I love Miley Cyrus

[Kai]

You can't trust them Nigels.

Not even Niley Cygel.

The funny thing is, it really is the little things. Everyone's talking about this and it isn't like she turned convention on its ear. She did all the same things, she just did them unsexy. It's sort of like the upscale store down the street from me hiring young black men to fill customer service positions (and if you don't know how unusual that is here, you've never been to Portland); it's just a little thing. But it irrevocably shifts the paradigm because all of a sudden OH SHIT EVERYBODY'S LOOKING. It changes the narrative from "there are no black people in Portland" to "Why aren't other stores in Portland hiring black people?"

Yep.  Like I said, it's the one missing ingredient that makes it all horrible and wrong.

And hilarious.

Of the few people that get it: we are entertained.

Of the majority that are outraged, or hipsterly blase : They are enjoying their outrage/hipster porn from being trolled to hell.

In either case, she has reached a massive audience, people are watching her videos and listening to her music, even if they HATE IT.

/Especially/ if they hate it. She won, she done good at art.

[tyrannosaurus vex]

Young woman clearly having the time of her life.  Must be either inappropriate or mundane. She's most likely being told what to do by a bunch of men at the record label. Couldn't possibly be anything else. Could it? Oh god please don't let it be anything else...

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

  Yep yep yep.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

I haven't missed it, I don't agree with it.

What, exactly, don't you agree with?

[Cain]

-

[Faust]

Yeah, well, I think I done pissed people off. 

I'm just trying to MAKE MY POINT.  Or maybe GET SOME SLEEP.  I'm not trying to get all over anyone's ass.

Not pissed off, US mere mortals have to sleep some times, we don't all have the stamina to stay up all night posting, besides anything I would post at 1 am would be  so muddled it wouldn't be worth reading, so much like anything else I post through the course of the day.

Well, I made an effort, I wont bother any more if I'm just a cultural snob when I try.

Well, it's like this:  Nigel brought up several points.  Those points were ignored.  This is not entirely unexpected, on account of 2 things:

1.  Nigel brought them up, and

2.  She unreasonably expected people to stop sneering for 10 seconds and examine what she had to say, and maybe even for 3 minutes 14 seconds to examine the video in question.  What Nigel, of course, doesn't even CONSIDER is that if we stop sneering at "pop culture" even for that long, EVEN in the interests of examining what MIGHT MAYBE POSSIBLY be the biggest MIND FUCK since p-funk shuffled off stage left, why, we'll lose our seniority down at the local Coffee & Wine Bar, and they'll take our Brad Pitt hats away.  We might even lose our tallbike licenses.  She's totally fucking unreasonable.  She FAILS to REALIZE that this sort of shit is REFLEXIVE, and we have about as much control over it as we do over our MIGHTY PENISES.  Mine, for example, is 3 feet long and beats up the neighbor once a week.  Anyway.

Yes, first time I watched it I couldn't see any difference between this and any other pretty girl dancing naked video. Obviously there is something more hence you know, me actually ASKING questions about it.

I would love to be able to sneer at people about culture, that would be possible if i read anything without people in capes in it, or listened to something that isn't bad synth from the 80ies. I know fuck all about culture. I don't pretend that I know any more then I do.

...All hyperbole aside, there is something hilarious going on here, and I'd expect just a LITTLE BIT MORE than CASUAL, SNEERING DISMISSAL from a board full of Discordians.  That's MY Discordia, though, and results may - as always - vary. 

The really interesting thing here is that everyone IMMEDIATELY has to scream THIS HAS BEEN DONE BEFORE, for the same reason many people - myself included - AUTOMATICALLY dismiss any good news as "bait for suckers".  It's a SUBSTITUTE FOR THINKING.  It's the uniform jacket so tight around our necks that we all involuntarily SHIT OURSELVES, and then congratulate ourselves on our scatalogical OUTLANDISHNESS.

Wait.  Scratch all that.  Nigel is the cancer that is killing PD, and Miley Cyrus is the same old shit microwaved to room temperature and dished out in pre-sized portions, and anyone who says anything different is just being contrary.

BURP.

