Principia Discordia

Principia Discordia => Apple Talk => Topic started by: Mangrove on October 23, 2012, 08:23:22 pm

Title: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 23, 2012, 08:23:22 pm
...to be Britain's most prestigious & prodigious paedophile and die without getting caught.

I'm starting to wonder  (a) Whose head rolls next?
                                (b) If the Jonathan King & Gary Glitter episodes were not unrelated incidents.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on October 23, 2012, 08:31:23 pm
Who is Jim?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 23, 2012, 08:59:45 pm
Who is Jim?

SIR Jimmy Saville.

He was a DJ and then TV personality in the UK for many years. He was an eccentric 'institution' of the BBC. Aside from doing enormous amounts of charity work, he was most known for a tv show called "Jim'll Fix It" in which children wrote him letters asking him to make their dreams come true. Bit like 'make a wish' foundation only theses kids weren't terminal cases. Sort of like "Dear Jim, could you fix it for me to ride in a hot air balloon? Love Tommy from Leeds." If Jim picked your letter and did the wish, you got to meet him on tv and get a JIM FIXED IT FOR ME medal.

Trouble is, Jim turned out to be a serial sex abuser. Grope kids on your show? Check. Sex with minors at the BBC? Check. Groping sick kids in hospitals? Check. And so the list goes on.

Of a similar era and vintage was Jonathan King, yet another DJ turned tv personality who got hit with a bunch of kiddie porn charges a few years ago. And until Jimmy Saville, the biggest case was Gary Glitter who also went down for kiddie porn and I believe, sex offenses in other countries.

In 2007 there were rumors circulating about Saville but it hadn't hit critical mass yet. The BBC made a documentary about the claims but shelved it. (The producer who made that show resigned this week.) Since Saville died in 2011, victims have been appearing in droves quite a few of them saying "Well, I told the cops but they said it wasn't possible". Or, people within the BBC would say "Holy crap! Saville is fiddling with kids!" and were told "err..yeah....but he's TOO FAMOUS to be a perv, so let it go."

The BBC are now scrambling about while the police are following up leads. It's a matter of finding out who knew, how much, for how long and why did they do precious little about it. Then of course is the question as to whether he 'acted alone' or whether there's going to be a string of other well known British celebs busted on similar charges.

There's a lot of Britspags of a certain age who are currently getting their childhood memories re-written.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on October 23, 2012, 09:08:41 pm
Sir Jimmy Saville. basically, he covered his tracks by being all philanthropic and trading on his reputation, no one believed the victims whilst he was alive and the police were paid off.  The whole thing ties into a very rape-culture environment of flagrant abuse and sexual harassment from the 60's to the 80's at the Beeb.

The Beeb is funded by the taxpayer, now there will be a massive enquiry and Things Will Not Look Good for the BBC. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Savile_sexual_abuse_scandal

Even the almost sainted John Peel it turns out was having sex with 15 year olds. I'm so glad I never posted the letter I wrote at 10 to Jim'll Fix It.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 23, 2012, 11:20:39 pm
As far as I know, in the case of John Peel it was a single allegation.

But as for Saville...yeah.  The BBC closed ranks and protected their own.  I'm going to go out on a limb here and bet some junior programming manager gets sacked for blocking the Newsnight investigation (because we all know such minor functionaries have the power to block programs from airing), the Director-General will proclaim the case closed, and nothing will be heard about it from the company ever again.

The question of who at the BBC might have known about Saville's appetites at the time they were going on, but decided to keep quiet because he was one of their star presenters, will also be likely ignored. 

And indeed, who outside of the Beeb might have known.  His charity work allowed him to move in some fairly select circles....close friend of Maggie Thatcher, for example.  Jehan Sadat, the wife of the Egyptian President of the same name, is another.

Too much potential for embarassment.  This inquiry will be strictly limited and quickly solved, because the questions and suspicions are just too uncomfortable to be allowed to fester.  Some poor sap who is overcharging on his expenses and turns up late for the meetings will take the blame, the tabloids will heap shame on him, and everyone will forget the wider context.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 24, 2012, 03:49:40 pm
As far as I know, in the case of John Peel it was a single allegation.

But as for Saville...yeah.  The BBC closed ranks and protected their own.  I'm going to go out on a limb here and bet some junior programming manager gets sacked for blocking the Newsnight investigation (because we all know such minor functionaries have the power to block programs from airing), the Director-General will proclaim the case closed, and nothing will be heard about it from the company ever again.

The question of who at the BBC might have known about Saville's appetites at the time they were going on, but decided to keep quiet because he was one of their star presenters, will also be likely ignored. 

And indeed, who outside of the Beeb might have known.  His charity work allowed him to move in some fairly select circles....close friend of Maggie Thatcher, for example.  Jehan Sadat, the wife of the Egyptian President of the same name, is another.

Too much potential for embarassment.  This inquiry will be strictly limited and quickly solved, because the questions and suspicions are just too uncomfortable to be allowed to fester.  Some poor sap who is overcharging on his expenses and turns up late for the meetings will take the blame, the tabloids will heap shame on him, and everyone will forget the wider context.

Depressing but likely outcomes ITT.  Seems that the BBC's method of handling this took the form of:

BBC: Jim! What's all this flap about you being a perv?
Jim: It's not true.
BBC: Ok, carry on old bean.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 24, 2012, 03:58:37 pm
Yup.  Hell, look at this, today

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-20070093

Quote
Labour MP Tom Watson has said police must investigate claims of a "powerful paedophile ring" linked to a previous prime minister's "senior adviser" and Parliament.

He asked David Cameron to ensure that officers looked into the allegations.

Mr Cameron said he would look into the issue, although he said he was not clear which former prime minister's adviser was being referred to.

The exchanges came during Prime Minister's Questions in the Commons.

Mr Watson said an evidence file collected by the police to convict paedophile Peter Righton in 1992 "contains clear intelligence of a widespread paedophile ring".

"One of its members boasts of his links to a senior aide of a former prime minister, who says he could smuggle indecent images of children from abroad," he said.

"The leads were not followed up, but if the files still exist, I want to ensure that the Metropolitan Police secure the evidence, re-examine it and investigate clear intelligence suggesting a powerful paedophile network linked to Parliament and No 10."

David Cameron said it was a "very difficult and complex case" and he was "not entirely sure" which former prime minister Mr Watson was referring to.

But he agreed to look at the case "very carefully and see what the government can do" to give Mr Watson the assurances he wanted.

I find this rather interesting, as I'm sure something came up in the foreign press (CounterPunch, IIRC) about someone linked to the Cabinet being swept up in Operation Ore.  But that was early 2000s, and I doubt the police were still collecting information on the case 10 years later.  Either way, you have another case of a pedophile being linked to the powerful, and the whole thing being neglected because of the potential embarassment and political fallout.

This is no different.  No doubt in two decades, we'll have Tom Watson asking for the files on the Saville case to be reviewed.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 24, 2012, 04:04:51 pm
Yup.  Hell, look at this, today

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-20070093

Quote
Labour MP Tom Watson has said police must investigate claims of a "powerful paedophile ring" linked to a previous prime minister's "senior adviser" and Parliament.

He asked David Cameron to ensure that officers looked into the allegations.

Mr Cameron said he would look into the issue, although he said he was not clear which former prime minister's adviser was being referred to.

The exchanges came during Prime Minister's Questions in the Commons.

Mr Watson said an evidence file collected by the police to convict paedophile Peter Righton in 1992 "contains clear intelligence of a widespread paedophile ring".

"One of its members boasts of his links to a senior aide of a former prime minister, who says he could smuggle indecent images of children from abroad," he said.

"The leads were not followed up, but if the files still exist, I want to ensure that the Metropolitan Police secure the evidence, re-examine it and investigate clear intelligence suggesting a powerful paedophile network linked to Parliament and No 10."

David Cameron said it was a "very difficult and complex case" and he was "not entirely sure" which former prime minister Mr Watson was referring to.

But he agreed to look at the case "very carefully and see what the government can do" to give Mr Watson the assurances he wanted.

I find this rather interesting, as I'm sure something came up in the foreign press (CounterPunch, IIRC) about someone linked to the Cabinet being swept up in Operation Ore.  But that was early 2000s, and I doubt the police were still collecting information on the case 10 years later.  Either way, you have another case of a pedophile being linked to the powerful, and the whole thing being neglected because of the potential embarassment and political fallout.

This is no different.  No doubt in two decades, we'll have Tom Watson asking for the files on the Saville case to be reviewed.

Yikes.

Incidentally, I was reading the link to the Independent that Pixie put on the thread about Israel. There's some gory details there about the Savile case including the BBC guy who said he didn't want to make a big deal out of the Newsnight fiasco because he had a 'busy lunch'.  :x
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 25, 2012, 08:30:05 am
We're almost getting to the stage of overlapping scandals here.  Consider:

Tom Watson brings up the 10 Downing Street Ring in Parliament.  Watson was one of the principle movers in the Leveson Inquiry, partially because News International hacked his phone.

News International worked with a corrupt South Yorkshire cop who was forced to resign recently because of how he colluded with The Sun in smearing the survivors of the Hillsborough tragedy.

Tom Watson's information about the Downing Street ring comes from a 1998 article by Nick Davies.

The information about the News International hacking scandal was originally unearthed by Nick Davies.

Tom Watson has also noted he was informed the Met "had material suggesting Savile was a predatory pedophile" but they were reluctant to act on it.

All we need now is to discover that Jimmy Savile killed Daniel Morgan and we will have come to the "Illuminati moment" of British politics.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 25, 2012, 03:08:26 pm
We're almost getting to the stage of overlapping scandals here.  Consider:

Tom Watson brings up the 10 Downing Street Ring in Parliament.  Watson was one of the principle movers in the Leveson Inquiry, partially because News International hacked his phone.

News International worked with a corrupt South Yorkshire cop who was forced to resign recently because of how he colluded with The Sun in smearing the survivors of the Hillsborough tragedy.

Tom Watson's information about the Downing Street ring comes from a 1998 article by Nick Davies.

The information about the News International hacking scandal was originally unearthed by Nick Davies.

Tom Watson has also noted he was informed the Met "had material suggesting Savile was a predatory pedophile" but they were reluctant to act on it.

All we need now is to discover that Jimmy Savile killed Daniel Morgan and we will have come to the "Illuminati moment" of British politics.

Owing to ubiquity of conspiracy theory nut bags, I have tended to take them (theories & nut bags) with a pinch of salt*. However, here is one of those times where the Dan Brown-esque story unfolding from Jimmy Savile and co. is very likely to be true. I guess that believing that there are 'no conspiracies anywhere' is as dangerous as believing that everything is.



*Not all nut bags contain salt of course. I like to eat plain cashews for instance.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 25, 2012, 03:20:51 pm
In my experience, the vast majority of probably existing actual conspiracies are either:

a) military in nature, concerning special operations, training and supplying of groups, false-flag attacks and so on.  Warfare on the cheap, and all warfare is based on deception.

b) people linked to a person who did some very embarrassing things, and could come back on them, even if only indirectly.  Much of the inconsistencies around 9/11 probably have to do with Saudi, Pakistani and covert US support for Islamist terrorism, for example.  Said support itself comes under category a, of course. 

Savile falls into the latter category.  He spent Christmas at Chequers throughout the 80s, when Saint Thatcher was Prime Minister, after all.  Now that scandal could have caused significant problems for a government, couldn't have it?  And since we know the Metropolitan police have a generally conservative political bias, it's not a bad question to ask if this was covered up to prevent harm to the government of the day.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 25, 2012, 03:48:41 pm
In my experience, the vast majority of probably existing actual conspiracies are either:

a) military in nature, concerning special operations, training and supplying of groups, false-flag attacks and so on.  Warfare on the cheap, and all warfare is based on deception.

b) people linked to a person who did some very embarrassing things, and could come back on them, even if only indirectly.  Much of the inconsistencies around 9/11 probably have to do with Saudi, Pakistani and covert US support for Islamist terrorism, for example.  Said support itself comes under category a, of course. 

Savile falls into the latter category.  He spent Christmas at Chequers throughout the 80s, when Saint Thatcher was Prime Minister, after all.  Now that scandal could have caused significant problems for a government, couldn't have it?  And since we know the Metropolitan police have a generally conservative political bias, it's not a bad question to ask if this was covered up to prevent harm to the government of the day.

This makes the Profumo Affair look very tame in comparison. When politicians are having affairs or frequenting hookers we tend to take it in our stride. But, a combination of paedophillia, politicians, police and celebrities is frightening. Hell, any one of those is scary its own but in combination? [shudder]

Again, as disgusting as they frequently turn out to be, the military cover ups don't surprise me so much as frustrate & irritate me. The last presidential debate touched upon the 'we want to make sure we give guns to the good guys' issue. Yeah, that worked out so well in Afghanistan in the 80s.

That Savile was cozied up with Thatcher isn't much of a revelation. That she was best buds with Pinochet already convinced me that being a good judge of character wasn't one of her strong points.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 26, 2012, 03:21:33 pm
Here's the Nick Davies article from 1998

http://www.nickdavies.net/1998/04/01/the-sheer-scale-of-child-sexual-abuse-in-britain/

Quote
The ease of the crime is reflected in its scale. No one knows the exact numbers, but to construct a picture is to watch an arithmetical explosion. Start with a hard fact. At the last count, there were 2,100 child sex abusers behind the bars of British jails. Now think of all those who have previously been convicted but who have been released back into the community. You have to multiply by 50: according to the Home Office Research Department, there are 108,000 convicted paedophiles in the community.

Now, think of all the child victims who are conned and confused and never report their abuse in the first place; and all those cases which are reported but which fall short of the demands of the courts; and all those cases of rape and indecent assault which are convicted but which are not statistically recorded as crimes against children. At the most conservative estimate, the NSPCC and specialist police agree with studies here and in the United States, that the official figures for convictions record no more than ten per cent of the paedophile population. Which means that today in Britain, there are probably 1.1 million paedophiles at large. Other studies suggest that the figure is very much higher.

This vast scale appears to be confirmed by “prevalance studies” which take samples of the population and establish how many were childhood victims of sexual abuse. In the UK, the United States, Germany, Switzerland and Australia, studies consistently find that around 20% of women and around 8% of men suffered sexual abuse as children. In the current population of UK children, that would cover 1.5 million girls and 520,000 boys, a figure that is consistent with the projection of 1.1 million offenders.

Quote
For example, police now invest relatively little time in the surveillance of public toilets where gay men go cottaging. The one thing that is likely still to trigger such an operation is a complaint that under-aged boys are involved – unless, that is, the toilets in question happen to be those behind the Royal Courts of Justice in the Strand, in which case, under the terms of a long-standing Metropolitan Police policy, the operation will take place only if it has the approval of an officer of the rank of commander or above. According to experienced London officers, the reason is that those toilets are used by High Court judges and barristers, and the Metropolitan Police have always said they do not want to encounter such a powerful offender without special authority.

Fleet Street routinely nurtures a crop of untold stories about powerful abusers who have evaded justice. One such is Peter Morrison, formerly the MP for Chester and the deputy chairman of the Conservative Party. Ten years ago, Chris House, the veteran crime reporter for the Sunday Mirror, twice received tip-offs from police officers who said that Morrison had been caught cottaging in public toilets with underaged boys and had been released with a caution. A less powerful man, the officers complained, would have been charged with gross indecency or an offence against children.

At the time, Chris House confronted Morrison, who used libel laws to block publication of the story. Now, Morrison is dead and cannot sue. Police last week confirmed that he had been picked up twice and never brought to trial. They added that there appeared to be no trace of either incident in any of the official records

Quote
Often the links between abusers lie beneath the surface of less horrific conspiracies. Take, for example, the case of Greystone Heath, an approved school for boys in Warrington, which for years enjoyed an unsullied reputation until police finally discovered that it had become a hot spot for paedophiles. This one institution – whose history of abuse is echoed now in scores of others – is a model of everyday paedophile collusion.

It appears to have started in 1965 when a 21-year-old student teacher named Keith Laverack went to work there and embarked on a campaign of buggery and indecent assault. Over the ensuing four years, he raped at least 16 boys, three of whom he shared with his colleague, Brian Percival, the clerk and storeman at the home. Once these two men had established sexual rights over the boys at Greystone, other abusers joined the staff: Alan Langshaw, who raped at least 24 boys; Dennis Grain who raped at least 18; Roy Shuttleworth who raped at least ten; Jack Bennett who indecently assaulted two; and Steve Norris who assaulted an unknown number.

The Greystone abusers then fanned out. Keith Laverack went to childrens’ homes in Cambridgeshire; Alan Langshaw became Principal of St Vincent’s Catholic boys’ home in Formby; Grain and Shuttleworth were both promoted to other homes in the Warrington area; Steve Norris went to North Wales. At their new homes, all of them continued to rape boys who were in their care and wherever they went, they crossed the paths of other paedophiles.

In Cambridgeshire, Keith Laverack worked with numerous colleagues, four of whom are now also suspected of abusing children. Dennis Grain worked in Doncaster for the same group of private schools as Terence Hoskins who went on to become headteacher of St Aiden’s Community Home in Widnes, where he liked to thrash naked boys with a cane, which he then pushed into their backsides, while his housemaster, Colin Dick, indecently assaulted those who caught his eye. Dennis Grain had previously attacked boys in Danesford childrens’ home in Congleton, opening the door to three others, John Clarke, Joseph Smith and Brian Hudson, who set about the boys with relish. Dennis Grain, in the meantime, went off to work at Eton, where he became a housemaster. The web is almost endless.

While he was Principal of St Vincent’s, Alan Langshaw recruited a care worker named Edward Stanton, who joined in Langshaw’s orgy. Stanton appears to have got the job through the good offices of Roy Shuttleworth, who was continuing to abuse the boys at Greystone and who is believed to have known Stanton from their time in Birmingham when they took the same course in residential child care.

That course in Birmingham, in turn, is believed to have been lectured by Peter Righton, a notorious paedophile who attempted to legitimise his obsession in a series of academic studies. Righton, for his part, belonged to the Paedophile Information Exchange, along with Jack Bennett who joined in the abuse at Greystone. Righton had earlier worked in the same childrens’ home in Maidstone, Kent as Peter Howarth, who went on to become a legendary abuser in the homes of North Wales where he shared his indulgence with Steve Norris, formerly of Greystone.

Each of these men claims to have abused alone. Even though their paths connected so frequently, even though the Greystone abusers were assaulting boys in buildings within yards of each other, even though several of them were raping the same boys, they claim never to have colluded with each other. No one who has been involved with investigating Greystone believes them.

The evidence suggests that such abusers not only collude to give each other work and access to children, but also to infiltrate the child protection system. Peter Righton lectured not only in Birmingham but in numerous other colleges. Before he was finally taken to court and convicted, he became a highly regarded consultant in child care and, eventually, the Director of Education at the prestigious National Institute of Social Work in London, a position from which he was able to have some influence on Government policy.

With similar cynicism, Keith Laverack, who opened the catalogue of abuse at Greystone Heath, went on to run the Guardian Ad Litem panel for Cambridgeshire County Council, with the job of representing the interests of children in court cases. This job not only introduced him to the most vulnerable children in the area but also gave him access to files on abused children all over the country. Terence Hoskins, who worked with some of the Greystone abusers, used connections with South Yorkshire police to get access to his own file, from the supposedly secret National Criminal Intelligence Service, NCIS.

Roger Saint who spent years assaulting his foster children in Clwyd secured himself a job on the local adoption panel, from which he could referee complaints about people like himself.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 26, 2012, 04:30:51 pm
Cain, thank you for the Nick Davies article even though it's left me full of  :argh!:

Of course, you do realize that the Catholic Church blames institutionalized paedohpillia on the 'permissive 1960s'.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 26, 2012, 04:33:14 pm
Sure.  The Telegraph and Mail have already declared Savile a left-wing hero, despite his Thatcher-Sadat friendships.  Their logic seems to be - BBC is a communist plot, therefore everyone who has ever worked for the BBC is a Communist.

Edit: if you want to see more of Nick Davies writing on this topic, I suggest looking into his investigation of Warwick Spinks. 
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 26, 2012, 04:39:31 pm
And while I'm here

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/26/world/europe/savile-inquiry-widens-to-others-at-bbc-reports-say.html?hp&_r=0

Quote
The officer, Cmdr. Peter Spindler, described Mr. Savile, who died last October at 84, as “undoubtedly” one of the most prolific sex offenders in recent British history, during a 50-year career as a self-styled pied piper for the young, the sick and the lonely. Commander Spindler said that in preliminary telephone interviews with 130 of the potential victims, 114 of them had accused Mr. Savile of criminal behavior ranging from “inappropriate touching” to rape. Of the 300 complainants, he said, all but 2 have been female.

Commander Spindler said the “vast majority” of the accusations logged by the police were against Mr. Savile alone, with the remainder involving Mr. Savile and others or episodes in which the entertainer was not implicated. Although the commander specified that investigators had found no evidence of a “pedophile ring,” as some published accounts in Britain have suggested, he said that a number of “living people” were under investigation.

And the 10 Downing Street pedophile ring suspect has been named

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/articles/397824/20121024/tom-watson-child-sex-ring-sire-peter.htm

Quote
The politician implicated in an alleged child sex ring at 10 Downing Street was Sir Peter Morrison, one of Margaret Thatcher’s closest advisers, IBTimes UK can reveal.

Morrison was the mystery “senior aide” MP Tom Watson alluded to at Prime Minister’s Questions (PMQs). Watson’s allegation of a paedophile ring close to Downing Street stunned the House of Commons.

Morrison was a Conservative politician who acted as Thatcher’s parliamentary private secretary while she was prime minister. He also masterminded her failed bid to hold on to the leadership in 1990.

Morrison left office in 1992 and died in 1995.

The sexual tastes of the prime minister’s trusted adviser were an open secret in some quarters but were concealed by a police cover-up and threats of libel by Morrison himself, according to a former editor of the Sunday Mirror, Peter Connew.

Simon Heffer wrote in the Daily Telegraph in 2009: “At least one member of Mrs Thatcher’s first cabinet was homosexual. Her last parliamentary private secretary, Sir Peter Morrison, was a constant trial to the whips, who were afraid that his late-night cruises around and skirmishes in Sussex Gardens would come to the attention of the press.”

Yes, that is the same Morrison named above by Nick Davies.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on October 26, 2012, 04:40:59 pm
Of course, you do realize that the Catholic Church blames institutionalized paedohpillia on the 'permissive 1960s'.

Well, it sure as fuck as nothing to do with THEIR policies, right?

And it's a good thing for them that there weren't loads of priests diddling kids in the 1950s or anything.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 26, 2012, 04:53:30 pm
Of course, you do realize that the Catholic Church blames institutionalized paedohpillia on the 'permissive 1960s'.

Well, it sure as fuck as nothing to do with THEIR policies, right?

And it's a good thing for them that there weren't loads of priests diddling kids in the 1950s or anything.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0rziDkWbpg   (watch at 30 seconds from tv show 'Father Ted')

Trying to find a link to the story that came out a few years ago when the Church did an investigation into abuse and returned with the verdict that it was 'the permissive 1960s' to blame.

ETA - Found it

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/19/us-catholic-church-sexual-abuse-report

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: tyrannosaurus vex on October 26, 2012, 04:56:15 pm
Apparently the Boy Scouts (http://www.dailyillini.com/opinion/columns/article_6b8f1afc-1e50-11e2-877f-0019bb30f31a.html) have a problem with this as well. If this shit keeps coming out, somebody's going to start saying the 1950s weren't all they were cracked up to be.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on October 26, 2012, 05:49:17 pm
Of course, you do realize that the Catholic Church blames institutionalized paedohpillia on the 'permissive 1960s'.

Well, it sure as fuck as nothing to do with THEIR policies, right?

And it's a good thing for them that there weren't loads of priests diddling kids in the 1950s or anything.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0rziDkWbpg   (watch at 30 seconds from tv show 'Father Ted')


Quote
This video contains content from Channel 4, who has blocked it in your country on copyright grounds.

 :eek:

Downloading the entire back catalogue on general principle...
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 27, 2012, 04:01:16 pm
CAIN!!! (Beware! The following link contains dangers levels of irony. View discretion is advised)

http://news.yahoo.com/catholic-church-wants-saviles-papal-honour-removed-114000751.html
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on October 27, 2012, 10:59:57 pm
Quote
Faced with growing public outrage at the allegations, the family decided to remove the headstone on Savile's grave and destroy it to avoid it becoming a target for vandals.

 :facepalm:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 27, 2012, 11:39:34 pm
Quote
Faced with growing public outrage at the allegations, the family decided to remove the headstone on Savile's grave and destroy it to avoid it becoming a target for vandals.

 :facepalm:

 :lulz:

Given that Rupert Murdoch is also the recipient of a Papal gong, I am not sure it's worth the effort to remove the honor from Savile. Seems that being utterly corrupt is part of the approval process.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 28, 2012, 09:01:00 am
It's worth remembering that Britain's most influential Catholic of recent times has no titles in the religion at all.

I am, of course, referring to Tony Blair.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 28, 2012, 09:42:20 am
Police are questioning Gary Glitter.

Strangely, I was going to say something about Glitter, but since it was mostly facetious innuendo, I decided it wasn't worth it.  Clearly, this shows I should engage in such things ALL THE TIME just in case I'm right.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 28, 2012, 04:18:58 pm
Police are questioning Gary Glitter.

Strangely, I was going to say something about Glitter, but since it was mostly facetious innuendo, I decided it wasn't worth it.  Clearly, this shows I should engage in such things ALL THE TIME just in case I'm right.

Likewise. I'm thinking Jonathan King is next. And remember, every day is 'facetious innuendo day' when it comes to ridiculing Britain's most beloved perverts. Go for it!
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Tiddleywomp Cockletit on October 28, 2012, 05:25:32 pm
Sir Jimmy Saville. basically, he covered his tracks by being all philanthropic and trading on his reputation, no one believed the victims whilst he was alive and the police were paid off.  The whole thing ties into a very rape-culture environment of flagrant abuse and sexual harassment from the 60's to the 80's at the Beeb.

The Beeb is funded by the taxpayer, now there will be a massive enquiry and Things Will Not Look Good for the BBC. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Savile_sexual_abuse_scandal

Even the almost sainted John Peel it turns out was having sex with 15 year olds. I'm so glad I never posted the letter I wrote at 10 to Jim'll Fix It.

When you said "the Beeb", my first thought was Justin Bieber.  :horrormirth:
I know, BBC...
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 29, 2012, 10:10:46 am
You know, and I never thought I'd say this seriously, but David Icke has an interesting piece on Jimmy Savile and, in particular, his connections to the Royal Family.

Even if you only go by the verifiable statements from legitimate newspapers, it seems Savile was rather close to the Royals until a row with, of all people, Prince Philip.

If you can ignore the constant references to Hitler being a British secret agent, satanism and orgies, there does seem to be a case that Buckingham Palace might have something to worry about from a full investigation of Savile's crimes.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 29, 2012, 03:17:52 pm
You know, and I never thought I'd say this seriously, but David Icke has an interesting piece on Jimmy Savile and, in particular, his connections to the Royal Family.

Even if you only go by the verifiable statements from legitimate newspapers, it seems Savile was rather close to the Royals until a row with, of all people, Prince Philip.

If you can ignore the constant references to Hitler being a British secret agent, satanism and orgies, there does seem to be a case that Buckingham Palace might have something to worry about from a full investigation of Savile's crimes.

Alien lizard people aside, this isn't too far fetched. Famous people, especially famous people who are high profile in charitable activities tend to get noticed by the Royals and get invites.

The part I don't believe is anyone arguing or falling out with Prince Phillip. Totally implausible.  :wink:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 29, 2012, 03:23:21 pm
It does make sense, and would explain the Met's reluctance to investigate even more than Thatcher.  Prime Ministers come and go, but the Crown endures.  There are a disturbing amount of people in both the police and the military (and lets not forget, lots of ex-military go into the police) who seem to think their job involves serving the Royal Family.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 29, 2012, 04:35:41 pm
The latest is that Savile was banned from participating in 'Children In Need' events. Also we're seeing a wave of "Well...we didn't know what he was up to specifically but we did think he was weird and that was enough for us."

As for the military thing, I've had it explained to me that you 'respect and serve' the position if not the person. The king/queen might be a total jackass but you respect them being the monarch. Serve the office, not the personality that holds it.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 29, 2012, 05:03:39 pm
Yeah, except legally speaking the Prime Minister is the commander of the armed forces.  Not the Crown.  Regardless of which inbred, chinless wonder is wearing the magic gold hat, they shouldn't be doing anything for them.  If the Queen, or Prince, or some minor Earl wants someone whacked or some journos roughed up, they should have to pay Blackwater to do it, like everyone else. 

And yeah, though to be fair, I think the BBC Governor in question has a point.  What was he meant to do, mount a police investigation all on his own?  He negated the possibility the man could do damage in a situation under BBC control.  While I think the BBC has a lot to answer for, not launching a criminal investigation into Savile is not one of them.  But everyone will beat up on the BBC because, unlike the Met, the BBC don't fight back.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on October 29, 2012, 05:30:23 pm
Yeah, except legally speaking the Prime Minister is the commander of the armed forces.  Not the Crown.  Regardless of which inbred, chinless wonder is wearing the magic gold hat, they shouldn't be doing anything for them.  If the Queen, or Prince, or some minor Earl wants someone whacked or some journos roughed up, they should have to pay Blackwater to do it, like everyone else. 

And yeah, though to be fair, I think the BBC Governor in question has a point.  What was he meant to do, mount a police investigation all on his own?  He negated the possibility the man could do damage in a situation under BBC control.  While I think the BBC has a lot to answer for, not launching a criminal investigation into Savile is not one of them.  But everyone will beat up on the BBC because, unlike the Met, the BBC don't fight back.

True legally speaking though, I think culturally it might not be how people think. The Armed Forces swear an oath to 'queen & country' and all branches are prefixed with the word 'Royal'. Of all the British service men I knew, I never got the impression that they viewed the Prime Minister as their 'boss' even though he/she was actually shot caller.

As for Savile, when I was kid I thought he was eccentric but didn't get completely creeped out until I saw the Louis Theroux documentary. He just screamed squickiness and his 'I hate children' thing smacked of protesting too much.

As for the BBC - as much as it has its problems, trust me you do not want American tv.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 30, 2012, 10:35:02 am
We shouldn't confuse soldiers with symbolism.  It just makes them act like idiots (see: all of human history).  Of course, we shouldn't confuse people with symbolism, but that's another argument for another day.

I thought I should link to the Icke article, since I mentioned it

http://21stcenturywire.com/2012/10/15/jimmy-savile-doorman-to-the-cesspit/

The trick with Icke is sorting his beliefs from carefully sourced and actually existing crimes.  He has a tendency to talk, quite sensibly, about documented child abuse at a boarding school and then (somehow) mention blithely that Savile supplied children for the sexual appetite of Ted Heath (!).

I mean, for instance, the stuff he writes about Jersey and Haut de la Garenne seems fairly solid.  But the conclusion that therefore the Crown is behind the abuse is...not borne out by the evidence.

This is why Icke is so damn frustrating.  It's like dealing with an earnest, somewhat intelligent Christian fundamentalist.  He can think and he makes references to the actually existing world...but then his beliefs kick in when triggered by certain phrases and he makes a giant leap in logic to get to the predetermined conclusion.  And like a Christian blaming everything on the Devil (or Teh Gaze), Icke's theories will always return to the Royal Family, Satanism and ritual child abuse.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 30, 2012, 02:50:46 pm
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/oct/29/met-police-sex-abuse-claims-downing-street

Quote
Scotland Yard is to examine allegations that a child sexual abuse ring was connected to a Downing Street aide.

The Metropolitan police commissioner, Bernard Hogan-Howe, said on Monday the claims would be treated seriously.

Last week the Labour MP Tom Watson used parliamentary privilege to make the allegations. It is understood they relate to a previous prime ministerial aide and not to anyone who has recently served in Downing Street.

Hogan-Howe said a senior officer would look at the claims and that police were in contact with Watson to see if he could provide detectives with more details.

He said they would ask the Labour MP this week "what his sources are and if they are prepared to talk to us" as the police assess the strength of the allegations.

Last week Watson told MPs that a police file relating to Peter Righton, who was convicted in 1992 of importing child abuse images from the Netherlands, needed to be re-examined.

"The evidence file used to convict Peter Righton, if it still exists, contains clear intelligence of a widespread paedophile ring," Watson said during prime minister's questions. "One of its members boasts of his links to a senior aide of a former prime minister, who says he could smuggle indecent images of children from abroad.

"The leads were not followed up, but if the files still exist, I want to ensure that the Metropolitan police secure the evidence, re-examine it and investigate clear intelligence suggesting a powerful paedophile network linked to parliament and No 10."
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on November 01, 2012, 03:25:45 pm
More Savile links:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2219442/BBCs-John-Humphrys-calls-Jimmy-Saviles-alleged-abuse-banter.html

Quote
It came as another woman claimed Jimmy Savile abused her on a cruise as a 16-year-old when he promised her an autograph if she came to his cabin.

Sue Southgate was with her friend in his room when he took off his trousers in front of them on the P&O ship SS Canberra, and then pulled her onto his bed for a 'quick cuddle'.

This was despite her friend having a camera - he was 51 at the time.

'At one point he slipped out of his pants and started rubbing himself up against me. I could feel that he was excited,' she told The Sun.

'He grasped me very tightly in his arms and told me to do the same to him.

'He said,"This is a special move that will help you stop the boys getting away".'

Mrs Southgate, now 51, spoke out days after it was revealed that he was later asked to leave the liner because he targeted a 14-year-old.

She added that she was shocked and ran away because she had innocently believed he was the 'harmless' man that people loved on TV.

Instead, she said, she knew if she hadn't fled she would have been forced to have sex with him.

The captain, who asked not to be named said of his decision to remove Savile: 'The more I quizzed him, the more convinced I became that he was lying.

'He was a shifty sort of chap whose eyes darted all over the place.

'The parents, who were not travelling first class, were very decent, ordinary people who were completely scandalised by Savile’s unwanted attention to their daughter. I told him he disgusted me and I wanted him off my ship when we reached Gibraltar.

'I detailed an officer to make sure he remained in his cabin until we reached the Rock.

'He was to take all his meals in his cabin and was not allowed to leave it under any circumstances short of shipwreck.'

http://bloodandtreasure.typepad.com/blood_treasure/2011/10/eldritch-uncanny-creature-made-dreams-come-true.html

Quote
There was always an odd edge to Jim’ll Fix It. At one level it was a power fantasy. The kiddies would write in with their outré yearnings. Jimmy, sat on his big red throne, casually dispensing the relevant favours. Then a medal would appear - as if by magic – from the depths of his thrones, and solemnly draped around the neck of the enthralled youth, while the parents, having been made to look thoroughly inadequate as providers in contrast to the magical powers of Sir Jimmy and his crack team of BBC researcher-gnomes, hung around grinning uneasily and shifting from foot to foot.

http://www.channel4.com/news/broadmoor-savile-was-a-lunatic-in-charge-of-the-asylum

Quote
Jimmy Savile was one of Britain's biggest stars during the 1960s and 1970s - and, allegedly, one of its worst sexual predators. He started out as a dance hall DJ, then in the early 1960s he hosted the music programme Top of the Pops and later "Jim'll Fix It," a TV show in which he made young viewers' wishes come true. But Broadmoor staff considered him a psychopath.

"I'd long considered him, as did my colleagues did, as a man with a severe personality disorder and a liking for children," Richard Harrison, a psychiatric nurse at Broadmoor for 30 years during Savile's tenure told Channel 4 News.

Talk about the entertainer being a paedophile was common among staff and paedophile patients - who gravitated toward him - staff said. But Jimmy Savile lived in an era of social transformation. He was not charged or put on trial during his lifetime and died a year ago, two days short of his 85th birthday.

"I'd say he was a psychopath," said Bob Allen, a staff nurse at the time. "A lot of the staff said he should be behind bars. We used to laugh about it in those days."

Mr Allen described one evening when he saw the BBC entertainer in a car with a young girl who appeared to be 14 or 15 years old. Savile and the girl went into the flat the star had been given to use at Broadmoor. As Mr Allen walked away, the lights in the flat dimmed but nobody came out. He said he reported it to his supervisor, who he believes did refer the matter up, but was told the following day that "no one appears to be interested."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012/oct/31/jimmy-savile-itv?CMP=twt_gu

Quote
Doctors and managers at Stoke Mandeville hospital were afraid to challenge Jimmy Savile over the free access he enjoyed to wards, out of fear that he would take his fundraising millions elsewhere, a former director of nursing has said, as fresh claims emerged of abuse at the hospital and elsewhere.

Christine McFarlane, former director of nursing and patient care at the Buckinghamshire hospital where Savile volunteered for many years, said the TV star "basically … had the freedom to walk wherever he wanted" and maintained a powerful position thanks to "subtle bullying" of hospital managers.

It also emerged on Wednesday night that Savile's will executor and trustee, NatWest bank, has frozen his £4.3m estate. "Given the claims raised, distribution of the estate has been put on hold," the bank said. The freeze is because of expected legal claims for damages from his alleged victims.

In an interview with ITV news, McFarlane said managers "didn't fight that hard" to challenge Savile. "There was a fine balance … to reach in not upsetting Jimmy."

Medical staff's gratitude for his fundraising efforts had given him a great deal of power within the hospital, she said. "Along with the power, people were afraid of Jimmy stopping raising money for the hospital. There was a fear of him taking something away. He argued that it was his and not theirs."
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on November 01, 2012, 03:48:43 pm
I'm sure Loveshade has a few words to say in Jimmy's defense. :vom:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on November 01, 2012, 03:56:31 pm
And this is an excellent essay

http://cdn.lrb.co.uk/v34/n21/andrew-ohagan/light-entertainment

Quote
One of the qualities that made the journey from radio to television was ‘personality’. Suddenly, you had these human beings who were ultra-everything: they were funnier and quicker and smarter than you – and, once on television, they were prettier, too. At the BBC these people became like gods. Even the weird ones. Even the ones whom everybody could tell were deranged. They had personality and that was the gold standard. Soon enough the notion of ‘men being men’ was extended, institutionally, into that’s just ‘Frankie being Frankie’ or ‘Jimmy being Jimmy’. We never asked whether a certain derangement was a crucial part of their talent.

And so you open Pandora’s box to find the seedy ingredients of British populism. It’s not just names, or performers and acts, it’s an ethos. Why is British light entertainment so often based on the sexualisation of people too young to cope? And why is it that we have a press so keen to feed off it? Is it to cover the fact, via some kind of willed outrage, that the culture itself is largely paedophile in its commercial and entertainment excitements? Milly Dowler’s phone was hacked by journalists cynically feeding the ravenous appetites of three million people who love that stuff, and that’s just the ones who actually bought the News of the World. When Leveson’s findings are duly buried, will we realise that it was the nation’s populist appetites that were on trial all along?

We’re not allowed to say it. Because we love our tots. Or, should I say: WE LOVE OUR TOTS? We know we do because the Mirror tells us we do, but would you please get out of the way because you’re blocking my view of another 14-year-old crying her eyes out on The X-Factor as a bunch of adults shatter her dreams. Savile went to work in light entertainment and thrived there: of course he did, because those places were custom-built for men who wanted to dandle dreaming kids on their knees. If you grew up during ‘the golden era of British television’, the 1970s, when light entertainment was tapping deep into the national unconscious, particularly the more perverted parts, you got used to grown-up men like Rod Hull clowning around on stage with a girl like Lena Zavaroni. You got used to Hughie Green holding the little girl’s hand and asking her if she wanted an ice-cream. Far from wanting an ice-cream, the little girl was starving herself to death while helpfully glazing over for the camera and throwing out her hands and singing ‘Mama, He’s Making Eyes at Me’. She was 13.

There’s something creepy about British light entertainment and there always has been. Joe Orton meets the Marquis de Sade at the end of the pier, with a few Union Jacks fluttering in the stink and a mother-in-law tied in bunting to a ducking-stool. Those of us who grew up on it liked its oddness without quite understanding how creepy it was. I mean, Benny Hill? And then we wake up one day, in 2012, and wonder why so many of them turned out to be deviants and weirdos. Our papers explode in outrage and we put on our Crucible expressions before setting off to the graveyard to take down the celebrity graves and break them up for landfill. Of course. Graffiti the plaques and take down the statues, because the joy of execration must match the original sin, when we made heroes out of these damaged and damaging ‘entertainers’. We suddenly wish them to have been normal, when all we ever ask of our celebrities is that they be much more fucked up than we are. And what do we do now? Do we burn the commemorative programmes, scratch their names from the national memory?

The public made Jimmy Savile. It loved him. It knighted him. The Prince of Wales accorded him special rights and the authorities at Broadmoor gave him his own set of keys. A whole entertainment structure was built to house him and make him feel secure. That’s no one’s fault: entertainment, like literature, thrives on weirdos, and Savile entered a culture made not only to tolerate his oddness but to find it refreshing. We can’t say so. We can’t know how to admit it because we don’t know who we are. ‘This is the worst crisis I can remember in my nearly fifty years at the BBC,’ John Simpson said on Panorama. ‘It’s off the scale of everybody’s belief system,’ said the DJ Paul Gambaccini.

But it is our belief system. And now it is part of the same system to blame Savile. He’s dead, anyway. Let’s blame him for all the things he obviously was, and blame him for a host of other things we don’t understand, such as how we love freaks and how we select and protect people who are ‘eccentric’ in order to feed our need for disorder. We’ll blame him for that too and say we never knew there would be any victims, when, in fact, we depend on there being victims. Savile just wouldn’t have been worth so much to us without his capacity to hurt. He was loved for being so rich and so generous and for loving his mother, the Duchess. And no one said, not out loud: ‘What’s wrong with that man? Why is he going on like that? What is he up to?’ He was an entertainer and that’s thought to be special. A more honest society brings its victims to the Colosseum and cheers. We agreed to find it OK when our most famous comedians were clearly not OK. When Benny Hill’s mother died, in 1976, he kept her house in Southampton as a shrine, just as Savile kept his mother’s clothes, and it might have been weird but it was also the kind of celebrity eccentricity we had come to expect.

Day by day over the past month details have emerged about the shelving of the Newsnight investigation into Savile. Girls from Duncroft children’s home had given evidence: some of them were 14 when Savile began coercing them into giving him blow-jobs. They felt it would be ‘an honour’ to be in the company of someone so famous. He promised them visits to the BBC studios and one of them says she saw Gary Glitter having sex with another girl who was also from Duncroft in a BBC dressing-room. ‘Did Duncroft, a well-equipped approved school for “intelligent emotionally disturbed girls” in leafy Surrey, really require the patronage of “Uncle” Jimmy Savile?’.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on November 01, 2012, 09:25:08 pm
Cain - good articles. Once again, thank you!

Also, Freddie got fingered....Freddie Starr that is.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/savile-freddie-starr-offers-talk-police-161204016.html
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on November 03, 2012, 08:46:13 pm
Cain - you called it. BBC/Savile issue now getting linked to Downing Street.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/politician-dragged-sex-abuse-scandal-060340884.html
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on November 08, 2012, 03:29:59 pm
Cameron is warning people to not use this as a witch-hunt against Teh Gaze.

Which is a good warning, but I hadn't actually seen any signs of that.  Obviously, some MPs are in the closet, or had past "homosexual experiences" at Eton and Cambridge and as a junior Cabinet Minister or whatever, but I think so long as under 16s were not involved, only a few eyebrows will be raised, and mostly at the hypocritical political positions these people may hold.

Meanwhile, this is a link

http://www.opendemocracy.net/ourbeeb/anthony-barnett/three-things-to-bear-in-mind-about-jimmy-savile-and-one-about-bbc

Quote
Why did ‘we the public’ admire a blatantly bad man? You only needed to look twice at his clothes, his glasses, his conjuror’s apparatus of decoys and diversions, his bling and his shell-suits and cultivated white-blond hair to sense he was repellent. Imagine getting onto a bus filled with Jims grinning with his arrogance and self-aggrandisement.

It was thanks to a form of celebrity that shares and rejoices in the whiff of wickedness that surrounds misogyny. The cult (and love) of chauvinist celebrity forgives misdemeanours ahead of time. It encourages men especially to project longings to be outside the law onto the figure of fame. The media may provide the cult’s priests, but the congregation is compliant and provides the energy. Today celebrities seem to build entire reputations on ‘getting away with it’ as ‘we the public’ continue to collude in a worship of strong and powerful men who break the rules.

And http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/i-based-psycho-on-jimmy-savile-says-1403727

Quote
Vance, a former athlete, hung about hospitals and toured towns in a show called Vance’s Visits – similar to the Savile’s Travels radio show.

Val, 57, said: “People often asked me where I had got the inspiration for the character. They never guessed it was Savile. For a start, Jacko is handsome and charming. I assume Savile didn’t recognise himself in that description.”

Val, from Fife, encountered Savile as a young reporter in 1977. She said: “He was a deeply unpleasant man. He was all smiles and laughter for the audience but as soon as we were alone, he was different. Savile was very much in the front of my mind when I was creating Jacko.”

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2216358/Jimmy-Savile-allegations-Why-did-listen-Jerry-Sadowitzs-howl-rage.html

Quote
There was a showbusiness personality brave enough to voice his concerns about Jimmy Savile. He’s the comedian they won’t let on television.

Jerry Sadowitz is not what you would call a family entertainer. Some revile him, most comics admire him. A few, such as Frankie Boyle and Ricky Gervais, have taken the germ of his act and watered it down for mass consumption. They sell out arenas pretending to shock; Sadowitz, the real deal, exists in relative obscurity.

Sadowitz is also one of the finest sleight-of-hand magicians in the world and his 2011 tour carried the banner ‘Comedian, Magician, Psychopath’. His shows remain the most uncomfortable night out in modern comedy. Few brave a seat in the front row. And, 25 years ago, this is what he had to say about Savile.

‘There have been serious allegations of child abuse in Cleveland. To my mind there is only one way to find out whether this is true or not and that’s to . . . CALL IN JIMMY SAVILE! You can’t afford to f*** about! Bring in an expert! Am I right? A friend of mine reckons Jimmy Savile is a paedophile. Rubbish — he’s a child-bender! That’s why he does all the f****** charity work: it’s to gain public sympathy for when his f****** case comes up.’

Quote
Obviously, Sadowitz wasn’t making jokes on the back of painstaking research into Savile’s private life. One presumes he had heard the rumours and was bold enough to put them out there. The point is, what about the rest of them?

If Sadowitz, a fringe comic with no connections to TV or radio at the time, had heard enough to joke about Savile in 1987, it is fair to presume his more famous contemporaries knew, too. This would include people who have done some serious moralising in the media of late.

Those last two paragraphs above are absolute killers.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on November 08, 2012, 04:18:55 pm
Wow...Jerry Sadowitz. Now there's a name I've not heard in a very long time. I also didn't know he was a stage magician either!

From what I've read/heard about the Savile debacle, I didn't get a sense there was anti-gay sentiment involved at least, not as far as JS is concerned because it seems that he targeted girls. (Or was he an equal opportunity abuser?)



Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on November 08, 2012, 04:21:50 pm
So far as we've heard, he only targeted girls. 

I'm fairly sure Cameron was being sincere...but then, if he was, wouldn't have the Cabinet Office Behavioural Team warned him that linking paedophilia and homosexuality, if only to deny the connection, would in fact perversely reinfornce the linkage? 

Of course, I am assuming all Cameron's public appearances are carefully scripted, because I'm fairly sure the Operating Thetans that control him would not be able to cope with the complexities of an unscripted reality.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on November 08, 2012, 04:28:51 pm
So far as we've heard, he only targeted girls. 

I'm fairly sure Cameron was being sincere...but then, if he was, wouldn't have the Cabinet Office Behavioural Team warned him that linking paedophilia and homosexuality, if only to deny the connection, would in fact perversely reinfornce the linkage? 

Of course, I am assuming all Cameron's public appearances are carefully scripted, because I'm fairly sure the Operating Thetans that control him would not be able to cope with the complexities of an unscripted reality.

Ahh...this is the same disease that Karl Rove, Bill O'Reilly & co are suffering from.

It is true though that there can be a tendency for people to link Homosexuality & Paedohillia. There's some very weird, dark, psychological nuance in that.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on November 08, 2012, 04:34:34 pm
Oh yes, for sure.  But I doubt Cameron telling them it's not connected is going to have the desired effect.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on November 08, 2012, 04:54:16 pm
Oh yes, for sure.  But I doubt Cameron telling them it's not connected is going to have the desired effect.


NO ONE THINK OF A SPIDER!! STOP THINKING ABOUT SPIDERS!!

I'm going to have to give this some more thought in a while but, here's how I perceive people's perceptions. (Woo..how meta!)

(a) Some people think that Homosexual = Paedophile. They seem certain that it's older males attracted to younger males exclusively. The classic meme for this being the dodgy Priest or the sketchy Boyscout leader.

(b) Older males abusing younger females is frowned upon for the most part. But then there's 'barely legal' porn, and the extensive sexualization of children, especially girls. There was a woman on a talk show here recently (think it was Anderson Cooper). She was getting verbally bitchslapped by an angry audience. Apparently, she couldn't see the problem with dressing up her little girl as Julia Roberts from "Pretty Woman" or like the biker chicks you see in magazines or garage calendars. And god forbid we even mention child beauty pageants. [shudder]. Seems like society is saying that abusing little girls is bad but getting them to dress, move or act like sexually mature adults is ok.....at least it's not GHEY, right??

(c) The discussion of women sexually abusing children of either sex is almost never discussed. [Unless a 20 something female teacher beds one of her teen something charges. Otherwise, this is invisible.]

(d) The predatory paedophile, while obviously a problem, has become like the serial killer in popular crime shows & movies. Fact is, most people don't get killed by serial killers. They usually get murdered by people they know and much child abuse occurs in the same manner. When people think of paedophiles, they tend to think of a man in a white van abducting little kids. Makes for great headlines, but victims of sexual abuse that I've met never suffered it under soapy, Hollywood like conditions. The evil was much more banal. 
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on November 22, 2012, 11:54:26 am
So, this is interesting

http://thesumpplug.blogspot.co.uk/2012/11/don-jimmy-gambino-obe.html

Quote
What exactly is going on here? Being driven around in a succession of fuck-you flash cars, the big cigars, never spending two nights running in the same house, flitting from nightspot to nightspot with a posse of big-muscled minders, packing a big roll of banknotes to pay off the police, demanding and receiving tithes from his underlings’ illicit earnings.... What does all that suggest to you: the quirks and foibles of a wannabe showbiz personality or the typical trappings of a mob boss?

Beneath the veneer of a Mecca middle manager, it looks as though Jimmy Savile was running a large-scale protection racket at dozens and dozens of Northern dance halls and nightclubs for the best part of two decades.

A lippy little tyke with his hair in a tartan bob (Black Watch, as he liked to point out) is all that most people chose to see. But up North he ruled the night. How’s about that, then?

Worth looking at the rest of the blog too, for such articles as this http://thesumpplug.blogspot.co.uk/2012/11/the-sorcerers-apprentice.html

Quote
Ray Teret kickstarted his career as Jimmy Savile's friend, flatmate, flunky and factotum. He stood in for Savile when he wasn't around and stood up for him when he was. He fixed things for the man who was destined to become Mr Fix-It. He was Savile's Mini-me, his H. R. Haldeman, his young ward Robin and his Squeaky Fromme all rolled into one.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on November 27, 2012, 11:00:09 pm
So, this is interesting

http://thesumpplug.blogspot.co.uk/2012/11/don-jimmy-gambino-obe.html

Quote
What exactly is going on here? Being driven around in a succession of fuck-you flash cars, the big cigars, never spending two nights running in the same house, flitting from nightspot to nightspot with a posse of big-muscled minders, packing a big roll of banknotes to pay off the police, demanding and receiving tithes from his underlings’ illicit earnings.... What does all that suggest to you: the quirks and foibles of a wannabe showbiz personality or the typical trappings of a mob boss?

Beneath the veneer of a Mecca middle manager, it looks as though Jimmy Savile was running a large-scale protection racket at dozens and dozens of Northern dance halls and nightclubs for the best part of two decades.

A lippy little tyke with his hair in a tartan bob (Black Watch, as he liked to point out) is all that most people chose to see. But up North he ruled the night. How’s about that, then?

Worth looking at the rest of the blog too, for such articles as this http://thesumpplug.blogspot.co.uk/2012/11/the-sorcerers-apprentice.html

Quote
Ray Teret kickstarted his career as Jimmy Savile's friend, flatmate, flunky and factotum. He stood in for Savile when he wasn't around and stood up for him when he was. He fixed things for the man who was destined to become Mr Fix-It. He was Savile's Mini-me, his H. R. Haldeman, his young ward Robin and his Squeaky Fromme all rolled into one.

And now it's time for another edition of......

"Publicize the dead paedophile MP!"

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/sir-cyril-smith-young-boys-were-abused-181133212.html
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on November 28, 2012, 12:58:44 am
So, this is interesting

http://thesumpplug.blogspot.co.uk/2012/11/don-jimmy-gambino-obe.html

Quote
What exactly is going on here? Being driven around in a succession of fuck-you flash cars, the big cigars, never spending two nights running in the same house, flitting from nightspot to nightspot with a posse of big-muscled minders, packing a big roll of banknotes to pay off the police, demanding and receiving tithes from his underlings’ illicit earnings.... What does all that suggest to you: the quirks and foibles of a wannabe showbiz personality or the typical trappings of a mob boss?

Beneath the veneer of a Mecca middle manager, it looks as though Jimmy Savile was running a large-scale protection racket at dozens and dozens of Northern dance halls and nightclubs for the best part of two decades.

A lippy little tyke with his hair in a tartan bob (Black Watch, as he liked to point out) is all that most people chose to see. But up North he ruled the night. How’s about that, then?

Worth looking at the rest of the blog too, for such articles as this http://thesumpplug.blogspot.co.uk/2012/11/the-sorcerers-apprentice.html

Quote
Ray Teret kickstarted his career as Jimmy Savile's friend, flatmate, flunky and factotum. He stood in for Savile when he wasn't around and stood up for him when he was. He fixed things for the man who was destined to become Mr Fix-It. He was Savile's Mini-me, his H. R. Haldeman, his young ward Robin and his Squeaky Fromme all rolled into one.

And now it's time for another edition of......

"Publicize the dead paedophile MP!"

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/sir-cyril-smith-young-boys-were-abused-181133212.html

What the fuck? Is being a member of Pedo Club part of the requirements?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on November 28, 2012, 09:11:40 am
And now it's time for another edition of......

"Publicize the dead paedophile MP!"

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/sir-cyril-smith-young-boys-were-abused-181133212.html

Yet another Amazing Dead Politician Pedo.

Incredible how quickly the police can confirm in death what they were unable to talk about while a person was alive...it's almost as if there was prior knowledge of the offences committed...
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on January 04, 2013, 05:20:36 pm
http://davidhencke.wordpress.com/2012/12/14/exclusive-police-re-open-investigation-into-london-political-paedo-ring/

Quote
Exaro News ( http://www.exaronews.com) today reveals that for the last two months the police have secretly been scoping a new investigation into senior politicians and their involvement in a paedophile ring, involving  under age boys, that took place in the 1980s.

This is separate to the current Operation Yewtree  investigation into Jimmy Savile and other celebrities, which mainly involves under age girls.

They are looking again at a raid that took place in 1982 on a  guest house in Barnes, south London, which appeared to be being used as a gay brothel and was frequented by prominent figures including, I am told, ministers, Tory MPs, a Liberal MP and two Labour Mps. Under age boys in  the care  of Richmond council and other local authorities were  visiting or staying at the guest house.

However, it should be noted that the police reasons for investigating this might not be out of genuine concern for the victims and a sense of justice.

As anyone who has been following the "Plebgate" scandal knows, it seems the Metropolitan Police are not very happy with the Tories, and indeed attempted to stitch up the Chief Whip with a faked but plausible controversy.

My belief is that the cuts, along with the handling of the Leveson Inquiry, made the police very unhappy with the Tories, and there is a simmering sense of resentment among the rank and file...the sort of feeling that leads to bent coppers trying every dirty trick in the book to get their target in trouble.

Such a ring may exist.  Actual members of the ring may even be implicated.  But then again, maybe they won't be.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on January 04, 2013, 06:49:14 pm
http://davidhencke.wordpress.com/2012/12/14/exclusive-police-re-open-investigation-into-london-political-paedo-ring/

Quote
Exaro News ( http://www.exaronews.com) today reveals that for the last two months the police have secretly been scoping a new investigation into senior politicians and their involvement in a paedophile ring, involving  under age boys, that took place in the 1980s.

This is separate to the current Operation Yewtree  investigation into Jimmy Savile and other celebrities, which mainly involves under age girls.

They are looking again at a raid that took place in 1982 on a  guest house in Barnes, south London, which appeared to be being used as a gay brothel and was frequented by prominent figures including, I am told, ministers, Tory MPs, a Liberal MP and two Labour Mps. Under age boys in  the care  of Richmond council and other local authorities were  visiting or staying at the guest house.

However, it should be noted that the police reasons for investigating this might not be out of genuine concern for the victims and a sense of justice.

As anyone who has been following the "Plebgate" scandal knows, it seems the Metropolitan Police are not very happy with the Tories, and indeed attempted to stitch up the Chief Whip with a faked but plausible controversy.

My belief is that the cuts, along with the handling of the Leveson Inquiry, made the police very unhappy with the Tories, and there is a simmering sense of resentment among the rank and file...the sort of feeling that leads to bent coppers trying every dirty trick in the book to get their target in trouble.

Such a ring may exist.  Actual members of the ring may even be implicated.  But then again, maybe they won't be.

Damn you History Channel!! That's how they end every single program: "Jesus might have been an Egyptian wizard from Mars....or he might not...we'll never know...but what if he was!??"

Seriously though....it would be entirely unsurprising if there was a ring consisting of MPs and sundry other power types. One of the many annoying features of conspiracy theorists (aside from them being barking mad) is that they are always looking for something vast, all encompassing and grand. I think that they miss the point that many conspiracies are actually much more banal & mundane (though no less disgusting.)  Something as basic and base as 'A bunch of pervs used their political influence to fuck children for kicks' is a lot more believable than 'The US has reverse engineered UFO propulsion and don't want you to know'. Proving the existence of sexual perversion is a hell of lot easier than making a case for space aliens.

Also - Jim Davidson is the latest 'celeb' caught up in the Saville wake. Did the police just sit down and write a list of 'obnoxious entertainers of the 80s'?  Freddie Starr, DLT and Jim Davidson.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on January 04, 2013, 06:51:49 pm
To be honest though, if those guys hadn't been on TV, everyone would have gotten massive pedo vibes off them anyway.  I mean, imagine seeing the ghoulish viasge of Jimmy Savile without ever having known of him before.  My first reaction as an adult would be to look for a knife and then a wall to put my back to.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on January 04, 2013, 07:06:38 pm
To be honest though, if those guys hadn't been on TV, everyone would have gotten massive pedo vibes off them anyway.  I mean, imagine seeing the ghoulish viasge of Jimmy Savile without ever having known of him before.  My first reaction as an adult would be to look for a knife and then a wall to put my back to.

Yeah, I think Jon Stewart did a bit on this on the Daily Show. They showed Sir Jim looking particularly skeevy and deranged and asked "How did you not know this guy was sick?"

With people like Freddie Star or Davidson, you have the venerable British institution of 'sea side post card' or 'Carry On' movies whereby 'cheeky chappies' are condoned for being over sexed assholes. None of the people who have been called in for interview have struck me as being especially surprising.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on January 08, 2013, 07:28:30 pm
Just calling it now - Bruce Forsythe will get his collar felt sooner or later.


On a different note, my newsfeed has had a bunch of "female teacher paedophile" stories from the US as of late, with consistent minor sentencing. The situation is much the same in the UK and I imagine in Europe. Any takers on speculating when crime will become equal?

I get that many think that the pupil is just a lucky bastard, but look at some of the mugshots and they're really not. Shallow, yes, but the point remains that abusers are not supermodels or adonis-like in the most part. It remains that it was an abusive situation, yet the sentencing disparity is amazing. Something to do with re-offending stats?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on January 08, 2013, 08:34:20 pm
Not so sure about Brucie. Struck me more as a 'traditional' pussy hound - 6ft leggy blondes and all that.

Rod Hull, on the other hand? If anyone is interested in running a sweep I'll buy that for a dollar
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on January 08, 2013, 08:38:01 pm
I'm running the book at our place. £1/name, next named(dead)/arrested(alive) takes the current pot.


Jim Davidson getting pinched was a nice return to work.

Edit- Brucie was more for my own personal satisfaction. If someone else tries to tell me about who fucking danced what with a particular H list celeb I will not be held accountable for my actions. I sent a memo and everything.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on January 09, 2013, 04:32:34 pm
Not so sure about Brucie. Struck me more as a 'traditional' pussy hound - 6ft leggy blondes and all that.

Rod Hull, on the other hand? If anyone is interested in running a sweep I'll buy that for a dollar

I was going to mention Rod Hull in my last post. 

(By the way, on the other hand was Emu.)
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on January 09, 2013, 05:08:40 pm
ICWATUDID  :argh!:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on January 11, 2013, 03:01:39 pm
http://www.nspcc.org.uk/news-and-views/our-news/child-protection-news/13-01-11-yewtree-report/yewtree-report-pdf_wdf93652.pdf

Quote
Children as young as eight were abused by Jimmy Savile, a report detailing 50 years of allegations has revealed.

The Met Police and NSPCC outlined offences at 13 hospitals, including Great Ormond Street in London and Wheatfields Hospice in Leeds.

Some 214 crimes were recorded across 28 police force areas, including 34 of rape or penetration, the report said.

The CPS apologised for missing the opportunity to prosecute Savile in 2009, while he was still alive.

Police said the victims' accounts painted a "compelling picture of widespread sexual abuse by a predatory sex offender," and Cdr Peter Spindler, who is leading the abuse probe, said Savile had "groomed the nation".
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on January 11, 2013, 04:19:34 pm
http://www.nspcc.org.uk/news-and-views/our-news/child-protection-news/13-01-11-yewtree-report/yewtree-report-pdf_wdf93652.pdf

Quote
Children as young as eight were abused by Jimmy Savile, a report detailing 50 years of allegations has revealed.

The Met Police and NSPCC outlined offences at 13 hospitals, including Great Ormond Street in London and Wheatfields Hospice in Leeds.

Some 214 crimes were recorded across 28 police force areas, including 34 of rape or penetration, the report said.

The CPS apologised for missing the opportunity to prosecute Savile in 2009, while he was still alive.

Police said the victims' accounts painted a "compelling picture of widespread sexual abuse by a predatory sex offender," and Cdr Peter Spindler, who is leading the abuse probe, said Savile had "groomed the nation".

Depressing. And is it just me, or was there something weirdly excessive about all the graphs & pie charts? "Well, as you can see, when we do a statistical analysis, on average a 14 year girl had a 23% chance of getting raped by Savile, but her risk factor would have greatly decreased had she lived in Devon instead of Yorkshire."
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on January 11, 2013, 07:42:23 pm
I will admit to laughing when Jim Davidson was pinched by the old bill, and then feeling bad for laughing. Not about the arrest, just that there was potential victims by the vile little scrote-weasel. With his sexist and misogynistic bullshit excuse for humour, I was hardly surprised.

 
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on January 11, 2013, 07:47:37 pm
http://www.nspcc.org.uk/news-and-views/our-news/child-protection-news/13-01-11-yewtree-report/yewtree-report-pdf_wdf93652.pdf

Quote
Children as young as eight were abused by Jimmy Savile, a report detailing 50 years of allegations has revealed.

The Met Police and NSPCC outlined offences at 13 hospitals, including Great Ormond Street in London and Wheatfields Hospice in Leeds.

Some 214 crimes were recorded across 28 police force areas, including 34 of rape or penetration, the report said.

The CPS apologised for missing the opportunity to prosecute Savile in 2009, while he was still alive.

Police said the victims' accounts painted a "compelling picture of widespread sexual abuse by a predatory sex offender," and Cdr Peter Spindler, who is leading the abuse probe, said Savile had "groomed the nation".

Depressing. And is it just me, or was there something weirdly excessive about all the graphs & pie charts? "Well, as you can see, when we do a statistical analysis, on average a 14 year girl had a 23% chance of getting raped by Savile, but her risk factor would have greatly decreased had she lived in Devon instead of Yorkshire."

graphs often make things a lot clearer to understand with stats on sexual assault. What i find depressing is that there were enough assaults to actually need any graphs and tables.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on January 14, 2013, 09:48:51 pm
The Sunday Express is now claiming that Savile was part of a "Satanic ring" of child abusers.

Link (http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/370439/Jimmy-Savile-was-part-of-satanic-ring).

Satanic Ritual Abuse is a tricky subject.  On the one hand, I am very sceptical of all claims by the Express, a paper best known for tabloid gossip and racist rants.  More pertinently, I am sceptical about the prevalence of Satanic Ritual Abuse.  The claims of the like of Valerie Sinason, of widespread networks of such abuse are very hard to credit.  Furthermore, the whole thing feeds into some very disturbing territory traditionally populated by White Nationalists and Christian Extremists ranting about the NWO.

However.

At the same time, I believe the counter-claim that Satanic Ritual Abuse has never ever happened in the history of the world ever, and anyone who claims otherwise is a deluded conspiracy theorist to be equally suspect.  One of the chief groups that played a role in debunking all SRA-claimed cases includes the False Memory Syndrome Foundation - whose board of members include contributers to a pro-paedophilic journal based out of Amsterdam. 

Satanic inspired ritual murders happen all the time, so the idea that abuse does not is patently laughable.  The real question is the extent and prevalence of such acts.

Now, in this particular case, the "evidence" comes from a single person, with a suspect location for the crime.  I'm inclined to disbelieve it.  That doesn't mean Savile wasn't a SRAbuser, however, the evidence he was is not convincing at all in this case.  I'm also inclined by the relative scarcity of such acts in comparison to overall rates of abuse to give it a low probability rating, unless some very credible evidence can swing things in the other direction.

See, this Bayesian thing does have its uses.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on January 14, 2013, 10:35:28 pm
On the OTHER other hand, though, who cares what motivated the abuse?  It's not like one kind of pedo shit is acceptable, and another kind isn't.

Thing is, find out if anyone else was involved or covering up or whatever, and then hang 'em all higher than Haman.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on January 14, 2013, 11:01:28 pm
True, the interest is fairly purient, and merely done to move copy, I suspect.

I have a professional interest in the psychopathology of certain criminal behaviour, which makes me curious in general about cases like this, but for most people, it shouldn't make a difference.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on January 14, 2013, 11:22:14 pm
Couple of famous fucks fiddling with kiddies is outrage and horrible but, for a lot of peeps, TEH DEVIL is "OMG ARMAGEDON IS COMING"

I'm not even talking born again freakshows like you get in the states, just your average punter that doesn't question that kind of indoctrinated shit and still believes on some level that suernatural crap like that is feasible.

Then Dubya froths "Axis of evil" and little stories like this reinforce the fact that we're under attack by demonic minions.

I often wonder if the spin they often chuck on shit like this is just stockpiling ammunition for a future invocation of Holy Crusade.

Of course, maybe it's not. Maybe society is still more superstitious than I give it credit for and certain demographics will always be looking out for evidence of lucifer
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on January 21, 2013, 08:10:20 am
Hmmm...

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/police-seize-vip-list-in-dawn-1546351

Quote
A list of names seized by police probing allegations of child abuse includes ministers, members of the royal household and a world-famous pop star...

All were recorded as visitors to a suburban guest house that operated as a gay brothel.

Now some could be suspects in an investigation into a network of powerful people who were secret paedophiles for years.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on January 22, 2013, 09:32:18 pm
Hmmm...

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/police-seize-vip-list-in-dawn-1546351

Quote
A list of names seized by police probing allegations of child abuse includes ministers, members of the royal household and a world-famous pop star...

All were recorded as visitors to a suburban guest house that operated as a gay brothel.

Now some could be suspects in an investigation into a network of powerful people who were secret paedophiles for years.

Oh tabloid press. They lead in with the inflammatory:

A list of names seized by police probing allegations of child abuse includes ministers, members of the royal household and a world-famous pop star, the Sunday People can reveal.


But later point out:

One of those is a best-selling musician, but like some others on the list he is not suspected of being involved in the child abuse.


So, the famous musician cited in the beginning of the article is both part of and not part of an investigation of child abuse? Schrodinger's Paedophile?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 22, 2013, 09:35:44 pm
They're on the list of patrons but are not suspects.

Seems pretty straightforward to me...
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on January 22, 2013, 09:42:22 pm
They're on the list of patrons but are not suspects.

Seems pretty straightforward to me...


But you are intelligent, literate and not the target audience of Brit newspapers like The Mirror.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on January 22, 2013, 10:45:33 pm
They're on the list of patrons but are not suspects.

Seems pretty straightforward to me...


But you are intelligent, literate and not the target audience of Brit newspapers like The Mirror.

This! Tabloid press have no agenda here besides unit sales. "FAMOUS ROCK STAR IN SHOCK PEDO HORROR full story on page 5" Page 5 will inevitably show a random musician along with a caption that reads "A famous rock star" Facts will be buried in the screeds of TL/DR which, for most readers, is the part after the byline.

Units fly off the shelves - Ka-ching - mission accompished
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 17, 2013, 03:56:14 pm
So, uh, given some of the other rumours (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2221922/Jimmy-Savile-necrophiliac-says-colleague-Paul-Gambaccini.html) about Savile, this obit (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obituaries/8857428/Sir-Jimmy-Savile.html) takes on a sinister and disturbing tone:

Quote
His closest relationship was with his mother, Agnes, whom Savile called “the Duchess”.

After her death in 1973, Savile sequestered himself with her body for five days, which he subsequently claimed were the “best five days of my life … She looked marvellous. She belonged to me. It’s wonderful, is death.” In later years he felt obliged to explain that he had not buried her sooner “because the ground was icy”. He continued to keep her room exactly as it was, and would have her clothes dry-cleaned once a year.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Tiddleywomp Cockletit on March 17, 2013, 04:43:34 pm
And now it's time for another edition of......

"Publicize the dead paedophile MP!"

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/sir-cyril-smith-young-boys-were-abused-181133212.html

Yet another Amazing Dead Politician Pedo.

Incredible how quickly the police can confirm in death what they were unable to talk about while a person was alive...it's almost as if there was prior knowledge of the offences committed...

This post. This THREAD.
 :x :vom:

Enlightening, though.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 17, 2013, 05:05:10 pm
So, uh, given some of the other rumours (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2221922/Jimmy-Savile-necrophiliac-says-colleague-Paul-Gambaccini.html) about Savile, this obit (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obituaries/8857428/Sir-Jimmy-Savile.html) takes on a sinister and disturbing tone:

Quote
His closest relationship was with his mother, Agnes, whom Savile called “the Duchess”.

After her death in 1973, Savile sequestered himself with her body for five days, which he subsequently claimed were the “best five days of my life … She looked marvellous. She belonged to me. It’s wonderful, is death.” In later years he felt obliged to explain that he had not buried her sooner “because the ground was icy”. He continued to keep her room exactly as it was, and would have her clothes dry-cleaned once a year.

 :eek:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 17, 2013, 06:40:44 pm
Yeah, that was pretty much my facial expression upon reading that.

Also consider this umprompted denial (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/4589779/Hospital-to-probe-Jimmy-Saviles-lone-visits-to-morgue.html):

Quote
Savile, who died last year at 84, said: “One of my jobs is to take away the deceased. You can look after somebody, be alone with somebody, who has lived a whole lifetime, and I’m just saying goodbye and looking after him.

“That is a privilege and an honour. Some people get hold of the fact that Jim likes looking after cadavers and say, ‘Aha, Jim’s a necrophiliac!’ I’m not a necrophiliac.”
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 17, 2013, 08:53:33 pm
Yeeeeeaahhhhhhh.  :horrormirth:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 18, 2013, 04:34:33 am
Here's the Nick Davies article from 1998

http://www.nickdavies.net/1998/04/01/the-sheer-scale-of-child-sexual-abuse-in-britain/

So, uh, I really didn't do my homework here.

It turns out that Tom Watson was not referring to Peter Morrison when he talked about a Downing Street aide who could get access to pornographic material.

Quote from: Tom Watson
Within the material seized at Righton’s home were letters from known and convicted paedophiles. The contact, who has seen the letters, claimed that one paedophile in particular was of great concern. He said that the paedophile, who worked with children, boasted of a key aide to a former PM who could help get hold of indecent images of children. I am not naming the person for obvious reasons but for clarity it is not former MP, Peter Morrison.

Also interesting to note that Jimmy Savile got the keys to Broadmoor because the Tories didn't like that the management there were actually listening to the union workers, giving out payrises and so on. 

So in addition to being a pedophile and possible necrophiliac, he was a scumbag scab in the bargain.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 18, 2013, 05:42:45 am
Uh, so during the Great Pink Panic, aka the Cold War, it turns out employees of the BBC were vetted by MI5 (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1522875/Revealed-how-the-BBC-used-MI5-to-vet-thousands-of-staff.html).

Quote

Confidential papers, obtained by The Sunday Telegraph, have revealed that the BBC allowed MI5 to investigate the backgrounds and political affiliations of -thousands of its employees, including newsreaders, reporters and continuity announcers.

The files, which shed light on the BBC's hitherto secret links with the Security Service, show that at one stage it was responsible for vetting 6,300 different BBC posts - almost a third of the total workforce.

They also confirm that the corporation held a list of "subversive organisations" and that evidence of certain kinds of political activity could be a bar to appointment or promotion.

The BBC's reliance on MI5 reached a peak in the late 1970s and early 1980s at exactly the same time as millions of viewers were tuning into the fictional adventures of George Smiley in Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy and -Smiley's People.

Even if Savile had not been vetted during his time spent with Maggie Thatcher at Chequers (he almost certainly was), he was likely vetted by MI5 earlier, due to his BBC work.

The most charitable explanation is that the security services cocked it up.  But that doesn't seem very plausible - Savile had already come to the attention of the police a couple of times for his preferences...those would be picked up on any basic background check. MI5 also had at the time a huge stable of "watchers" it could call on, for surveillance purposes.  Admittedly, said watchers were not too good when it came to the KGB running around the streets of London, but at least the KGB had tradecraft which could explain that.

All other explanations involve them being willing to overlook it.  Which then leads to the question of why?  His political opinions, insofar as I can find them, suggest he was more a man of the right....were they content to have a politically reliable character at the forefront of the popular music industry, regardless of his other activities?  Or was it for some other reason....I can't help but think of Savile's northern dance club empire and wonder how it interacted with the drugs trade, for example.

And of course, one cannot rule out simple blackmail.  Though for what purpose is another question...
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 18, 2013, 06:05:53 am
Wait, what?

(http://i1178.photobucket.com/albums/x369/semperoccultus2/DailyStartpg01.jpg)

(http://i1178.photobucket.com/albums/x369/semperoccultus2/DailyStartpg02.jpg)

(http://i1178.photobucket.com/albums/x369/semperoccultus2/DailyStartpg03.jpg)

(Original at link (http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/279380/TORY-PAEDO-COVER-UP/))

OK, the coverup aspect we already knew about.  But Belgium?  Well, that's a new angle, for sure.

And a very, very disturbing one.  Amerispags may not know this, but Belgium is basically Europe's Florida - not in terms of the people who live there, so much, but it is the ground zero for weird shit, banana republic style shenanigans and corruption on a grand scale.

In particular, there have been numerous rumours about the "ballet roses" (http://www.whale.to/c/belgians_shocked.html), which the above article seems to be referring to.

Also note the reference to Marc Dutroux (https://wikispooks.com/ISGP/dutroux/Belgian_X_dossiers_of_the_Dutroux_affair.htm) (note: NSFW, triggering).  And that is some extremely dangerous territory. 

Belgium also leads, inevitably, to, Amsterdam.  And whenever Amsterdam and pedophilia are linked, one should remember the story of Warwick Spinks (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2234679/Britains-wanted-paedophile-Warren-Spinks-kidnapped-sold-young-boys-abuse-finally-caught-15-years-run.html).  Interesting that Spinks was nabbed so recently, after such a long time on the run, isn't it?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 18, 2013, 06:14:55 am
Too tired to think about this properly.  But I will persevere regardless.  Not rigorous, this.  Merely speculation.  Showing connections between dots, without narrative.  No thesis, just facts.   Well, not true, never just facts, elimination and juxtaposition of information, ranking according to percieved trustworthiness, influenced by hidden biases.  No overt theories yet, however.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 18, 2013, 06:27:55 am
Creepy (http://cowanandthestupiddream.wordpress.com/2012/10/16/bruno-savile-starr-this-is-your-life/):

Quote
‘Frank is one of the hardest people to buy a present for’ he says, addressing the audience like they’re the end-of-pier crowd.
‘You never bought me one though!’ Frank replies, chuckling like mad.
‘I did! I did – it was for Christmas. And do you remember, it was a Black & Decker?’

If you’re unfamiliar with the innuendo there (I was too), it turns out ‘Black & Decker’ is a euphemism for a willy. Presumably a black man’s willy. There’s a report out there in internet-land where Bruno defends himself against an accusation of wife-beating using the term himself.

‘My mum’s here. Don’t talk about that. Pass on that one Freddie, cool down’ Frank says, laughing at the in-joke.
‘…But it broke down’ Starr continues, possibly referring to a specific event. Unless he’s still joking. If he is, we don’t really get to a punchline.

‘The Black & Decker?’ Frank asks, trying to recall.
‘Yeah’
‘It was alright on holiday though!’ Frank says.
‘Yeah!’
‘It was on turbo, mate!’

Quote
But, let’s go back. What’s that? What’s Frank been saying? Jimmy tells us…

‘Now listen! Underneath this… drab exterior’

He’s pulling at his trousers. The groin area of his trousers.

‘It ain’t a White & Decker is it?’ asks a giggling Bruno.

Have Starr, Bruno and Savile been on holiday together? A Black & White & Decker holiday? It doesn’t bear thinking about.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: EK WAFFLR on March 18, 2013, 11:54:26 am
...wow. Just wow.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on March 18, 2013, 12:21:18 pm
More good finds Cain, Thanks.

