Principia Discordia

Principia Discordia => Or Kill Me => Topic started by: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 07:18:00 AM

Title: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 07:18:00 AM
So, the other day I was there with my friends, in a park. Being homeless, I had slept in this particular park before, and in that instance had been awoken by police officers the next morning who had taken down my information and warned me that I was not allowed to sleep in that park.
One day I was in the local market, selling copies of my artwork. One person who was very interested in picking up a set of all the ones I had on me confessed that he didn't have any money, but asked me if I'd like to trade him for some Acid. Being the loveable psychonaut that I am, I happily agreed, and gave him four photocopied peices of paper for two chemical-soaked peices of paper.
(I won't go into the details of the trip, but it was damned good Acid. We're talking real LSD here, none of this 2c-* stuff. Not that I dislike phenylethylmines.)
As the night went, though, granted that I was up and awake and flying all night, people kept asking me if I'd be sticking around long enough for me to watch their things. I didn't really have any plans except to chill in the park and dance, so I happily agreed. As time went on, things kept piling up and up, and people would go... But not come back.
By the time 5am rolled around, I was surrounded by three sleeping bodies (one of which had also been asked to watch things, two who didn't care if they got caught sleeping in the park) and a slew of bags, trinkets, and even a bicycle. Having spend hours and hours taxing my body, I started to grow weary, and, with the LSD beginning to wear off, I began giving more and more contemplation to sleeping in the park with my companion, the one who had also been asked to watch things. Just as the first hints of pre-sunrise blue started to breach the horizon, I propped up my bag to use as a pillow, and passed out.
In what seemed like mere moments later, I was awoken by a soft kick to the boot. I opened my eyes, and much to my chagrin, there was a police officer standing over me. I sat up, and was shocked to find four of them! They had come in three cars!
Each of the four of us who had slept in the park was being taken care of by a different officer. Mine pulled me aside and asked for my identification. I gave him my health card and offered my birth certificate, to which he declined. I referred to him as "Sir" and "Officer". When he asked me a question, I politely and dutifully answered in full detail; he asked me my name, and I offered both my legal name and my alias, and even offered to spell it for him. I showed him all my tattoos and identifying markings, et cetera, et cetera. He apologized for the hassle, to which I told him I understood, that he was just doing his job.
The four officers went back to the cars with our respective IDs. During this time I was informed by my friends that we were getting ticketed; a $125 fine! Just for sleeping in the park!
After a moment passed, the officers came back, each with a peice of idenfication and a peice of paper. The officer assigned to me waved his hand away from the others, and handed me both. I opened the ticket, and the first thing I noticed was that my last name had been spelled wrong. He then said to me, "Sorry about all this, but I've got to go through all the procedures and everything." I went to absolve him again, but he continued, "But if you'll look there, you'll see your last name is spelled wrong. You don't have to worry about it."
The others all recieved $125 fines. I got off scott free.

Why?

People do things to be things. In this particular instance, this officer went to college and law school to get a job with the police. He wanted respect, he wanted authority... He wanted to be treated like an Officer. I treated him like an officer, and he treated me like I wanted to be treated; a good, honest, under-the-radar punk kid.
People do what it takes to be doctors or firefighters 'cos they want to be treated like lifesavers. People act like gangsta thugs 'cos they want to be treated like they have power and personal freedom (and in this society, having money does mean having power and personal freedom). People become soldiers because they value unity and they want to feel like they are a part of something big.
Nature and Nurture arise together to form in a person's mind what they think is Really Cool, and then the more enterprising of us go off and do whatever it takes to be Really Cool. When you disrupt a person's fantasy-life by treating them how they don't want to be treated, animosity quickly builds up and said person will (in the instance where they have the option) take effective measures to remove you from their life, or (in the instance where they don't have that option, or don't realize they have that option), seek to force you to empathize with their position by treating you in a way that you don't like to be treated.
It doesn't feel good, does it? Then why are you doing it?
However, when you act in a way that is congruent with someone's fantasy, you have nothing but all to gain. You stand not only to inherit the benefits of what someone in their particular position and disposition has to offer (in my case, an 'accidental' misspelling), but also, they will be more likely to indulge you in your fantasies.

Mahatma Ghandi once said, "Be the change you wish to see in the world." Be fantastic, and the world will be fantastic to you.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Lies on September 25, 2007, 08:06:38 AM
:mittens:

Can't wait to see what TGRR has to say about this one :lol:

And as I had discussed some place else with Kaienne but to share my thoughts on this piece...

While I totally dig and respect how you handled the situation, and getting off scott free being your reward for the respect and understanding you showed towards the mentality of those who are simply doing their jobs, my approach to dealing with those who threaten me with fines (well, in my case it has always been the public transport "authorities") that I feel are total BS is to question them with things that force them to become introspective about what it is they are doing, but always in a polite manner with the guise that I'm an idiot who's curious about how great their job must be.

I ask them, are they proud of the job they are doing? Is it what they imagined they would be doing with their lives when they were leaving school and taking charge of their life? is their family proud? How does it feel to know that they are making society a better and safer place by issuing me the fine they are trying to push on me? Does the actual reasoning as to why I'm getting a fine really make sense them and are they are giving it to me because its "just", or are they just doing their jobs trying to get by like everyone else? Weren't the nazis just doing their jobs as well, and if so did that excuse them from what we all know was wrong? (Ok, thats usually where I stop sounding like a curious idiot and definitely do come across as a bit of a smart arse).

The answers I get back always manage to get me smiling with a secret knowing, because regardless of what they say, the look on their faces and body language always tells me they were uncomfortable with having to think introspectively about their life, because they really don't like the answers they know they would have to say if they were going to be honest with themselves and me.

And yes, I do the cop the fine sweet in the end. But in mind it is a small price to pay knowing that I've planted the seeds of doubt and change, and I have a lot of faith in the butterfly effect, so really the only thing I personally get out of my approach is the knowing that with a little luck, maybe, just maybe, I may have helped someone else get an invitation to the prison break. (Not to mention the fact I end up disputing the fine in court and play them at their own game and have so far managed to win my cases, which pretty much affirms to me I was right to begin with...)

But yeah, I don't recommend my method if you are trying to stop yourself from getting a fine, but it works for me and I find there is a personal reward in it.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: LMNO on September 25, 2007, 01:33:17 PM
Hold on... If you're homeless and broke, how are you posting this?
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Lies on September 25, 2007, 01:40:41 PM
From a friends place zhes been residing at the last day or two
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: hunter s.durden on September 25, 2007, 01:58:10 PM
 :mittens:

Possibly the first useful thing Iv'e read by you.

Cops piss me off, but the fact is you've gotta play the game. Acting like a little twerp won't get you off.


"Hey, you fucking pigs, I just wanted to sleep!!!"
"Oh, well, I never thought of it that way. Go in peace friend!"

That conversation is unlikely.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Cain on September 25, 2007, 02:03:12 PM
Of course, the problem comes when you profile the person in charge wrong, and play according to the stereotype, not the person.  For example, my friend's dad became a cop after someone in his town was killed it was suspected body was dumped in the sea.  He ran boats out, doing diving trips for tourists.  Because of the time it would take to get divers down from London, he volunteered to help.  Afterwards, he signed up to the force, because of a lack of experienced divers.  Never planned to be a cop, not that interested in the power of the position. 

Just a little caveat.  For the most part, you'll be fine, but generalization can screw anything up.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: hunter s.durden on September 25, 2007, 02:06:37 PM
So I shouldn't be polite and submissive to him?
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: LMNO on September 25, 2007, 02:13:57 PM
Quote from: hunter s.durden on September 25, 2007, 02:06:37 PM
So I shouldn't be polite and submissive to him?



When I read this, my worldveiw twisted inside out.





Hunter?  Polite and submissive?
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Cain on September 25, 2007, 02:17:08 PM
Quote from: hunter s.durden on September 25, 2007, 02:06:37 PM
So I shouldn't be polite and submissive to him?

Depends if he thinks you're doing it simply to try and appease him or not.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: hunter s.durden on September 25, 2007, 02:18:16 PM
Playin' the game, baby, just playin' the game.

When the option is tuck the tail and walk away, or stand up and go to jail, I know where I stand.

Usually.

Protest is a different animal...
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 02:56:27 PM
Quote from: Cain on September 25, 2007, 02:03:12 PM
Of course, the problem comes when you profile the person in charge wrong, and play according to the stereotype, not the person.  For example, my friend's dad became a cop after someone in his town was killed it was suspected body was dumped in the sea.  He ran boats out, doing diving trips for tourists.  Because of the time it would take to get divers down from London, he volunteered to help.  Afterwards, he signed up to the force, because of a lack of experienced divers.  Never planned to be a cop, not that interested in the power of the position. 

Just a little caveat.  For the most part, you'll be fine, but generalization can screw anything up.

Even in such an instance, it probably doesn't hurt to refer to him as "Sir". Although naturally every encounter with every person you meet should be dealt with on a one-for-one basis; even positive predjudice is still predjudice.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Cain on September 25, 2007, 02:59:17 PM
Oh yeah, definitely.  Politeness is good and all, but overly subservient may make some wonder.  Fine lines, distinctions and all that.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 03:10:53 PM
Well, like, for instance, I was talking to one guy who read it, and he gave me his interpretation of how to act upon that sort of situation, with a police officer; his list of politenesses included not making eye contact, and I said noooo. The officer may be in a position of authority, but simmer everything off, and what you're left with is one human being talking to another human being. Giving them power- not authority or respect, but power- they don't need only gives them the allowance to abuse it. Not necessarily saying they will, but they now have the option. The walkable fine line is one where you establish, through mannerisms and body language, that you will politely allow them to be anything they want to be, as long as they let you be anything you want to be, 'an ye harm none.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Payne on September 25, 2007, 03:50:45 PM
tl;dr
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: LMNO on September 25, 2007, 03:56:09 PM
NEEDS MOAR STEAMPUNK.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 03:58:06 PM
Quote from: LMNO on September 25, 2007, 03:56:09 PM
NEEDS MOAR STEAMPUNK.

I know wit isn't exactly your forte, so I'll pretend like I'm actually hurt.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: LMNO on September 25, 2007, 04:03:46 PM
You're so good to me.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Littlest Ubermensch on September 25, 2007, 04:28:02 PM
Wait a minute, you mean to say people's actions are often determined by social positions they wish to fill? By God, this is indeed some of the most illuminating information I've ever come across!

Teach me oh wise one.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 04:32:51 PM
As simple of a concept as it is, you'd be suprised at how many people don't actually understand it... And even then, those who do often possess an unworded understanding, and oftentimes appreciate having someone quantify it into plain language.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: East Coast Hustle on September 25, 2007, 04:40:18 PM
"urban shaman"?

:lulz:

Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Littlest Ubermensch on September 25, 2007, 04:40:55 PM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 04:32:51 PM
As simple of a concept as it is, you'd be suprised at how many people don't actually understand it... And even then, those who do often possess an unworded understanding, and oftentimes appreciate having someone quantify it into plain language.

1. I somehow doubt that we are those people.
2. If this was intended towards marketing to the average person, who wouldn't have a concept of that, the point would be lost on them entirely. Rather than go "hmm, here's an interesting view of social interactions I had never considered before" or "I'd been thinking this, but was waiting for someone to write this", they'd go "hey look, some homeless hippy bum wrote about themselves and had stupid ideas on drugs. What's that Mr. Trashcan? You want this? Well okay." Or you'd get dumb "counterculture" kids reading it going "damn straight. What a bunch of conformists. I'm so glad I'm not like that".
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 04:48:41 PM
Someone else coined the phrase in reference to me.

Quote from: The Littlest Ubermensch on September 25, 2007, 04:40:55 PM
1. I somehow doubt that we are those people.
2. If this was intended towards marketing to the average person, who wouldn't have a concept of that, the point would be lost on them entirely. Rather than go "hmm, here's an interesting view of social interactions I had never considered before" or "I'd been thinking this, but was waiting for someone to write this", they'd go "hey look, some homeless hippy bum wrote about themselves and had stupid ideas on drugs. What's that Mr. Trashcan? You want this? Well okay." Or you'd get dumb "counterculture" kids reading it going "damn straight. What a bunch of conformists. I'm so glad I'm not like that".

I actually wrote the article for a journal where I keep my own little personal thoughts on stuff like this. I had no intention of posting it here, until Lysergic suggested I do so because Rog might enjoy it.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Suu on September 25, 2007, 04:58:13 PM
(http://blogs.experience.com/technologychannel/uploaded_images/tarp-30198-795894.jpg)
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Lies on September 25, 2007, 05:40:09 PM
*sigh* fuck you guys. This was a decent thread, just because Kai made another thread that you guys didn't like didn't mean you had to ruin this one.

I mean, come on. I respect you guys too much to have to tell you you're being cock fuckers.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: LMNO on September 25, 2007, 05:45:43 PM
Ok, ok... it's a good example of trying to keep your head down and picking your battles.

It shows why having (or at leat showing) respect can be a useful tool.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Lies on September 25, 2007, 05:53:31 PM
Thanks for that.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: LMNO on September 25, 2007, 05:55:01 PM
Of course, it also shows that if you dress like an industrial goth gutterpunk, drop acid, and fall asleep in the park, you'll most likely get woken up by a group of cops.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 05:57:40 PM
Quote from: LMNO on September 25, 2007, 05:55:01 PM
Of course, it also shows that if you dress like an industrial goth gutterpunk, drop acid, and fall asleep in the park, you'll most likely get woken up by a group of cops.
And knowing is half the battle.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Doktor Loki on September 25, 2007, 06:04:02 PM
If you're gonna be a criminal, know how to deal with cops.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Cain on September 25, 2007, 06:07:14 PM
Quote from: Doktor Loki on September 25, 2007, 06:04:02 PM
If you're gonna be a criminal, know how to deal with cops.

Irrelevant in my town.

Cain,
knoas the cops only arrest people in cars, or too unconscious to protest.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Triple Zero on September 25, 2007, 06:08:10 PM
i did read the piece of text, and quite frankly, i'm (pleasantly) surprised by the level of insight you're displaying.

yeah that may sound a bit condescending, this is because of the other thing i want to say. apparently, from the story, i see you do have the ability to consider the way you come across to different people and to adapt your behaviour to the sort of person you're communicating with.
so, why did this go wrong and apparently is still going wrong, posting on this messageboard?
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 06:17:15 PM
J'm being insufferable on purpose. J'm just an asshole. :D
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Littlest Ubermensch on September 25, 2007, 06:17:59 PM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 06:17:15 PM
J'm being insufferable on purpose. J'm just an asshole. :D

I'm going to guess more OUTLANDISH than an asshole.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Lies on September 25, 2007, 06:20:12 PM
Ok, I'm staying out of all this now.

Have fun everyone. Hail Eris.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 06:20:32 PM
Potato, potahto.

Hail!
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Doktor Loki on September 25, 2007, 06:23:21 PM
No.  Just potato.

Nobody says potahto.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: That One Guy on September 25, 2007, 06:34:49 PM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 06:17:15 PM
J'm being insufferable on purpose. J'm just an asshole. :D

We know - it's not like it's the first time anyone has ever done so, whether around here or IRL. Care to actually contribute in spite of it, like some around here do? Or do you just care to be an asshole for its own sake? I'm not up to dealing with masses of pointless bullshit, and I have things to do today, so if its to be just the pointless bullshit (OP notwithstanding - there's some good stuff in there) because you "want to" then I'll just ignore all of this and go on with my day. This might mean that useful shit gets missed, but that's the price you pay when you intentionally stir shit for no good reason - the baby gets tossed with the proverbial bathwater every time.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 26, 2007, 01:01:50 AM
They started it. :(

J'll be as intelligent to everyone else as they are with me. When J come here and get flamed for no reason other than the fact that people have grudges against me, J'll hold grudges and sling shit. If people actually post honest queries to the things J've said or done, J'll give honest answers.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Triple Zero on September 26, 2007, 01:07:10 AM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 26, 2007, 01:01:50 AM
They started it. :(

for fucks sake ..

if people wouldn't be able to get over such things they would never even get past the traditional "fuck you" welcome to the forums.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Suu on September 26, 2007, 01:23:13 AM
Quote from: Cain on September 25, 2007, 06:07:14 PM
Quote from: Doktor Loki on September 25, 2007, 06:04:02 PM
If you're gonna be a criminal, know how to deal with cops.

Irrelevant in my town.

Cain,
knoas the cops only arrest people in cars, or too unconscious to protest.

Sounds like you need Nicholas Angel!

(http://www.workingtitlefilms.com/photos/news/146/SP350-01.jpg)
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Chairman Risus on September 26, 2007, 01:31:27 AM
    Fuck yeah!
             \\
(http://www.popentertainment.com/NickFrostHOT1588R.jpg)
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: PopeTom on September 26, 2007, 10:36:16 AM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 05:57:40 PM
Quote from: LMNO on September 25, 2007, 05:55:01 PM
Of course, it also shows that if you dress like an industrial goth gutterpunk, drop acid, and fall asleep in the park, you'll most likely get woken up by a group of cops.
And knowing is half the battle.

Yo Joe!
     \\
(http://www.tomsimpson.org/images/gijoe.jpg)
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: hunter s.durden on September 26, 2007, 02:21:46 PM
Quote from: triple zero on September 26, 2007, 01:07:10 AM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 26, 2007, 01:01:50 AM
They started it. :(

for fucks sake ..

if people wouldn't be able to get over such things they would never even get past the traditional "fuck you" welcome to the forums.

