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UNLIMITED 2020 THREAD

Started by Doktor Howl, March 01, 2019, 08:53:02 PM

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Cramulus

I always remember Jon Stewart's point on Crossfire, when they were needling him about whether John Kerry was the best possible choice to represent democrats.

And he basically said  "elections are not about who is best at governing.. elections are about who is best at winning elections."


Doktor Howl

Quote from: Cramulus on August 07, 2020, 04:44:55 PM
I always remember Jon Stewart's point on Crossfire, when they were needling him about whether John Kerry was the best possible choice to represent democrats.

And he basically said  "elections are not about who is best at governing.. elections are about who is best at winning elections."

This is why a constitutional monarchy seems to be the best system of human governance.

However, Britain has shown that humans can even fuck THAT up.
Molon Lube

Doktor Howl

Quote from: LMNO on August 07, 2020, 04:33:20 PM
TWJ, the Democrats are not the Leftists.  The majority of Americans, apparently, do not want radical structural change; and they chose their candidate accordingly.

I'm not saying I like their choice, but that's who the majority of Dems want.

This is one of those things where people start thinking their own vote doesn't count because other peoples' votes count.  I express my intent.  Others express their intent and my intent is voted down.  This angers my inner monkey and now I'm butthurt that *I* spoke and what I wanted didn't happen, even though I clearly expressed that I wanted it.
Molon Lube

The Wizard Joseph

Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 07, 2020, 04:30:11 PM
Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on August 07, 2020, 04:16:53 AM
Look I want Donnie off the throne probably more than most, but Biden is causing me to doubt his ability to do that under any circumstances. I'm still voting against Trump, but I have just about had it with this ridiculous age of decline Punch and Judy show bullshit. It's clear to me now that Biden cannot help but shove his whole leg hip deep in his mouth on a regular basis. I sincerely doubt that the Democrats even want to win if out of ALL OTHER OPTIONS they have put Biden up seemingly more or less by fiat. I am pissed off. Maybe I just need to cool down, but I can't say I even want to participate in this farce. I will because the future of the most godawful, powerful nation in history is at stake, but FUCK THESE ASSCLOWNS MAN!!

Got it out of my system, but FUUUUCK...

(bolding mine)

Biden won the required number of delegates, by the vote of the electorate.

I am unsure what the problem is, here.  This is how the system works.

You're right it wasn't by fiat. It just SEEMS like it to me. I am on the razors edge of my very last fuck. Maybe it's more comforting to think that they're crooked rather than relresenting folks betting on this particular horse willingly. Either way I doubt they're in it to win it. Maybe it's more comforting to think that too if this is the best an honest and fair electoral process can do. Is it ok if I'm a little bit wrong in my perspective when angry enough to chew hornets?

Quote from: LMNO on August 07, 2020, 04:33:20 PM
TWJ, the Democrats are not the Leftists.  The majority of Americans, apparently, do not want radical structural change; and they chose their candidate accordingly.

I'm not saying I like their choice, but that's who the majority of Dems want.

I did not say anything about any of that. He's incompetent and seems unable to stop punching himself. I do not in fact give a shit about "leftist" politics or any other at this point. The left is pretty much in a self imposed exile of disunity and I would in fact prefer a fucking iron clad autocracy to the ongoing shitshow if I thought it had a chance getting the virus and social collapse under control. Not an endorsement of autocracy. Just an illustration of the depth of my disgust and outright despair.

Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 07, 2020, 05:04:42 PM
Quote from: Cramulus on August 07, 2020, 04:44:55 PM
I always remember Jon Stewart's point on Crossfire, when they were needling him about whether John Kerry was the best possible choice to represent democrats.

And he basically said  "elections are not about who is best at governing.. elections are about who is best at winning elections."

This is why a constitutional monarchy seems to be the best system of human governance.

However, Britain has shown that humans can even fuck THAT up.

You know maybe in a broader sense I'm done with humans. It's a statement of faith to say we are able to rule ourselves, an absurd one against the backdrop of known history. So much so that we fantasize about abstracted, idealized utopias and Kingdom of Prester John "benevolent dictators" as something to aspire to.

