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Non-Locality

Started by Bu🤠ns, September 12, 2009, 09:23:46 PM

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The Good Reverend Roger

#45
September 15, 2009, 11:49:49 PM
Quote from: Enki v. 2.0 on September 15, 2009, 02:08:08 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on September 14, 2009, 08:51:25 PM
Quote from: Enki v. 2.0 on September 14, 2009, 08:50:29 PM
In before wavicles?

In before collapse.

So my posting in the thread is not fatal to a waveform?

We haven't yet reached an eigenstate?

There are no Eigenstates, from this moment forward.  The universe WILL fucking PICK a result, and it will STICK WITH IT.

You fuckers hear me?  Quantum mechanics is now OVER.  :crankey:
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Kai

#46
September 16, 2009, 01:15:20 AM
Quote from: LMNO on September 14, 2009, 04:55:06 PM
Are we talking about non-locality, or Heisenberg?  Choose one.

Sorry, got carried away in trying to understand wave/particle form, and how to visualize a photon.
If there is magic on this planet, it is contained in water. --Loren Eisley, The Immense Journey

Her Royal Majesty's Chief of Insect Genitalia Dissection
Grand Visser of the Six Legged Class
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Mesozoic Mister Nigel

#47
September 16, 2009, 01:29:57 AM

I'm a little operator, short and stout
here is my eigenfunction,
here is my eigenvalue.
"I'm guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk," Charles Wick said. "It was very complicated."

LMNO

#48
September 16, 2009, 02:42:59 AM
Quote from: Kai on September 16, 2009, 01:15:20 AM
Quote from: LMNO on September 14, 2009, 04:55:06 PM
Are we talking about non-locality, or Heisenberg?  Choose one.

Sorry, got carried away in trying to understand wave/particle form, and how to visualize a photon.

remember the bit with the rope and the colored filters?

That.

Kai

#49
September 16, 2009, 02:50:08 AM
Quote from: LMNO on September 16, 2009, 02:42:59 AM
Quote from: Kai on September 16, 2009, 01:15:20 AM
Quote from: LMNO on September 14, 2009, 04:55:06 PM
Are we talking about non-locality, or Heisenberg?  Choose one.

Sorry, got carried away in trying to understand wave/particle form, and how to visualize a photon.

remember the bit with the rope and the colored filters?

That.

Thats really nice for some parts of it, but it doesn't help me understand how photons interact with, say, the double slit experiment.

Thinking of a photon as this probability cloud of energy is much more helpful.

and by understand, I mean I can see the cause/effect connections. And not just be able to say a rote statement about it.
If there is magic on this planet, it is contained in water. --Loren Eisley, The Immense Journey

Her Royal Majesty's Chief of Insect Genitalia Dissection
Grand Visser of the Six Legged Class
Chanticleer of the Holometabola Clade Church, Diptera Parish

Telarus

#50
September 16, 2009, 04:41:07 AM
So, let's introduce some further brain-hurt to this discussion:

Creating a Quantum Superposition of Living Things
http://science.slashdot.org/story/09/09/11/1457200/Creating-a-Quantum-Superposition-of-Living-Things

They want to put a virus into a state of superposition......

"They point out that after creating the superposition, scientists will be able to perform the Schrodinger's Cat experiment for the first time, which should be fun (but less so for the virus)"

:asplode:
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Golden Applesauce

#51
September 16, 2009, 05:28:38 AM
Quote from: Telarus on September 16, 2009, 04:41:07 AM
So, let's introduce some further brain-hurt to this discussion:

Creating a Quantum Superposition of Living Things
http://science.slashdot.org/story/09/09/11/1457200/Creating-a-Quantum-Superposition-of-Living-Things

They want to put a virus into a state of superposition......

"They point out that after creating the superposition, scientists will be able to perform the Schrodinger's Cat experiment for the first time, which should be fun (but less so for the virus)"

:asplode:

I'm just curious how they're going to cool complex proteins and D/RNA down to a ground state without breaking any of it.  And I don't really see what this would accomplish - the Shrodinger's Cat paradox is a thought experiment, not something that actually tests anything.  Running it wouldn't result in new knowledge, although simply creating and observing large objects in superposition might.
Q: How regularly do you hire 8th graders?
A: We have hired a number of FORMER 8th graders.

