http://www.latinalista.net/palabrafinal/2010/04/arizonas_new_law_makes_it_open_season_on.html
QuoteThis story has a lot of parallels with a developing story from Arizona. Come Friday, the biggest example yet of an authority entity giving the green light to single out a minority group may be Arizona -- if the governor signs into law a bill that in essence is declaring "open season" on the state's Latinos.
The unfortunate reality is that unlike these black workers, the Latinos impacted by this law would have no legal route to take to defend themselves.
The Arizona bill is known as Senate Bill 1070 and it would require:
Anyone whom police suspect of being in the country illegally to produce "an alien registration document," such as a green card, or be charged with a Class 1 misdemeanor and pay a minimum $500 fine.
An act that immediately criminalizes an undocumented immigrant and impacts their chances of ever returning to the United States. This is problematic since many undocumented have lived in the country for years and their families are of mixed-status.
Makes it illegal to seek work from a road or sidewalk if doing so slows traffic. It also makes it a crime to pick up someone if a driver "knows or recklessly disregards the fact that the alien is here illegally."
Basically, like Oklahoma, the other state that wants to terrorize people from helping the undocumented, giving someone a lift to the hospital, school, store, etc. and the driver knows they are undocumented criminalizes the citizen being a Good Samaritan.
A law enforcement officer, without a warrant, may arrest a person if the officer has probable cause to believe that the person has committed any public offense that makes the person removable from the United States.
While no one would like to believe police officers would abuse their positions, unfortunately that's not the case, especially in Arizona which is home to the infamous Sheriff Arpaio.
This section of the law could be abused in going after Latino citizens. If a warrant is not needed that gives the officer the first excuse of getting his foot in the door to look for other signs of, real or imagined, violations of the law.
A law enforcement agency may securely transport an alien who is unlawfully present in the United States and who is in the agency's custody to a federal facility in this state or to any other point of transfer into federal custody that is outside the jurisdiction of the law enforcement agency.
Basically, this allows for the "disappearance" of undocumented immigrants. Since these immigrants are not afforded the opportunity to contact family members to let them know what has happened to them, this "transport" to facilities outside the region and/or state is a cruel act to perpetuate on a family worried to death about where their husband, wife, mother or child is.
A person may bring an action in Superior Court to challenge any official or agency of this state or a county, city, town or other political subdivision of this state that adopts or implements a policy that limits or restricts the enforcement of federal immigration laws to less than the full extent permitted by federal law. If there is a judicial finding that an entity has violated this section, the court shall order any of the following...
This section may actually be one of those things that comes and bites the state of Arizona in the ass. It allows for everyday citizens -- in addition to the Minuteman, Tea Party and other racist extremists -- to bring to court any law enforcement agency or city official deemed not enforcing the full extent of the immigration law.
For those people who are so prejudicial that any Latino is one too many, they would now have recourse to legally exhibit their discrimination -- without fear. The way the bill reads on about what would happen to the person who brings the charges is that they would be rewarded by having their court costs and attorney fees covered.
It goes on to say how the "entity" would be punished for not complying with the law if it was found to be guilty but nothing would be done to the person for bringing the charges, other than they would have to pay the court costs and attorney fees.
It's a blatant attempt to encourage citizens to turn against their neighbor and their local city and law enforcement officials -- and it serves to not only destabilize the social fabric of Arizona but make it such an unfriendly place by empowering the person on the street to challenge law enforcement that this bill redefines what the Wild West is in the 21st Century.
Petitions have been set up by such organizations as the National Council of La Raza and the United Farm Workers urging Arizona Gov. Brewer to not sign into law a bill that has the potential to harm both citizen and non-citizen Latinos in the state.
Governor Brewer signed it this afternoon. :lulz:
WHEEEEE! Welcome back to 1950!
Sorry Dok, but I hate your state.
Actually I hate that entire quadrant of the country. It ought to be glassed and turned into solar panel farms.
In school Monday, when most of the school does the pledge of allegiance, I'm just going to wait until they get to "Land of the Free" and then projectile vomit onto the nearest redneck.
The worst part is that none of this shit even surprises me anymore.
It's not supposed to surprise you. You're supposed to just sigh and get on with your drab, wretched life.
Consider that.
I cant fucking believe this shit. I mean, I'm pretty disgusted by ANY law which removes the restriction of needing a warrant from law enforcement, but for such a law to blatantly target a specific minority group is beyond what even I thought was possible.
TURNER INDUSTRIES
simply, ought not to hire anyone who is not white. They obviously are not an equal opportunity employer in the true sense, so why waste everyones time and create all the drama?
SO FAR AS IMMIGRATION
the turner industries article is like apples to az's oranges.
QUOTE:
Anyone whom police suspect of being in the country illegally to produce "an alien registration document," such as a green card, or be charged with a Class 1 misdemeanor and pay a minimum $500 fine.
An act that immediately criminalizes an undocumented immigrant and impacts their chances of ever returning to the United States. This is problematic since many undocumented have lived in the country for years and their families are of mixed-status.
IF
this were in Wisconsin, or Alaska, I'd say this was suspicious. However, being a border State (if not THE border state), AZ is at the heart of the illegal issue.
-let me address right now the media confused label of 'illegal immigrant'. one is either here in the u.s. as a legal immigrant, or one is here illegally.
for EVERY country in the world, illegal presence is a crime.
entering the u.s. 'under the radar' is very, very expensive for individuals who choose this and it can be a life-threatening, dangerous excursion. read up on the human border trafficing and you'll be like, fuck
it is a shitty job for cops to have to take this on, but cops have shitty jobs to do.
QUOTE:
Makes it illegal to seek work from a road or sidewalk if doing so slows traffic. It also makes it a crime to pick up someone if a driver "knows or recklessly disregards the fact that the alien is here illegally."
o.k., i read this entirely different than you did, Dok. as a person in the "trades(carpenter)" I've got A LOT to say about activity involving illegals. i understood this to equal (=) that stretch of Burnside bridge in portland which has (mostly) illegals lined up daily waiting for work. i've had friends get hired by the guys in pick-ups on the bridge, told they'd be working 8-10 hours for "food", drove to a jobsite, worked like a dog all day and were "fed" a bag of chips and a coke, for a full days work. Like the chips you buy at a bar for a dollar cuz yer buzzed.
i can't tell you how many times i've been on a jobsite and seen a contractor hire illegals for unsafe, un-permitable work. usually involving asbestos exposure or dangerous moulds.
I WOULD LOVE TO SEE THOSE MOTHERFUCKERS BUSTED FOR THEIR SLAVE LABOUR BULLSHIT!
QUOTE:
A law enforcement agency may securely transport an alien who is unlawfully present in the United States and who is in the agency's custody to a federal facility in this state or to any other point of transfer into federal custody that is outside the jurisdiction of the law enforcement agency.
Basically, this allows for the "disappearance" of undocumented immigrants. Since these immigrants are not afforded the opportunity to contact family members to let them know what has happened to them, this "transport" to facilities outside the region and/or state is a cruel act to perpetuate on a family worried to death about where their husband, wife, mother or child is.
- this is (further)proof that we are no longer a first world country, you may be too informed Dok, and therefore a conspiracy theorist, however this is way too "midnight Obama express"
ON A PERSONAL LEVEL
I know and work with both hispanic/ Mexican "immigrants"(read:U.S. Citizens) and illegals. I encourage and promote both to help themselves and their families equally, I could never conceive of turning someone in because they're illegal. They're trying to better their situation, but I do know they're very aware of what they are doing and have their own reasons for the what/why.
Nigel recently accompanied me when I went to check out the "day labour" site which the city of Portland set up, there are several, but they are directly across the street from the illegal labour "sites"(burnside bridge, etc.) These day labour sites have a $10- an hour guarantee with negotiable plus wages between employer and worker based on skill.
Now, as a self employed carpenter, i charge a sliding scale, and often charge $25-30 an hour for my finish carpentery(a total deal!!), but i'm not too proud to dig ditches for $10- an hour to bring home some spam. I WAS TOLD BY THE ORGANIZER that they had been sending out about 2 guys a day on average!! the 'illegal' situation across the street probably turns over 30-40 workers a day. these are HUMAN BEINGS working mostly in conditions which we as a society deem INHUMAN(we've spent centuries to establish working conditions), for far, far less than a liveable wage.
If my house were our country, openly having no immigration requirements would be like removing my front door, for anyone to come and take what they want. My household cannot support an economic chaos, or a chaos of humane-ness.
ALSO
i demand the re-instatement of teabagger
EOT, you're missing a fine point of the law, here.
If an Hispanic is pulled over and doesn't have ID (even if he isn't the driver), he is guilty of the misdemeanor, even if he is a citizen or legal resident. IE, he can be released from detainment upon proof of legality, but is still guilty under this law of not having the ID on his person.
Your papers, citizen?
Quote from: Doktor Howl on April 17, 2010, 07:37:13 AM
EOT, you're missing a fine point of the law, here.
If an Hispanic is pulled over and doesn't have ID (even if he isn't the driver), he is guilty of the misdemeanor, even if he is a citizen or legal resident. IE, he can be released from detainment upon proof of legality, but is still guilty under this law of not having the ID on his person.
Your papers, citizen?
Hmm...
Trying to ascertain the truth of that. I'm resorting to actually reading the text of these laws. Also presenting snippets for others to see.
It seems that you can't fuck over a citizen with this law, but you can add criminal trespass to the shit through which you put a permanent resident or someone with just a visa.
The Arizona bill in question
http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/49leg/2r/bills/sb1070s.htm
Quote from: Arizona Senate Bill 1070
Sec. 3. Title 13, chapter 15, Arizona Revised Statutes, is amended by adding section 13-1509, to read:
13-1509. Trespassing by illegal aliens; assessment; exception; classification
A. IN ADDITION TO ANY VIOLATION OF FEDERAL LAW, A PERSON IS GUILTY OF TRESPASSING IF THE PERSON IS BOTH:
1. PRESENT ON ANY PUBLIC OR PRIVATE LAND IN THIS STATE.
2. IN VIOLATION OF 8 UNITED STATES CODE SECTION 1304(e) OR 1306(a).
B. IN THE ENFORCEMENT OF THIS SECTION, THE FINAL DETERMINATION OF AN ALIEN'S IMMIGRATION STATUS SHALL BE DETERMINED BY EITHER:
1. A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER WHO IS AUTHORIZED BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT TO VERIFY OR ASCERTAIN AN ALIEN'S IMMIGRATION STATUS.
2. A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER OR AGENCY COMMUNICATING WITH THE UNITED STATES IMMIGRATION AND CUSTOMS ENFORCEMENT OR THE UNITED STATES BORDER PROTECTION PURSUANT TO 8 UNITED STATES CODE SECTION 1373(c).
US Code referenced
Quote from: 8 USC 1304 (e)
(e) Personal possession of registration or receipt card; penalties
Every alien, eighteen years of age and over, shall at all times
carry with him and have in his personal possession any certificate of
alien registration or alien registration receipt card issued to him
pursuant to subsection (d) of this section. Any alien who fails to
comply with the provisions of this subsection shall be guilty of a
misdemeanor and shall upon conviction for each offense be fined not to
exceed $100 or be imprisoned not more than thirty days, or both.
Quote from: 8 USC 1306 (a)
(a) Willful failure to register
Any alien required to apply for registration and to be fingerprinted
in the United States who willfully fails or refuses to make such
application or to be fingerprinted, and any parent or legal guardian
required to apply for the registration of any alien who willfully fails
or refuses to file application for the registration of such alien shall
be guilty of a misdemeanor and shall, upon conviction thereof, be fined
not to exceed $1,000 or be imprisoned not more than six months, or both.
Definition of "Alien"
Quote from: 8 USC 1101
(a)(3) The term "alien'' means any person not a citizen or national of
the United States.
EOT, how you would like to hope the law would be enforced is one thing.
There are already laws against employing illegal immigrants. What this law has done, specifically, is remove warrant requirements. It opens the door for harrassment of anyone who "looks Mexican". It's a bad law. In Arizona, if you were giving a Latino friend a ride to work, the police could legally pull you over because your friend is Latino. If your friend doesn't have proof of being a US citizen (do you carry your passport or birth certificate at all times?), you could both be detained; him for being brown, and you for giving a brown guy a ride.
In Arizona, if I was driving though with my kids I could be pulled over for being brown, and all four of us could be thrown into jail until I could produce birth certificates. I am concerned about the part that says the arrested will not be afforded the opportunity to contact family members... if that is true, it would mean I would not have the ability to call home and get the documentation I would need to prove citizenship.
The poor drafting of even a well-intentioned law can have disastrous consequences.
QuoteWhile no one would like to believe police officers would abuse their positions, unfortunately that's not the case, especially in Arizona which is home to the infamous Sheriff Arpaio.
It's Arizona. This law WILL be abused.
I'm guessing trespass is one of those things they can boot the legals out of the country for?
Cause that would mean that they've set themselves up to kick people out for 'trespassing' on a public sidewalk.
Quote from: The Right Reverend Nigel on April 17, 2010, 03:45:05 PM
It's Arizona. This law WILL be abused.
Bad day to be smudgy in Tempe.
Tucson cops are a little more savvy. They haven't spent 5 years building trust with the community to piss it all away on this. Of course, the bill's sponsor wants to be governor, and he'll draft legislation to punish Tucson for not going along with it. Again.
I am very glad I didn't emigrate to Arizona.
This legislation seems like a nasty piece of work.
Americans: Pissing away American freedoms since 1787.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on April 17, 2010, 07:37:13 AM
EOT, you're missing a fine point of the law, here.
If an Hispanic is pulled over and doesn't have ID (even if he isn't the driver), he is guilty of the misdemeanor, even if he is a citizen or legal resident. IE, he can be released from detainment upon proof of legality, but is still guilty under this law of not having the ID on his person.
Your papers, citizen?
Actually, I'm pretty sure this applies to everyone, not just Latinos. If a cop wants to hassle you he can just say you sounded like you had a Canadian accent (for Whites) or a West Indian one (For Blacks)
But you see, he won't. Which makes it a dumb argument.
Quote from: Kai on April 18, 2010, 05:21:28 AM
But you see, he won't. Which makes it a dumb argument.
He will if he doesn't like you.
I'm not saying the cops aren't going to use this mostly as an excuse for racist harrassment, I'm saying the non Latinos ought to be scared too.
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 18, 2010, 06:57:23 AM
Quote from: Kai on April 18, 2010, 05:21:28 AM
But you see, he won't. Which makes it a dumb argument.
He will if he doesn't like you.
I'm not saying the cops aren't going to use this mostly as an excuse for racist harrassment, I'm saying the non Latinos ought to be scared too.
I ain't afraid of Sheriff Joe.
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 18, 2010, 04:31:59 AM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on April 17, 2010, 07:37:13 AM
EOT, you're missing a fine point of the law, here.
If an Hispanic is pulled over and doesn't have ID (even if he isn't the driver), he is guilty of the misdemeanor, even if he is a citizen or legal resident. IE, he can be released from detainment upon proof of legality, but is still guilty under this law of not having the ID on his person.
Your papers, citizen?
Actually, I'm pretty sure this applies to everyone, not just Latinos. If a cop wants to hassle you he can just say you sounded like you had a Canadian accent (for Whites)
We have an accent?
Quote from: CAPTAIN SLACK on April 18, 2010, 03:25:50 PM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 18, 2010, 04:31:59 AM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on April 17, 2010, 07:37:13 AM
EOT, you're missing a fine point of the law, here.
If an Hispanic is pulled over and doesn't have ID (even if he isn't the driver), he is guilty of the misdemeanor, even if he is a citizen or legal resident. IE, he can be released from detainment upon proof of legality, but is still guilty under this law of not having the ID on his person.
Your papers, citizen?
Actually, I'm pretty sure this applies to everyone, not just Latinos. If a cop wants to hassle you he can just say you sounded like you had a Canadian accent (for Whites)
We have an accent?