You can conflate what I said with what other people have said but I wont really be able to respond to it, what with me not thinking, doing or saying those things. All I'm going to be able to do is shrug.

I found the video generic at first, I watched it a few more times and I did get that it is uncomfortable. I've read the posts here and I kind of get the sexual assertive bit but not why it makes the video uncomfortable.

[Faust]

So far the clues I have are:

Lyrics that invoke images of sexual violence, be it physical or emotional. If it was a dude singing it I'd be very wary of him being a creeper.

Horror movie aesthetic: No other people, main character is sexually aggressive. The fact that there are no other people makes the viewer feel like a voyeur, the sexual aggression is personal to each and every viewer.

Weird phallic imaginary:



Why is hers bigger then mine?

The clues might be staring me right in the face but I don't see it. She is staring at me right in the face, that's uncomfortable.

I get that its not like other pretty girl videos because its horribly uncomfortable without being windowlicker obvious. What I don't get is why its uncomfortable or the purpose.

[AFK]

I haven't missed it, I don't agree with it.

What, exactly, don't you agree with?

This:

Is it the complete lack of men anywhere? Or just other people in general?

DING.

Also, the visuals and the lyrics?  She IS the man.

This is why the balance of the outrage is from men.  WAY in the back of their brain, they're getting rape panic signals.  The screeching outrage all over social media is pretty much based on this.

Because of this:

"Miley loved the idea of going naked because it suits the song," the source continued. "She's showing her naked emotions. It's her vulnerable side and it's not something she shows very often, so having nudity made sense."
A tweet has been surfacing on the Internet that supposedly breaks down the true meaning of the video. It explains that Cyrus was kissing the sledge hammer to represent that she "secretly still loves the pain," she was naked to show how the love destroyed and hurt her and the wrecking ball was symbolic of a destructive love.
According to Hollywood Life the song is very personal to Cyrus. A source told the celebrity website that when Richardson wanted her to cry he told her to think about losing Liam Hemsworth and she broke down in tears.
"It was very intense and wasn't an act," the source said. "Even though she was happy and in a good mood, it only took like two seconds for her to start crying."

So it really has nothing to do with a woman expressing sexual aggressiveness.  It seems to be more about her showing that she is vulnerable after losing a relationship.  It isn't some pop-culture troll or mindfuck.  It's someone just trying to make a personal statement about love and relationships.  Again, why I compare it to Sinead O'Connor who basically akready did it, except even more stripped down, just her, a black backdrop, and a camera. 

[Reginald Ret]

I haven't missed it, I don't agree with it.

What, exactly, don't you agree with?

This:

Is it the complete lack of men anywhere? Or just other people in general?

DING.

Also, the visuals and the lyrics?  She IS the man.

This is why the balance of the outrage is from men.  WAY in the back of their brain, they're getting rape panic signals.  The screeching outrage all over social media is pretty much based on this.

Because of this:

"Miley loved the idea of going naked because it suits the song," the source continued. "She's showing her naked emotions. It's her vulnerable side and it's not something she shows very often, so having nudity made sense."
A tweet has been surfacing on the Internet that supposedly breaks down the true meaning of the video. It explains that Cyrus was kissing the sledge hammer to represent that she "secretly still loves the pain," she was naked to show how the love destroyed and hurt her and the wrecking ball was symbolic of a destructive love.
According to Hollywood Life the song is very personal to Cyrus. A source told the celebrity website that when Richardson wanted her to cry he told her to think about losing Liam Hemsworth and she broke down in tears.
"It was very intense and wasn't an act," the source said. "Even though she was happy and in a good mood, it only took like two seconds for her to start crying."

So it really has nothing to do with a woman expressing sexual aggressiveness.  It seems to be more about her showing that she is vulnerable after losing a relationship.  It isn't some pop-culture troll or mindfuck.  It's someone just trying to make a personal statement about love and relationships.  Again, why I compare it to Sinead O'Connor who basically akready did it, except even more stripped down, just her, a black backdrop, and a camera.

