White Student Union forms at Georgia State

[Nephew Twiddleton]

Also this:

"We want a homeland where we are a majority," he said. "We have a government of traitors... White people who express a desire for a homeland are labeled as haters." He ended his speech to applause: "Think of secession...Think of hometowns. We have to build them ourselves... Survival is the first law. We have no choice but to keep fighting."

Guess it sucks if you're a non-whitey where Jared wants to play Aryan Washington.  Because nothing says "a strong nation-state that's well-defended but at peace with the world" like ethnic cleansing.

I always figure folks like this should go back to Europe.

Because Europe doesn't have any brown people? 

No, cause Europe has actual homelands that racist shits can be nostalgic about in a way that makes any sense.   proclaiming part of the US, which is all stolen land settled by people who have become mixed race anyway, as a homeland for some sort of pure white race doesn't make sense to anyone but the sort of jackasses who think they need a white student union.

Europe is also mostly stolen and settled by people who have become mixed race, depending on how far back you go. Except maybe Iceland, I think they're still pretty pure/uninvaded.

This. You don't even have to go back that far.

Twid,
thinking about World War II

[East Coast Hustle]

I often wonder, when people attempt to derail something like this with (incorrect) nit-picky quibbles, why they would attempt to do so.

Either they're channelling Enki, or they have an agenda.

That's just my opinion, of course.

Kinda having similar thoughts.

Some people are just big on accurate communication and like to make sure terms are clarified if they are unsure of the manner in which that term is being used.

I could turn right back around and say that people who are super-quick to jump to conclusions about what's in someone else's head based on a few sentences and try to cast them in a certain light based on those assumptions must have an agenda. Frankly, it's kind of ugly when people do that and it certainly doesn't encourage honest and open communication about a subject when one participant makes it known that if you ask the wrong questions or say the wrong things you will be immediately assumed to be some sort of BADWRONG. So maybe we can knock it off with the ugly insinuations for no reason and just get back to the meat of the discussion?

[East Coast Hustle]

Pergamos, can you define the word "minority" as used in this conversation?

group that is less than half of the total.

So whites are in fact a minority of the students of Georgia State, being only 38% of the student body.  Meanwhile as a percentage of American Citizens whites will remain the majority for a few more decades.

Well, then.

Let's say you have 3 subgroups:

Whites at 38%
Blacks at 30%
Hispanics at 28%
Asians at 4%

Who is the majority?

There isn't one.  There's 3 sizeable minorities and a tiny minority (and apparently no middle easterners at all)

OMG did you read anything at all that other people posted about the meaning of "minority"? Because now you're using your own made-up definition that no one else uses, except racists who don't understand the term and try to use it to mean "less than 50%". Good lord.

Jesus tittyfucking Christ. you ARE aware that not everyone here is a sociology student and that "less than 50%" is the commonly accepted colloquial definition of the word "minority", right?

Because this business of implying that someone is a racist because they don't understand how you're using a term is really fucked up.

[East Coast Hustle]

"Minority" technically means "less than half" in places like Congress. But even then, it isn't really referring to numbers, it's referring to power. The "Minority Party" is the party that doesn't get to to call the shots. So while the etymological history of the word "minority" might come from a definition of numbers, its usage and just about every context it is used in today refers to being at the mercy of another group: whether that other group is larger per se, or just more powerful.

In terms of race, "minority" means -- let's face it -- non-white. Not necessarily because there are MORE whites, but because it is the whites who call the shots. How is this hard to understand?

If you want to talk about political power in a democracy, it's disingenuous to talk about percentages of the whole population anyway. The whole population isn't where political power is exercised. If you want to get a better idea of who is a minority and who isn't, look at the legislative, judicial, and executive offices that are in charge. And if you look there, I'll bet you will always find that whites comprise a much larger majority than their respective percentage of the general population.

Thank you for that explanation that didn't involve calling anyone who didn't already know this a racist.

[Cardinal Pizza Deliverance.]

Jesus tittyfucking Christ. you ARE aware that not everyone here is a sociology student and that "less than 50%" is the commonly accepted colloquial definition of the word "minority", right?

I was actually unaware of this so I appreciate the clarification. I guess that got glossed over or I was absent that day.

[Left]

So maybe we can knock it off with the ugly insinuations for no reason and just get back to the meat of the discussion?

Damn Carnivore!