Yes.
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 18, 2010, 06:57:23 AM
Quote from: Kai on April 18, 2010, 05:21:28 AM
But you see, he won't. Which makes it a dumb argument.
He will if he doesn't like you.
I'm not saying the cops aren't going to use this mostly as an excuse for racist harrassment, I'm saying the non Latinos ought to be scared too.
What do you not understand about RACIST COPS WANTING TO KICK AROUND LATINOS?
They'll use it to harass indians and blacks, too. Arizona has historically had a problem with the dusky people.
Quote from: The Right Reverend Nigel on April 18, 2010, 04:18:45 PM
They'll use it to harass indians and blacks, too. Arizona has historically had a problem with the dusky people.
THIS.
To be fair, the Indians in the early settling days here liked to fight, too.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on April 18, 2010, 04:20:59 PM
Quote from: The Right Reverend Nigel on April 18, 2010, 04:18:45 PM
They'll use it to harass indians and blacks, too. Arizona has historically had a problem with the dusky people.
THIS.
To be fair, the Indians in the early settling days here liked to fight, too.
Yeah, but they had that whole "defending their home from invaders" excuse.
I can't wait for the first Native American to get brought in for not having immigration papers. I mean, it'll suck for that guy, but it'll be absolutely hilarious.
Quote from: Requia ☣ on April 18, 2010, 04:45:19 PM
I can't wait for the first Native American to get brought in for not having immigration papers. I mean, it'll suck for that guy, but it'll be absolutely hilarious.
Don't think Sheriff Joe and his constituents aren't masturbating furiously at that very thought.
Quote from: Requia ☣ on April 18, 2010, 04:45:19 PM
I can't wait for the first Native American to get brought in for not having immigration papers. I mean, it'll suck for that guy, but it'll be absolutely hilarious.
They do look a lot like Mexicans (at least to racist cops)
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 18, 2010, 05:49:55 PM
Quote from: Requia ☣ on April 18, 2010, 04:45:19 PM
I can't wait for the first Native American to get brought in for not having immigration papers. I mean, it'll suck for that guy, but it'll be absolutely hilarious.
They do look a lot like Mexicans (at least to racist cops)
In Tempe, it doesn't matter. You're either White or not White.
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 18, 2010, 05:49:55 PM
Quote from: Requia ☣ on April 18, 2010, 04:45:19 PM
I can't wait for the first Native American to get brought in for not having immigration papers. I mean, it'll suck for that guy, but it'll be absolutely hilarious.
They do look a lot like Mexicans (at least to racist cops)
There's really no genetic difference between the little brown guys on the Arizona side of the border and the little brown guys on the Mexico side.
Quote from: The Right Reverend Nigel on April 18, 2010, 05:59:27 PM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 18, 2010, 05:49:55 PM
Quote from: Requia ☣ on April 18, 2010, 04:45:19 PM
I can't wait for the first Native American to get brought in for not having immigration papers. I mean, it'll suck for that guy, but it'll be absolutely hilarious.
They do look a lot like Mexicans (at least to racist cops)
There's really no genetic difference between the little brown guys on the Arizona side of the border and the little brown guys on the Mexico side.
Depends where from South of the border. In Sonora, you're right. Go South and East, and there's a lot more European blood (Gallegos).
But yeah, Sheriff Joe isn't bitching about the 6' tall blond Mexican chicks that come on El Mundo.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on April 18, 2010, 06:01:16 PM
Quote from: The Right Reverend Nigel on April 18, 2010, 05:59:27 PM
Quote from: BabylonHoruv on April 18, 2010, 05:49:55 PM
Quote from: Requia ☣ on April 18, 2010, 04:45:19 PM
I can't wait for the first Native American to get brought in for not having immigration papers. I mean, it'll suck for that guy, but it'll be absolutely hilarious.
They do look a lot like Mexicans (at least to racist cops)
There's really no genetic difference between the little brown guys on the Arizona side of the border and the little brown guys on the Mexico side.
Depends where from South of the border. In Sonora, you're right. Go South and East, and there's a lot more European blood (Gallegos).
