Principia Discordia

Principia Discordia => Principia Discussion => Topic started by: Apikoros II on January 08, 2008, 01:06:46 pm

Title: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Apikoros II on January 08, 2008, 01:06:46 pm
My illumination in Eris and Discordianism came first through the Illuminatus Trilogy, then the Principia Discordia and then Zen Without Zen Masters. Out of all 3, I love them in that order the most. In fact, I read the Trilogy as if it was Science Fiction/Cult Classic and nothing else.... and it blew my mind... and led me to other things... How bout you? BTW, if someone already asked this question, bugger you, as I am asking it again.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: LMNO on January 08, 2008, 01:09:22 pm
Prometheus Rising

and

Beneath Reality
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: hunter s.durden on January 08, 2008, 01:50:59 pm
The Bible.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: LMNO on January 08, 2008, 01:53:31 pm
The KOTON.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on January 08, 2008, 01:54:21 pm
 :lulz:

I'll add mine in a bit.  It'll take a while to consider.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Triple Zero on January 08, 2008, 02:08:34 pm
the illuminatus 3, goedel escher bach and the internet (esp the self liberators digest (http://www.maths.qmul.ac.uk/~ade/)).

in the reverse order.

ETA: also some book called "Complexity: On the edge of chaos", taught me most of what i know about chaos theory/catastrophe theory. actually, if i hadn't read this book, i wouldn't have believed one single word of the Black Swan (because of the shoddy/false examples in that book, it's kinda like the parable of the sacred bull, i had to rely on my own knowledge to figure out what's true heh)
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: AFK on January 08, 2008, 02:21:31 pm
The only one of the books from the OP I've read is the PD.  The SJGames version.  I'm in the minority around here as that I really don't read a lot of books.  It's mostly an issue of not having sufficient down time to get involved in a book.  I tend to use that time with the family and playing music. 
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on January 08, 2008, 02:45:55 pm
I first read the PD (because my sneaky girlfriend left it "laying around" conspicuously... particularly whenever I was stoned. I read it and nearly poked my third eye out due to the convulsive laughter. From there I read Illuminatus!, Prometheus Rising, Quantum Psychology, Cosmic Trigger, Temporary Autonomous Zones, Masks of The Illuminati, Historical Illuminatus Chronicles, Coincidance, Island (Huxley), Illusions, Book Four, Book of the Law, Book of Lies, The Hero with a Thousand Faces, InfoPsychology... and I haven't stopped yet ;-)

Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Jasper on January 08, 2008, 05:11:56 pm
I found Speaker For The Dead more enlightening than PD.  Also: Man And His Symbols, Evil Genes, anything by Bucky Fuller, and the Transmetropolitan comics series.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Apikoros II on January 08, 2008, 05:50:59 pm
Nice, we seem to be a well read group... Ever read anything by Charles Fort? I can't seem to find anything in print... Also, he is listed as a Childrens/Yound Adult author, but Daniel Pinkwater's books are FILLED with things that I can only call Discordian. Plus they are wicked funny...
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Jasper on January 08, 2008, 05:56:05 pm
Fort is new to me, maybe I'll remember to look him up.

I've always been a libriophile, until I realized I'm an infotweaker.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Triple Zero on January 08, 2008, 06:05:21 pm
infotweaker?
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: LMNO on January 08, 2008, 06:05:39 pm
I found Speaker For The Dead more enlightening than PD.  Also: Man And His Symbols, Evil Genes, anything by Bucky Fuller, and the Transmetropolitan comics series.

You actually found the dullest book of the trilogy to be the most enlightening?
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Jasper on January 08, 2008, 06:14:00 pm
Yes, because it dealt with more intellectual and metaphysical matters than "Kids In Space!"
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: LMNO on January 08, 2008, 06:16:13 pm
Which matters?  The half-assed Jungian cloning, or whether a virus is alive?
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Triple Zero on January 08, 2008, 06:35:24 pm
i thought the bit where they talked about how all stuff is connected via invisible wires and these wires were somehow life and also a dual reality or something was pretty cool. was that in that book?

cause it was pretty cool, and he talked about it convincingly, but all in all, it was just scifi. cause, psssst, things don't really work like that (yeah, but WHAT IF .. :) )

but what's an infotweaker?
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: LMNO on January 08, 2008, 06:38:16 pm
Oh yeah, the cruciable*, and Jane as a conciousness.




Oh, and I suppose an infotweaker is one who tweaks info.














*wrong word.  Insta-communication thingie
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: The Apex, The Harmony Of on January 08, 2008, 06:43:44 pm
The 3 most influential books too me so far are something like (no order):

Peter J Carroll - PsyberMagick: Advanced ideas in chaos magick.
I love this book because its like a 'timebinding' book (korzybski term  :)) that contains a plethora of information about a wide range of subjects in so little pages.

Roger Penrose - Shadows of the mind
To tell the truth I havnt actually read ALL this book. But im going to re-read it again very soon. I originally started it about a year ago and gave up because I just lost where I was in his arguments and reasoning.
Im sick of alot of popular books on Science since they all seem to same the same thing, follow the given dogma and stop at important details "...theres not enough room in this book to elaborate without getting into technical details". I like the Penrose books because I dont know technical Math and Physics but he doesnt hold back and goes into all the details regardless and I normally find myself following along well. Plus he goes into lots of alternatives, fallacies, paradoxes etc

John Gribbin - Stardust
Just wow. The recyling of planets, stars and people and the roles all the chemical constituents play. How the elements were made inside stars and came to make us etc.

Iv had a bunch of fiction books influence me as well. Mostly sci-fi like Baxter, McAuley, Haldeman, Clarke, K Dick...plus a book I just finished by Greg Bear "Blood Music". At the moment Im working through the "Future Classics" and each one iv read has been fucking unreal.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Jasper on January 08, 2008, 06:47:44 pm
Ansible.

Infotweaker is a word I heard but wasn't explained to me so I appropriated it as the name of my behaviors regarding information.

I found the entire discourse on the nature of intelligence very stimulating.  Alien intelligence, viral, electronic, so on.  The Jungian Cloning thingy they did seemed to me like an easy way to save the plot that turned into a great way to end the series.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Triple Zero on January 08, 2008, 06:52:44 pm
Oh, and I suppose an infotweaker is one who tweaks info.

"Tweaking refers to fine-tuning or adjusting a complex system, [usually an electronic device]. Tweaks are any small modifications intended to improve a system."

so you finetune information?

is that like doing a spellcheck or something?
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cainad (dec.) on January 08, 2008, 06:53:06 pm
I don't remember exactly what led me to it, but I read the PD first (this HTML version (http://www.ology.org/principia/body.html)) and was entranced. After that came the Apocrypha Discordia, and I was lucky enough to spot a copy of Illuminatus! in a bookstore this past summer.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Jasper on January 08, 2008, 06:55:51 pm
I read the 2nd volume of Illuminatus! first around fourteen, then went back and found the whole series at age sixteen, then quickly went for a copy of PD after.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Diseris on January 08, 2008, 08:10:22 pm
Advanced Dungeons and Dragons Dungeon Master's Guide by Gary Gygax

- learned way to early that reality was not only mutable, but also arbitrary.

followed closely by the PD.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Doktor Loki on January 08, 2008, 10:15:49 pm
I'd read the Principia, the Apocrypha, the Book of Eris, Illuminatus, all that, but what really did it was The BotSG, and even more so Revelation X.

Those books kicked my brain just the right way, I guess.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on January 08, 2008, 10:33:50 pm
James Gleick - Chaos: Making a New Science
Hell, its got mad props from Douglas Adams and Douglas Hofstadter and its hella easy to read and understand.

Nietzsche - Beyond Good and Evil
Not only does Nietzsche rage against the religions and "morals" of his time, expressing his sarcastic and often humourous absolute scepticism, he also takes digs at science (for being too reductionist - a claim repeated by the Chaos Theorists and Gleick above).  A thoroughly iconoclastic book.

The Book of Five Rings - Miyamoto Mushashi
The quintissential Japanese strategy guide.  The object of the lesson is that the lesson never ends, and to never rely on anything external to yourself to succeed.

A Perfect Spy - John le Carre
Probably his best book, its an excellent piece of writing that illustrates how conflicting personalities can exist in one person until something triggers that person off and they can no longer maintain the contradictions of their life.  A fictional study in psychological chaos.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cramulus on January 08, 2008, 10:51:56 pm
(this HTML version (http://www.ology.org/principia/body.html))


That HTML version was my first version of the Principia as well. I printed the whole thing out and carried it with me everywhere. I was fifteen or sixteen, and had recently cast aside Christianity in favor of atheism, then atheism in favor of Taoism (they're not exclusive, but meh), then finally Taoism in favor of Discord. Recently I cast Discord away in favor of Discord, then cast that away in favor of Discord.

When I was 17 I bought Illuminatus! totally randomly. (I think it was on sale)
When I found out it was about Discordia, I went  :asplode:

other books / authors I sometimes find relevant to my personal version of Discordja
-Cosmos by Carl Sagan - underscores the universe's beauty
-Prime Chaos by Phil Hine - underscores the power and mutability of beliefs
-parts of Metamagical Themas by Douglas Hofstadter - made me fascinated by pattern recognition and creative process
-some Carlos Castaneda
-Edith Hamilton's retelling of Greek Mythology - underscores the harsh, impersonal arbitrariness of the universe
-The Hero with a Thousand Faces (Campbell)
-Fight Club
-Parts of the Apocrypha Discordia

I think the movies Waking Life and I Heart Huckabees also influenced my beliefs a bit.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on January 08, 2008, 10:52:01 pm
Heh, none of my books are actually really Discordian in any sense.  I like some of them (Prometheus Rising etc) but in general they confirm a worldview I inherited from the above books I mentioned.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Jasper on January 08, 2008, 11:24:45 pm
Truly spoken.  I've really just been using Discordia as an umbrella term for whatever I'm believing or thinking at the time for several years.

