Author Topic: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...  (Read 3769 times)

Jasper

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #15 on: November 21, 2009, 09:14:08 am »
Talk about spin.  People see a guy being more accepting of other religions and acting with a bit of perspective and integrity, and suddenly the story is that Obama hates christianity.
He's accepting of religions?

Why does he hate atheists?

He is accepting of religions therefore he hates atheists?

Don't follow.

Freeky

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #16 on: November 22, 2009, 03:36:04 am »
Talk about spin.  People see a guy being more accepting of other religions and acting with a bit of perspective and integrity, and suddenly the story is that Obama hates christianity.
He's accepting of religions?

Why does he hate atheists?


Atheism is a belief system, by not believing in gods based on no evidence whatsoever.
If someone does the ďFine, youíre right, Iím clearly a terrible person, Iím Satan, Iím the worst person alive, I should just dieĒ thing in response to criticism of their harmful behavior, they are trying to manipulate people and flip the situation around so that they look like a victim.

As a neuroscientist I have to disagree with the perception that anyone is doing mathematical modeling of cognitive intelligence, yet; intelligence as an economist defines it, yes, but economists are worlds away from actual cognition.


Although it is outside the purview of this organization to offer personal advice, we can say -- without assuming any liability -- that previous experience indicates (and recent market studies corroborate) that given the present condition of the marketplace, continuing with your present course of action is likely to result in substantial in

Jasper

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #17 on: November 22, 2009, 04:19:18 am »
Not sure how much progress can be made arguing whether atheism is a belief system, but for what it's worth I don't treat my lack of faith as a belief system in itself.

Freeky

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #18 on: November 22, 2009, 04:43:37 am »
Not sure how much progress can be made arguing whether atheism is a belief system, but for what it's worth I don't treat my lack of faith as a belief system in itself.
Well, it's just a way I view it, and for some it's possibly more applicable to some than others, but if one believes in no god, then they have a belief, right?

And some athiests, or at least I hear of them from other people, are just as firm on there being no god at all as many christians believe there is a god. Faith, in my opinion, doesn't really come into play. I mean, I don't believe in God, (and if someone were to present evidence to the contrary, I would accept that, but stil lwouldn't go with that religion on principal, but that's just me) but I have a few ideas that I think might eventually be some kind of equivalent to a faith.

If someone does the ďFine, youíre right, Iím clearly a terrible person, Iím Satan, Iím the worst person alive, I should just dieĒ thing in response to criticism of their harmful behavior, they are trying to manipulate people and flip the situation around so that they look like a victim.

As a neuroscientist I have to disagree with the perception that anyone is doing mathematical modeling of cognitive intelligence, yet; intelligence as an economist defines it, yes, but economists are worlds away from actual cognition.


Although it is outside the purview of this organization to offer personal advice, we can say -- without assuming any liability -- that previous experience indicates (and recent market studies corroborate) that given the present condition of the marketplace, continuing with your present course of action is likely to result in substantial in

Jasper

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #19 on: November 22, 2009, 04:56:46 am »
Depends on whether you're an agnostic or gnostic atheist.  In other words, whether you're saying you know god exists, or you're saying you don't know, but won't assume so.  Given the difficulty of proving it either way, I generally think act like an agnostic atheist.  The key is that I think and act, as opposed to believe.

I can't say whether nonbelief as a belief is a semantic argument, an epistemological problem, or what.  However I do know that the whole discussion should probably map back in some meaningful way to how Obama's secularization of the "winter holiday" means he is spurning Christianity.

The Johnny

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #20 on: November 22, 2009, 04:58:46 am »
Believing God exists and believing God doesnt exist are both based on belief.

Each is a side of a coin named "belief", either affirmation or negation.

I "play my cards" as if one didnt exist, so im close to what would be called an agnostic that acts like an atheist.

The Johnny

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #21 on: November 22, 2009, 05:04:43 am »
On that note, fuck christmas. Its all about Cola Claus and his consumerist sledge anyway.

Freeky

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #22 on: November 22, 2009, 05:09:37 am »
Depends on whether you're an agnostic or gnostic atheist.  In other words, whether you're saying you know god exists, or you're saying you don't know, but won't assume so.  Given the difficulty of proving it either way, I generally think act like an agnostic atheist.  The key is that I think and act, as opposed to believe.