Not a bad analysis.
But the funny for me is in the reaction of other people.
- The way almost all responses done by males imply that these responders are incapable of processing the concept of a strong independent woman in popular culture.
- The outrage at her act on the VMA when the only thing she did was take the sexy out of it. Apparantly it is the VMA goal to be as sexy as possible in the most degrading and unsexy context as possible. Miley merely took the sexy out, thereby clarifying to the audience what a horrible world these hollywood types live in. Since the audience uses hollywood to define their self-image this causes huge cognitive dissonance.

[tarod]

Why does it matter that she is using shock and horror to get attention and make sales? Why does it matter that she is paying others to write the lyrics, do the musical arrangements, direct the shoots? Why does her shit have to be extremely radically different from other women popstars to have meaning?
This woman evidently has some manner of vision, has the means, financially and other wise, to pay for professional assistance in realizing her vision, even if all it is being shocking for the purpose of being shocking and getting more money.
Or is this just some affected cynical snobbery?

You are making my point for me.  She isn't different from other women pop stars.  She's playing the same game all the others played before her.  And yes, she is playing it very well as evident by breaking that record of most views.  But I don't see anything particularly "arty" in her vision compared to other pop-stars as has been suggested by others.


And honestly, I don't even see how anything she has done can be considered "shocking".

It gets harder to shock people as time passes. So IMO she's done it better than all the previous ones, and with the handicap of not using religion.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

So far the clues I have are:

Lyrics that invoke images of sexual violence, be it physical or emotional. If it was a dude singing it I'd be very wary of him being a creeper.

That's kind of the point.  Sexy girl isn't sexy, she's THAT GUY.

I get that its not like other pretty girl videos because its horribly uncomfortable without being windowlicker obvious. What I don't get is why its uncomfortable or the purpose.

Not sure what the purpose is, but the reason its uncomfortable is that the standard meme of the pop girl video is broken.  It's not functioning correctly, and instead of seeing a piece of meat, the audience FEELS like a piece of meat.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

So far, there have been a few common responses via social media and blogs.

1.  GAH!  SOMEONE STOP THAT MONSTER!  SHE'S TELLING KIDS TO FUCK A TOPKNOT!  SHE'S MAKING HERSELF AVAILABLE FOR TEH SEXXORZ, BUT THERE'S NO GUY!  I CAN'T GO ON LIKE THIS!!!11
2.  HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
3.  I am far too sophisticated to issue an opinion on this sort of plebian activity.
4.  STOP DISTRACTING US FROM OUR UPCOMING WAR PORN.

Um,

I'm in the number 4 category.  Well, not so much war porn as "lets try and not have a war, and if you do, I'm going to document each and every one of your failures" porn, but, uh, yeah.

It is somewhat interesting that so many people are interested in what she is doing, but I have to prioritise my interests due to lack of time, and, to be honest, she kinda falls further down on the list than a lot of things.  Don't know if that makes me a cultural snob or not, but there it is.  Lady Gaga aside, I basically have paid no attention to pop culture since about 2008 anyway(no TV, can't stand most radio), so I'm well out of the loop on these things.

Thing is, you also aren't out there hollering about her 24/7.

Facebook has been nothing short of HILARIOUS.  A million people posting ALL DAY about how MILEY CYRUS IS GONNA ALLOW THE WAR BY DISTRACTING EVERYONE FROM IT...But not an actual post of the upcoming war to be seen.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

So far the clues I have are:

Lyrics that invoke images of sexual violence, be it physical or emotional. If it was a dude singing it I'd be very wary of him being a creeper.

That's kind of the point.  Sexy girl isn't sexy, she's THAT GUY.

I get that its not like other pretty girl videos because its horribly uncomfortable without being windowlicker obvious. What I don't get is why its uncomfortable or the purpose.

Not sure what the purpose is, but the reason its uncomfortable is that the standard meme of the pop girl video is broken.  It's not functioning correctly, and instead of seeing a piece of meat, the audience FEELS like a piece of meat.

What I mean by "broken meme" is that the standard meme SEEMS to be there, and your brain gets all ready for it.  Then it doesn't happen, or it happens WRONG.  Sort of like puns...Your mind GETS it, but the HAHA part isn't hit, so you are left annoyed.  In this case, you are left with a bag of mixed signals that SHOULD be nice and routine.