Oh, "Blink" was a big one for me too.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Apikoros II on January 09, 2008, 02:04:07 am
Hmmmm, great stuff! Prof Cramulus, you really like Hamilton's translations? When it comes to Myth, give me Campbell anyday. To paraphrase the guy in The Man who Shot Liberty Valence, If the truth sucks print the legend.

But reading these replies, I think am gonna start a movie thread to see what people say...

Oh, and my reading list has expanded some what now I think.... May Eris always keep Amazon selling used books. Can we start a sticky with a "Must Read or Face the Wrath of <<Insert witty thing here, I'm tired and not feeling witty>>> thread? With links and stuff? And maybe hats?  Yah, each author we name has to be shown in a picture wearing a hat. Or the book has to wear a hat. Either way...

Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on January 09, 2008, 02:07:17 am
Sounds like an interesting idea.  I could edit the first post in the thread and have the rest devoted to peoples suggestions, where they can debate the merits of a certain book going on "the list." 
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Apikoros II on January 09, 2008, 02:07:28 am
Well Diddle me for being noob, as I see we already HAVE like, a library section and a book thread and a what are you reading thread and a Apikoros, read the fucking board first thread. Man, I really am tired.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cramulus on January 09, 2008, 05:06:54 am
Prof Cramulus, you really like Hamilton's translations? When it comes to Myth, give me Campbell anyday.

I liked 'em because they were my first brush with a lot of Greek Mythology. You know how people are about their first loves.

I also love Campbell's commentary and analysis of mythology, but didn't know he authored any translations.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Fredfredly ⊂(◉‿◉)つ on January 09, 2008, 07:05:44 am
I WAS ILLUMINATED BY TUBGIRL AND HARRY POTTER
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Mesozoic Mister Nigel on January 09, 2008, 07:48:44 am
For me, it was really "Watership Down" when I was six.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Eve on January 09, 2008, 08:42:59 am
Orson Scott Card (Ender's Game) got me started, ironically.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: LMNO on January 09, 2008, 12:53:33 pm
I WAS ILLUMINATED BY TUBGIRL AND HARRY POTTER


YOU ARE TRULY ENLIGHTENED.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Jasper on January 10, 2008, 03:19:48 am
Orson Scott Card (Ender's Game) got me started, ironically.

The trilogy or the first one?  I just can't help but think the first one was just plain old great sci-fi.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Eve on January 10, 2008, 03:27:39 am
Orson Scott Card (Ender's Game) got me started, ironically.

The trilogy or the first one?  I just can't help but think the first one was just plain old great sci-fi.

The first one is definitely plain old great sci-fi. The whole series got me thinking, but EG is what really stuck with me.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Jasper on January 10, 2008, 03:42:16 am
It's a lot of fun to read, and inspired a lot of RPG material in my youth.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cainad (dec.) on January 10, 2008, 06:26:53 am
Oh geez, I forgot to mention The Prince of Nothing trilogy by R. Scott Bakker. Those books got my brain gears turning like no other before it.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Jasper on January 14, 2008, 07:36:03 am
I'm just now getting into The Meditations Of Marcus Aurelius, which represents Stoicism very well so far.  It's rational, clear, and just the thing for practically dealing with uncertainty.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on January 14, 2008, 07:38:13 am
The Stoics are pretty cool.

I gave that to a friend for her birthday, actually.  Highly recommended, a fascinating read.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Jasper on January 14, 2008, 07:48:59 am
It'd interest LHX, of that I can be sure.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Agrippa on January 14, 2008, 07:33:00 pm
In my teens i liked Liber Null and Psychonaut.
It was a good start.

One of the recent ones is Influence or the power of influence by Caldini
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Pvt Conrad on January 14, 2008, 07:36:45 pm
I heard of a crazy man somewhere in New York who found some golden tablets written by God! If that were true, it would blow my mind. As it is, fighting the North gives me no time for any intellectual pursuit not directly related to improving my country's chances of survival -- and so we have all been studying a book on the military prowess of a man named Nero.

Fiddles,

Pvt. Conrad
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Frater Frankenfurter on January 14, 2008, 10:19:45 pm
I started out as a consparicy theorist, by influence of my uncle at a young age who was a major amature investigator in the Kennedy assassination.  So by the age of 13, (which was a long time ago . .lol), I already had developed a healthy disbelief in anything the goverment said or did.

In a bookstore one day, I ran across the book, "Everything Is Under Control"  by RAW and my exploration in discordisim began.  It lead eventually to Steve Jackson's PD, Illuminatius Triliogy, and pretty much all of RAW's books.  Later, as a pagan, it developed easily for me into Peter Carroll's work, Phil Hine, and Frater U.D., (but not so much of U.D., he gives me the willies . . .)

Of all the books as of late that have seem to blow my mind the most has been Illusions, Confessions of a Relutant Messiah, by Richard Bach, and my obssession in finding correlations between the magick system in the White Wolf Game, Mage the Ascension and the works of Carroll.

man . . .am I screwed in the head or what . . .?
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on January 14, 2008, 11:10:27 pm
I started out as a consparicy theorist, by influence of my uncle at a young age who was a major amature investigator in the Kennedy assassination.  So by the age of 13, (which was a long time ago . .lol), I already had developed a healthy disbelief in anything the goverment said or did.

