The Great Work

[Bu🤠ns]

I hear both of you loud and clear.

I don't mean 'must' in the sense of obligation or expectation. That's what I was touching upon when i said that the Great Work is nothing that you /should/ do.  That will kill spontaneity quicker than hell. It's why when there's a rut or lag in some collaboration, chances are it's because it has become that way. I mean 'must' in the sense that when the feeling comes through you-- you just HAVE to get it out.  When that unique drive comes through to do what you must.

Example: I MUST put googly eyes on damn near everything -- it's about what drives you.

[Kai]

/quote]

I THOUGHT it was one of you spags spagging up my campus with googly eyes! 

[Richter]

I've always had a love / hate relationship with "achievement", as in the Murals vs. Doodles metaphor.

Sure, the guy who makes the mural is putting up a big piece that a lot of people will see.  Hopefully, it's good, and inspires / amuses / makes life a little nicer to look at for a lot of people.  Hopefully it gets the artist some combination of exposure, fame, and money.  Is it worth any more than the guy who keeps a notebook or two full of doodles, (which might be better), and never seeks to do anything else with his work?

Personal opinion; they're equal on a couple levels.  Both people have created things, and gotten things inside their head OUT.  There's always fun in the creative process, and (again, hopefully) our mural artist is not so caught up in the commercial aspects that it's a chore for him.  Special conditions and situations aside, both folks created.  Judging which is better, or over which timeframe sucess is judged (Ex: HP Lovecraft, or anyone else unknown in their own time.), is a really subjective thing, that can develop into monkey - style chest thumping dick shaking.

Like one of the great noble truths in Buddhism, "Life is pain.".  How MUCH pain, or how they got it gets subjective and irrelevant.  Everyone hurts, everyone gets scarred, everyone calibrates that to their own pain experience.  Same thing with any creative process, I think.  Doesn't matter who is getting what reward, product, or recognition out of it, as long as they are doing what they do.     

(I could be crass and commercial, making my millions tortuing myself with wharf rats up the ass, and sellign the videos.  I have no desire to engage in wharf - rat insertion, though, and will not see refinement or development of wharf rat insertion as a worthy goal.  It jsut doesn't strike me as fun, so I don't do it.  )

(Granted, everyone has their price.  Still, no matter how much it makes me, I wouldn't ENJOY it, and would be doing a disservice to the greater art of W.R.I.  You reading this may have noticed similar performers in hopefully different videos.)

(Fucking Ratfuckers.)

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I have no interest in fame or fortune, beyond being well-known enough to sell my work for enough to pay the bills. However, I do feel compelled to have an effect on people, to change their lives in some way. I guess that's going pretty well.

I'm at an interesting plateau in my life, where I have quite literally achieved everything I've worked for, and now I need to finish up a few things and find more stuff to work for. I don't know what that stuff will be, yet, so I'm kind of just taking a breather. I feel strongly that whatever it is I end up doing, the next phase of my life will be a collaborative one. Up until now I have been almost fiercely solitary in my endeavors.

[Kai]

I've always had a love / hate relationship with "achievement", as in the Murals vs. Doodles metaphor.

Sure, the guy who makes the mural is putting up a big piece that a lot of people will see.  Hopefully, it's good, and inspires / amuses / makes life a little nicer to look at for a lot of people.  Hopefully it gets the artist some combination of exposure, fame, and money.  Is it worth any more than the guy who keeps a notebook or two full of doodles, (which might be better), and never seeks to do anything else with his work?

Personal opinion; they're equal on a couple levels.  Both people have created things, and gotten things inside their head OUT.  There's always fun in the creative process, and (again, hopefully) our mural artist is not so caught up in the commercial aspects that it's a chore for him.  Special conditions and situations aside, both folks created.  Judging which is better, or over which timeframe sucess is judged (Ex: HP Lovecraft, or anyone else unknown in their own time.), is a really subjective thing, that can develop into monkey - style chest thumping dick shaking.

