Oh Noez! What about Teh Menz? -Patriarchy isn't a dude's friend EITHER!

[tyrannosaurus vex]

relevant?

[Pope Pixie Pickle]

Pix might know.  I've long since lost track of 90% of what I've written here.

ack, it was months ago, maybe around the time of the Prostitution Vs Feminism thread Nigel started waaay back. IIRC was before I moved in to this place, which was in March.

relevant?

hahah. Yes, relevant.

VERBL has a point about the term cis. I don't object to it because I know a few transgender and genderqueer folks IRL and cis is better than "normal" for me and them to use, when being trans is opposite to normal rather than an intellectual word like cis it kinda can make people feel like freaks, and those cats and kittens have it pretty tough already.  I don't see it as a restriction on me, just that it makes my (already marginalised and often misunderstood) friends that I hang out with more comfortable.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

VERBL has a point about the term cis. I don't object to it because I know a few transgender and genderqueer folks IRL and cis is better than "normal" for me and them to use, when being trans is opposite to normal rather than an intellectual word like cis it kinda can make people feel like freaks, and those cats and kittens have it pretty tough already.  I don't see it as a restriction on me, just that it makes my (already marginalised and often misunderstood) friends that I hang out with more comfortable.

I can see how labels could make someone feel more comfortable.

I'm just not sure that comfortable is a good thing.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

VERBL has a point about the term cis. I don't object to it because I know a few transgender and genderqueer folks IRL and cis is better than "normal" for me and them to use, when being trans is opposite to normal rather than an intellectual word like cis it kinda can make people feel like freaks, and those cats and kittens have it pretty tough already.  I don't see it as a restriction on me, just that it makes my (already marginalised and often misunderstood) friends that I hang out with more comfortable.

I can see how labels could make someone feel more comfortable.

I'm just not sure that comfortable is a good thing.

In fact I think that is an even worse reason for a label.

"I'ma label those people so I feel better about me"

WTF?

[The Good Reverend Roger]

VERBL has a point about the term cis. I don't object to it because I know a few transgender and genderqueer folks IRL and cis is better than "normal" for me and them to use, when being trans is opposite to normal rather than an intellectual word like cis it kinda can make people feel like freaks, and those cats and kittens have it pretty tough already.  I don't see it as a restriction on me, just that it makes my (already marginalised and often misunderstood) friends that I hang out with more comfortable.

I can see how labels could make someone feel more comfortable.

I'm just not sure that comfortable is a good thing.

In fact I think that is an even worse reason for a label.

"I'ma label those people so I feel better about me"

WTF?

Or even, "I'm going to label myself so I feel better about me."

Or worse.

"I'm going to label myself so others feel better about me."

[East Coast Hustle]

So, we need to invent a new catalog of swear words. Resolved, then.

We still have

Shit
Fuck
Damn
Cocksucker
Motherfucker (assuming strapons are available)

Now, what about using terms in a positive light?  As in "This new reverse F wrench design is the tits"?

This whole line of conversation makes me so motherfucking angry that I'm not even going to read the rest of the thread (posting from page 20 here). Anybody who expects me to stop using any swear word or obscene phrase for any reason can just get bent in half at the asshole.

Not like they're getting bent over in half so that their asshole ends up folding IN on itself. Oh no.

The OTHER way.

[Anna Mae Bollocks]

So, we need to invent a new catalog of swear words. Resolved, then.

We still have

Shit
Fuck
Damn
Cocksucker
Motherfucker (assuming strapons are available)

Now, what about using terms in a positive light?  As in "This new reverse F wrench design is the tits"?

This whole line of conversation makes me so motherfucking angry that I'm not even going to read the rest of the thread (posting from page 20 here). Anybody who expects me to stop using any swear word or obscene phrase for any reason can just get bent in half at the asshole.

Not like they're getting bent over in half so that their asshole ends up folding IN on itself. Oh no.

The OTHER way.

Damn. I shoulda mentioned ECH in the warm fuzzy post. 

Filing this away for future use. 

[The Good Reverend Roger]

So, we need to invent a new catalog of swear words. Resolved, then.

We still have

Shit
Fuck
Damn
Cocksucker
Motherfucker (assuming strapons are available)

Now, what about using terms in a positive light?  As in "This new reverse F wrench design is the tits"?

This whole line of conversation makes me so motherfucking angry that I'm not even going to read the rest of the thread (posting from page 20 here). Anybody who expects me to stop using any swear word or obscene phrase for any reason can just get bent in half at the asshole.

Not like they're getting bent over in half so that their asshole ends up folding IN on itself. Oh no.

The OTHER way.

I slay myself sometimes.   

[East Coast Hustle]

And now I see we're on the whole "labels" thing again.

