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I'm reminded of the original jihad against 'serious discordians'. Hard to believe that discordians would take anything, let alone themselves, very seriously.

ITs not very discordian to take yourself seriously, but it is very discordian to debate. Disagreeing and argueing are very discordian things.

wow.

thanks for quoting that insipid little pamphlet to us as if it were dogma.

0/10

which quote? the mirror thing? I was just makin the point that No matter what you read you interperate it to mean what you already thought. I dont think anyone has been profoundly changed by the principia. We all are just using the PD back up ideas we already had. Thats what this arguement. is all about.

And the other quote I used is there because it sums up all of discordianism for me. Thats my favorite page of the PD. I dont think its dogma, I just agree with it and it seems to back up my point. I offered it up as a point, but not an irrefutable one

ya, Im disagreeing. I guess I interpreted the principia differently. The way I see it Discordians are more laid back, easy going, and good-natured. We should have sympathy and agreeability and love, those are all good qualities. you shouldnt be a complete jerkoff just so your "different" or whatever. Thats not accomplishing anything. I say if the principia has one overall message its not to be serious but to be funloving and light-hearted. Your making us sound like assholes and eris knows there are enough assholes in the world.

Plus, if ya really wanna change things, then youve gotta have some credibility amoungst people, and you instantly lose credibility with most if you lack sympathy, agreeability or love.

Im agreeing with seer here. Although Im not as into the spiritual aspect, I agree that the world is run by religious people who follow, strict, and completely insane dogmas that they will never deviate from. The USA is one step away from a theocracy. For every kid in my school that I make question their faith, or at the very least, see that atheists arent evil immoral people, thats one more point for our side and one less for the impending theocracy.

So, in short, lighten up. Dont be a jackass just becuase you dont want to go by the laws of what society tells you is appropiate conduct. Show some goddamn empathy for other people.

You missed the point.  The whole entire point.  The point is not to be laid-back, fun-loving, and to shoot rainbows out of your ass.  The point she is a Goddess of CHAOS and STRIFE.  You have both Constructive and Destructive Chaos.  Sure, sure, sure, that includes love and light, but don't try to limit it to love and light.  Experiance the whole fucking range of emotion.

And, fuck society.  Somehow I think some of the people remaining silent on this topic (Death to Poultry and She Who Eats Souls come to mind) would agree, at least on some level.  Both of them, while nice and polite when appropriate will still tell you to go KYSNFTB (or better yet, let someone else do it) if you step out of line.  It's just a bit harder to get them to say it.  

If you really want to change things, you're going to stand up and make a riot.  Not sit on your ass agreeing that "yes, something needs to be done"  or, "ohh, I feel so sorry for those thousands of kids that DIE OF STARVATION every day, but I want to buy a new CD so they can starve."  That's called being a fat-shit.  If you think anything is going to change through agreeability and sympathy, you've got your head screwed on the wrong way.

Love is certainly an important component to changing something, but not the kind you mean.  It's a tough love, that is dedication not a, "I love everybody" while tripping on mushrooms or whatever spiritual nonsense is getting you through the day.  A labour of love requires commitment and sacrifice.  Not empty words about what is wrong or right in the world.

[/quote]

Well I think this PD quote sums up this whole arguement "This book is a mirror"
But I will continue to argue my point:
I dont belive in a literal eris. I doubt you do either. Shes may be the godess of Chaos and Strife, but thats irrelavant, she just represents one end of the spectrum, the eristic side. But as the five fingered hand, the hodge podge, and the little creation/destruction chart all depict: Eristic values are not the only thing neccesary. The PD expects that you already know alll about the Aneristic side of things, becuase thats what the entire rest of the world is. Its introducing you to the other side of the coin: eris, so you can realize that both sides are equal and reject the destructive parts of each. I quote the PD "But to choose the creative over the destructive is an all-creative trip composed of both order and disorder." just check out page 00063, its all right there.
So see, no destructive parts are neccecary. all creative.