This caught my eye:
http://mystoryaboutsocialservices.wordpress.com/2012/09/20/silencing-a-scandal-the-story-of-colin-smart-copied-from-nick-davis/

Excellent reporting.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: LMNO on March 18, 2013, 12:41:24 pm
That shit about Doutrox is horrifying.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on March 18, 2013, 12:59:02 pm
I'm gonna take a pass on checking that one out, at least for the moment. D:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: LMNO on March 18, 2013, 01:15:21 pm
Nigel, at the risk of engaging in some reverse psychology, you do not want to read that article.

"Trigger warning" doesn't even begin to cover it.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Tiddleywomp Cockletit on March 18, 2013, 03:03:34 pm
I'm not sure there's even a word for that level.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 18, 2013, 05:47:12 pm
The X Dossiers are not comfortable reading.

LMNO is right, I should have added a trigger warning, I will edit the post afterwards to reflect that.  The article in question involves, at least in part, lengthy interviews with the victims of sustained and organised childhood sexual abuse. 

The article also shows several (mercifully edited and purposefully low quality) pictures from the Dutroux dossier.  These are not gratuitous, but designed to show there is corroborating evidence for the claims of several witnesses concerning the kinds of abuse they underwent.

However, the most important thing about the article are the claims.  In essence, after Dutroux's arrest, and the speculation about a network he was kidnapping and providing girls to, several people came forward, believing due to the seriousness of the investigation into Dutroux that the police and Justice Department officials could be trusted with their stories.

Each witness was given an "X" designation and interviewed.  And if even 10% of what they say is true....then Belgium has some very serious issues.  And the chances are, what they say is at least partly true, because they were interviewed seperately, and their reports corroborated each other.  The same names came up, again and again.  The same places.  The witnesses were able to positively identify girls who were murdered by the network, and investigators found discrepancies in the death certificates issued for them.

Despite the trigger material, the meat of the article is in the investigation, showing the credibility of the witnesses, and the allegations and their implications.

If anyone wishes, I can send them the article minus the most obvious triggers (the graphic descriptions of abuse etc), should they want to see the evidence for themselves.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on March 18, 2013, 06:14:41 pm
I've printed off the Dutroux info, starting through it now.

10 pages in, appalled and fairly certain to finish it tonight now. I assume there's been little real follow up in terms of arrests and convictions?

One thing that does seem startling is the level of mutual protection offered by those involved to each other. I would have thought in any potential network of this size there'd be a catastrophic weak link sooner or later?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 18, 2013, 06:25:57 pm
As you'll see in part 10, the original examining magistrate was removed from the case of Dutroux based on a technicality, and his replacement, Jacques Langlois, catergorically denied the existence of child abuse networks and put investigators to work on bogus leads that led nowhere and kept them away from the main thrust of the investigation thus far.

The X Dossier interviewees, whose task force had been acting mostly independently at that stage, were also rolled into a team under the control of Gendarmerie Commandant Jean-Luc Duterme.  Langlois did not read their testimonies themselves, and relied on Duterme to interpret them - investigators felt Duterme was purposefully highlighting what they considered disinformation in order to discredit the witnesses entirely.

Or it's possible he really just was that stupid.  Any country with the amount of corruption and secrets that Belgium has no doubt also has its fair share of people who got their positions based on who they know, and not what they know.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on March 18, 2013, 06:34:35 pm
Ah, thanks. I'll finish the thing before further comment/questions
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 18, 2013, 06:38:41 pm
Also look out for Police commissioner Georges Marnette - he was named by X2 and Nathalie W. as an abuser.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 18, 2013, 07:16:17 pm
And because this may help inform the Dutroux "Dossier X" affair

http://www.canadafreepress.com/2006/thomas100806.htm

Quote
The allegedly abused children of Portugal represent a fraction of a global industry. Its annual revenues were estimated in 2003 to exceed half a trillion dollars globally. This is twice the value of all United States currency currently in circulation at any given time, more than the annual gross national products of many countries.

To understand the sheer size of profits accruing from such terrible misery, consider this: a million dollars in gold would weigh as much as a Japanese Sumo wrestler. A half trillion dollars would come close to exceeding the entire population weight of a medium sized Australian city.

The profits come from child sexual trafficking in all its forms: white slavery, sex rings, pornography, the sex tourism industry, lap dancing, bogus adoption schemes and procuring the victims -- the untold millions of children globally entrapped in the sex trade industry who are forced to allow their bodies to be used in exchange for food, money, shelter, alcohol and drugs.

Children are bought, sold, traded and misused in underground child sex markets daily. Every state in the United States, and every other nation, contributes in some fashion to the steady flow of children, the customers and exploiters.

It is estimated that the profits from this vast evil empire, when properly invested, would draw an interest exceeding US $2 million an hour. The sexual trafficking in children is not so much an industry but a global empire.

Sovereign and expansionist, it is frequently torn by internal struggle -- fights to the death between the Chinese Triads and the Russian Mafia, between the multi-gangs of the Balkans, are commonplace. But the empire presents a secret front to the world. It is from there it plunders our children, snatches them, never to be seen again.

The predators who control the sexual trafficking in children are well organized. They have thugs who snatch and break the resistance of children; banks who account the empire's profits without asking questions; ships that convey the hapless children from one continent to another and private planes that transport them to clients around the world.

Yet there is little or no cohesive and sustained war against this terrible evil. The United States and Britain try to stamp on the trafficking within its own borders. But as yet there is no universal challenge to the ever-growing sexual trafficking in children.

Yes, I know, Canada Free Press is a crank website, but the author of the article, Gordon Thomas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordon_Thomas_%28Welsh_author%29), is not.  Though he is Welsh.  Regardless, what this article shows is the sheer global extent and massive profits that child sex trafficking can make.

And if this is happening all over the world, the only reason to assume it's not happening on our own cities is because our police are less corrupt and more diligent, our political processes more open and fair.  Except, of course, they're not always, are they?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on March 19, 2013, 08:40:38 am
Got about 40 pages in, one of the toughest things I've had to read for a while.

The potential level of implications here is huge. It really does put the Icke crowd in a bit of different light. They're lunatics, but not for the reasons I originally thought.

Will press on with it tonight, is there much follow up to the royal family links/allegations?


I have no idea how Belgium gained the cultural stereotype of "boring", "horrific" seems more apt for anyone of prominence. 
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 19, 2013, 08:52:43 am
I believe the most highly ranked person implicated directly in the X dossiers is a baron, though, in an interview, Nihoul claimed he had photographic evidence of Prince Albert forcing himself on a 16 year old girl, for a six figure sum.  But then, can Nihoul really be trusted?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: LMNO on March 19, 2013, 12:29:20 pm
I think it's going to take some fine parsing between testimony and hearsay.  They say that extraordinary claims demand extraordinary proof -- and I now believe the astonishing (sickening) level of inhumanity that was reached, due to this quite extraordinary proof. 

But to say that "I saw a picture of Prince Albert raping a child" just isn't enough for me at this point.  I could be true, but right now there's not enough to tip it over the 60% probability that I generally use as a guideline for "true things".
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 19, 2013, 01:24:13 pm
Yeah, Nihoul's a tainted source, making an allegation without corroboration.  His testimony alone is not strong enough to be considered any kind of proof.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 26, 2013, 03:07:58 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21936350

Quote
Mr De'Ath was asked on Today about a previous claim that Savile had spent the night in a hotel with a girl who was probably 10-years-old.

Mr De'Ath said it had "never occurred " to him to go to the police.

"I did say to [Savile] 'I think you're living dangerously'," he said.

"I was pretty shocked and disgusted. Also, I was physically frightened of Savile. He had been a boxer and a wrestler and he was in with some very rough people.

"I would never have dreamed of grassing him up."
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 26, 2013, 03:22:22 pm
And while I'm here:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/paedophile-mp-cover-up-claim-detective-1785273#.UVFrqk6bYTY.twitter

Quote
Tasked with flushing out ­paedophiles preying on vulnerable youngsters at children’s homes, Detective Chief Inspector Clive Driscoll relished the challenge.

But the officer suddenly found himself booted off the case and put on a ­disciplinary after revealing ­politicians were named among the suspects.

At least one of the figures is understood to have been an MP.

And former Labour councillor Anna Tapsell claims she was visited by a police chief to “warn her off” after she raised concerns that detectives would not ­properly investigate allegations of ­paedophile activity in care homes.

Mr Driscoll launched his probe into child sex abuse claims in the South London borough of Lambeth in 1998.

But he claims Scotland Yard began meddling as soon as the politicians were named.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: LMNO on March 26, 2013, 03:40:44 pm
Oh, fantastic.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 26, 2013, 04:03:12 pm
Yeah.  This was a case in the late 90s, not the most recent one, but still worth noting.

If you read the full article, you'll see it's another case of already convicted pedophiles being allowed to slip through the cracks or otherwise protected.  In the words of the article:

Quote
Michael John Carroll, the former boss of the Angell Road home, was arrested in 1998 by Merseyside police for abuse spanning decades.

By that time Ms Tapsell had spent more than 10 years highlighting his case after she discovered Lambeth bosses let him run children’s homes until 1991 despite ­executives learning in 1986 he was a convicted ­paedophile.

Quote
Ms Tapsell told the judge that Carroll, who had not at that point been arrested, was “protected” by Lambeth social ­services bosses along with paedophile Les Paul who worked in South Vale.

Paul was jailed for two and a half years in 1994 for abusing three boys including one from the children’s home.

Ms Tapsell wrote: “Les Paul took little boys home and on holiday, just as Carroll did with the full knowledge of area staff. The examples are numerous.

“Almost all the internal abuse issues have involved collusion across divisions.

"I have no doubt Angell Road may have been used for organised child abuse which involved adults other than staff.

Everyone knew.  Previous convictions ignored.  The social services apparently cool with the whole situation.

If that's not suggestive of a coverup, then almost nothing is.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: LMNO on March 26, 2013, 04:16:29 pm
This makes me nauseous.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on March 26, 2013, 06:47:14 pm
I must admit I'm a mixture of shocked (takes quite a lot) and disappointed. That old saying about evil being the inaction of good men ... A lot of people that could have and should have, did fuck all to help those kids. I saw an interview with Mr Death at the time and I remember thinking it'd be nice to throw the cunt in jail for aiding and abetting just to spite him. A guy is about to bang the arse off a ten year old. Who he is becomes kind of irrelevant at that point. Either you put him down or you get a hold of people who can do it for you but you don't brush it all off and go back to your room.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 26, 2013, 07:04:12 pm
Couldn't agree more.

I have to admit though, I would have liked for him to have been pressed more on exactly what it was about Savile that physically intimidated him.  That section put me in mind of the article, way back near the start of this thread, about his nightclub bouncers and the characterization of Savile as closer to a mob boss than a club middle manager.

I could certainly see that being the case, but the period he seems to be talking about is the 70s, whereas Savile was doing his club thing mostly in the 50s and 60s.  Or did he mean some other associates?  I would imagine, given Savile's club and showbiz connections, a potential drug connection would not have been out of the question, especially in the 70s.  Or did the unfortunately named De'Ath mean something else?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on March 26, 2013, 07:11:32 pm
Even in the criminal world there's plenty would draw the line at what was going on. Whoever Savilles connections were, there had to be other fuckers who wouldn't let that shit wash and had enough clout of their own not to have to think twice? Makes me wonder if "specialist tastes" become a bit less unpalatable as you rise up the echelons of wealth and power.

Is this a class division per chance?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 26, 2013, 07:12:22 pm
Worth mentioning?  Maybe

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/businessman-spared-jail-over-child-porn-8465596.html

Quote
An MP's son who joined an online “club” of perverts who shared sickening images of child abuse has been handed a suspended jail term.

Nicholas Beaumont-Dark, whose late father was a Conservative MP from 1979 to 1992, downloaded and distributed almost 400 illegal images, including one of a baby being sexually assaulted.

Warwick Crown Court heard that Beaumont-Dark, 50, was arrested in March last year after police seized a computer from his home in Tanworth-in-Arden, Warwickshire.

The businessman, who pleaded guilty at a previous hearing to 16 offences of making and distributing indecent images, was given a one-year jail sentence, suspended for two years.

Pretty lenient, that sentencing.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on March 26, 2013, 07:31:04 pm
I'm thinking about the culture I'm from. The people I know. I can't think of anyone who isn't pro-ripping their balls off. And that's from the heart. Everyone at least knows someone who has a kid. I'm not saying child molesters don't happen but they sure as fuck get dealt with as soon as someone finds out.

Then there's folks who can afford people. Who can afford kids to do all sorts of fucked up shit to. A strata of wage slavers, and idle rich who feed on the spoils? I've heard a lot of nasty stories about what these fucks get up to but I gotta say, something about this one makes it really noise me up in a way that the other bullshit doesn't.

Something cold. Something dark. Something inhuman. I'm against the perpetrators, of course. Nothing much has changed there but the culture that turns a blind eye to it? I want to burn that fucker to the ground Anyone who knew about this and didn't act. Exterminated. No excuses. No mercy. No compassion.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on March 26, 2013, 07:48:00 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21936350

Quote
Mr De'Ath was asked on Today about a previous claim that Savile had spent the night in a hotel with a girl who was probably 10-years-old.

Mr De'Ath said it had "never occurred " to him to go to the police.

"I did say to [Savile] 'I think you're living dangerously'," he said.

"I was pretty shocked and disgusted. Also, I was physically frightened of Savile. He had been a boxer and a wrestler and he was in with some very rough people.

"I would never have dreamed of grassing him up."

Yeah, the above is pretty typical for this guy. He's got a pretty fucking sketchy past to say the least, and is very familar with a jail cell. You really had to question this guy, no matter how thin.

I will note, more allegations do seem to come after confirmation and details of the first. Pretty sure he'll get his in time.

And Jim Davidson, you greasy shit.

"Nick Nick". Laugh that off you evil fucker.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on March 27, 2013, 02:58:37 am
I'm thinking about the culture I'm from. The people I know. I can't think of anyone who isn't pro-ripping their balls off. And that's from the heart. Everyone at least knows someone who has a kid. I'm not saying child molesters don't happen but they sure as fuck get dealt with as soon as someone finds out.

Then there's folks who can afford people. Who can afford kids to do all sorts of fucked up shit to. A strata of wage slavers, and idle rich who feed on the spoils? I've heard a lot of nasty stories about what these fucks get up to but I gotta say, something about this one makes it really noise me up in a way that the other bullshit doesn't.

Something cold. Something dark. Something inhuman. I'm against the perpetrators, of course. Nothing much has changed there but the culture that turns a blind eye to it? I want to burn that fucker to the ground Anyone who knew about this and didn't act. Exterminated. No excuses. No mercy. No compassion.

Rape culture, my friend, the culture of looking the other way and blaming the victim. Like those dudes that targeted girls from "troubled backgrounds" in Rochdale and Oxford. Choose a victim no one will believe, or elevate social status to "respected", is how predators choose targets. Local to me there was a minister/vicar whatever, who acted shocked during a child abuse case, was later found with a massive record or ledger of all the squick he had committed.  Saville's body count got so high because of reputation, being seen as respected.

I did a child safeguarding course recently and the trainer said that abuse happens in working class and middle class and up about equally, but upper class perps hide it better. The child sexual abuse stats for the UK are pretty terrifying. http://www.nspcc.org.uk/Inform/resourcesforprofessionals/sexualabuse/statistics_wda87833.html

The abuse of kids by other kids is worrying, and I reckon proper consent, sex and relationship education is something we seriously need. We need to teach kids about consent, because how many parents do you know talk about that with their kids? I know some, but they are all pretty much stanch feminists, so... minority there.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on April 19, 2013, 09:06:35 am
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22212131

Rolf Harris Arrested.

2 little boys indeed.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on April 19, 2013, 12:09:44 pm
 :lord:

MY CHILDHOOD TV PROGRAMMES= FULL OF SEX OFFENDERS.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on April 19, 2013, 12:22:56 pm
:lord:

MY CHILDHOOD TV PROGRAMMES= FULL OF SEX OFFENDERS.

I'm thinking the same shit. All we need is Johnny Morris in a bestiality scandal and my childhood will be completely rooint  :argh!:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on April 19, 2013, 12:59:57 pm
:lord:

MY CHILDHOOD TV PROGRAMMES= FULL OF SEX OFFENDERS.

I'm thinking the same shit. All we need is Johnny Morris in a bestiality scandal and my childhood will be completely rooint  :argh!:

Or Timmy Mallet.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on April 19, 2013, 01:00:55 pm
Was unsurprised by Jim Davidson though.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on April 19, 2013, 01:29:31 pm
Not sure I feel the same. Davidson is a fucking racist, sure. But one character flaw does not necessarily mean he has them all. They're not like Pokemon.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on April 19, 2013, 01:35:32 pm
Not sure I feel the same. Davidson is a fucking racist, sure. But one character flaw does not necessarily mean he has them all. They're not like Pokemon.

Eh, not mutually exclusive though, either. so.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on April 19, 2013, 01:36:36 pm
Not sure I feel the same. Davidson is a fucking racist, sure. But one character flaw does not necessarily mean he has them all. They're not like Pokemon.

Jim Davidson uses "Old Dirty Man" routine.

It's super effective!
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on April 19, 2013, 01:54:43 pm
Not sure I feel the same. Davidson is a fucking racist, sure. But one character flaw does not necessarily mean he has them all. They're not like Pokemon.

Jim Davidson uses "Old Dirty Man" routine.

It's super effective!
:pika::vom:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on April 19, 2013, 02:13:46 pm
Yeah, I gotta confess to not remembering much about him, other than that "Chalky" shit
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on April 19, 2013, 02:40:23 pm
Yeah, I gotta confess to not remembering much about him, other than that "Chalky" shit

yea, I kind of remember him as equally offensive to women and minorities.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on April 19, 2013, 02:49:50 pm
I remember the shitstain all too well.

He had(has) a similar level of wit and comedy to Bernard manning. His "act" was essentially watered down Roy "Chubby" Brown.

Not to my tastes.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on April 19, 2013, 05:15:50 pm
Rolf Harris?? FUCKING HELL.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on April 25, 2013, 10:02:24 pm
Freddie Starr arrested again, seperate similar allegations.

Not the most fortuitous turn of events. I suspect Max Clifford is pulling in every favour he's owed right now. Been quite quiet on him.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on April 26, 2013, 11:03:13 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22313286

AND FUCK YOU TOO CLIFFORD.

This man is an exemplary example of so many things that are fucking wrong and evil about UK media.

Quote
PR guru Max Clifford has been charged with 11 indecent assaults allegedly committed between 1966 and 1985.

The alleged offences relate to seven different women and girls ranging in age from 14 to 19 years old.

Mr Clifford, 70, from Surrey, who says the allegations are "completely false", will appear in court next month.

He was arrested in Operation Yewtree - set up after claims were made against Jimmy Savile - although his arrest was unrelated to the former BBC DJ.

Operation Yewtree has three strands. One concerns Savile's crimes exclusively, while another relates to allegations against Savile and others.

The third strand, under which Mr Clifford was arrested, concentrates on accusations unconnected to the Savile investigations but which emerged as a result of the publicity surrounding Savile.

Mr Clifford was not charged over three further allegations as there was "insufficient evidence to authorise charges", the Crown Prosecution Service said.

Mr Clifford denied the allegations against him.

He said: "The allegations in respect of which I have been charged are completely false and I have made this clear to the police during many, many hours of interviews.

"Nevertheless a decision has been taken to charge me with 11 offences involving seven women, the most recent of which is 28 years ago and the oldest 47 years ago.

"I have never indecently assaulted anyone in my life and this will become clear during the course of the proceedings."

How many favours with the police do you have left Max? Not enough I hope.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on April 26, 2013, 11:36:02 pm
Context goodness regarding Starr and Clifford, this one just a mild example of how he operates. Favour and story trading is his actual profession. Don't publish A about B, have this much more compelling (will sell more) story about Y doing Z.

Quote
On 13 March 1986, The Sun carried as its main headline: "Freddie Starr Ate My Hamster" - one of the best known of all British tabloid newspaper headlines. According to the story invented by Clifford, Starr had been staying at the home of Vince McCaffrey (who was co-writing Starr's biography at the time), and his 23-year-old girlfriend Lea La Salle in Birchwood, Warrington, Cheshire when the incident took place. Starr was alleged to have returned home from a performance at a Manchester nightclub in the small hours of the morning and demanded that La Salle make him a sandwich. When she refused, he went into the kitchen and put her pet hamster, 'Supersonic', between two slices of bread and proceeded to eat it.[1]
Clifford counter spun the story the next day, when he flew with a journalist from The Sun to Starr's home in Waltham St Lawrence, Berkshire with another hamster the newspaper had called Sandwich, which was photographed with claimed vegetarian Starr. Starr now admits in interviews that this story was untrue, but brought him much-needed publicity for his forthcoming tour.[1]
The story was one of the first examples where, rather than PR agents managing what went into the media or confirming a journalist's storyline, Clifford created a fast-selling story which he sold to the media, and its counter line follow-up. As a result, it brought Clifford to the British public's attention.[1] Clifford and Starr ended their connection shortly afterwards, and Clifford later used background material to fuel the media story lines around Starr's later revelations during his divorce of wife battering, alcoholism, and drug taking.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Clifford

I have no idea why, but his wikipedia page seems a little..... biased? Must just be because he's such a good guy.

Quote
Clifford has since represented various clients, including former Liverpool left-wing politician Derek Hatton, for whom Clifford created an affair in order to change his image;[1] Rebecca Loos, when she negotiated with the press about her alleged affair with England football captain David Beckham;[1] and Jade Goody, in the period of the reality star's cervical cancer and death. The media publicising the dangers of cervical cancer after Goody's diagnosis with the disease is credited with improving the uptake of cervical smears in the UK.[13]
Clifford represents Gillian McKeith, saying of her doctorate in nutrition potentially being misconstrued as a medical degree by viewers of her advertisements: "personally, I wish it had never been mentioned. She never needed it, and it's done nothing but cause her embarrassment."[14]
Journalist Louis Theroux followed Clifford in the BBC Two 2002 programme When Louis Met... Max Clifford During filming, it appeared that Clifford was trying to set up Theroux during a PR stunt in Sainsbury's. It backfired after Clifford was heard on his microphone lying, unaware it was still on

Google any of the above for typically british media shitstorm, mundane, banal pathetic cash grabs at the expense of dignity. No prizes for guessing who suggested making said facts known in the first place as loudly as possible. Enjoy the forthcoming shitty ghost written  "book from jail". You'll see that within a year of conviction. The "My side" a couple of years later.

Or we may be lucky and a shanking will occur. Pray for stabby inmates.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on April 26, 2013, 11:44:10 pm
I also wonder if Clifford is being targeted because, well, if you want someone who may know the dirty secrets of Britain's celebrities, he is a pretty good candidate.*

He's probably a shitneck too, but just saying, there may be more to this than simple policing.

*Among other people, which I'm sure the Met will not enquire about at all because they are outside the scope of the investigation and the Met have no interest in wielding political power.  Har har har.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on April 26, 2013, 11:52:57 pm
There's no doubts whatsoever that the shitbag knows where a lot of bodies are buried. And where things are stashed. He's pretty much one of the big keepers of secrets for a small number of very high profile celebs and many F-Z list celebs. I'd credit him with creating categories J-R personally, but that would imply some kind of achievement. This level of "fame" is typically established on a minor event and the "personality" of the random person it occurred to becomes key. If they're saleable in some way, great. Got a talent? Better. Dark past? Fucking wonderful, come here and lets get you coked up for a night on the town.

There's a decent documentary on this which details some of the more blatant fleet street links and story trading.

The potential implications about child abuse are nothing compared to the drug knowledge he'll have, I'd guarantee that.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on April 27, 2013, 12:07:36 am
For fun, you may want to try this some time:

Quote
When will I get paid?
You will get your money by cheque or paid direct to your bank within a few weeks of your story appearing in the paper.
In very exceptional circumstances we may be able to make a payment to charity or pay you in cash.

Can I sell videos?

Yes, we pay for exclusive videos too.

Call 0207 782 4645 or e-mail sunvideo@newsint.co.uk to sell your video clips.

What kind of stories is The Sun looking for?

Anything you can see being published in the paper. From celebrity exclusives to medical miracles to cheating politicians, we want your stories on all of them.

We also love heart-warming real stories about our amazing readers, so if you've triumphed over tragedy, give us a call.


"3AM" or whatever the celeb gossip column of a typical rag is called make these "Cash exceptions" all the time as the jurno's and paps need to get to where some nobody is having a drink. The clients they are used to dealing with tend to demand around £50-70 per encounter to reveal the location of the "celeb". More if more famous, more if more intoxicated.

But why typically £50-70? Well I'm told this will reliably purchase a certain amount of a certain substance that would probably make you very awake at 3AM......

As to the quoted, get any old shitty tabloid. Leave it alone for a week. Think of a good halloween costume you've seen. Pick a random nobody out of the paper around 10-11 at night, call that number. You think they're on a stag do at X. Wait near X. Watch journalist arrive.

You have options at that point. Get creative.

I do this every time I'm in London. Let me know your results.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on May 02, 2013, 11:23:05 am
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-22379286

Quote
Broadcaster Stuart Hall has admitted 14 charges of indecently assaulting girls including one as young as nine.

The 83-year-old from Wilmslow, Cheshire pleaded guilty at Preston Crown Court to the offences, involving 13 victims, which occurred between 1967 and 1985.

A further three charges of indecent assault and one of rape have been left to lie on the court file.

His lawyer said Hall apologised to his victims and added: "He is all too aware that his disgrace is complete."

He has been bailed until sentencing on 17 June.

'Opportunistic predator'
Hall admitted the offences last month but they could not be revealed due to reporting restrictions.

Chief Crown Prosecutor for the North West, Nazir Afzal, described Hall as an "opportunistic predator".

