about".
Well, that wouldn't be completely true. I did know at one point, back when I was consistently studying in the field. I just don't know now. Hence the term "forget."
:lulz: :lulz: :lulz:
God I hope you come back and reread these posts in five years. You're adorable.
I do know what it's like to see the absurdities in the writings of my former self. However, I don't see how
that part of
that post could be considered funny in the future. But, then again, maybe that's the point. Kinda hope you're right, because I may need a laugh depending on where I'm at in 5 years.
If I remember your age correctly, I AM you in 5 years, which is probably why I took great joy in shitting on you yesterday. I joined this shitty website when I was 17, and literally every post I made for like 3 years (excepting maybe a small handful of tolerable essays) was trash.
Trust me, you're hilarious.
Quote from: Cainad (dec.) on June 09, 2015, 02:25:15 PM
If I remember your age correctly, I AM you in 5 years, which is probably why I took great joy in shitting on you yesterday. I joined this shitty website when I was 17, and literally every post I made for like 3 years (excepting maybe a small handful of tolerable essays) was trash.
Trust me, you're hilarious.
This warms my heart, because if you can identify with this guy even a little, there's hope.
When I was around that age, a little younger actually, I read a book series with a major character who is a master manipulator, to a nearly superhuman degree (this is the Prince of Nothing series I talk about with Cain sometimes). The character is the prodigy of a monastic cult of hyper-rationalists who live isolated from a word that is full of fanatical, medieval Europe style religion. He can read faces and body language, predict the movement of people's thoughts, and figure out what makes them tick within the span of a single conversation. He is, of course, an absurdly effective character who gets an improbable amount of shit done.
Upon a second re-read a few years later, I put it together that this character is NOT the Good Guy. There's always hope for progress.
Quote from: Cainad (dec.) on June 09, 2015, 02:25:15 PM
If I remember your age correctly, I AM you in 5 years, which is probably why I took great joy in shitting on you yesterday. I joined this shitty website when I was 17, and literally every post I made for like 3 years (excepting maybe a small handful of tolerable essays) was trash.
Trust me, you're hilarious.
Well, shit. I can die now. My dream was to give up manipulation to be a comedian, but I never thought I'd be funny. But, since I'm
hilarious :lulz:
Seriously, the thought that what you were trying to describe is just you not remembering exactly how things with AES and hashing works.... Fucking hilarious.
Yeah, I'm still working on the "Very preachy, even when uninformed" aspect of my problems. At least you guys point it out to make me more aware.
While we're at it, you also misunderstand prefacing.
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
Quote from: Pæs on June 09, 2015, 11:50:08 PM
While we're at it, you also misunderstand prefacing.
Quote from: PlightOfFernandoPoo on June 01, 2015, 10:34:05 PM
It just so happens the government uses AES a lot, so I would use that with [as random as you can make them] salts and seeds, as well as making sure the key is as random as you can make it, while also making it long enough for a hash cracker to be useless. As far as I know, if you can get ahold of a hash of a small enough key, you can just bruteforce the hash and get the key easily. But, because the size of any hash is cut off, only part of the key could even be recovered if you got ahold of a hash for a very long key. Or, it would be a useless chain of characters, depending on whether length had anything to do with the hash encryption algorithm. I forget exactly how that works.
:lulz: FUCK
Ok, so, what I did was, I clarified my level of understanding (or lack there of)
at the end.
This was not my
greatest piece, I'll admit. In-fact, it was, as Cainad said, "trash."
Quote from: Rev Thwack on June 09, 2015, 08:07:00 PM
Seriously, the thought that what you were trying to describe is just you not remembering exactly how things with AES and hashing works.... Fucking hilarious.
:lulz: