OS loyalty = Religion

[Cain]

With a few simple steps, most net-savvy individuals can easily proof a Windows machine against adware, spyware and general infection.  It's not ideal, but since it is an accepted fact Windows will be more heavily targeted (see: P3nt's post) there will be more software and support out there to prevent and deal with the outcome of this.

On the other hand, Macs are generally more secure - which is fine, except for when they do get caught out that one time, and the consequences throw Apple customers in at the deep end.  Since "macs don't get infected" as a rule, there will be less work put into creating the workarounds and support, which will likely also be of a lower quality and probably longer in finding their way to end-users.

In both situations, a net-savvy person is likely to be fine, which suggests the problem is not hardware or OS, but idiots using computers.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

With a few simple steps, most net-savvy individuals can easily proof a Windows machine against adware, spyware and general infection.  It's not ideal, but since it is an accepted fact Windows will be more heavily targeted (see: P3nt's post) there will be more software and support out there to prevent and deal with the outcome of this.

On the other hand, Macs are generally more secure - which is fine, except for when they do get caught out that one time, and the consequences throw Apple customers in at the deep end.  Since "macs don't get infected" as a rule, there will be less work put into creating the workarounds and support, which will likely also be of a lower quality and probably longer in finding their way to end-users.

In both situations, a net-savvy person is likely to be fine, which suggests the problem is not hardware or OS, but idiots using computers.

What Cain said.

The computer I use for image-handling and shipping runs Windows, and the computer I use for my own personal shit is a Mac. I like the Mac better and have had fewer problems with it, but there are things about Mac OS that I don't like and the file management system is among them. On the other hand, I hate how virus/adware/spy scanners slow my Windows computer the fuck down. Neither is perfect. Both are fine.

[bugmenоt]

i have an oecumenic machine at home. running ubuntu which can start a virtual windows xp or macosx if i need to.

virtualbox brings peace and happiness to OS fanatics. because remember: it's not a sin if you run it virtually.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I can never seem to get virtual MacOS or Windows to run well on my Linux machines. Probably because they're so old and slow.

[East Coast Hustle]

I got a kick-ass tablet with a 10" touchscreen that runs Android and does everything an iPad does, and I got it for $220 from Hong Kong on ebay. Yeah, I had to teach myself some chinese on the fly in order to switch the interface to english (it also has a cyrillic setting for russian), but I think that was worth saving $600.

By my math, $499 minus $220 is not even close to $600.

And that sounds awesome! I probably wouldn't be willing to take the risk or put the time into tinkering with it, but it's a good thing that some people are because it keeps the market competitive.

the cheapest iPad you can get is $629, and that's only 16GB and wi-fi only, no 3G. The 32GB wi-fi and 3G version (what my tablet has) goes for $799, IIRC.

http://www.apple.com/ipad/

Yeah, and like I said...if you want an iPad with any sort of worthwhile capabilities it's gonna run you more like $700 or $800.

ETA: 32GB with wifi and 3G is $700, 64GB with wifi and 3G is $800.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I got a kick-ass tablet with a 10" touchscreen that runs Android and does everything an iPad does, and I got it for $220 from Hong Kong on ebay. Yeah, I had to teach myself some chinese on the fly in order to switch the interface to english (it also has a cyrillic setting for russian), but I think that was worth saving $600.

By my math, $499 minus $220 is not even close to $600.

And that sounds awesome! I probably wouldn't be willing to take the risk or put the time into tinkering with it, but it's a good thing that some people are because it keeps the market competitive.

the cheapest iPad you can get is $629, and that's only 16GB and wi-fi only, no 3G. The 32GB wi-fi and 3G version (what my tablet has) goes for $799, IIRC.

http://www.apple.com/ipad/

Yeah, and like I said...if you want an iPad with any sort of worthwhile capabilities it's gonna run you more like $700 or $800.

ETA: 32GB with wifi and 3G is $700, 64GB with wifi and 3G is $800.

Well, if your $220 Hong Kong knockoff runs just as well, I'm impressed; good deal.

[East Coast Hustle]

Frankly, I mostly see the "my way is the best and therefore only right way!" posturing as pure insecurity.

I'm not sure who was doing that ITT, but it wasn't me. I just think Apple is a ridiculous company that makes ridiculous products and sells them for ridiculous prices. It has nothing at all to do with my way.

In other words, you're ridiculing the people who make a different choice than you, and justifying your choices.

No. I'm not even discussing what my personal preference is because it's totally irrelevant. I'm ridiculing one specific choice that some people make, and really I'm ridiculing the ridiculous company that makes those ridiculous products more than I'm ridiculing the people that choose to waste their money on those ridiculous products. Surely you can see the difference, so I'll thank you to stop completely twisting what I've said ITT.

[East Coast Hustle]

I got a kick-ass tablet with a 10" touchscreen that runs Android and does everything an iPad does, and I got it for $220 from Hong Kong on ebay. Yeah, I had to teach myself some chinese on the fly in order to switch the interface to english (it also has a cyrillic setting for russian), but I think that was worth saving $600.

By my math, $499 minus $220 is not even close to $600.

