The Pental and the Pomal

[hooplala]

The Sacred Chao represents everything in the Universe, of course.  On one side we have a representation of a Pentagon which represents ORDER, and on the other side there is a representation of the Apple of Eris, which represents DISORDER.  Neither is "true" and neither dominates: Elementary Discordianism.

But, like all things, the Sacred Chao reveals even more upon deeper reflection . . .

The Hairless Ape mind has (at least) two components: The Pental, and the Pomal.

PENTAL: The Pental is very observant, very quick, and likes to compartmentalize everything it witnesses; the Pental is also extremely arrogant.  The Pental isn't usually aware of the Pomal, and when it is aware of its existence is very jealous and manipulative.  The Pental believes itself to be the entire universe, and in a sense it is correct. The Pental IS the entire universe, at least for each of us.  Everything I see is part of the Pental, everything I think about is part of the Pental, and my Pental tells me how to see and think about things.  When I look at a "tree" I only "know" it is a "tree" because my Pental tells me.  The Pental would have you believe that it is the only thing which exists.

POMAL: On the other hand, the Pomal has none of those qualities, in fact, to even attempt to describe the Pomal is doing it a grave disservice . . . any description or definition I gave would only be my Pental's idea of the Pomal anyway, and would therefor be useless.  The closest I will come to pinning anything on the Pomal would be to compare it with the "Tao" . . . but even that is off.  The Pomal is the Pomal, and thats really all there is to say about it.  Don't let the lack of a definition trick you into believing the Pomal is lesser than the Pental however, that's just your Pental whispering to you.  The Pomal rules dreams, intuition, synchronicity, tarot, the I-Ching, and magick - perhaps even quantum physics. Anytime the Pomal pops itself into your "normal world" the Pental will immediately pounce on it, and dominate it, to show you that it is boss, in this way the Pental shows that its power is over everything, and at the same time saves itself from destruction (despite what it believes, the Pental is very fragile, and can be disrupted easily by extreme emotional jolts, heavy drugs, meditation and yoga).  The Pomal's influence on the world of the Pental is subtle, but profound.

Looking at the Sacred Chao again, with this in mind, will reveal that the image of the Chao also represents the Pental and the Pomal of the mind.  The Pentagon -representing ORDER- also represents the Pental, which spreads its grid of knowledge over everything it sees and hears and simultaneously imposes its notion of "order" onto what is primal chaos in essence.  The Apple of Eris -representing DISORDER- also represents the Pomal, and the vastly unnamable qualities it symbolizes.

The Sacred Chao, obviously, also represents everything else you can think of as well, from Bingo to Symphony Orchestras, but my Pental and Pomal felt like talking about themselves today.

[LMNO]

Pental = Linear?
Pomal = Non-Linear?

Pental = Logic?
Pomal = Intuition?

Pental = Rational?
Pomal = Irrational?



What's interesting about your essay is that although you can't really speak about the Pomal without the Pental getting in the way, the equal balance still exists.  To use a horribly inaccurate metaphor, it's like Dark Matter: we don't know what it is, we can't observe it, but it's there all the same.

I want to overlap this onto the 8 circuit model*, if I can.  Do you think that the development of the Pental relates to the imprinting of the circuits, and how?














*well, 4-or-5 circuit model, really.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

w00t, nice Hoop!!!

[Cramulus]

interesting thoughts, Hoops.

It does seem a bit asymmetrical though that you describe the Pental part as having a purely predatory relationship with the Pomal part. Would you say the Pental part pounces on the Pomal part because the Pomal is a big threat to the Pental way of things?

[LMNO]

Also:  Hoops, I missed your writings 'round here.

[hooplala]

Pental = Linear?
Pomal = Non-Linear?

Pental = Logic?
Pomal = Intuition?

Pental = Rational?
Pomal = Irrational?

I would agree with all of that, except that all those terms are -de facto- created by the Pental;  but essentially it is still correct, if you allow that all the terms connected to the Pomal are only loose approximations.

Do you think that the development of the Pental relates to the imprinting of the circuits, and how?

It seems to me that the first two circuits come to us as "a gift" from our older predecessors, and that the Pental is most closely related to the 3rd circuit (and 4th to some degree).  I think the Pomal could be considered the originating point of the forces which manipulate the 5th-8th circuits.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Pental = Linear?
Pomal = Non-Linear?

Pental = Logic?
Pomal = Intuition?

Pental = Rational?
Pomal = Irrational?

I would agree with all of that, except that all those terms are -de facto- created by the Pental;  but essentially it is still correct, if you allow that all the terms connected to the Pomal are only loose approximations.

