Oh Noez! What about Teh Menz? -Patriarchy isn't a dude's friend EITHER!

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I don't find it particularly offensive. Just pointing it out.


Eta: me or him?

Him.

I find the connotation of pussy more indignation inducing than offensive. Soft, weak, so on.

Women pop small watermelons out of there all the time.  Is that weak or soft? I dare dudes to give themselves gall stones. If you refuse, you're a fucking pussy.

Note: not really a challenge.

This is a fact.  Gallstones are enough to make a grown man cry, and they're tiny.

Pooping a watermelon?  The species would go extinct.

[P3nT4gR4m]

Yes.  That's your prerogative to not like it when people cry, and I don't blame you in the least. 




To further the discussion, I agree that while men don't lose as much as women do in the grand scheme of things, I think as people they get a pretty raw deal.  They have to be just so, fit in this box, or -gasp- LOSE YOUR MAN CARD!  If you MUST get touchy-feely, you may only indulge in a short, furtive side hug (btw FUCK YUO ALTY), after which you have to make a rape or sexist joke lol, or talk about boobs or sports or whatever it is you men talk about.  You can't show emotion, cuz that's actin' like a pussy, dawg.  You got worries?  Shit, I don't wanna hear about worries you have about the future!  Talk about tits and ass instead.  You got some deep thoughts on feminism, or what you find to be beautiful in the world, or maybe want to bounce some poetry off me?  FUCKIN' FAG! 

Honestly, I'm running through all the things that guys are supposed to like to do, and I can only come up with some of the most shallow, vile crap that is untrue, I hope.  I mean, like Nigel said upthread, that can't be good for their spirituality or humanity.

Been thinking a bit about this and I'd say that, speaking as a guy, a lot of macho shit is fun and totally suits me, as long as it's not taken seriously. There's a switch in my brain that gets a buzz out of challenging one of my mates to do something mental or he's a pussy. Likewise - to rise to a similar challenge and make a dent in that lamp post, using the power of my head, to earn "man points". I see no reason not to indulge flicking that particular switch, from time to time, in the right company and setting.

I see no harm in it but, if that's all you have, like there's no intellectual, or emotional side to you then you've pretty much overdosed and become a walking cliche.

I just wanna take a second to point out that "pussy" is a gendered insult.

Yeah, but only barely. I don't think it's as bad as saying something like "you drive like a woman" which would definitely be a gendered insult. Referring to a bodypart, tho, is more on par with calling someone a dick or an asshole. And it should be noted that, if you are the type of person who would take offence to me saying something like that then I'm much more likely to do it around you because I'm a bit of a cunt like that.

Well I guess you've bought in then, haven't you?

If you're prepared to label me as a misogynist on the strength of which swear words I use then you are exactly the kind of person I want to offend. Want to try the old "I don't realise it but..." bullshit? Good luck with that.

[Juana]

I don't find it particularly offensive. Just pointing it out.


Eta: me or him?

Him.

I find the connotation of pussy more indignation inducing than offensive. Soft, weak, so on.

Women pop small watermelons out of there all the time.  Is that weak or soft? I dare dudes to give themselves gall stones. If you refuse, you're a fucking pussy.

Note: not really a challenge.

This is a fact.  Gallstones are enough to make a grown man cry, and they're tiny.

Pooping a watermelon?  The species would go extinct.

I had a health teacher in high school say it was, proportionally, like trying to get a golf ball through your dick.

[The Dark Monk]

I don't find it particularly offensive. Just pointing it out.


Eta: me or him?

Him.

I find the connotation of pussy more indignation inducing than offensive. Soft, weak, so on.

Women pop small watermelons out of there all the time.  Is that weak or soft? I dare dudes to give themselves gall stones. If you refuse, you're a fucking pussy.

Note: not really a challenge.

This is a fact.  Gallstones are enough to make a grown man cry, and they're tiny.

Pooping a watermelon?  The species would go extinct.

I had a health teacher in high school say it was, proportionally, like trying to get a golf ball through your dick.

I've pissed a ripping stone through a bladder infection. Definitely in the top 10 worst pains in my life, up there with gut dropping into my sack and rib punctured lung and frontal tooth smashy-outtie. (dental pain fucking SUCKS)

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Yes.  That's your prerogative to not like it when people cry, and I don't blame you in the least. 