Quote

what I wanted didn't happen, even though I clearly expressed that I wanted it.
Posted by: Doktor Howl
« on: Today at 05:04:42 pm »Insert Quote

All I want is competency. It's not anywhere to be found. If complaining or ranting means I'm "butthurt" as if I did it to myself... How exactly is that so? How exactly am I to blame?

Maybe I just shouldn't talk at all. Ya know? It's not helping anything. Opening my mouth to complain IS my doing, but if that's butthurt or otherwise invalid around here guess the joke is on me.

I need a break from politics I think. Hopefully the woefully inadequate last, best chance for American democracy can keep himself from marginalizing and insulting folks he needs votes from. Obviously that's out of my hands though. I just resent that my only alternative to a fascist dictator keeps handing artillery to his opponent.
You can't get out backward.  You have to go forward to go back.. better press on! - Willie Wonka, PBUH

Life can be seen as a game with no reset button, no extra lives, and if the power goes out there is no restarting.  If that's all you see life as you are not long for this world, and never will get it.

"Ayn Rand never swung a hammer in her life and had serious dominance issues" - The Fountainhead

"World domination is such an ugly phrase. I prefer to call it world optimisation."
- Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality :lulz:

"You program the controller to do the thing, only it doesn't do the thing.  It does something else entirely, or nothing at all.  It's like voting."
- Billy, Aug 21st, 2019

"It's not even chaos anymore. It's BANAL."
- Doktor Hamish Howl

Cain

Quote"You take your natural vices and call them virtues.  Of which geed is the most despicable.  That and betrayal of commonality.  After all, whoever decided that competition is always and without exception a healthy attribute?  Why that particular path to self-esteem?  Your heel on the hand of the one below.  This is worth something?  Let me tell you, it's worth nothing.  Nothing lasting.  Every monument that exists beyond the moment – no matter which king, emperor or warrior lays claim to it – is actually a testament to the common, to co-operation, to the plural rather than the singular."

"Ah," Tehol interjected, managing to raise a finger to mark his objection, "without a king, general or whomever – without a leader, no monument gets built."

"Only because you mortals know only two possibilities.  To follow or lead.  Nothing else."

"Hold on.  I've seen consortiums and co-operatives at work, Bugg.  They're nightmares."

"Aye, breeding grounds for all those virtues such as greed, envy, betrayal and so on.  In other words, each within the group seeks to impose a structure of followers and leaders.  Dispense with a formal hierarchy, and you have a contest of personalities."

"So what's the solution?"

"Would you be greatly disappointed to hear that you're not it?"

"Who?  Me?"

"Your species.  Don't feel bad.  None have been, as of yet.  Still, who knows what the future will bring?"

The Wizard Joseph

Gonna have to read this "Midnight Tides".
You can't get out backward.  You have to go forward to go back.. better press on! - Willie Wonka, PBUH

Life can be seen as a game with no reset button, no extra lives, and if the power goes out there is no restarting.  If that's all you see life as you are not long for this world, and never will get it.

"Ayn Rand never swung a hammer in her life and had serious dominance issues" - The Fountainhead

"World domination is such an ugly phrase. I prefer to call it world optimisation."
- Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality :lulz:

"You program the controller to do the thing, only it doesn't do the thing.  It does something else entirely, or nothing at all.  It's like voting."
- Billy, Aug 21st, 2019

"It's not even chaos anymore. It's BANAL."
- Doktor Hamish Howl

Doktor Howl

Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on August 07, 2020, 05:49:29 PM
You're right it wasn't by fiat. It just SEEMS like it to me. I am on the razors edge of my very last fuck. Maybe it's more comforting to think that they're crooked rather than relresenting folks betting on this particular horse willingly. Either way I doubt they're in it to win it. Maybe it's more comforting to think that too if this is the best an honest and fair electoral process can do. Is it ok if I'm a little bit wrong in my perspective when angry enough to chew hornets?