In a bookstore one day, I ran across the book, "Everything Is Under Control"  by RAW and my exploration in discordisim began.  It lead eventually to Steve Jackson's PD, Illuminatius Triliogy, and pretty much all of RAW's books.  Later, as a pagan, it developed easily for me into Peter Carroll's work, Phil Hine, and Frater U.D., (but not so much of U.D., he gives me the willies . . .)

Of all the books as of late that have seem to blow my mind the most has been Illusions, Confessions of a Relutant Messiah, by Richard Bach, and my obssession in finding correlations between the magick system in the White Wolf Game, Mage the Ascension and the works of Carroll.

man . . .am I screwed in the head or what . . .?

Sounds like your in the same boat as some of us.... Illusions was an absolutely awesome book and Mage is a total rip off of the system/metaphors Carroll and Hine like to use. Having some friends that are on the inside, this apparently isn't accidental... what do you expect when you let geeks make games ;-)
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cramulus on January 14, 2008, 11:13:31 pm
yeah and once you hit level 13, they'll teach you REAL MADGICK.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Frater Frankenfurter on January 14, 2008, 11:23:06 pm

Sounds like your in the same boat as some of us.... Illusions was an absolutely awesome book and Mage is a total rip off of the system/metaphors Carroll and Hine like to use. Having some friends that are on the inside, this apparently isn't accidental... what do you expect when you let geeks make games ;-)

I am glad i am not the only one who has noticed this.  I have always wondered how much infuence Carroll had over Mage, and if the authors did it just by accident or what.  As a praticing CM I have found myself using the termnology out of the game system since so much of it seems like a simplified, direct representation of CM ideas and principals.  Maybe I am not as fucked up as I thought . . .

Or maybe its worse since I have now found others who agree with me . . .
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on January 18, 2008, 04:20:05 pm

Sounds like your in the same boat as some of us.... Illusions was an absolutely awesome book and Mage is a total rip off of the system/metaphors Carroll and Hine like to use. Having some friends that are on the inside, this apparently isn't accidental... what do you expect when you let geeks make games ;-)

I am glad i am not the only one who has noticed this.  I have always wondered how much infuence Carroll had over Mage, and if the authors did it just by accident or what.  As a praticing CM I have found myself using the termnology out of the game system since so much of it seems like a simplified, direct representation of CM ideas and principals.  Maybe I am not as fucked up as I thought . . .

Or maybe its worse since I have now found others who agree with me . . .

At least two of the White Wolf people studied Chaos Magic at one point, dunno if they still practice.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Bharlion on January 24, 2008, 03:31:26 am
Bhagavad Gita.
The King in Yellow.
Enuma Elish.
The Necromancers Handbook (Latin to Eng trans 15th Cent. very rare most were burned)
Lucifer Rising.


Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Verbal Mike on January 24, 2008, 01:12:45 pm
I was born skeptic, managed to shrug off attempts at injecting me with religion until about the age of 13 when I started actively going atheist. A couple of years later I started half-seriously drifting into slightly new-age spiritualism and more seriously into ontological anarchy (without any external influence iirc). This was when books started to affect me.
First it was Tao of Physics.
Then I became familiar with Discordianism and sympathetic with its symbolism thanks to the Wikipedia article on Discordianism.
Then it was Temporary Autonomous Zone which totally blew my mind basically by virtue of one word, Simulation.
Then I read PD on PD.com (I had already seen many parts of it before). Some time before or after that it was Alan Watts' superb Wisdom of Insecurity.
Then a few days ago BIP drop-kicked my brain real nice.

I don't read nearly as much I'd like to, but I'm working on it.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on January 24, 2008, 02:08:44 pm
I was born skeptic, managed to shrug off attempts at injecting me with religion until about the age of 13 when I started actively going atheist. A couple of years later I started half-seriously drifting into slightly new-age spiritualism and more seriously into ontological anarchy (without any external influence iirc). This was when books started to affect me.
First it was Tao of Physics.
Then I became familiar with Discordianism and sympathetic with its symbolism thanks to the Wikipedia article on Discordianism.
Then it was Temporary Autonomous Zone which totally blew my mind basically by virtue of one word, Simulation.
Then I read PD on PD.com (I had already seen many parts of it before). Some time before or after that it was Alan Watts' superb Wisdom of Insecurity.
Then a few days ago BIP drop-kicked my brain real nice.

I don't read nearly as much I'd like to, but I'm working on it.

Have your read  Jean Baudrillard's "Simulacra and Simulations"?
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on January 24, 2008, 02:10:25 pm
If not, I have a pdf of it.

Debord's Society and the Spectacle is also well worth reading.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Dysfunctional Cunt on January 24, 2008, 02:48:49 pm

The Book of Five Rings - Miyamoto Mushashi
The quintissential Japanese strategy guide.  The object of the lesson is that the lesson never ends, and to never rely on anything external to yourself to succeed.