Most don't.

You're welcome.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: LMNO on September 26, 2007, 02:23:32 PM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 26, 2007, 01:01:50 AM
They started it. :(

J'll be as intelligent to everyone else as they are with me. When J come here and get flamed for no reason other than the fact that people have grudges against me, J'll hold grudges and sling shit. If people actually post honest queries to the things J've said or done, J'll give honest answers.


y'know, if you look at the chronological post history, the flames only started after you started acting like a dumbass.


::hands Kai a gas can::
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: hunter s.durden on September 26, 2007, 02:27:52 PM
Quote from: Lysergic on September 25, 2007, 05:40:09 PM
*sigh* fuck you guys. This was a decent thread, just because Kai made another thread that you guys didn't like didn't mean you had to ruin this one.

Hi, I'm Hunter...

I thought we'd met?
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: PopeTom on September 27, 2007, 12:47:13 AM
Quote from: LMNO on September 26, 2007, 02:23:32 PM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 26, 2007, 01:01:50 AM
They started it. :(

J'll be as intelligent to everyone else as they are with me. When J come here and get flamed for no reason other than the fact that people have grudges against me, J'll hold grudges and sling shit. If people actually post honest queries to the things J've said or done, J'll give honest answers.


y'know, if you look at the chronological post history, the flames only started after you started acting like a dumbass.


::hands Kai a gas can::

But of course anyone who posts to forums long enough will have a chance to be the dumbass.

We all have out off days.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: faust on September 27, 2007, 01:55:05 AM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 25, 2007, 07:18:00 AM
So, the other day I was there with my friends, in a park. Being homeless, I had slept in this particular park before, and in that instance had been awoken by police officers the next morning who had taken down my information and warned me that I was not allowed to sleep in that park.
One day I was in the local market, selling copies of my artwork. One person who was very interested in picking up a set of all the ones I had on me confessed that he didn't have any money, but asked me if I'd like to trade him for some Acid. Being the loveable psychonaut that I am, I happily agreed, and gave him four photocopied peices of paper for two chemical-soaked peices of paper.
(I won't go into the details of the trip, but it was damned good Acid. We're talking real LSD here, none of this 2c-* stuff. Not that I dislike phenylethylmines.)
As the night went, though, granted that I was up and awake and flying all night, people kept asking me if I'd be sticking around long enough for me to watch their things.
I didn't really have any plans except to chill in the park and dance, so I happily agreed. As time went on, things kept piling up and up, and people would go... But not come back.
By the time 5am rolled around, I was surrounded by three sleeping bodies (one of which had also been asked to watch things, two who didn't care if they got caught sleeping in the park) and a slew of bags, trinkets, and even a bicycle. Having spend hours and hours taxing my body, I started to grow weary, and, with the LSD beginning to wear off, I began giving more and more contemplation to sleeping in the park with my companion, the one who had also been asked to watch things. Just as the first hints of pre-sunrise blue started to breach the horizon, I propped up my bag to use as a pillow, and passed out.
In what seemed like mere moments later, I was awoken by a soft kick to the boot. I opened my eyes, and much to my chagrin, there was a police officer standing over me. I sat up, and was shocked to find four of them! They had come in three cars!
Each of the four of us who had slept in the park was being taken care of by a different officer. Mine pulled me aside and asked for my identification. I gave him my health card and offered my birth certificate, to which he declined. I referred to him as "Sir" and "Officer". When he asked me a question, I politely and dutifully answered in full detail; he asked me my name, and I offered both my legal name and my alias, and even offered to spell it for him. I showed him all my tattoos and identifying markings, et cetera, et cetera. He apologized for the hassle, to which I told him I understood, that he was just doing his job.
The four officers went back to the cars with our respective IDs. During this time I was informed by my friends that we were getting ticketed; a $125 fine! Just for sleeping in the park!
After a moment passed, the officers came back, each with a peice of idenfication and a peice of paper. The officer assigned to me waved his hand away from the others, and handed me both. I opened the ticket, and the first thing I noticed was that my last name had been spelled wrong. He then said to me, "Sorry about all this, but I've got to go through all the procedures and everything." I went to absolve him again, but he continued, "But if you'll look there, you'll see your last name is spelled wrong. You don't have to worry about it."
The others all recieved $125 fines. I got off scott free.