I am the last person in the world to tell someone to calm down.  :lol:

That being said, echo chambers are gonna echo chamber.  If all you're talking to is radical leftists, I can see why you'd be mad about this (and where the notion that it was by fiat originally came from).

Is Biden my ideal candidate?  No.  He was my number 5 pick, out of 7.  But to think that he's even remotely as bad as Trump is ridiculous, and given current circumstances, it's hardly any surprise that he's outperforming Trump as much as he outperformed Bernie Sanders.  Gonna let you in on the Nenslo principle, here:

"When the house is burning down, nobody wants a radical."

This is why Trump's popularity has tanked, and it's why all the leftist candidates got slaughtered.  Most people right now want some normalcy, regardless of how rotten and corrupt the system is as a whole.

QuoteI did not say anything about any of that. He's incompetent and seems unable to stop punching himself. I do not in fact give a shit about "leftist" politics or any other at this point. The left is pretty much in a self imposed exile of disunity and I would in fact prefer a fucking iron clad autocracy to the ongoing shitshow if I thought it had a chance getting the virus and social collapse under control. Not an endorsement of autocracy. Just an illustration of the depth of my disgust and outright despair.

Nobody gives a shit about gaffes.  They're voting for another 4 years of Obama, or the next best thing.

QuoteYou know maybe in a broader sense I'm done with humans. It's a statement of faith to say we are able to rule ourselves, an absurd one against the backdrop of known history. So much so that we fantasize about abstracted, idealized utopias and Kingdom of Prester John "benevolent dictators" as something to aspire to.

It's the only game in town.

QuoteAll I want is competency. It's not anywhere to be found. If complaining or ranting means I'm "butthurt" as if I did it to myself... How exactly is that so? How exactly am I to blame?

Maybe I just shouldn't talk at all. Ya know? It's not helping anything. Opening my mouth to complain IS my doing, but if that's butthurt or otherwise invalid around here guess the joke is on me.

I need a break from politics I think. Hopefully the woefully inadequate last, best chance for American democracy can keep himself from marginalizing and insulting folks he needs votes from. Obviously that's out of my hands though. I just resent that my only alternative to a fascist dictator keeps handing artillery to his opponent.

You need to hear some perspectives other than The Best of Leftbook.

I say that being a lefty of the old school.
Molon Lube

Doktor Howl

Well.

https://apnews.com/16face02db6c4946b66e38834a351ca0

QuoteLast-ditch virus aid talks collapse; no new help for jobless

Economy fails utterly by Friday of next week.
Molon Lube

The Wizard Joseph

Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 07, 2020, 10:52:33 PM
Well.

https://apnews.com/16face02db6c4946b66e38834a351ca0

QuoteLast-ditch virus aid talks collapse; no new help for jobless

Economy fails utterly by Friday of next week.

:kingmeh: I'm already at the point where I'm resorting to sleight of hand shoplifting to survive because there's no work and the SNAP benefits hotline is straight up not taking calls. I'm EXTREMELY lucky to have a friend willing to let me squat in his currently disused dojo. Almost everyone I know personally that applied for unemployment has not seen a dime or gotten a stimulus check. People are violently desperate. If mass unrest is what they want, it's coming.
You can't get out backward.  You have to go forward to go back.. better press on! - Willie Wonka, PBUH

Life can be seen as a game with no reset button, no extra lives, and if the power goes out there is no restarting.  If that's all you see life as you are not long for this world, and never will get it.

"Ayn Rand never swung a hammer in her life and had serious dominance issues" - The Fountainhead

"World domination is such an ugly phrase. I prefer to call it world optimisation."
- Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality :lulz:

"You program the controller to do the thing, only it doesn't do the thing.  It does something else entirely, or nothing at all.  It's like voting."
- Billy, Aug 21st, 2019

"It's not even chaos anymore. It's BANAL."
- Doktor Hamish Howl

Doktor Howl

Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on August 07, 2020, 11:08:38 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 07, 2020, 10:52:33 PM
Well.

https://apnews.com/16face02db6c4946b66e38834a351ca0

QuoteLast-ditch virus aid talks collapse; no new help for jobless

Economy fails utterly by Friday of next week.