Like one of the great noble truths in Buddhism, "Life is pain.".  How MUCH pain, or how they got it gets subjective and irrelevant.  Everyone hurts, everyone gets scarred, everyone calibrates that to their own pain experience.  Same thing with any creative process, I think.  Doesn't matter who is getting what reward, product, or recognition out of it, as long as they are doing what they do.     

Yes!, especially to the bolded part.

[ñͤͣ̄ͦ̌̑͗͊͛͂͗ ̸̨̨̣̺̼̣̜͙͈͕̮̊̈́̈͂͛̽͊ͭ̓͆ͅé ̰̓̓́ͯ́́͞]

I don't mean 'must' in the sense of obligation or expectation. That's what I was touching upon when i said that the Great Work is nothing that you /should/ do.  That will kill spontaneity quicker than hell. It's why when there's a rut or lag in some collaboration, chances are it's because it has become that way. I mean 'must' in the sense that when the feeling comes through you-- you just HAVE to get it out.  When that unique drive comes through to do what you must.

Like when you've hit the point of no return, and you're going to have an orgasm no matter what?

[Bu🤠ns]

I have no interest in fame or fortune, beyond being well-known enough to sell my work for enough to pay the bills. However, I do feel compelled to have an effect on people, to change their lives in some way. I guess that's going pretty well.

I'm at an interesting plateau in my life, where I have quite literally achieved everything I've worked for, and now I need to finish up a few things and find more stuff to work for. I don't know what that stuff will be, yet, so I'm kind of just taking a breather. I feel strongly that whatever it is I end up doing, the next phase of my life will be a collaborative one. Up until now I have been almost fiercely solitary in my endeavors.

And the collaboration just 'feels right', right?  like you sort of somehow 'know' that's what you've got to do.

[Bu🤠ns]

I've always had a love / hate relationship with "achievement", as in the Murals vs. Doodles metaphor.

Sure, the guy who makes the mural is putting up a big piece that a lot of people will see.  Hopefully, it's good, and inspires / amuses / makes life a little nicer to look at for a lot of people.  Hopefully it gets the artist some combination of exposure, fame, and money.  Is it worth any more than the guy who keeps a notebook or two full of doodles, (which might be better), and never seeks to do anything else with his work?

Personal opinion; they're equal on a couple levels.  Both people have created things, and gotten things inside their head OUT.  There's always fun in the creative process, and (again, hopefully) our mural artist is not so caught up in the commercial aspects that it's a chore for him.  Special conditions and situations aside, both folks created.  Judging which is better, or over which timeframe sucess is judged (Ex: HP Lovecraft, or anyone else unknown in their own time.), is a really subjective thing, that can develop into monkey - style chest thumping dick shaking.

Like one of the great noble truths in Buddhism, "Life is pain.".  How MUCH pain, or how they got it gets subjective and irrelevant.  Everyone hurts, everyone gets scarred, everyone calibrates that to their own pain experience.  Same thing with any creative process, I think.  Doesn't matter who is getting what reward, product, or recognition out of it, as long as they are doing what they do.     

Yes!, especially to the bolded part.

Spot on.  Primarily the first sentence...that's what i'm looking for. Getting it OUT---making it known.  I think also, in a lot of ways, touches on creating specifically for an audience vs. creating for yourself (which may or may not have a target audience).  It reminds me of something alan moore said...i vaguely recall mentioning this before.  "It is not the job of the artist to give the audience what they want. If the audience knew what they want, they wouldn't be the audience, they'd be the artist.  It's the artist job to give the audience what they need." 

Or something to that effect.

Something Dok mentioned regarding stickering something:  7/10 people won't give a shit.  2/10 will think it's stupid. But then there's that one person whose affected in such a way that he will get angry or frusterated (or what have you) and have no idea why. 

That seems to me to be the artist giving the audience what he or she needs.

[Bu🤠ns]

I don't mean 'must' in the sense of obligation or expectation. That's what I was touching upon when i said that the Great Work is nothing that you /should/ do.  That will kill spontaneity quicker than hell. It's why when there's a rut or lag in some collaboration, chances are it's because it has become that way. I mean 'must' in the sense that when the feeling comes through you-- you just HAVE to get it out.  When that unique drive comes through to do what you must.