This was one of the first books I read that had a huge influence on me and my road to here.  What is so strange is I read it after seeing so many quotes by Miyamoto Mushashi in "The Wiccan Warrior" by Kerr Cuhulain which was a gift from my sister who, at the time, was trying to convince me that I was wiccan.  Strange how the road twists to a completely unexpected destination! :lol:
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on January 24, 2008, 02:50:37 pm
From the little I've seen (extracts really) Kerr Culhain seems to know what he is talking about.  Good book?
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Verbal Mike on January 24, 2008, 03:05:06 pm
Cain, I'd be glad to have a gander at that pdf. I hadn't heard of S&S before but Wikipedia makes it out to sound like an interesting read.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on January 24, 2008, 03:08:06 pm
Here you go http://www.mediafire.com/?aswygxwct0d
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Verbal Mike on January 24, 2008, 03:31:08 pm
Thank you. :)
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on January 24, 2008, 03:31:32 pm
No problems.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Dysfunctional Cunt on January 24, 2008, 04:09:08 pm
From the little I've seen (extracts really) Kerr Culhain seems to know what he is talking about.  Good book?

Actually I thoroughly enjoyed it.  I have recommended it many times to friends and family!  There are a few places where I was just 'thanks but uh NO' but in all it was a good book!  I have found men seem to get it more than women, a very masculine point of view on stuff!  Not a lot of fluff, very to the point yanno?
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Jasper on January 24, 2008, 10:28:16 pm
I'm almost through "Patterns On The Stone".  It's cool.

Oh, and I'm about to gobble up several gigs of Nikola Tesla and elec eng documents.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on January 25, 2008, 11:41:34 am
From the little I've seen (extracts really) Kerr Culhain seems to know what he is talking about.  Good book?

Actually I thoroughly enjoyed it.  I have recommended it many times to friends and family!  There are a few places where I was just 'thanks but uh NO' but in all it was a good book!  I have found men seem to get it more than women, a very masculine point of view on stuff!  Not a lot of fluff, very to the point yanno?

Swote.

I probably wont read it, I have reading stocked up for years to come, but if I see it on someone elses bookshelf, I shall assume they are a person of decency and taste.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Verbal Mike on January 25, 2008, 05:41:14 pm
I realized there's another book that I read that kind of laid the mental groundwork for this chaos. It was Daniel Greenberg's "Worlds in Creation", which is mainly a book about learning.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Iason Ouabache on February 23, 2008, 01:09:13 am
For me it goes like this:

Principia Discordia (Steven Jackson Games version)
H2G2 (which I read when I was 12)
The Illumintus Triology
Summa Discordia
Black Iron Prison
The Tao of Physics
Techniques of Chaos Magic (http://www.boudicca.de/max1-e.htm)
The Gnostic Gospels by Elaine Pagels (first time I looked at religion from a political POV)

I just started reading Prometheus Rising but I'm sure that it's going to be somewhere on that list really soon.

Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on February 23, 2008, 01:20:16 am
Incidentally, if anyone has e-book versions of anything on here, I suggest uploading them.  I'm going to go through my rather extensive library later tomorrow, and see what I have already.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Epimetheus on February 23, 2008, 04:58:48 am
Douglas Adams is a great influence. I read Daniel Pinkwater books in elementary school, and I don't care how young I was, I recognized them as great books. I still think they're great, as far as I remember them.
I'm a Taoist so Taoist texts (I've read) blow me away.
Honestly, things like PBF comics, SMBC, and Cyanide and Happiness blow me away.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on February 23, 2008, 12:54:38 pm
I read both Adams and Pratchett at secondary/high school, so I would tend to agree.  They weren't the most influential things I read, but they still made me think and helped develop my somewhat twisted sense of humour.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: the other anonymous on February 23, 2008, 02:53:44 pm
In the order I read them:

Some five-cent book from the 70s found in my high school's library, about world mythologies that included an alternate history for Christ. That blew my mind.

To Ride a Silver Broomstick, by Silver RavenWolf.

A book a friend in high school was writing about her visions.

The Dada Manifestos

Meditations on First Philosophy, by Descartes.

You see, not only did I learn that all religions are mythical, but I learned that all myths are religical. Then I learned I could roll my own. Then I learned it was all shit anyway. And then I learned to love playing in the shit.

-toa,
two philosophers, one cup
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on February 23, 2008, 03:25:14 pm
Wait...Silver Ravenwolf?

I'm genuinely curious about what you got out of her, given the general consensus in the srs Pagan community is to despise her and everything she does.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on February 23, 2008, 04:12:40 pm
OK, uploads of books I have.

