Ego Sickness

[Iron Sulfide]

so, i like the term Ego Sickness.

i assume you're using the classical term EGO and not the colloquial "egotistical" variety.

my beef: the vantage point is still an Us Them dichotomy.

maybe Ego, in and of itself (the asat, the capitol I, the self), is not bad.
you kind of addressed that, and i think were perhaps trying to imply that.
but perhaps it's more of a sickness of the ego, versus sickness from the ego.
dig?

a lad that says "i am a student" isn't really that bad.

but then the teacher gives him a grade of "C", and he's off to the market.
now he's infected with the notion that he is a "C" instead of a "Medium Grade Work In Progress," which we all know to be the implication of that grade.
(or a flat out lack of effort, or some such)..

but what i'm saying is the student doesn't impose the "C" mentality on himself,
nor does his Ego do it. the grade is assigned by the teacher. the grading system is mprescribed by standardization, tradition, the LAW, etc. which were all imposed by some collective, or another. (read= the exact opposite of an 'I')

now that i'm done being an asshat...nice article.

[Triple Zero]

[Darth Cupcake]

PF --

I mostly agree. The problem is, I think, when the student internalizes the "C" assigned to him by the teacher, thus taking the C from an external label and transforming it into an actual facet of himself and will not break away from it.

[AFK]

PF --

I mostly agree. The problem is, I think, when the student internalizes the "C" assigned to him by the teacher, thus taking the C from an external label and transforming it into an actual facet of himself and will not break away from it.

Not to mention others who may reinforce it.  Say a parent, or parents.  A "C" can be a positive learning experience if handled correctly.  It can also be a horrible bad-wrong detriment if hammered into a kids heart. 

It depends on the kid for sure, but it also depends on the kids support, if he has any.  A good parent and a good teacher will work as a team, with the student, to find solutions, that don't stomp the ego.  It's sad how deficient those teams are in the society at large. 

[Darth Cupcake]

PF --

I mostly agree. The problem is, I think, when the student internalizes the "C" assigned to him by the teacher, thus taking the C from an external label and transforming it into an actual facet of himself and will not break away from it.

Not to mention others who may reinforce it.  Say a parent, or parents.  A "C" can be a positive learning experience if handled correctly.  It can also be a horrible bad-wrong detriment if hammered into a kids heart. 

It depends on the kid for sure, but it also depends on the kids support, if he has any.  A good parent and a good teacher will work as a team, with the student, to find solutions, that don't stomp the ego.  It's sad how deficient those teams are in the society at large. 

I have nothing to add to this. I think you are quite right.

[AFK]

What's sick is that some parents think that it's actually a good parenting method.  Thinking their going to guilt their kid into better grades. 

[Darth Cupcake]

And there's some that do genuinely see a C as a failure, no matter what reason might be behind it. Some people have very bizarre priorities.

[AFK]

I don't want to sound like a bleeding heart idealogue, but I see a trend in some kids and families of not teaching responsibility and the importance of self-responsibility, and this can affect ego.  You may have heard the stats on the news yesterday and today that a study has found less then 50% of 16 to 18 year olds will be getting or looking for a summertime job this year.  There were many factors cited in the study but one of them was families with more disposible income and more income that they can devote to college tuitions.  In other words, kids aren't needing to save up for college expenses, themselves.

In one sense this is good news, less financial burden on the kid.  On the other hand I think it takes away a good experience.  Looking back, I see the summer job as less about making money and more about learning responsibility.  About putting in a good day's work.  About effort equaling result. 

I think that is an important quality to have.  To know that one can use their two hands and their brains to do what it takes to allow them to survive, on their own, without a safety net. 

Kids need to understand that you can't go through life solely on cruise control. 

[Darth Cupcake]

Families have so much disposable income that they can pay for college tuition AND the spending habits of a teenager? They should share the damn wealth!

My mother made the grievous mistake of telling me, at age 14, that I could have any car I wanted so long as I bought it myself. Same went for clothes I wanted to wear, or hair dye. So I got a job.

In short order she had a daughter wearing ridiculous clothes with blue hair driving a fairly well modified sports car. Interestingly enough, she also had a heart attack.

In all seriousness, my job kept me sane through high school. Any kid who isn't applying for a job because mommy and daddy can support them are missing the point--if you get a job, not only do you not need mommy and daddy anymore, but you are given a certain liberty to tell them to shove it and make your own decisions. A lot of these decisions will probably be bad, but having the responsibility for one's own decisions kicks fucking ass. Making mistakes sucks, but it's so much nicer to know that you don't have to make them again in the future, because you're the one in control. You can actually LEARN from fuck ups, instead of just having to cruise along accepting the shit that gets handed to you because HEY it's easier this way.

Mommy and daddy should be expecting their little princesses to get their hands dirty eventually, no matter how much disposable income they have. I don't want to wake up in twenty years to discover that the world is full of even bigger retards and mental cripples and emotional children than it already is, just because no one could be bothered to work before the age of 30.

[Cramulus]

A game, perhaps? An internet meme (like those lame 20 question things)?

Something Along the lines of:
--------------
WHOOOO are YOOOOU? (with picture of the Caterpillar on the 'shroom with the Hooka)

Children often ask the annoying question "Why?" and for every answer you give, they ask again "Why?"... Yet, perhaps asking why isn't a bad thing. As adults, maybe we don't consider why we do the things we do, or why we are where we are. So as a challenge, as a moment of childhood clarity, you have been challenged to answer the question "Why?" 