Like when you've hit the point of no return, and you're going to have an orgasm no matter what?

Shaky metaphor, but I'll humor you. 

It's like seeing a fine piece of ass that's so nice that you yourself: I would  risk Aids and pregnancy just to tap that once.

Or not, it's quite possible that I'm the only one who things these sorts of things. But the drive in general, I think, isn't /quite/ so different.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I have no interest in fame or fortune, beyond being well-known enough to sell my work for enough to pay the bills. However, I do feel compelled to have an effect on people, to change their lives in some way. I guess that's going pretty well.

I'm at an interesting plateau in my life, where I have quite literally achieved everything I've worked for, and now I need to finish up a few things and find more stuff to work for. I don't know what that stuff will be, yet, so I'm kind of just taking a breather. I feel strongly that whatever it is I end up doing, the next phase of my life will be a collaborative one. Up until now I have been almost fiercely solitary in my endeavors.

And the collaboration just 'feels right', right?  like you sort of somehow 'know' that's what you've got to do.

Yes; like knowing to push after you pass transition.

[Bu🤠ns]

I have no interest in fame or fortune, beyond being well-known enough to sell my work for enough to pay the bills. However, I do feel compelled to have an effect on people, to change their lives in some way. I guess that's going pretty well.

I'm at an interesting plateau in my life, where I have quite literally achieved everything I've worked for, and now I need to finish up a few things and find more stuff to work for. I don't know what that stuff will be, yet, so I'm kind of just taking a breather. I feel strongly that whatever it is I end up doing, the next phase of my life will be a collaborative one. Up until now I have been almost fiercely solitary in my endeavors.

And the collaboration just 'feels right', right?  like you sort of somehow 'know' that's what you've got to do.

Yes; like knowing to push after you pass transition.

IOW, know when to hold 'em and know when to fold 'em.

[Bu🤠ns]

You know I quite enjoyed hearing about what drives your creative impulses.

Today I considered Andrew Goldsworthy in a new light.

I was having a headache today due to awful allergy symptoms.  All I wanted to do was fart around online, play some trivia and go to sleep.  The last thing I had in my mind was doing serious scrubbing and vacuuming and dry hands etc... but it was one of those 'right thing to do' situations so i dragged my lazy ass out of bed.

Sweeping, I began to compare how what I was doing with what he was doing.  He basically uses nature and creates beautiful patterns and shapes with the found objects like rocks, mud, sticks, icicles and so on. [YouTube Link]

It always seems so peaceful, serene...exactly what I always feel like I'm lacking in life on occasion. Then it occurs to me that my scrubbing and vacuuming and dry hands etc... is doing exactly the same thing he's doing.

So tonight, i ended up having a fucking blast. 


When we were sitting on the patio The Dok said your facial expression DICTATES you mood. And I do believe there was a very serious emphasis on the DICTATES.

Daruko mentioned a Hunter S. Thompson quote saying something to the effect of :You can get away with anything if you're good at what you do. It was better stated but at the moment I can't recall how.

The point of view sort of makes everything going  on  into an artform...and why the hell not, ya know?

And i figure this way, the only way they can stop me from having fun now, is by putting a bullet in my brain. 

[P3nT4gR4m]

From the moment they wake they devote themselves to the perfection of whatever they pursue.

I've always loved this notion. Wiping your arse can be art if you approach it in the right frame of mind.

[Juvenal]

Wiping your arse can be art if you approach it in the right frame of mind.

  This was sooo the right thing to read upon first waking up this morning.

[Bu🤠ns]

From the moment they wake they devote themselves to the perfection of whatever they pursue.

I've always loved this notion. Wiping your arse can be art if you approach it in the right frame of mind.

Perfect.

Wiping your arse can be art if you approach it in the right frame of mind.

  This was sooo the right thing to read upon first waking up this morning.

OH HAI