Shooting at CT Elementary School. WTF AMERICA?!

[Faust]

less of them

So tell me, Faust...How successful were the British at disarming Ireland in the past?  And with whatever measures of success they may have had, how well did they curb violence?

I'll believe it when I see it.

There was this guy, see, named Timothy McVeigh...

The occupying brittish force were completely unsuccessful, the domestic government never had to deal with the problem. Timothy Mcvey was one over a decade ago.
What day was the last monthly school shooting I forget?

[Faust]

Thing is, many Europeans make the mistake of thinking of Americans as Europeans without monarchies, with a few dozen extra pounds.

This is a mistake.

The United States is nothing like Europe.  The USA is basically batshit insane, and always has been.  It's an indelible part of our national character, and with good reason.

Agreed, It seems to be encouraged, a new reality tv show peraps, the winner racks up the most kills, peraps they could form teams for areas.

[Elder Iptuous]

Faust,
how did it go down over there when guns were banned.  did anyone resist?  did they just grumble as the turned them in?

i'm curious to know how it went down compared to how it would likely go down if legislation were passed over here.
incidentally, how do you think it would go down over here?

[Faust]

Faust,
how did it go down over there when guns were banned.  did anyone resist?  did they just grumble as the turned them in?

i'm curious to know how it went down compared to how it would likely go down if legislation were passed over here.
incidentally, how do you think it would go down over here?

Gun proliferation was never prominent, there were caches that the IRA were armed from. There are still a lot of homes that might have some archaich rifle kicking around but they are museum pieces at this point.
It wasn't a smooth transition basically everything was concentrated in northern Ireland from then on, and there is still prominent nationalistic violence up there from both those that consider themselves Irish and those that consider themselves brittish. In the republic of Ireland however it was minimised. There is no eliminating gun crime but it can be minimised if caught early.

Its not a fair comparison to the US though because we never had a Gun Culture and that does seem to be where the majority of the problem stems from, we do have it easier and it would be a lot harder to roll back the clock for the US.

[Anna Mae Bollocks]

A lot of european countries have less shootings than the US. Hell, probably ALL of them have a lot less, and they actually seem shocked when it does happen.

But they're first world countries, aren't they? People have all kinds of nifty perks and benefits that will never happen here because US tards are brainwashed that SOME SMUDGEY PERSON MIGHT PLAY THE SYSTEM. Maybe the powers that be in europe don't give a fuck if the people live or die, but at least they PRETEND to.


People get along a lot better when there's enough to go around. They tend to snap a lot less, too. When all the austerity kicks in, we'll see how it goes over there. Guns or no guns.

[Faust]

A lot of european countries have less shootings than the US. Hell, probably ALL of them have a lot less, and they actually seem shocked when it does happen.

But they're first world countries, aren't they? People have all kinds of nifty perks and benefits that will never happen here because US tards are brainwashed that SOME SMUDGEY PERSON MIGHT PLAY THE SYSTEM. Maybe the powers that be in europe don't give a fuck if the people live or die, but at least they PRETEND to.


People get along a lot better when there's enough to go around. They tend to snap a lot less, too. When all the austerity kicks in, we'll see how it goes over there. Guns or no guns.

It's not a European thing, or even an economic thing though I did joke about that earlier.

I don't buy that either. How many Guatomallan school shootings are there?

Its true it does shock me that this happens every other week and people still seem to cling to the belief that its justifiable and unaviodable.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

A lot of european countries have less shootings than the US. Hell, probably ALL of them have a lot less, and they actually seem shocked when it does happen.

But they're first world countries, aren't they? People have all kinds of nifty perks and benefits that will never happen here because US tards are brainwashed that SOME SMUDGEY PERSON MIGHT PLAY THE SYSTEM. Maybe the powers that be in europe don't give a fuck if the people live or die, but at least they PRETEND to.


People get along a lot better when there's enough to go around. They tend to snap a lot less, too. When all the austerity kicks in, we'll see how it goes over there. Guns or no guns.

It's not a European thing, or even an economic thing though I did joke about that earlier.

I don't buy that either. How many Guatomallan school shootings are there?

Its true it does shock me that this happens every other week and people still seem to cling to the belief that its justifiable and unaviodable.

Wow, I can't really understand why you chose Guatemala for your comparison, but OK.

http://www.laht.com/article.asp?ArticleId=360166&CategoryId=23558

Not exactly big school shooting events, but Guatemala is a country still dealing with a lot of unrest and horrific levels of violence, as are many of the countries in Latin America.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I don't buy cultural heratige as a reason to have the right to a firearm, the russians aren't about to march in, the fact is that the majority of people who get killed by guns in the US are through accidents or violence in the home.

Sure, but I'd like to bring up one further issue on the cultural level.  Fact is, our constitution has a set of (supposedly) inalienable rights.  These rights are already constantly being trampled...The last thing I want to do is restructure those rights, given that both sides of the political spectrum have a laundry list of rights they'd like to curtail.

The simplest way you'd deal with that would be an amendment to repeal the 2nd amendment.  That isn't going to happen in today's political climate.  It would have precisely zero chance of passing, no matter who is in office.

So to curtail that one right, you'd need either a constitutional convention, and then it's Katy bar the door on ALL rights (the religious right, for example, has been pushing for a convention since 1981), or to outright abrogate the constitution, which would have even worse results.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

less of them

So tell me, Faust...How successful were the British at disarming Ireland in the past?  And with whatever measures of success they may have had, how well did they curb violence?

I'll believe it when I see it.

There was this guy, see, named Timothy McVeigh...

The occupying brittish force were completely unsuccessful, the domestic government never had to deal with the problem. Timothy Mcvey was one over a decade ago.
What day was the last monthly school shooting I forget?