Ah, but I'm just talking about the little brown guys.
Quote
But yeah, Sheriff Joe isn't bitching about the 6' tall blond Mexican chicks that come on El Mundo.
Rich white tourists are rich white tourists no matter what country they're from, right? :lulz:
Quote from: The Right Reverend Nigel on April 18, 2010, 04:40:48 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on April 18, 2010, 04:20:59 PM
Quote from: The Right Reverend Nigel on April 18, 2010, 04:18:45 PM
They'll use it to harass indians and blacks, too. Arizona has historically had a problem with the dusky people.
THIS.
To be fair, the Indians in the early settling days here liked to fight, too.
Yeah, but they had that whole "defending their home from invaders" excuse.
Actually, they were all about fighting before the White man showed up. The Apache just really, really liked to fight.
Quote from: The Right Reverend Nigel on April 18, 2010, 07:05:56 PM
Rich white tourists are rich white tourists no matter what country they're from, right? :lulz:
Until the money runs out.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on April 18, 2010, 07:18:48 PM
Quote from: The Right Reverend Nigel on April 18, 2010, 04:40:48 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on April 18, 2010, 04:20:59 PM
Quote from: The Right Reverend Nigel on April 18, 2010, 04:18:45 PM
They'll use it to harass indians and blacks, too. Arizona has historically had a problem with the dusky people.
THIS.
To be fair, the Indians in the early settling days here liked to fight, too.
Yeah, but they had that whole "defending their home from invaders" excuse.
Actually, they were all about fighting before the White man showed up. The Apache just really, really liked to fight.
This is true. They're pretty much why Texas doesn't belong to Mexico.
Surprise! MW posters found to be in favour of this law
hxxp://mysticwicks.com/showthread.php?t=229052
Quote from: Cain on April 21, 2010, 05:09:12 PM
Surprise! MW posters found to be in favour of this law
hxxp://mysticwicks.com/showthread.php?t=229052
QuoteIt doesn't make any sense to ignore ethniticity in the name of Political Correctness if a certian group of people are the ones consistantly commiting a certian crime
:horrormirth:
Do they get upset when you point out they are racists?
Probably. I'm too busy lulzing it up in other threads, but I know Dok is big into ripping on Sheriff Joe and his fans, so I thought I should bring this to his attention.
Quote from: Kai on April 21, 2010, 10:15:24 PM
Do they get upset when you point out they are racists?
Oh yeah they do! Especially memnoch. He tries to say that he isn't racist, he's just "non-PC".
(http://www.bartcop.com/az-nazis.jpg)
Well, at least this sort of thing isn't gaining popular support in the rest of America (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2010/jun/03/glenn-beck/glenn-beck-says-president-obama-out-step-nation-ar/)
:spit:
Quote from: Risus on June 04, 2010, 08:57:53 PM
Well, at least this sort of thing isn't gaining popular support in the rest of America (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2010/jun/03/glenn-beck/glenn-beck-says-president-obama-out-step-nation-ar/)
Yeah, apparently, "most" Americans oppose the federal lawsuit against AZ's new immigration law. (http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/dcnow/2010/07/poll-most-americans-oppose-federal-suit-to-block-arizona-immigration-law.html)
Because I'm sure, of all those polled, the ones in support were definitely well-informed of the consequences of this law, and had read the whole thing.
...like all other polls administered, I bet you're right... :lol:
On the other hand, even if they were "it wouldn't happen to people like them". It'd happen to other, more deserving people. Smudgy people, leeching off hardworking American's prosperity.
In my experience, that's usually the case: those that are for "harsher" laws on so and so and more justice for such and such never really believe this could be applied to them, in any way. They are of course more than happy to have it applied, sometimes even erroneously, to others, as they "deserve."
Welcome to the new old same America™.
Quote from: Dr. James Semaj on April 17, 2010, 02:04:53 AM
In school Monday, when most of the school does the pledge of allegiance, I'm just going to wait until they get to "Land of the Free" and then projectile vomit onto the nearest redneck.
The worst part is that none of this shit even surprises me anymore.
