from a BIP reader

[Forteetu]

Take it, leave it, whatever ,Ķ some thoughts from one reader of the BIP.

I guess more than anything else, it seemed ,Äúpreachy,Äù. Serious and dark observations, opinions and arguments that all seemed to be directed AT the reader and most of time delivered from what felt like the top of a soap box. At times the message was along the lines of ,Äúyou,Äôre on your own pal, wise up and see the prison you,Äôre in,Äù or become and suffer the consequences of being a part of the MACHINE. Fair enough and although stark and bleak, the over-all metaphor of the prison is well developed. When the message turns to one of ,Äúwise up or we,Äôre coming to get you,Äù, this just seems to close to the fire and brimstone preaching, again just felt like I was being berated from a pulpit at times.

My personal opinion would be that as a ,Äúrevisit to Discordia,Äù it misses the mark on the serious/humorous element that (I feel) is central to Discordianism. What has drawn me to Discordianism as a ,Äúdefault reality grid,Äù is the laugh. It is a fun way to view the universe we live in. The original PD says to the reader, ,Äúcome and view the world this way, suspend your disbelief and have a laugh with me,Äù. The BIP creates a rather stark reality grid for the reader and any real laughs are had at the reader,Äôs expense. While this may be the intent, it,Äôs not an effective method for getting people to buy-in.

What I saw as I was reading it was the basis for a kind of journal, a prison journal written and left behind to be discovered by the next inmate. The journal is told in first person and builds the reality grid of BIP as our anonymous journal author learns his ropes around the prison he found himself in. Stories and anecdotes relate key learnings and discoveries about the nature of the prison and its inhabitants with other characters portraying certain archetypes or personality classes for interaction lessons. The jail authority being the ,ÄúMachine,Äù, while appearing all encompassing it actually represents the twisted, corrupt failings of the endeavors of man and conformity. The affects of disinformation could be relayed in the interactions of prison inmates and guards. While not mythical in any sense, a pantheon or host of characters could be useful in delivering material. All this leads up to the eventual awakening and escape of the journal author, leaving behind a guide for the next hapless prisoner.

Anyway, just my thoughts ,Ķ

Congrats over-all on getting a group of Discordians together to get anything done.

BTW, favorite line of the text is page 18 ,Ķ ,ÄúTherefore we exist because something is a lying cheating bastard.,Äù Love this concept and was the one decent laugh in the whole text. Not only is this a decent chuckle, but as the ,Äúsomething,Äù is very easily linked to the eastern philosophy of the ,Äúillusion of separation,Äù, it,Äôs a metaphysically correct statement as well. 

[East Coast Hustle]

fair enough assessment. I think it's not so much that we left the humor out as it is that a majority of hte people that collaborate on this project have REALLY dark senses of humor.

[Richter]

I'd agree with Tits on this, as I've had a similar perspective on the BIP.  I won't say I've read everything there is to offer, (working on it), but it does carry with it a sense of urgency that turns me off to allot of philosophical tracts (Although some def. need to hear it.).

I still consider it valuable and interesting work, and plan to pitch in my own views when the solidify to coherency.

[AFK]

To be clear:  The BIP was never meant to be a stand-alone work.  There were two other projects planned to follow, one of which would have been an attempt to infuse some more modern humor into the material.  "Lollercaust" it would've been called.  There was also another that would've delved more into the occult type stuff.  Unfortunately, as it has been mentioned many times by many of us, we don't get paid to do this stuff.  And so the requisite pot of community time and effort was rather empty. 

Yeah it's dark, yeah it's preachy.  That's how a lot of us felt at that time.  We all started writing and this was what came out.  Again, more was to follow but we just couldn't get into the proper modes to churn it out. 

I think it would still be nice to get a "Lollercaust" type thing done but it seems like we're in a dry spell right now.  Perhaps as summer turns to fall the creative juices will start flowing.  And hopefully, the new blood can throw down as well. 

[The Good Reverend Roger]

To be clear:  The BIP was never meant to be a stand-alone work.

Naw.  But if you ram it into "top billing", it makes it look that way.

[AFK]

I have to say I agree.  Especially considering how pre-conditioned people are to read from top to bottom.

"Okay, so I've come to PrincipiaDiscordia.com now I'm going to try these forums out.  ???  What's this BIP thing?" 

I understand the sentiment.  Getting new blood into the thing, but I think perhaps it's more appropriate to move it back down and have the established posters guide the new blood.  I just think it may be confusing for n00bs and they're likely to skip it anyway. 

Just my thoughts, take them for what they're worth. 

I also think that if we go off on any othe substantial courses of thought (i.e. Shrapnel, Ripples, etc.) we may want to retitle the sub-forum. 

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I have to say I agree.  Especially considering how pre-conditioned people are to read from top to bottom.

"Okay, so I've come to PrincipiaDiscordia.com now I'm going to try these forums out.  ???  What's this BIP thing?" 

I understand the sentiment.  Getting new blood into the thing, but I think perhaps it's more appropriate to move it back down and have the established posters guide the new blood. 

Well, that's because you hate America,Ñ¢ and love terrorists.

We should just rename the whole forum BIP, and erase everything else, as was earlier threatened.

Then we'd be REALLY REAL Discordians, because WE'D have a BIP, and those losers over on Myspace wouldn't.

[AFK]

I'm gonna name my new cat Bippy the WunderBip. 

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I'm gonna name my new cat Bippy the WunderBip. 

I'm gonna ask our local board of corrections to rename all of the state prisons BIPs.

[Cain]

Since the BIP was only one part of a much larger trend, and this has been an area more for new ideas than anything else, a name change may be in order.  Something linked to Neophilia, perhaps?

[Cain]

Also, I really need to remove that new reply crap while on wireless.  I spent 7 minutes trying to post my above reply.

[AFK]

sounds good to me.  I think we need to get away from BIP for awhile.  It's kind of like were those parents who refuse to remodel their son's room.  The son who has since gone on to college and is now running his own IT business. 

[Triple Zero]

the common thing between the topics discussed in this subforum seems to be that they're all in a way connected to reality grids, how they are formed and how they can be dissected.

a name change is a good idea, because even though the subforum is called BIP, only the old threads are really about the BIP anymore, and the rest is mostly busy searching for something new to explore.

but a name like "neophilic reality grid development studies" is probably something you'd rather find at the bottom of the forumlist anyway

[The Good Reverend Roger]

the common thing between the topics discussed in this subforum seems to be that they're all in a way connected to reality grids, how they are formed and how they can be dissected.

a name change is a good idea, because even though the subforum is called BIP, only the old threads are really about the BIP anymore, and the rest is mostly busy searching for something new to explore.

but a name like "neophilic reality grid development studies" is probably something you'd rather find at the bottom of the forumlist anyway

How about we call it "ITT, WE TAKE OURSELVES ALL SERIOUSLY!"?

[Triple Zero]

yeah let's call the subform "Serious Discordianism"

instant WINNAR