He added: "We prosecuted Stuart Hall because the evidence of the victims clearly established a pattern of behaviour that was unlawful and for which no innocent explanation could be offered.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on May 02, 2013, 12:23:26 pm
I hate this whole story because it strongly suggests that fucking 9 year olds is a lot more popular than I'd given credit for. I'm not sure if this is just within a specific celebrity subset or the population as a whole. If it's the latter then I'd thank you for leaving me blissfully ignorant of this fact  :argh!:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on May 02, 2013, 01:08:02 pm
I hate this whole story because it strongly suggests that fucking 9 year olds is a lot more popular than I'd given credit for. I'm not sure if this is just within a specific celebrity subset or the population as a whole. If it's the latter then I'd thank you for leaving me blissfully ignorant of this fact  :argh!:

I'd say the latter, mate.

and of course a lot of sex offenders like to use status and seeming respectability  as a cover for their crimes. 9 out of 10 rapists are someone known to the victim.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on May 02, 2013, 02:15:22 pm
I hate this whole story because it strongly suggests that fucking 9 year olds is a lot more popular than I'd given credit for. I'm not sure if this is just within a specific celebrity subset or the population as a whole. If it's the latter then I'd thank you for leaving me blissfully ignorant of this fact  :argh!:

I'd say the latter, mate.


Well thanks for giving my, already bordering on sociopathic, mysanthropy the shot in the arm it so desperately needed  :evilmad:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on May 10, 2013, 06:04:57 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-22476937

UK police investigate themselves, verdict: Innocent.

Quote
A West Yorkshire Police report has found "no evidence" Jimmy Savile was protected from arrest or prosecution by his relationship with the force.

But it highlighted an "over-reliance on personal friendships" between Savile and some officers, and said "mistakes were made" in handling intelligence.

The force's assistant chief constable admitted "we did fail victims".

Hundreds of allegations of abuse by the former BBC entertainer emerged after his death in October 2011.

Speaking after publication of the report, Assistant Chief Constable Ingrid Lee said: "They didn't know, the people engaged with Jimmy Savile, that actually there were these allegations against him. That's what our investigations found out.

"There clearly was information available that we should have tied together and we did fail victims in relation to tying that evidence together and we should have done.

"If he were alive today, there's absolutely no doubt that he would have had a number of questions to answer."

These people say this shit with a straight face and everything. Tom Cruise would sacrifice Hubbard himself for that kind of acting talent.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on May 10, 2013, 06:08:15 pm
Also, Stuart Hall now in jail after admitting multiple offences.

Prisoners rumoured to hum this upon his arrival:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5hExLsJlaI

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22429904

Jimmy Tarbuck also arrested. I've got a bad feeling now about Roy Castle.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on May 10, 2013, 06:46:55 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-22486758

And now Eddy Shah too.

Quote
The jury in the Eddy Shah rape trial at the Old Bailey has been discharged.

The case, in which Mr Shah, 69, of Chippenham, Wiltshire, denies six counts of raping a girl under 16, opened at the court on Tuesday.

But on Friday Recorder of London Judge Brian Barker told jurors they could not carry on. "We have had problems which we simply cannot overcome," he said.

The case will be relisted on Monday when a new panel of jurors should be selected to retry the case.

Mr Shah, who founded the now-defunct Today newspaper in 1986 and is now an author, and two others are accused of sexually abusing an under-age girl in the early 1990s.

Susan Davies, 53, of Swanley, Kent, denies 14 counts of aiding and abetting rape, indecent assault and child cruelty.

Her former lover Anthony Pallant, 53, of West Malling, Kent, denies six counts of rape and indecent assault.

I met this guy a couple of times and actually worked at one of his later ventures after he abandoned being a press baron.

Didn't particularly like him then, fucker never paid on time or in full. This does not surprise me in the slightest for various reasons. I'd be be amazed if he's not guilty. 
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on May 12, 2013, 05:42:39 pm
I think it'll be easier if we just compile a shortlist entitled: "British Celebrities of the 70s & 80s that are NOT sex offenders".

Looks like it might be a very short, shortlist.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on May 12, 2013, 05:44:28 pm
Bruce Forsyth and, uh, yeah.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on June 23, 2013, 06:45:17 pm
If you're interested in keeping up with the various child abuse investigations in the UK, you may want to start reading David Hencke and Exaro News (http://davidhencke.wordpress.com/):

Quote
Over the last two weeks the Met Police Child Abuse Investigation Command  has been  secretly running a new investigation into alleged child abuse involving former schoolboys who went to primary and secondary  schools run by the Roman Catholic Salesian Order in England and Scotland.

Quote
A virtually  unreported hearing of the Commons defence committee has revealed an extraordinary complacent state of affairs of the Ministry of Defence towards complaints from forces parents of sexual abuse and bullying at private schools.

Quote
A report by my colleague Nick Fielding for Exaro News ( see http://www.exaronews.com/articles/4961/police-abandon-probe-into-cyril-smith-s-sexual-abuse-of-boys ) reveals the former MP linked to child sex abuse cases at the Elm Guest House in Richmond,London to Rochdale where he was an MP is now off the hook.

Quote
The latest damning disclosure about both the police and Richmond Council’s handling of the  child abuse scandal  at Elm Guest House and Grafton Close children’s home adds to growing disquiet that both the council and the police were not up to the job.

Quote
Operation Fernbridge – the criminal investigation into a paedophile ring centred round the London borough of Richmond and the shady Elm Guest House – is now turning to the role of Independent Police Complaints Commission over the whole affair.

Quote
The Met Police  has launched a further investigation into historic child sex abuse – this time focusing on the Roman Catholic Church in England.

I understand from good sources that the Met Police are investigating the role of a Roman Catholic bishop – both involving allegations involving paedophilia and whether he protected Roman Catholic priests who were alleged paedophiles.

Those are just from the front three pages.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on June 25, 2013, 10:05:59 pm
Good issue of Private Eye this week:
http://www.private-eye.co.uk/sections.php?section_link=in_the_back&
Quote
INSIGHT into how prosecutors in the 1970s handled allegations against high-profile individuals of what today would be seen as sexual abuse or paedophile behaviour is revealed in newly released documents relating to a police investigation into the Bishop of Stepney, the internationally renowned anti-apartheid campaigner Trevor Huddleston, in 1974.
A redacted version of the Scotland Yard file was released by the National Archives last month after a freedom of information request by Private Eye last November following the Jimmy Savile scandal and the failure to prosecute former Liberal MP Sir Cyril Smith. The Huddleston file was previously ordered to remain closed until 2069.

Quote
On Huddleston, Skelhorn decided that “the evidence is not sufficient to warrant proceedings”. It later emerged that Skelhorn had consulted not just “leading Treasury counsel” but also Labour attorney-general Sam Silkin, who knew Huddleston, a Labour party hero. In a 1979 BBC radio interview, referring to a case involving a “very well known” man” and “small boys”, Silkin stated: “If he had been prosecuted at all it would have ruined his career and influence. Within the DPP’s department everyone thought the man would be acquitted – though there was clearly evidence.” The Huddleston file does not mention Silkin’s involvement.

Silkin told the Daily Mirror, again without naming Huddleston: “If he had been prosecuted – and acquitted – it would still have been disastrous for him. A great deal of mud would have stuck. The decision was made for the public good. We were almost certain that this man would be acquitted.”

Semi-Saville and co related, helps to highlight the procedural difficulties in actually prosecuting influential figures. I suspect recent decisions on cases like this in the various prosecutors offices are under close review. Or shredding. Possibly both.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on August 29, 2013, 01:11:12 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23880768

Quote
TV presenter Rolf Harris has been charged with nine counts of indecent assault and four of making indecent images of children, police have said.

Mr Harris was first arrested in March by officers investigating historical allegations of child sexual abuse.

Six offences relate to the indecent assault of a girl aged 15-16 between 1980 and 1981 and three relate to a girl aged 14 in 1986.

The indecent images of children were alleged to have been made last year.

So, that's some jail then.

Title: Well, this just moved into David Icke territory...
Post by: Cain on January 12, 2014, 05:50:14 pm
From Exaro News (http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5174/met-s-vip-paedophiles-probe-turns-into-murder-investigation):

Quote
Detectives are investigating the sadistic killing of a young boy as they examine allegations of a paedophile ring linked to politicians and other VIPs.

Exaro can reveal how police operations that are looking at historical claims of child sex abuse by political figures has turned into a murder investigation.

One of those linked to the investigations is Sidney Cooke, a "procurer" of children for sex abuse parties with a history of murder, and who has also spent enough time in Amsterdam that the Dutch police would like to speak with him.

Not clear if he spent any time in Belgium, but I'd really like to know one way or another.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on January 14, 2014, 04:05:17 pm
A belgium connection from any quarter would be very interesting indeed.

Dave Lee Travis in the dock:
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/jan/14/dave-lee-travis-trial-fame-target-vulnerable-young-women


Quote
Another incident took place in Travis's dressing room as he appeared in a pantomime in Crawley in 1991, the court heard, when the DJ pinned a women up against the door before shoving his hand down her jogging bottoms.

The assault lasted a matter of seconds, the jury was told, before Travis was interrupted by one of the Chuckle Brothers walking past his dressing room.

Who would ever have thought about the Chuckle Brothers as saviours?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on January 16, 2014, 09:10:40 am
As weird as those two actually are, I'm surprised to find that I am struggling to see them as sex offenders.  Given their whole act, I'd normally put them near the top of the list for futher aiding police enquiries, but I'm having trouble seeing it.

The Express has an article (http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/453381/Female-MP-abused-boy-in-care) up today.  Sorting the verifiable facts from the unverifiable facts from the wild, rampaging tabloid gossip mixed with unadulterated bullshit is a fun exercise:

Quote
A FORMER female MP was involved in a paedophile network at the heart of government, police have been told.

She is alleged to have forced a boy in care to perform a “vile” sex act at one of a series of drug-fuelled parties in Westminster in the Eighties where boys and girls as young as 13 were allegedly abused.

Last night her alleged victim told the Sunday Express: “I want justice.”

Andrew Ash, now 45, said he has given Scotland Yard the name of the former MP. We cannot name her for legal reasons.

Mr Ash claims he was frequently ferried down to London from the North of England, where he was in care, to take part in sex parties.

He says they were organised by a paedophile ring involving David Smith, Jimmy Savile’s former chauffeur who killed himself last year before he was due to stand trial for sex offences.

He said: “It wasn’t just politicians, there were also a number of celebrities, including Jimmy Savile, who seemed to have a lot of good links to MPs and powerful businessmen.



Mr Ash claims officers have footage which shows a senior male MP in the same frame as him, although no abuse takes place on camera. He said he is speaking out now because he is frustrated by the lack of action after being interviewed for 70 hours by the Met Police’s Paedophile Unit.

He says he was abused by the male MP on another occasion too. He said: “I remember being filmed with this MP, who was abusing me in a garage of a very prominent building behind a Rolls-Royce.

“Another politician turned up with a video camera but the man abusing me just smirked and joked, ‘OK, OK, I’ll vote any way you want’ as if he was being blackmailed. What I want to know is why they haven’t arrested him yet if they have this evidence.

Elements of this align with what is being reported in more respectable publications, like the Times and Exaro...but of course, that's the thing.  If some of the information is already in the public domain, anyone could just make up some extra bits and tack them on.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on January 16, 2014, 09:38:14 am
Quote
“Another politician turned up with a video camera but the man abusing me just smirked and joked, ‘OK, OK, I’ll vote any way you want’ as if he was being blackmailed. What I want to know is why they haven’t arrested him yet if they have this evidence.

"Evidence" in this case to mean his testimony, not actual physical evidence of guilt.

Quote
nterviews were conducted mainly at a safe house in Bridlington, East Yorkshire, but also in London. “The interviews were usually carried out in blocks of three, normally every Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday.

“On at least two occasions there were two other officers present that I didn’t recognise. They didn’t ask me a thing, they just scribbled notes.

“I asked who they were but all I was told was that they were from ‘upstairs’. It was clear from the tone that they were intelligence officers.

“They had obviously been made aware of the high-profile names and the sensitive information I had given police.”

Dutch intelligence officers attended at least one interview because Andrew told of being trafficked to Amsterdam on a number of occasions to be abused by a group of paedophiles including convicted child killer Sidney Cooke.

Plausible? Certainly. I'm a little surprised about how restrained the piece is. I can only infer from that the the Ex-MP's are probably right-leaning. I'm reasonably confident that if it'd had been an ex-labour MP there would have been additional details to make it easier to figure out who we're talking about.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on February 06, 2014, 04:37:17 pm
Bill Roach and Michael Le Vell acquitted.

However:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-26073155

Quote
he former headmaster of a school attended by Deputy Prime Minister Nick Clegg has been jailed for eight years for sexually abusing five pupils.

Roland Peter Wright, 83, of Farnham Royal, Buckinghamshire, abused boys aged between eight and 13 at Caldicott Preparatory School from 1959 to 1970.

His sentencing went ahead despite the death of another former teacher who had been due to appear with him.

Hugh Henry, 82, apparently threw himself under a train on Tuesday.

The end is still far from visible.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 05, 2014, 11:20:31 am
Bump

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/10674757/Cameron-aide-Patrick-Rock-arrested-over-allegations-relating-to-child-porn.html

Quote
One of David Cameron's closest aides has been arrested on suspicion of offences relating to child pornography.

Patrick Rock, who was one of the government's advisors on policy for online pornography filters, was arrested last month after police examined computers in No 10 Downing Street.

Mr Rock resigned as a policy advisor to the Prime Minister soon afterwards.

No 10 said he was arrested last month "a few hours" after Downing Street contacted police.

The former deputy head of the No 10 Policy Unit has been close to Mr Cameron for two decades. The two men worked for Michael Howard when he was Home Secretary in the 1990s.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on March 05, 2014, 12:46:57 pm
Oh wow. Adds another uncomfortable level of accuracy to David Icke. He must be going absolutely berserk about now.

Pretty much killed a future political career of Cameron too. Shame.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 30, 2014, 04:02:34 pm
http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5225/customs-seized-video-of-child-sex-abuse-and-ex-cabinet-minister
http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5226/man-who-tried-to-import-video-i-did-not-know-what-was-inside

Quote
Customs officials are trying to silence an ex-colleague who seized video that allegedly shows child sex abuse in the presence of a former cabinet minister.

Exaro can reveal that the politically explosive video was seized by a Customs officer, Magianal Solanki, at Dover's Eastern Car Terminal in 1982.

The video was coming into the UK from - where else - Amsterdam.  The video tape itself was passed by Customs onto MI5, and shows a former Conservative Cabinet minister.  However, Solanki, who has seen the video, has refused to go on the record about the exact nature of what the minister was doing in the video, due to the sensitive nature of the tape, and is furthermore legally gagged by the Official Secrets Act.

Exaro has confirmed this Minister is the same one which the Met are currently investigating under the auspices of Operation Fernbridge.  They refuse to name the Minister in order to not jepordize ongoing police investigations (though one wonders why the calls for the Met to be disbanded, once a fringe suggestion, have suddenly gained currency in the national press).

A Mr Russell Tricker was responsible for bringing the video into the UK.  He claims he had no knowledge of what was on it, and was released by Customs without charge.  Mr Tricker ran a travel service and apartments which featured in holiday and gay guides for Holland. Tricker claims he was asked to bring the videos into the UK by a "business colleague". 

Tricker himself was for child sex offences, but his lawyers were able to show the boy in question had ID which showed him to be of legal age, and that he pretended to be of this age.  The boy in question was later killed in a shooting.  In addition to this, Tricker was a person friend of Peter Glencross, the founder of Spartacus International, an underground pedophile network, and of the notorious Warwick Spinks - a child abuser, killer and procurer of children for others.

One video was titled "GB10", and apparently showed videos of boys from Britain, for sale to pedophile clients.  Another video showed children from other parts of Europe.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on April 07, 2014, 01:52:36 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-26922887

Celebrities kept out of tabloids by Max Clifford come to his defence.

Quote
Birds Of A Feather star Pauline Quirke, who is also a witness for the defence, said she had known Mr Clifford for 20 years and that they were vice-patrons of the same charity, the Rhys Daniels Trust.

She said they were friends and described him as a "good, decent man... down to earth, very normal".

"The word I've always associated with Max, since I've known him, is the word 'integrity'," she told jurors.

Really? Max Clifford? Integrity? Well if your definition of the word involves trading in sleazy non-stories regarding C-Z list celebrities, then the man has integrity in spades.

Out of the whole Savile affair, I'll consider the world a better place with Clifford in a  prison cell. If nothing else it'll raise the overall standard of journalism in the UK considerably.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on April 28, 2014, 09:12:38 am
This keeps coming up:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27183369

Quote
Police are examining whether there is evidence of a criminal cover-up over claims of sexual abuse at a school linked to the late MP Sir Cyril Smith.

The leader of Rochdale Council and Greater Manchester's chief constable are due to give an update on the claims over Knowl View school in Rochdale.

Officers are already investigating the abuse allegations and the council is set to widen its own inquiry.

Sir Cyril's family has said he always denied such accusations.

The development comes after police launched an investigation into allegations that former Liberal MP Sir Cyril, who died in 2010 aged 82, sexually abused boys at Knowl View residential school. The school closed in 1992.

Officers are also looking into claims he abused boys at the privately run Cambridge House children's care home, which closed in 1965.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27170909

Quote
But Simon Danczuk, Rochdale's current Labour MP, claims Sir Cyril used his powerful position to evade prosecution for sexually abusing boys.

The allegations first surfaced in 1979 when Private Eye magazine carried reports that he abused teenagers at Cambridge House, a privately run "hostel for working boys" in Rochdale, which closed in 1965.

As a rule of thumb, Private Eye tend not to print anything they're not totally sure that they can win in court with. If they were pushing that idea in '79, I'd bet they had pretty solid reasons for doing so. Nothing else particularly astonishing but it's yet another unfortunate link between relatively powerful UK citizens and paedophilia.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on April 28, 2014, 04:02:25 pm
Craig Murray (http://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2014/04/corruption-and-fear-in-the-uk/#rssowlmlink) also mentioned this, in relation to his campaign against Jack Straw in 2005:

Quote
The point of which is – I know how Cyril Smith did it.  It was a different category of crime he was committing, but I have seen how in these Lancashire towns like Blackburn and Rochdale the authorities collude together so comfortably to cover up the crimes of the local big man, be it Cyril Smith or Jack Straw.  It may seem quite incredible that everybody knew in Rochdale and nothing was done, but having tried to challenge Straw in Blackburn, I know precisely how it worked.  The entire political culture of industrial Lancashire is deeply rotten, and ought to be a source of deep shame.

In other news (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27192600):

Quote
Publicist Max Clifford has been found guilty of eight indecent assaults on women and girls as young as 15.

The 71-year-old, from Surrey, was convicted of a string of assaults which happened over nearly 20 years.

He was cleared of two charges of indecent assault, while the jury at Southwark Crown Court failed to reach a verdict on another charge.

Clifford, who is the first person to be convicted under Operation Yewtree, was bailed and will be sentenced on Friday.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on April 28, 2014, 04:56:45 pm
Excellent news regarding Clifford. Couldn't happen to a more deserving individual. Here's hoping he starts letting loose with names too cut some of his own time down.

Fucker dying in jail is pretty close to justice for his various crimes against journalism, with any luck exactly that will happen.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on April 29, 2014, 08:43:00 am
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27192600

Quote
Afterwards, Clifford posed outside court for photographers with his daughter Louise but ignored questions from reporters, saying: "I have been told by my lawyers to say nothing at all."

That faint echo you hear is me laughing.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on May 06, 2014, 11:07:16 am
HA HA

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27294888

Quote
Entertainer Freddie Starr will not be prosecuted following allegations of sex offences, the Crown Prosecution Service has said.

There was "insufficient evidence" to prosecute, the CPS said.

Mr Starr has been on bail after being arrested by detectives investigating allegations of sexual abuse as part of Operation Yewtree.

He was first questioned in November 2012, and has always denied any wrongdoing.

Quote
"In relation to one further complainant, we have decided that although there is sufficient evidence for a realistic prospect of conviction, according to the Code for Crown Prosecutors, a prosecution would not be in the public interest.

ONLY SERIOUS.

Best go and have a chat with Max, eh? Bet he'll be quite willing to tell you ALL SORTS OF THINGS.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on May 06, 2014, 11:12:19 am
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-27291032

Quote
Ex-BBC presenter Stuart Hall has pleaded guilty to indecently assaulting a girl under 16 but denies a further 19 charges.

Mr Hall is accused of a series of rape and indecent assault offences, which are alleged to have happened between 1976 and 1981 in Greater Manchester and Cheshire.

He has admitted one count of indecent assault against a girl in 1978.


Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on May 27, 2014, 02:46:07 pm
And the hits just keep on coming (http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/elm-guest-house-undercover-cop-3434195):

Quote
An undercover cop probing VIP child abuse allegations at a gay sex parlour ended up raping a teenage boy, according to ­sensational new claims.

The victim, who was 16 at the time, has told how he was forced into sex work as a masseur at the Elm Guest House near Barnes in South West London in 1982.

Among the rich and powerful who he says abused him was disgraced former Liberal MP Cyril Smith.

Others said to frequent the guest house included a government ­minister, a high-ranking policeman, a member of the royal household, an MI5 ­officer and traitor spy Anthony Blunt.

It is the Mirror, so treat with due caution.

More credibly, Exaro has been following the story of the rape of a 19 year old student by an ex-Cabinet minister in 1967 - a woman the Met have been trying to smear in recent days.

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5262/rapist-ex-cabinet-minister-named-in-tom-watson-s-dpp-letter
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: MMIX on May 27, 2014, 03:22:54 pm
Politicians, eh? You've got to love them. No really, you've got to or they'll use force . . .
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on June 05, 2014, 05:16:54 pm
This just in from our 'completely unsurprising' dept:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-27720875
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on June 05, 2014, 05:23:03 pm
What a shock. I wonder if he's still going for the "crap satan" look. The last load of mugshots with that shitty goatee made him look hilarious.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on June 05, 2014, 05:29:22 pm
What a shock. I wonder if he's still going for the "crap satan" look. The last load of mugshots with that shitty goatee made him look hilarious.

What is shocking is this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Glitter

In particular, the number of times the phrase 'reduced sentence' appears.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: BadBeast on June 06, 2014, 08:14:05 pm
I think the main reason Savile got away with it for so long was that he had the dirt on everyone, from the Palace down. The man moved in some surprisingly powerful circles, regularly spent Christmas with The Queen at Balmoral, or with his very good friends, the Thatchers. There are even rumours that Carol Thatcher is actually his daughter, and to look at, they are like, really alike. He was a procurer of children to all the most elite paedophiles, from the Palace, to the Vatican, and had some really powerful mojo going on. He was known as "Mr Fix-it" by some real heavy underworld figures (Including the Krays) a long time before the TV show came along, and used his influence to blackmail, bully, and intimidate the establishment into doing just what he wanted. Also interesting that the only two people I ever heard of who openly denounced Savile as a paedophile were themselves, subjected to total ridicule (David Icke) or had brilliant careers sidelined, and kept out of the public eye. (Jerry Sadowicz)

I'm not prone to believing any old lot of hocus pocus magicky bullshit as a rule, but this documentary makes some very interesting points about Savile, and while I don't subscribe to "supernatural" powers, the similarities between Savile's MO, and some of the more sinister MKUltra techniques used by the CIA (Among others) to produce throwaway sex slaves / alters bears scrutiny.
http://youtu.be/-QUuCWNyvv8
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: LuciferX on June 06, 2014, 09:45:14 pm
Great production value - having trouble loading after intro - good use of "Lost Boys" title song.  I hope the video is not too disturbing?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: BadBeast on June 06, 2014, 11:49:43 pm
Great production value - having trouble loading after intro - good use of "Lost Boys" title song.  I hope the video is not too disturbing?
It's not lurid or gratuitous, and yeah, the production values are almost TV Standard. "Jingle jangle" *shudders
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: LuciferX on June 07, 2014, 02:09:35 am
Great production value - having trouble loading after intro - good use of "Lost Boys" title song.  I hope the video is not too disturbing?
It's not lurid or gratuitous, and yeah, the production values are almost TV Standard. "Jingle jangle" *shudders

Yea, that crept up quick.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on June 27, 2014, 01:29:37 am
Well, at least one suspicion about Saville has been given a significant boost in credence (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/jimmy-savile-abuse-report-set-to-reveal-accounts-of-sex-offences-in-dozens-of-nhs-hospitals-9563974.html):

Quote
One witness was cited in the report as saying he “wore huge rings that he said were made from the glass eyes of dead bodies” held in the mortuary there.

The investigation heard the entertainer claimed to have "interfered with the bodies of deceased patients".

Dr Sue Proctor, who led the investigation into his abuse at LGI, said a student nurse recalled a conversation with Savile in which he claimed he performed sex acts on the dead.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: LuciferX on June 27, 2014, 06:12:16 am
Well, at least one suspicion about Saville has been given a significant boost in credence (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/jimmy-savile-abuse-report-set-to-reveal-accounts-of-sex-offences-in-dozens-of-nhs-hospitals-9563974.html):

Quote
One witness was cited in the report as saying he “wore huge rings that he said were made from the glass eyes of dead bodies” held in the mortuary there.

The investigation heard the entertainer claimed to have "interfered with the bodies of deceased patients".

Dr Sue Proctor, who led the investigation into his abuse at LGI, said a student nurse recalled a conversation with Savile in which he claimed he performed sex acts on the dead.
Admittedly, I did not click the link, do my diligence, or overcome my naiveté; however, that just sounds like the kind of thing I would tell those inclined believe such lyrical nonsense.  Say, if I had done it, I would not tell it like that.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on June 27, 2014, 06:19:06 pm
Well, at least one suspicion about Saville has been given a significant boost in credence (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/jimmy-savile-abuse-report-set-to-reveal-accounts-of-sex-offences-in-dozens-of-nhs-hospitals-9563974.html):

Quote
One witness was cited in the report as saying he “wore huge rings that he said were made from the glass eyes of dead bodies” held in the mortuary there.

The investigation heard the entertainer claimed to have "interfered with the bodies of deceased patients".

Dr Sue Proctor, who led the investigation into his abuse at LGI, said a student nurse recalled a conversation with Savile in which he claimed he performed sex acts on the dead.