Includes:

The PD
Illuminatus! Trilogy
Prometheus Rising
Beneath Reality
Godel, Escher, Bach
The Temporary Autononmous Zone/Broadsheets on Ontological Chaos
The Book of Law
The Book of Lies/Liber 333
Liber ABA/Book 4
The Hero With A Thousand Faces
Apocrypha Discordia
AD&D Complete Second Edition
Beyond Good and Evil
The Book of 5 Rings
The Spy Who Came in From the Cold (cant find my e-copy of A Perfect Spy)
Oven Ready Chaos (instead of Prime Chaos, again couldn't find)
The Teachings of Don Juan
Fight Club
Ender's Game
Liber Null
Bhagavad Gita
Simulacra and Simulations
HHGTTG

I dont have the rest.  Upload here: http://www.mediafire.com/?16yyecshjnm
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Requia ☣ on February 23, 2008, 11:46:12 pm
Oooh, been looking for another copy of Apocrypha Discordia for a while.

Not really discordian, but the Nag Hammadi was probably the first thing to make me question my belief structure around the supernatural.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Kurt Christ on February 24, 2008, 03:57:55 am
The PD, The Illuminatus! Trilogy, and Beyond Good and Evil would be my top three. Siddhartha by Hesse also had some influence.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Vene on February 24, 2008, 04:14:17 am
First it was the Bible (I have found nothing better for deconverting Xians), and for a few years I started to notice more and more chaos in the world (along with the thought that the universe is fundamentally flawed).  Just over a year ago I read The Illuminatus! Trilogy and the references to the Principia Discordia so I searched for and read it.  It was at that point I knew Discordianism was for me.

And Douglas Adams wins, pure and simple.

So, in order it was:
The Bible
A few years of confusion
Illuminatus!
PD
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Triple Zero on February 24, 2008, 10:28:52 pm
I dont have the rest.  Upload here: http://www.mediafire.com/?16yyecshjnm

sweet. feels good just to have them :-)

one day i'll get a device with an e-ink display and i might actually read them, too :)

wait, who listed "AD&D Complete Second Edition" ? :)

- Oven Ready Chaos (instead of Prime Chaos, again couldn't find)

i printed and read that one, but, isn't there some slightly more serious discussion about chaos magick available somewhere? because when i read it, i was mostly busy having a look at the occult and just see what it's all about, with the most open mind possible, but i kind of like the no-nonsense explanations these days. i still play around with Tarot, for example, which i think can be a useful (and fun) psychological tool, but i'm not going to pretend it's predicting my future.
just like with Chaos Magick, you got these sigils and the idea of gnosis, and now i have a vague idea of the psychological theory behind that, but i really don't care for "explanations" such as "gnosis helps the sigil/magick to bypass the psychic censor".
eh, so if anyone has got some title suggestions that delve into Chaos Magick without too much of the bullshit, that would be great :)

i might actually try and read Liber Null from the screen, i've heard that book mentioned so often now, i'm kinda curious what's in it, anyway.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on February 24, 2008, 10:42:51 pm
Someone mentioned Gary Gygax, and while I dont have the first editon rules, I thought the second edition would go down well.

As for magick....blargh, practically everything I read on it looks like bullshit to me.  Carl Jung is probably the only person worth reading if you want a psychological take on similar topics, the rest seem to be engaged in metaphysical masturbation.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: DORADA on February 25, 2008, 09:36:49 am
 :lulz:first read the book please
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: barumunk on February 25, 2008, 05:08:57 pm
Lifetide, Gift of Unknown Things, and The Romeo Error... all by Lyle Watson

 :fap: :fap: :fap: :fap: :fap: :fap:

and Sophie's World (I really dug it, twas my introduction/crash-course in philosophy)
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on February 25, 2008, 05:13:49 pm
:lulz:first read the book please

1st ed. D&D?

Why?

Will it help me complete Neverwinter Nights faster?
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: barumunk on February 25, 2008, 05:19:39 pm
:lulz:first read the book please

1st ed. D&D?

Why?

Will it help me complete Neverwinter Nights faster?

hahahaha not likely that game was pooh. and im not sure how else it could have been an enlightening read :D
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: the other anonymous on March 02, 2008, 06:06:26 pm
Wait...Silver Ravenwolf?

I'm genuinely curious about what you got out of her, given the general consensus in the srs Pagan community is to despise her and everything she does.

Quote
You see, not only did I learn that all religions are mythical, but I learned that all myths are religical. Then I learned I could roll my own. Then I learned it was all shit anyway. And then I learned to love playing in the shit.

Also, that consensus adds to the part about "it was all shit anyway".

-toa,
tried them all on, none fitted
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on March 02, 2008, 06:12:14 pm
Sounds fair to me, even if I don't exactly know what you mean by reglical.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: LMNO on March 03, 2008, 02:14:11 pm
I think it's just a clever-ish play on "magical".

What I think he's saying is that Religion contains elements of Myth, and that Myth constains elements of Religion.

Hence, if you have a big enough of a Myth, you can form a Religion around it.  See Beatles, Elvis, Scientology, et al.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on March 03, 2008, 03:37:48 pm
Or he meant they worshipped kings.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on March 03, 2008, 03:55:46 pm
:lulz:first read the book please

1st ed. D&D?

Why?

Will it help me complete Neverwinter Nights faster?

NWN is based on 3rd Edition rules:
www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd.html

However, the rules won't help you... NWN's base stories are just something ya gotta slag through. Now, once you start playing in the online worlds stuff gets much more interesting. ;-)
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on March 03, 2008, 03:58:07 pm
Sorry, I'm too busy profiteering from the crisis.