Some of you may know of the movie "Rumor has it..." with jennifer aniston, if not the trailer can be seen here: http://www.apple.com/trailers/wb/rumor_has_it/

Now, this movie is a blantant attempt at taking The Graduate (one of the most brilliant movies ever) and making a money-making, jennifer aniston, romantic comedy. The Graduate should not have a sequel. period. Especially not one this shitty looking. Listen to Kevin kostner's lines in that commercial, he is so goddamn different from the originial character. This movie will ruin the Graduate for everybody. I am going to boycott this movie, thats right Im going to boycott it. Everyone go out to blockbuster and rent The Graduate and then refuse to watch Rumor Has it...
to say Im pissed off about this movie would be understating it. Im pissed at the entire movie industry for letting this come out. So my fellow discordians, dont let this happen, boycott Rumor Has It!

It is also considered (by me) a discordian virtue to disagree.

You're all doing great!

I agree.

If Im not mistaken, discordianism isnt just about embracing disorder is it? ITs all about realizing that both order and disorder are neccecary components of the world and both will always exist. I mean isnt that what the Chao is? or when it talks about the eristic and aneristic illusions, it specifically says that both are illusions. Discordianism is about embracing creativity, both orderly creativity and disorderly creativity, over destruction of any kind. Ill qutoe the principia at length:

" To choose order over disorder, or disorder over order, is to accept a trip composed of both the creative and the destructive. But to choose the creative over the destructive is an all-creative trip composed of both order and disorder.
 The Curse of Greyface included the division of life into order/disorder as the essential positive/negative polarity, instead of building a game foundation with creative/destructive as the essential positive/negative. He has thereby caused man to endure the destructive aspects of order and has prevented man from effectively participating in the creative uses of disorder. Civilization reflects this unfortunate division.
 POEE proclaims that the other division is preferable, and we work toward the proposition that creative disorder, like creative order, is possible and desirable; and that destructive order, like destructive disorder, is unnecessary and undesirable."

That page alone was what made me go and read the rest of the PD and to me its still the best simple summary of the philisophy discordianism around.
You guys seem to be missing this fact, that discordians are not trying to destroy, we are trying to create. This is how I interperate the PD and you guys seem to be going the other way with it.

I hate arguing. It makes me sad and gets me nowhere.

I prefer to skip fighting and just ax murder my problems in the face right away. Much more rewarding.

I love argueing. I have a debating addiction, and that gets you in as much trouble as a gambling addiction but its a million times more fun.

but I think weve debated this topic down to the point where weve made every point and no ones gonna change their minds. So I, personally will agree to disagree and cool down for a while.

1. seer covered that with the happy anarchy quote.

2. Ghandi, Martin Luther King, Darwin, Copernicus. All these people incited huge amounts of change without a single gun. Thats the kind of revolution I want to be part of.

3. No, discordianism joins the club when it starts saying its members should act a certain way and that they should try and force other people to think like them.

4.Well I guess you and I differ here. Cuase I think 99% of people are good deepdown, just misguided by society and standards.

1.  Apples and oranges.

2.  You are, of course, aware of what happened to these people?

3.  Where did anyone say that?  The OP was expressing HIS view of Discordianism, not commanding you to behave in a certain way.  

4.  Um...they CREATED and ARE the fucking society and its standards.  Just saying.

TGRR,
Is just saying.

1. ok then, we agree to disagree.

2. yea, but I bet you a trillion dollars, if they were brought back to life and  had the choice of either undoing their revolution, and surviving longer, or doing things exactly like they did. They would pick the second choice.

3. ok... well you win this section

4. Thats what that remaining 1% is for. More realisticly its probably a higher number, but there are a small percent of people running the show a huge amount of sheep, and then theres us. The guys running things are generally not good, and they just have alot of influence over the sheep-types.

ya, Im disagreeing. I guess I interpreted the principia differently. The way I see it Discordians are more laid back, easy going, and good-natured. We should have sympathy and agreeability and love, those are all good qualities. you shouldnt be a complete jerkoff just so your "different" or whatever. Thats not accomplishing anything. I say if the principia has one overall message its not to be serious but to be funloving and light-hearted.  Your making us sound like assholes and eris knows there are enough assholes in the world.