Why?

People do things to be things. In this particular instance, this officer went to college and law school to get a job with the police. He wanted respect, he wanted authority... He wanted to be treated like an Officer. I treated him like an officer, and he treated me like I wanted to be treated; a good, honest, under-the-radar punk kid.
People do what it takes to be doctors or firefighters 'cos they want to be treated like lifesavers. People act like gangsta thugs 'cos they want to be treated like they have power and personal freedom (and in this society, having money does mean having power and personal freedom). People become soldiers because they value unity and they want to feel like they are a part of something big.
Nature and Nurture arise together to form in a person's mind what they think is Really Cool, and then the more enterprising of us go off and do whatever it takes to be Really Cool. When you disrupt a person's fantasy-life by treating them how they don't want to be treated, animosity quickly builds up and said person will (in the instance where they have the option) take effective measures to remove you from their life, or (in the instance where they don't have that option, or don't realize they have that option), seek to force you to empathize with their position by treating you in a way that you don't like to be treated.
It doesn't feel good, does it? Then why are you doing it?
However, when you act in a way that is congruent with someone's fantasy, you have nothing but all to gain. You stand not only to inherit the benefits of what someone in their particular position and disposition has to offer (in my case, an 'accidental' misspelling), but also, they will be more likely to indulge you in your fantasies.

Mahatma Ghandi once said, "Be the change you wish to see in the world." Be fantastic, and the world will be fantastic to you.

you got one of the decent ones, I dunno bout america but in ireland the garda are formed mostly of tight collar creeps who become garda's just for that chance encounter of the guy who stole their lunch money.
Dealing with impolite people is probably a cliché to them, as is dealing with people who are fearful and subservient, treating them as human and using a reasonable conversational tone has gotten me out of more shit then I can count on both hands.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 27, 2007, 02:31:44 AM
The cops in Toronto are awesome. There's even a place in Kensington Market where you can go in, roll up a joint inside, and then take it to the back patio to smoke it. It's called the Hot Box Cafe. :D
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: faust on September 27, 2007, 02:57:55 AM
oh come on you can do better then that.
for someone who claims to be non conformist, judging the standards of your police from the point of view of joint rolling freedom? just saying it falls into the "fight the establishment" *smokes a shit load of weed*  stereotype.
next you will be telling me you have a replica katana and a fedora
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 27, 2007, 03:07:19 AM
While I own neither of these, they are on my Christmas list.

I use the example of joint-rolling freedom as a medium for weighing police chillness as the reaction of police to marijuana in Canada varies greatly from "Don't care" to "JAIL, MUTHAFUCKA!".
I personally judge the standards of police by their willingness to talk to me; granted I do look like I got lost on my way to the new Mad Max movie set. The park I spend the majority of my time at has an enormous reputation for drug use, so the police come by or through several times a day, in cars or on bikes, respectively. I've found the officers from 14 Division (the division that polices the like, 6 block radius the park is a park of) to be exceptionally friendly.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: faust on September 27, 2007, 03:20:21 AM
whenever I had to call in the garda to take away people they were generally nice enough, only once did I have an asshole garda, and all he did was act gruff and say "go back to your own country" to the guy I had arrested.
everyone I ever had to stop I was polite to if they were polite to me.
the one guy who I offered to leave off, who shat on that and he ran away,  I mugged. (ripped his jacket in half to get back store goods).
I only ever had one person get violent when stopped, and I accidentally stuck my thumb in his eye when trying to grab his arms. he started screaming assault.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 27, 2007, 03:41:15 AM
Where do you work? Are you with the police?
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: faust on September 27, 2007, 04:00:43 AM
I was security in an off license beside a homeless shelter.
before I quit it had gotten to about 2 arrests a day, and drunks following me around town shouting shit.
was not fun.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Sir Squid Diddimus on September 27, 2007, 05:19:59 AM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 27, 2007, 03:07:19 AM
While I own neither of these, they are on my Christmas list.

I use the example of joint-rolling freedom as a medium for weighing police chillness as the reaction of police to marijuana in Canada varies greatly from "Don't care" to "JAIL, MUTHAFUCKA!".
I personally judge the standards of police by their willingness to talk to me; granted I do look like I got lost on my way to the new Mad Max movie set. The park I spend the majority of my time at has an enormous reputation for drug use, so the police come by or through several times a day, in cars or on bikes, respectively. I've found the officers from 14 Division (the division that polices the like, 6 block radius the park is a park of) to be exceptionally friendly.

more like found your way out of the dumpster
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Triple Zero on September 27, 2007, 12:17:24 PM
Quote from: Cthulhu's Squidling on September 27, 2007, 05:19:59 AM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 27, 2007, 03:07:19 AM
While I own neither of these, they are on my Christmas list.