JUST KIDDING!

...I just think that a lot of whites are not aware of the stuff they do not have to put up with because they are white.
http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/09/study-black-man-and-white-felon-same-chances-for-hire/

The results of these studies were startling. Among those with no criminal record, white applicants were more than twice as likely to receive a callback relative to equally qualified black applicants. Even more troubling, whites with a felony conviction fared just as well, if not better, than a black applicant with a clean background.
Racial disparities have been documented in many contexts, but here, comparing the two job applicants side by side, we are confronted with a troubling reality: Being black in America today is just about the same as having a felony conviction in terms of one's chances of finding a job.

The above is not the first time this type of study has been done.
http://www.chicagobooth.edu/capideas/spring03/racialbias.html

That's one, but there's a number of others.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Pergamos, can you define the word "minority" as used in this conversation?

group that is less than half of the total.

So whites are in fact a minority of the students of Georgia State, being only 38% of the student body.  Meanwhile as a percentage of American Citizens whites will remain the majority for a few more decades.

Well, then.

Let's say you have 3 subgroups:

Whites at 38%
Blacks at 30%
Hispanics at 28%
Asians at 4%

Who is the majority?

There isn't one.  There's 3 sizeable minorities and a tiny minority (and apparently no middle easterners at all)

OMG did you read anything at all that other people posted about the meaning of "minority"? Because now you're using your own made-up definition that no one else uses, except racists who don't understand the term and try to use it to mean "less than 50%". Good lord.

Jesus tittyfucking Christ. you ARE aware that not everyone here is a sociology student and that "less than 50%" is the commonly accepted colloquial definition of the word "minority", right?

Because this business of implying that someone is a racist because they don't understand how you're using a term is really fucked up.

Did you not read THE WHOLE REST OF THE THREAD where everybody patiently tried to explain about 20 times, including links, the ACTUAL AND CORRECT DEFINITION OF MINORITY IN A SOCIAL CONTEXT?

And frankly, I've met maybe four people IN MY LIFE who did not know that definition. Maybe I'm a special snowflake, but in my experience the only people who try to use the straight-up population definition when they're talking about political issues (like organizing for representation, eg. forming a student union) are Right Wingers whining about white rights.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Try reading the posts from OLDEST to NEWEST so that you have a sense of the chronological order in which explanations were given before I started to suspect that Pergamos has some kind of latent racist bullshit going on in his head.

[tyrannosaurus vex]

Try reading the posts from OLDEST to NEWEST so that you have a sense of the chronological order in which explanations were given before I started to suspect that Pergamos has some kind of latent racist bullshit going on in his head.

I'm not convinced that "latent racist" tendencies should be met with the same level of disgust and vitriol that outright racism warrants. Isn't there a qualitative difference between "I tend to think a certain way because that is how I have been conditioned" and "I think a certain way despite mountains of plain evidence"? After all, Pergamos at worst is displaying oversimplified thinking in terms of race, I haven't seen any kind of superiority talk and in fact he has made it pretty clear he's anti-racism, even if his thinking is contaminated with latent racism.

Isn't it a little extreme to throw him to the wolves at this point as if he's some kind of unabashed Klansman? If the default reaction to people spouting things they haven't quite worked out yet is going to be fire and brimstone like it's a crime to start a journey you haven't finished yet, then what's the point in saying anything at all?

[Doktor Howl]

What gets me is that the numerical definition of majority, while accurate in one sense, is used to attempt to downplay the power the sociological majority enjoys...Whether the person arguing the point is doing so consciously or not.

There's really no other reason to dig heels in and argue definitions in this sort of thing.

[tyrannosaurus vex]

What gets me is that the numerical definition of majority, while accurate in one sense, is used to attempt to downplay the power the sociological majority enjoys...Whether the person arguing the point is doing so consciously or not.

There's really no other reason to dig heels in and argue definitions in this sort of thing.

That's the truth, but I think "whether the person arguing the point is doing so consciously or not" deserves more attention.

Latent racism is another word for Privilege, right? It is unjust and unfair and tragic, but none of that injustice exists as far as the privileged person is concerned. It isn't that they don't care, exactly, it's that they don't see it. Privilege is a condition -- not a disease, not a natural state, but a condition that comes along with being born into a world that immediately begins programming children. Privileged people are not "evil" for simply failing to naturally recognize, transcend, and reject that privilege any more than a kid born in the Amazon is "evil" for not naturally growing up to speak Dutch all by himself. So coming at privileged people from a position of "hey fuck you for not seeing your blind spots" is ridiculous at best. Not that it's bad to show people the things they're missing -- but being angry and disrespectful by default (not that this is the case specifically here) isn't going to be very productive.