Plus, if ya really wanna change things, then youve gotta have some credibility amoungst people, and you instantly lose credibility with most if you lack sympathy, agreeability or love.

Im agreeing with seer here. Although Im not as into the spiritual aspect, I agree that the world is run by religious people who follow, strict, and completely insane dogmas that they will never deviate from. The USA is one step away from a theocracy. For every kid in my school that I make question their faith, or at the very least, see that atheists arent evil immoral people, thats one more point for our side and one less for the impending theocracy.

So, in short, lighten up. Dont be a jackass just becuase you dont want to go by the laws of what society tells you is appropiate conduct. Show some goddamn empathy for other people.

1.  Where was anything like that implied in the PD?

2.  No, usually you just need the most guns.  History is on my side on this one, I think.

3.  And the moment Discordianism becomes "spiritual", it will join the club.

4.  What if I LIKE being a jackass?  What if I think the average jerk is as deserving of my empathy as the average Guinea worm is?  Being a jackass because society tells you not to is Pink, but being a jackass because  that's your nature isn't, necessarily.  For example, I really hate people.  Should I show empathy?  Really?  Because the emotions I show aren't going to involve fluffy white clouds and pink monkeys, you know.  More likely, I'll POOMP my hatred all over the place...and I think everyone around here has had quite enough of THAT.  99.99999% of people are swine...my lack of empathy is all that is keeping me off of a watertower.

1. seer covered that with the happy anarchy quote.

2. Ghandi, Martin Luther King, Darwin, Copernicus. All these people incited huge amounts of change without a single gun. Thats the kind of revolution I want to be part of.

3. No, discordianism joins the club when it starts saying its members should act a certain way and that they should try and force other people to think like them.

4.Well I guess you and I differ here. Cuase I think 99% of people are good deepdown, just misguided by society and standards.

ya, Im disagreeing. I guess I interpreted the principia differently. The way I see it Discordians are more laid back, easy going, and good-natured. We should have sympathy and agreeability and love, those are all good qualities. you shouldnt be a complete jerkoff just so your "different" or whatever. Thats not accomplishing anything. I say if the principia has one overall message its not to be serious but to be funloving and light-hearted.  Your making us sound like assholes and eris knows there are enough assholes in the world.

Plus, if ya really wanna change things, then youve gotta have some credibility amoungst people, and you instantly lose credibility with most if you lack sympathy, agreeability or love.

Im agreeing with seer here. Although Im not as into the spiritual aspect, I agree that the world is run by religious people who follow, strict, and completely insane dogmas that they will never deviate from. The USA is one step away from a theocracy. For every kid in my school that I make question their faith, or at the very least, see that atheists arent evil immoral people, thats one more point for our side and one less for the impending theocracy.

So, in short, lighten up. Dont be a jackass just becuase you dont want to go by the laws of what society tells you is appropiate conduct. Show some goddamn empathy for other people.

1. oh man... thats alot of sermons

2. oh common, how can you be against jon stewart? he is to politics like you are to religion.

(Or I could just pimp my own stuff: http://poee.co.uk/boards/viewforum.php?f=15 )

Any chance, you could condense those 15 or so sermons into a concise little summary paragraph for those of us who can only read right now during the commercial breaks during jon stewart?

Oh, we've got monsters, all right...but they look just like us.

worse... they are us!

after reading some subgenius stuff (mostly the Wikipedia entry) I still think I prefer Discordianism. Eris is way sexier.

but, uhm just to get back to this: Is that bob thing something completely different from discordianism? are they written by the same guy or something? From what Ive seen I think I prefer Eris to Bob, personally.