To begin, write an "I am" statement which you feel describes a key part of who you are. Maybe "I am an artist", "I am a hacker", "I am a Christian", "I am an atheist", then you must ask yourself "Why?" and provide an answer, follow the answer with another "Why?" and the why, with another answer. Do this so that you have a total of twenty-three answers and then post it in your blog/journal.
--------------

The Internet meme is a pathetic, yet popular filler for blogs, but if we can use such a transport for a more insidious meme, then perhaps there is some value. The above is just a concept, but hopefully you get the idea.... getting people to question their self-identification seems to have some potential. Maybe we could release a series of these, where we are more specific about the first question...

An 'I Am' statement that describes your physical being.
An 'I Am' statement that describes your social life.
An 'I Am' statement that describes your philosophical beliefs
An 'I Am; statement that describes your ...

Also, perhaps we could create one called "Right Where You Are Now", and ask the question "Why are you where you are now, this minute?" (I remember this as similar to a meditation trick RAW talked about. )

Thoughts?

Okay, trying it out...

1. I am a long haired guy. Why?

2. I started growing my hair out in 7th grade. Why?

3. I wanted to stand out and be different from others. Why?

4. I was worried that I'd grow up and be an interchangable cog. why?

5. At the time, I was a C student, and the average height and weight for my age. Why was I a C student?

6. I just couldn't muster up the energy to care enough to get As. Seemed like a waste of time. Why?

7. All the A students were boring snobs. I was as smart as them but didn't get along with them. I had a lot of difficulty following directions. Why?

8. I've always thought that weird was cool. Why?

9. Perhaps because Gonzo was always my favorite muppet. Why?

10. I liked that he was always up to something funny which you'd never expect. Why?

11. It seemed funnier than say, Fozzie, who was telling straight jokes. Gonzo had an aura of chaos around him because he was uncategorizable and unpredictable. The humor wasn't about the punchline, it was about the situation. Why did I find that cool?

12. As a kid I was always saying really random unexpected stuff which occasionally got a lot of laughs. Why?

13. I guess I got more of a reward for being different than I got for being like everyone else. Why?

14. I was a first-born in a family of three kids, so I was always out adventuring, being in front, marking the path. Why?

15. My younger brothers always seemed to follow my example. Even when they were being really original, I kind of feel it was the same KIND of originality that I was displaying. Why?

16. I enjoyed seeing them interested in the same stuff I was interested in.

17. So I could have someone else to talk to about it. Like when I started playing D&D (in like 5th grade), I tried to teach my younger brother about it so I'd have someone to play with. Why?

18. perhaps to rub it in his face that I was better than him. why?

19. Because it made me so mad when people would praise him for something that I came up with or discovered! They should be paying attention to me! Why?

20. Because I was the first born kid and lurved the attention. Why?

21. Because when my younger brother was born, my mom had to divide attention between the two of us. I got a lot more extroverted once I had to work for attention. Why?

22. Because she was busy taking care of the baby. Why?

23. 'cause!

That was difficult! Around question 11 it got kind of interesting. Then by question 16 I was going in circles. I feel like I'd be missing the point if the causal chains trailed away from myself, so the instructions should probably clarify that.

[Payne]

I've brought people to tears by asking "Why?" over and over again. I don't know how I direct the questioning that it has such a profound effect, or how I could write it down as a set of instructions, but I'll think about it.

[Bu🤠ns]

so if you identify with yourself as "i am" this or that in relationship you find yourself needing that person to reassure those conditions that have been labeled as your identity. consider how often potential relationships fail because one person isn't holding up to the model the other has placed.  its not really fair and its seems to happen all the time.  by not identifying, a person offers up a space for the other to be .. whatever they wish. . its just that YOU don't have to fall for their own identity models. this space of awareness might place a person in any relationship to not have to worry about playing his or her role. once you stop judging the other person as a fixed idenity, the other person doesn't have to justify where he or she is standing. its about giving them a chance to be free of roles. by not standing in a fixed position you're essentially giving the other an opportunity to stand without boundaries and you can actually relate to each other as humans. 

for instance, i'm a server and i want to develop a good rapport with my guest. but as long as i'm identifying as "server" and the guest is identifing as "guest" the relationship is cold and businesslike.  but say i start talking about my job and how it's been 'soo slow lately' or i say something that allows the person to break out of that idenity as being a guest and relate to me as a fellow human then we're standing on common ground.

and i get a bigger tip too 

[Cramulus]

The I AM meme is sticky. Other memes touch it, and if they are chemically compatible, they form bonds. Some of these bonds decay over time, and some simply detach because they no longer fit the identity. Picture the kid who thinks he's "too big" to watch cartoons. Optimus Prime is floating down the memestream away from him, waving goodbye nostalgically.

There is a large complex of memes - a whole memeplex - attached to your I AM meme. Its chemistry is complicated, and it brushes against nearly every meme you encounter. In a way, your I AM meme licks everything, seeing how it tastes.

When you have Ego Sickness, every meme you encounter must be evaluated - will it be assimilated into the hive? or will we reject it forever?






thought experiment:
In the above diagram, the I AM meme has an open spot. Let's visualize a political affiliation going there. Based on the chemistry of this slice of memeplex, what political memes do you think are most likely to form bonds?

[Cramulus]

revamp of last chart:

[Forteetu]

And there's some that do genuinely see a C as a failure, no matter what reason might be behind it. Some people have very bizarre priorities.

One of my friends back in High School (about 14/15 years old) got a "C" on his report card. First and only "C" he had ever received ... a week later he blew his chest open with his father's .357 mag

dumb fucker

There is no accounting for how people perceive the world around them