I suspect the most support for this doesn't come from the rednecks, I bet it comes from middle class people holed up and hiding in their upper scale subdivisions.
Quote from: Charley Brown on July 12, 2010, 04:34:59 PM
Quote from: Dr. James Semaj on April 17, 2010, 02:04:53 AM
In school Monday, when most of the school does the pledge of allegiance, I'm just going to wait until they get to "Land of the Free" and then projectile vomit onto the nearest redneck.
The worst part is that none of this shit even surprises me anymore.
I suspect the most support for this doesn't come from the rednecks, I bet it comes from middle class people holed up and hiding in their upper scale subdivisions.
As far as I've seen, at least in Tucson, those that support the bill tend to be at the bottom of the heap.
Which isn't at all surprising. If they have someone to shit on, they aren't at the very bottom, right? This is the same mechanism the Southern landowners used to get poor people to fight a civil war, which - had they won - would have guaranteed that the poor whites would be permanently locked into their class.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 12, 2010, 05:26:31 PM
Quote from: Charley Brown on July 12, 2010, 04:34:59 PM
Quote from: Dr. James Semaj on April 17, 2010, 02:04:53 AM
In school Monday, when most of the school does the pledge of allegiance, I'm just going to wait until they get to "Land of the Free" and then projectile vomit onto the nearest redneck.
The worst part is that none of this shit even surprises me anymore.
I suspect the most support for this doesn't come from the rednecks, I bet it comes from middle class people holed up and hiding in their upper scale subdivisions.
As far as I've seen, at least in Tucson, those that support the bill tend to be at the bottom of the heap.
Which isn't at all surprising. If they have someone to shit on, they aren't at the very bottom, right? This is the same mechanism the Southern landowners used to get poor people to fight a civil war, which - had they won - would have guaranteed that the poor whites would be permanently locked into their class.
Interesting, but I bow to your first hand knowledge.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 12, 2010, 05:26:31 PM
Quote from: Charley Brown on July 12, 2010, 04:34:59 PM
Quote from: Dr. James Semaj on April 17, 2010, 02:04:53 AM
In school Monday, when most of the school does the pledge of allegiance, I'm just going to wait until they get to "Land of the Free" and then projectile vomit onto the nearest redneck.
The worst part is that none of this shit even surprises me anymore.
I suspect the most support for this doesn't come from the rednecks, I bet it comes from middle class people holed up and hiding in their upper scale subdivisions.
As far as I've seen, at least in Tucson, those that support the bill tend to be at the bottom of the heap.
Which isn't at all surprising. If they have someone to shit on, they aren't at the very bottom, right? This is the same mechanism the Southern landowners used to get poor people to fight a civil war, which - had they won - would have guaranteed that the poor whites would be permanently locked into their class.
This pretty much explains the appeal of modern conservatism.
Quote from: Cain on July 12, 2010, 05:35:19 PM
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 12, 2010, 05:26:31 PM
Quote from: Charley Brown on July 12, 2010, 04:34:59 PM
Quote from: Dr. James Semaj on April 17, 2010, 02:04:53 AM
In school Monday, when most of the school does the pledge of allegiance, I'm just going to wait until they get to "Land of the Free" and then projectile vomit onto the nearest redneck.
The worst part is that none of this shit even surprises me anymore.
I suspect the most support for this doesn't come from the rednecks, I bet it comes from middle class people holed up and hiding in their upper scale subdivisions.
As far as I've seen, at least in Tucson, those that support the bill tend to be at the bottom of the heap.
Which isn't at all surprising. If they have someone to shit on, they aren't at the very bottom, right? This is the same mechanism the Southern landowners used to get poor people to fight a civil war, which - had they won - would have guaranteed that the poor whites would be permanently locked into their class.
This pretty much explains the appeal of modern conservatism.
"Modern Conservativism: Hey, at least you aren't at the
bottom!"
I think I need to add "redneck", "hillbilly", and "working stiff" to the dictionary.
Quote from: Doktor Howl on July 12, 2010, 05:49:03 PM
I think I need to add "redneck", "hillbilly", and "working stiff" to the dictionary.
I agree.