The only thing that bothers me about the whole mess is that this is the sort of shit WE should have been doing in 2006.  Although in a different manner.  Maybe.

[AFK]

I haven't missed it, I don't agree with it.

What, exactly, don't you agree with?

This:

Is it the complete lack of men anywhere? Or just other people in general?

DING.

Also, the visuals and the lyrics?  She IS the man.

This is why the balance of the outrage is from men.  WAY in the back of their brain, they're getting rape panic signals.  The screeching outrage all over social media is pretty much based on this.

Because of this:

"Miley loved the idea of going naked because it suits the song," the source continued. "She's showing her naked emotions. It's her vulnerable side and it's not something she shows very often, so having nudity made sense."
A tweet has been surfacing on the Internet that supposedly breaks down the true meaning of the video. It explains that Cyrus was kissing the sledge hammer to represent that she "secretly still loves the pain," she was naked to show how the love destroyed and hurt her and the wrecking ball was symbolic of a destructive love.
According to Hollywood Life the song is very personal to Cyrus. A source told the celebrity website that when Richardson wanted her to cry he told her to think about losing Liam Hemsworth and she broke down in tears.
"It was very intense and wasn't an act," the source said. "Even though she was happy and in a good mood, it only took like two seconds for her to start crying."

So it really has nothing to do with a woman expressing sexual aggressiveness.  It seems to be more about her showing that she is vulnerable after losing a relationship.  It isn't some pop-culture troll or mindfuck.  It's someone just trying to make a personal statement about love and relationships.  Again, why I compare it to Sinead O'Connor who basically akready did it, except even more stripped down, just her, a black backdrop, and a camera.

Not a bad analysis.
But the funny for me is in the reaction of other people.
- The way almost all responses done by males imply that these responders are incapable of processing the concept of a strong independent woman in popular culture.

Could you provide some examples of this? 

- The outrage at her act on the VMA when the only thing she did was take the sexy out of it. Apparantly it is the VMA goal to be as sexy as possible in the most degrading and unsexy context as possible. Miley merely took the sexy out, thereby clarifying to the audience what a horrible world these hollywood types live in. Since the audience uses hollywood to define their self-image this causes huge cognitive dissonance.

I disagree.  The goal of the VMA's has always been to have that one performance that is so over the top that people talk about it the next day.  Such as Madonna writhing on the floor singing Like A Virgin, Prince's performance of "Get Off", the one where Madonna kisses Spears and Aguilera, I think there was another one involving Spears and a snake.  Oh, I think Madonna had another one for Vogue.


So I see the Miley Cyrus VMA thing pretty much in that spirit.  Different dance moves and imagery, sure, but the same goal.  To give an outrageous performance everyone talks about the next day. 


Also, did she take the sexy out or is she just unsexy?  I'm not seeing the deliberate troll/pop culture commentary in that performance.  I just see someone saying, let's throw a lot of crazy shit out there so people take notice.

[AFK]

Why does it matter that she is using shock and horror to get attention and make sales? Why does it matter that she is paying others to write the lyrics, do the musical arrangements, direct the shoots? Why does her shit have to be extremely radically different from other women popstars to have meaning?
This woman evidently has some manner of vision, has the means, financially and other wise, to pay for professional assistance in realizing her vision, even if all it is being shocking for the purpose of being shocking and getting more money.
Or is this just some affected cynical snobbery?

You are making my point for me.  She isn't different from other women pop stars.  She's playing the same game all the others played before her.  And yes, she is playing it very well as evident by breaking that record of most views.  But I don't see anything particularly "arty" in her vision compared to other pop-stars as has been suggested by others.


And honestly, I don't even see how anything she has done can be considered "shocking".

It gets harder to shock people as time passes. So IMO she's done it better than all the previous ones, and with the handicap of not using religion.

How was what she did shocking?  I mean, to anyone who isn't a senior citizen and is actually in MTV's viewing demographics?  It looked garrish and awkward and awful, but "shocking" was never an adjective that came to mind.