Certainly plausible, probably more likely than not, but I can't help but remain a touch skeptical. With the UK press being what it is, he'll have taken ambulances full of corpses for joyrides playing Iron Maiden to battersea dogs home, while beating a pensioner with a rake and singing Cliff Richard's greatest hits by next week. I can't help but think that anyone not caught by now has a serious interest in throwing as much bad signal around about Savile as possible. Discredit one sensational claim and you put a shadow of doubt over future, as well as historical allegations/crimes.

I suppose I may just have a distaste for agreeing at any point with Icke.

Edit to better reflect what the UK press would/will actually do.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: LuciferX on June 27, 2014, 07:30:09 pm
Well, at least one suspicion about Saville has been given a significant boost in credence (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/jimmy-savile-abuse-report-set-to-reveal-accounts-of-sex-offences-in-dozens-of-nhs-hospitals-9563974.html):

Quote
One witness was cited in the report as saying he “wore huge rings that he said were made from the glass eyes of dead bodies” held in the mortuary there.

The investigation heard the entertainer claimed to have "interfered with the bodies of deceased patients".

Dr Sue Proctor, who led the investigation into his abuse at LGI, said a student nurse recalled a conversation with Savile in which he claimed he performed sex acts on the dead.

Certainly plausible, probably more likely than not, but I can't help but remain a touch skeptical. With the UK press being what it is, he'll have taken ambulances full of corpses for joyrides playing Iron Maiden to battersea dogs home, while beating a pensioner with a rake and singing Cliff Richard's greatest hits by next week. I can't help but think that anyone not caught by now has a serious interest in throwing as much bad signal around about Savile as possible. Discredit one sensational claim and you put a shadow of doubt over future, as well as historical allegations/crimes.

I suppose I may just have a distaste for agreeing at any point with Icke.

Edit to better reflect what the UK press would/will actually do.

Okay, full disclosure.  It's not that I want to take any allegations against him lightly, I don't know, either way.  As a trope, wearing the glass eyes of deceased as rings, well, that caught my attention.  I am a bad person :lulz:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on June 30, 2014, 01:53:40 pm
Rolf Harris has been found guilty of all 12 charges of indecent assault.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 03, 2014, 01:42:51 pm
Running short on suspects?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-28141531

Quote
Nick Clegg has rejected growing calls for a full public inquiry into allegations about a paedophile ring at Westminster in the 1970s and 1980s.

Quote
Former Home Secretary Lord Brittan has been under fire over his handling of two dossiers of evidence handed to him.

The peer initially said he had asked officials to look into allegations contained in a bundle of documents given to him by Tory MP Geoffrey Dickens in the mid-1980s, but could not recall any further action being taken.

Quote
The Home Office later revealed that it carried out an independent review into the case last year, which found Lord Brittan had passed some of the concerns to the public prosecutor and that he had dealt with the allegations appropriately.

But the review also found that the dossiers of evidence appear to have been destroyed by officials, prompting allegations of a cover-up.

Quote
Former director of public prosecutions Lord Macdonald told BBC Radio 4's PM programme: "It sounds to me as though there needs to be further investigation into this. Some of the detail is more than troubling. It's always alarming when material goes missing.

"This may just be the passage of time, it may not be anything sinister, but I don't think people are going to be satisfied for this to be left as it is."

Those various allegations about the involvement/complicity of the UK government just took a decent step towards "Plausible". Having scapegoat Clegg lead the charge for the ignoring of historical accusations is quite classy. He's politically dead anyway so he can be safely used as a mouthpiece for whatever the latest idiotic issue of the day is.



Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on July 04, 2014, 06:21:18 pm
Rolf Harris has been found guilty of all 12 charges of indecent assault.

Good.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: BadBeast on July 06, 2014, 04:00:49 pm
Rolf Harris has been found guilty of all 12 charges of indecent assault.
Just in time for "Ooh, we did have a fucking great dossier on all the wrongcocks in the House of Commons in the 1980s, but we appear to have  . . . . erm, lost it"
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on July 07, 2014, 09:29:35 am
Rolf Harris has been found guilty of all 12 charges of indecent assault.
Just in time for "Ooh, we did have a fucking great dossier on all the wrongcocks in the House of Commons in the 1980s, but we appear to have  . . . . erm, lost it"

Well, maybe (http://barthsnotes.com/2014/07/02/geoffrey-dickens-child-abuse-claims-and-satanic-panic/#rssowlmlink).

Quote
Elements of the dossier may indeed have been “credible”, but it’s likely that anything valuable was hidden among dross: most of the news reports on the subject out today appear to have overlooked the important detail that Dickens was an extravagant conspiracy theorist who helped to contribute to the “Satanic panics” that emerged in the UK just a few years later.

Here’s one report, from 1988:

Quote
Young people are in danger from the effects of witchcraft which is “sweeping the country,” Mr Geoffrey Dickens, the Tory campaigner against child abuse, warned in the Commons yesterday… Mr Dickens said outside the Commons that now he would be pressing for – or possibly himself introducing – a Bill to make to make it illegal to practise witchcraft, and empowering courts to pass heavy custodial sentences…. “If we are to protect children from their sordid, sexual and diabolical grasp, we must bring in new laws to wipe witches off the face of the earth”.

And from later the same year:

Quote
Babies and young children were being sacrified to the Devil in witchcraft rituals all over Britain, according to Tory MP Mr Geoffrey Dickens….

“Six hundred children go missing every year. At least 50 of these children are simply never found again…. With witchcraft sacrifice nothing is ever found”

I'm extremely worried this aspect of the story is not getting play in the media and I stronly suspect this is because it is forming a pivotal part of the coverup.

With the X-Dossier case in Belgium in particular, misleading information pointing to Satanic Ritual Abuse was introduced into the investigation on spurious grounds only to be later used to dismiss the case.

Could the same be happening here?  It's interesting to note the dossier has come to light at the same time as more and more MPs are joining in a (cross-party) call for an independent inquiry into organised child sex abuse claims.  This includes two cabinet members, who are currently leading 122 MPs in pressuring David Cameron into setting up the inquiry.

You'll notice Cameron has not set up an inquiry, but has, in fact, put pressure on the civil service to find this missing document (underming Nick Clegg in the process - nicely played, Dave).

If the report does ever see the light of day, it'll probably take a few weeks before people point out Dickens is, well, a bit of a lunatic.  But when they do, the ridicule will cause popular support for investigations to collapse.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 07, 2014, 10:04:38 am
That's certainly concerning. I'd guess most people would now dismiss satanic claims related to abuse quite quickly. Those that don't/won't are probably already firm believers in the idea of it occurring so you get a nice section of crazy to help push everything else under the rug.

Quote
You'll notice Cameron has not set up an inquiry, but has, in fact, put pressure on the civil service to find this missing document (underming Nick Clegg in the process - nicely played, Dave).

Naturally. The past few months, and I suspect the next few the political panto will be in full flow. At this point, you know what line of bullshit each of them are going to come out with. The only impressive thing remaining is that some still do it with a straight face.

Anyway, fucking satanic panic. Every few years or so this shit keeps coming back and turns people into loons. All shorts of idiocy to ensure, mark my words.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on July 07, 2014, 10:24:48 am
I think an argument can be made in some cases for Satanic-related child abuse (I'm just as sceptical of those who claim Satanic child abuse has never occured as I am of those who claim to see Satan's hand in every evil act), but I struggle with the organised aspect, given Satanism itself is not exactly a strongly organised religion and its most public and organised fronts (CoS, Temple of Set) do not strike me as hotbeds of rampant pedophilia.  Hotbeds of juvenile philosophy and rampant egomania, sure, but not so much the other stuff.

But yes.  There is no evidence to sustain allegations in this case, beyond the endless self-promotion of the extremely unreliable Valerie Sinason (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerie_Sinason).  The media will rightly scoff at it, and it will be used to undermine more effective investigations, such as the one currently focused on an ex-Cabinet minister, as baseless conspiracy theorism.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: BadBeast on July 07, 2014, 01:21:55 pm
I think an argument can be made in some cases for Satanic-related child abuse (I'm just as sceptical of those who claim Satanic child abuse has never occured as I am of those who claim to see Satan's hand in every evil act), but I struggle with the organised aspect, given Satanism itself is not exactly a strongly organised religion and its most public and organised fronts (CoS, Temple of Set) do not strike me as hotbeds of rampant pedophilia.  Hotbeds of juvenile philosophy and rampant egomania, sure, but not so much the other stuff.


Sexual abuse of a child is more powerful when it is put into the context of demonic magic. The abuser’s semen is magic and seals the programming. The ritual aspect of it, and the repetitive nature of the abuse creates several dynamics that accompany the abuse that wouldn’t occur in non-ritual abuse. The lie that accompanies such abuse is that this institutionalized abuse is an obligation for both the abuser and the victim. For instance, the mind-control of the Beast Barracks experience at West Point, USMA is an institutionalized abuse that allows the abuser to side step responsibility for sadistic behavior, and sets the stage for the abuse to be continued under the disguise of tradition.

http://educate-yourself.org/mc/illumformula2chap.shtml
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on July 07, 2014, 02:54:22 pm
Yeah, I'll choose to not read the lunatic ravings of a convicted armed robber and white supremacist, thanks.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: BadBeast on July 07, 2014, 04:16:26 pm
Yeah, I'll choose to not read the lunatic ravings of a convicted armed robber and white supremacist, thanks.
Hah! That's what they all say, then it's a little peep between the fingers, and before you know it, the rabbit hole you thought you were peeking into becomes a black hole, an irresistible vortex of plausible supposition that sucks you in, and shows you the REAL truth of what makes the World go round!   :aaa:

 :roll: I don't blame you for your reluctance to pick through this document and sift the more credible rantings from the Christian Cultbuster Worldview this missive obviously is. But whatever skewed perspective the author's personal, religious, or socio / political angle  was birthed from, their  sources and citations are, for the most part credibly supportive, if not evidential, and supremely worth an examination, if only on the strength of the lulz generated by how far "out there" a well crafted conspiracy model can take you.

The main artery much of this conspiracy hangs on is the well accepted and citable fact that Josef Mengeles was the visionary and architect behind the CIA's widely documented MKUltra program. The implications of, and potential for abuse , even for an unimaginative, steadfast conservative such as myself, are frighteningly self evident.   :|

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that there's any more credence in this conspiracy theory than there is in any other, but surely the only Discordian response to a scenario such as Springmeier & Wheeler present, is to grin with that :fap: "Oh yeah? Come at me bro" :fap: grin, before flinging oneself headfirst into this . . .this . . . . this clusterfuck of pathological Gotterdammerung / Armageddon /  would be Gospel of the endtimes, with the same gusto a starving 500lb chubby on a pimped out Rascal has for a "Happy meal" on a stick. After all, what's the worst that can happen? 
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 08, 2014, 02:53:13 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-28203914

Quote
Retired senior judge Elizabeth Butler-Sloss, 80, has been named as the chairman of a wide-ranging review into historical child sex abuse.

Lady Butler-Sloss led the Cleveland child abuse inquiry in the late 1980s.

Older spags may recall this one as the judge that bailed on the Diana inquest as it required a jury. My hopes aren't high here to be blunt.

Without putting too fine a point on it, the other side of the thing is she's 80. Given the potential length, breadth and depth (if it's to be anything worth actually doing and this is apparently what's claimed) there's surely a reasonable chance she won't live to the end of it. I wouldn't put money on it at any rate. The other thing at 80 is, well, maybe your faculties aren't what they were.

I don't say that lightly, I say that because this is the woman who was in charge of the Cleveland Inquiry.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_child_abuse_scandal

Quote
Following the media outcry, a public inquiry, The Cleveland Report[4] was established, led by Elizabeth Butler-Sloss. This judicial inquiry found that the pediatricians had "acted properly" and the report supported the manner in which they had applied the reflex anal dilatation test. This finding contradicted the decision of the judges involved in the case, who had stated that the test was "controversial".[5]

Yeah. That test is/was apparently a thing.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflex_anal_dilatation

Quote
Reflex anal dilation (RAD) is the reflexive dilation of the human anus to a diameter greater than two centimeters in response to the parting of the buttocks or anal stimulation, such as brushing with a medical instrument. RAD was theorized to be a clinical marker associated with anal sexual assault in children,[1] and has been associated with other signs of sexual assault[2] but also appears in children with severe chronic constipation and those subject to invasive medical treatments of the anus.[3] The finding of RAD alone is not considered indicative of sexual abuse,[4] and a normative sample of children not suspected of having been sexually abused found that a significant number of children showed anal dilation either continuously or intermittently.[5]

Used extensively in the Cleveland child abuse scandal, it was discredited during the trial as the sole indication of sexual abuse, determined to be considered a sign of sexual assault by a tiny minority of British physicians.[6] RAD is now considered discredited

Chances for satanic panic bullshit? Rising. Substantially. Chances for general bullshit clouding the issue for years with no real resolution for anyone? At this stage it's practically assured. I'd really like to be very, very wrong here.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on July 08, 2014, 03:53:17 pm
Given the pisspoor methodology of the NSPCC investigation into Savile, which mostly consisted of "someone (who I can't name) once told me that their sister's cousin's best friend's classmate was once groped by Jimmy Savile in a Maggie Thatcher mask at Buckingham Palace...sometime in the 80s", I had rather higher hopes for this one. 

Oh well.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 14, 2014, 07:11:13 am
Seems the best place for this:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28282050

Quote
Pope Francis has been quoted as saying that reliable data indicates that "about 2%" of clergy in the Catholic Church are paedophiles.

The Pope said that abuse of children was like "leprosy" infecting the Church, according to the Italian La Repubblica newspaper.

He vowed to "confront it with the severity it demands".

But a Vatican spokesman said the quotes in the newspaper did not correspond to Pope Francis's exact words.

The BBC's David Willey in Rome says there is often a studied ambiguity in Pope Francis' off-the-cuff statements.

Quote
In the interview, Pope Francis was quoted as saying that the 2% estimate came from advisers. It would represent around 8,000 priests out of a global number of about 414,000.

"Among the 2% who are paedophiles are priests, bishops and cardinals. Others, more numerous, know but keep quiet. They punish without giving the reason," Pope Francis was quoted as saying.

"I find this state of affairs intolerable," he went on.
Quote
Vatican spokesman Father Federico Lombardi denied that Pope Francis had said that there were cardinals who were paedophiles.

There's a degree of dispute over the exact words used, but the sentiment seems sound. The "1 in 50" headline will get quite a bit of play and rightly so.

Lombardi seems to have the job of deflecting suspicion away from the upper ranks and spinning whatever this Pope says into something generally more palatable for the clergy and general public. £5 says he knows where a lot of bodies are buried. £10 says he's dug more than a couple of holes of his own.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on July 14, 2014, 10:05:37 am
Content advisory. Some discussion of physical abuse ahead (I've stripped the descriptions of sexual abuse from the descriptions).

Some quotes from David Yallop's The Power and the Glory:

Quote
The secret system that protects the clerical sex abuser was functioning effectively as far back at least as the early part of the seventeenth century when the founder of the Piarist Order, Father Joseph Calasanz, suppressed the sexual abuse of children by his priests from becoming public knowledge. One such paedophile, Father Stefano Cherubini, the member of a well-connected Vatican family, was so successful at covering up his crimes he even succeeded in becoming head of the Order. It took fifteen years of complaints against him and other senior members of the Order before action was taken by Pope Innocent X and the Order was temporarily closed down. As historian Karen Liebreich, in Fallen Order shows, the seventeenth-century secret system had a very modern ring, including ‘promotion for avoidance’ – elevate the abuser away from his victims.

Quote
Recently yet another secret Vatican document concerning the crime of solicitation has surfaced. The document, Instructions on the Manner of Proceeding in Cases of Solicitation, deals with the crime of a priest attempting to procure sexual favours from an individual whose confession he is hearing. It was published by the Prefect of the Holy Office, Cardinal Alfredo Ottaviani, with the approval of the then Pope, John XXIII, in March 1962. The document has never been made available to the general public. The distribution list was confined to ‘Patriarchs, Archbishops, Bishops and Other Diocesan Ordinaries’. Among those receiving a copy would have been the newly promoted Bishop of Cracow, Karol Wojtyla.

It deals with the secret trial arrangements of any cleric charged with the offence. The document has recently been described by lawyers as ‘a blueprint for deception and concealment’ while apologists have argued that as the Sacrament of Penance is protected by a shroud of absolute secrecy, the procedures for dealing with this ‘ecclesiastical’ crime also invoke secrecy, putting the offender above the criminal law of the land. This was precisely the position that the Vatican has taken for many centuries on all acts of clerical paedophilia perpetrated in or out of the confessional box.

The 1962 Holy Office instructions for ‘addressing this unspeakable crime’ go to remarkable lengths to ensure total secrecy. The victim must lodge a complaint within ‘thirty days’ of the crime. Failure to do so will mean the victim’s automatic excommunication. As the victim was often a young child, that particular directive beggars belief. The alleged perpetrator was able to ‘be transferred to another assignment unless the Ordinary of the place has forbidden it’. Both the perpetrator and the victim are ordered to observe ‘perpetual silence’, under pain of excommunication. Again an element of the secret system has come into play. ‘The oath of keeping the secret must be given in these cases also by the accusers or those denouncing the priest and the witnesses.’ Chapter Five of the document, entitled ‘The Worst Crime’, states ‘by the name of the worst crime is understood at this point evidence of any obscene, external deed, gravely sinful act, perpetrated by a cleric or attempted with a person of his own sex or attempted by him with youths of either sex or with brute animals (bestiality)’.

Quote
In St Ninian’s the monks varied the regular beatings, rapes and the gamut of sexual abuses of the boys with their own version of torture and brutality. An electric generator was set up in the boot room where boys were forced to hold onto the bare wires leading from the machine and receive a series of electric shocks. The children were also subjected to whippings with a riding crop with the ends tied to cause greater pain.

Christopher Fearns, a social worker, recalled, ‘I was beaten with the riding crop two or three times a week for four years. They told us they’d whip the Devil out of us. I was battered so many times on my head and ears I cannot hear a thing on my left side, and I’ve undergone extensive surgery because of it.’

To date just three people have been brought to trial; all were found guilty. Among the ten charges that were proved against Brother Benedict were assault, forcing children to eat their own vomit and breaking a boy’s arm. The three men were given token sentences of two years’ imprisonment. Brother Benedict appealed and was granted bail. More than a year later his appeal has yet to be heard and he walks freely among his fellow citizens.

Jimmy Boyle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Boyle_%28artist%29), formerly the most feared man in Scotland, recalled his years in another De La Salle school, St John’s in Springboig: ‘Even today I can still hear the sounds of breaking bones as a monk deliberately smashed a child’s leg to smithereens. Or footsteps in the night that heralded yet another horrific rape of a terrified, crying child.’

Quote
Appalling abuse by the Christian Brothers has been matched by cruelty from the Poor Sisters of Nazareth or the Daughters of Charity of St Vincent de Paul or the Sisters of Mercy. For more than 100 years there were Nazareth homes all over the United Kingdom, Australia, South Africa, the United States and Ireland.

From the mid-nineteenth century to recent times ‘Nazareth homes’ cared for the young and the old. The orphanages were run by nuns from the order of the Sisters of Mercy. Violent degradation and thrashings were a daily event. The children woke up to the screams of other children and to the familiar sound of the strap. In 1965 Helen Cusiter was eight years of age when her mother disappeared and she was taken, along with her five brothers, to the Nazareth House in Aberdeen. In 2004 at the age of forty-seven, after a chance meeting with one of her childhood tormentors, Helen became one of over five hundred former residents to bring an action against the Sisters.

Her recall of what she had endured was corroborated by other former inmates who had not met for a lifetime. It included a particular incident with Sister Alphonso who had come looking for her while Helen had been playing on the swings.

‘She took me off by the hair, twisted me round and threw me against the church wall. She broke all my front teeth, my face was a mashed mess, the other kids were all screaming.’ Helen Howie, one of those screaming children, remembers the blood pouring from Helen’s face: ‘Sister Alphonso didn’t use leather straps, she used her fists, she had such strength.’

When the dentist queried the extensive bruising on the eight year old’s face he was told, ‘She fell.’ Sister Aphonso was convicted on four charges of cruel and unnatural treatment. Because of her age she was merely admonished rather than imprisoned. There are all too many similar testimonies from hundreds of damaged people. Many sought not compensation but just the opportunity of being heard, of having the pain they still felt acknowledged. The Poor Sisters are no longer poor. They have approaching £200 million in their bank and have eventually dropped the ‘Poor’ from their title. There is now an international campaign to bring the Order to the bar of justice. It will be an uphill struggle with the insurance companies combining with a number of the bishops to ward off the attack.

Quote
In 1966 at the age of nine, Willie was the oldest of ten children, living in a caravan without sanitation or running water. It was his responsibility to help to feed the family. His father, a tinsmith confronting a shrinking market with the advent of long-life kitchen utensils, needed all the help he could get. Willie was caught stealing piglets and sentenced to six years in Letterfrack, an industrial school in the west of Ireland, described by survivors as ‘a hell on earth’. Inmates suffered physical, mental and sexual abuse. Willie was treated brutally. In 1970, by now thirteen, a few days before he was due home for a precious two-week holiday, Willie was continously beaten about the head. Survivors have recently testified that one of the Christian Brothers was continuously beating Willie’s head with a bunch of keys; others remember him using a pole. At home Willie complained of severe headaches, then he suffered a fit, went into a coma and died. Doctors at St Luke’s Hospital in Kilkenny said he had died of meningitis.

And some figures

Quote
It was subsequently revealed that in New Zealand in early 1991 six Roman Catholic dioceses had confirmed thirty-eight cases of sexual abuse by priests and brothers, within two years of a complaints procedure being set up: a great many more were in the pipeline including complaints of abuse that reached back fifty years to the 1940s. For most of that period the Catholic population of New Zealand was less than 500,000, with only around 500 priests: the confirmed cases indicated a historic average of some seven per cent of priests being sex abusers.

Quote
The Catholic psychotherapist Wunibald Müller, a man with decades of experience in the treatment of priests with psychological and psychiatric problems, has estimated that there is a minimum of two per cent of all priests in Germany with a predisposition to paedophilia, giving a national figure of between 250 and 300. Paedophiles are invariably serial offenders and therefore the number of children at very real risk in Germany today, even by the most conservative of estimates, is somewhere between 5,000 and 10,000. The actual figure is undoubtedly much higher. Müller’s estimate was based on the evidence that has been made available to him through clinical study of the general German population. But the extraordinary efficiency of the German application of the secret system has for decades dramatically suppressed the abnormal incidence of sexual abuse among the clerical population. Consequently Müller’s estimates are only around half of comparable estimates for other countries, notably the USA. His figure is disturbingly low.

Quote
In the United States during the fifteen years after the Gauthe case of 1985/86, over 1,200 paedophile priests were exposed. In view of the fact that there have continued to be weekly if not daily exposures, new civil claims and continuous fresh allegations, the actual total continues to move in the United States inexorably towards 3,000 paedophiles or five per cent of the Roman Catholic priesthood. Even those estimates may prove to be far too low when more exhaustive research has been completed. If the evidence from the Indiana diocese of Lafayette was to be replicated across the United States, all of the previous estimates would have to be rewritten. In a diocese of just seventy-five active priests, by early 1997 it had been established that at least sixteen per cent were guilty of a wide range of sexual abuses.

Quote
From 1978 until April 2002 the Pope had deliberately and studiously avoided any public references to the global epidemic of sexual abuse by his priests and members of Catholic orders, apart from a few oblique comments. He had talked in March 2002 of ‘a dark shadow of suspicion’ that had been cast over priests ‘by some of our brothers who have betrayed the grace of ordination’ and have succumbed to the ‘most grievous forms of the mystery of evil at work in the world’. He could not quite bring himself to utter the word paedophilia.

Note all figures are from 2005 or so, when the book was published.

I admire the current Pope for his stand against paedophilia in the Church and against the corruption of Vatican politics by money laundering and "masonic lodges"*, but he has to be careful as hell.  The "secret system" endures, especially in southern Europe.  He can't trust people inside the Vatican to help him.  And he's treading ground that at least one previous Pope has gone down...that Pope, you may recall, did not last very long in his position.  30 days, to be exact.

*Which may all be interconnected.  While somewhat hard to credit, to put it mildly, a former Catholic priest by the name of Malachi Martin has some interesting things to say on this topic:

Quote from: Peter Levenda, Sinister Forces Book 3: The Manson Secret
While the Catholic Church has been officially silent on the matter of Malachi Martin, his books have been popular among a certain segment of the Catholic population, who believe that there is an evil, Satanic element within the Vatican that has hijacked the Church for its own purposes. Martin was writing about this years before revelations exploded about the Vatican banking scandals, the Masonic P-2 society infiltration of the Vatican as high as cardinal level, and the alleged murder of Pope John Paul I after only thirty days as Pontiff. Thus, it is entirely possible that there are at least two factions within the Church, and that one faction supported Martin’s researches and that another firmly opposed them. Martin also alleged that there existed within the Church something he called the “Superforce,” which was the name he gave to the cabal of evildoers within the Vatican that perpetrated not only political and financial crimes, but which was also involved in pedophilia and other sexual scandals, some under the guise of a satanic cult of sex abusers. Recent revelations concerning the widespread cover up of pedophilia and other forms of sexual abuse within the Church—a cover up that begins at the highest levels of the Vatican bureaucracy—seem to support Martin’s contentions, particularly as, in some cases, this abuse was connected with vaguely ritualistic settings and ceremonies.

Martin isn't a complete crank, it should be noted.  As Yallop notes, when detailing the lie of how Pope John Paul II took credit for redefining the Vatican's relationship with Jews:

Quote
Claims have also been made that he was the leading author of the final declaration. In just fifteen lengthy sentences, Nostra Aetate was a groundbreaking document launching a movement to reverse 2,000 years of hatred, oppression, vilification and annihilation of Jews by Catholics in the name of God. But it owes nothing to Karol Wojtyla for its existence. Just as the stories of Wojtyla’s wartime dramatic interventions to save Jewish lives are fantasies piled on myths so the claims that have been made on behalf of Wojtyla regarding his input and influence on the creation of this historic declaration are without foundation.