I'm actually sabotaging any attempt to compete the game, and instead am going round extorting money from people and assassinating guards.  And that fucker Desther is gonna get a smack in the gob soon.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Bebek Sincap Ratatosk on March 03, 2008, 05:52:08 pm
Sorry, I'm too busy profiteering from the crisis.

I'm actually sabotaging any attempt to compete the game, and instead am going round extorting money from people and assassinating guards.  And that fucker Desther is gonna get a smack in the gob soon.

Ehehehe, that's what my evil Gnome Sorcerer did ;-)

Watch killing innocent children though... I pissed off some little girl and she killed my henchman... and almost killed me.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: aestetix on March 03, 2008, 09:31:12 pm
OK, uploads of books I have.

Includes:

The PD
Illuminatus! Trilogy
Prometheus Rising
Beneath Reality
Godel, Escher, Bach
The Temporary Autononmous Zone/Broadsheets on Ontological Chaos
The Book of Law
The Book of Lies/Liber 333
Liber ABA/Book 4
The Hero With A Thousand Faces
Apocrypha Discordia
AD&D Complete Second Edition
Beyond Good and Evil
The Book of 5 Rings
The Spy Who Came in From the Cold (cant find my e-copy of A Perfect Spy)
Oven Ready Chaos (instead of Prime Chaos, again couldn't find)
The Teachings of Don Juan
Fight Club
Ender's Game
Liber Null
Bhagavad Gita
Simulacra and Simulations
HHGTTG

I dont have the rest.  Upload here: http://www.mediafire.com/?16yyecshjnm

From what I can tell, that's a pretty good list.

I was a bit disappointed by Prometheus Rising, but only because I'd already encountered all the ideas in other places before. It's great to see Godel Escher Bach too... one of my favorites.

I'm kind of surprised nobody has mentioned Atlas Shrugged or the Fountainhead. Or, as a newcomer to this forum, am I simply missing past hooplah about the Randroids? Especially given that around 1/4 of Illuminatus Trilogy is devoted to making fun of Ayn Rand (Telemachus Sneezed, anyone?).

Are we aiming for destruction of childish illusionment (normally Orwell, Rand, maybe Robert Pirsig) or tomes that actually worked to reconstruct public thought into new ideas? Campbell's work (Hero's Journey, etc) is fantastic. I'd also suggest Descartes' Discourse on Method as a useful tool for bullshit filtering.

Years ago, Kuro5hin (k5) had a couple of stories related to this, although they were more "what books have been influential in your life" while I suspect this is more "what books have been influential in your exploration of Discordianism".
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Doktor Loki on March 03, 2008, 10:02:51 pm
It really was the SubGenius stuff that did it.  The Principia was a good laugh, and it made me think.
BotSG made me stop thinking, and start KNOWING.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Hoopla! on March 03, 2008, 10:54:53 pm
I'm kind of surprised nobody has mentioned Atlas Shrugged or the Fountainhead.

:|

Or, as a newcomer to this forum, am I simply missing past hooplah about the Randroids? Especially given that around 1/4 of Illuminatus Trilogy is devoted to making fun of Ayn Rand (Telemachus Sneezed, anyone?).

Hoopla is not spelled with two H's.  Anywhere.  Just saying.

Second, I personally find Ayn Rand distasteful, if somewhat hilarious.   Actually, Objectivism is hilarious, and Ayn was something special.  She believed there were Universal Morals, which could be found through Pure Reason, which applied to everyone, except her of course.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Cramulus on March 03, 2008, 11:06:07 pm
Hi Aestetix! Nice to see you found your way here. I saw you had registered a few weeks back, glad to see you poking your head in.

I met Aestetix IRL at the Scientology protest and hung out with him afterwards. I somehow lured him here, too.

Offtopic note to 000: Aestetix has friends that say they know about coding our forum-bot thing.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Triple Zero on March 03, 2008, 11:13:07 pm

Offtopic note to 000: Aestetix has friends that say they know about coding our forum-bot thing.

Offtopic note to Cram: In that case, Aestetix should come to the IRC channel and talk to me, preferably at a moment when i'm not wasted (hint: it's not now).
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on March 03, 2008, 11:37:51 pm
From what I can tell, that's a pretty good list.

I was a bit disappointed by Prometheus Rising, but only because I'd already encountered all the ideas in other places before. It's great to see Godel Escher Bach too... one of my favorites.

I'm kind of surprised nobody has mentioned Atlas Shrugged or the Fountainhead. Or, as a newcomer to this forum, am I simply missing past hooplah about the Randroids? Especially given that around 1/4 of Illuminatus Trilogy is devoted to making fun of Ayn Rand (Telemachus Sneezed, anyone?).

Are we aiming for destruction of childish illusionment (normally Orwell, Rand, maybe Robert Pirsig) or tomes that actually worked to reconstruct public thought into new ideas? Campbell's work (Hero's Journey, etc) is fantastic. I'd also suggest Descartes' Discourse on Method as a useful tool for bullshit filtering.