I can't say whether nonbelief as a belief is a semantic argument, an epistemological problem, or what.  However I do know that the whole discussion should probably map back in some meaningful way to how Obama's secularization of the "winter holiday" means he is spurning Christianity.

It's not about Christianity anymore, it's about being Politcally Correct. After all, the country isn't exactly majorly christian anymore, (And yes, jonnhyx, it is about the moneys now), and the president is just trying to be totally fair about it. Which he's getting flac for, but he would probably get that anyway, just because.
If someone does the ďFine, youíre right, Iím clearly a terrible person, Iím Satan, Iím the worst person alive, I should just dieĒ thing in response to criticism of their harmful behavior, they are trying to manipulate people and flip the situation around so that they look like a victim.

As a neuroscientist I have to disagree with the perception that anyone is doing mathematical modeling of cognitive intelligence, yet; intelligence as an economist defines it, yes, but economists are worlds away from actual cognition.


Although it is outside the purview of this organization to offer personal advice, we can say -- without assuming any liability -- that previous experience indicates (and recent market studies corroborate) that given the present condition of the marketplace, continuing with your present course of action is likely to result in substantial in

Jasper

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #23 on: November 22, 2009, 05:11:55 am »
People would find something to freak out about regardless, so why bother listening to those people?

Freeky

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #24 on: November 22, 2009, 05:12:59 am »
Exactly.
If someone does the ďFine, youíre right, Iím clearly a terrible person, Iím Satan, Iím the worst person alive, I should just dieĒ thing in response to criticism of their harmful behavior, they are trying to manipulate people and flip the situation around so that they look like a victim.

As a neuroscientist I have to disagree with the perception that anyone is doing mathematical modeling of cognitive intelligence, yet; intelligence as an economist defines it, yes, but economists are worlds away from actual cognition.


Although it is outside the purview of this organization to offer personal advice, we can say -- without assuming any liability -- that previous experience indicates (and recent market studies corroborate) that given the present condition of the marketplace, continuing with your present course of action is likely to result in substantial in

fomenter

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #25 on: November 22, 2009, 05:14:01 am »
calling atheism a "belief" or a "belief no different than a religions belief" is mostly just a fun way to screw with certain types of loudmouth asshole atheists, most sensible atheists admit agnosticism, the fun to mess with ones adamantly believe there is no god
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Jasper

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #26 on: November 22, 2009, 05:15:00 am »
Yeah, but if I had to choose absolutely one or the other, I'd go full on gnostic atheist.

Dysnomia

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #27 on: November 22, 2009, 08:02:23 am »
SUU how about you shoot back with "HEY ASSHOLES!  NOT EVERYONE IN THIS CUNTRY IS CHRISTIAN, GET OVER IT!  OH AND ALL THOSE HOLIDAY TRADITIONS?  MOSTLY BORROWED FROM OTHER RELIGIONS!  THE END!"
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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #28 on: November 22, 2009, 01:56:14 pm »
Depends on whether you're an agnostic or gnostic atheist.  In other words, whether you're saying you know god exists, or you're saying you don't know, but won't assume so.  Given the difficulty of proving it either way, I generally think act like an agnostic atheist.  The key is that I think and act, as opposed to believe.

I can't say whether nonbelief as a belief is a semantic argument, an epistemological problem, or what.  However I do know that the whole discussion should probably map back in some meaningful way to how Obama's secularization of the "winter holiday" means he is spurning Christianity.

It's not about Christianity anymore, it's about being Politcally Correct. After all, the country isn't exactly majorly christian anymore, (And yes, jonnhyx, it is about the moneys now), and the president is just trying to be totally fair about it. Which he's getting flac for, but he would probably get that anyway, just because.



Freeky, the US is MASSIVELY Xtian. It's the
denominations that keep shifting.

Cain

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Re: I think my relatives are trying to get a rise out of me for Christmas...
« Reply #29 on: November 22, 2009, 02:14:31 pm »
In fact, the US has religious belief levels more in common with certain theocracies than most other industrial democracies.  I have no doubt if it wasn't for inter-Christian factionalism, it probably would be a theocracy by now, or at very least a theocratic constitutional republic a la Iran.