The credit for this historic document should be given in particular to two men, the Jesuit Cardinal Bea and Father Malachi Martin who had doctorates in Semitic languages, archaeology and Oriental history and was destined to become a highly controversial author. Working closely with Cardinal Bea, Martin drafted the document, which exonerated the Jews from culpability in the execution of Jesus Christ. Father Martin received overwhelming if not unanimous approval from the Vatican Council and many accolades from around the world.

So there may well be something in his allegations.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 14, 2014, 10:54:24 am
Another one for the list then. Sinister forces is already on it but should really be moved up. Between that and the other thread here they're clearly worth a read.

From the second quote:
Quote
The victim must lodge a complaint within ‘thirty days’ of the crime. Failure to do so will mean the victim’s automatic excommunication. As the victim was often a young child, that particular directive beggars belief. The alleged perpetrator was able to ‘be transferred to another assignment unless the Ordinary of the place has forbidden it’. Both the perpetrator and the victim are ordered to observe ‘perpetual silence’, under pain of excommunication.

There's so much horror there it's difficult to quantify it. There's no logical way this makes sense unless you're trying to explicitly protect the accused over the victims. Adding the excommunication angle is just stunning for a variety of reasons. The first one that mainly comes to mind is how well ingrained the Catholic world view gets, well, beaten mainly, into folk so that carries serious heft.

As far as the numbers go, it seems 2% is rather optimistic, 4-6% would seem to be closer from what the other sources quoted indicate. I wonder if anyone's going to have the decency to give the Pope these facts and let him know the problem seems to be at least twice as bad as he thinks.

It doesn't look good for Lombardi either. If that "Promotion for avoidance" policy is accurate, the chances of these people being cardinals or holding a range of senior positions seems likely. At least we can be confident that any such people in such positions will obviously be fully co-operative with any investigation.

So, problems ahoy for the next decade at least.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Faust on July 14, 2014, 10:58:33 am
The Irish Woman who met him over the weekend was very happy with what he had to say.

So he said "2% of priests are pedophiles", the Vatican steps in saying she misheard and now she is pissed off saying that was exactly what he said.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0714/630600-pope/
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 14, 2014, 11:10:25 am
I have to assume that the spokesman in question is Lombardi.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federico_Lombardi

Quote
In an editorial for "Octava Dies", a weekly program of the Vatican Television Center, he criticized statements made by Bishop Richard Williamson denying the extent of the Holocaust.[5] Lombardi was later criticized himself by Cardinal Dario Castrillon Hoyos over the problems in communication revealed during the affair.[6]

Lombardi said that the Pope had never been a member of the Hitler Youth, but journalists quickly pointed out to him that Cardinal Ratzinger, later Pope, had admitted this himself in the 1997 book Salt of the Earth.[7]

In 2009 Lombardi said that in "cases like Pope Benedict XVI’s Regensburg discourse, the bishop Williamson affair, or the controversy over Pope Benedict XVI’s statements regarding condoms and the spread of HIV and AIDS in Africa ... once the first wave of criticism had passed, people were able to do some real hard thinking ... subsequent reflections were serious, penetrating and well-argued."[8]

In September 2012, Lombardi released a second statement on the 2012 diplomatic missions attacks which clearly condemned mob violence; his first statement had been criticized by Catholic bloggers for omitting to condemn the violence, and for emphasizing primarily on the religious feelings of offended Muslims.[9]

Quote
Father Federico Lombardi, S.J. (born 29 August 1942[1]) is an Italian Catholic priest and the current director of the Holy See Press Office.

In short, he's their spin doctor.

Quote
Upon assuming the directorate, Lombardi said he would not be a papal "spokesman" since he believes Benedict XVI did not need an interpreter, saying, "I don't think my role is to explain the Pope's thinking or explain the things that he already states in an extraordinarily clear and rich way.

Clearly, this pope isn't expressing himself correctly.

If there was ever a suitable candidate for rubber hose interrogations, it's this guy. £20 says he can not only say where the bodies are buried, but who buried them, when they were buried and where they bought the spade to do the digging.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Lecherous on July 14, 2014, 11:28:34 am
James Stewart - Harvey (1/2): http://youtu.be/hBvpxzl54D8

Demolition Man - Illegal.mp4: http://youtu.be/puM1eT15NYw
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 14, 2014, 12:43:11 pm
Sigh:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-28295282

Quote
Retired judge Baroness Butler-Sloss has stepped down as head of a probe into child sex abuse saying she was "not the right person" for the job.

Downing Street said "it was entirely her decision" and a new chair would be appointed within days.

Lady Butler-Sloss has been under pressure to quit from MPs and victims concerned about her family links.

Her late brother, Sir Michael Havers, was attorney general in the 1980s

Quote
Lady Butler-Sloss said she "did not sufficiently consider" whether her family links would cause difficulties in the inquiry.

Less than a week. I'd be surprised if she didn't have form for such behaviour.

Taking bets on the suitability of the next appointed person. I've got a fiver on "Equally unsuitable" and a quid on "Freddy Starr".
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on July 14, 2014, 11:04:03 pm
Fucking hell.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 15, 2014, 07:22:20 am
Fucking hell.

Something of an understatement.

It's bubbling now, but I think the boil is a long way off still. So far, the convictions and investigations are still quite closely contained and focused. I imagine everyone was happy enough to throw Gary Glitter and Rolf under the bus, but when the questions lead to younger or more influential people progress stops/slows dramatically.

What I would suspect is that if around 4-6% of the priesthood have had some kind of involvement with abuse, I find no reason not to assume that this figure holds good in other professions. This also makes me very suspicious of anyone shouting for leniency for historic crimes, particularly when they've not already been implicated in some way.

The other angle is the actual prosecutions. Freddy Starr walked because essentially it was not economically viable to proceed. They were apparently confident in gaining one conviction but the others less so, so drop everything. Poor man has suffered enough.


Oddly enough, Madeline Mcann tales are back in vogue. It would seem that a focus on a perpetually missing young white girl is somehow more important than most other news.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 15, 2014, 07:48:20 am
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-28283480

Quote
Fresh allegations of child sex abuse against the Church of England (CofE) are likely to surface, the Archbishop of Canterbury has warned.

The Most Rev Justin Welby said he was braced for an abuse inquiry to reveal "bad stories" about the Church.

Quote
Asked if he was prepared for more "bad stories" of child abuse within the establishment, the archbishop told the BBC: "I would love to say there weren't, but I expect there are. There are in almost every institution in this land.

It's rather oddly worded and pre-emptive. It's also not making me think my above post is wrong.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on July 15, 2014, 09:39:32 am
In the case of Freddie Starr, well, I can understand why Stephen Fry was angry.  I don't have any idea of the validity of the charges against him, but the proceedings have clearly wrecked the man.  He was a bumbling wreck in that press conference his solicitor put on.

Of course, this is exactly the press culture we demanded.  Idolizing of celebrity, creepy fetishization of children and vicious, snarling condemnation from atop towers of righteous fury.  It's no surprise we ended up where we are, really.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on July 15, 2014, 11:09:01 am
Another one for the list then. Sinister forces is already on it but should really be moved up. Between that and the other thread here they're clearly worth a read.

From the second quote:
Quote
The victim must lodge a complaint within ‘thirty days’ of the crime. Failure to do so will mean the victim’s automatic excommunication. As the victim was often a young child, that particular directive beggars belief. The alleged perpetrator was able to ‘be transferred to another assignment unless the Ordinary of the place has forbidden it’. Both the perpetrator and the victim are ordered to observe ‘perpetual silence’, under pain of excommunication.

There's so much horror there it's difficult to quantify it. There's no logical way this makes sense unless you're trying to explicitly protect the accused over the victims. Adding the excommunication angle is just stunning for a variety of reasons. The first one that mainly comes to mind is how well ingrained the Catholic world view gets, well, beaten mainly, into folk so that carries serious heft.

As far as the numbers go, it seems 2% is rather optimistic, 4-6% would seem to be closer from what the other sources quoted indicate. I wonder if anyone's going to have the decency to give the Pope these facts and let him know the problem seems to be at least twice as bad as he thinks.

It doesn't look good for Lombardi either. If that "Promotion for avoidance" policy is accurate, the chances of these people being cardinals or holding a range of senior positions seems likely. At least we can be confident that any such people in such positions will obviously be fully co-operative with any investigation.

So, problems ahoy for the next decade at least.

Is it reasonable to expect that protecting the image and integrity of the church would be pretty much top of their list of priorities?

Given that (comparatively?) a whole bunch of servants ordained by God, to carry out his work on earth turn out to be kiddie fiddlers, how does this paint the church or, for that matter, god himself?

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 15, 2014, 11:26:10 am
In the case of Freddie Starr, well, I can understand why Stephen Fry was angry.  I don't have any idea of the validity of the charges against him, but the proceedings have clearly wrecked the man.  He was a bumbling wreck in that press conference his solicitor put on.

Of course, this is exactly the press culture we demanded.  Idolizing of celebrity, creepy fetishization of children and vicious, snarling condemnation from atop towers of righteous fury.  It's no surprise we ended up where we are, really.

As I understand it, Fry is mainly angry that the culture of "Guilty once accused" is still pretty strong. Which is reasonable enough. The UK press certainly spends enough time condemning everything not totally aligned with it.

That said, I believe the case against Starr had a fair chance of success based on statements from prosecutors. There's a lot of "What's in the public interest" kind of shit associated with this. I'm fairly sure someone's made the call at some point that Freddy Starr is living his own punishment as he is Freddy Starr.

Quote
Is it reasonable to expect that protecting the image and integrity of the church would be pretty much top of their list of priorities?

I would expect that exact line to be part of Lombardi's job description. Particularly the "image" part.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 16, 2014, 10:51:50 am
Daily "Jesus fucking christ" link:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28326128

Quote
More than 650 suspected paedophiles have been arrested as part of a six-month operation targeting people accessing child abuse images online.

The National Crime Agency (NCA) said the 660 arrested included doctors, teachers, scout leaders, care workers and former police officers.

More than 400 children have been protected as a result, the agency said.

Arrests were made across the UK and the majority of those held had no previous contact with police.

The NCA said 39 were of those arrested are registered sex offenders.

Charges already brought range from possessing indecent images of children to serious sexual assault.

The NCA stressed that none of those arrested is a serving or former MP or member of the Government.

Behold the final word in the argument in UK communications monitoring. That bill has already flown through the usual process and anyone who dares decry it will be directed to this and accused of sympathising with paedophiles.

It'd almost be funny if it wasn't tragic. Terrorists and drug dealers not scary enough for you? "Well if we don't have X we won't be able to properly protect your kids"

You can't help but wonder about the bold. It seems an odd thing to emphasise to me. Last week there was some discontent over a missing dossier which apparently implicated MP's and other such government figures. Making a point about how none of them are involved seems like a rather politically motivated statement.

 
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on July 17, 2014, 11:12:56 am
That 650/660 number could apparently be over 10K according to various headlines.

Wonderful.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on July 17, 2014, 11:33:52 am
Daily "Jesus fucking christ" link:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28326128

Quote
More than 650 suspected paedophiles have been arrested as part of a six-month operation targeting people accessing child abuse images online.

The National Crime Agency (NCA) said the 660 arrested included doctors, teachers, scout leaders, care workers and former police officers.

More than 400 children have been protected as a result, the agency said.

Arrests were made across the UK and the majority of those held had no previous contact with police.

The NCA said 39 were of those arrested are registered sex offenders.

Charges already brought range from possessing indecent images of children to serious sexual assault.

The NCA stressed that none of those arrested is a serving or former MP or member of the Government.

Behold the final word in the argument in UK communications monitoring. That bill has already flown through the usual process and anyone who dares decry it will be directed to this and accused of sympathising with paedophiles.

It'd almost be funny if it wasn't tragic. Terrorists and drug dealers not scary enough for you? "Well if we don't have X we won't be able to properly protect your kids"

You can't help but wonder about the bold. It seems an odd thing to emphasise to me. Last week there was some discontent over a missing dossier which apparently implicated MP's and other such government figures. Making a point about how none of them are involved seems like a rather politically motivated statement.

 

the fact that it's an official announcement from the Ministry of Truth would make it seem like a rather politically motivated statement
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on August 14, 2014, 03:18:35 pm
FUCKING CALLED IT.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28790718

Quote
Police have searched a Berkshire property belonging to Sir Cliff Richard in relation to an alleged historical sex offence.

No arrests have been made and Sir Cliff, 73, who is abroad, said the allegation was "completely false".

Police said the allegation involved a boy under 16 and dated from the 1980s.

The BBC understands it relates to an alleged sexual assault at an event where US preacher Billy Graham appeared at Bramall Lane, Sheffield.

Back later, can't stop laughing.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Pope Pixie Pickle on August 14, 2014, 10:14:22 pm
FUCKING CALLED IT.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28790718

Quote
Police have searched a Berkshire property belonging to Sir Cliff Richard in relation to an alleged historical sex offence.

No arrests have been made and Sir Cliff, 73, who is abroad, said the allegation was "completely false".

Police said the allegation involved a boy under 16 and dated from the 1980s.

The BBC understands it relates to an alleged sexual assault at an event where US preacher Billy Graham appeared at Bramall Lane, Sheffield.

Back later, can't stop laughing.
funny me and payne and HouseMatt were saying the exact same thing 3 weeks ago.....
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on August 15, 2014, 08:24:45 am
Rumours have been circulating for a while.

No idea how credible they are, though.  On the one hand, never-married overtly Christian popstar with buckets of money who gives heavily to charity.  You can see a cause for suspicion.  On the other hand, despite never marrying his known past relationships have been, for want of a better word, normal. 

Also, given how heavily connected Cliff Richard is in the world of showbiz, he couldn't get away with it without a heavy level of collusion with others.  At the very least, his manager, the manager's mother and his girlfriend all lived with him for extended periods.  If Cliff is guilty, then others must have known.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on August 15, 2014, 10:44:05 am
Quote
If Cliff is guilty, then others must have known.

Reasonable, though not necessarily.

Savile's antics were "known" but widely ignored/dismissed. The various rumours about Cliff are far from recent which makes it somewhat more difficult to assess.

I guess the most immediately telling factor would be if he decides to return to the UK. I doubt he's in any rush to get on a flight and clear his name in person. That said, doing so would certainly slant my opinion in his favour.

I can't recall royal/political connections off-hand, but I'm sure there's got to be some, at least.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on August 15, 2014, 11:37:24 am
It would be very hard, if not impossible, to hide such activities from others he lived with, if he was a consistent predatory sex offender.  Much like Savile.  I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm just saying that if it did happen, then it's pretty certain at least some other people knew about it, in some capacity.

He doesn't have that many Royal connections, surprisingly.  He has a Knighthood, of course, performed at Buckingham Palace a couple of times and probably rubbed elbows with some royals while doing his charity work.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on August 15, 2014, 11:55:16 am
It seems worth noting that many people suddenly knew things about Savile and Co. after they were arrested and publicly known to have committed various offences.

Guess it's a bit of a waiting game for more info. If he has been a consistent predator then I'd guess additional accusations to surface over the coming week.

It seems worth noting as well that he may be quite innocent of all this. I, however, have been making jokes about this day coming for around 10 years so I'm sure as hell going to laugh it up while I can.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: BadBeast on August 15, 2014, 06:41:26 pm
I pretty much knew he was a wrongcock when I was ten years old, and Jim'll fix it was on every Saturday teatime. It used to make me cringe to see him with some poor little dying kid sitting on his lap.

And Cliff Richard always made my shit itch too, tbh.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mangrove on August 22, 2014, 08:15:47 pm
How did we miss this one?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Denning 

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: BadBeast on August 26, 2014, 06:48:17 pm
How did we miss this one?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Denning 


I've never heard of him, but that's probably why he's been lower profile than other Operation Yewtree catches. He hasn't worked for the BBC since 1969, but he still worked there, so were he to be overlooked, it might reflect badly on the BBC.

However, he's hardly been "low profile" in Europe, judging by his conviction history. And he seems to be connected to other "less famous" paedos like Tam Paton, as well as people like Jonathan King, Gary Glitter, and (at least half of) The Bay City Rollers. He's got quite a rap sheet, seeing as he's spent thirty years in Prison though. Doen't look like he'll be getting out anytime soon either. 
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on August 27, 2014, 08:09:00 am
It continues:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28935733

Quote
The stereotypical belief that boys are less vulnerable to child sexual exploitation means they are receiving insufficient protection from frontline services, Barnardo's has claimed.

The children's charity says new findings reveal up to a third of victims are male.

The figure, taken from analysis of more than 9,000 records, shows a deeper problem than previously recognised.

Barnardo's says schools must teach boys about the dangers of grooming.

Barnardo's are far from perfect, so if they're indicating a problem of this size I would suggest it to be a minimum figure.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-28947707

Quote
South Yorkshire's Police and Crime Commissioner is facing calls to resign after the publication of a report into widespread child abuse in Rotherham.

The study, published on Tuesday, found at least 1,400 children in the town were sexually exploited by criminal gangs between 1997 and 2013.

PCC Shaun Wright was responsible for children's services at Rotherham Council from 2005 to 2010.

Rotherham isn't even that big of a place. That's some seriously disturbing shit.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on August 27, 2014, 11:15:12 am
I haven't fully read into that particular series of cases, but I'm making the assumption that the tabloid approved version of this story, namely "Islamic paedo rape gangs allowed to bugger YOUR CHILDREN by PC Brigade because they're afraid of being called racist" is not strictly accurate?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on August 27, 2014, 12:10:29 pm
You would be correct.

Please collect your jaw from the floor in your own time.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on August 27, 2014, 12:16:09 pm
I am shocked.

Also, just checked the BBC article:

Quote
The inquiry team noted fears among council staff of being labelled "racist" if they focused on victims' descriptions of the majority of abusers as "Asian" men.

It takes quite the imagination or lack of reading comprehension to read that as "Muslims allowed to rape children because PC brigade afraid of being called racist".

Besides, recent history has shown lots of white guys getting away with child rape too. I believe some papers have reflected on this issue.  Perhaps the problem is not racism, or some kind of mythical PC brigade, but that this country badly handles all kinds of hideous crimes against children, and frequently the authorities collude in covering up the full extent of the problem, no matter the skin colour of the perpetrators.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on August 27, 2014, 12:31:15 pm
Careful now, you're wading into Icke infested waters.

It's dangerous to go alone, take this:
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-PdPgLn3x1_8/TrerfF6711I/AAAAAAAACRA/da4r0vlYioM/s1600/MC253804e.jpg)


Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on August 27, 2014, 12:36:15 pm
Given the choice of sharing space with Icke or sharing space with the editorial team of the Sun, Express and Mail...well, there's no proof the royal family aren't satanic shapeshifting reptiles from the lower 4th dimension, really. 
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on August 27, 2014, 05:25:54 pm
Careful now, you're wading into Icke infested waters.

It's dangerous to go alone, take this:
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-PdPgLn3x1_8/TrerfF6711I/AAAAAAAACRA/da4r0vlYioM/s1600/MC253804e.jpg)

My god, that's hideous. I want it.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on August 27, 2014, 05:26:28 pm
Given the choice of sharing space with Icke or sharing space with the editorial team of the Sun, Express and Mail...well, there's no proof the royal family aren't satanic shapeshifting reptiles from the lower 4th dimension, really.

 :lulz: :lulz: :lulz:
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on August 28, 2014, 04:48:56 pm
Heh.  According to page 91 of the report, the "inquiry team [is] confident ethnic issues did not influence professional decision-making in individual cases".

So, in other words, the tabloids made shit up.  Not entirely out of thin air, the report does note that frontline staff expressed concerns their work could be interpreted as racist, but still, c'mon now.

The figure of 1400 abused is questionable, as the inquiry team only looked at 66 individual case files.  They drew a random sample from the available case files they had access to...which while statistically valid, in a kind of naive way, is really open to basic sampling errors.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on August 28, 2014, 04:59:12 pm
And it gets better.  The oh-so politically correct culture of the Rotheram police?  The report describes it as "bullying and macho", with a lot of sexist bullying in particular going on.  This was only amplified by the "traditional" Pakistani approach to gender relations, such as town councillors demanding social workers reveal the locations of women fleeing domestic violence on behalf of their husbands.

zomg teh peecee loonasee.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on October 30, 2014, 08:54:01 am
Bump. Because this shit isn't ending and actually appears to be again, worse than suspected:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-29803799

Quote
During the inquiry, Stockport MP Ms Coffey spoke to young people who had been approached by men.

One told her: "I said: 'Can you not see I am a little girl? I am in my uniform'."

Ms Coffey said: "It is an everyday occurrence for [some young girls], something they find deeply upsetting, that older men are approaching them on the street inviting them into cars and in some instances touching them."

The girls told her: "Well it happens so often, so many men, what can the police do?"

"That indicates they are living in an environment where it is felt to be ok to go and touch, and harass, and pester girls in uniforms," added Ms Coffey. "That is what I mean by it being a new social norm.

"It completely horrified me, so unexpected."

Quote
Report's main recommendations:
Investigate why, out of 12,879 recorded sexual offences, only 2,341 were taken to court and why, of those, just 1,078 led to convictions

Quote
"Progress has been made and changes are taking place... but the biggest changes needed are in culture and attitudes of us all," Ms Coffey said.

She was "alarmed" the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) highlighted one girl who wore cropped tops and another being described as a "slag" by her father in cases that were declared No Further Action.

Police, social workers, prosecutors and juries all carry attitudes around with them, Ms Coffey said in the report.

Holy shit. I think it's fairly self evident as to why the prosecution and conviction rates are what they are.

Coffey, unfortunately is a bit of non-entity politically. It's almost worth advocating some kind of policy where announcements of this nature have to be done by, oh, I don't know, Footballers or Soap opera actors or something. Anyone more publicly recognisable than Random MP would be better. You could probably get a list of those that would/help comply together quite quickly.

It's something I've mocked the USA for in the past, but the "forcing celebrities to do PSA work" sounds like it might just work out here.

And of course, you get to draw up another very interesting list for the ones that refuse.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on October 30, 2014, 09:45:31 am
As always, it's worth following Exaro News for these sorts of stories:

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5379/graham-wilmer-blasts-michael-gove-over-sex-abuse-at-schools

Quote
Graham Wilmer, a member of the panel for the overarching inquiry into child sex abuse (CSA), is furious with Michael Gove for refusing, when he was education secretary, to order an investigation into allegations against schools run by a Catholic order in Great Britain. Wilmer was sexually abused as a pupil at a school run by the order – the Salesians.

In his book, ‘The Devil’s Advocate’, which is published today, Wilmer says that he “had written several times” to Gove to investigate the Salesian order, which runs several schools in the UK. Wilmer is director of the Lantern Project, a charity that supports CSA victims.

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5389/justin-welby-admits-child-abuse-has-been-rampant-within-coe

Quote
Archbishop of Canterbury Justin Welby admits in a private letter that child abuse has been “rampant” in the Church of England and other UK institutions.

Writing to the mother of three boys who were groomed and sexually abused by the headmaster of a school run by the Church of England (CoE), Welby says: “The betrayal of Christ in such behaviour is complete.”

His strikingly candid comments underline the scale of the task for the overarching inquiry into child sex abuse, whose terms of reference were announced on Tuesday.

He wrote the letter after the mother, Marilyn Hawes, a committed Christian from Hertfordshire, turned to Exaro because an official at Lambeth Palace twice fobbed her off when she tried to raise the issue with the current and previous archbishops.

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5363/conservative-conference-faces-fresh-claims-over-paedophile-mps

Quote
This year’s Conservative conference is set to be dogged by fresh allegations about how the party covered up for paedophile MPs.

New claims about Sir Peter Morrison, the late MP who was Lady Thatcher’s parliamentary private secretary (PPS) when she was prime minister, are due to be published at the end of this month to coincide with the Conservatives’ annual conference.

It will renew questions about who in the party knew what about Morrison and when. He was publicly identified as a paedophile after he died.

The details are to be disclosed by Gyles Brandreth, broadcaster, and former Conservative MP and government whip in John Major’s government, in his updated diaries.

His book, ‘Breaking the Code’, is also expected to disclose details about the secretive workings of the Whips’ Office, which is embroiled by concerns about how it helped to cover up paedophilia among MPs.

www.exaronews.com/articles/5381/operation-fernbridge-loses-chief-as-pressure-mounts-on-met

Quote
Scotland Yard’s senior detective who was heading its wide-ranging investigations into paedophile politicians has been forced to quit, Exaro can reveal.

Detective chief inspector Paul Settle, head of the Metropolitan Police Service’s paedophile unit, has stepped aside after months of pressure over the direction of the investigations. According to one Met source, the DCI is formally off on sick leave.

The Met has also more than tripled the number of officers on the investigations, from seven to 22. The increased effort comes as its handling of the allegations faces close scrutiny from the overarching inquiry into child sex abuse (CSA), which was announced in July.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on November 02, 2014, 12:53:50 pm
So, I try to avoid reading the papers whenever possible.  As such, I'd like to know: has any newspaper reported on the relationship between Lord Leon Brittan and the Deputy Prime Minister?  Nick Clegg worked for him for quite a few years, and one wonders whether the Deputy PM has something to be concerned about.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on November 09, 2014, 09:22:05 am
Intelligence link made

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5398/ex-mi6-chief-named-as-sexual-abuser-of-boys-at-dolphin-square

Quote
One of the VIPs who sexually abused boys at an apartment complex near Parliament has been identified as a former deputy director of MI6.

The disclosure of his identity to Exaro by a key witness has also been provided to Scotland Yard for its new investigation into historical allegations that MPs and other prominent people carried out child sex abuse at Dolphin Square and elsewhere.

An abuse survivor, known as “Nick” to protect his identity, told Exaro: “He used to like to kiss and to touch, liked me to do that to him. But it would always culminate in being raped. That is what happened all the time. That was normal.”

Exaro can reveal today that this VIP identified by Nick as an abuser at Dolphin Square is Sir Peter Hayman, who was linked under parliamentary privilege in 1981 by Geoffrey Dickens, the late Conservative MP, to the Paedophile Information Exchange (PIE), which promoted sex with children.

Nothing was said in Parliament about Hayman’s role at the Secret Intelligence Service (SIS), better known as MI6, and Press reports at the time referred to him solely as a diplomat and as the UK’s former high commissioner to Canada.