The Good Reverend Roger

#52
September 16, 2009, 04:50:01 PM
The cat is dead.  DEAD.

TGRR,
Added a little something to the experiment, just to end this assfuckery.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Triple Zero

#53
September 16, 2009, 07:17:53 PM
But Schrödingers cat was named Elvis.
Ex-Soviet Bloc Sexual Attack Swede of Tomorrow™
e-prime disclaimer: let it seem fairly unclear I understand the apparent subjectivity of the above statements. maybe.

INFORMATION SO POWERFUL, YOU ACTUALLY NEED LESS.

The Good Reverend Roger

#54
September 16, 2009, 09:41:15 PM
Quote from: Triple Zero on September 16, 2009, 07:17:53 PM
But Schrödingers cat was named Elvis.

So make blue suede shoes out of him.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

ñͤͣ̄ͦ̌̑͗͊͛͂͗ ̸̨̨̣̺̼̣̜͙͈͕̮̊̈́̈͂͛̽͊ͭ̓͆ͅé ̰̓̓́ͯ́́͞

#55
September 19, 2009, 11:32:47 AM
Quote from: Burns on September 13, 2009, 04:48:51 AM
Quote from: Ne+@uNGr0+ on September 13, 2009, 02:30:34 AM


So you're saying there's a Hidden Variable or what?

No, that's just Einstein playing the blues because Hidden Variables lack Evidence.

P E R   A S P E R A   A D   A S T R A

PeregrineBF

#56
September 20, 2009, 02:28:29 AM
You cannot observe anything in a superposition. This should be obvious.

Igor

#57
September 20, 2009, 02:56:04 PM
That's assuming that the act of observation causes the destruction of the superposition. Not everyone believes that. For example, Roger Penrose says it happens under the influence of gravity, when an object becomes larger than a certain characteristic size.

Quote
If a dust speck is in two locations at the same time, each one should create its own distortions in space-time, yielding two superposed gravitational fields. According to Penrose's theory, it takes energy to sustain these dual fields. The stability of a system depends on the amount of energy involved: The higher the energy required to sustain a system, the less stable it is. Over time, an unstable system tends to settle back to its simplest, lowest energy state—in this case, one object in one location producing one gravitational field. If Penrose is right, gravity yanks objects back into a single location, without any need to invoke observers or parallel universes.

Taken from this article: http://timfolger.net/penrose.PDF
Be what you would seem to be - or, if you'd like it put more simply - never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise.

The Good Reverend Roger

#58
September 20, 2009, 05:00:37 PM
Quote from: Igor on September 20, 2009, 02:56:04 PM
That's assuming that the act of observation causes the destruction of the superposition. Not everyone believes that. For example, Roger Penrose says it happens under the influence of gravity, when an object becomes larger than a certain characteristic size.

Quote
If a dust speck is in two locations at the same time, each one should create its own distortions in space-time, yielding two superposed gravitational fields. According to Penrose's theory, it takes energy to sustain these dual fields. The stability of a system depends on the amount of energy involved: The higher the energy required to sustain a system, the less stable it is. Over time, an unstable system tends to settle back to its simplest, lowest energy state—in this case, one object in one location producing one gravitational field. If Penrose is right, gravity yanks objects back into a single location, without any need to invoke observers or parallel universes.

Taken from this article: http://timfolger.net/penrose.PDF

My cousin is a total tit about these things, though.
" It's just that Depeche Mode were a bunch of optimistic loveburgers."
- TGRR, shaming himself forever, 7/8/2017

"Billy, when I say that ethics is our number one priority and safety is also our number one priority, you should take that to mean exactly what I said. Also quality. That's our number one priority as well. Don't look at me that way, you're in the corporate world now and this is how it works."
- TGRR, raising the bar at work.

Igor

#59
September 20, 2009, 05:10:18 PM
 :eek: You're related?
Be what you would seem to be - or, if you'd like it put more simply - never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise.
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