I swear to fucking christ, sometimes this board is like a place where somebody put the "smart" lemmings and tried to teach them not to jump off the cliff. And succeeded. And now the lemmings are all jumping into the fucking washing machine and calling it progress. There isn't really a single word to describe a place like that. but if there was, PD would be like one of those.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

And now I see we're on the whole "labels" thing again.

I swear to fucking christ, sometimes this board is like a place where somebody put the "smart" lemmings and tried to teach them not to jump off the cliff. And succeeded. And now the lemmings are all jumping into the fucking washing machine and calling it progress. There isn't really a single word to describe a place like that. but if there was, PD would be like one of those.

I'd respond, but I'm still giggling like a mad bastard about your last post.

I am SO stealing that.

Anybody who expects me to stop using any swear word or obscene phrase for any reason can just get bent in half at the asshole.

Not like they're getting bent over in half so that their asshole ends up folding IN on itself. Oh no.

The OTHER way.

I think I'm gonna pee myself.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

To get back to the original discussion... I think the real point is that Patriarchy, or ANY system where there are oppressors isn't ANYONE's friend. It wasn't like everyone in 1806 liked the idea of slavery or thought that color should matter. However, for the most part we don't think about that, we think of the 1800's Americans as slave owning, Native American killing bastards. The poor sods that actually gave a fuck get slopped in with the oppressors.

[Pope Pixie Pickle]

VERBL has a point about the term cis. I don't object to it because I know a few transgender and genderqueer folks IRL and cis is better than "normal" for me and them to use, when being trans is opposite to normal rather than an intellectual word like cis it kinda can make people feel like freaks, and those cats and kittens have it pretty tough already.  I don't see it as a restriction on me, just that it makes my (already marginalised and often misunderstood) friends that I hang out with more comfortable.

I can see how labels could make someone feel more comfortable.

I'm just not sure that comfortable is a good thing.

eh it's not something that bothers me, using the word, to describe myself in certain company,  whereas being given transphobic abuse by people who consider themselves "normal" and my trans/ GQ mates freaks and abominations is shitty as fuck. Think of it as one of the small signals of acceptance I can send them that makes them feel safer in my company, rather than a label. Other signals would be asking what pronouns they prefer.  A tiny three letter word that means I will not freak out if you use the same loo as me, and I'll tell others to back the fuck up if they start something, and I get the idea about gender identity having spectrums, even though I view the whole gender thing as a social construct.

They may not feel comfortable or safe once they've left my company, but I can make it easier by understanding, using and not rejecting their terminology while they are with me. They usually just call me Annie rather than "that weird cis-hetroflexible-geek who yammers on about culture jamming to anyone who will listen." 

and if that makes me some kind of uniform or eejit or whatever I couldn't care less, they are my friends and I only really use or consider the terms when I am around that particular group, like some sort of sociology slang/jargon. Its basically just a taxonomy.

[Cain]

So, we need to invent a new catalog of swear words. Resolved, then.

We still have

Shit
Fuck
Damn
Cocksucker
Motherfucker (assuming strapons are available)

Now, what about using terms in a positive light?  As in "This new reverse F wrench design is the tits"?

This whole line of conversation makes me so motherfucking angry that I'm not even going to read the rest of the thread (posting from page 20 here). Anybody who expects me to stop using any swear word or obscene phrase for any reason can just get bent in half at the asshole.

Not like they're getting bent over in half so that their asshole ends up folding IN on itself. Oh no.

The OTHER way.

Your usage of "bent" and "asshole" in the above passage is offensive to the gay community.

Please contact the LGBTWTFROFLBBQ committee for more details about the nature and severity of your sanction.

[Placid Dingo]

VERBL has a point about the term cis. I don't object to it because I know a few transgender and genderqueer folks IRL and cis is better than "normal" for me and them to use, when being trans is opposite to normal rather than an intellectual word like cis it kinda can make people feel like freaks, and those cats and kittens have it pretty tough already.  I don't see it as a restriction on me, just that it makes my (already marginalised and often misunderstood) friends that I hang out with more comfortable.

I can see how labels could make someone feel more comfortable.

I'm just not sure that comfortable is a good thing.

In fact I think that is an even worse reason for a label.

"I'ma label those people so I feel better about me"

WTF?

In honestly, wouldn't it bother you if the standard way to describe people who weren't like you in some way "normal?" I would imagine it would frustrate me.

[The Johnny]

WAIT so... "cis" and "trans" are both in reference to "gender role"...

This entails no deconstruction of gender roles?

Shouldnt trans and cis both be thrown out the window?

ETA: like, i think the idea of "bigender" is a step forward; although it has a baseline assuming what roles are for each gender, it acknowledges the possibility of acting different roles in different situations!