Curious about a concept in the BIP

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

The border between the Real and the Unreal is not fixed, but just marks the last place where rival gangs of shamans fought each other to a standstill.
Robert Anton Wilson


There we have RAW chiming in about it.  From his point of view Discordianism is a form of Shamanism.

(For WK's benefit and any others not familiar with the history of Discordianism he's one of the founders of Discordianism, along with Kerry Thornley and some others.

Is not.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Welcome to Discordia. "Founder" just means they happened to write some cool stuff that inspired other stuff. Many folsk here have never read anything by the 'founders'.

Also interesting.  I understood that Discordia was to each his own and think for yourself, but I'm surprised that people would group themselves in any group without researching it, if not first then soon after getting interested in it.  My own prejudice showing I guess.  I am big on researching things that interest me.  Doesn't it make it hard when there are no necessarily common points of reference?

Oh, good luck with THIS rabbit-hole. You seem to be looking for doctrine. There is no doctrine.

Have you ever read the Tao Te Ching? Good. Now you know as much about Discordianism as you need to get started.

[Wyldkat]

Welcome to Discordia. "Founder" just means they happened to write some cool stuff that inspired other stuff. Many folsk here have never read anything by the 'founders'.

Also interesting.  I understood that Discordia was to each his own and think for yourself, but I'm surprised that people would group themselves in any group without researching it, if not first then soon after getting interested in it.  My own prejudice showing I guess.  I am big on researching things that interest me.  Doesn't it make it hard when there are no necessarily common points of reference?

Oh, good luck with THIS rabbit-hole. You seem to be looking for doctrine. There is no doctrine.

Have you ever read the Tao Te Ching? Good. Now you know as much about Discordianism as you need to get started.

I'm not looking for doctrine, I'm looking to understand concepts to at least some extent.  In my experience reading the literature about a subject helps.  I've managed to learn a lot from this thread already.

[Freeky]

Welcome to Discordia. "Founder" just means they happened to write some cool stuff that inspired other stuff. Many folsk here have never read anything by the 'founders'.

Also interesting.  I understood that Discordia was to each his own and think for yourself, but I'm surprised that people would group themselves in any group without researching it, if not first then soon after getting interested in it.  My own prejudice showing I guess.  I am big on researching things that interest me.  Doesn't it make it hard when there are no necessarily common points of reference?

That's why YOU'RE the filthy pagan, and WE'RE the assholes who poke holes in your "reality".

[BabylonHoruv]

The border between the Real and the Unreal is not fixed, but just marks the last place where rival gangs of shamans fought each other to a standstill.
Robert Anton Wilson


There we have RAW chiming in about it.  From his point of view Discordianism is a form of Shamanism.

(For WK's benefit and any others not familiar with the history of Discordianism he's one of the founders of Discordianism, along with Kerry Thornley and some others.

Is not.

Is in some sense, is not in some sense, and is irrelevant in some sense.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

The border between the Real and the Unreal is not fixed, but just marks the last place where rival gangs of shamans fought each other to a standstill.
Robert Anton Wilson


There we have RAW chiming in about it.  From his point of view Discordianism is a form of Shamanism.

(For WK's benefit and any others not familiar with the history of Discordianism he's one of the founders of Discordianism, along with Kerry Thornley and some others.

Is not.

Is in some sense, is not in some sense, and is irrelevant in some sense.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Welcome to Discordia. "Founder" just means they happened to write some cool stuff that inspired other stuff. Many folsk here have never read anything by the 'founders'.

Also interesting.  I understood that Discordia was to each his own and think for yourself, but I'm surprised that people would group themselves in any group without researching it, if not first then soon after getting interested in it.  My own prejudice showing I guess.  I am big on researching things that interest me.  Doesn't it make it hard when there are no necessarily common points of reference?

Oh, good luck with THIS rabbit-hole. You seem to be looking for doctrine. There is no doctrine.

Have you ever read the Tao Te Ching? Good. Now you know as much about Discordianism as you need to get started.

I'm not looking for doctrine, I'm looking to understand concepts to at least some extent.  In my experience reading the literature about a subject helps.  I've managed to learn a lot from this thread already.

So... wait, knowing little to nothing about it, why are you so surprised that not all Discordians have read Robert Anton Wilson? Are you also surprised that not all Discordians have read the Book of the Subgenius? Do you even know why you're surprised? Why not ask questions before forming judgments?

[Cardinal Pizza Deliverance.]

Well. You know every single pagan has not only memorized Bucky's Big Blue Book, but has also read Silver RavenWolf's entire body of work . . .

We have scintillating discussions on Starhawk's "The Fifth Sacred Thing" weekly and eagerly await Amber K's latest offering with bated breath. All of us. Everywhere.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Welcome to Discordia. "Founder" just means they happened to write some cool stuff that inspired other stuff. Many folsk here have never read anything by the 'founders'.

Also interesting.  I understood that Discordia was to each his own and think for yourself, but I'm surprised that people would group themselves in any group without researching it, if not first then soon after getting interested in it.  My own prejudice showing I guess.  I am big on researching things that interest me.  Doesn't it make it hard when there are no necessarily common points of reference?

That's because you're a Pagan.  You need rules, research, all that shit.  We just jam our junk into whatever open ports the machine has, and wait to see what happens.

Sure, we all wind up with horrible scars and speech impediments that are better left undescribed, but we have FUN.

Remember FUN?  It's what you used to have, before you started worrying about inconsequential shit so fucking much.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Welcome to Discordia. "Founder" just means they happened to write some cool stuff that inspired other stuff. Many folsk here have never read anything by the 'founders'.

Also interesting.  I understood that Discordia was to each his own and think for yourself, but I'm surprised that people would group themselves in any group without researching it, if not first then soon after getting interested in it.  My own prejudice showing I guess.  I am big on researching things that interest me.  Doesn't it make it hard when there are no necessarily common points of reference?

Oh, good luck with THIS rabbit-hole. You seem to be looking for doctrine. There is no doctrine.

Have you ever read the Tao Te Ching? Good. Now you know as much about Discordianism as you need to get started.

I'm not looking for doctrine, I'm looking to understand concepts to at least some extent.  In my experience reading the literature about a subject helps.  I've managed to learn a lot from this thread already.!!!

At its most basic I think the shared concept is that we're all Cosmic Schmucks, Talking Monkeys and Holy Men (or Women). The raging disagreement among Discordians is as much a part of Discordianism as anything else.

Discordianism isn't about what IS... but about whatever the individual Pope decides to see what they can get away with. This forum tends to be its own Cabal. There are Discordians that think the BiP is nonsense. There are Discordians that think the PD is nonsense. There are Discordians that like all of it, plus RAW's stuff... plus anything else that mentions the name Eris. There are Discordians that parrot the jokes from others and Discordians that hate every old Discordian joke...

And they're all equally Discordian.

I wonder what she'd say,
if she happened by today,
and saw us in our rituals of life?
Would she think we're doing well,
in our own chaotic hell,
or would she decide to add a little strife?

There's Erisians on the net,
who are trying, you can bet,
to spread those words of chaos writ by Mal.
But Discordians, you know,
might aim an extra blow,
at their brothers and their sisters of the Chao.

I have seen the common spat,
regarding this and that,
and who and what and where and why and how.
And in the orgy of the fray,
we oft forget our way,
and might spill our bitter tea upon our towel.

So I wonder what she'd say,
if she happened through this way,
and stopped to see the madness we had wrought.
I think she'd laugh the most,
and head back home to boast,
about the way in which her Children fought.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Well. You know every single pagan has not only memorized Bucky's Big Blue Book, but has also read Silver RavenWolf's entire body of work . . .

We have scintillating discussions on Starhawk's "The Fifth Sacred Thing" weekly and eagerly await Amber K's latest offering with bated breath. All of us. Everywhere.

Yeah, it's actually been pretty AMAZING reading MW and TCC (especially TCC) and realizing that most of the users, including (especially) the mods on TCC, have very obviously read almost none of the seminal/founding work on their own (alleged) religions.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Welcome to Discordia. "Founder" just means they happened to write some cool stuff that inspired other stuff. Many folsk here have never read anything by the 'founders'.

Also interesting.  I understood that Discordia was to each his own and think for yourself, but I'm surprised that people would group themselves in any group without researching it, if not first then soon after getting interested in it.  My own prejudice showing I guess.  I am big on researching things that interest me.  Doesn't it make it hard when there are no necessarily common points of reference?

That's because you're a Pagan.  You need rules, research, all that shit.  We just jam our junk into whatever open ports the machine has, and wait to see what happens.

Sure, we all wind up with horrible scars and speech impediments that are better left undescribed, but we have FUN.

Remember FUN?  It's what you used to have, before you started worrying about inconsequential shit so fucking much.

[Wyldkat]

Welcome to Discordia. "Founder" just means they happened to write some cool stuff that inspired other stuff. Many folsk here have never read anything by the 'founders'.

Also interesting.  I understood that Discordia was to each his own and think for yourself, but I'm surprised that people would group themselves in any group without researching it, if not first then soon after getting interested in it.  My own prejudice showing I guess.  I am big on researching things that interest me.  Doesn't it make it hard when there are no necessarily common points of reference?

Oh, good luck with THIS rabbit-hole. You seem to be looking for doctrine. There is no doctrine.

Have you ever read the Tao Te Ching? Good. Now you know as much about Discordianism as you need to get started.

I'm not looking for doctrine, I'm looking to understand concepts to at least some extent.  In my experience reading the literature about a subject helps.  I've managed to learn a lot from this thread already.

So... wait, knowing little to nothing about it, why are you so surprised that not all Discordians have read Robert Anton Wilson? Are you also surprised that not all Discordians have read the Book of the Subgenius? Do you even know why you're surprised? Why not ask questions before forming judgments?

I'm mildly surprised that they haven't chosen to, simply because I, and most people I know, like to learn about subjects that interest them especially before identifying personally with them.  I'm not a Discordian and I read the BIP and PD because I was interested in something that might be discussed in them.

I am asking questions.  To ask a question one must have some sort of base to start from.  Using a personal frame of reference to work from to compare and contrast generally helps me gain greater understanding of most subjects.

Well. You know every single pagan has not only memorized Bucky's Big Blue Book, but has also read Silver RavenWolf's entire body of work . . .

We have scintillating discussions on Starhawk's "The Fifth Sacred Thing" weekly and eagerly await Amber K's latest offering with bated breath. All of us. Everywhere.

LOL  Ok, point.  I've never read the Big Blue Book myself, although I have read Spiral Dance and a good number of the other notable books even though most of them aren't about my path.  The thing is that if someone isn't a total newb in the pagan community they have heard of the books and understand to at least a basic extent certain key concepts (pentagram, rituals, grounding, etc...).  I'm getting somewhat curious if there is anything along those lines here.  Well I guess certain key phrases like "Think for yourself schmuck" would be sort of like that.

This is definitely very different than any other place I've visited.

I'm actually very good at having fun, believe it or not.  *grins*  I fed my cubscouts bugs and weeds this past week.  I was rather disappointed when the moms refused their share.  I do have an admittedly odd sense of humor at times...

[Cardinal Pizza Deliverance.]

You should have hung out at the old AAW MSN freechat room, Wyldkat. The "twelfth generation Strega" who didn't know what fucking country that path comes from and the white trash in Montana practicing 'authentic voodoo' would have left you rolling.

[Wyldkat]

You should have hung out at the old AAW MSN freechat room, Wyldkat. The "twelfth generation Strega" who didn't know what fucking country that path comes from and the white trash in Montana practicing 'authentic voodoo' would have left you rolling.

*twitches*  yeouch...  Really?  Claimed 12th generation and didn't know the country of origin?  Wow..........