Do you think that the development of the Pental relates to the imprinting of the circuits, and how?

It seems to me that the first two circuits come to us as "a gift" from our older predecessors, and that the Pental is most closely related to the 3rd circuit (and 4th to some degree).  I think the Pomal could be considered the originating point of the forces which manipulate the 5th-8th circuits.

Much like the "Kia" in Peter Carroll's books.

First circuit does require labeling and compartmentalization: Fight or Flee, Enemy of Friend, Safe or Not Safe. This seems to be an early program which can be modified through training (martial arts etc), or through some other system of modification... So in a sense it might it be considered Pental (programmed Is/Is Not) ?

Second circuit requires labels like Top Dog and Bottom Dog, again, programmed early and modifiable (I think). Could it also be Pental in some sense then?

[hooplala]

interesting thoughts, Hoops.

It does seem a bit asymmetrical though that you describe the Pental part as having a purely predatory relationship with the Pomal part.

I probably make that sound harsher than it really is.  Early in life I believe children are primarily all Pomal, and only when the Question Phase of growing up begins does the Pental begin to make itself prominent.  The Pental is important, and I don't want to make it sound like I am disparaging it, without the Pental none of us would be able to communicate.  However, I think by the time you are an adult the relationship is rather predatory when the Pental is aware of the Pomal at all, but I should make clear that the Pental is almost never aware of the Pomal at all, and again, when it is it swallows the idea of the Pomal into itself.

Think of it like walking through a forest at night . . . you walk by something which suddenly moves and makes some sort of sound:  this is the Pomal, but the Pental immediately begins to reel, and thus, to save itself begins to do what it does best: label.  It will throw out several labels immediately (such as "animal", "monster", "ghost", "madman").

Would you say the Pental part pounces on the Pomal part because the Pomal is a big threat to the Pental way of things?

Absolutely.  Since the Pental's job is to know what everything is, or if you want to get fancy to 'create' everything (the great artist who makes the grass green), by definition it can't not know what something is - everything is under its jurisdiction.  Its why we can't fathom the unfathomable, yet try anyway.

[hooplala]

First circuit does require labeling and compartmentalization: Fight or Flee, Enemy of Friend, Safe or Not Safe. This seems to be an early program which can be modified through training (martial arts etc), or through some other system of modification... So in a sense it might it be considered Pental (programmed Is/Is Not) ?

Second circuit requires labels like Top Dog and Bottom Dog, again, programmed early and modifiable (I think). Could it also be Pental in some sense then?

Those are good points.  I will consider those and get back to you.

[LMNO]

Perhaps the metaphors can work in tandem.  Where you imprint on the circuitboard affects the strength of the pental, and vice versa. So, a Fighting Top Dog will have a different Pental than a Fleeing Bottom Dog, which will affect how the 3rd circuit imprints, which will affect the Pental further, which will influence the 4th, etc etc.

[hooplala]

OOooOoOOooooh.  I like that.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Perhaps the metaphors can work in tandem.  Where you imprint on the circuitboard affects the strength of the pental, and vice versa. So, a Fighting Top Dog will have a different Pental than a Fleeing Bottom Dog, which will affect how the 3rd circuit imprints, which will affect the Pental further, which will influence the 4th, etc etc.

Very nice. This seems to fit well with Leary's quadrants.

[hooplala]

Is there evidence for the left brain/right brain idea? 

If so, how do you think it fits into Leary's model?

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Is there evidence for the left brain/right brain idea? 

If so, how do you think it fits into Leary's model?

Well, from what I get out of Leary's model, right/left brain would fit more in the underlying hardware (to continue his technology metaphor). There appears in Leary's model some set of our 'reality tunnel' that is rooted in our Hardware, our DNA and genetic traits. This seems true for something simple like if you end up being a taster, super taster or non taster... color blind or have some other variation in sensory equipment. It also seems feasible in Leary's system to accept that people may have a hardwired preference for creative expression or logical expression. How well they interface the hardware (DNA) and the wetware (8 Circuits/Programming) with interactive reality (Whatever the hell that might be) seems more like what Leary's model focuses on, based on my reading of it.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Perhaps the metaphors can work in tandem.  Where you imprint on the circuitboard affects the strength of the pental, and vice versa. So, a Fighting Top Dog will have a different Pental than a Fleeing Bottom Dog, which will affect how the 3rd circuit imprints, which will affect the Pental further, which will influence the 4th, etc etc.

I like that... some people seem to consider the circuits as independent, but they seem much more interrelated to me... The separation (1-8) appears as ordering for sake of discussion as far as I can tell.