I use the example of joint-rolling freedom as a medium for weighing police chillness as the reaction of police to marijuana in Canada varies greatly from "Don't care" to "JAIL, MUTHAFUCKA!".
I personally judge the standards of police by their willingness to talk to me; granted I do look like I got lost on my way to the new Mad Max movie set. The park I spend the majority of my time at has an enormous reputation for drug use, so the police come by or through several times a day, in cars or on bikes, respectively. I've found the officers from 14 Division (the division that polices the like, 6 block radius the park is a park of) to be exceptionally friendly.

more like found your way out of the dumpster

hey um, next time you take a stab at someone for no apparent reason, could you at least try to make it mildly entertaining?

no matter my own opinions on the target, this is below-gradeschool level stuff, and i expect to read better.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Sir Squid Diddimus on September 27, 2007, 05:24:11 PM
i dont even remember posting that.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Sir Squid Diddimus on September 27, 2007, 06:08:05 PM
besides, its pretty out of character for me to harp on anyone.
im generally an almost nice person.
so somewhere in my subconscience i must just not like that kid.
which would be the reasoning.
at any rate....

whatever.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Triple Zero on September 27, 2007, 07:37:20 PM
okay :)
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Sir Squid Diddimus on September 27, 2007, 08:05:39 PM
 :)  i like you
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Payne on September 27, 2007, 08:20:44 PM
Quote from: triple zero on September 27, 2007, 07:37:20 PM
okay :)

I can't believe you fell for that story!

Hey, did you know "Gullible" isn't in the dictionary? Check it out!
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Sir Squid Diddimus on September 27, 2007, 08:32:38 PM
baaaaaaah!

molehill.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 27, 2007, 08:38:14 PM
More like, borehill.

*crickets*

Your face.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Sir Squid Diddimus on September 27, 2007, 08:40:56 PM
 :lulz:

wait...


:|  huh?
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Triple Zero on September 27, 2007, 10:35:06 PM
Quote from: Payne on September 27, 2007, 08:20:44 PM
Quote from: triple zero on September 27, 2007, 07:37:20 PM
okay :)

I can't believe you fell for that story!

Hey, did you know "Gullible" isn't in the dictionary? Check it out!

hey yeah

there is nothing between "gulheid" and "gulp"

did you know "goedgelovig" is also not in the dictionary?
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 27, 2007, 10:36:52 PM
Quote from: triple zero on September 27, 2007, 10:35:06 PM
Quote from: Payne on September 27, 2007, 08:20:44 PM
Quote from: triple zero on September 27, 2007, 07:37:20 PM
okay :)

I can't believe you fell for that story!

Hey, did you know "Gullible" isn't in the dictionary? Check it out!

hey yeah

there is nothing between "gulheid" and "gulp"

did you know "goedgelovig" is also not in the dictionary?

Wow. I didn't know that, actually.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: faust on September 28, 2007, 12:09:54 AM
this thread sucks. and I made an effort.
4 shame.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: on September 29, 2007, 10:56:27 AM
Dont you give a reason to be known as a Ragamuffin,
People look down on Ragamuffins,
and they'll look down on you if they can call you one.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on September 29, 2007, 03:19:28 PM
But <i>I</i> like ragamuffins.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on September 29, 2007, 05:01:02 PM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 26, 2007, 01:01:50 AM
They started it. :(

J'll be as intelligent to everyone else as they are with me. When J come here and get flamed for no reason other than the fact that people have grudges against me, J'll hold grudges and sling shit. If people actually post honest queries to the things J've said or done, J'll give honest answers.

Life sucks.  Wear a hat.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on September 29, 2007, 05:02:12 PM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 29, 2007, 03:19:28 PM
But <i>I</i> like ragamuffins.

So do I.  They cannot afford lawyers, so whatever I arrest them for usually sticks.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Cain on September 29, 2007, 05:48:37 PM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 29, 2007, 03:19:28 PM
But <i>I</i> like ragamuffins.

Take thou HTML elsewhere, heathen.  Only BBCode is used among the Faithful.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: PopeTom on September 29, 2007, 08:57:25 PM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 29, 2007, 03:19:28 PM
But <i>I</i> like ragamuffins.