[Doktor Howl]

Latent racism is another word for Privilege, right?

That's kind of where I was heading.

It is unjust and unfair and tragic, but none of that injustice exists as far as the privileged person is concerned. It isn't that they don't care, exactly, it's that they don't see it. Privilege is a condition -- not a disease, not a natural state, but a condition that comes along with being born into a world that immediately begins programming children. Privileged people are not "evil" for simply failing to naturally recognize, transcend, and reject that privilege any more than a kid born in the Amazon is "evil" for not naturally growing up to speak Dutch all by himself. So coming at privileged people from a position of "hey fuck you for not seeing your blind spots" is ridiculous at best. Not that it's bad to show people the things they're missing -- but being angry and disrespectful by default (not that this is the case specifically here) isn't going to be very productive.

This is why I haven't offered him a white sheet and hood. 

[tyrannosaurus vex]

Latent racism is another word for Privilege, right?

That's kind of where I was heading.

It is unjust and unfair and tragic, but none of that injustice exists as far as the privileged person is concerned. It isn't that they don't care, exactly, it's that they don't see it. Privilege is a condition -- not a disease, not a natural state, but a condition that comes along with being born into a world that immediately begins programming children. Privileged people are not "evil" for simply failing to naturally recognize, transcend, and reject that privilege any more than a kid born in the Amazon is "evil" for not naturally growing up to speak Dutch all by himself. So coming at privileged people from a position of "hey fuck you for not seeing your blind spots" is ridiculous at best. Not that it's bad to show people the things they're missing -- but being angry and disrespectful by default (not that this is the case specifically here) isn't going to be very productive.

This is why I haven't offered him a white sheet and hood. 

HA! Actually, offering the time-honored and official garments of the racist elite to a latent racist might be a useful way to bring their attention to the ways they are behaving. I imagine setting up a clothesline outside this White Students' Union and hanging a bunch of Klan ponchos from it would send a fun message.

[Doktor Howl]

Latent racism is another word for Privilege, right?

That's kind of where I was heading.

It is unjust and unfair and tragic, but none of that injustice exists as far as the privileged person is concerned. It isn't that they don't care, exactly, it's that they don't see it. Privilege is a condition -- not a disease, not a natural state, but a condition that comes along with being born into a world that immediately begins programming children. Privileged people are not "evil" for simply failing to naturally recognize, transcend, and reject that privilege any more than a kid born in the Amazon is "evil" for not naturally growing up to speak Dutch all by himself. So coming at privileged people from a position of "hey fuck you for not seeing your blind spots" is ridiculous at best. Not that it's bad to show people the things they're missing -- but being angry and disrespectful by default (not that this is the case specifically here) isn't going to be very productive.

This is why I haven't offered him a white sheet and hood. 

HA! Actually, offering the time-honored and official garments of the racist elite to a latent racist might be a useful way to bring their attention to the ways they are behaving. I imagine setting up a clothesline outside this White Students' Union and hanging a bunch of Klan ponchos from it would send a fun message.

The difference here is that the people in the articles are overt racists, and wouldn't care.

[East Coast Hustle]

Latent racism is another word for Privilege, right?

That's kind of where I was heading.

It is unjust and unfair and tragic, but none of that injustice exists as far as the privileged person is concerned. It isn't that they don't care, exactly, it's that they don't see it. Privilege is a condition -- not a disease, not a natural state, but a condition that comes along with being born into a world that immediately begins programming children. Privileged people are not "evil" for simply failing to naturally recognize, transcend, and reject that privilege any more than a kid born in the Amazon is "evil" for not naturally growing up to speak Dutch all by himself. So coming at privileged people from a position of "hey fuck you for not seeing your blind spots" is ridiculous at best. Not that it's bad to show people the things they're missing -- but being angry and disrespectful by default (not that this is the case specifically here) isn't going to be very productive.

This is why I haven't offered him a white sheet and hood. 

No, but you did suspect him of "having an agenda" in a context that made it pretty clear what you were getting at.