To further the discussion, I agree that while men don't lose as much as women do in the grand scheme of things, I think as people they get a pretty raw deal.  They have to be just so, fit in this box, or -gasp- LOSE YOUR MAN CARD!  If you MUST get touchy-feely, you may only indulge in a short, furtive side hug (btw FUCK YUO ALTY), after which you have to make a rape or sexist joke lol, or talk about boobs or sports or whatever it is you men talk about.  You can't show emotion, cuz that's actin' like a pussy, dawg.  You got worries?  Shit, I don't wanna hear about worries you have about the future!  Talk about tits and ass instead.  You got some deep thoughts on feminism, or what you find to be beautiful in the world, or maybe want to bounce some poetry off me?  FUCKIN' FAG! 

Honestly, I'm running through all the things that guys are supposed to like to do, and I can only come up with some of the most shallow, vile crap that is untrue, I hope.  I mean, like Nigel said upthread, that can't be good for their spirituality or humanity.

Been thinking a bit about this and I'd say that, speaking as a guy, a lot of macho shit is fun and totally suits me, as long as it's not taken seriously. There's a switch in my brain that gets a buzz out of challenging one of my mates to do something mental or he's a pussy. Likewise - to rise to a similar challenge and make a dent in that lamp post, using the power of my head, to earn "man points". I see no reason not to indulge flicking that particular switch, from time to time, in the right company and setting.

I see no harm in it but, if that's all you have, like there's no intellectual, or emotional side to you then you've pretty much overdosed and become a walking cliche.

I just wanna take a second to point out that "pussy" is a gendered insult.

Yeah, but only barely. I don't think it's as bad as saying something like "you drive like a woman" which would definitely be a gendered insult. Referring to a bodypart, tho, is more on par with calling someone a dick or an asshole. And it should be noted that, if you are the type of person who would take offence to me saying something like that then I'm much more likely to do it around you because I'm a bit of a cunt like that.

Well I guess you've bought in then, haven't you?

If you're prepared to label me as a misogynist on the strength of which swear words I use then you are exactly the kind of person I want to offend. Want to try the old "I don't realise it but..." bullshit? Good luck with that.

No, I just think you've gotten so caught up in showing everybody what a badass you are, you've forgotten how to walk upright. It just disappoints me in the way it always disappoints me when I know someone is capable of better. I know... you Don't Care™. I've heard it enough times to know it's part of your uniform.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

A thought:  Why would you make fun of people who have genuine beliefs and an urge to make things better?

Ripping on that isn't booting a sacred cow, it's being part of The Machine^TM.  I think (not sure, mind you, I've been more rational) that this might be the root cause of the disagreement, here.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Basically, if your stance is the tired old "I'M NOT GUNNA THINK ABOUT OR OBJECTIVELY DISCUSS THE WIDER SOCIAL IMPLICATIONS OF COMMON LANGUAGE USAGES 'CAUSE I RAWK TOO HARD, FUCKEM" why are you even participating in this conversation? Don't you have a dominant paradigm to go uphold?

FFS. I know, consciousness is hard. SHOWING US WHAT A TOUGH GUY YOU ARE is much, much easier, because you don't even have to take off your nametag.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

(Not directed at you, Roger, you just posted while I was posting)

[The Good Reverend Roger]

(Not directed at you, Roger, you just posted while I was posting)

S'ok, I kinda figured.  I'm feeling quite a bit better, today, so I don't think EVERYTHING is aimed at me.  These things are less and less severe, and last shorter and shorter amounts of time.  And they're less frequent. 

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

(Not directed at you, Roger, you just posted while I was posting)

S'ok, I kinda figured.  I'm feeling quite a bit better, today, so I don't think EVERYTHING is aimed at me.  These things are less and less severe, and last shorter and shorter amounts of time.  And they're less frequent.

Good!

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

I think there was a valid point there though. Using genital terms as slang isn't necessarily misogynistic.  I just recently heard about "Elevatorgate" some bizarre dustup in the skeptic/atheist community dealing with misogyny, hurt feelings, blog fights and other stuff that sounded a lot like "I am monkey, hear me beat my chest!!" Anyway, Dawkins came down on one side, and the feminists on the other.  Throughout the debate the feminists and the people that supported their side kept referring to Dawkins as "Dick", obviously due to his first name, his gender and their opinion of him.