And that sounds awesome! I probably wouldn't be willing to take the risk or put the time into tinkering with it, but it's a good thing that some people are because it keeps the market competitive.

the cheapest iPad you can get is $629, and that's only 16GB and wi-fi only, no 3G. The 32GB wi-fi and 3G version (what my tablet has) goes for $799, IIRC.

http://www.apple.com/ipad/

Yeah, and like I said...if you want an iPad with any sort of worthwhile capabilities it's gonna run you more like $700 or $800.

ETA: 32GB with wifi and 3G is $700, 64GB with wifi and 3G is $800.

Well, if your $220 Hong Kong knockoff runs just as well, I'm impressed; good deal.

Runs better. Android kicks the crap out of Apple's tablet OS, and gives me access to all the cool apps that iPad users can't get.

Only fair to mention, my tablet would not be an appropriate purchase for someone who wasn't computer savvy. Took quite a bit of messing around with to get the settings into a configuration that's usable for a gaijin.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Frankly, I mostly see the "my way is the best and therefore only right way!" posturing as pure insecurity.

I'm not sure who was doing that ITT, but it wasn't me. I just think Apple is a ridiculous company that makes ridiculous products and sells them for ridiculous prices. It has nothing at all to do with my way.

In other words, you're ridiculing the people who make a different choice than you, and justifying your choices.

No. I'm not even discussing what my personal preference is because it's totally irrelevant. I'm ridiculing one specific choice that some people make, and really I'm ridiculing the ridiculous company that makes those ridiculous products more than I'm ridiculing the people that choose to waste their money on those ridiculous products. Surely you can see the difference, so I'll thank you to stop completely twisting what I've said ITT.

You can try to frame it that way, but it's awfully hard to escape the implication that people who choose these "ridiculous" products are lacking in critical thinking skills.

[East Coast Hustle]

Well, yeah. That implication is totally present.

I'm just pointing out that it's not a case of "the way I do it is better", but a case of "there are so many ways to do this, why would you pick the stupidest and most expensive way?"

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I got a kick-ass tablet with a 10" touchscreen that runs Android and does everything an iPad does, and I got it for $220 from Hong Kong on ebay. Yeah, I had to teach myself some chinese on the fly in order to switch the interface to english (it also has a cyrillic setting for russian), but I think that was worth saving $600.

By my math, $499 minus $220 is not even close to $600.

And that sounds awesome! I probably wouldn't be willing to take the risk or put the time into tinkering with it, but it's a good thing that some people are because it keeps the market competitive.

the cheapest iPad you can get is $629, and that's only 16GB and wi-fi only, no 3G. The 32GB wi-fi and 3G version (what my tablet has) goes for $799, IIRC.

http://www.apple.com/ipad/

Yeah, and like I said...if you want an iPad with any sort of worthwhile capabilities it's gonna run you more like $700 or $800.

ETA: 32GB with wifi and 3G is $700, 64GB with wifi and 3G is $800.

Well, if your $220 Hong Kong knockoff runs just as well, I'm impressed; good deal.

Runs better. Android kicks the crap out of Apple's tablet OS, and gives me access to all the cool apps that iPad users can't get.

Only fair to mention, my tablet would not be an appropriate purchase for someone who wasn't computer savvy. Took quite a bit of messing around with to get the settings into a configuration that's usable for a gaijin.

That "quite a bit of messing around" might easily be worth spending an extra $500 for some people, BTW.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Well, yeah. That implication is totally present.

I'm just pointing out that it's not a case of "the way I do it is better", but a case of "there are so many ways to do this, why would you pick the stupidest and most expensive way?"

I am just trying to point out that what you think is the stupidest and most expensive way may be the smartest and cheapest way for someone else, because their situation is different. For example, I wouldn't buy a cheapo tablet off eBay unless I was completely willing to eat it if the hardware breaks in six months... so there's risk management. I also wouldn't want to buy something I had to spend more than an hour tinkering with to get it to work. This is especially true for people who have a high billable hourly rate... when my beads were selling well, three hours of fucking with a tablet to make it work would have been a loss of $600 in torch time, and I'd rather just shell out for something with a warranty that works right fucking now and has hardware support.

So, you're willing to take a risk, are tech-savvy, and have time to burn. So a Hong Kong tablet running Android makes sense for you. But it's not the best or smartest choice for everyone.

Well-reviewed Android tablets with hardware support are very close in price to iPads. If I didn't want to support Apple, and I wanted a tablet, I'd probably buy one of those.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

This whole discussion is exactly why the "my gadgetry choices are smarter than yours" discussion is completely retarded... because everyone's life and needs are different.

[East Coast Hustle]

Good thing we're (again) not having that discussion, but rather the "your gadgetry choices are totally retarded regardless of what my gadgetry choices are" discussion, because everyone's life and needs may be different but buying ridiculous crap from the Cult of Apple never makes sense.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Good thing we're (again) not having that discussion, but rather the "your gadgetry choices are totally retarded regardless of what my gadgetry choices are" discussion, because everyone's life and needs may be different but buying ridiculous crap from the Cult of Apple never makes sense.

This appears to be a matter of religion for you.