Wanna know why people are comfortable with torture?

[Slyph]

...trained...

HAHAHAHAHA

[Cain]

You know what I mean.

[Cain]

But thanks for the substansive reply and all.

[Slyph]

Oh no, I'm sorry. I was just trying to say; They absolutely do not train us. They employ, basically, warm bodies. Want to know why I was hired? What the criteria was?

Zero professional qualifications, brother with Aspergers. basically, I'd heard of Autistic Spectrum Disorders. I was hired alongside someone who in fact didn't know what Autism was; quote: "I didn't know they couldn't talk and that."

Social Care is a bunch of chimps trying to do the job of a professional. It's capital B Bullshit. My problem with the job has never been that I've observed any active malfeasance, It's just that... Everybody's a bit shit.

[BadBeast]

I knew a Mental Nurse who was sent (by the Government) into Rampton Hospital (mostly criminally insane patients) for three months, to investigate rumours of abuse in the early 1980's, and what he uncovered there was so horrific that I'm not going to go into any details. The conclusion they came to, was that the positions there, were being appointed on nepotism, rather than qualification, or suitability. People would get their sons or relatives jobs there, and this had been the case practically since it was first opened. After ten weeks, there had been two attempts on his life, and the investigation was ended early because they needed to get him out of the situation immediately, or he may well have been killed. There were dozens of arrests, prison sentences, etc, and as a result, the Government completely revised the hiring standards for all secure institutions in Britain, (including Prisons)

I think the magnitude of what was happening, took the Government completely by surprise, because if they had any idea of how bad it was, they wouldn't have sent an investigator, they would have shut the place down immediately. And this was the Tories too, not exactly known for their compassion. The man who was sent in, had a nervous breakdown after the Court case, as a direct result of the pressure and stress. Thinking about some of the stuff he told me, even now,  I'm almost not posting this, but I will.
I don't usually have any trouble at all going into graphic details, but not this time.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

If you want to be horrified, Google "Oregon State Hospital". Maybe also look up "Oregon Board of Eugenics" while you're at it.

[Salty]

Diffusion of responsibility. 

I could enter a crowded place with a baby and a cleaver, make a great show of bringing the blade up and down on the neck and then chop the head off, and the chances of people intervening are so low precisely due to the number of people there.  "Why doesn't someone do something?"  "You first" is the cynical and all too accurate reply.  Oh sure, they might do something once the baby is actually dead, make a show of moving after the killing blow was already struck....but until that moment, it is Somebody Else's Problem.

That makes me MORE angry. I suppose that makes such inaction as human as, say genocide, or cooking, or painting. But it's still wrong. Maybe I'm delusional to think that I would step up and do the right thing, maybe a lot of people feel that way. These things carry on despite my revulsion.

So how do we get around that? How do we short-circuit that sort of response?
If it's a question of responsibility, do we attempt to put install leadership and organization that keeps things like this from happening? Or is this kind of human behavior inevitable, unstoppable?

[ñͤͣ̄ͦ̌̑͗͊͛͂͗ ̸̨̨̣̺̼̣̜͙͈͕̮̊̈́̈͂͛̽͊ͭ̓͆ͅé ̰̓̓́ͯ́́͞]

Diffusion of responsibility. 

I could enter a crowded place with a baby and a cleaver, make a great show of bringing the blade up and down on the neck and then chop the head off, and the chances of people intervening are so low precisely due to the number of people there.  "Why doesn't someone do something?"  "You first" is the cynical and all too accurate reply.  Oh sure, they might do something once the baby is actually dead, make a show of moving after the killing blow was already struck....but until that moment, it is Somebody Else's Problem.

That makes me MORE angry. I suppose that makes such inaction as human as, say genocide, or cooking, or painting. But it's still wrong. Maybe I'm delusional to think that I would step up and do the right thing, maybe a lot of people feel that way. These things carry on despite my revulsion.

So how do we get around that? How do we short-circuit that sort of response?
If it's a question of responsibility, do we attempt to put install leadership and organization that keeps things like this from happening? Or is this kind of human behavior inevitable, unstoppable?

There is some evidence that when people know about this tendency they counteract it.

I could dig up the references on that, but I'm sure someone else will do it.

[P3nT4gR4m]

Diffusion of responsibility.  

I could enter a crowded place with a baby and a cleaver, make a great show of bringing the blade up and down on the neck and then chop the head off, and the chances of people intervening are so low precisely due to the number of people there.  "Why doesn't someone do something?"  "You first" is the cynical and all too accurate reply.  Oh sure, they might do something once the baby is actually dead, make a show of moving after the killing blow was already struck....but until that moment, it is Somebody Else's Problem.

That makes me MORE angry. I suppose that makes such inaction as human as, say genocide, or cooking, or painting. But it's still wrong. Maybe I'm delusional to think that I would step up and do the right thing, maybe a lot of people feel that way. These things carry on despite my revulsion.

So how do we get around that? How do we short-circuit that sort of response?
If it's a question of responsibility, do we attempt to put install leadership and organization that keeps things like this from happening? Or is this kind of human behavior inevitable, unstoppable?

There is some evidence that when people know about this tendency they counteract it.

I could dig up the references on that, but I'm sure someone else will do it.

That has a definite ring of truth to it. I can relate to a lot of similar psychological effects. When I was at college we did this module called Communications. Pretty broad topic but when we got to non-verbal communications we learned about the Rapport effect whereby people who are connected with a level of rapport (they might be agreeing on something - for instance) will mirror each other's body language, posture, arm positions, etc...

So sure enough me and my classmates find ourselves sitting in the canteen during a break, all in a circle, about 7 or 8 of us and then someone noticed we all had the same leg crossed over and our arms folded. Then I started paying attention to the effect on me, whenever I was interacting with people and I stopped doing it. Unless there was a positive gain available, in which case I'd do it on purpose - people can be pushed into feeling comfortable with you if you, to a degree, if you just mirror them a bit.

[Placid Dingo]

Diffusion of responsibility. 

I could enter a crowded place with a baby and a cleaver, make a great show of bringing the blade up and down on the neck and then chop the head off, and the chances of people intervening are so low precisely due to the number of people there.  "Why doesn't someone do something?"  "You first" is the cynical and all too accurate reply.  Oh sure, they might do something once the baby is actually dead, make a show of moving after the killing blow was already struck....but until that moment, it is Somebody Else's Problem.

That makes me MORE angry. I suppose that makes such inaction as human as, say genocide, or cooking, or painting. But it's still wrong. Maybe I'm delusional to think that I would step up and do the right thing, maybe a lot of people feel that way. These things carry on despite my revulsion.

So how do we get around that? How do we short-circuit that sort of response?
If it's a question of responsibility, do we attempt to put install leadership and organization that keeps things like this from happening? Or is this kind of human behavior inevitable, unstoppable?

There is some evidence that when people know about this tendency they counteract it.

I could dig up the references on that, but I'm sure someone else will do it.

A basic introduction to cognitive science, 'opening skinners box' covers the genovese case, the smoking room and the heart attack over radio experiment, the five (or some number) step plan to preventing diffusion of responsibility, and the evidence that suggests awareness of it it has an impact on behaviour.

The researchers in question and the books author escape me though.