There's a word for that.

[Epimetheus]

Agreed, Nigel.


On a similar subject...
I've noticed that when there's not a word for something, it tends to mean general lack of awareness that that concept/experience is common. This means a lot of "You do that too?!" moments between people, and a lot of laughs for stand-up comics who talk about the little quirks we all have but aren't often talked about.

You know what I find interesting? If you lose a spouse, you're called a widow or a widower. If you're a child and you lose your parents, then you're an orphan. But what's the word to describe a parent who loses a child?  I guess that's just too fucking awful to even have a name.

So, yeah, not that nobody understands that parents who lose a child exist, just something nobody really wants to think about enough to pin a word on it.

I think that particular example is explained more by the fact that (historical) cultural norms dictate that women and children are weaker and therefore can be defined by a thing that has traumatized them, whereas men/parents (the "stronger" in both relationships) can rise above such happenings.

Women and men both lose children.

I was saying that in the parent-child relationship the parents are the stronger, so there'd be a word for orphan but not for bereaved parents. That said, I have now been shown to be wrong about that and about the spouse words, so I concede that point.

[hooplala]

Word.

I think sometimes it's not that people can't conceptualize the idea, more than its that they don't want to give it a name because it seems to legitimize it in some manner.  I have nothing to back that up, mind you, just an uneducated hunch on my part.

It reminds me of a speech from Six Feet Under, which touches on this idea and I suppose informed my "hunch" above in a sense, since it was an idea I had never really thought about:

You know what I find interesting? If you lose a spouse, you're called a widow or a widower. If you're a child and you lose your parents, then you're an orphan. But what's the word to describe a parent who loses a child?  I guess that's just too fucking awful to even have a name.

So, yeah, not that nobody understands that parents who lose a child exist, just something nobody really wants to think about enough to pin a word on it.

The word in English is bereft, in Hebrew shakhol. The English word has come to primarily refer to other types of loss over time, as being bereaved of children has become less common.

Really?  My dictionary says the english word "bereave" comes from the Old English and originally meant to be deprived of something in general.  I have no idea about the Hebrew word though.

However if you are right, good to know.

http://dictionary.reference.com/etymology/bereft

Just as "widow" and "orphan" have other uses, it also means to be deprived in general, but it is the word for a parent who has lost their young, although that context is no longer primary.

Ahh, ok.  Whoopsie.

This opens the door for another peeve of mine, though, which is when people say "There is no such" instead of "I don't know of".

I don't remember saying "there is no such", or do you mean in general?

[LMNO]

This opens the door for another peeve of mine, though, which is when people say "There is no such" instead of "I don't know of".

I've always thought this was a good indication of an Erisian mind.

[Adios]

I am afraid I don't understand. 

[BabylonHoruv]

English has no direct translation for "chismosa", but we understand the concept.

In the king James Bible it was translated "Witch" as in "Thou Shalt not suffer a witch to live"

[Whatever]

English has no direct translation for "chismosa", but we understand the concept.

In the king James Bible it was translated "Witch" as in "Thou Shalt not suffer a witch to live"

Doesn't stop it from sounding like some fruity drink that has rum or some such in it.

[Cain]

I am afraid I don't understand. 

Only because your language does not have a word for this kind of thread.

[Phox]

I am afraid I don't understand. 

Only because your language does not have a word for this kind of thread.

Mine does: Mittens.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Word.

I think sometimes it's not that people can't conceptualize the idea, more than its that they don't want to give it a name because it seems to legitimize it in some manner.  I have nothing to back that up, mind you, just an uneducated hunch on my part.

It reminds me of a speech from Six Feet Under, which touches on this idea and I suppose informed my "hunch" above in a sense, since it was an idea I had never really thought about:

You know what I find interesting? If you lose a spouse, you're called a widow or a widower. If you're a child and you lose your parents, then you're an orphan. But what's the word to describe a parent who loses a child?  I guess that's just too fucking awful to even have a name.

So, yeah, not that nobody understands that parents who lose a child exist, just something nobody really wants to think about enough to pin a word on it.

The word in English is bereft, in Hebrew shakhol. The English word has come to primarily refer to other types of loss over time, as being bereaved of children has become less common.

