TRANSMISSIONS FROM ARIZONA

[AFK]

So do we also execute all of the Congresspeople, like Hillary Clintin, John Kerry, etc., who voted and gave Bush the authority/go-ahead to go into Iraq?

[Requia ☣]

No, the war itself is not the problem per se, even the action of a few nutjob soldiers and officers aren't the problem, the problem is administrrative policies that encourage and protect this behavior.  If soldiers, and more importantly, officers, knew they would face consequences for torture and shooting civilians, it wouldn't happen nearly as often.

[Triple Zero]

if you ever think of laying a finger on hillary again, i'll go on STRIKE you hear me????

[Jack of Turnips]

Every member of the Senate or Congress who voted for the authorization of force should be ejected from government office in disgrace. Before the war I read the CIA assessments of Iraq's strategic capabilities, and only a sludge-brained political herd-animal could have read the facts and believed Iraq posed any threat at all to the USA.

Not ONE of them should be left in office.

(I wrote a lot of letters in that era. Several to Colin Powell, as he seemed the one most likely to have the sense to see what madness was being proposed and be able to do something about it. After Robert Byrd's speech in the Senate I wrote him one, too. Something like "If I may say so, Senator, you have balls. And you have my undying respect.")

Sadly, I have no way to force the political herd-animals from office. And you can't pry off leeches if you have no way to force them...

The only time people are executed for war crimes is if they lose the war. And fall into the hands of their enemies. So Bush is safe as houses.

Should he be prosecuted for war crimes? In a perfect world?

In a perfect world aggressive war would be universally prosecutable. Would Bush the First have invaded Panama if he knew he would spend hard time in the federal pen for it? Probably not. Would LBJ and Nixon have pursued Vietnam to the horrible ends they did if they had to keep the war going from a prison cell? Probably not.

So hell yes, Bush and every other son of a bitch who invades and kills should be prosecuted and sentenced and hove into a small cell for many years. That would be a good thing.

A good thing, but as realistic as turning turds to gold.

~~ Jack of Turnips

[The Good Reverend Roger]

So do we also execute all of the Congresspeople, like Hillary Clintin, John Kerry, etc., who voted and gave Bush the authority/go-ahead to go into Iraq?

No, impeachment and imprisonment would suffice for them.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Every member of the Senate or Congress who voted for the authorization of force should be ejected from government office in disgrace.

This is the correct motorcycle.

They willfully accepted a pack of lies that fooled nobody.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Every member of the Senate or Congress who voted for the authorization of force should be ejected from government office in disgrace. Before the war I read the CIA assessments of Iraq's strategic capabilities, and only a sludge-brained political herd-animal could have read the facts and believed Iraq posed any threat at all to the USA.

Not ONE of them should be left in office.

(I wrote a lot of letters in that era. Several to Colin Powell, as he seemed the one most likely to have the sense to see what madness was being proposed and be able to do something about it. After Robert Byrd's speech in the Senate I wrote him one, too. Something like "If I may say so, Senator, you have balls. And you have my undying respect.")

Sadly, I have no way to force the political herd-animals from office. And you can't pry off leeches if you have no way to force them...

The only time people are executed for war crimes is if they lose the war. And fall into the hands of their enemies. So Bush is safe as houses.

Should he be prosecuted for war crimes? In a perfect world?

In a perfect world aggressive war would be universally prosecutable. Would Bush the First have invaded Panama if he knew he would spend hard time in the federal pen for it? Probably not. Would LBJ and Nixon have pursued Vietnam to the horrible ends they did if they had to keep the war going from a prison cell? Probably not.

So hell yes, Bush and every other son of a bitch who invades and kills should be prosecuted and sentenced and hove into a small cell for many years. That would be a good thing.

A good thing, but as realistic as turning turds to gold.

~~ Jack of Turnips

[Pope Lecherous]

So you have no moral sense.

I have a moral sense.  (as it relates to killing) As far as the performance of my duties goes, only those that pose a threat to the things i am supposed to protect die.  As far as me walking around on the street on my off-time,  i don't start fights and i only fight to protect myself or the people i am with who can't defend themselves.  I don't try to fuck people over or hurt them, but it might happen for revenge if someone ruined my life.  As far as politics are concerned, a lot of my values are conservative however, i tend to vote liberal.  As far as the economy is concerned i lean more towards the right.  The ends justify the means in many cases, because after all it takes pain to truly learn most things, but not where human lives are at stake.

[Pope Lecherous]

Every member of the Senate or Congress who voted for the authorization of force should be ejected from government office in disgrace. Before the war I read the CIA assessments of Iraq's strategic capabilities, and only a sludge-brained political herd-animal could have read the facts and believed Iraq posed any threat at all to the USA.

Not ONE of them should be left in office.

Most definitely, if not for deliberately telling lies, then for dereliction of duty.

[Pope Lecherous]

Hang on a minute.

The US government has willfully pursued a policy where innocent Iraqis are going to die, in very large numbers, and instead of taking steps to mimimize those casualties, has instead decided to cover its own ass and those of the people it lets kill Iraqis with abandon. 

I like the majority of that post but this statement.  Innocent people always die in war and it really is a tragedy (no sarcasm), but the govt lets the military create policies in battle which minimize civilian casualties as well as ensuring that people who violate the Law of War are investigated and punished accordingly. The curfews in fallujah for example, did cause a lot of inconvenience to the locals but the locals certainly knew about it.  A friend of mine highly disagreed with imposing the curfew and saw an old lady violate it one night and let her slide... the shitty thing about that was she was giving intel to terrorists about his unit's equipment and movements and he had to kill her personally.  It does suck royally he told me to kill an old lady, but people gathering intelligence most of the time get the LEAST amount of mercy once discovered.  War sucks.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Of course, in this case "terrorist" = "patriotic resistance against illegally invading forces" , which leads us right back to the ethical can of worms.

[P3nT4gR4m]

Regardless of ethical or moral considerations the lesson learned from the northern irish occupation and others like it should have been - whether you like it or not terrorism appears to be the only means of defense available to these people. Whether it's right or wrong they will practice it and if they practice for long enough they'll get really good at it, eventually the fight will land on your shores.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

So you have no moral sense.

I have a moral sense.  (as it relates to killing)

At this point, I'm going to dismiss you as a wannabe, and assume that you're a cook or a typist.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I like the majority of that post but this statement.  Innocent people always die in war and it really is a tragedy (no sarcasm), but the govt lets the military create policies in battle which minimize civilian casualties as well as ensuring that people who violate the Law of War are investigated and punished accordingly. The curfews in fallujah for example, did cause a lot of inconvenience to the locals but the locals certainly knew about it.

What war?  There was never a declaration of war, and your hero has already told us "mission accomplished".

A friend of mine highly disagreed with imposing the curfew and saw an old lady violate it one night and let her slide... the shitty thing about that was she was giving intel to terrorists about his unit's equipment and movements and he had to kill her personally.

What a steaming load of shit.   

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Every member of the Senate or Congress who voted for the authorization of force should be ejected from government office in disgrace. Before the war I read the CIA assessments of Iraq's strategic capabilities, and only a sludge-brained political herd-animal could have read the facts and believed Iraq posed any threat at all to the USA.

Not ONE of them should be left in office.

Most definitely, if not for deliberately telling lies, then for dereliction of duty.

Wait.  What?

Weren't you just defending Bush a few pages back.