I'd also like to bring up Theodore Kacszinksi (the Unabomber).  The argument you made was that people can't build bombs with a bit of googling.  They can.  They have.

McViegh's bomb was made from nitrate fertilizer and diesel fuel.  Both are readily available.  In fact, another identical bomb was placed in front of an IRS office four years ago, but failed to go off due to a faulty fuse system.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Thing is, many Europeans make the mistake of thinking of Americans as Europeans without monarchies, with a few dozen extra pounds.

This is a mistake.

The United States is nothing like Europe.  The USA is basically batshit insane, and always has been.  It's an indelible part of our national character, and with good reason.

Agreed, It seems to be encouraged, a new reality tv show peraps, the winner racks up the most kills, peraps they could form teams for areas.

Don't laugh.

[Faust]

less of them

So tell me, Faust...How successful were the British at disarming Ireland in the past?  And with whatever measures of success they may have had, how well did they curb violence?

I'll believe it when I see it.

There was this guy, see, named Timothy McVeigh...

The occupying brittish force were completely unsuccessful, the domestic government never had to deal with the problem. Timothy Mcvey was one over a decade ago.
What day was the last monthly school shooting I forget?

I'd also like to bring up Theodore Kacszinksi (the Unabomber).  The argument you made was that people can't build bombs with a bit of googling.  They can.  They have.

McViegh's bomb was made from nitrate fertilizer and diesel fuel.  Both are readily available.  In fact, another identical bomb was placed in front of an IRS office four years ago, but failed to go off due to a faulty fuse system.

A successful bomb has a wider casualty list, I'm not disputing people can make them but to go back to the home remote it would still be the choice of less people then the gun spree crowd.

But that's only the spree crowd, then there is the domestic violence crowd, and I whisper this in fear of waking the ugly behemoth of the feminism threads but there is also the accidents and violence in the home against family members which generally speaking is the woman of the house as the target.
Arguably these are the more likely of the violent crimes that would occur even if the perpetrator did not have a firearm.

[Faust]

I don't buy cultural heratige as a reason to have the right to a firearm, the russians aren't about to march in, the fact is that the majority of people who get killed by guns in the US are through accidents or violence in the home.

Sure, but I'd like to bring up one further issue on the cultural level.  Fact is, our constitution has a set of (supposedly) inalienable rights.  These rights are already constantly being trampled...The last thing I want to do is restructure those rights, given that both sides of the political spectrum have a laundry list of rights they'd like to curtail.

The simplest way you'd deal with that would be an amendment to repeal the 2nd amendment.  That isn't going to happen in today's political climate.  It would have precisely zero chance of passing, no matter who is in office.

So to curtail that one right, you'd need either a constitutional convention, and then it's Katy bar the door on ALL rights (the religious right, for example, has been pushing for a convention since 1981), or to outright abrogate the constitution, which would have even worse results.

From what I have seen it is the only inalienable right that has not been circumvented or made a mockery of, the fact that it is the most repugnant and obsolete stands as testament of its failure.

But I agree and I believe if it it was to be rewritten there is no hope that it could be replaced with something better.

[Faust]

A lot of european countries have less shootings than the US. Hell, probably ALL of them have a lot less, and they actually seem shocked when it does happen.

But they're first world countries, aren't they? People have all kinds of nifty perks and benefits that will never happen here because US tards are brainwashed that SOME SMUDGEY PERSON MIGHT PLAY THE SYSTEM. Maybe the powers that be in europe don't give a fuck if the people live or die, but at least they PRETEND to.


People get along a lot better when there's enough to go around. They tend to snap a lot less, too. When all the austerity kicks in, we'll see how it goes over there. Guns or no guns.

It's not a European thing, or even an economic thing though I did joke about that earlier.

I don't buy that either. How many Guatomallan school shootings are there?

Its true it does shock me that this happens every other week and people still seem to cling to the belief that its justifiable and unaviodable.

Wow, I can't really understand why you chose Guatemala for your comparison, but OK.

http://www.laht.com/article.asp?ArticleId=360166&CategoryId=23558

Not exactly big school shooting events, but Guatemala is a country still dealing with a lot of unrest and horrific levels of violence, as are many of the countries in Latin America.

I chose Guatomala because exactly because of its heinous violence, it still has less school shootings. Targeting schools is a cultural thing.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I don't buy cultural heratige as a reason to have the right to a firearm, the russians aren't about to march in, the fact is that the majority of people who get killed by guns in the US are through accidents or violence in the home.

Sure, but I'd like to bring up one further issue on the cultural level.  Fact is, our constitution has a set of (supposedly) inalienable rights.  These rights are already constantly being trampled...The last thing I want to do is restructure those rights, given that both sides of the political spectrum have a laundry list of rights they'd like to curtail.

The simplest way you'd deal with that would be an amendment to repeal the 2nd amendment.  That isn't going to happen in today's political climate.  It would have precisely zero chance of passing, no matter who is in office.

So to curtail that one right, you'd need either a constitutional convention, and then it's Katy bar the door on ALL rights (the religious right, for example, has been pushing for a convention since 1981), or to outright abrogate the constitution, which would have even worse results.

From what I have seen it is the only inalienable right that has not been circumvented or made a mockery of, the fact that it is the most repugnant and obsolete stands as testament of its failure.

But I agree and I believe if it it was to be rewritten there is no hope that it could be replaced with something better.

Well, we still have amendment III.  Because there's no fat contracts in quartering troops in peoples' homes.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

However, the fact that the 2nd amendment was put in place to protect the rest of the bill of rights has in fact become a sad joke.

Amendment's there, but everyone's too busy to defend the rest.