I don't think that meant that they hated all men or felt that all men were horrible people, or lesser beings or anything like that. It was just petty name calling. Cunt certainly 'could' be misogynistic in some usages, just as 'dick' could be, or it could just be name calling.

[Signora Pæsior]

I think there was a valid point there though. Using genital terms as slang isn't necessarily misogynistic.  I just recently heard about "Elevatorgate" some bizarre dustup in the skeptic/atheist community dealing with misogyny, hurt feelings, blog fights and other stuff that sounded a lot like "I am monkey, hear me beat my chest!!" Anyway, Dawkins came down on one side, and the feminists on the other.  Throughout the debate the feminists and the people that supported their side kept referring to Dawkins as "Dick", obviously due to his first name, his gender and their opinion of him.

I don't think that meant that they hated all men or felt that all men were horrible people, or lesser beings or anything like that. It was just petty name calling. Cunt certainly 'could' be misogynistic in some usages, just as 'dick' could be, or it could just be name calling.

Usage of "dick" vs "cunt" as insults aren't on the same level, though. I think Jessica Valenti (though I'm normally not a fan) said it best: the worst thing you can call a woman (slut, whore, bitch, cunt) is a woman. The worst thing you can call a man (pussy, mangina, fag, bitch) is a girl. In much the same way that "cracker" and "n***er" are both race-based insults, but one has a much stronger history of oppression and hatred behind it, saying "well some women call people dicks" isn't actually a valid counterpoint to "hey, using cunt as an insult is misogynistic."

[Juana]

I think there was a valid point there though. Using genital terms as slang isn't necessarily misogynistic.  I just recently heard about "Elevatorgate" some bizarre dustup in the skeptic/atheist community dealing with misogyny, hurt feelings, blog fights and other stuff that sounded a lot like "I am monkey, hear me beat my chest!!" Anyway, Dawkins came down on one side, and the feminists on the other.  Throughout the debate the feminists and the people that supported their side kept referring to Dawkins as "Dick", obviously due to his first name, his gender and their opinion of him.

I don't think that meant that they hated all men or felt that all men were horrible people, or lesser beings or anything like that. It was just petty name calling. Cunt certainly 'could' be misogynistic in some usages, just as 'dick' could be, or it could just be name calling.

Usage of "dick" vs "cunt" as insults aren't on the same level, though. I think Jessica Valenti (though I'm normally not a fan) said it best: the worst thing you can call a woman (slut, whore, bitch, cunt) is a woman. The worst thing you can call a man (pussy, mangina, fag, bitch) is a girl. In much the same way that "cracker" and "n***er" are both race-based insults, but one has a much stronger history of oppression and hatred behind it, saying "well some women call people dicks" isn't actually a valid counterpoint to "hey, using cunt as an insult is misogynistic."

Bless most of this post.

[Anna Mae Bollocks]

I reclaimed "cunt".

"Damn right and don't you forget it", "I'm not a cunt, I'm THE cunt", etc. 

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I think there was a valid point there though. Using genital terms as slang isn't necessarily misogynistic.  I just recently heard about "Elevatorgate" some bizarre dustup in the skeptic/atheist community dealing with misogyny, hurt feelings, blog fights and other stuff that sounded a lot like "I am monkey, hear me beat my chest!!" Anyway, Dawkins came down on one side, and the feminists on the other.  Throughout the debate the feminists and the people that supported their side kept referring to Dawkins as "Dick", obviously due to his first name, his gender and their opinion of him.

I don't think that meant that they hated all men or felt that all men were horrible people, or lesser beings or anything like that. It was just petty name calling. Cunt certainly 'could' be misogynistic in some usages, just as 'dick' could be, or it could just be name calling.

Usage of "dick" vs "cunt" as insults aren't on the same level, though. I think Jessica Valenti (though I'm normally not a fan) said it best: the worst thing you can call a woman (slut, whore, bitch, cunt) is a woman. The worst thing you can call a man (pussy, mangina, fag, bitch) is a girl. In much the same way that "cracker" and "n***er" are both race-based insults, but one has a much stronger history of oppression and hatred behind it, saying "well some women call people dicks" isn't actually a valid counterpoint to "hey, using cunt as an insult is misogynistic."

Nail, head.