Really?  My dictionary says the english word "bereave" comes from the Old English and originally meant to be deprived of something in general.  I have no idea about the Hebrew word though.

However if you are right, good to know.

http://dictionary.reference.com/etymology/bereft

Just as "widow" and "orphan" have other uses, it also means to be deprived in general, but it is the word for a parent who has lost their young, although that context is no longer primary.

Ahh, ok.  Whoopsie.

This opens the door for another peeve of mine, though, which is when people say "There is no such" instead of "I don't know of".

I don't remember saying "there is no such", or do you mean in general?

I mean in general... really more referring to the Six Feet Under quote, which doesn't make that statement verbatim, but which implies it with the statement "I guess that's just too fucking awful to even have a name".

It seems very common for people to state that something doesn't exist because they have never heard of it, without doing research to find out whether it exists. In my opinion, most people would be better off if they started with the assumption that it might exist, but that they don't know about it, especially with language. Even a very fluent, educated native English speaker has a vocabulary of only 20,000-30,000 English words, but not counting specialized scientific vocabulary, English has over 500,000 words.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I am afraid I don't understand. 

Only because your language does not have a word for this kind of thread.

[hooplala]

Word.

I think sometimes it's not that people can't conceptualize the idea, more than its that they don't want to give it a name because it seems to legitimize it in some manner.  I have nothing to back that up, mind you, just an uneducated hunch on my part.

It reminds me of a speech from Six Feet Under, which touches on this idea and I suppose informed my "hunch" above in a sense, since it was an idea I had never really thought about:

You know what I find interesting? If you lose a spouse, you're called a widow or a widower. If you're a child and you lose your parents, then you're an orphan. But what's the word to describe a parent who loses a child?  I guess that's just too fucking awful to even have a name.

So, yeah, not that nobody understands that parents who lose a child exist, just something nobody really wants to think about enough to pin a word on it.

The word in English is bereft, in Hebrew shakhol. The English word has come to primarily refer to other types of loss over time, as being bereaved of children has become less common.

Really?  My dictionary says the english word "bereave" comes from the Old English and originally meant to be deprived of something in general.  I have no idea about the Hebrew word though.

However if you are right, good to know.

http://dictionary.reference.com/etymology/bereft

Just as "widow" and "orphan" have other uses, it also means to be deprived in general, but it is the word for a parent who has lost their young, although that context is no longer primary.

Ahh, ok.  Whoopsie.

This opens the door for another peeve of mine, though, which is when people say "There is no such" instead of "I don't know of".

I don't remember saying "there is no such", or do you mean in general?

I mean in general... really more referring to the Six Feet Under quote, which doesn't make that statement verbatim, but which implies it with the statement "I guess that's just too fucking awful to even have a name".

It seems very common for people to state that something doesn't exist because they have never heard of it, without doing research to find out whether it exists. In my opinion, most people would be better off if they started with the assumption that it might exist, but that they don't know about it, especially with language. Even a very fluent, educated native English speaker has a vocabulary of only 20,000-30,000 English words, but not counting specialized scientific vocabulary, English has over 500,000 words.

Excellent point.

[East Coast Hustle]

This concept also surfaces in another way, such as when you hear people say things (typically of middle eastern countries) like "do you know they don't have a word for freedom/citizen/vote/etc?"

This has always annoyed me greatly.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

This opens the door for another peeve of mine, though, which is when people say "There is no such" instead of "I don't know of".

I've always thought this was a good indication of an Erisian mind.

And I think it's creeping e-prime.

I can name several things that don't exist.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

This concept also surfaces in another way, such as when you hear people say things (typically of middle eastern countries) like "do you know they don't have a word for freedom/citizen/vote/etc?"

This has always annoyed me greatly.

"As I understand it, the Russians don't even have a word for freedom."
- Ronald Reagan, 1983, apparently having missed the word "svoboda" ("freedom").

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

This concept also surfaces in another way, such as when you hear people say things (typically of middle eastern countries) like "do you know they don't have a word for freedom/citizen/vote/etc?"

This has always annoyed me greatly.

Oh my god, yeah. It's really annoying.

THEM'S MUST NOT BE REAL PEOPLE THEN.
                  /