Years ago, Kuro5hin (k5) had a couple of stories related to this, although they were more "what books have been influential in your life" while I suspect this is more "what books have been influential in your exploration of Discordianism".

Well, I have to say, the view on Ayn Rand on here isn't exactly...fantastic.  Now it could just be that most of us have either met Objectivists, either online or off (I know the local libertarian crowd, but they're very...classical in their approach) who seem a little...insane.  This is possible, given that nowadays Objectivism, as practised by the Ayn Rand Institute, is little more than a cult.  Also, the most vocal people within that group seem to be hypocrites, who profess individualism while having no problem with lumping in all Muslims together and nuking them, for example.  I wish I were making this up, but they seem to be 100% behind the War On Terror as well as the corporate arm of the government, and have advocated nuclear weapons to be used on the entire Middle East.  Rothbard/Hess innfluenced libertarians in particular seem to hold a deep hatred for Objectivists and their wholesale backing of the War on Terror.

As for Ayn Rand herself, I've heard contradictory things about her works.  On the one hand, you have a very dogmatic, demanding and somewhat authoritarian personality, not least towards women, homosexuals and Arabs, who sided with systems of control more often than not.  This view seems to be borne out by her many successors, both within the Institute and in the less controlled blogosphere.  On the other hand, in some respects, she made a couple of valid critiques, especially with regard to culture, and The Fountainhead is meant to be good in that respect, even if she spent much of her later life trying to repudiate certain views held within that.

The thing is...there are a lot of valid cultural critiques around, and if I spent all day reading them, I'd never get anything done.  From what I can see, Rand wasn't an especially talented philospher, and her main influences are Aristotle and Nietzsche, both of whom I have read in detail and consider generally superior to most philosophy.  Also, Nietzsche is a hilarious read most of the time.  More than a few people here tend towards Nietzsche than Aristotle, philosophically too, and of course Rand took the opposite view, so there is a rather large difference in terms of worldview there, which may explain some level of antipathy.

Anyway, welcome to the forums Aestetix.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Mangrove on March 06, 2008, 07:26:17 pm
Does anyone want an Ayn Rand biography? I have one sitting at home (one of my late brother in law's effects).

Contact SSOOKN HQ (Dept of Archival Resources & Book Acquisitions)
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Hoopla! on March 06, 2008, 07:32:00 pm
I'll take it, if you don't mind much.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Mangrove on March 06, 2008, 07:58:38 pm
I'll take it, if you don't mind much.

Winnar. (Being our first and only applicant)

PM me to sort out getting the aforementioned tome shipped to your locale.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on March 06, 2008, 09:38:20 pm
Is it as long as Atlas Shrugged?
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Hoopla! on March 06, 2008, 10:26:16 pm
Only the Phone Book is as long as Atlas Shrugged.

I should admit here that I actually enjoyed the only Rand book I've ever read, which was Anthem, and I read it at 17.  It is considerably shorter than her other novels.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Iason Ouabache on March 07, 2008, 08:46:37 am
Only the Phone Book is as long as Atlas Shrugged.

I should admit here that I actually enjoyed the only Rand book I've ever read, which was Anthem, and I read it at 17.  It is considerably shorter than her other novels.
That's the one where she mess around with the pronouns a lot, right?  I think that i read that at 17 also.  Not bad, but not great.  Only Rand book I've read too.  My best friend with though a Rand Objectivist phase.  He's lucky that I didn't kick his ass for it.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Hoopla! on March 07, 2008, 12:30:55 pm
Only the Phone Book is as long as Atlas Shrugged.

I should admit here that I actually enjoyed the only Rand book I've ever read, which was Anthem, and I read it at 17.  It is considerably shorter than her other novels.
That's the one where she mess around with the pronouns a lot, right?  I think that i read that at 17 also.  Not bad, but not great.  Only Rand book I've read too.  My best friend with though a Rand Objectivist phase.  He's lucky that I didn't kick his ass for it.

Yeah I think so - I know that the word "I" was banned in the novel.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Cain on March 07, 2008, 03:10:23 pm
You know...that just makes Pawnman and AmericanME's pathetic criticisms of e-prime even more hilarious.

dOnT yUo kNoW bAnNiNg cErTaIn wOrDs aNd nOuNs iS nEwSpEaK!  eXcEpT wHeN rAnD dOeS iT, cUz sHe'S oUr hErO!
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Hoopla! on March 07, 2008, 03:47:29 pm
Not really though, because in her book it wasn't a good thing.  The hero uses it for the first time at the end, and its a 'moment of triumph'.

Or, some such rot.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the mo
Post by: Coyote on March 07, 2008, 05:03:53 pm
Spiritually Incorrect Enlightenment, by jed mckenna was pretty good.
Title: Re: Which of these (or some other tome you want to mention) blew you away the most?
Post by: Requia ☣ on March 07, 2008, 09:30:08 pm
Funnily enough, I read (and own, though I no longer have time to read epics like Fountainhead or, god forbid, Atlas shrugged) all of Rand's books except Anthem, which I never found a copy of.