Of course, it's still only an allegation at this stage.  But it's an allegation with a certain amount of weight to it, given Dickens' own use of Parliamentary privilege to name him.

And while there have been reasons to doubt Dickens' dossier at least in part, it is worth highlighting this story (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/10942103/MP-burgled-after-handing-paedophile-dossier-to-Leon-Brittan.html) from the Telegraph:

Quote
The home of an MP who compiled a dossier alleging paedophile activity within Westminster was burgled twice in suspicious circumstances around the time he took it to the authorities, his son has said.

Barry Dickens said nothing was taken in what appeared to be two ''very professional'' intrusions into his father Geoffrey's home in 1983, leading to suspicions they may have been related to his attempt to expose alleged abuse.

He told ITV News he found it ''confusing and slightly worrying'' that the case appeared not to have been fully investigated at the time and backed calls for a public inquiry to establish the truth of the claims gathered by the Conservative MP.

And he said he did not know what had happened to an apparent second copy of the dossier after the Home Office admitted one which it received for investigation at the time appeared to have been destroyed.

''My parents had two burglaries at the time close to it without anything being taken, which seemed a very professional job the way they were carried out, so again a bit of suspicion there but who knows,'' Mr Dickens – whose father died in 1995 – told the programme.

Needless to say, British intelligence have made extensive use of trained personnel in robbery since the 1930s.  The infamous/legendary Maxwell Knight was probably the best historical example we have - he organised the break-in and theft of the British Communist Party's membership list and other documents in the 1930s.

So, just putting that out there.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on November 16, 2014, 11:38:25 am
Shit just got serious.

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/5410/analysis-what-led-to-homicide-probe-by-operation-midland

Quote

I arranged a secret meeting with someone who was prepared to talk. It was in a London park in May. This man had information for me.

But nothing could prepare me for what he described, the darkest of ordeals.

Exaro journalists had since late 2012 been investigating allegations that MPs and other prominent people sexually abused boys over many years in a high-level network of paedophiles.

The contact wanted his identity kept confidential and tightly contained. We would later refer to him as “Nick” in a series of articles.

On the face of it, Nick’s account of his decade-long abuse – the trafficking, the brutal sexual and physical assaults, and the murders – and revelations about the status of the men defied belief.

Unlike many abuse survivors, Nick has gone on to have a successful life. He is intelligent, articulate and strong-minded. His accounts are uncomfortably detailed and consistent.

At that stage, Nick had no interest in talking to the police, the result of fear as well as previous failures to investigate high-profile paedophiles such as Jimmy Savile, the BBC star, and Sir Cyril Smith, the former Liberal MP.

But during our detailed discussions, Nick’s confidence soared. His counselling was crucial. But, he said, Exaro had also done something that abuse survivors value. We listened, and we investigated.

In July, Exaro together with the Sunday People published a report on alleged abuse at Dolphin Square, an apartment complex favoured by MPs near Parliament, based on the accounts of Nick and another survivor.

The report told a horrifying story of how two former Conservative MPs – including an ex-cabinet minister – and other VIPs sexually abused, even raped, Nick and other boys.

The detective in charge of ‘Operation Fairbank’, Scotland Yard’s wide-ranging investigation into allegations of child sex abuse by MPs and VIPs, contacted Exaro’s Editor-in-Chief, Mark Watts, to ask whether our two witnesses would talk to them.

I passed on the request. To my surprise and delight, Nick chose to come forward to talk to the police as a witness.

He agreed to meet the officer in charge of the operation and a second detective, but he insisted that I attend.

During this meeting in October, Nick handed over to police a list of his abusers, venues and other key information.

The Metropolitan Police Service’s paedophile unit duly launched ‘Operation Midland’, under the Fairbank umbrella, investigating child sex abuse at Dolphin Square and other locations.

And on Friday, the Met announced that Operation Midland was investigating “possible homicide”. We reveal today that police are investigating three murders, including an allegation that one boy was killed by a Conservative MP.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on November 16, 2014, 06:15:45 pm
Good lord.

I hope this goes somewhere, and isn't just hushed up in a business-as-usual way.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on November 16, 2014, 06:21:56 pm
It was on the front pages of a couple of papers this morning.  The Sunday People, which is urgh and tabloidish (though it is actually at least following the story) and some of the broadsheets.

Notable lack of interest from the Mail, Sun and Express, though I think the Mail has at least given front page coverage to this story in the recent past.

Tom Watson, the Labour MP, is also still strongly supporting the investigation and pushing the issue. 
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Demolition Squid on December 07, 2014, 05:37:09 am
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/dec/06/theresa-may-child-sexual-abuse-inquiry-panel-accused-victims-letters

Quote
Two members of Theresa May’s panel inquiring into child sex abuse are facing calls to resign after being accused of sending threatening or insulting emails to victims who had criticised the inquiry.

Lawyers for one abuse survivor have written to the home secretary to complain of a string of unsolicited communications, including an allegedly threatening email sent two days before an official meeting that both panellists and an abuse survivor were due to attend.

The victim, who is on medication for post-traumatic stress disorder, was left too anxious to attend the “listening meeting” in November.

So obviously, I am not a lawyer... but this seems like a fairly clear cut case of perverting the course of justice, doesn't it? These people should be put on trial and potentially face imprisonment. But I'm guessing that actually, they'll just resign from the panel - causing yet more delays as they hunt for replacements, and bringing the whole thing even further into disrepute.

Between this and the 'lost records', it is becoming more and more obvious that the main aim of these efforts is to cover up the embarrassing truth. It'd almost be comical, if it wasn't for the fact we're talking about organized and systematic child rape which may well still be going on today.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on December 07, 2014, 08:20:40 am
This whole thing has been incredibly revealing.  Just the inquiry mess, I mean.

It's tempting to put the whole thing down to Government omnishambles (which always get some blame but, IMO, is far worse with the current coalition than any previous government except maybe John Major) or attempts to undermine Teresa May's reputation to prevent a future leadership bid.

But given we're discussing, in effect, a conspiracy involving members of the political class...well, it does look pretty bad.

I'm not going to lie, the whole thing is pretty shocking.  I mean, Savile, I can sorta see.  Even individual MPs or high ranking civil servants having coverups in their wake.  But the Exaro and police investigations are making it pretty clear that the historic case is that of organised, systemic child abuse...and that it involved murder.  I mean, that's a staple of some of the darker conspiracy theory literature, and I will admit even I found that difficult to entertain, as a theory.  To discover there is likely some kind of credible basis to those rumours, and that there are definitive links to the intelligence services, MPs and someone in Buckingham Palace (Exaro is being remarkably tight-lipped about that...though I can understand why) is quite unpleasant.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: P3nT4gR4m on December 07, 2014, 12:31:31 pm
The whole "power corrupts" thing seems cliche'd and overstated but I can't help thinking there seems to come a point in these wankers lives where they realise they're untouchable and can even rape and murder little kids for a laugh. Just when I'm almost coming to terms with the notion that there may be some redeeming features in the notion of humans governing others, I'm reminded that, no, it's just too fucking dangerous.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on December 16, 2014, 10:58:39 am
From Dan Davies' biography on Jimmy Savile:

(http://i1178.photobucket.com/albums/x369/semperoccultus2/IPS01_zps4aed2b6b.jpg)
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Demolition Squid on December 16, 2014, 11:07:36 am
Well. That's disturbing.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on December 16, 2014, 11:16:07 am
It is.  Especially since Sonderkommando is a generic designation within the SS, and while Sonderkommando were indeed non-Germans (mostly Jews in fact) pressed into service in the concentration camps, SS-Sonderkommando were "special action groups" sent into the field for specific tasks, normally as auxilary support for other branches of the SS.  As such, membership of the latter makes one culpable for the SS's war crimes, while the former does not.

Also, most Sonderkommando were, of course, killed in the end.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Faust on December 16, 2014, 11:28:06 am
Wait, what?

He's confessing to ordering peoples executions here, why haven't I seen any mention of this before?
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Demolition Squid on December 16, 2014, 11:52:18 am
I found: http://www.theguardian.com/media/2014/jul/13/jimmy-savile-man-who-knew-him-best-dan-davies-in-plain-sight

Apparently it was published in July. Although the guy writing it worked on it for a decade and kept trying to draw attention to the fact Saville was some sort of monster - but until fairly recently, nobody was interested in hearing about it.

Every time I think I have a fairly good handle on how disturbing the world can be, it turns out there's new depths to sink to.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on December 16, 2014, 11:56:55 am
Wow. Just when you thought the creepy little fuck couldn't get any worse.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on December 16, 2014, 12:20:24 pm
Also, once you filter for their usual biases*, this RigInt thread (http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=35572) is full of very interesting information.  At the very least, in addition to the above picture:

- Barbara Bush was a big fan of Savile, and appeared to know him in a personal capacity
- Prince Charles also said he saw Savile as a "mentor"...in what, one dreads to think.  Also yet another reason for why the walking Constitutional Crisis that is Prince Charles should never be allowed to become King
- More on Savile's politics.  Seems he was less the doctrinaire neoliberal rightwinger, and more of a romanticist
-More investigation into the possibility that Savile's secret was not entirely unknown in entertainment circles.  In particular, there is an interesting video of him being interviewed by Ricky Gervais where the latter can barely hide his contempt for the man, and makes a couple of curious comments.
- Speculation regarding his links to the private security industry via the trustees of his charity (in particular "Sabrewatch") and the highly politically connected Coutts bank.
- information about organised pedophilia being covered up by Lambeth and Islington councils (and check out some of the names linked to those scandals!).
- information that Savile went to Moscow on holiday in the 1950s.
- Speculation over Savile's enigmatic remark that "I am the Myra Hindley story".
- video of Louis Theroux talking about his interviewing of Savile
- video interviews of Savile's driver were stolen from a data storage firm who work with Manchester police
- It seems at least three predatory pedophiles in addition to Savile had essentially unrestricted access to the Royal Family - Paul Kidd, the former MI6 ambassador guy, and Keith Harding.
- The intelligence services posted D-notices with the Observer and Guardian regarding specific allegations of child abuse in 1984
- information about Kincora and "Clockwork Orange"


The last, while not directly tied to Savile, interests me, as one theory I've been knocking around in regards to why there was a police and intelligence coverup touches on that.  Basically, the UK in the 1970s was a pretty politically volatile place.  You had the intelligence services playing games with government, an assortment of cranks and would-be militias springing up, intrigue and violence, economic malaise...the UK was looking very shaky.

Under those circumstances, finding out some rather high ranking members of government were into raping children may have been the trigger which could bring the whole thing spiralling out of control.  The thing about the security services, alluded to in that thread but also something I've noted from my own interactions with them and knowledge of them, is that they are typically status quo extremists.  Not necessarily to the government of the day, but to the existing power structure (which government is derived from).  As such, they can justify almost any act when it comes to defending the stability and viability of the British state.  Assassination, torture...and maybe covering up for child abusers?  It's not beyond the realm of possibility.

Of course, that doesn't explain everything, as it's a politically and chronologically bound explanation of a series of events that, clearly, go well beyond the 70s.  But it may well be an important part of the puzzle.

*for those who are not aware of RigInt, their usual biases are the role of the occult in parapolitics, suspicion about the potentially Lovecraftian nature of the universe and the links between those, fascism and organised pedophilia
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on December 16, 2014, 12:34:44 pm
(http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/8667/98v0.jpg)
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on December 16, 2014, 01:18:07 pm
Wait, what?

He's confessing to ordering peoples executions here, why haven't I seen any mention of this before?

At the time he said it?  Probably because they thought he was joking.  "Oh Savile, what a card.  You are hilarious, with your tracksuit and big talk".  Savile had that reputation, as a joker and teller of tall tales, and his public perception allowed him to get away with saying all kinds of disturbing things.  Like when he told a patient at a hospital he was visiting that they were lucky the nurse was there or he would be able to have his way with her (because she was physically disabled).  That's just Jimmy being Jimmy, innit?

After the allegations came to light....well, that's a very good question, isn't it?  There are so many potentially seedy aspects to the Savile story it's now almost impossible to keep track of who may be covering for him.  People close to the Royals, close to the Tory Party, the intelligence services, people in the entertainment industry....not to mention Savile did some quite serious work as a consultant and PR expert for some rather large businesses.  While the press apparently delight in making up ridiculous nonsense to publish about him (because who wouldn't want to emulate such a great media figure as Max Clifford), everyone's just a little bit wary about what might come out of such an investigation.

Which is also an interesting point.  Savile alleged, years ago, that just before his knighthood, the press were looking into his past, trying to figure out why he hadn't received any honours yet.  He said they found nothing because there was nothing to find....but we know that wasn't true.  Were the press really sniffing around his past?  If so, they either did a bloody awful job of it....or else they were persuaded to keep quiet.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Demolition Squid on January 02, 2015, 02:38:59 pm
Well, this is disturbing - IIRC, there was a witness who claimed a royal connection and said they had done away with others who knew about it, before mysteriously disappearing himself quite recently.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jan/02/prince-andrew-named-us-lawsuit-underage-sex-allegations

Quote
The new motion alleges that Epstein instructed the girl “to give the prince whatever he demanded” and also instructed her to “report back on the details of the sexual abuse”.

The woman’s lawyers allege in their motion that, in addition to facilitating her alleged encounters with the prince and Dershowitz, Epstein trafficked her to “many other powerful men, including numerous prominent American politicians, powerful business executives, foreign presidents, a well-known prime minister, and other world leaders”.

These are obviously allegations and not proven at this point - and the girl was 17 when it is alleged to have occurred (paedophilia in the USA, not in the UK). But one of the world's biggest investment bankers using young women as bribery to reach other major establishment figures seems very plausible. If true, it lends more credence to the idea of a coverup... but maybe an American court will be able to expose it where a British one wouldn't.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Hoopla on January 02, 2015, 10:32:09 pm
It's not all that different from that one aspect of MK-ULTRA... "Operation Midnight Climax", if memory serves.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: President Television on January 03, 2015, 04:40:20 am
It's not all that different from that one aspect of MK-ULTRA... "Operation Midnight Climax", if memory serves.

Considering the subject matter, that name is fucking horrifying.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on January 03, 2015, 10:27:58 am
It's not all that different from that one aspect of MK-ULTRA... "Operation Midnight Climax", if memory serves.

Yes.  Or, indeed, the case of Craig J. Spence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craig_J._Spence).

At the very least, we know Britain's former ambassador to Canada had those sort of...inclinations.  No doubt other ambassadors, diplomatic personnel, elected officials and political aides also do, if only as a matter of statistics.  Do we really think an intelligence agency as shady as the CIA would not stoop to underage prostitution, in the name of National Security?  Obviously, it could never ever be official policy....but for a group that has assassinated, tortured and overthrown governments, I don't see it as that big a leap, especially among the more extreme fringes of its membership.  Lets remember, after the "Halloween massacre", lots of "Agency" ops took place off the books, via former agents and front companies funded by private business ventures - like the Safari Club and World Anti-Communist League.

Getting blackmail information on a foreign dignitary or someone close to them would be a piece of cake.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on January 03, 2015, 11:17:35 am
Well, this is disturbing - IIRC, there was a witness who claimed a royal connection and said they had done away with others who knew about it, before mysteriously disappearing himself quite recently.

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/jan/02/prince-andrew-named-us-lawsuit-underage-sex-allegations

Quote
The new motion alleges that Epstein instructed the girl “to give the prince whatever he demanded” and also instructed her to “report back on the details of the sexual abuse”.

The woman’s lawyers allege in their motion that, in addition to facilitating her alleged encounters with the prince and Dershowitz, Epstein trafficked her to “many other powerful men, including numerous prominent American politicians, powerful business executives, foreign presidents, a well-known prime minister, and other world leaders”.

These are obviously allegations and not proven at this point - and the girl was 17 when it is alleged to have occurred (paedophilia in the USA, not in the UK). But one of the world's biggest investment bankers using young women as bribery to reach other major establishment figures seems very plausible. If true, it lends more credence to the idea of a coverup... but maybe an American court will be able to expose it where a British one wouldn't.

More interesting for me, in this account, is sudden introduction of Robert Maxwell and his daughter.

I'm not sure if most people my age, or outside the UK, are aware of this, but Maxwell was long considered an agent for Mossad (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Maxwell#Israeli_connection) (note: the Nick Davies mentioned is not the Guardian investigative journalist Nick Davies).  Ari Ben-Menashe isn't a 100% credible source, but he does seem to mostly know what he is talking about, and he has legitimate greivances with the state of Israel that suffice as motivation to spill the beans.

Now, it may not mean anything.  Probably doesn't.  It's just odd, that the daughter of a potentially very influential Israeli intelligence asset, who died in somewhat mysterious circumstances, should turn up under these circumstances.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on March 24, 2015, 06:31:10 pm
It's time for layer upon layer of irony

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEolSjlcqng

Dr Fox Arrested. For those too young or ignorant, the Brass Eye paedophile special was a masterwork. Go and watch it right now.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on March 24, 2015, 06:32:58 pm
In other news, I have suspicions that at least a couple of current MP's spend their weekends disguised as schools. It seems inevitable.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on March 24, 2015, 07:44:29 pm
It's time for layer upon layer of irony

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEolSjlcqng

Dr Fox Arrested. For those too young or ignorant, the Brass Eye paedophile special was a masterwork. Go and watch it right now.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who remembered his less than glorious appearance on Brass Eye.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on March 24, 2015, 07:48:18 pm
I've been using "There's no evidence but it is scientific fact" for years.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on June 19, 2015, 11:50:45 am
New edition of The Lobster (if you're only going to read one parapolitical journal, it should be this one) has an interesting article (http://www.lobster-magazine.co.uk/free/lobster70/lob70-child-abuse-network.pdf) by Tim Wilkinson on organised pedophilia and the Tory party.

Killer quotes:

Quote
Tebbit, asked whether there was a political cover-up of such matters, replied:

‘I think there may well have been. It was almost unconscious. It was the thing that people did.’ He explained:

‘At that time I think most people would have thought that the establishment, the system, was to be protected and if a few things had gone wrong here and there that it was more important to protect the system.’

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In 1995, Tim Fortescue, recalling his career as Conservative MP and whip, reported that a member of his party who faced ‘a scandal involving small boys’ would ask the party whips to help hush it up. As Fortescue put it, ‘we would do everything we can because.....if we could get a chap out of trouble then he will do as we ask forever more.’

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One example, whose case has been raised in Parliament to deafening silence, is Stuart Syvret. Syvret was a long-serving member of the government of the small island of Jersey, the independent ‘Peculiar of the Crown’ and playground for rich tax-dodgers. He attempted to publicise allegations of abuse and surrounding corruption. No libel proceedings were ever
brought. Instead Google closed down his blog at the request of the Jersey authorities and Syvret was prosecuted and imprisoned under a bizarre construal of Jersey’s data protection law. Another Jersey Senator was forced to resign when it was revealed that he had advised Syvret to commit suicide.

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For example, child protection officer Chris Fay, who attempted to take statements from children in connection with the exclusive Elm Guest House child brothel, reports that his house was shot at in his absence, and that he was threatened at gunpoint by officers of the Metropolitan Police Special Branch – a unit with national reach which liaises with the Security Service. Ten days after he raised the issue in the House, Tom Watson MP himself reported ‘warnings from people who should know that my personal safety is imperilled if I dig any deeper’.

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Simon Danczuk, one of the two Labour MPs who have been instrumental in bringing awareness of these matters out of the shadows, reports that the day before he was due to give evidence on the matter he was accosted by a Conservative MP who had never spoken to him before.

‘He warned me to think very carefully about what I was going to say the next day before the Home Affairs Select Committee when I’d be answering questions on child abuse. “I hear you’re about to challenge Lord Brittan about when he knew about child sex abuse,” he said. “It wouldn’t be a wise move”, he advised me. “It was all put to bed a long time ago.” He warned me I could even be responsible for his death. We looked at each other in silence for a second. I knew straight away he wasn’t telling me this out of concern for the man’s welfare. There was no compassion in his voice.’

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on June 24, 2015, 01:17:11 am
Well well well

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-33243782

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Lord Janner has been accused in Parliament of being a serial abuser who attacked children inside the Palace of Westminster.

Labour MP Simon Danczuk said police had told him they wanted to bring 22 historical charges against Lord Janner, dating between 1969 and 1988.

The director of public prosecutions (DPP) announced in April that he would not be charged because of his dementia, although that decision is under review.

The ex-MP denies any wrongdoing.

Lord Janner's family has said that the peer "is entirely innocent of any wrongdoing".

DPP Alison Saunders said Lord Janner's dementia was so severe that he could "play no part in a trial".

Police condemned the CPS decision as "wrong", and the Labour Party has suspended the 86-year-old peer.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Cain on August 05, 2015, 07:11:02 pm
This has taken an interesting turn.  I cant help but feel there is something off about this, however.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/aug/04/edward-heath-met-have-been-investigating-claims-for-several-months

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The child abuse controversy surrounding Sir Edward Heath grew on Tuesday as it emerged that at least five police forces have been running investigations into the late former prime minister.

Detectives in Wiltshire, London, Jersey, Kent and Hampshire have examined claims that the former Tory leader was a paedophile. But the Metropolitan police said that it had dismissed an allegation that he raped a 12-year-old boy.

As the breadth of police inquiries into Heath’s activities became apparent, a brothel-keeper was identified as the woman who triggered the latest in a series of controversies that have linked a high-profile establishment figure to alleged child abuse.

Myra Forde, 67, who has twice been jailed for operating a brothel in Salisbury, Wiltshire, where Heath lived after leaving office, is reported to have had a prosecution against her dropped after threatening to expose him as a paedophile.

The Independent Police Complaints Commission sparked a flurry of revelations when it revealed it was investigating claims made by a retired senior officer that Wiltshire police dropped the prosecution in the 1990s.

The former officer making the allegations of a coverup was a constable at the time, and rose to the rank of inspector or above.

Heath's sexuality was always up for debate, and the common opinion, even at the time he was PM, was that he was gay.

Why I find this a little unsettling is for two reasons: "everyone knew" Ted Heath was gay.  Notorious nutter David Icke has pointed the finger of blame at Ted Heath before, even going so far as to allege that Jimmy Saville "procured" boys for him.  And David Cameron warned against the investigations turning into a witch hunt against homosexuals a couple of years back.

Wouldn't it just be perfect if these allegations were later "proven" to be false?  David Icke's status as a hateful nutter is upheld (and he is a nutter, though he has hit uncomfortably close to the truth a couple of times with his comments....though again, any perusal of the more interesting political journals of the UK have made reference to some of these things before now), Cameron looks like a progressive visionary, and everyone feels bad for casting aspersions on a dead, former PM who just happened to be gay.

But who knows?  Maybe there is some truth to these latest allegations.  It could explain the extent of the coverup.  It just seems to fit a little too well...in my experience, people in government who end up doing the more illegal things are those peripherally close to the centre, but not so in the limelight.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on June 02, 2016, 01:38:16 pm
Bump.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36433568

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A former aide to Prime Minister David Cameron, Patrick Rock, has avoided a prison sentence after downloading indecent images of underage girls
The ex-deputy director of policy at Downing Street was given a two-year conditional discharge after being convicted of five charges.

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Although he will not serve time in prison, Judge Alistair McCreath said Rock's punishment was "the loss of your reputation and your very public humiliation".

What a fucking joke of a punishment.

Additionally, Cameron's advisers are even putting Blair's to shame now. That would be impressive if it wasn't so fucking horrific. At this rate I'm considering sticking a fiver on Peter Sutcliffe or Myra Hindley being one to Boris.

Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on November 28, 2016, 11:58:02 pm
It's still going on here, you know.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38134941
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Ex-youth football coach Barry Bennell, who is at the centre of a sex abuse scandal, has been taken to hospital after being found unconscious.
The convicted sex offender was found at an address in Knebworth Park, Stevenage on Friday, Thames Valley Police said.

Quote
Bennell was named last week by several former footballers who alleged they were abused as children.
Five police forces are now investigating claims of historical abuse.

Wider speculation is ongoing, but this looks like it might be quite big. There's been some notable equivalent examples in the US so I'm expecting to see more by the end of the year. FIFA is naturally being useless at handling it so that should bring some laughs. With any luck the way footballers are treated in this country this should get some decent traction and raises the chances of exposing some shady shit.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on December 01, 2016, 02:16:44 pm
Seriously, it's looking fucking grim:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38172940

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About 350 victims have reported child sexual abuse within UK football clubs, police chiefs say

I have never been happier to have had fuck all interest in football as a child or adult.

Expecting this to carry over into other sports, particularly cricket and rugby.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on December 02, 2016, 04:36:43 am
So incredibly gross and depressing. All these fucking institutions where perverts can go to molest kids.
Title: Re: Brit Spags! So Jim fixed it...
Post by: Junkenstein on December 08, 2016, 12:20:17 pm
Football accusations continuing to spiral, various figures being charged.

And now we have:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38240524

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More than 300 police officers have been accused of using their position to sexually exploit people, including victims of crime, a report has said.
Her Majesty's Inspectorate of Constabulary said abuse of authority for sexual gain was now the "most serious" form of corruption facing police in England and Wales.
The watchdog's figures were gathered over two years to the end of March.
The National Police Chiefs' Council described the problem as a "disease".

Quote
Other findings outlined in the report:
Fewer than half (48%) of the 436 reported allegations had been referred to the Independent Police Complaints Commission
There was an "apparent disconnect" between the numbers of alleged cases and any subsequent staff dismissals
Officers did not have a "sufficiently clear understanding" of boundaries around establishing or pursuing relationships with vulnerable people
Some counter-corruption units did not have the ability or capacity to seek information about potential cases
Almost half of forces inspected were unable to audit or monitor the use of all IT systems, which limited the ability to spot any staff accessing databases to identify vulnerable victims

So the IPCC is again less than worthless. What's particularly disturbing is the lack of ability to investigate themselves even when handed to counter-corruption. It's enough to make you think that those higher in the chain do not want them to have the ability to investigate this crap. That line about "failing to recognise vulnerable people" is fucking appalling too. I doubt this is through honest ignorance and much more likely to be a solid indicator of criminal intent/action.

If you didn't despise the UK police prior to this, you surely should now. Yes, yes, they do a difficult job. So do bank robbers but they don't fuck about with kids and get medals and overtime pay for the privilege.