Author Topic: Turning Purple  (Read 5294 times)

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #30 on: November 11, 2016, 10:20:58 pm »
There's also putting to rest the low-turnout myth: http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/11/11/did_clinton_fail_to_turn_out_registered_democrats.html

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Nate Cohn of the New York Times estimates that when every vote is tallied, some 63.4 million Americans will have voted for Clinton and 61.2 million for Trump. That means Clinton will have turned out more supporters than any presidential candidate in history except for Obama in 2008 and 2012. And as David Wasserman of Cook Political Report notes, the total vote count—including third-party votes—has already crossed 127 million, and will “easily beat” the 129 million total from 2012. The idea that voters stayed home in 2016 because they hated Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton is a myth.

Note that this is DESPITE rampant voter suppression.
“I’m guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk,” Charles Wick said. “It was very complicated.”


Vanadium Gryllz

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #31 on: November 12, 2016, 09:17:56 am »
That  Cinemax link was an interesting read Nigel, thanks for posting. I thought this section:

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This election, you had two major Presidential providers. One offered you the Stronger Together plan, and the other offered you the Make America Great Again plan. You chose the Make America Great Again plan. The thing is, the Make America Great Again has in its package active, institutionalized racism (also active, institutionalized sexism. And as it happens, active, institutionalized homophobia). And you know it does, because the people who bundled up the Make America Great Again package not only told you it was there, they made it one of the plan’s big selling points.

And you voted for it anyway.

So did you vote for racism?

You sure did.

And you say, but I’m not racist, and I would never treat people in a racist fashion, and I don’t like being called out as having done a racist thing.

And others say to you, okay, but you knew that when you signed up for the Make America Great Again plan that active, institutionalized racism was part of the package. Your vote supports racism. By voting, you endorsed a racist plan.

And you say, but I didn’t want that part. I wanted the other parts.

And others say to you, that’s fine, but you knew that to get the other parts, you had to sign on for the racism, too. And evidently you were okay with that.

And you say, no I’m not, I hate racism.

And others say to you, but apparently you like these other things more than you hate racism, because you agreed to the racism in order to get these other things.

And you say, well, the Stronger Together plan had horrible things in it too.

And others say to you, yes, and you didn’t vote for that, you voted for this. Which has racism in it. You voted for racism.

And you say, stop saying that.

And the others ask, why.

makes the point really clear.
"I was fine until my skin came off.  I'm never going to South Attelboro again."

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #32 on: November 12, 2016, 04:31:31 pm »
I liked that part a lot too. A lot of white people act like being told they have done something racist is an outlandish accusation, as if you're accusing them of lynching babies. They cling super hard to the idea that they AREN'T racist because they know that racism is a bad thing, and get very angry when you say that voting for Trump is racist because it supports a platform of racism and xenophobia.

They can't quite grasp that saying it's not racist isn't enough to make it actually not racist.
“I’m guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk,” Charles Wick said. “It was very complicated.”


LMNO

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #33 on: November 12, 2016, 05:10:11 pm »
I don't really have the proper platform to say it, but on FB I posted that if someone voted for Trump and don't consider themselves bigots, or voted or him despite their misgivings about his bigotry, here are the links to the ACLU, Southern Poverty Law Center, AIDS Action Committee, and Planned Parenthood, and to please donate to support the people who are now at risk because of your vote.

It's a troll, but it's a CHARITY troll.

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #34 on: November 12, 2016, 05:14:02 pm »
I don't really have the proper platform to say it, but on FB I posted that if someone voted for Trump and don't consider themselves bigots, or voted or him despite their misgivings about his bigotry, here are the links to the ACLU, Southern Poverty Law Center, AIDS Action Committee, and Planned Parenthood, and to please donate to support the people who are now at risk because of your vote.

It's a troll, but it's a CHARITY troll.

I like this! It's BRILLIANT.
“I’m guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk,” Charles Wick said. “It was very complicated.”


MMIX

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #35 on: November 12, 2016, 06:31:31 pm »
I liked that part a lot too. A lot of white people act like being told they have done something racist is an outlandish accusation, as if you're accusing them of lynching babies. They cling super hard to the idea that they AREN'T racist because they know that racism is a bad thing, and get very angry when you say that voting for Trump is racist because it supports a platform of racism and xenophobia.

