ATTN: Actual Discordians RE: Hodge and Podge

[Pæs]

The PODGE of the Sacred Chao is symbolized as The Golden Apple of Discordia, which represents the Eristic Principle of Disorder.

The Pentagon represents the Aneristic Principle of Order and symbolizes the HODGE.

It is the HODGE-PODGE of the Erisians. And, instead of a Podge spot on the Hodge side, it has a PENTAGON which symbolizes the ANERISTIC PRINCIPLE, and instead of a Hodge spot on the Podge side, it depicts the GOLDEN APPLE OF DISCORDIA to symbolize the ERISTIC PRINCIPLE.

WHAT DOES THIS MEAN?

"Instead of a Podge (Eristic) spot on the Hodge (Aneristic) side, it has a PENTAGON which symbolizes the ANERISTIC PRINCIPLE."

Is placing an Aneristic symbol on the Aneristic side and an Eristic symbol on the Eristic side supposed to be a meaningful subversion of the balance represented by the yin-yang's shade and light each containing the seed of the other? Is the point that Order and Disorder are in conflict, rather than having a harmonious and flowing relationship? Did those hippies forget which term they were using for which?

There are other Discordian sites/glossaries which have Hodge as Eristic and Podge as Aneristic. Are there explanations of or elaborations on these labels outside of the PEEDEE?

[Iron Sulfide]

Probably.

[Cain]

Is placing an Aneristic symbol on the Aneristic side and an Eristic symbol on the Eristic side supposed to be a meaningful subversion of the balance represented by the yin-yang's shade and light each containing the seed of the other? Is the point that Order and Disorder are in conflict, rather than having a harmonious and flowing relationship?

I suspect this to be the case, as it sounds entirely in keeping with the rest of the book.

It could just be that Thornley and Hill did too much of the devil weed and forgot which was which, though.

[Iron Sulfide]

Aren't the Hodge and Podge sides the same, except for the apple and pentagon? I'm fairly sure that the first several Sacred Chaos I've seen are the same color/shade on both sides, even though a lot of the depictions are more like the Tao.

[LMNO]

If I were riffing, I'd say that by placing the Apple in the Podge and the Pentagon in the Hodge, they are labelling the two sides of the conflict (which is an illusion, anyway). 

They clearly say that the Apple represents the Podge, and the Pentagon represents the Hodge.  And instead of swapping bits of either for the other side, the two sides are represented in balance.  Remember, Discordia isn't Taoism -- they just stole a lot of the symbology.

Going further, if you didn't have the symbols clearly indicating which side is which, you'd never know what was being represented; all you'd have would be dichotomy.  So we also are able to show how we can only distinguish between order and disorder by LABELLING them as such; without the labels, we would only have swirling Chaos.

Chapter 44

Order or Disorder, which do you prefer?
Creation or Destruction, which do you choose?
Those who chase one are led to the other.
Those who embrace both
are free to choose which is more effective.
The only thing is, can you be sure
which is which?

[AFK]

Monday morning quarterbacking, it probably wasn't the best symbology they could come up with.  But then, I suppose this symbol wasn't meant to be a literal map of the territory.  If it was, then it would be a really bad symbol.  Because it would, inadvertently, reinforce the idea of compartmentalizing. 

Or maybe it's a test. 

Sneaky hippies!

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Inside every golden apple of disorder is the five sectioned pentagon of order.

I think the symbols were intentional, because 'order' and 'disorder' are simply the labels we apply to bits of chaos we perceive as patterned or without pattern. Within order is disorder and within disorder lies order. It all depends on what you can get away with....

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Inside every golden apple of disorder is the five sectioned pentagon of order.

I think the symbols were intentional, because 'order' and 'disorder' are simply the labels we apply to bits of chaos we perceive as patterned or without pattern. Within order is disorder and within disorder lies order. It all depends on what you can get away with....

Re-read his post... according to the wording of the PD, the little piece of order is on the order side, and the little piece of disorder is on the disorder side, rather than a little piece of order on the DISorder side, and the little piece of DISorder on the order side.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

What I don't get is how the pentagon is used as a symbol for aneristic stuff.

The pentagon generates more disorder than any other organization on Earth.  It's sort of a factory for LMNO's Principle...and it, in itself, is disorderly as hell, as anyone who has ever been there will tell you.

[LMNO]

You know, that's a pretty interesting point. I know the pinealist answer to that, but I think we may want to go back to the drawing board.

What symbol most purely represents Order, Rules, Organization?

[LMNO]

Off the top of my head,

[The Good Reverend Roger]

You know, that's a pretty interesting point. I know the pinealist answer to that, but I think we may want to go back to the drawing board.

What symbol most purely represents Order, Rules, Organization?

The American Flag.

[LMNO]

You know, that's a pretty interesting point. I know the pinealist answer to that, but I think we may want to go back to the drawing board.

What symbol most purely represents Order, Rules, Organization?

The American Flag.

Have you seen what's been going on around here?

I'd have to disagree, for the same reason you want to disqualify the pentagon.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

You know, that's a pretty interesting point. I know the pinealist answer to that, but I think we may want to go back to the drawing board.

What symbol most purely represents Order, Rules, Organization?

The American Flag.

Have you seen what's been going on around here?

I'd have to disagree, for the same reason you want to disqualify the pentagon.

Sure, I've seen what goes on around here.  People lining up in neat rows, keeping their heads down, and begging for Uncle Sugar to keep them safe.  Add into that the various movements to create anti-flag burning laws, and you get what I'm talking about.  The American flag represents everything about America that wants to be a good slave.

The pentagon is a symbol of something that wants to enslave.  The flag is a symbol of those who demand enslavement.

[LMNO]

Ok, I think I see where you're coming from.

What I'm hearing, pardon the paraphrasing, is that you're talking about the Aneristic Illusion, as opposed to the Aneristic Illusion. 

That is, it's focusing on the people who create and demand their easily understood narratives and patterns, who ignore the apparent disorder, and delude themselves with easily digestible order.

If that's not where you were going, apologies; that's where I ran with it.