:kingmeh: I'm already at the point where I'm resorting to sleight of hand shoplifting to survive because there's no work and the SNAP benefits hotline is straight up not taking calls. I'm EXTREMELY lucky to have a friend willing to let me squat in his currently disused dojo. Almost everyone I know personally that applied for unemployment has not seen a dime or gotten a stimulus check. People are violently desperate. If mass unrest is what they want, it's coming.

It's almost as if McConnell and Trump were trying to deliberately tank November.
Molon Lube

The Wizard Joseph

Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 07, 2020, 11:40:24 PM
Quote from: The Wizard Joseph on August 07, 2020, 11:08:38 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 07, 2020, 10:52:33 PM
Well.

https://apnews.com/16face02db6c4946b66e38834a351ca0

QuoteLast-ditch virus aid talks collapse; no new help for jobless

Economy fails utterly by Friday of next week.

:kingmeh: I'm already at the point where I'm resorting to sleight of hand shoplifting to survive because there's no work and the SNAP benefits hotline is straight up not taking calls. I'm EXTREMELY lucky to have a friend willing to let me squat in his currently disused dojo. Almost everyone I know personally that applied for unemployment has not seen a dime or gotten a stimulus check. People are violently desperate. If mass unrest is what they want, it's coming.

It's almost as if McConnell and Trump were trying to deliberately tank November.

I am preparing as well as I can for the eventuality that they may well succeed.
You can't get out backward.  You have to go forward to go back.. better press on! - Willie Wonka, PBUH

Life can be seen as a game with no reset button, no extra lives, and if the power goes out there is no restarting.  If that's all you see life as you are not long for this world, and never will get it.

"Ayn Rand never swung a hammer in her life and had serious dominance issues" - The Fountainhead

"World domination is such an ugly phrase. I prefer to call it world optimisation."
- Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality :lulz:

"You program the controller to do the thing, only it doesn't do the thing.  It does something else entirely, or nothing at all.  It's like voting."
- Billy, Aug 21st, 2019

"It's not even chaos anymore. It's BANAL."
- Doktor Hamish Howl

Faust

Quote from: Doktor Howl on August 07, 2020, 05:04:42 PM
Quote from: Cramulus on August 07, 2020, 04:44:55 PM
I always remember Jon Stewart's point on Crossfire, when they were needling him about whether John Kerry was the best possible choice to represent democrats.

And he basically said  "elections are not about who is best at governing.. elections are about who is best at winning elections."

This is why a constitutional monarchy seems to be the best system of human governance.

However, Britain has shown that humans can even fuck THAT up.

Ireland uses proportional representation with transferrable vote, for the party, not the leader of the party (still think having a presidential election is a massive distraction, and the circus that feeds that appeal to persona).
We have three parties in government in a coalition, none of which can pass legislation because of the tug of war, it works fairly well. If you like a schizophrenic mess of a gov, and I do because they cant interfere as much this way, then it works pretty well
Sleepless nights at the chateau

Doktor Howl

Biden got off the pot.

It's Harris, who was my first choice in the primary.

https://apnews.com/5ac8fff8bbe1c70479604e3ff62ecb10
Molon Lube

Juana

I do not especially like her but the veep debate will be a thing of beauty. she will pin Pence like a butterfly and wipe the floor with him.
"I dispose of obsolete meat machines.  Not because I hate them (I do) and not because they deserve it (they do), but because they are in the way and those older ones don't meet emissions codes.  They emit too much.  You don't like them and I don't like them, so spare me the hysteria."

altered

Strongly dislike Harris for the entrenched, punitive transphobic nonsense she pushes.

But I was fearing Tulsi. And my response to her can be found in the newsfeed.
"I am that worst of all type of criminal...I cannot bring myself to do what you tell me, because you told me."

There's over 100 of us in this meat-suit. You'd think it runs like a ship, but it's more like a hundred and ten angry ghosts having an old-school QuakeWorld tournament, three people desperately trying to make sure the gamers don't go hungry or soil themselves, and the Facilities manager weeping in the corner as the garbage piles high.