They can't quite grasp that saying it's not racist isn't enough to make it actually not racist.

I've been haunted for a while now by the creeping realisation that  a goodly percentage of people don't actually know that racism is a bad thing. Its just that they keep being told that racism is a bad thing and repeat it mindlessly without actually engaging with it personally.

"Just because the village idiots have spoken doesn't mean we have to destroy the village"

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #36 on: November 12, 2016, 07:03:54 pm »
I liked that part a lot too. A lot of white people act like being told they have done something racist is an outlandish accusation, as if you're accusing them of lynching babies. They cling super hard to the idea that they AREN'T racist because they know that racism is a bad thing, and get very angry when you say that voting for Trump is racist because it supports a platform of racism and xenophobia.

They can't quite grasp that saying it's not racist isn't enough to make it actually not racist.

I've been haunted for a while now by the creeping realisation that  a goodly percentage of people don't actually know that racism is a bad thing. Its just that they keep being told that racism is a bad thing and repeat it mindlessly without actually engaging with it personally.

Hmmm, that's an interesting observation, and consistent with my observation that people know enough to get angry about being told they're being racist, but not enough to actually understand that they were being racist.
“I’m guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk,” Charles Wick said. “It was very complicated.”


Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #37 on: November 13, 2016, 12:39:27 am »
I saw this and I thought you guys might dig it.

“I’m guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk,” Charles Wick said. “It was very complicated.”


Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #38 on: November 13, 2016, 12:40:12 am »
Basically, to rephrase if I'm understanding her correctly;

Welcome to the jungle.
“I’m guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk,” Charles Wick said. “It was very complicated.”


Cainad (dec.)

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #39 on: November 13, 2016, 02:57:39 pm »
I don't really have the proper platform to say it, but on FB I posted that if someone voted for Trump and don't consider themselves bigots, or voted or him despite their misgivings about his bigotry, here are the links to the ACLU, Southern Poverty Law Center, AIDS Action Committee, and Planned Parenthood, and to please donate to support the people who are now at risk because of your vote.

It's a troll, but it's a CHARITY troll.

:mittens: I like this.

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #40 on: November 13, 2016, 04:39:57 pm »
I don't think we're going to make any progress until the intractably racist segment of the white middle class is more afraid of what will happen if we don't get equality than they are afraid of us getting equality.
“I’m guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk,” Charles Wick said. “It was very complicated.”


LMNO

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #41 on: November 13, 2016, 04:55:53 pm »
Yeah, pretty much that.


Also, we really need to figure out a way to overcome gerrymandering.

Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #42 on: November 13, 2016, 06:14:34 pm »
A lot of people don't really know how the Civil Rights movement actually went down. There were riots, there was violence, and many historians and sociologists don't think the Civil Rights movement would have prevailed had it not been for a combination of peaceful protests and riots, which essentially put racist whites in the position of choosing the lesser of what they viewed as two evils: the civil rights act vs. angry black mobs.

If racist white Americans have taught us anything, it's that we need to use both the carrot and the stick.
“I’m guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk,” Charles Wick said. “It was very complicated.”


Mesozoic Mister Nigel

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #43 on: November 13, 2016, 06:16:22 pm »
I am saying that the stick is going to be a necessary component of how we get laws that both reverse voter suppression and end gerrymandering. Things are going to get worse and scarier before they get better.
“I’m guessing it was January 2007, a meeting in Bethesda, we got a bag of bees and just started smashing them on the desk,” Charles Wick said. “It was very complicated.”


Cainad (dec.)

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Re: Turning Purple
« Reply #44 on: November 13, 2016, 06:28:35 pm »
I am saying that the stick is going to be a necessary component of how we get laws that both reverse voter suppression and end gerrymandering. Things are going to get worse and scarier before they get better.

I think you are very correct in this. The "peace is the only way, riots don't solve anything!" pap is sounding less and less true to me every day.

A lot of people are going to get hurt, it seems. But if "lesser of two evils" really is the only path to progress in this society, then a greater evil must be presented as the alternative to the lesser "evil" of treating Those People as humans.

(In case the FBI is listening, this hurts my White Male Feelings and I'm against it, for the record. Also, well played, pigs.)