Who are you and what have you done with Kaienne?
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Sir Squid Diddimus on September 30, 2007, 01:08:21 AM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 29, 2007, 03:19:28 PM
But <i>I</i> like ragamuffins.

don't you mean J?

or wait <i>J</i>
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on September 30, 2007, 01:35:38 AM
Quote from: Cthulhu's Squidling on September 30, 2007, 01:08:21 AM
Quote from: Kaienne on September 29, 2007, 03:19:28 PM
But <i>I</i> like ragamuffins.

don't you mean J?

or wait <i>J</i>

Ouch.  Dang.  :lol:
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Lies on September 30, 2007, 03:06:52 AM
Yeah, I knew Rog would love this post.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on September 30, 2007, 03:18:33 AM
Quote from: Lysergic on September 30, 2007, 03:06:52 AM
Yeah, I knew Rog would love this post.

I would have leaped on it sooner, but I am busy looking for pigs and traitors.

They are everywhere.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Lies on September 30, 2007, 03:27:58 AM
Pigs?
Traitors?

*zoom*
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on September 30, 2007, 03:30:56 AM
Quote from: Lysergic on September 30, 2007, 03:27:58 AM
Pigs?
Traitors?

*zoom*

Zoom?
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Lies on September 30, 2007, 03:37:46 AM
As in, plane flying over my head.

Plane = Your wit.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on September 30, 2007, 03:38:48 AM
Quote from: Lysergic on September 30, 2007, 03:37:46 AM
As in, plane flying over my head.

Plane = Your wit.

Wit?  What wit?
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Lies on September 30, 2007, 03:42:14 AM
It looks like we're both confused now...  :cry:
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on September 30, 2007, 03:43:34 AM
Quote from: Lysergic on September 30, 2007, 03:42:14 AM
It looks like we're both confused now...  :cry:

YOU'RE ONE OF THEM, AREN'T YOU?  I NEVER TRUSTED YOU, NOT SINCE YOU CAME OOZING IN THROUGH THE FLOOR GRATE.

GET THE FUCK AWAY FROM ME.  I HAVE SALT.  YOU'LL SHRIVEL UP LIKE A LEECH.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: PopeTom on September 30, 2007, 11:40:02 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on September 30, 2007, 03:18:33 AM
Quote from: Lysergic on September 30, 2007, 03:06:52 AM
Yeah, I knew Rog would love this post.

I would have leaped on it sooner, but I am busy looking for pigs and traitors.

They are everywhere.

Found a pig!

(http://hurryupharry.bloghouse.net/archives/pigsqueal.jpg)
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on October 02, 2007, 04:34:55 PM
Yeah, I got bored of the J thing after a couple hours.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on October 03, 2007, 02:09:52 AM
Quote from: Kaienne on October 02, 2007, 04:34:55 PM
Yeah, I got bored of the J thing after a couple hours.

We'll get bored of rubbing your nose in it in a couple of years.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on October 03, 2007, 06:12:44 PM
As long as it's rubbed in appropriately.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: PopeTom on October 03, 2007, 10:05:45 PM
Quote from: Kaienne on October 02, 2007, 04:34:55 PM
Yeah, I got bored of the J thing after a couple hours.

You need to learn how to be better at beating a dead horse.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Kaienne on October 03, 2007, 10:20:42 PM
J've got some really great teachers around here.
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Cramulus on October 04, 2007, 03:36:36 AM
 :lulz:
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: Mangrove on October 04, 2007, 09:00:52 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on October 03, 2007, 02:09:52 AM
Quote from: Kaienne on October 02, 2007, 04:34:55 PM
Yeah, I got bored of the J thing after a couple hours.

We'll get bored of rubbing your nose in it in a couple of years.

ITT: Roger explains the PD.com 'crime to punishment' ratio.

:lulz:
Title: Re: People Do Things To Be Things
Post by: The Good Reverend Roger on October 05, 2007, 08:13:59 PM
Quote from: Mangrove on October 04, 2007, 09:00:52 PM
Quote from: The Good Reverend Roger on October 03, 2007, 02:09:52 AM
Quote from: Kaienne on October 02, 2007, 04:34:55 PM
Yeah, I got bored of the J thing after a couple hours.

We'll get bored of rubbing your nose in it in a couple of years.

ITT: Roger explains the PD.com 'crime to punishment' ratio.

:lulz:

Fuck yeah.  No more coddling criminals.